Am I crazy or did he just say that?
January 25, 2010 12:26 PM Subscribe
My coworker is saying things that I'm not sure are inappropriate or considered harassment. Where's the line, and what do I do about it?
I have an older male coworker that has said some questionable things to me at work. Here are a few examples of the things he's said to me over the years, beginning with his statement today:
- "I like your hair better the other way. Down and flowing"
- "I like you better as a blonde"
- "Why don't you go put on a bikini and pick dandelions?"
These things are really hurtful to me. The dandelions comment was the most sexual he's ever gotten with me. He mostly comments negatively about my appearance. (And I don't think I'm particularly unattractive!)
Am I just wildly insensitive or is he behaving inappropriately? How do I handle this situation? I feel VERY uncomfortable approaching him myself, but there is no "HR" department at my small company. Do I go to my boss and hope he "handles" it?
I have an older male coworker that has said some questionable things to me at work. Here are a few examples of the things he's said to me over the years, beginning with his statement today:
- "I like your hair better the other way. Down and flowing"
- "I like you better as a blonde"
- "Why don't you go put on a bikini and pick dandelions?"
These things are really hurtful to me. The dandelions comment was the most sexual he's ever gotten with me. He mostly comments negatively about my appearance. (And I don't think I'm particularly unattractive!)
Am I just wildly insensitive or is he behaving inappropriately? How do I handle this situation? I feel VERY uncomfortable approaching him myself, but there is no "HR" department at my small company. Do I go to my boss and hope he "handles" it?
This guy sounds like a weirdo and it's really inappropriate. Especially the bikini part. I would think you should file a complaint to HR, but I don't know what kind of trouble that would cause.
posted by anniecat at 12:28 PM on January 25, 2010
posted by anniecat at 12:28 PM on January 25, 2010
It's certainly inappropriate but I wouldn't call it harassment until you've indicated that he should stop. If you don't feel comfortable asking him to stop yourself then, yeah, you pretty much have to ask your boss to tell him to stop.
posted by Justinian at 12:28 PM on January 25, 2010 [3 favorites]
posted by Justinian at 12:28 PM on January 25, 2010 [3 favorites]
- "Why don't you go put on a bikini and pick dandelions?"
Not that it's an excuse for making someone uncomfortable, but are you sure he's not gay?
posted by hermitosis at 12:29 PM on January 25, 2010 [1 favorite]
Not that it's an excuse for making someone uncomfortable, but are you sure he's not gay?
posted by hermitosis at 12:29 PM on January 25, 2010 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: About my job:
I'm currently a full time student. This job has been extremely flexible with my school schedule, and it pays very well considering I don't have a college degree. It is almost guaranteed that I would never find another job like this, let alone in this economic mess. Leaving this job is not a possibility.
posted by Lizsterr at 12:30 PM on January 25, 2010
I'm currently a full time student. This job has been extremely flexible with my school schedule, and it pays very well considering I don't have a college degree. It is almost guaranteed that I would never find another job like this, let alone in this economic mess. Leaving this job is not a possibility.
posted by Lizsterr at 12:30 PM on January 25, 2010
It is harrassment if the attention is unwanted. Clearly you do not want this attention. Bring it up with your boss, they will take it seriously and try to nip it in the bud, as they want to avoid a lawsuit against teh company.
posted by WeekendJen at 12:31 PM on January 25, 2010
posted by WeekendJen at 12:31 PM on January 25, 2010
Response by poster: @hermitosis I don't think so. 60s dude with a wife. Not saying it's not possible, but very unlikely he's still closeted. :D
posted by Lizsterr at 12:32 PM on January 25, 2010
posted by Lizsterr at 12:32 PM on January 25, 2010
The first two are sort of crossing a work-friend appropriateness level. So if you guys aren't friends I would say he is pretty out of line. The bikini comment I wouldn't consider appropriate to say to even a friend; it is really rude.
Sorry he's being an ass. These things get handled in different ways at companies. Is there anyone in HR you can ask about your companies harassment policies?
On the other hand, are you opposed to just talking with him the next time he says something inappropriate and telling him that you find his comments out of bounds for work, you are only co-workers - not friends, and you do not wish to discuss anything other than work related matters? In my experience, that has nipped things like this in the bud.
posted by zephyr_words at 12:33 PM on January 25, 2010 [1 favorite]
Sorry he's being an ass. These things get handled in different ways at companies. Is there anyone in HR you can ask about your companies harassment policies?
On the other hand, are you opposed to just talking with him the next time he says something inappropriate and telling him that you find his comments out of bounds for work, you are only co-workers - not friends, and you do not wish to discuss anything other than work related matters? In my experience, that has nipped things like this in the bud.
posted by zephyr_words at 12:33 PM on January 25, 2010 [1 favorite]
He mostly comments negatively about my appearance.
You need to start sending him the message that your appearance is not up for discussion. He says, I liked you better as a blonde, and you say, Good thing I didn't ask for your opinion then! You can smile when you say it to take the edge off. For really shocking things like the bikini comment, I'd recoil and say, Excuse me?, and stare. Hold your ground if he tries to insist he's being funny or "helpful".
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 12:35 PM on January 25, 2010 [16 favorites]
You need to start sending him the message that your appearance is not up for discussion. He says, I liked you better as a blonde, and you say, Good thing I didn't ask for your opinion then! You can smile when you say it to take the edge off. For really shocking things like the bikini comment, I'd recoil and say, Excuse me?, and stare. Hold your ground if he tries to insist he's being funny or "helpful".
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 12:35 PM on January 25, 2010 [16 favorites]
Best answer: He is behaving inappropriately. It sounds like a (sadly) typical example of a man not understanding that women don't exist for his personal pleasure -- that the way you dress and wear your hair aren't engineered to please him, and as such his opinion is not only unwanted but irrelevant.
How you handle this in part depends on your industry and office environment -- level of formality, number of employees (how small is small?) importance and enforcement of hierarchy and authority, how closely you work with this man and how friendly he is with your boss, etc.
Personally, I've only worked in extremely informal offices (most animation studios) and so I'm hesitant to offer specific advice. Broadly speaking, if you feel comfortable talking to your boss that would probably be the best place to start -- particularly if you frame it not as complaining about a coworker, but rather as asking for help with a situation that's making it difficult for you to do your job.
posted by Narrative Priorities at 12:38 PM on January 25, 2010 [2 favorites]
How you handle this in part depends on your industry and office environment -- level of formality, number of employees (how small is small?) importance and enforcement of hierarchy and authority, how closely you work with this man and how friendly he is with your boss, etc.
