Waitress lost my phone...now what?
October 10, 2009 11:19 PM Subscribe
Left my phone at the restaurant/bar after dinner, went back and was told they had it but the waitress had misplaced it. Is there anything I can do?
[sob story] I wouldn't be so upset except that I upgraded my phone last week, (iPhone 3Gs) and it didn't work out of the box. They made me make an appointment at the Apple store (3 days later), where they discovered my phone was defective and replaced it with a new one. While I was there getting my phone replaced, my wallet was stolen out of my purse. [/sob story]
One week later...I'm at dinner tonight and I paid the check and left my phone on the table. When I returned for it about 15 minutes later, the person behind the bar said Yes! The phone that was just turned in! And proceeded to leave me waiting. Then the manager came over, apologized profusely and explained that the waitress had my phone but had laid it down somewhere and now they can't find it.
I left them a number to call when they find it, but what else can I do? Other than very politely asking that they "fix it" (i.e., pay for it) do I have any recourse if it doesn't turn up?
[sob story] I wouldn't be so upset except that I upgraded my phone last week, (iPhone 3Gs) and it didn't work out of the box. They made me make an appointment at the Apple store (3 days later), where they discovered my phone was defective and replaced it with a new one. While I was there getting my phone replaced, my wallet was stolen out of my purse. [/sob story]
One week later...I'm at dinner tonight and I paid the check and left my phone on the table. When I returned for it about 15 minutes later, the person behind the bar said Yes! The phone that was just turned in! And proceeded to leave me waiting. Then the manager came over, apologized profusely and explained that the waitress had my phone but had laid it down somewhere and now they can't find it.
I left them a number to call when they find it, but what else can I do? Other than very politely asking that they "fix it" (i.e., pay for it) do I have any recourse if it doesn't turn up?
Best answer: Call it. When it rings, they can find it. If it's been carried off, tell whoever answers it to carry it back. If your account goes straight to voicemail, or isn't answered, you're probably out a phone.
I don't think you can expect somebody else to reimburse you for something you left behind, in case you don't get it back. The most you can expect is their best faith assistance in helping you get it back. If you don't have it back in 12 hours or so, cancel/suspend your account on that device.
posted by paulsc at 11:23 PM on October 10, 2009 [1 favorite]
I don't think you can expect somebody else to reimburse you for something you left behind, in case you don't get it back. The most you can expect is their best faith assistance in helping you get it back. If you don't have it back in 12 hours or so, cancel/suspend your account on that device.
posted by paulsc at 11:23 PM on October 10, 2009 [1 favorite]
Unfortunately, most restaurants post a sign that says "not responsible for lost items." Waitress has a new iPhone. :(
posted by IndigoRain at 11:50 PM on October 10, 2009
posted by IndigoRain at 11:50 PM on October 10, 2009
You forgot your phone.
If it was then subsequently lost by someone in the course of a best-effort, good faith attempt to keep it from walking off in the hands of another patron, that's hardly the fault of the people attempting to protect you from your own actions (or inactions). You can ask them to 'fix it', but that's a terrible thing to do to anyone making the sort of money you make at a restaurant, especially when it really isn't their fault.
posted by Rendus at 12:03 AM on October 11, 2009 [6 favorites]
If it was then subsequently lost by someone in the course of a best-effort, good faith attempt to keep it from walking off in the hands of another patron, that's hardly the fault of the people attempting to protect you from your own actions (or inactions). You can ask them to 'fix it', but that's a terrible thing to do to anyone making the sort of money you make at a restaurant, especially when it really isn't their fault.
posted by Rendus at 12:03 AM on October 11, 2009 [6 favorites]
Waitress has a new iPhone. :(
Waitress is not going to announce the new acquisition if Waitress is nicking phones. Come on.
The notion that the restaurant should "fix it" (i.e., pay for it) is even more ridiculous.
posted by kmennie at 12:55 AM on October 11, 2009 [6 favorites]
Waitress is not going to announce the new acquisition if Waitress is nicking phones. Come on.
The notion that the restaurant should "fix it" (i.e., pay for it) is even more ridiculous.
posted by kmennie at 12:55 AM on October 11, 2009 [6 favorites]
Best answer: I think you need to keep better track of your stuff. The restaurant isn't liable for things you leave behind. Check back in with them tomorrow and ask them if they've found your phone. Don't wait for them to call you, and checking back in person is the best way to make sure that they have your phone - go back at the beginning of the night - right after they open - and you will have better luck in getting them to pay full attention to your plight.
But...really....keep an eye on your stuff. Losing your wallet, and then your brand new phone means that you don't have your head fully in the game.
posted by The Light Fantastic at 1:27 AM on October 11, 2009 [8 favorites]
But...really....keep an eye on your stuff. Losing your wallet, and then your brand new phone means that you don't have your head fully in the game.
posted by The Light Fantastic at 1:27 AM on October 11, 2009 [8 favorites]
It's highly likely the waitress or another employee stole your phone after someone turned it in.
Contact the restaurant's owner, and explain that you're going to file a police report, and that you'll be there to testify when his liquor license is up for renewal. Then explain that you're also going to take your story to the local TV stations' "investigative" or consumer affairs shows.
Ask him how his restaurant stands to do in this economy when word gets around that expensive items turned in to his restaurant go missing, or if he'd prefer his restaurant have a reputation for taking care of its mistakes by making its patrons whole.
He has insurance, or if items "lost" by employees aren't covered, well, $300 is a minor cost of doing business compared to what he pays Sysco for his food and for advertising.
posted by orthogonality at 1:30 AM on October 11, 2009 [4 favorites]
Contact the restaurant's owner, and explain that you're going to file a police report, and that you'll be there to testify when his liquor license is up for renewal. Then explain that you're also going to take your story to the local TV stations' "investigative" or consumer affairs shows.
