Women lie, men lie. But how far can it go?
October 14, 2010 11:15 PM Subscribe
So my roommate, a lovely, nice, intelligent, mostly wonderful sweet girl is MAYBE a psychopath. Maybe.
Here's the deal: she broke up with her boyfriend several months ago (I think maybe 2-5 months, not sure). They still talked, were supposed to be good friends but occasionally fought about their actual friendship. They still had sexytimes (unprotected, like in their relationship) after they broke up. So the other day she told me that 1. she lied about being late to her ex boyfriend 2. she LIED ABOUT BEING PREGNANT and 3. she LIED ABOUT GETTING AN ABORTION. When she first revealed these things to me, I wanted to say "WTF ARE YOU DOING? THIS IS CRAZY! You're one of those hypothetical (in my mind, at least) crazy ex girlfriends I watch on Jerry Springer!" I tried to stop myself and filter out any judgments because she seems like she has a problem and I want to help her so I asked her why.
Her reason is that she wanted to see if her ex boyfriend still cared about her. Here's the disappointment (from her perspective), he cared, but didn't call because he doesn't have a phone. She said that he wishes he could do something and actually be there (They live in different countries). And on the day of her 'pretend' abortion, he didn't email her or ask her about it. I'm assuming the guy knows she's crazy.
Even before this, she admitted to hacking onto his email and Facebook. I still thought that was kinda crazy, but harmless. After she told me about this, I thought it was a big red flag and maybe a cry for help. I know she lies to her parents (but who doesn't?) and to her brother about being religious. I've caught her in a lie about her other "ex boyfriend" (he doesn't exist), I've caught her lying about people coming over the apartment, and hanging out with people she knows that would hurt me (like my ex boyfriend and his friends).
She's also depressed, if that makes any difference. We actually became friends freshman year because we were both waiting for counseling at school. Maybe she's just a compulsive liar? After all of this, I still want to be her friend because for the most part she's a great person, she's happy, very considerate, we always have fun and get into trouble. It's just this side of her is really concerning me. Mefites, how can I help her?
Here's the deal: she broke up with her boyfriend several months ago (I think maybe 2-5 months, not sure). They still talked, were supposed to be good friends but occasionally fought about their actual friendship. They still had sexytimes (unprotected, like in their relationship) after they broke up. So the other day she told me that 1. she lied about being late to her ex boyfriend 2. she LIED ABOUT BEING PREGNANT and 3. she LIED ABOUT GETTING AN ABORTION. When she first revealed these things to me, I wanted to say "WTF ARE YOU DOING? THIS IS CRAZY! You're one of those hypothetical (in my mind, at least) crazy ex girlfriends I watch on Jerry Springer!" I tried to stop myself and filter out any judgments because she seems like she has a problem and I want to help her so I asked her why.
Her reason is that she wanted to see if her ex boyfriend still cared about her. Here's the disappointment (from her perspective), he cared, but didn't call because he doesn't have a phone. She said that he wishes he could do something and actually be there (They live in different countries). And on the day of her 'pretend' abortion, he didn't email her or ask her about it. I'm assuming the guy knows she's crazy.
Even before this, she admitted to hacking onto his email and Facebook. I still thought that was kinda crazy, but harmless. After she told me about this, I thought it was a big red flag and maybe a cry for help. I know she lies to her parents (but who doesn't?) and to her brother about being religious. I've caught her in a lie about her other "ex boyfriend" (he doesn't exist), I've caught her lying about people coming over the apartment, and hanging out with people she knows that would hurt me (like my ex boyfriend and his friends).
She's also depressed, if that makes any difference. We actually became friends freshman year because we were both waiting for counseling at school. Maybe she's just a compulsive liar? After all of this, I still want to be her friend because for the most part she's a great person, she's happy, very considerate, we always have fun and get into trouble. It's just this side of her is really concerning me. Mefites, how can I help her?
You can't. You need to decide if the good outweighs the bad, but don't fool yourself into thinking you can change her or help her if she doesn't want your help.
posted by MadamM at 11:23 PM on October 14, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by MadamM at 11:23 PM on October 14, 2010 [1 favorite]
If you decide to be friends with her, go in with your eyes open and protect yourself. Protect your various accounts from hacking; don't leave your cell phone vulnerable; don't make it possible for her to contact your employer; make sure your friends and family trust you so that if you decide you need a break, or she becomes angry at you for another reason, you won't have to worry about her messing up your life.
posted by amtho at 11:26 PM on October 14, 2010 [9 favorites]
posted by amtho at 11:26 PM on October 14, 2010 [9 favorites]
You can't help her if she doesn't want to be helped, and especially not if she doesn't see that how she is behaving is a problem.