Personally, I've only worked in extremely informal offices (most animation studios) and so I'm hesitant to offer specific advice. Broadly speaking, if you feel comfortable talking to your boss that would probably be the best place to start -- particularly if you frame it not as complaining about a coworker, but rather as asking for help with a situation that's making it difficult for you to do your job.
posted by Narrative Priorities at 12:38 PM on January 25, 2010 [2 favorites]
I would say directly to the guy "You making comments about my appearance and body are making me uncomfortable. I suggest you stop before I feel the need to make a formal complaint." This way, if he's unaware that he's making you uncomfortable he will now know and hopefully stop, and if he is aware, then perhaps the threat will make him stop. Either way, follow through on filing a complaint with your boss if he continues.
posted by greta simone at 12:43 PM on January 25, 2010 [7 favorites]
posted by greta simone at 12:43 PM on January 25, 2010 [7 favorites]
It's all well and fine to suggest that the OP "send this guy a message", but often it's very intimidating to do so - that's the point of harassment.
What the OP should do is let someone else know, preferably a senior manager. If possible, document what was said, and when it happened (specific times, with locations and other context).
After you have asked for help it might be best to "send a message".
posted by KokuRyu at 12:43 PM on January 25, 2010 [3 favorites]
What the OP should do is let someone else know, preferably a senior manager. If possible, document what was said, and when it happened (specific times, with locations and other context).
After you have asked for help it might be best to "send a message".
posted by KokuRyu at 12:43 PM on January 25, 2010 [3 favorites]
"Regarding what you said about my hair earlier -- I think comments about my appearance are unprofessional and I'd like you to stop."
Document, document, document. Write notes on everything you can remember that he has said so far, dates, situations, etc.
If he does it again after you tell him to stop, take your documentation to HR and/or your boss.
posted by Jacqueline at 12:44 PM on January 25, 2010 [1 favorite]
Document, document, document. Write notes on everything you can remember that he has said so far, dates, situations, etc.
If he does it again after you tell him to stop, take your documentation to HR and/or your boss.
posted by Jacqueline at 12:44 PM on January 25, 2010 [1 favorite]
Do I go to my boss and hope he "handles" it?
Whatever you do, you don't "hope" your boss enforces basic standards of decent interpersonal behavior within the company. You expect him to. The comments this person is making are utterly, entirely inappropriate (negative comments about a coworker's body/appearance? never ok), and you shouldn't feel bad at all about expecting your supervisor to ensure that his employee is not being harassed.
That said, you know your employer better than I do, and what is legal and/or ethical does not always determine a company's (or a boss's) actions. Sometimes, expecting to be treated decently and with respect can have unfair consequences.
posted by Meg_Murry at 12:45 PM on January 25, 2010 [2 favorites]
Whatever you do, you don't "hope" your boss enforces basic standards of decent interpersonal behavior within the company. You expect him to. The comments this person is making are utterly, entirely inappropriate (negative comments about a coworker's body/appearance? never ok), and you shouldn't feel bad at all about expecting your supervisor to ensure that his employee is not being harassed.
That said, you know your employer better than I do, and what is legal and/or ethical does not always determine a company's (or a boss's) actions. Sometimes, expecting to be treated decently and with respect can have unfair consequences.
posted by Meg_Murry at 12:45 PM on January 25, 2010 [2 favorites]
He's being inappropriate. Anything that makes you feel uncomfortable needs to be addressed. Simply tell him that his comments are making you uncomfortable and that you'd like him to stop. If it persists, then by all means, seek help from HR (or the equivalent you would seek help from in your work situation).
posted by ThaBombShelterSmith at 12:46 PM on January 25, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by ThaBombShelterSmith at 12:46 PM on January 25, 2010 [1 favorite]
Best answer: No, I don't think you are being overly sensitive. Yes, I think he is being inappropriate. If the comments he makes to you are hurtful and making you uncomfortable, as your boss I would be concerned about it no matter what. Even if it's just borderline inappropriate, that's still too close to the line.
Any chance of you telling the person directly that his comments are rude and that you would like him to stop them? I would likely have struck back with something. "I like you better as a blonde". "Yea? Well, I like the way it is now. I would like you better without the snide comments, myself." Something like that, anyway. Sometimes it works and stops that kinds of nuisance comments, sometimes it doesn't.
But the dandelion comment is just way out there and over the top. That says to me that he has an issue that isn't just stupid not-well-thought-out comments from a clueless person, but that he has some sort of issue with you. Is the boss a good person who cares about his employees and their well being? If he isn't the best-buddy of the offender, I would certainly go to him. Do you have any other female co-workers who have been a target as well? Perhaps a joint action might be worthwhile. Do you have a good male friend among the staff that would be able to act as a witness?
On preview. Yes. Document everything going forward. He is being inappropriate, you shouldn't have to put up with it.
posted by gemmy at 12:48 PM on January 25, 2010
Any chance of you telling the person directly that his comments are rude and that you would like him to stop them? I would likely have struck back with something. "I like you better as a blonde". "Yea? Well, I like the way it is now. I would like you better without the snide comments, myself." Something like that, anyway. Sometimes it works and stops that kinds of nuisance comments, sometimes it doesn't.
But the dandelion comment is just way out there and over the top. That says to me that he has an issue that isn't just stupid not-well-thought-out comments from a clueless person, but that he has some sort of issue with you. Is the boss a good person who cares about his employees and their well being? If he isn't the best-buddy of the offender, I would certainly go to him. Do you have any other female co-workers who have been a target as well? Perhaps a joint action might be worthwhile. Do you have a good male friend among the staff that would be able to act as a witness?
On preview. Yes. Document everything going forward. He is being inappropriate, you shouldn't have to put up with it.
posted by gemmy at 12:48 PM on January 25, 2010
At least, that's what I would do.
