How to use Dropbox
November 8, 2010 12:47 PM Subscribe
Dropbox... explain it to me like I'm a child. Scenario inside
So I have a desktop and a laptop. I have only one file that I wish to share between them--a writing project that I update from both computers.
After losing about 4 months of work by (mis)using dropbox, I'd like to know, precisely, step-by-step, what I should do to make sure that both computers have the latest version of that file and what I should do after changing the file.
Yes, I've read already the dropbox site and thought that I was using it correctly already when I lost the work.
So I have a desktop and a laptop. I have only one file that I wish to share between them--a writing project that I update from both computers.
After losing about 4 months of work by (mis)using dropbox, I'd like to know, precisely, step-by-step, what I should do to make sure that both computers have the latest version of that file and what I should do after changing the file.
Yes, I've read already the dropbox site and thought that I was using it correctly already when I lost the work.
Dropbox is like your "My Documents" folder but it doesn't live on your computer - it lives on a server somewhere else. However, your computer(s) are constantly syncing up with that folder whenever they're online. And when they're not offline, they have copies of the most recent version of the files. So imagine that you're on an airplane (without WiFi), and you still have all of your "My Documents" files, and you make some changes to some of them. Then you get home and you're on the Internet again, and your My Documents says HEY! Server! I made some changes, grab these new files. All the while, you don't have to do anything.
And then imagine that you're at a friend's house without your computer. You want to check out a document on your My Documents. Normally you'd be SOL. Not with Dropbox - cuz it has a webpage that lets you see the contents of your My Documents folder.
Does that make sense?
posted by k8t at 12:52 PM on November 8, 2010 [1 favorite]
And then imagine that you're at a friend's house without your computer. You want to check out a document on your My Documents. Normally you'd be SOL. Not with Dropbox - cuz it has a webpage that lets you see the contents of your My Documents folder.
Does that make sense?
posted by k8t at 12:52 PM on November 8, 2010 [1 favorite]
To make sure that both computers have the latest version of the file you're working on, you should only ever save to your dropbox folder. If you create a link to your dropbox folder on the desktop of both computers and put the file in that folder - it will be the same file on both computers provided dropbox is running on both computers.
posted by Siena at 12:52 PM on November 8, 2010
posted by Siena at 12:52 PM on November 8, 2010
dobbs, Could you explain out how exactly you have been using dropbox (step-by-step)? It may help us pinpoint how to help you (instead of rehashing the dropbox site directions).
posted by watch out for turtles at 12:55 PM on November 8, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by watch out for turtles at 12:55 PM on November 8, 2010 [1 favorite]
Dropbox does save older versions of your work. I use it in precisely the fashion you are describing, and all I do is hit save (but I make sure my computer is connected to the internet, otherwise it doesn't update the server or sync obviously). Can you describe what your process is, and maybe people here can figure out what you did wrong?
(Did you for example save on computer 1 which wasn't connected to the internet, and then work on it on computer 2 not noticing that the file wasn't updated, and then save it updating it on the server and on computer 1 replacing the most recent version? That has happened to me. And you will lose your work done on computer 1. The only thing you can do is make sure to connect to the internet some time soon after saving the document (and before working on it on your other computer).)
posted by bluefly at 1:01 PM on November 8, 2010
(Did you for example save on computer 1 which wasn't connected to the internet, and then work on it on computer 2 not noticing that the file wasn't updated, and then save it updating it on the server and on computer 1 replacing the most recent version? That has happened to me. And you will lose your work done on computer 1. The only thing you can do is make sure to connect to the internet some time soon after saving the document (and before working on it on your other computer).)
posted by bluefly at 1:01 PM on November 8, 2010
Hmm, do you know how it lost the files? The only thing I can imagine is that your connection between Dropbox and your computer was not active.
1. Install Dropbox on your desktop. Login with your account. Make sure the Dropbox icon in the tray has a small green circle with a checkmark. That means everything is up to date and active.
2. Follow same procedure on your laptop. Login with same account, check for green circles with checkmark. A blue circle means Dropbox is up or downloading files.
3. You should be good to go. The latest file should be updated each time you are online.
4. If something happens - Saving over a file incorrectly, deleting, etc. - go onto the website dropbox.com, and you can look through deleted or changed files and revert to a previous version. It might be worthwhile to check there now, and see if that lost work is hiding in there.
If your Dropbox icon doesn't have the green circle with a check, that's generally the only time to be concerned.
posted by shinynewnick at 1:02 PM on November 8, 2010
1. Install Dropbox on your desktop. Login with your account. Make sure the Dropbox icon in the tray has a small green circle with a checkmark. That means everything is up to date and active.
2. Follow same procedure on your laptop. Login with same account, check for green circles with checkmark. A blue circle means Dropbox is up or downloading files.