Ask him how his restaurant stands to do in this economy when word gets around that expensive items turned in to his restaurant go missing, or if he'd prefer his restaurant have a reputation for taking care of its mistakes by making its patrons whole.
He has insurance, or if items "lost" by employees aren't covered, well, $300 is a minor cost of doing business compared to what he pays Sysco for his food and for advertising.
posted by orthogonality at 1:30 AM on October 11, 2009 [4 favorites]
Bullying a business owner into buying you a new phone is a pretty awful idea. For all anyone knows, the waitress laid it down in sight of a thieving bar patron.
shopefowler:
If you manage to get this phone back, or buy a new one, I'd highly recommend splurging on a MobileMe subscription and enabling Find My Phone.
posted by secret about box at 1:46 AM on October 11, 2009 [9 favorites]
shopefowler:
If you manage to get this phone back, or buy a new one, I'd highly recommend splurging on a MobileMe subscription and enabling Find My Phone.
posted by secret about box at 1:46 AM on October 11, 2009 [9 favorites]
I can't possibly agree less with orthogonality.
You lost your phone. That's your responsibility. The fact that it was found for a few minutes doesn't change the fact that you lost your phone. If somebody had found your phone and kept it, it would still be your responsibility for failing to protect and keep your gear. You could argue that a "good" person would give it back... but it doesn't change the fact that you shouldn't have given them the opportunity anyway.
If you dropped it in the toilet, would you go super-bitch on the owner and threaten his livelihood?
What a dick move that would be.
posted by Netzapper at 2:00 AM on October 11, 2009 [7 favorites]
You lost your phone. That's your responsibility. The fact that it was found for a few minutes doesn't change the fact that you lost your phone. If somebody had found your phone and kept it, it would still be your responsibility for failing to protect and keep your gear. You could argue that a "good" person would give it back... but it doesn't change the fact that you shouldn't have given them the opportunity anyway.
If you dropped it in the toilet, would you go super-bitch on the owner and threaten his livelihood?
What a dick move that would be.
posted by Netzapper at 2:00 AM on October 11, 2009 [7 favorites]
Let me get this straight:
1) You lost your iPhone.
2) Someone found your iPhone but, while trying to get it back to you, it was again lost.
3) ...
4) You hold that someone responsible for replacement cost of phone.
What goes #3??? Seems like a non-sequitur to me.
And please, if you have any sort of conscience, don't resort to the extortionist tactics that orthogonality is advocating. Yeah, they might cave to that, but then you don't deserve to sleep at night.
posted by randomstriker at 2:04 AM on October 11, 2009 [1 favorite]
1) You lost your iPhone.
2) Someone found your iPhone but, while trying to get it back to you, it was again lost.
3) ...
4) You hold that someone responsible for replacement cost of phone.
What goes #3??? Seems like a non-sequitur to me.
And please, if you have any sort of conscience, don't resort to the extortionist tactics that orthogonality is advocating. Yeah, they might cave to that, but then you don't deserve to sleep at night.
posted by randomstriker at 2:04 AM on October 11, 2009 [1 favorite]
forgive me if it works differently in the US, but isn't this what insurance is for? Any mobile phone I have is automatically insured on my home insurance, therefore making it an inconvenience if I lose it, but not any more than that. Can you check your home insurance to see if you are covered?
Other than that, I second calling it, and mobile me's find my phone
posted by nunoidia at 2:38 AM on October 11, 2009
Other than that, I second calling it, and mobile me's find my phone
posted by nunoidia at 2:38 AM on October 11, 2009
Best answer: You lost your phone. That's your responsibility.
That's not technically true. The restaurant lost it after it was in their possession. They had it, then they lost it. You lost it, then they found it, then they lost it too.
I'm not saying you should try to extort money from them, but I just think from a literalist perspective, they did lose your phone.
posted by delmoi at 2:50 AM on October 11, 2009 [3 favorites]
That's not technically true. The restaurant lost it after it was in their possession. They had it, then they lost it. You lost it, then they found it, then they lost it too.
I'm not saying you should try to extort money from them, but I just think from a literalist perspective, they did lose your phone.
posted by delmoi at 2:50 AM on October 11, 2009 [3 favorites]
Any response to nunoidia's question about insurance? In the US, I can't imagine losing a phone and expecting my homeowner's insurance to pay for it, but maybe I'm wrong.
posted by mmoncur at 2:54 AM on October 11, 2009
posted by mmoncur at 2:54 AM on October 11, 2009
In my country, all cell phone providers share a blacklist of stolen phones, so if my phone is stolen, I contact my provider who puts the phone on the blacklist, and the stolen phone can no longer be used to make calls (in this country) - which needless to say makes it less valuable, and hence less worth stealing in the first place.
I gather the list in my country is called the "Central Equipment Identity Register".
If you have such a list in your country, contact your cell phone provider and have them put your phone on it. If you don't have such a list, you could contact your political representatives and suggest they encourage your country's phone industry to also adopt such a list.
posted by Mike1024 at 3:15 AM on October 11, 2009
I gather the list in my country is called the "Central Equipment Identity Register".
If you have such a list in your country, contact your cell phone provider and have them put your phone on it. If you don't have such a list, you could contact your political representatives and suggest they encourage your country's phone industry to also adopt such a list.
posted by Mike1024 at 3:15 AM on October 11, 2009
Report the phone as stolen: it was lost, found, then stolen either by restaurant employee or by patron. Even in my country with one of the worst law enforcement in the EU, stolen mobile phones are being found using IMEI 40%-60% of the time (or being more specific, I find them in investigations I am conducting 40%-60% of the time).