However, I should acknowledge that sometimes women have good reasons not to complain or report harassment. If you are too worried about your job and the economy to make waves, you might find Penelope Trunk's advice (and the discussion in the comments) in these posts helpful:
http://blog.penelopetrunk.com/2001/06/25/leverage-sexual-harassment/
http://blog.penelopetrunk.com/2006/11/02/dont-report-sexual-harassment-in-most-cases/
(Before I get flamed -- I don't personally agree with Penelope's strategy -- but if OP decides not to complain, report, or leave, she's going to need another empowering way to handle it instead of just feeling victimized.)
posted by Jacqueline at 12:51 PM on January 25, 2010
However, I should acknowledge that sometimes women have good reasons not to complain or report harassment. If you are too worried about your job and the economy to make waves, you might find Penelope Trunk's advice (and the discussion in the comments) in these posts helpful:
http://blog.penelopetrunk.com/2001/06/25/leverage-sexual-harassment/
http://blog.penelopetrunk.com/2006/11/02/dont-report-sexual-harassment-in-most-cases/
(Before I get flamed -- I don't personally agree with Penelope's strategy -- but if OP decides not to complain, report, or leave, she's going to need another empowering way to handle it instead of just feeling victimized.)
posted by Jacqueline at 12:51 PM on January 25, 2010
As a manager in a large corporation, I have gone through many training classes from the legal department. It is the managers responsibility to address this situation, not yours. Tell your manager in person, and then follow up with an e-mail for documentation. You should not feel uncomfortable in your workplace.
posted by Edward L at 12:52 PM on January 25, 2010
posted by Edward L at 12:52 PM on January 25, 2010
Next time, I'd go ahead and tell him that personal comments like that are inappropriate. I agree you should document all of this. And finally, unless there is something wrong with your boss that you haven't told us about, I'd sit down with him to say that something has been going on that makes you uncomfortable, and relay what has been said. Document that meeting too.
This is not a gray area any more, and I see no reason to excuse what has been happening based on your co worker's age.
FYI it is unlawful to fire you in retaliation for reporting harassment, esp. since it seems clear this harassment is based on your gender.
posted by bearwife at 12:56 PM on January 25, 2010
This is not a gray area any more, and I see no reason to excuse what has been happening based on your co worker's age.
FYI it is unlawful to fire you in retaliation for reporting harassment, esp. since it seems clear this harassment is based on your gender.
posted by bearwife at 12:56 PM on January 25, 2010
First of all, no, you are not crazy. This is completely inappropriate. One hundred percent. No question.
There are two ways to go about this. The funniest way is to respond by mocking his appearance. Because he is an older dude, this will be easy as hell.
E.g.: "I like your hair better the other way. Down and flowing."
"I liked yours better the other way, too, when it wasn't so thin I could count your liver spots."
The best way, though, is to get this gross old coot the fuck out of the office forever. Tell him that his comments make you uncomfortable and create a hostile work environment. He will try to pretend like he's just playing and he didn't mean any harm. Depending on the laws of your state, you should secretly record this conversation. Many smart phones have this functionality. Test it out first before the real thing. Take notes on every occurrence and go directly to your supervisor. Take notes when you meet with your supervisor. If you find no relief there, go to HR. Take notes there, too. If it continues to happen with no action on their part, file suit.
If you don't, you will just be one of many women to be harassed by this piece of shit. If you do, you can change things for the better. Notes. Folllow-through. Notes. I cannot stress this enough.
posted by Optimus Chyme at 1:00 PM on January 25, 2010
There are two ways to go about this. The funniest way is to respond by mocking his appearance. Because he is an older dude, this will be easy as hell.
E.g.: "I like your hair better the other way. Down and flowing."
"I liked yours better the other way, too, when it wasn't so thin I could count your liver spots."
The best way, though, is to get this gross old coot the fuck out of the office forever. Tell him that his comments make you uncomfortable and create a hostile work environment. He will try to pretend like he's just playing and he didn't mean any harm. Depending on the laws of your state, you should secretly record this conversation. Many smart phones have this functionality. Test it out first before the real thing. Take notes on every occurrence and go directly to your supervisor. Take notes when you meet with your supervisor. If you find no relief there, go to HR. Take notes there, too. If it continues to happen with no action on their part, file suit.
If you don't, you will just be one of many women to be harassed by this piece of shit. If you do, you can change things for the better. Notes. Folllow-through. Notes. I cannot stress this enough.
posted by Optimus Chyme at 1:00 PM on January 25, 2010
Co-worker: [makes comment about your appearance that makes you uncomfortable]
You: Please stop making comments about my appearance.
Co-worker: Geez, I was only saying I thought you looked better as a blonde (or whatever) [or says something to indicate that what he is saying is not a big deal and you're overreacting. Note: you are NOT overreacting.]
You: Please stop making comments about my appearance. [in other words, stand your ground!! Walk away (if you're in the hallway or whatever), or turn towards your computer.]
Then go to your boss and say your co-worker has been saying things to you about your appearance that make you uncomfortable and that you want him to stop. Now, you have to decide what you want your boss to do (don't "hope" that he will just "handle" it). Do you want your boss to talk to the co-worker? Do you want your boss to just be aware of this? Is there any kind of formal complaint process at your company?
I wouldn't suggest "responding" like others have suggested (e.g. "I like my hair better now"). I think it's better to put a firm boundary around yourself and make that boundary known - NO comments about your appearance whatsoever. You have the right to feel uncomfortable about this. You have the right to not have these comments made to you. But you are the only one who can speak up about this, whether to him or to your boss. I appreciate that you are very uncomfortable about this, but how long do you want this to go on for without ever saying anything? You owe this to yourself!
posted by foxjacket at 1:05 PM on January 25, 2010 [5 favorites]
You: Please stop making comments about my appearance.
Co-worker: Geez, I was only saying I thought you looked better as a blonde (or whatever) [or says something to indicate that what he is saying is not a big deal and you're overreacting. Note: you are NOT overreacting.]
You: Please stop making comments about my appearance. [in other words, stand your ground!! Walk away (if you're in the hallway or whatever), or turn towards your computer.]
Then go to your boss and say your co-worker has been saying things to you about your appearance that make you uncomfortable and that you want him to stop. Now, you have to decide what you want your boss to do (don't "hope" that he will just "handle" it). Do you want your boss to talk to the co-worker? Do you want your boss to just be aware of this? Is there any kind of formal complaint process at your company?
I wouldn't suggest "responding" like others have suggested (e.g. "I like my hair better now"). I think it's better to put a firm boundary around yourself and make that boundary known - NO comments about your appearance whatsoever. You have the right to feel uncomfortable about this. You have the right to not have these comments made to you. But you are the only one who can speak up about this, whether to him or to your boss. I appreciate that you are very uncomfortable about this, but how long do you want this to go on for without ever saying anything? You owe this to yourself!
posted by foxjacket at 1:05 PM on January 25, 2010 [5 favorites]
It's definitely inappropriate. WRITE THIS STUFF DOWN every time it happens, precisely what was said, and what date and time. Document! Create a written record of these things. I guess it's your call whether you want to tell the coworker directly that his behavior is unprofessional and needs to stop, or whether you want to start by going to your boss. Be professional about it and not emotional, but have a written list of the things that were said, and tell your boss this has to stop. That should do it. Your boss needs to take it seriously and tell your coworker to stop it immediately, if this behavior doesn't stop immediately, see a lawyer.