3. You should be good to go. The latest file should be updated each time you are online.
4. If something happens - Saving over a file incorrectly, deleting, etc. - go onto the website dropbox.com, and you can look through deleted or changed files and revert to a previous version. It might be worthwhile to check there now, and see if that lost work is hiding in there.
If your Dropbox icon doesn't have the green circle with a check, that's generally the only time to be concerned.
posted by shinynewnick at 1:02 PM on November 8, 2010
Response by poster: Well, I haven't really been using it. I used it once and lost a ton of work. It was about a week ago and 3 in the morning but if I remember correctly, this is what I did:
1. File was on laptop and not on desktop.
2. Both computers had dropbox installed.
3. I dragged the file to the dropbox icon.
4. I opened the file on the desktop and it was corrupt or only half there or something. (It was a Scrivener file).
5. I thought, Okay, I guess I didn't give it enough time to upload from the laptop to dropbox.
6. I dragged the file out of dropbox (thinking it corrupt) and into the trash bin of my computer.
Now things get more blurry. All I know is that when I re-opened the file on the laptop, it was also corrupt/half-there.
At least, that's my recollection. The whole thing happened so fast I tried everything I could think of that didn't involve dropbox but the work I did between July and September seems to be lost in the ether.
posted by dobbs at 1:07 PM on November 8, 2010
1. File was on laptop and not on desktop.
2. Both computers had dropbox installed.
3. I dragged the file to the dropbox icon.
4. I opened the file on the desktop and it was corrupt or only half there or something. (It was a Scrivener file).
5. I thought, Okay, I guess I didn't give it enough time to upload from the laptop to dropbox.
6. I dragged the file out of dropbox (thinking it corrupt) and into the trash bin of my computer.
Now things get more blurry. All I know is that when I re-opened the file on the laptop, it was also corrupt/half-there.
At least, that's my recollection. The whole thing happened so fast I tried everything I could think of that didn't involve dropbox but the work I did between July and September seems to be lost in the ether.
posted by dobbs at 1:07 PM on November 8, 2010
Response by poster: When I now go to the dropbox folder, there are some files that I guess I put there a year or so ago and forgot about (pdfs), which all have sizes and date modified variables.
The file I lost is listed in the trash, but no size or variables exist. When I restore it and try and open it in Scrivener, it tells me it's corrupt.
posted by dobbs at 1:14 PM on November 8, 2010
The file I lost is listed in the trash, but no size or variables exist. When I restore it and try and open it in Scrivener, it tells me it's corrupt.
posted by dobbs at 1:14 PM on November 8, 2010
Thanks for the update. That helps us diagnose what went wrong.
At your step 3, as you were dragging into Dropbox, the Dropbox icon should have had a blue swirly circle in the corner. That means that it is in the process of uploading/syncing.
This is important: Once you drag a file onto the Dropbox, IT IS NO LONGER ON YOUR COMPUTER. This is NOT like a USB key or other type of removable media where dragging onto it makes a copy. The Dropbox copy becomes your only copy.
After the file is done syncing, the Dropbox icon should turn into a green checkmark circle in the corner. This tells you everything is up to date and ready.
Your step 5 is probably true, if you shut down your laptop before the Dropbox icon turned green. Step 6 is probably where things started to go downhill. From here, it sounds like you deleted half a broken file from the Dropbox (by dragging it out) and then went back to your laptop. I'm not sure how you had a phantom file left on your laptop after you supposedly dragged it to Dropbox, but my guess is that it might have been able to recover itself if you left the first half in the Dropbox.
Here's how I use Dropbox. I treat it like its own virtual folder. I don't use it as a way to transfer completed files from computer to computer (the way you would use a USB key, which kind of sounds like what you did to start).
1. Open MS Word or whatever other document. (at work computer)
2. Type/Edit
3. Save As...
4. Select MyDropbox and make new folder within Dropbox
5. Save
6. Continue typing/editting
7. Close MS Word (Do you want to save? yes)
8. Double-check that Dropbox icon has green checkmark
9. Shut down computer
10. Go home, eat, relax
11. Boot up home PC
12. The Dropbox icon will tell me "Filename has been added to your Dropbox"
13. Open Dropbox folder
14. Open document
15. Edit/type
16. Save (NOT Save As, just plain Save)
17. Close document
18. Double-check that Dropbox icon has green checkmark
19. Shut down computer
20. Go to sleep
21. Get to work, fire up PC
22. The Dropbox icon will tell me "Filename has been updated in your Dropbox"
23. Open, rinse, repeat
posted by watch out for turtles at 1:24 PM on November 8, 2010 [2 favorites]
At your step 3, as you were dragging into Dropbox, the Dropbox icon should have had a blue swirly circle in the corner. That means that it is in the process of uploading/syncing.