But you need to protect yourself from her. Don't let her know your passwords or usernames for facebook, email, or bank accounts. Make sure you always log out of these. Don't necessarily believe anything she tells you unless you have external confirmation. Don't fall for any guilt-tripping she attempts on you.
Have a back-up plan of somewhere to live or at least stay if things go pear-shaped between you.
Anything you see her doing to other people, she could be doing to you, in the future if not already.
posted by lollusc at 11:28 PM on October 14, 2010 [4 favorites]
But you need to protect yourself from her. Don't let her know your passwords or usernames for facebook, email, or bank accounts. Make sure you always log out of these. Don't necessarily believe anything she tells you unless you have external confirmation. Don't fall for any guilt-tripping she attempts on you.
Have a back-up plan of somewhere to live or at least stay if things go pear-shaped between you.
Anything you see her doing to other people, she could be doing to you, in the future if not already.
posted by lollusc at 11:28 PM on October 14, 2010 [4 favorites]
I can't tell if you are roommates in school, or if you are renting an apartment together. If it's the former, well, there isn't much you can do to help, aside from stopping biting your tongue about how troubling you find some of her actions to be. You can't make her get the help she needs, you can only do your best to make sure she knows that you feel that some of her behaviors are deeply unhealthy, and a sign that she should continue to seek counseling.
If you two are off-campus or post-collegiate roommates, and are signed onto a lease together, than my advice would be to find the quickest and least conflict generating way out of it.
posted by patnasty at 11:35 PM on October 14, 2010 [1 favorite]
If you two are off-campus or post-collegiate roommates, and are signed onto a lease together, than my advice would be to find the quickest and least conflict generating way out of it.
posted by patnasty at 11:35 PM on October 14, 2010 [1 favorite]
This sounds like fairly normal, if intense, drama. It certainly wouldn't be the first time in human history that that exact sequence of events played out, including lying about a nonexistent ex. Maybe the boyfriend saw through the pregnancy ruse, maybe he's a jerk, but in hindsight, they appear to be broken up. I don't know what you do about pathological liars, though, which would seem to be what remains.
posted by rhizome at 11:53 PM on October 14, 2010 [3 favorites]
posted by rhizome at 11:53 PM on October 14, 2010 [3 favorites]
lollusc: But you need to protect yourself from her.
yes. very much so.
posted by molecicco at 12:47 AM on October 15, 2010 [1 favorite]
yes. very much so.
posted by molecicco at 12:47 AM on October 15, 2010 [1 favorite]
She could be a pathological liar, possibly. The only thing you can do for her is to encourage her to seek therapy (again). You could point out to her that her lying is, at least in this case, harmful and unacceptable. Also, hacking into her ex-boyfriend's accounts is not harmless.
Okay... story time... In college in a different decade, I had a roommate who was, and still is, an intelligent, lovely, wonderful person, and a pathological liar. She actually convinced me that she had a malicious tumor in her brain. I tried to help, I tried to be there for her, I missed classes, I did all the housework, looked after her, etc. Years later, she finally went to lots of therapy, and started to get happier and healthier. Well, she friend-dumped me when her therapist told her she either had to come clean or cut people out. It was very hurtful, I was very sad and confused.
Protect yourself, do not get too involved nor invested. There are lots of people with whom you can have fun and get into trouble. She is not the good kind of trouble.
posted by copperbleu at 1:10 AM on October 15, 2010
Okay... story time... In college in a different decade, I had a roommate who was, and still is, an intelligent, lovely, wonderful person, and a pathological liar. She actually convinced me that she had a malicious tumor in her brain. I tried to help, I tried to be there for her, I missed classes, I did all the housework, looked after her, etc. Years later, she finally went to lots of therapy, and started to get happier and healthier. Well, she friend-dumped me when her therapist told her she either had to come clean or cut people out. It was very hurtful, I was very sad and confused.