It's your job, and if this is creating a hostile work environment, there are laws about this kind of thing! Perhaps I sound more strident than others here, but my point of departure is that you have the right to be treated with respect in the workplace as much as anybody else, and not have to put up with constant inappropriate comments about your appearance. Stand up for yourself.
posted by citron at 1:16 PM on January 25, 2010
It's your job, and if this is creating a hostile work environment, there are laws about this kind of thing! Perhaps I sound more strident than others here, but my point of departure is that you have the right to be treated with respect in the workplace as much as anybody else, and not have to put up with constant inappropriate comments about your appearance. Stand up for yourself.
posted by citron at 1:16 PM on January 25, 2010
If you're in so small a company that there's no HR then you're stuck with dealing with it (uncomfortable), putting up with it (untenable) or complaining to management.
I worked in a 4 person office and was frequently alone with my tormentor. I was driven out after reporting his harassment. The harassment consisted of long, graphic monologues regarding the rapes and random violence that happened over the property's long history. The man was much older than I and in a position of authority though not my boss. I wasn't confident enough to tell him off myself so I reported him and then ... well, after all was said and done he made the work environment so toxic I had to find another job. It would have been easier to squelch him at the beginning but I lacked confidence.
Say what I was afraid to say: "Ouch, stop saying that! It hurts my feelings/upsets me horribly/pisses me off, so knock it off!". Say it as lightly or seriously as is warranted, then go back to business as normal. Call him on it every time he snipes at you. Document, document, document. Then, if it continues, take it up the ladder to the boss and let him handle it.
posted by Allee Katze at 1:22 PM on January 25, 2010 [1 favorite]
I worked in a 4 person office and was frequently alone with my tormentor. I was driven out after reporting his harassment. The harassment consisted of long, graphic monologues regarding the rapes and random violence that happened over the property's long history. The man was much older than I and in a position of authority though not my boss. I wasn't confident enough to tell him off myself so I reported him and then ... well, after all was said and done he made the work environment so toxic I had to find another job. It would have been easier to squelch him at the beginning but I lacked confidence.
Say what I was afraid to say: "Ouch, stop saying that! It hurts my feelings/upsets me horribly/pisses me off, so knock it off!". Say it as lightly or seriously as is warranted, then go back to business as normal. Call him on it every time he snipes at you. Document, document, document. Then, if it continues, take it up the ladder to the boss and let him handle it.
posted by Allee Katze at 1:22 PM on January 25, 2010 [1 favorite]
That dandelions comment doesn't even make sense.
posted by smackfu at 1:25 PM on January 25, 2010 [2 favorites]
posted by smackfu at 1:25 PM on January 25, 2010 [2 favorites]
Inappropriate. Some old dudes think they get a pass on shit like that because they're old. They do not.
posted by electroboy at 1:26 PM on January 25, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by electroboy at 1:26 PM on January 25, 2010 [1 favorite]
I definitely think you should pick a line and stick to it -- and if any comments continue after that exchange then escalate. Generally, people don't like to be called out or made to appear in a negative light. By stepping up and being the one to speak the words "I think that comment is inappropriate", you've established a boundary, been proactive in dealing with his encroaching behavior, AND turned the tables to make him feel like the one in the uncomfortable spot.
It is perfectly fine for you to admit that this behavior is inappropriate. It is also perfectly fine for you, when faced with an uncomfortable situation, to voice your discomfort.
While I think speaking to your boss would be an appropriate next step, I think for your own self esteem responding with a direct, pre-planned statement is a good first step.
Think like a jedi. Control a situation instead of letting the situation control you.
Also in line with thinking like a jedi, when you are deciding what your pre-planned response will be to a comment of his that makes you feel uncomfortable, think about what you want his response to be. Step up to the situation with your comment and tone directing him into the response you are expecting him to give.
Example:
Him - uncomfortable comment
You - in a clear, firm, normal speaking tone, facing him -- looking at him, state "I believe that comment is inappropriate."
Him - uncomfortable shifting, downward gaze, mumbled apology
You control the situation and the dialogue by making your response active and direct.
posted by countrymod at 1:30 PM on January 25, 2010
It is perfectly fine for you to admit that this behavior is inappropriate. It is also perfectly fine for you, when faced with an uncomfortable situation, to voice your discomfort.
While I think speaking to your boss would be an appropriate next step, I think for your own self esteem responding with a direct, pre-planned statement is a good first step.
Think like a jedi. Control a situation instead of letting the situation control you.
Also in line with thinking like a jedi, when you are deciding what your pre-planned response will be to a comment of his that makes you feel uncomfortable, think about what you want his response to be. Step up to the situation with your comment and tone directing him into the response you are expecting him to give.
Example:
Him - uncomfortable comment
You - in a clear, firm, normal speaking tone, facing him -- looking at him, state "I believe that comment is inappropriate."
Him - uncomfortable shifting, downward gaze, mumbled apology
You control the situation and the dialogue by making your response active and direct.
posted by countrymod at 1:30 PM on January 25, 2010
Response by poster: @smackfu I guess the only way to explain it is that we were having an especially slow day at work. Everyone was bored. It was the middle of the summer. He was suggesting something for me to do.
posted by Lizsterr at 1:37 PM on January 25, 2010
posted by Lizsterr at 1:37 PM on January 25, 2010
These are things he's said over the years? And you've never once said anything back? Maybe you were brought up to always be polite or something? As a start, if you find yourself biting your tongue to avoid any hint of impoliteness in response to these rude comments, stop it. Say something back in a similar vein. At the very least, unfavourable comments on your looks should get a look of sweet innocent confusion and a query along the lines of 'and this affects me how, exactly?'.
I've had similar comments about bikinis at times, in my case it was probably related to being the only woman in the place, working with a lot of guys in boilersuits. It's also more likely to be said in a nasty way from someone who thinks I'm not up to doing my job properly; as *I* knew I could do it, it's not really a problem for me. I'd probably have smiled sweetly and said something like 'no, I think I'll sit here and file my nails instead'. That probably wouldn't work in the same way if you do file your nails at work, though.