This is important: Once you drag a file onto the Dropbox, IT IS NO LONGER ON YOUR COMPUTER. This is NOT like a USB key or other type of removable media where dragging onto it makes a copy. The Dropbox copy becomes your only copy.
After the file is done syncing, the Dropbox icon should turn into a green checkmark circle in the corner. This tells you everything is up to date and ready.
Your step 5 is probably true, if you shut down your laptop before the Dropbox icon turned green. Step 6 is probably where things started to go downhill. From here, it sounds like you deleted half a broken file from the Dropbox (by dragging it out) and then went back to your laptop. I'm not sure how you had a phantom file left on your laptop after you supposedly dragged it to Dropbox, but my guess is that it might have been able to recover itself if you left the first half in the Dropbox.
Here's how I use Dropbox. I treat it like its own virtual folder. I don't use it as a way to transfer completed files from computer to computer (the way you would use a USB key, which kind of sounds like what you did to start).
1. Open MS Word or whatever other document. (at work computer)
2. Type/Edit
3. Save As...
4. Select MyDropbox and make new folder within Dropbox
5. Save
6. Continue typing/editting
7. Close MS Word (Do you want to save? yes)
8. Double-check that Dropbox icon has green checkmark
9. Shut down computer
10. Go home, eat, relax
11. Boot up home PC
12. The Dropbox icon will tell me "Filename has been added to your Dropbox"
13. Open Dropbox folder
14. Open document
15. Edit/type
16. Save (NOT Save As, just plain Save)
17. Close document
18. Double-check that Dropbox icon has green checkmark
19. Shut down computer
20. Go to sleep
21. Get to work, fire up PC
22. The Dropbox icon will tell me "Filename has been updated in your Dropbox"
23. Open, rinse, repeat
posted by watch out for turtles at 1:24 PM on November 8, 2010 [2 favorites]
It sounds to me like the file was corrupt on your laptop, and that the error has nothing to do with dropbox.
I use dropbox to back up all of my writing. I do so by having the folder automatically connected on all of my computers, and by saving directly into that folder--dragging and dropping need not be involved. That was, every time I save (and I autosave all of my writing with MSWord), it's backed up automatically on dropbox's servers. If something goes wrong with that file, it's easy to log into the dropbox website and restore a copy. And if something goes wrong with the internet on one of my computers, then the next time it connects to dropbox it will automatically generate copies of the conflicting files (these are labeled by dropbox as "filename.dox (computer x's conflicting copy)" or something like that).
Dropbox really isn't all that great for occasional back-ups of files--using it that way is no better than, say, emailing it to yourself, and that's really where the potential for accidentally backing up a corrupted file is. What it is good for is to keep a constant, automatic dialog with your computer; if you're going to use it, use it as the primary storage for your files so that backing up there is second-nature. That way you'll have a variety of versions of your files on there.
All that being said, sorry for your likely loss. :(
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 1:28 PM on November 8, 2010
I use dropbox to back up all of my writing. I do so by having the folder automatically connected on all of my computers, and by saving directly into that folder--dragging and dropping need not be involved. That was, every time I save (and I autosave all of my writing with MSWord), it's backed up automatically on dropbox's servers. If something goes wrong with that file, it's easy to log into the dropbox website and restore a copy. And if something goes wrong with the internet on one of my computers, then the next time it connects to dropbox it will automatically generate copies of the conflicting files (these are labeled by dropbox as "filename.dox (computer x's conflicting copy)" or something like that).
Dropbox really isn't all that great for occasional back-ups of files--using it that way is no better than, say, emailing it to yourself, and that's really where the potential for accidentally backing up a corrupted file is. What it is good for is to keep a constant, automatic dialog with your computer; if you're going to use it, use it as the primary storage for your files so that backing up there is second-nature. That way you'll have a variety of versions of your files on there.
All that being said, sorry for your likely loss. :(
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 1:28 PM on November 8, 2010
Response by poster: It sounds to me like the file was corrupt on your laptop, and that the error has nothing to do with dropbox.
I suppose it's possible, but I was literally using the file 2 seconds prior to involving dropbox.
posted by dobbs at 1:30 PM on November 8, 2010
I suppose it's possible, but I was literally using the file 2 seconds prior to involving dropbox.
posted by dobbs at 1:30 PM on November 8, 2010
I suppose it's possible, but I was literally using the file 2 seconds prior to involving dropbox.
It still happens, though. I've had that sort of thing happen countless times with MS Word (I'm not very familiar with Scrivener). The other possibility is watch watch out for turtles suggests, that you didn't wait for the file to completely update to dropbox's servers. However, I find this unlikely unless it was a veeeery large file, or unless your internet connection is very slow.