Protect yourself, do not get too involved nor invested. There are lots of people with whom you can have fun and get into trouble. She is not the good kind of trouble.
posted by copperbleu at 1:10 AM on October 15, 2010
Best answer: She is probably not a psychopath, but it is clear to me that she's a boatload of drama. Who has the kind of time to create new problems out of existing ones? I would protect yourself to the hilt from this one. Whether or not you decide to keep her as your roommate and/or friend is up to you. But either way, I would try not to be so involved in her life, i.e. find ways that make it difficult for you to know the details of her life and for her to convey them to you.
posted by iamkimiam at 1:11 AM on October 15, 2010 [4 favorites]
posted by iamkimiam at 1:11 AM on October 15, 2010 [4 favorites]
I don't think terms like "psychopath" are really helpful or applicable in situations like this...
But I think you should get this person out of your life in the quickest, easiest way possible. You don't want friends, accquaintances or associates like that. Why even bother trying to help her? Firstly, it's not possible. You can't just "fix" somebody with issues like that. Secondly, why are you even bothered? She's not your responsibility in the slightest.
Cut ties.
posted by Ted Maul at 2:15 AM on October 15, 2010 [4 favorites]
But I think you should get this person out of your life in the quickest, easiest way possible. You don't want friends, accquaintances or associates like that. Why even bother trying to help her? Firstly, it's not possible. You can't just "fix" somebody with issues like that. Secondly, why are you even bothered? She's not your responsibility in the slightest.
Cut ties.
posted by Ted Maul at 2:15 AM on October 15, 2010 [4 favorites]
I don't know if you can rightly call her lying pathological, or label her as a psychopath, or chalk all this up to depression.
In a way it's easier to label her crazy, but what she's actually done here is express values that are very different from yours (which is not to be nonjudgemental in any way - obviously her values are, like, really bad ones).
Posters who've pointed out that she's eventually going to turn this stuff on you are probably right. So now you have a contradiction to resolve. On the one hand, she's fun and really nice. On the other hand, she's evil. Plus you have to live with her. No wonder you're trying to find a way of making sense of it. However, you can be evil in all sorts of ways without actually being a psychopath.
In the end, you will never solve the mystery of another human's subjectivity. The question is usually what to do with it. In your case I'd suggest that you secure your information at all times and try to find a way out of your living situation so as to minimize contact with her.
While this may hurt her feelings, and you won't have a fun person to hang out with, the only thing that has the smallest chance of succeeding is if she loses friends and suspects that it's a result of her behaviour. And even that is beyond your control. She may rationalize it or just not give a toss.
OTOH if you decide to stay friends with her, expect to get hurt.
posted by tel3path at 3:19 AM on October 15, 2010 [1 favorite]
In a way it's easier to label her crazy, but what she's actually done here is express values that are very different from yours (which is not to be nonjudgemental in any way - obviously her values are, like, really bad ones).
Posters who've pointed out that she's eventually going to turn this stuff on you are probably right. So now you have a contradiction to resolve. On the one hand, she's fun and really nice. On the other hand, she's evil. Plus you have to live with her. No wonder you're trying to find a way of making sense of it. However, you can be evil in all sorts of ways without actually being a psychopath.
In the end, you will never solve the mystery of another human's subjectivity. The question is usually what to do with it. In your case I'd suggest that you secure your information at all times and try to find a way out of your living situation so as to minimize contact with her.
While this may hurt her feelings, and you won't have a fun person to hang out with, the only thing that has the smallest chance of succeeding is if she loses friends and suspects that it's a result of her behaviour. And even that is beyond your control. She may rationalize it or just not give a toss.
OTOH if you decide to stay friends with her, expect to get hurt.
posted by tel3path at 3:19 AM on October 15, 2010 [1 favorite]
The most I would do in your shoes is provide a shoulder to cry on and encourage her to seek professional help. She has already crossed the line of rational behaviour and may not respond well to more direct methods (such as telling the bunny boiler she's got to fess up to her ex).
But before you go even that far, ask yourself how much you really care how it ends for her. Enough to risk getting sucked into her world of drama and deception? Nobody would blame you if you just nodded and smiled in all the right places while looking for somewhere else to live.
posted by londonmark at 4:34 AM on October 15, 2010
But before you go even that far, ask yourself how much you really care how it ends for her. Enough to risk getting sucked into her world of drama and deception? Nobody would blame you if you just nodded and smiled in all the right places while looking for somewhere else to live.
posted by londonmark at 4:34 AM on October 15, 2010
Sometimes a relationship - not a good one, obviously - makes you crazy and stupid. Maybe she's like this as a permanent condition, or maybe this will be one of those cringe-y life lessons she'll get to look back on and think, "Man, my roommate was such a ______ when all that crazy happened."