Of course, if he's creepy, go straight in with the things other people have already said - please don't say things like that / that's not an appropriate comment, it's offensive / please don't ever say anything like that again / etc.
posted by Lebannen at 1:42 PM on January 25, 2010
I've had similar comments about bikinis at times, in my case it was probably related to being the only woman in the place, working with a lot of guys in boilersuits. It's also more likely to be said in a nasty way from someone who thinks I'm not up to doing my job properly; as *I* knew I could do it, it's not really a problem for me. I'd probably have smiled sweetly and said something like 'no, I think I'll sit here and file my nails instead'. That probably wouldn't work in the same way if you do file your nails at work, though.
Of course, if he's creepy, go straight in with the things other people have already said - please don't say things like that / that's not an appropriate comment, it's offensive / please don't ever say anything like that again / etc.
posted by Lebannen at 1:42 PM on January 25, 2010
One other thing...are there other females in the office, maybe an older woman you could talk to? If so, run it by her and see what suggestions she might have. She would know your office culture better than we would and perhaps would have some pointers on how best to put Older Male Coworker in his place.
If it were me, I'd just look him in the eye and tell him to knock it off. To the dandelion comment I would have literally said-"What the heck is the matter with you? Have you completely lost your freaking mind?"
Now, if that doesn't work, yes, go to the boss and say, "Boss, Frank is saying stupid crap to me, I told him to knock it off, he isn't stopping, would you mind backing me up? " That shows confidence, and that you are willing to try to handle things yourself before going up the chain. But do not hesitate to go up the chain if Frank keeps being a jerk.
posted by St. Alia of the Bunnies at 1:43 PM on January 25, 2010
If it were me, I'd just look him in the eye and tell him to knock it off. To the dandelion comment I would have literally said-"What the heck is the matter with you? Have you completely lost your freaking mind?"
Now, if that doesn't work, yes, go to the boss and say, "Boss, Frank is saying stupid crap to me, I told him to knock it off, he isn't stopping, would you mind backing me up? " That shows confidence, and that you are willing to try to handle things yourself before going up the chain. But do not hesitate to go up the chain if Frank keeps being a jerk.
posted by St. Alia of the Bunnies at 1:43 PM on January 25, 2010
Everyone was bored. It was the middle of the summer. He was suggesting something for me to do.
Yeah, while unwelcome, it doesn't seem like this was a suggestive comment in the vein of "I'm imagining you in a bikini." Though what do I know, I wasn't there. It seems more along the line of, "Don't you wish you were having frivolous summer fun?"
I think he's probably just clumsy in his approach to women, probably because he doesn't understand them really well, and any indication that his personal comments are unwelcome will probably make him err on the side of caution in future interactions.
posted by hermitosis at 1:47 PM on January 25, 2010 [2 favorites]
Yeah, while unwelcome, it doesn't seem like this was a suggestive comment in the vein of "I'm imagining you in a bikini." Though what do I know, I wasn't there. It seems more along the line of, "Don't you wish you were having frivolous summer fun?"
I think he's probably just clumsy in his approach to women, probably because he doesn't understand them really well, and any indication that his personal comments are unwelcome will probably make him err on the side of caution in future interactions.
posted by hermitosis at 1:47 PM on January 25, 2010 [2 favorites]
Best answer: By every management training class I've ever been in, this is clearly sexual harrassment and against the law since it creates a hostile work environment. Comments about appearance and dress are explicitly covered by the statutes. Your employer is required by law to correct the situation and ensure that there is no retaliation against you. If your boss does not know the law, he needs some training.
Don't take any action yourself. Pushing back in other than the most polite and respectful way will weaken your case. Besides, it's your boss' job not yours. Look up the applicable laws in your area and start recording everything. If you have no HR department, you may need to provide evidence yourself and press your own claim if your boss drags his feet. Good luck.
posted by cross_impact at 1:52 PM on January 25, 2010
Don't take any action yourself. Pushing back in other than the most polite and respectful way will weaken your case. Besides, it's your boss' job not yours. Look up the applicable laws in your area and start recording everything. If you have no HR department, you may need to provide evidence yourself and press your own claim if your boss drags his feet. Good luck.
posted by cross_impact at 1:52 PM on January 25, 2010
This is a very bad way to handle the situation and is stupid advice:
"I like your hair better the other way. Down and flowing."
"I liked yours better the other way, too, when it wasn't so thin I could count your liver spots."
It then opens the door for further "banter".
posted by KokuRyu at 2:05 PM on January 25, 2010 [2 favorites]
"I like your hair better the other way. Down and flowing."
"I liked yours better the other way, too, when it wasn't so thin I could count your liver spots."
It then opens the door for further "banter".
posted by KokuRyu at 2:05 PM on January 25, 2010 [2 favorites]
This sucks. You don't have to be rude when you tell him this not ok, but be direct as possible. You don't ask him not to comment about your appearance or suggest clothing for hypothetical activities - TELL him. "Don't make comments on my appearance - I don't like it and it's inappropriate."
He might make a fuss, but he will either get with the program or continue being a dick.
This is why you should definitely talk to your boss about it. If it gets worse - then your boss knows about it and hopefully has your back.
I once asked not to work alone with someone. He was annoying and creepy. My boss thought I was over-reacting, but did respect my wishes. It's your boss's job to handle this stuff.
posted by Gor-ella at 2:07 PM on January 25, 2010 [1 favorite]
He might make a fuss, but he will either get with the program or continue being a dick.
This is why you should definitely talk to your boss about it. If it gets worse - then your boss knows about it and hopefully has your back.
I once asked not to work alone with someone. He was annoying and creepy. My boss thought I was over-reacting, but did respect my wishes. It's your boss's job to handle this stuff.
posted by Gor-ella at 2:07 PM on January 25, 2010 [1 favorite]
I think this is the sort of man you would make an enemy of by confronting.
He won't be able to handle the shame of looking at his own behavior and acknowledging what a pathetic little loser he has allowed himself to become, and will respond by calling you a bitch-- perhaps even out loud-- and then doing everything he can to undermine you at the company.
But you might be able to stop him with something indirect enough that he may not recognize what you are doing (we already know he's completely obtuse) and has the virtue of being a lot meaner than a direct confrontation.
If he has a daughter, she's likely to be your age or older. When he says "I like you better as a blonde", say "Oh, does your daughter bleach her hair, then?". This will identify you with his daughter and put him the position of having sexual feelings about his child, and that should make him uncomfortable enough to stop in short order.
If he has no daughter, say something to the effect of 'how strange-- you make me realize that my own father stopped making comments about my looks when I turned about twelve. I'll have to ask him about it'.
posted by jamjam at 2:07 PM on January 25, 2010
He won't be able to handle the shame of looking at his own behavior and acknowledging what a pathetic little loser he has allowed himself to become, and will respond by calling you a bitch-- perhaps even out loud-- and then doing everything he can to undermine you at the company.