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 1:33 PM on November 8, 2010
It still happens, though. I've had that sort of thing happen countless times with MS Word (I'm not very familiar with Scrivener). The other possibility is watch watch out for turtles suggests, that you didn't wait for the file to completely update to dropbox's servers. However, I find this unlikely unless it was a veeeery large file, or unless your internet connection is very slow.
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 1:33 PM on November 8, 2010
This is important: Once you drag a file onto the Dropbox, IT IS NO LONGER ON YOUR COMPUTER
THIS IS NOT TRUE. THIS INFORMATION IS FALSE.
posted by dmd at 1:40 PM on November 8, 2010 [13 favorites]
THIS IS NOT TRUE. THIS INFORMATION IS FALSE.
posted by dmd at 1:40 PM on November 8, 2010 [13 favorites]
The Dropbox program keeps one folder on your computer (your Dropbox folder) in sync across other computers, mobile devices, and their website. Whatever you do in that folder, at any location, is mirrored in every other location linked to your account.
When you save a file to your Dropbox folder, that file is pushed to your other locations. When you delete a file from your Dropbox folder, that file is deleted from your other locations.
As long as both computers are connected to the internet and the Dropbox program isn't giving you any errors, all computers linked to your Dropbox account should have identical Dropbox folders. (Given time for uploading/downloading changes, of course.)
posted by Zozo at 1:48 PM on November 8, 2010
When you save a file to your Dropbox folder, that file is pushed to your other locations. When you delete a file from your Dropbox folder, that file is deleted from your other locations.
As long as both computers are connected to the internet and the Dropbox program isn't giving you any errors, all computers linked to your Dropbox account should have identical Dropbox folders. (Given time for uploading/downloading changes, of course.)
posted by Zozo at 1:48 PM on November 8, 2010
dmd - exactly. That is utter rubbish. The file is still on your computer hence you can disconnect from the internet and still read it.
There are two things here. Firstly, you should keep the file in the dropbox folder at all times and edit it there. This ensures your latest changes are synchronised with dropbox constantly (while you are online).
Secondly, you should be able to log into dropbox and use the web interface to restore previous revisions. This should get a working version of your file back. To me, it sounds like the desktop corrupted the file and resynced the corruptions back to the laptop via dropbox. Let us know if you can get an old revison to work.
posted by turkeyphant at 1:51 PM on November 8, 2010
There are two things here. Firstly, you should keep the file in the dropbox folder at all times and edit it there. This ensures your latest changes are synchronised with dropbox constantly (while you are online).
Secondly, you should be able to log into dropbox and use the web interface to restore previous revisions. This should get a working version of your file back. To me, it sounds like the desktop corrupted the file and resynced the corruptions back to the laptop via dropbox. Let us know if you can get an old revison to work.
posted by turkeyphant at 1:51 PM on November 8, 2010
Secondly, you should be able to log into dropbox and use the web interface to restore previous revisions. This should get a working version of your file back.
Not if this was the first time dobbs saved a version of that file into his dropbox folder. :(
Have you tried doing anything like rolling back your computer to a previous version?
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 1:53 PM on November 8, 2010
Not if this was the first time dobbs saved a version of that file into his dropbox folder. :(
Have you tried doing anything like rolling back your computer to a previous version?
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 1:53 PM on November 8, 2010
(Your laptop, where the original scrivener file was saved, that is.)
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 1:54 PM on November 8, 2010
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 1:54 PM on November 8, 2010
It sounds like the problem may have come from the fact that you moved a file while it was open, and you were working on it. Normally, this isn't a huge deal, but some programs really don't like it.
If you drag a file into your dropbox, you should still be able to work on it while it's uploading itself to the Dropbox server (ie. blue circle). However, you won't be able to work on it on other computers until it's been uploaded. Like I mentioned earlier, you shouldn't move files around while they're open, regardless of whether it's between another folder, dropbox, usb drive, etc.
Dropbox is usually pretty much foolproof. There's no technical reason for you to be taking files in or out of your Dropbox -- the computer sees it as a normal, completely unremarkable folder*. I usually create my documents in the Dropbox folder, and leave them there.
*And it is, in fact, a normal, completely unremarkable folder. If you close the Dropbox program, or even uninstall it, those files stay there as if they had always been on your PC. The program simply synchronizes any changes that you might make across multiple computers and the dropbox website.