In my country the restaurant owner would be legally responsible for loss of phone previously found within his premises so perhaps there is some similar law in your state.
posted by przepla at 3:35 AM on October 11, 2009
In my country the restaurant owner would be legally responsible for loss of phone previously found within his premises so perhaps there is some similar law in your state.
posted by przepla at 3:35 AM on October 11, 2009
The season finale of season 4 of Curb Your Enthusiasm covers precisely this dilemma.
posted by caek at 3:50 AM on October 11, 2009 [3 favorites]
posted by caek at 3:50 AM on October 11, 2009 [3 favorites]
If im not mistaken, the 3GS has Find my iPhone. If you have MobileMe, you can at least see where your phone is, and if the restaurant still has it or if the phone has walked its way across town. Already there's been servery articles and news stories how that feature has helped people get their phone back, maybe you can activate it post theft?
posted by tropikal at 4:39 AM on October 11, 2009
posted by tropikal at 4:39 AM on October 11, 2009
I've lost my iPhone just like this (left on table, fell out of pocket in taxi cab, etc) and had it returned about five times in three different countries. No MobileMe or FindMyPhone. Just lucky, I guess.
Did this just happen last night? Give the restaurant a day or two to track it down before reporting it stolen or you'll have a bigger hassle "un-marking" it later.
Nunoidia, some homeowners insurance (and some business insurance, if it's a work item) does include coverage for walkabout items that are kept in pockets or cars outside the literal house, but there's usually a minimum "deductible" cost of $200-500 that the insured has to pay themselves, meaning if the loss is only $300 like this, there's little point in making a claim. Also, making claims tends to raise your insurance premiums for next year, making it doubly costly to do so for minor things. (Insurance companies are filthy scammers, yes.)
posted by rokusan at 5:08 AM on October 11, 2009
Did this just happen last night? Give the restaurant a day or two to track it down before reporting it stolen or you'll have a bigger hassle "un-marking" it later.
Nunoidia, some homeowners insurance (and some business insurance, if it's a work item) does include coverage for walkabout items that are kept in pockets or cars outside the literal house, but there's usually a minimum "deductible" cost of $200-500 that the insured has to pay themselves, meaning if the loss is only $300 like this, there's little point in making a claim. Also, making claims tends to raise your insurance premiums for next year, making it doubly costly to do so for minor things. (Insurance companies are filthy scammers, yes.)
posted by rokusan at 5:08 AM on October 11, 2009
I lost a phone once. It's been lost ever since. Just write it off and be more careful next time!
posted by turgid dahlia at 5:17 AM on October 11, 2009
posted by turgid dahlia at 5:17 AM on October 11, 2009
Response by poster: I will go back when they open for lunch and see if there's been any luck. Find My iPhone says there's no data network available, although there is service because the phone rings.
Of course leaving it at the restaurant in the first place is my fault. I would certainly not ask the waitress to pay for my phone, and I wouldn't threaten the owner with going to the news. But what am I losing by asking if he'll reimburse me, on the off chance he says yes? I was only wondering if there was anything else to do in the meantime, or some obscure Apple policy or something (delusional, I know) that covered my stupidity 10 days out.
My wallet was actually stolen, and I haven't lost a phone before. So I think this is more an unfortunate incident than a comment on my general ability to keep up with my stuff. Thanks!
posted by shopefowler at 5:40 AM on October 11, 2009
Of course leaving it at the restaurant in the first place is my fault. I would certainly not ask the waitress to pay for my phone, and I wouldn't threaten the owner with going to the news. But what am I losing by asking if he'll reimburse me, on the off chance he says yes? I was only wondering if there was anything else to do in the meantime, or some obscure Apple policy or something (delusional, I know) that covered my stupidity 10 days out.
My wallet was actually stolen, and I haven't lost a phone before. So I think this is more an unfortunate incident than a comment on my general ability to keep up with my stuff. Thanks!
posted by shopefowler at 5:40 AM on October 11, 2009
If they said they had it in their possession but then lost it; I'd file a police report.
posted by dzaz at 6:06 AM on October 11, 2009 [1 favorite]
posted by dzaz at 6:06 AM on October 11, 2009 [1 favorite]
dzaz, what on earth would the police charge them with? Being nice but just as momentarily careless as the OP?
I totally understand your frustration. NOT a cheap phone, and people get emotionally invested in their little Apple wonderbricks. But...ergh...at the most you could ask for HALF the price of the phone, since they're only responsible for losing it one time out of the two times it was lost in the last week.
This is like a guest coming to your house, leaving a precious object behind, you seeing and misplacing it, and then having the guest expect you to pony up $800. I think that'd test a lot of friendships...and you don't have a friendship to poison with the restaurant owner so don't hold your breath.
posted by paanta at 6:24 AM on October 11, 2009
I totally understand your frustration. NOT a cheap phone, and people get emotionally invested in their little Apple wonderbricks. But...ergh...at the most you could ask for HALF the price of the phone, since they're only responsible for losing it one time out of the two times it was lost in the last week.
This is like a guest coming to your house, leaving a precious object behind, you seeing and misplacing it, and then having the guest expect you to pony up $800. I think that'd test a lot of friendships...and you don't have a friendship to poison with the restaurant owner so don't hold your breath.
posted by paanta at 6:24 AM on October 11, 2009
paanta, I'd file because the restaurant reported that they did have the phone in their possession; then they lost it. I think the distinction lies in that they reported to the owner that they did, indeed, have her property, then they lost it. I would only have the cops come and file the report to show the restaurant management that they do have responsibility when they say they have your stuff but then they lose it. And I'd try to get the restaurant to reimburse me (and the restaurant has insurance, right?).