But you might be able to stop him with something indirect enough that he may not recognize what you are doing (we already know he's completely obtuse) and has the virtue of being a lot meaner than a direct confrontation.
If he has a daughter, she's likely to be your age or older. When he says "I like you better as a blonde", say "Oh, does your daughter bleach her hair, then?". This will identify you with his daughter and put him the position of having sexual feelings about his child, and that should make him uncomfortable enough to stop in short order.
If he has no daughter, say something to the effect of 'how strange-- you make me realize that my own father stopped making comments about my looks when I turned about twelve. I'll have to ask him about it'.
posted by jamjam at 2:07 PM on January 25, 2010
Best answer: I had a manager like this and have had a number of coworkers like this...never saying anything explicitly sexual per se, but wildly inappropriate. Oh, the shit we put up with in order to pay rent. My responses were a varied mixture of the following:
* "Huh? What a strange thing to say."
* "Y'know, I'd rather not chat about my hair/clothes/appearance. ANYWAY, [work talk.]"
* "Please stop commenting on my hair/clothes/appearance, it really bothers me."
* STARE OF STONE, then excuse yourself.
None of these involves you making an accusation. Yeah, what you SHOULD say is "stop discussing my body, it's wildly inappropriate and offensive," but I know I've taken a more compromising tone when I couldn't risk the job. My perceived "sense of humor" took a hit, but my work was beyond reproach.
I had another manager at a real good ol' boys firm that I gave the WTF look a few times, then followed up with "OKAY LOOK, I'd like to make a deal with you. You're going to not share any of your thoughts about women within my earshot, and then I'll have nothing about which to complain, and we both win and can do our jobs, deal?" I said this all with a smile and a sweet voice. I got a grin, told I was "sassy," and he upheld his end of the bargain. But in that case, I already knew I could get away with that attitude.
Yeah, while unwelcome, it doesn't seem like this was a suggestive comment in the vein of "I'm imagining you in a bikini." Though what do I know, I wasn't there. It seems more along the line of, "Don't you wish you were having frivolous summer fun?"
Nope, sorry, does not pass logic test. There are a zillion ways to wish some summer fun on someone without suggesting a particularly skimpy costume in which to do it. How totally bizarre would it be for you if you were in Lizster's exact position? Is there any way in which "Why don't you go put on a speedo and pick dandelions" would not be utterly sexual?
posted by desuetude at 2:08 PM on January 25, 2010 [1 favorite]
* "Huh? What a strange thing to say."
* "Y'know, I'd rather not chat about my hair/clothes/appearance. ANYWAY, [work talk.]"
* "Please stop commenting on my hair/clothes/appearance, it really bothers me."
* STARE OF STONE, then excuse yourself.
None of these involves you making an accusation. Yeah, what you SHOULD say is "stop discussing my body, it's wildly inappropriate and offensive," but I know I've taken a more compromising tone when I couldn't risk the job. My perceived "sense of humor" took a hit, but my work was beyond reproach.
I had another manager at a real good ol' boys firm that I gave the WTF look a few times, then followed up with "OKAY LOOK, I'd like to make a deal with you. You're going to not share any of your thoughts about women within my earshot, and then I'll have nothing about which to complain, and we both win and can do our jobs, deal?" I said this all with a smile and a sweet voice. I got a grin, told I was "sassy," and he upheld his end of the bargain. But in that case, I already knew I could get away with that attitude.
Yeah, while unwelcome, it doesn't seem like this was a suggestive comment in the vein of "I'm imagining you in a bikini." Though what do I know, I wasn't there. It seems more along the line of, "Don't you wish you were having frivolous summer fun?"
Nope, sorry, does not pass logic test. There are a zillion ways to wish some summer fun on someone without suggesting a particularly skimpy costume in which to do it. How totally bizarre would it be for you if you were in Lizster's exact position? Is there any way in which "Why don't you go put on a speedo and pick dandelions" would not be utterly sexual?
posted by desuetude at 2:08 PM on January 25, 2010 [1 favorite]
It's more sexist than sexual.
posted by smackfu at 2:15 PM on January 25, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by smackfu at 2:15 PM on January 25, 2010 [1 favorite]
The first thing that came to mind once you noted his age was that it has probably been more socially acceptable (not right by any means, but acceptable nonetheless) to say these types of things to women without a second-thought.
I once had a manager about that age that would make the most off-the-wall comments about the way I dressed and what my boyfriend thought and what I was doing that weekend. At first I was completely floored and offended, then I just realized the dude's counting down the days until retirement and really doesn't give a damn + he's just trying to be hip and young again. Doesn't excuse his behavior, but puts a different spin on it.
Thankfully in my situation, it really only happened when other co-workers around because he thought he was being pretty darn funny. If this isn't the case with you, that's what would set some alarms off for me.
posted by june made him a gemini at 2:34 PM on January 25, 2010
I once had a manager about that age that would make the most off-the-wall comments about the way I dressed and what my boyfriend thought and what I was doing that weekend. At first I was completely floored and offended, then I just realized the dude's counting down the days until retirement and really doesn't give a damn + he's just trying to be hip and young again. Doesn't excuse his behavior, but puts a different spin on it.
Thankfully in my situation, it really only happened when other co-workers around because he thought he was being pretty darn funny. If this isn't the case with you, that's what would set some alarms off for me.
posted by june made him a gemini at 2:34 PM on January 25, 2010
Re-reading my comment, I didn't mean to be ageist, it obviously has a lot to do with where you're from and how you were brought up and your exposure to women. It was quite obvious this guy had little true experience with women despite being married.
posted by june made him a gemini at 2:36 PM on January 25, 2010
posted by june made him a gemini at 2:36 PM on January 25, 2010
I think this is the sort of man you would make an enemy of by confronting...and will respond by calling you a bitch-- perhaps even out loud-- and then doing everything he can to undermine you at the company.
I have to agree with jamjam on this. Something similar happened to me; luckily, I didn't get undermined, but a certain sort of person will do that, so watch out. The how-I-like-your-hair comments are sexist, and the dandelion/bikini type comments point to his being either unstable or outright hostile. Can you have several private conversations with your boss and other higher-ups (i.e., higher than your position) to alert them that you are feeling uncomfortable? Focus on the more unstable and hostile comments. If you have a handful of people who are keeping an ear out for these comments, eventually the offender should start getting either hard stares from others (as well as yourself) or someone is going to pull him aside and warn him that he is putting the company in jeopardy.