Also, if you think you've corrupted a file, it's generally not such a great idea to delete it immediately. Don't do that again. You might have nerdy friends (who happen to be contactable via a particular green website) who might be able to help you recover its contents.
posted by schmod at 2:09 PM on November 8, 2010
If you drag a file into your dropbox, you should still be able to work on it while it's uploading itself to the Dropbox server (ie. blue circle). However, you won't be able to work on it on other computers until it's been uploaded. Like I mentioned earlier, you shouldn't move files around while they're open, regardless of whether it's between another folder, dropbox, usb drive, etc.
Dropbox is usually pretty much foolproof. There's no technical reason for you to be taking files in or out of your Dropbox -- the computer sees it as a normal, completely unremarkable folder*. I usually create my documents in the Dropbox folder, and leave them there.
*And it is, in fact, a normal, completely unremarkable folder. If you close the Dropbox program, or even uninstall it, those files stay there as if they had always been on your PC. The program simply synchronizes any changes that you might make across multiple computers and the dropbox website.
Also, if you think you've corrupted a file, it's generally not such a great idea to delete it immediately. Don't do that again. You might have nerdy friends (who happen to be contactable via a particular green website) who might be able to help you recover its contents.
posted by schmod at 2:09 PM on November 8, 2010
Response by poster: To me, it sounds like the desktop corrupted the file and resynced the corruptions back to the laptop via dropbox.
Yes, this is exactly what I think happened.
However, since it was the first time I used dropbox with this file, it's the only incarnation of it on the service.
PhoB, I tried everything I could think of but couldn't find the file.
posted by dobbs at 2:11 PM on November 8, 2010
Yes, this is exactly what I think happened.
However, since it was the first time I used dropbox with this file, it's the only incarnation of it on the service.
PhoB, I tried everything I could think of but couldn't find the file.
posted by dobbs at 2:11 PM on November 8, 2010
Response by poster: Don't do that again. You might have nerdy friends (who happen to be contactable via a particular green website) who might be able to help you recover its contents.
Yes, except that I deleted it on a computer B while, I thought, it was intact on Computer A. I didn't expect computer B to send the corrupted file back to computer A and replace the good file.
Nine years of working on documents and emailing them back and forth between computers without a single issue. I step into the 21st century for 3 minutes and I lose 4 months of work.
Anyway, thanks for your answers, folks. I think it's best I just avoid the future and stay in the past.
posted by dobbs at 2:15 PM on November 8, 2010
Yes, except that I deleted it on a computer B while, I thought, it was intact on Computer A. I didn't expect computer B to send the corrupted file back to computer A and replace the good file.
Nine years of working on documents and emailing them back and forth between computers without a single issue. I step into the 21st century for 3 minutes and I lose 4 months of work.
Anyway, thanks for your answers, folks. I think it's best I just avoid the future and stay in the past.
posted by dobbs at 2:15 PM on November 8, 2010
PhoBWanKenobi - I was working on the assumption that it was synced from the laptop then corrupted by the desktop.
dobbs - if that did happen, there would be a previous version uploaded from the laptop before it was overwritten by the desktop. Are there definitely no revisions?
posted by turkeyphant at 2:24 PM on November 8, 2010
dobbs - if that did happen, there would be a previous version uploaded from the laptop before it was overwritten by the desktop. Are there definitely no revisions?
posted by turkeyphant at 2:24 PM on November 8, 2010
Response by poster: Well, the file was called September09.scriv.
When I look at my dropbox website I see this:
September09Backup.scriv
September09Old_backup.scriv
Both have little square "package" like icons next to them. If I click on them they open and reveal things like "binder.scriv.proj" and some xml files. If I download them, Scrivener won't open them and tell me the file is possibly in use on another computer (it's not).
When I go into my Deleted files on Dropbox web site I see the same files as above and when I restore them and download them, none of them will open.
None of those packages have any date info or size data so I have no idea what's what. In the deleted files I see multiple versions of September09Old_backup.scriv and then September09Old_backupOld_backup.scriv and then September09Old_backupOld_backupOld_backup.scriv
posted by dobbs at 2:34 PM on November 8, 2010
When I look at my dropbox website I see this:
September09Backup.scriv
September09Old_backup.scriv
Both have little square "package" like icons next to them. If I click on them they open and reveal things like "binder.scriv.proj" and some xml files. If I download them, Scrivener won't open them and tell me the file is possibly in use on another computer (it's not).
When I go into my Deleted files on Dropbox web site I see the same files as above and when I restore them and download them, none of them will open.
None of those packages have any date info or size data so I have no idea what's what. In the deleted files I see multiple versions of September09Old_backup.scriv and then September09Old_backupOld_backup.scriv and then September09Old_backupOld_backupOld_backup.scriv
posted by dobbs at 2:34 PM on November 8, 2010
Anyway, thanks for your answers, folks. I think it's best I just avoid the future and stay in the past.