If they initially said they hadn't seen it, I'd be peeved but I'd drop the whole thing.
And if a friend came to my house and misplaced something pricey, I'd tear the house apart looking for it, as should the restaurant.
But now that I think about it, maybe I'm wrong.
posted by dzaz at 6:31 AM on October 11, 2009
If they initially said they hadn't seen it, I'd be peeved but I'd drop the whole thing.
And if a friend came to my house and misplaced something pricey, I'd tear the house apart looking for it, as should the restaurant.
But now that I think about it, maybe I'm wrong.
posted by dzaz at 6:31 AM on October 11, 2009
And my money's on the restaurant's manager/owner now how a shiny new phone, not the waitress...service industry money stinks.
posted by dzaz at 6:47 AM on October 11, 2009
posted by dzaz at 6:47 AM on October 11, 2009
The folks who keep insisting that you lost your phone are incorrect. The waitress took your phone. You left it, but then she found it, and now she probably has it. I completely agree with orthogonality. This whole situation is predicated on you not pushing to hard to get this back, but you should push hard. Sure, you shouldn't have left your phone there, but once they found it it was their responsibility to safeguard it.
People leaving credit cards at restaurants and stores is a fairly common occurrence. It's not a smart thing to do, but it happens. I can't imagine that people here would think it acceptable that a restaurant that found your card would lose it again, or, as is more likely in this case, that the finder would get to use the cc without penalty simply because you made a mistake in the first place.
posted by OmieWise at 6:53 AM on October 11, 2009 [2 favorites]
People leaving credit cards at restaurants and stores is a fairly common occurrence. It's not a smart thing to do, but it happens. I can't imagine that people here would think it acceptable that a restaurant that found your card would lose it again, or, as is more likely in this case, that the finder would get to use the cc without penalty simply because you made a mistake in the first place.
posted by OmieWise at 6:53 AM on October 11, 2009 [2 favorites]
once they found it it was their responsibility to safeguard it
?
They're not running a phone-storage service.
posted by kmennie at 7:00 AM on October 11, 2009 [5 favorites]
?
They're not running a phone-storage service.
posted by kmennie at 7:00 AM on October 11, 2009 [5 favorites]
Another way to put this is that restaurants are in the business of providing you with a certain package of services. These services do not begin or end with the serving of food, but extend to and past basic civility, safety, and reasonable comfort. It's perfectly understandable that restaurants would try to indemnify themselves against correcting faults over which they have no control (your loss of an item), but preserving a very expensive item of yours until you return to retrieve it, once they have found it, is well within what most reasonable people would consider the basic package of services that a decent restaurant should provide. They have admitted that they found the item, now they need to provide the service that goes along with that.
posted by OmieWise at 7:02 AM on October 11, 2009 [3 favorites]
posted by OmieWise at 7:02 AM on October 11, 2009 [3 favorites]
They're not running a phone-storage service.
Are you serious? What part of preserving a customer's expensive belongings for a reasonable time, once found, equates to running a phone-storage service? You argue as if the expectation of a basic level of service is unreasonable.
posted by OmieWise at 7:04 AM on October 11, 2009
Are you serious? What part of preserving a customer's expensive belongings for a reasonable time, once found, equates to running a phone-storage service? You argue as if the expectation of a basic level of service is unreasonable.
posted by OmieWise at 7:04 AM on October 11, 2009
Are you serious? What part of preserving a customer's expensive belongings for a reasonable time, once found, equates to running a phone-storage service?
The part where they are responsible for the safe-keeping of the phone, actually.
Doesn't matter what you leave sitting on the table. Customer-copy receipts, iPhones, to-go containers, scarves, whatever . . . the restaurant is not obligated to hold and care for these things for you until you return.
The mistake the restaurant made here was admitting that they ever had possession of it.
posted by toomuchpete at 7:17 AM on October 11, 2009 [1 favorite]
The part where they are responsible for the safe-keeping of the phone, actually.
Doesn't matter what you leave sitting on the table. Customer-copy receipts, iPhones, to-go containers, scarves, whatever . . . the restaurant is not obligated to hold and care for these things for you until you return.
The mistake the restaurant made here was admitting that they ever had possession of it.
posted by toomuchpete at 7:17 AM on October 11, 2009 [1 favorite]
Buy a new phone and get over it. The restaurant is not responsible for your lost phone.
posted by HuronBob at 7:19 AM on October 11, 2009
posted by HuronBob at 7:19 AM on October 11, 2009
Doesn't matter what you leave sitting on the table. Customer-copy receipts, iPhones, to-go containers, scarves, whatever . . . the restaurant is not obligated to hold and care for these things for you until you return.
The mistake the restaurant made here was admitting that they ever had possession of it.
This isn't a phone lost by the OP. I'm not sure why people are insisting that it is, even though the framing of the question was bad. This is a phone that the restaurant staff had in their possession. It is a FOUND phone. To characterize the mysterious disappearance of an expensive portable item as a mistaken admission of possession is disingenuous. Maybe the phone was lost by the restaurant, maybe it was stolen by a staff member. We do not know. What we know for sure is that the phone was NOT ultimately lost by shopefowler. It was left by her and found by the restaurant staff, a series of events confirmed by two people at the restaurant.
posted by OmieWise at 7:38 AM on October 11, 2009 [1 favorite]
The mistake the restaurant made here was admitting that they ever had possession of it.