Also, for a little revenge fantasy, let me recommend the short story The Catbird Seat.
posted by Knowyournuts at 2:48 PM on January 25, 2010
I have to agree with jamjam on this. Something similar happened to me; luckily, I didn't get undermined, but a certain sort of person will do that, so watch out. The how-I-like-your-hair comments are sexist, and the dandelion/bikini type comments point to his being either unstable or outright hostile. Can you have several private conversations with your boss and other higher-ups (i.e., higher than your position) to alert them that you are feeling uncomfortable? Focus on the more unstable and hostile comments. If you have a handful of people who are keeping an ear out for these comments, eventually the offender should start getting either hard stares from others (as well as yourself) or someone is going to pull him aside and warn him that he is putting the company in jeopardy.
Also, for a little revenge fantasy, let me recommend the short story The Catbird Seat.
posted by Knowyournuts at 2:48 PM on January 25, 2010
Response by poster: Thanks for the comments folks!
I think (as some have said) that it may have been more appropriate to make comments like this in his generation than it is today. Obviously it doesn't excuse it, but it makes it a little easier to deal with.
I really just wanted to make sure I wasn't being petty, because I really felt hurt by his comments. The great majority of you agreed that the behavior was inappropriate, so I took this matter to my supervisor.
At this point, my boss is going to be "handling" the situation (i. e. telling him not to say that stuff any more). I was little shocked when I listed some of the things he's said to me over the years, only to have my boss respond with, "Well, the only thing I think is inappropriate was the bikini comment", but I firmly held my ground and explained that everything he was saying was wrong because I dress appropriately (more so than most) for work and these comments made me feel awful.
The guy is actually not a bad person to work with otherwise. He doesn't make these comments every day. I wasn't looking to get him fired, just get him to stop saying these things!
Also: Yes, I guess I tend to be more polite and non confrontational when dealing with coworkers/people I know know well or at all, which is one reason why I stated I didn't want to tell him directly. He would have most likely made a smartass comment in return that would have made the situation worse.
Anyway, thanks for the help. Clearly if it happens once more, I'll have a much bigger problem on my hands.
posted by Lizsterr at 3:03 PM on January 25, 2010
I think (as some have said) that it may have been more appropriate to make comments like this in his generation than it is today. Obviously it doesn't excuse it, but it makes it a little easier to deal with.
I really just wanted to make sure I wasn't being petty, because I really felt hurt by his comments. The great majority of you agreed that the behavior was inappropriate, so I took this matter to my supervisor.
At this point, my boss is going to be "handling" the situation (i. e. telling him not to say that stuff any more). I was little shocked when I listed some of the things he's said to me over the years, only to have my boss respond with, "Well, the only thing I think is inappropriate was the bikini comment", but I firmly held my ground and explained that everything he was saying was wrong because I dress appropriately (more so than most) for work and these comments made me feel awful.
The guy is actually not a bad person to work with otherwise. He doesn't make these comments every day. I wasn't looking to get him fired, just get him to stop saying these things!
Also: Yes, I guess I tend to be more polite and non confrontational when dealing with coworkers/people I know know well or at all, which is one reason why I stated I didn't want to tell him directly. He would have most likely made a smartass comment in return that would have made the situation worse.
Anyway, thanks for the help. Clearly if it happens once more, I'll have a much bigger problem on my hands.
posted by Lizsterr at 3:03 PM on January 25, 2010
Not that I think anyone should be embarrassed because they didn't go where I did when I read this question (quite the reverse, actually), but what does a girl in a bikini do with a dandelion after she picks it?
From urbandictionary.com:
dandelion
someone who recieves an excess amount of head. a person that is constantly recieving blow-jobs
They call me dandelion because im always getting blown.
It was very explicitly sexual.
posted by jamjam at 3:08 PM on January 25, 2010
From urbandictionary.com:
dandelion
someone who recieves an excess amount of head. a person that is constantly recieving blow-jobs
They call me dandelion because im always getting blown.
It was very explicitly sexual.
posted by jamjam at 3:08 PM on January 25, 2010
Response by poster: @jamjam It definitely was. I remember exactly how he said it. He wasn't being hostile at all. It was very suggestive. Thankfully that's the worst he's said to me.
posted by Lizsterr at 3:13 PM on January 25, 2010
posted by Lizsterr at 3:13 PM on January 25, 2010
You should have started by addressing him directly. I think you are right that a generational difference doesn't excuse the comments, but it could certainly make all the difference in your perceptions; and since you said this has happened "over the years," he has had no reason to think that you regarded this as anything but harmless banter. Taking it up with the boss without going to him first will likely burn a bridge, at the least. Getting him in trouble might change the behavior but will he have learned anything?
posted by rahnefan at 3:15 PM on January 25, 2010
posted by rahnefan at 3:15 PM on January 25, 2010
Oh... @ the dandelion thing. Had no idea. OK so not just banter!
In that case screw it, good for you.
posted by rahnefan at 3:16 PM on January 25, 2010
In that case screw it, good for you.
posted by rahnefan at 3:16 PM on January 25, 2010
There are two ways to go about this. The funniest way is to respond by mocking his appearance. Because he is an older dude, this will be easy as hell.
Yeah, um, don't do this. If you engage it as a joke, it may escalate, and his response (when eventually confronted) will be that he assumed you knew he was joking, because you were joking back. Just wanted to throw that in.
posted by davejay at 3:36 PM on January 25, 2010
Yeah, um, don't do this. If you engage it as a joke, it may escalate, and his response (when eventually confronted) will be that he assumed you knew he was joking, because you were joking back. Just wanted to throw that in.
posted by davejay at 3:36 PM on January 25, 2010
The first two aren't even close to sexual harassment. I have no idea what yinz are thinking.
posted by lakerk at 5:45 PM on January 25, 2010
posted by lakerk at 5:45 PM on January 25, 2010
Saying something that is inappropriate is not the same thing as harassment. I'm not really sure if it's necessarily 'inappropriate' to comment on your appearance, either - unless he's saying things like, "You look like warm death," or, "Polka dots make your boobs like HUGE!", then I don't think he's doing anything wrong (maybe not very nice, but not necessarily wrong).
The bikini comment is not really harassment, to my mind, though it is pretty inappropriate. It's not like he suggested you throw on latex stockings and run through a shower of oil or anything, but it is an odd thing to say.