I think you can't go wrong filling that blank with "calm, sympathetic presence" rather than "asshole". You don't have to get deeply involved, but you don't have to break a lease and bail on her just for having a bad patch. If it's ongoing, if it's disrupting your life, if she's unable to pay rent and bills, then you need to take care of your business, obviously. But if you can go on about your own life and also be in the vicinity for her, I don't see how that's going to hurt anybody.
posted by Lyn Never at 5:26 AM on October 15, 2010 [1 favorite]
I think you can't go wrong filling that blank with "calm, sympathetic presence" rather than "asshole". You don't have to get deeply involved, but you don't have to break a lease and bail on her just for having a bad patch. If it's ongoing, if it's disrupting your life, if she's unable to pay rent and bills, then you need to take care of your business, obviously. But if you can go on about your own life and also be in the vicinity for her, I don't see how that's going to hurt anybody.
posted by Lyn Never at 5:26 AM on October 15, 2010 [1 favorite]
Desperate people do stupid things. This does not qualify as a permanent medical condition.
posted by L'Estrange Fruit at 5:26 AM on October 15, 2010 [4 favorites]
posted by L'Estrange Fruit at 5:26 AM on October 15, 2010 [4 favorites]
She would not be the first person to tell this particular set of lies by a long shot, but that doesn't mean I'd want to be friends with her. I suggest that you extricate yourself from this roommate situation at the earliest available opportunity.
posted by amro at 5:28 AM on October 15, 2010
posted by amro at 5:28 AM on October 15, 2010
Anecdote:
I was friends with a woman who, in my opinion, was a pathological liar. For a long time, it didn't affect me and I was happy to hang out with her and enjoyed her company a great deal. Over time, it became more and more difficult to watch her lie to people. The lies ranged from small - what she had done at work that day - to much larger - usually things concerning her relationships with men.
She was a very good looking, articulate woman and men found her quite attractive; she employed the classic model of letting men buy her affection and would discuss with me how much it would take for her to do certain things - an expensive dinner, jewelry, and so on - and I'd cringe knowing that eventually she'd turn on the crazy and I'd have to hear about how everyone turned against her. The pattern with men repeated itself with her jobs - she'd do great for a few months and then end up getting fired, again, because everyone was against her.
When the proverbial sh$t hit the fan was when I dated the brother of one of her boyfriends and she started lying to me about things that he had said. It was about two years after he and I had amicably broken up - we were and still are friends and she called me and told me that her former boyfriend (my ex-boyfriends brother) had mentioned that he felt that I was stalking him. I was astonished because we were only sporadically in touch at that point but we'd planned to go camping for our birthdays in a few weeks. He had called me and suggested this. I was extremely disturbed by what she said and was worried that my ex might feel that I was calling him too much or something - that there was an error in transmission of what she'd heard through his brother. I called my ex-boyfriend to make sure that there wasn't a problem and he told me that he hadn't spoken to his brother in more than a couple of months. He then called his brother who said that this woman had been calling him repeatedly and that he'd told her directly to never contact him again. It was she who was stalking him.
We had a great time camping and I returned home and just never returned her calls. I'm sure from her perspective I'm just another person who turned against her. I'm still in touch with this ex-boyfriend and we still call one another on our birthdays and we occasionally mention how crazy this woman was.
During our friendship, I suggested to her multiple times to go see a therapist - I didn't mention the lying because I was somehow scared to. I have no idea how to handle your situation, but I wanted to tell this cautionary tale: eventually the crazy can get focused on you, so try to help your roommate but be careful.
posted by sciencegeek at 6:06 AM on October 15, 2010
I was friends with a woman who, in my opinion, was a pathological liar. For a long time, it didn't affect me and I was happy to hang out with her and enjoyed her company a great deal. Over time, it became more and more difficult to watch her lie to people. The lies ranged from small - what she had done at work that day - to much larger - usually things concerning her relationships with men.
She was a very good looking, articulate woman and men found her quite attractive; she employed the classic model of letting men buy her affection and would discuss with me how much it would take for her to do certain things - an expensive dinner, jewelry, and so on - and I'd cringe knowing that eventually she'd turn on the crazy and I'd have to hear about how everyone turned against her. The pattern with men repeated itself with her jobs - she'd do great for a few months and then end up getting fired, again, because everyone was against her.