Aw, seriously, dropbox used properly can stop precisely this issue from happening--and from your even needing to ever go through manual back-up ever again. Which, you know, maybe you should have done in four months of work? I get your pain; really, I do. But that's a long time to go without backing up a writing project! See this previous question from me about the data loss that prompted me to begin using dropbox in the first place.
What with there only being one (corrupted) copy of the file on dropbox's servers, I suspect one of two things happened:
-The file on the laptop was corrupted.
-You opened the file on your desktop before it finished transferring from your desktop, hence scrivener telling you the file was corrupted. Then you dragged it from your dropbox file into the trash. If you were connected to the internet when you did this, it likely messed up the file in your dropbox even further (in fact, I'm surprised it was even there when you went back to your laptop).
Something to keep in mind is that your files in your dropbox folder are meant to be identical on all computers it's located on, so long as your computer is logged in and connected to the internet. If you want to make a manual copy, it's better to copy it and paste it rather than relocating the file wholesale--but again, with the way that dropbox works, it's actually best to just work entirely in the folder, because dropbox's servers will keep timed backups of all of your files, accessible from anywhere (not just your computers) in the event that, say, you have a massive hard drive failure on all of your computers at once or something terrible like that.
Good luck finding a copy of your project somewhere, though. I'll keep my fingers crossed that perhaps you have some of it lying around somewhere you haven't checked yet.
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 2:41 PM on November 8, 2010
Aw, seriously, dropbox used properly can stop precisely this issue from happening--and from your even needing to ever go through manual back-up ever again. Which, you know, maybe you should have done in four months of work? I get your pain; really, I do. But that's a long time to go without backing up a writing project! See this previous question from me about the data loss that prompted me to begin using dropbox in the first place.
What with there only being one (corrupted) copy of the file on dropbox's servers, I suspect one of two things happened:
-The file on the laptop was corrupted.
-You opened the file on your desktop before it finished transferring from your desktop, hence scrivener telling you the file was corrupted. Then you dragged it from your dropbox file into the trash. If you were connected to the internet when you did this, it likely messed up the file in your dropbox even further (in fact, I'm surprised it was even there when you went back to your laptop).
Something to keep in mind is that your files in your dropbox folder are meant to be identical on all computers it's located on, so long as your computer is logged in and connected to the internet. If you want to make a manual copy, it's better to copy it and paste it rather than relocating the file wholesale--but again, with the way that dropbox works, it's actually best to just work entirely in the folder, because dropbox's servers will keep timed backups of all of your files, accessible from anywhere (not just your computers) in the event that, say, you have a massive hard drive failure on all of your computers at once or something terrible like that.
Good luck finding a copy of your project somewhere, though. I'll keep my fingers crossed that perhaps you have some of it lying around somewhere you haven't checked yet.
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 2:41 PM on November 8, 2010
Does this help? It sounds like dropbox and scrivener aren't known for playing nicely together.
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 2:44 PM on November 8, 2010
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 2:44 PM on November 8, 2010
This link specifically talks about how some forked file formats, including scrivener, sometimes leaves copies in dropbox's cache. More information is on Scrivener's forums here.
(Sorry so many posts; having known the pain of data loss, I'd love for you to magically recover your project!)
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 2:55 PM on November 8, 2010
(Sorry so many posts; having known the pain of data loss, I'd love for you to magically recover your project!)
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 2:55 PM on November 8, 2010
It's worth noting that there is (or maybe was; it's not clear to me whether this has been totally fixed yet) a compatibility problem between Dropbox and Scrivener. I don't know if that explains the behavior; I haven't used Dropbox myself (just Scrivener), so I'm just throwing that out there.
I know that the makers of Scrivener have recommended zipping the .scriv file before storing it anywhere because it doesn't play nice with network syncing. That's an old thread, though, so it's possible the new version may have changed something.
[On preview: what PhoB said.]
posted by sineala at 2:55 PM on November 8, 2010
I know that the makers of Scrivener have recommended zipping the .scriv file before storing it anywhere because it doesn't play nice with network syncing. That's an old thread, though, so it's possible the new version may have changed something.
[On preview: what PhoB said.]
posted by sineala at 2:55 PM on November 8, 2010
Best answer: Oooh ooh ooh, try this from the next page of that Scrivener forum post:
Re: Working off of network drives (MobileMe; DropBox...)posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 3:01 PM on November 8, 2010
by dave8118 on Mon Oct 25, 2010 10:51 pm
What I've read in the past led me to believe that work wouldn't quite exactly be *lost* through dropbox. As I understand it, what in fact happens is something like this: when dropbox sees a potential sychronization conflict between two versions of a file it renames one of them (e.g. to something like "3 monday-oct-25th-version.rtf"). When those files are located within a .scriv package, scrivener doesn't know to look for a file that has a title different from the title that scrivener originally gave it.