No matter my opinion, however, it's not me that has to listen to this guy say goofy things, it's you. If the things he says make you feel uncomfortable, then that's a problem. If you are an adult, then it falls to you to tell this guy that he's making you uncomfortable with his comments. Give the guy a chance to apologize and stop making the comments rather than just jumping to the conclusion that he's a terrible sexist dick and trying to get him in trouble though, would you? It may be an honest misunderstanding. Sure, it could be some kind of lame chauvinist power-trip too, but try approaching the situation with the same measure of personal responsibility that you're expecting this guy to have.
My guess is that you are not being hysterically sensitive, but that you are not terribly up-front about your feelings and this guy is a bit boorish. If you let him get away with being mildly inappropriate before, then he will continue to do it. Stopping this could be as easy as saying, "stop."
posted by Pecinpah at 5:56 PM on January 25, 2010
The bikini comment is not really harassment, to my mind, though it is pretty inappropriate. It's not like he suggested you throw on latex stockings and run through a shower of oil or anything, but it is an odd thing to say.
No matter my opinion, however, it's not me that has to listen to this guy say goofy things, it's you. If the things he says make you feel uncomfortable, then that's a problem. If you are an adult, then it falls to you to tell this guy that he's making you uncomfortable with his comments. Give the guy a chance to apologize and stop making the comments rather than just jumping to the conclusion that he's a terrible sexist dick and trying to get him in trouble though, would you? It may be an honest misunderstanding. Sure, it could be some kind of lame chauvinist power-trip too, but try approaching the situation with the same measure of personal responsibility that you're expecting this guy to have.
My guess is that you are not being hysterically sensitive, but that you are not terribly up-front about your feelings and this guy is a bit boorish. If you let him get away with being mildly inappropriate before, then he will continue to do it. Stopping this could be as easy as saying, "stop."
posted by Pecinpah at 5:56 PM on January 25, 2010
Oh... @ the dandelion thing. Had no idea. OK so not just banter!
OTOH, 60 year old's don't get their slang from the urbandictionary.com.
posted by smackfu at 6:07 PM on January 25, 2010
OTOH, 60 year old's don't get their slang from the urbandictionary.com.
posted by smackfu at 6:07 PM on January 25, 2010
Best answer: Saying something that is inappropriate is not the same thing as harassment. I'm not really sure if it's necessarily 'inappropriate' to comment on your appearance, either - unless he's saying things like, "You look like warm death," or, "Polka dots make your boobs like HUGE!", then I don't think he's doing anything wrong (maybe not very nice, but not necessarily wrong).
What's the fine-print difference between not nice and wrong? It has to be an insult or downright vulgar to count as actionable? (Note, the OP did note that most of the comments were negative regarding her appearance, they just weren't the examples she gave us.) "Less Sexist Than Mad Men" is not a shiny beacon of progress.
It's rude for a casual acquaintance to criticize your appearance, whether positively or negatively, in a professional setting, because it's crossing an intimacy line. (If you're friends outside of work, that's a different story.) Lizsterr's co-worker is engaging in objectification, reducing her to the sum of her pretty parts. Dude should know better, and while yes, Lizsterr should make it clear that this is not okay, it's ridiculous (though sadly common) that the prevailing wisdom is that her boorish co-worker can say whatever pops into his head and that it's on her to tell him to stop each time.
posted by desuetude at 9:41 PM on January 25, 2010 [3 favorites]
What's the fine-print difference between not nice and wrong? It has to be an insult or downright vulgar to count as actionable? (Note, the OP did note that most of the comments were negative regarding her appearance, they just weren't the examples she gave us.) "Less Sexist Than Mad Men" is not a shiny beacon of progress.
It's rude for a casual acquaintance to criticize your appearance, whether positively or negatively, in a professional setting, because it's crossing an intimacy line. (If you're friends outside of work, that's a different story.) Lizsterr's co-worker is engaging in objectification, reducing her to the sum of her pretty parts. Dude should know better, and while yes, Lizsterr should make it clear that this is not okay, it's ridiculous (though sadly common) that the prevailing wisdom is that her boorish co-worker can say whatever pops into his head and that it's on her to tell him to stop each time.
posted by desuetude at 9:41 PM on January 25, 2010 [3 favorites]
What's the fine-print difference between not nice and wrong?
That kind of distinction that comes down to common sense and situational discretion. If you need to spell a thing like that out in a blanket answer that is right for every possible situation, then you are inevitably going to have to favor the lowest common denominator in order to ensure that you offend the least number of people. That kind of bureaucratic response doesn't sound like 'a shiny beacon of progress' to me, anymore than 'Less Sexist Than Mad Men' does.
To clarify the last point I made ('Stopping this could be as easy as saying, "stop."'); if the OP can't bring herself to tell this person that what he is saying is offensive, then she's partially culpable for it's carrying on the way it has. Yes, he shouldn't offend her; but maybe he doesn't know he has. If she steps up to tell him that what he's saying is offensive and he continues to say these things, then he's in the wrong and things can move on to more disciplinary territory. If she tells him and he apologizes and never does it again, then everyone has acted like the adults that they pretend to be in front of their parents and the world can continue to turn. Yay, being an active participant in your own life.
posted by Pecinpah at 3:40 PM on January 26, 2010
That kind of distinction that comes down to common sense and situational discretion. If you need to spell a thing like that out in a blanket answer that is right for every possible situation, then you are inevitably going to have to favor the lowest common denominator in order to ensure that you offend the least number of people. That kind of bureaucratic response doesn't sound like 'a shiny beacon of progress' to me, anymore than 'Less Sexist Than Mad Men' does.
To clarify the last point I made ('Stopping this could be as easy as saying, "stop."'); if the OP can't bring herself to tell this person that what he is saying is offensive, then she's partially culpable for it's carrying on the way it has. Yes, he shouldn't offend her; but maybe he doesn't know he has. If she steps up to tell him that what he's saying is offensive and he continues to say these things, then he's in the wrong and things can move on to more disciplinary territory. If she tells him and he apologizes and never does it again, then everyone has acted like the adults that they pretend to be in front of their parents and the world can continue to turn. Yay, being an active participant in your own life.
posted by Pecinpah at 3:40 PM on January 26, 2010
"Hey - not cool. Knock it off."
posted by obiwanwasabi at 12:36 AM on January 27, 2010
posted by obiwanwasabi at 12:36 AM on January 27, 2010
This thread is closed to new comments.
The answers to your questions all depend on your location, your prospects for other employment if it comes to that, etc.
posted by dfriedman at 12:27 PM on January 25, 2010