This isn't a phone lost by the OP. I'm not sure why people are insisting that it is, even though the framing of the question was bad. This is a phone that the restaurant staff had in their possession. It is a FOUND phone. To characterize the mysterious disappearance of an expensive portable item as a mistaken admission of possession is disingenuous. Maybe the phone was lost by the restaurant, maybe it was stolen by a staff member. We do not know. What we know for sure is that the phone was NOT ultimately lost by shopefowler. It was left by her and found by the restaurant staff, a series of events confirmed by two people at the restaurant.
posted by OmieWise at 7:38 AM on October 11, 2009 [1 favorite]
Yeah but "If it was then subsequently lost by someone in the course of a best-effort, good faith attempt to keep it from walking off in the hands of another patron, that's hardly the fault of the people attempting to protect you from your own actions (or inactions)."
posted by kmennie at 8:20 AM on October 11, 2009
posted by kmennie at 8:20 AM on October 11, 2009
Have you checked what kind of credit card protection you have? Some credit cards insure items that have been stolen if less than 90 days after the purchase. According to Smartmoney, loss is not covered, but maybe you have a good case that it was stolen.
Also, the same thing happened to me at a bar; they found my phone but it got misplaced again. I called my carrier to get long distance calling blocked, and then spent the next 3 days calling and texting my phone. Finally someone was able to hear it ringing. It turned up at the same bar just under stuff.
posted by MS_gal at 8:29 AM on October 11, 2009 [1 favorite]
Also, the same thing happened to me at a bar; they found my phone but it got misplaced again. I called my carrier to get long distance calling blocked, and then spent the next 3 days calling and texting my phone. Finally someone was able to hear it ringing. It turned up at the same bar just under stuff.
posted by MS_gal at 8:29 AM on October 11, 2009 [1 favorite]
Are you serious? What part of preserving a customer's expensive belongings for a reasonable time, once found, equates to running a phone-storage service? You argue as if the expectation of a basic level of service is unreasonable.
I think it depends on how the phone came to be missing after the waitress found it.
Obviously, if the waitress (or any other restaurant employee) stole it, I agree with you that I would expect the restaurant to put things right.
On the other hand, if the waitress found the phone and put it in the drawer on the hostess stand for you to collect; then it was stolen by another patron; I don't think it's so clear-cut. Certainly, the restaurant should employ better procedures with high value lost property in future, but it seems odd that by moving lost property from somewhere unsafe to somewhere slightly safer, they become responsible for the fact that the property isn't completely safe.
Needless to say, we can only speculate as to whether it was another customer or a restaurant employee that stole the phone - so it's not immediately clear to me whether it's reasonable to expect the restaurant to put things right.
posted by Mike1024 at 8:31 AM on October 11, 2009 [1 favorite]
I think it depends on how the phone came to be missing after the waitress found it.
Obviously, if the waitress (or any other restaurant employee) stole it, I agree with you that I would expect the restaurant to put things right.
On the other hand, if the waitress found the phone and put it in the drawer on the hostess stand for you to collect; then it was stolen by another patron; I don't think it's so clear-cut. Certainly, the restaurant should employ better procedures with high value lost property in future, but it seems odd that by moving lost property from somewhere unsafe to somewhere slightly safer, they become responsible for the fact that the property isn't completely safe.
Needless to say, we can only speculate as to whether it was another customer or a restaurant employee that stole the phone - so it's not immediately clear to me whether it's reasonable to expect the restaurant to put things right.
posted by Mike1024 at 8:31 AM on October 11, 2009 [1 favorite]
I'm sorry, I just don't understand the "Yeah but." How does it work in other situations?
"I found your lost dog, but then I locked it in my hot car and it died of heat exposure."
"We found the credit card you left, it was in the register, and then an employee stole it. Sorry."
"I took your child to the security office in the mall, but they left your six year old to play with someone's confiscated switchblade, and the kid stabbed itself."
"I know you sent your laptop to my data recovery business, I was trying to save you from your lack of regular backups, when I dropped the computer and the screen broke."
"I was trying to fix your engine for you, and one of my mechanics backed into your car, I hope your ruined side panel won't be a problem."
"I wish you hadn't needed to go to the bathroom in my restaurant, after all, you came her for the food, not the toilet seat."
posted by OmieWise at 8:41 AM on October 11, 2009 [1 favorite]
"I found your lost dog, but then I locked it in my hot car and it died of heat exposure."
"We found the credit card you left, it was in the register, and then an employee stole it. Sorry."
"I took your child to the security office in the mall, but they left your six year old to play with someone's confiscated switchblade, and the kid stabbed itself."
"I know you sent your laptop to my data recovery business, I was trying to save you from your lack of regular backups, when I dropped the computer and the screen broke."
"I was trying to fix your engine for you, and one of my mechanics backed into your car, I hope your ruined side panel won't be a problem."
"I wish you hadn't needed to go to the bathroom in my restaurant, after all, you came her for the food, not the toilet seat."
posted by OmieWise at 8:41 AM on October 11, 2009 [1 favorite]
Data recovery businesses and car repair shops are specifically offering to take care of computers and cars. Restaurants have no obligation to safeguard patron's lost objects. That is not to say that they shouldn't even try or anything like that -- just that the OP has no rational basis to expect compensation.
posted by kmennie at 8:53 AM on October 11, 2009
posted by kmennie at 8:53 AM on October 11, 2009
If the waitress did steal the iPhone, she would not have told anyone she had it in the first place. How about we wait to see what the restaurant tells the OP after they return? It really may have been misplaced. It may have been busy and the waitress may have forgotten where she laid it down. Maybe she hid it somewhere she thought was safe so no one else would steal it and then forgot where the safe place was. Maybe another employee found it and stashed it in a safe place...there are a million possibilities other than saying an employee stole it.
posted by MaryDellamorte at 9:04 AM on October 11, 2009
posted by MaryDellamorte at 9:04 AM on October 11, 2009
OK, let's think of an analogous situation: the coat-check room. Do you know of any coat-checks that will ever assume responsibility for lost/stolen items? Even though you have a ticket to confirm they had your item in the first place? Of course not. That would open a bottomless can of worms.
posted by randomstriker at 9:33 AM on October 11, 2009
posted by randomstriker at 9:33 AM on October 11, 2009
I'm sorry, I just don't understand the "Yeah but." How does it work in other situations?