When the proverbial sh$t hit the fan was when I dated the brother of one of her boyfriends and she started lying to me about things that he had said. It was about two years after he and I had amicably broken up - we were and still are friends and she called me and told me that her former boyfriend (my ex-boyfriends brother) had mentioned that he felt that I was stalking him. I was astonished because we were only sporadically in touch at that point but we'd planned to go camping for our birthdays in a few weeks. He had called me and suggested this. I was extremely disturbed by what she said and was worried that my ex might feel that I was calling him too much or something - that there was an error in transmission of what she'd heard through his brother. I called my ex-boyfriend to make sure that there wasn't a problem and he told me that he hadn't spoken to his brother in more than a couple of months. He then called his brother who said that this woman had been calling him repeatedly and that he'd told her directly to never contact him again. It was she who was stalking him.
We had a great time camping and I returned home and just never returned her calls. I'm sure from her perspective I'm just another person who turned against her. I'm still in touch with this ex-boyfriend and we still call one another on our birthdays and we occasionally mention how crazy this woman was.
During our friendship, I suggested to her multiple times to go see a therapist - I didn't mention the lying because I was somehow scared to. I have no idea how to handle your situation, but I wanted to tell this cautionary tale: eventually the crazy can get focused on you, so try to help your roommate but be careful.
posted by sciencegeek at 6:06 AM on October 15, 2010
Honestly, a diagnosis is hard to make from what we have available here - but it is also not so relevant.
It would be a really good idea to disengage yourself from this person as soon as possible. The lies she's telling are not harmless, and the closer you get to her, the more likely it will be that one of her over-the-top episodes will be focused on you.
Believe me when I say you do not want this to happen.
posted by FAMOUS MONSTER at 6:37 AM on October 15, 2010
It would be a really good idea to disengage yourself from this person as soon as possible. The lies she's telling are not harmless, and the closer you get to her, the more likely it will be that one of her over-the-top episodes will be focused on you.
Believe me when I say you do not want this to happen.
posted by FAMOUS MONSTER at 6:37 AM on October 15, 2010
The drama that a friendship like this brings is not worth the stories that you can tell at later dates. She may not be a psychopath, but she is not someone you want around, much like someone with a bad drug habit who suddenly pushes the baggie under the driver seat when you're not looking and causes you to get arrested.
Good luck. Move out and don't return the calls.
posted by zombieApoc at 6:37 AM on October 15, 2010 [1 favorite]
Good luck. Move out and don't return the calls.
posted by zombieApoc at 6:37 AM on October 15, 2010 [1 favorite]
Best answer: [F]or the most part she's a great person...
Remember Primal Fear? Richard Gere plays Marty, a lawyer defending Aaron, a meek stuttering alter boy played by Ed Norton who is accused of killing a priest. Aaron, it emerges, harbors another persona named Roy, who is aggressive and mean. When Roy makes havoc in the courtroom, an insanity defense is ensured. But then there's a revealing glitch and here's how the movie ends:
Marty: So there never... there never was a Roy?
Roy: Jesus Christ, Marty. If that's what you think, I'm disappointed in you. There never was an Aaron, counselor.
Why do you think the great person is her core personality and not the liar? Time to go.
posted by carmicha at 6:38 AM on October 15, 2010 [9 favorites]
Remember Primal Fear? Richard Gere plays Marty, a lawyer defending Aaron, a meek stuttering alter boy played by Ed Norton who is accused of killing a priest. Aaron, it emerges, harbors another persona named Roy, who is aggressive and mean. When Roy makes havoc in the courtroom, an insanity defense is ensured. But then there's a revealing glitch and here's how the movie ends:
Marty: So there never... there never was a Roy?
Roy: Jesus Christ, Marty. If that's what you think, I'm disappointed in you. There never was an Aaron, counselor.
Why do you think the great person is her core personality and not the liar? Time to go.
posted by carmicha at 6:38 AM on October 15, 2010 [9 favorites]
I'll give you some advice based on my dealings with liars.
They can be great people and fun to hang around, but don't fall into the trap of believing that because they are your friend they will not lie to you, or hurt you. They are LIARS!