But the file continues to exist (albeit invisible to Scrivener, which only looks for files with names like "3.rtf") within the package. So if you're looking for your lost work, you just have to right-click and select "show package contents…" —and if you're wondering if you've ever had lost work, you just have to do that and look for files with funny names like that.
The mechanics aren't that important, really. Is my conclusion (dropbox-lost work isn't really lost; it's just invisible to scrivener, hiding in files inside the .scriv project) correct? If not, that would affect my risk-reward calculation here.
Thanks,
David
dave8118
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Re: Working off of network drives (MobileMe; DropBox...)
by KB on Mon Oct 25, 2010 11:04 pm
Hi David,
Yes, the worst that usually happens is that Dropbox renames some files inside the .scriv package "behind Scrivener's back", so fixing it is usually as easy as drilling into the .scriv file and changing the names back. Scrivener 2.0 is better at looking for the most recent binder file anyway - which is the most frequent problem - but that won't prevent problems if Dropbox renames other files too. Most Dropbox issues are an easy fix and we really need to put something on our wiki page about it when we get chance to breathe, but it would be remiss of us to say that you can't lose data, because there is a minor risk involved still. I'm sure Ioa will be able to say more as he's a bit of an expert on these issues.
All the best,
Keith
Normally, this isn't a huge deal, but some programs really don't like it.
I've used Scrivener and tried to work out a Scrivener + Dropbox solution for sharing work and it was really tough to do. Partly this is because a Scrivener "file" is actually a set of files all jammed together (a package) that Dropbox views as similar to a folder. We got around this by basically zipping the file before we uploaded it so it was clear that there was one zipped file that was moving back and forth. This did add an extra annoying step, however. You might want to look into the renaming option that PhoBWanKenobi suggests because it might be that you can salvage more than you think.
posted by jessamyn at 3:24 PM on November 8, 2010
I've used Scrivener and tried to work out a Scrivener + Dropbox solution for sharing work and it was really tough to do. Partly this is because a Scrivener "file" is actually a set of files all jammed together (a package) that Dropbox views as similar to a folder. We got around this by basically zipping the file before we uploaded it so it was clear that there was one zipped file that was moving back and forth. This did add an extra annoying step, however. You might want to look into the renaming option that PhoBWanKenobi suggests because it might be that you can salvage more than you think.
posted by jessamyn at 3:24 PM on November 8, 2010
Did you know that Dropbox keeps a revision history of your changes? You should never be lose work on Dropbox unless you're approaching the size limits or one of your computers fails to sync your work.
Not entirely true. Dropbox keeps a revision history for 30 days unless you have the Pack Rat add-on. Revisions older than that are deleted from Dropbox.
Not knowing this screwed me over big time when I corrupted files but decided not to retrieve the last saved version immediately under the assumption that they would always be there. Two months later, when I desperately needed them, they were gone from Dropbox forever.
posted by emilyd22222 at 3:43 PM on November 8, 2010 [1 favorite]
Not entirely true. Dropbox keeps a revision history for 30 days unless you have the Pack Rat add-on. Revisions older than that are deleted from Dropbox.
Not knowing this screwed me over big time when I corrupted files but decided not to retrieve the last saved version immediately under the assumption that they would always be there. Two months later, when I desperately needed them, they were gone from Dropbox forever.
posted by emilyd22222 at 3:43 PM on November 8, 2010 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: Thanks everyone.... Especially PhoBWanKenobi! Looks like that method gets the text back! Though Scrivener can't open the file, I can read the text in a text editor and cut and paste it so the works not lost, just a mess of formatting and a few hours of back-and-forthing it.
Thanks!
posted by dobbs at 4:06 PM on November 8, 2010 [1 favorite]
Thanks!
posted by dobbs at 4:06 PM on November 8, 2010 [1 favorite]
Glad this is resolved, dobbs. I don't use Scrivener, but I do have a Dropbox system that's not quite been spelled out yet.
I have gigs and gigs of files that are old and won't really ever change, but which I might need to access to start a new project. These are stored in a folder called "archive" that I have multiply backed up, and copied on to the harddrives of all the machines I work on. THEN I have dropbox, which is where I store everything new. At significant milestones (like the purchase of a new computer), I clean up the Dropbox, moving completed projects to a new version of Archive, and staying below the Dropbox free storage limit. I replace the Archive on all my machines, and I never change it until I do a new cleanup. In short, all old work is backed up insanely, and all new work exists on about 4 physical machines and on dropbox (and usually on a USB key as well).
Also, I don't know about the Scrivener conflict, but for most apps the Dropbox system will, as someone pointed out, create a new file if there's a conflict. That way if I leave something open (and unsynced) on a work computer, I can still change that file on my laptop and later go back and sort it out. This can be not pretty, but it usually means no "lost work" in the absolute sense.