"I found your lost dog, but then I locked it in my hot car and it died of heat exposure."[...]"I took your child to the security office in the mall, but they left your six year old to play with someone's confiscated switchblade, and the kid stabbed itself."
Obviously it would be stupid to give a 6-year-old a switchblade - but in this case what the waitress did (leave the iphone somewhere it could be stolen) was exactly the same thing that the customer did, so the customer can hardly argue it's stupid.
If you gave your hypothetical child a switchblade, then I took the child's switchblade and gave it a smaller, blunter switchblade, but the child still stabbed itself, is it my fault? Would it perhaps be better if next time I let the child keep the bigger, sharper switchblade you gave it?
posted by Mike1024 at 9:44 AM on October 11, 2009
"I found your lost dog, but then I locked it in my hot car and it died of heat exposure."[...]"I took your child to the security office in the mall, but they left your six year old to play with someone's confiscated switchblade, and the kid stabbed itself."
Obviously it would be stupid to give a 6-year-old a switchblade - but in this case what the waitress did (leave the iphone somewhere it could be stolen) was exactly the same thing that the customer did, so the customer can hardly argue it's stupid.
If you gave your hypothetical child a switchblade, then I took the child's switchblade and gave it a smaller, blunter switchblade, but the child still stabbed itself, is it my fault? Would it perhaps be better if next time I let the child keep the bigger, sharper switchblade you gave it?
posted by Mike1024 at 9:44 AM on October 11, 2009
Best answer: Your odds of recovering your phone may go up if you offer a reward.
posted by theora55 at 9:54 AM on October 11, 2009
posted by theora55 at 9:54 AM on October 11, 2009
But what am I losing by asking if he'll reimburse me, on the off chance he says yes?
The fact that you ask this suggests - a little self respect.
Which is understandable. Ultimately, it was your leaving the thing behind that started the ball rolling. If another patron had walked off with the phone, you would presumably chalk it up to bad luck. Since it was a little more baroque in outcome and apparently the place really did try to do right, you'd be punishing them for a good deed poorly executed (or sabotaged by any number of people doing wrong) But again - a good deed that stemmed ultimately from going after your mistake. Try the Good Samaritan analogy and would you sue the doctor who treats the guy on the sidewalk for malpractice.
Or put it this way- if the manager did pay up, would you expect him to go after the waitress? Would you be okay with that?
Hope for the best, suck it up for the worst is my vote.
posted by IndigoJones at 11:19 AM on October 11, 2009 [1 favorite]
The fact that you ask this suggests - a little self respect.
Which is understandable. Ultimately, it was your leaving the thing behind that started the ball rolling. If another patron had walked off with the phone, you would presumably chalk it up to bad luck. Since it was a little more baroque in outcome and apparently the place really did try to do right, you'd be punishing them for a good deed poorly executed (or sabotaged by any number of people doing wrong) But again - a good deed that stemmed ultimately from going after your mistake. Try the Good Samaritan analogy and would you sue the doctor who treats the guy on the sidewalk for malpractice.
Or put it this way- if the manager did pay up, would you expect him to go after the waitress? Would you be okay with that?
Hope for the best, suck it up for the worst is my vote.
posted by IndigoJones at 11:19 AM on October 11, 2009 [1 favorite]
I'd recommend that you get renter's insurance. Costs practically nothing but a total life saver in situations like these.
posted by special-k at 11:55 AM on October 11, 2009
posted by special-k at 11:55 AM on October 11, 2009
Let's forget about the vexed questions of duty for a moment here.
Here's what you do, shopefowler: go to the restaurant in person. Speak to the waitress who found your phone. Ask her what happened. Expect that she may be bullshitting you a bit, but see if you can give her an out to give it back; e.g., say, "Could you look for it again, please?" or something like that. If there's any chance she'll return it, this is really the easiest way to make it happen.
posted by clockzero at 12:17 PM on October 11, 2009
Here's what you do, shopefowler: go to the restaurant in person. Speak to the waitress who found your phone. Ask her what happened. Expect that she may be bullshitting you a bit, but see if you can give her an out to give it back; e.g., say, "Could you look for it again, please?" or something like that. If there's any chance she'll return it, this is really the easiest way to make it happen.
posted by clockzero at 12:17 PM on October 11, 2009
kmennie: "Waitress has a new iPhone. :(
Waitress is not going to announce the new acquisition if Waitress is nicking phones. Come on.
The notion that the restaurant should "fix it" (i.e., pay for it) is even more ridiculous."
Uh, where did I say she was going to announce it? EVERYONE knows what an iPhone is and knows that it's a $300+ item. You don't just put it down somewhere.
posted by IndigoRain at 1:17 PM on October 11, 2009
Waitress is not going to announce the new acquisition if Waitress is nicking phones. Come on.
The notion that the restaurant should "fix it" (i.e., pay for it) is even more ridiculous."