As long as you are aware of that fact, have fun with them, be their friends. But don't believe anything they say, especially this: "But I would never lie to you." I mean, if she lies to her boyfriend (whom she supposedly loves), her parents and her brother, why wouldn't she lie to you? If you keep that fact in mind, you won't get hurt.
But know that even with that knowledge, it's hard to stay in a close friendship with someone like this because eventually she *will* manipulate you and you will find yourself crushed that she betrayed you. People who lie like this are only looking out for number one and you're not it.
posted by patheral at 7:07 AM on October 15, 2010 [2 favorites]
They can be great people and fun to hang around, but don't fall into the trap of believing that because they are your friend they will not lie to you, or hurt you. They are LIARS!
As long as you are aware of that fact, have fun with them, be their friends. But don't believe anything they say, especially this: "But I would never lie to you." I mean, if she lies to her boyfriend (whom she supposedly loves), her parents and her brother, why wouldn't she lie to you? If you keep that fact in mind, you won't get hurt.
But know that even with that knowledge, it's hard to stay in a close friendship with someone like this because eventually she *will* manipulate you and you will find yourself crushed that she betrayed you. People who lie like this are only looking out for number one and you're not it.
posted by patheral at 7:07 AM on October 15, 2010 [2 favorites]
she's nuts ... you can't help her ... run like the wind.
posted by jannw at 7:09 AM on October 15, 2010
posted by jannw at 7:09 AM on October 15, 2010
There's an interesting statement in your question that no one has directly commented on so far, which is "we always have fun and get into trouble". Presumably, the trouble that you are getting into has so far been relatively minor, or the nature of your question would be different (possibly "where can I find a good lawyer in my neighborhood?"). But from what you have told us about this woman, I expect continued and more serious trouble, if you continue to share housing with her. Of course, it's good to have fun. But ideally, you should be able to have fun without getting into trouble. If you can only have fun by getting into trouble, you really need to reconsider what you are doing, while you still can.
posted by grizzled at 7:20 AM on October 15, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by grizzled at 7:20 AM on October 15, 2010 [1 favorite]
In my experience, people who lie a lot can't be helped and, long term, can't be reliable friends either. They might be "fun" for a while, but believe me, that'll wear off as the lies pile up and trust evaporates.
posted by fivesavagepalms at 7:23 AM on October 15, 2010
posted by fivesavagepalms at 7:23 AM on October 15, 2010
I've behaved like kind of a nut regarding boys, especially in my younger immediate post-college years, but this description makes even me raise my eyebrows.
The abortion-lying is the kind of thing I would fantasize about doing immediately after a terrible breakup, and then not do. Fantasizing about it is kind of nuts. Doing it is really nuts.
People do grow up and change, so maybe she will. But. If she had just done the stuff to her exboyfriend, I'd say keep her around, because she seems crazy and immoral but what a bore to surround yourself with only perfect friends. The fact that she has done stuff to you, though, means you might want to get away.
posted by millipede at 9:17 AM on October 15, 2010
The abortion-lying is the kind of thing I would fantasize about doing immediately after a terrible breakup, and then not do. Fantasizing about it is kind of nuts. Doing it is really nuts.
People do grow up and change, so maybe she will. But. If she had just done the stuff to her exboyfriend, I'd say keep her around, because she seems crazy and immoral but what a bore to surround yourself with only perfect friends. The fact that she has done stuff to you, though, means you might want to get away.
posted by millipede at 9:17 AM on October 15, 2010
I still want to be her friend because for the most part she's a great person
You really have no reason to believe this, as she lies to everyone else. Why wouldn't she be creating a new self for you, as she does for the others in her life?
If you want to have lightweight good times with her, I think that's fine, but I'd be careful about getting emotionally caught up or believing anything, literally anything, that came out of her mouth.
posted by A Terrible Llama at 9:46 AM on October 15, 2010
You really have no reason to believe this, as she lies to everyone else. Why wouldn't she be creating a new self for you, as she does for the others in her life?
If you want to have lightweight good times with her, I think that's fine, but I'd be careful about getting emotionally caught up or believing anything, literally anything, that came out of her mouth.
posted by A Terrible Llama at 9:46 AM on October 15, 2010
Best answer: I have a few questions for you...does it seem like she has a lot of piercings/tattoos/etc that she gets on a whim? Does she change other aspects of her appearance, like her hair, frequently? Is she promiscuous? Has she ever attempted or threatened suicide? Does she have problems with drugs, alcohol, cigarettes, etc? Is she moody? Does she steal, sometimes from friends? Does she get jealous easily? Does she have a history of abuse? Is getting attention important to her? You've already answered this one...does she lie?