I would like to use Ubuntu One in this way but I haven't figured it out yet.
posted by Mngo at 4:26 PM on November 8, 2010 [1 favorite]
I have gigs and gigs of files that are old and won't really ever change, but which I might need to access to start a new project. These are stored in a folder called "archive" that I have multiply backed up, and copied on to the harddrives of all the machines I work on. THEN I have dropbox, which is where I store everything new. At significant milestones (like the purchase of a new computer), I clean up the Dropbox, moving completed projects to a new version of Archive, and staying below the Dropbox free storage limit. I replace the Archive on all my machines, and I never change it until I do a new cleanup. In short, all old work is backed up insanely, and all new work exists on about 4 physical machines and on dropbox (and usually on a USB key as well).
Also, I don't know about the Scrivener conflict, but for most apps the Dropbox system will, as someone pointed out, create a new file if there's a conflict. That way if I leave something open (and unsynced) on a work computer, I can still change that file on my laptop and later go back and sort it out. This can be not pretty, but it usually means no "lost work" in the absolute sense.
I would like to use Ubuntu One in this way but I haven't figured it out yet.
posted by Mngo at 4:26 PM on November 8, 2010 [1 favorite]
This is important: Once you drag a file onto the Dropbox, IT IS NO LONGER ON YOUR COMPUTER
THIS IS NOT TRUE. THIS INFORMATION IS FALSE.
Thanks for clarifying this dmd. I'm sorry, I spoke too fast. I meant that if you dragged and dropped to the Dropbox folder from another folder, then it was no longer in the original folder. It's equivalent to the move function between folders, not the copy function between a hard-drive folder to a usb key. The Dropbox folder version is then the master copy, and if the file is changed on another computer, there's no "original" to go back to and find on the first computer outside of the Dropbox. (only Dropbox's own backup system)
posted by watch out for turtles at 4:35 PM on November 8, 2010
THIS IS NOT TRUE. THIS INFORMATION IS FALSE.
Thanks for clarifying this dmd. I'm sorry, I spoke too fast. I meant that if you dragged and dropped to the Dropbox folder from another folder, then it was no longer in the original folder. It's equivalent to the move function between folders, not the copy function between a hard-drive folder to a usb key. The Dropbox folder version is then the master copy, and if the file is changed on another computer, there's no "original" to go back to and find on the first computer outside of the Dropbox. (only Dropbox's own backup system)
posted by watch out for turtles at 4:35 PM on November 8, 2010
Yay! Glad you got your files back.
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 5:01 PM on November 8, 2010
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 5:01 PM on November 8, 2010
I have used Dropbox heavily for two years without any issues. I have approx. 20,000 files in my Dropbox folder, and I share the same folder across 6 devices (3 Windows and 3 OS X/iOS). I have never lost a single byte, and it has been an incredibly convenient application. I now save virtually all my documents directly to Dropbox, except for large media files. I highly recommend that anyone not familiar with it learn how to incorporate it into your computing life, as the benefits are immense.
posted by SNACKeR at 6:59 PM on November 8, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by SNACKeR at 6:59 PM on November 8, 2010 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: I should add that I just got an email from Scrivener--I sent them the corrupt file to see if they could do anything with it. They couldn't "fix" it but these steps allowed me to get the text into Scrivener in the best way possible:
1. On your computer (ie, not on dropbox), right click on the package and choose "reveal contents"
2. A folder will open with all the files.
3. Open Scrivener and create a new project.
4. Delete all non RTFD RTF PDF and TXT files from your Scrivener package.
5. Drag all remaining files into your Scrivener project's binder.
The files will import and appear as they used to. However, you'll lose the Scrivener folder structure and file names (they'll just be numbered).
Thanks again to everyone who answered!
posted by dobbs at 7:42 PM on November 8, 2010
1. On your computer (ie, not on dropbox), right click on the package and choose "reveal contents"
2. A folder will open with all the files.
3. Open Scrivener and create a new project.
4. Delete all non RTFD RTF PDF and TXT files from your Scrivener package.
5. Drag all remaining files into your Scrivener project's binder.
The files will import and appear as they used to. However, you'll lose the Scrivener folder structure and file names (they'll just be numbered).
Thanks again to everyone who answered!
posted by dobbs at 7:42 PM on November 8, 2010
For posterity (hello, future Googlers!), this is a great roundup post of everything you might need to know about effectively using Dropbox.
posted by Zozo at 9:27 AM on November 15, 2010
posted by Zozo at 9:27 AM on November 15, 2010
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by zixyer at 12:50 PM on November 8, 2010 [1 favorite]