Uh, where did I say she was going to announce it? EVERYONE knows what an iPhone is and knows that it's a $300+ item. You don't just put it down somewhere.
posted by IndigoRain at 1:17 PM on October 11, 2009
Likely she is not the one who found the iPhone. Some customer found it and turned it in and she saw it laying there and took it and claimed she misplaced it.
posted by IndigoRain at 1:18 PM on October 11, 2009
posted by IndigoRain at 1:18 PM on October 11, 2009
Best answer: I think your mistake was in not being firm enough with the manager. E.g., telling him "So a customer turned it in to Waitress, and in fifteen minutes she's lost it? Do you really believe that story? Does that make sense to you? Because it seems awfully transparent to me. Do you think we should call the police, or the restaurant owner first? Maybe while I'm calling the police, you could try again to find the phone."
You let the manager off the hook, you let him make his problem (a larcenous or incompetent employee) your problem. Don't do this. Make him own the problem, make him aware that it'll take more than glib excuses for him to get out of this without repercussions.
Now that you let the manager off the hook, you have to put the owner on the hook, as I wrote before: make the owner aware that either the phone id produced, or you're compensated its full value, or he'll have a publicity problem more costly than an iphone.
posted by orthogonality at 3:06 PM on October 11, 2009 [6 favorites]
You let the manager off the hook, you let him make his problem (a larcenous or incompetent employee) your problem. Don't do this. Make him own the problem, make him aware that it'll take more than glib excuses for him to get out of this without repercussions.
Now that you let the manager off the hook, you have to put the owner on the hook, as I wrote before: make the owner aware that either the phone id produced, or you're compensated its full value, or he'll have a publicity problem more costly than an iphone.
posted by orthogonality at 3:06 PM on October 11, 2009 [6 favorites]
I'm feeling a need to speak up for this poor waitress. First off, the OP called them, they said they had it, but then couldn't find it. There are a lot of points between A and OMGSTEALINGWAITRESS! Some of those are: host/hostess on that shift has a "safe" spot where they put left items and the manager didn't know where that was; it wasn't put in the usual safe spot, but another one of host/hostess/managers devising; waitress/manager/host took it home for safe keeping (yes, this happens); someone else in the restaurant nicked it. The assumptions everyone is making about the waitress are pretty distressing to me - I know many, many honest servers who make plenty of money and can afford their own damn iphones.
posted by The Light Fantastic at 3:12 PM on October 11, 2009 [7 favorites]
posted by The Light Fantastic at 3:12 PM on October 11, 2009 [7 favorites]
where did I say she was going to announce it?
OP: "explained that the waitress had my phone"
If Waitress was going to pocket a phone, there wouldn't have been a 'Yes, Manager, I did have the phone' but just: 'No, nothing got left behind that I saw.'
posted by kmennie at 4:12 PM on October 11, 2009 [1 favorite]
OP: "explained that the waitress had my phone"
If Waitress was going to pocket a phone, there wouldn't have been a 'Yes, Manager, I did have the phone' but just: 'No, nothing got left behind that I saw.'
posted by kmennie at 4:12 PM on October 11, 2009 [1 favorite]
So a customer turned it in to Waitress, and in fifteen minutes she's lost it? Do you really believe that story? Does that make sense to you? Because it seems awfully transparent to me. Do you think we should call the police, or the restaurant owner first? Maybe while I'm calling the police, you could try again to find the phone."
This is ridiculous. As much as it sucks, if you can afford to have an iPhone, you can afford to replace an iPhone.
Who the hell knows what happened. No one. It's all guessing. Definitely follow up. But don't be THAT guy. Do what orthogonality says and you 'might' get your iPhone back, but you better not go back because you're guaranteed to have something nasty done to your food. People hate THAT guy.
(and watching orthogonality and omniewise play tagteam favoring each others comments makes me think maybe they're simply yankin' your chain.)
posted by Dennis Murphy at 6:18 PM on October 11, 2009
This is ridiculous. As much as it sucks, if you can afford to have an iPhone, you can afford to replace an iPhone.
Who the hell knows what happened. No one. It's all guessing. Definitely follow up. But don't be THAT guy. Do what orthogonality says and you 'might' get your iPhone back, but you better not go back because you're guaranteed to have something nasty done to your food. People hate THAT guy.
(and watching orthogonality and omniewise play tagteam favoring each others comments makes me think maybe they're simply yankin' your chain.)
posted by Dennis Murphy at 6:18 PM on October 11, 2009
Response by poster: I went back today before it got crowded and of course there was a whole new shift of people working. So I let them know what happened and offered a reward. Still haven't received a call.
To clarify, the manager's words were "The waitress is very embarrassed about this, but she was bringing the phone to me and got distracted and misplaced it." Again, I don't blame the waitress because it was busy and she was doing her job, which is not watching out for my stuff. But I do expect the management to be a little more proactive, especially if they claim it's in the building somewhere.
And no, being able to afford an iPhone does NOT mean I can afford to replace one.
posted by shopefowler at 7:05 PM on October 11, 2009
To clarify, the manager's words were "The waitress is very embarrassed about this, but she was bringing the phone to me and got distracted and misplaced it." Again, I don't blame the waitress because it was busy and she was doing her job, which is not watching out for my stuff. But I do expect the management to be a little more proactive, especially if they claim it's in the building somewhere.
And no, being able to afford an iPhone does NOT mean I can afford to replace one.
posted by shopefowler at 7:05 PM on October 11, 2009
This is ridiculous. As much as it sucks, if you can afford to have an iPhone, you can afford to replace an iPhone.
I agree with everything in your post but the "suck it up, richey-rich" implication behind this remark. It is completely irrelevant what the OP can and cannot afford. She lost something expensive that she just got; it doesn't matter what her bankroll is, because it sucks to lose expensive things and have to replace them.