If you answered yes to many of those questions or if it seems like I have described her pretty well without knowing her, she may have borderline personality disorder.
I knew a woman who did the EXACT same thing that your roommate did. She faked a pregnancy to an ex-boyfriend, and then later faked getting an abortion. This is not something a reasonable person would do when they "want to see if their ex-boyfriend still cares about them". This is a whole different level of lying. As time went on, no one could stand to be around the woman I knew after they knew her. She seemed so nice and intelligent and interesting at first. She went through a string of 'friends' insanely quickly because it was only a matter of time before she did something completely unacceptable to them or involving them and they ran away as quickly as possible. I later found out, while trying to help this woman make better choices, that she had borderline personality disorder (but really, I knew that already). I finally had to stop any contact with her after she started 'borrowing' my things and never giving them back, spread false information about myself and others, and knowingly attempted to give me an unwanted alcoholic beverage saying that it was 'orange juice'.
IANAPsychiatrist, but I did study psychology and spent a good amount of time interning for a psychiatric crisis center, helping to evaluate and assist people with borderline personality disorder on a daily basis. I also researched the topic quite a bit while I was writing my thesis.
My two cents? Please, please, please do not invest too much trust in this person. Wait until you can make out her character more before telling her anything that you would not want repeated, if you do so at all. Maintain strong boundaries, both emotional and physical. Lying about pregnancy and abortion is a big red flag. Protect yourself. If it turns out that she does indeed have BPD, you can still be friends but you really need to be careful.
Good luck with this. It sounds like you are a very kind and understanding person.
posted by delicate_dahlias at 10:47 AM on October 15, 2010
If you answered yes to many of those questions or if it seems like I have described her pretty well without knowing her, she may have borderline personality disorder.
I knew a woman who did the EXACT same thing that your roommate did. She faked a pregnancy to an ex-boyfriend, and then later faked getting an abortion. This is not something a reasonable person would do when they "want to see if their ex-boyfriend still cares about them". This is a whole different level of lying. As time went on, no one could stand to be around the woman I knew after they knew her. She seemed so nice and intelligent and interesting at first. She went through a string of 'friends' insanely quickly because it was only a matter of time before she did something completely unacceptable to them or involving them and they ran away as quickly as possible. I later found out, while trying to help this woman make better choices, that she had borderline personality disorder (but really, I knew that already). I finally had to stop any contact with her after she started 'borrowing' my things and never giving them back, spread false information about myself and others, and knowingly attempted to give me an unwanted alcoholic beverage saying that it was 'orange juice'.
IANAPsychiatrist, but I did study psychology and spent a good amount of time interning for a psychiatric crisis center, helping to evaluate and assist people with borderline personality disorder on a daily basis. I also researched the topic quite a bit while I was writing my thesis.
My two cents? Please, please, please do not invest too much trust in this person. Wait until you can make out her character more before telling her anything that you would not want repeated, if you do so at all. Maintain strong boundaries, both emotional and physical. Lying about pregnancy and abortion is a big red flag. Protect yourself. If it turns out that she does indeed have BPD, you can still be friends but you really need to be careful.
Good luck with this. It sounds like you are a very kind and understanding person.
posted by delicate_dahlias at 10:47 AM on October 15, 2010
People like your room-mate don't have friends, they have victims and enablers - and they always expect forgiveness, no matter how destructive their behaviour.
You can find plenty of friends and room-mates who don't come with high drama attached. We teach people how to treat us and you're choosing to let yourself be treated badly. You deserve authentic friends - go find some and leave rescuing your room-mate to someone else.
posted by Lolie at 2:21 PM on October 16, 2010 [2 favorites]
You can find plenty of friends and room-mates who don't come with high drama attached. We teach people how to treat us and you're choosing to let yourself be treated badly. You deserve authentic friends - go find some and leave rescuing your room-mate to someone else.
posted by Lolie at 2:21 PM on October 16, 2010 [2 favorites]
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That may sound snarky but really it sounds like she needs to spend some quality time with a counselor/psychologist. And as a friend/roommate you can't provide that kind of help.
What happened when you actually caught her in a lie? That's probably the behavior you should be most concerned about as her roommate.
posted by grapesaresour at 11:23 PM on October 14, 2010