I do agree (as is evident from my comment waaay above) that being accusatory and combative to the manager/owner is a douchebag thing to do here, for exactly the reason you state.
This is exactly why I'll never own a restaurant or a bar. If one of my waitresses found an item, put it down, and then some drunk motherfucker took it when she wasn't looking, I would probably want to punch a customer who started threatening me with legal action or the cops because "I or someone in my employ obviously stole it".
The whole "the waitress obviously stole it" thing is total bullshit, too. Not only is it not obvious, it isn't even likely. Otherwise, she would never have mentioned it.
posted by secret about box at 7:19 PM on October 11, 2009
I agree with everything in your post but the "suck it up, richey-rich" implication behind this remark. It is completely irrelevant what the OP can and cannot afford. She lost something expensive that she just got; it doesn't matter what her bankroll is, because it sucks to lose expensive things and have to replace them.
I do agree (as is evident from my comment waaay above) that being accusatory and combative to the manager/owner is a douchebag thing to do here, for exactly the reason you state.
This is exactly why I'll never own a restaurant or a bar. If one of my waitresses found an item, put it down, and then some drunk motherfucker took it when she wasn't looking, I would probably want to punch a customer who started threatening me with legal action or the cops because "I or someone in my employ obviously stole it".
The whole "the waitress obviously stole it" thing is total bullshit, too. Not only is it not obvious, it isn't even likely. Otherwise, she would never have mentioned it.
posted by secret about box at 7:19 PM on October 11, 2009
To clarify, the manager's words were "The waitress is very embarrassed about this, but she was bringing the phone to me and got distracted and misplaced it." Again, I don't blame the waitress because it was busy and she was doing her job, which is not watching out for my stuff. But I do expect the management to be a little more proactive, especially if they claim it's in the building somewhere.
Can talk to the waitress and get her to retrace her steps after she found it? (Apologies if that was done already and I missed it upthread.) It might jog her memory a bit and either help locate it or discover it got left in an area where it could've walked off easily.
posted by secret about box at 7:23 PM on October 11, 2009
Can talk to the waitress and get her to retrace her steps after she found it? (Apologies if that was done already and I missed it upthread.) It might jog her memory a bit and either help locate it or discover it got left in an area where it could've walked off easily.
posted by secret about box at 7:23 PM on October 11, 2009
Response by poster: Also for the record, it hasn't been used and the battery is now dead. Naive as I may be, I do believe it's misplaced and not stolen at this point.
posted by shopefowler at 7:32 PM on October 11, 2009
posted by shopefowler at 7:32 PM on October 11, 2009
Response by poster: In case anybody still cares, they finally told me point blank that the waitress put it in the office, and it disappeared from the office within the ~15 minutes it was unattended there. The office is not accessible to patrons, therefore it appears it was stolen by an employee. I am going to make the owner aware of the situation.
posted by shopefowler at 9:38 PM on October 11, 2009 [1 favorite]
posted by shopefowler at 9:38 PM on October 11, 2009 [1 favorite]
Very awesome that they straight-up told you what happened after the waitress put it down. I'd definitely ask that they make it right at this point, if only employees had access to the area it was taken to.
posted by secret about box at 9:55 PM on October 11, 2009
posted by secret about box at 9:55 PM on October 11, 2009
Well, in light of the fact that it wasn't lost, but undoubtedly stolen by an employee, I do think they bear some responsibility and ought to make it right.
The restaurant isn't responsible for its other patrons, or for keeping track of your stuff, but it is responsible for its employees' actions when they're on the job.
posted by Netzapper at 4:00 AM on October 13, 2009 [3 favorites]
The restaurant isn't responsible for its other patrons, or for keeping track of your stuff, but it is responsible for its employees' actions when they're on the job.
posted by Netzapper at 4:00 AM on October 13, 2009 [3 favorites]
f you can afford to have an iPhone, you can afford to replace an iPhone.
Bad logic.
Due to the subsidized carrier plans in most countries, your first iPhone probably costs $99, but if you lose it, your replacement will cost $800.
A lot of people can afford the $99 phone, but not many can afford the $800 replacement.
posted by rokusan at 12:17 PM on October 14, 2009
Bad logic.
Due to the subsidized carrier plans in most countries, your first iPhone probably costs $99, but if you lose it, your replacement will cost $800.
A lot of people can afford the $99 phone, but not many can afford the $800 replacement.
posted by rokusan at 12:17 PM on October 14, 2009
I was only wondering if there was anything else to do in the meantime, or some obscure Apple policy or something (delusional, I know) that covered my stupidity 10 days out.
Actually, yes, if you had the foresight to buy it with the right kind of American Express card. Gold cards and above carry automatic theft and damage insurance on new purchases for 90 days.
posted by Caviar at 3:31 PM on October 15, 2009
Actually, yes, if you had the foresight to buy it with the right kind of American Express card. Gold cards and above carry automatic theft and damage insurance on new purchases for 90 days.
posted by Caviar at 3:31 PM on October 15, 2009
Response by poster: Followup: The owner did replace the phone. And the restaurant has my business for life. I'm posting good reviews online and telling all my friends to go there. Happy ending.
posted by shopefowler at 12:53 PM on November 10, 2009
posted by shopefowler at 12:53 PM on November 10, 2009
That's really great news, and a great business decision. The cost of the phone is negligible to the business, especially when offset by good word of mouth.
posted by OmieWise at 1:52 PM on November 10, 2009
posted by OmieWise at 1:52 PM on November 10, 2009
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by 2oh1 at 11:21 PM on October 10, 2009