I'm scared

May 15, 2008 4:30 PM

what are the chances she's pregnant?

i had relations with a girl yesterday. we were both bottomless and i rubbed my penis on her vagina. there was minimal insertion, and no pre-ejaculation. however at the end i masturbated onto her leg, and a little bit touched her vagina... right in the opening. I immediately got a dry paper towel and wiped it off until she was dry. on a scale of 1-10, what are the chances she could get pregnant, with 10 being almost certain?

posted by anonymous to health & fitness (48 comments total)

IANAD - but on a scale of one to ten it's a one. It'd seriously be a miracle.
posted by moxiedoll at 4:34 PM on May 15, 2008

No one will be able to tell you with 100 percent accuracy. She should look into morning-after medications.
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 4:36 PM on May 15, 2008 [1 favorite]

Extremely unlikely, but not impossible.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 4:37 PM on May 15, 2008

This Google search may help.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 4:38 PM on May 15, 2008

the morning after pill is safe and legal, but it's no joke. (she should read up on side effects, if she's so inclined). honestly, I think taking the morning after pill because a tiny bit of ejaculate got on the "opening" of her vagina would be a wild overreaction. (not that I don't understand getting nutty over this kind of thing).
posted by moxiedoll at 4:39 PM on May 15, 2008 [7 favorites]

also, she has medical problems, particularly with her heart, so i dunno if she could even take the morning after pill...
posted by FireStyle at 4:39 PM on May 15, 2008

2, with leanings towards 1.
posted by Frasermoo at 4:43 PM on May 15, 2008

I just want to clarify my thought ... it is indeed extremely unlikely ... but would you rather take the bullets out of the gun or wear a bulletproof vest? In other words, would you rather do something or hope for something?
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 4:46 PM on May 15, 2008

this is most definitely my first and lat game of russian roulette...
posted by FireStyle at 4:48 PM on May 15, 2008 [1 favorite]

i'm glad this frightened you. never mind pregnancy, have you ever seen a genital wart? or a herpes sore?

i think the odds of her getting pregnant are tiny, but for the love of pete, don't forget how panicked you feel right now and use a rubber next time.
posted by thinkingwoman at 4:52 PM on May 15, 2008 [2 favorites]

If she can take the morning after pill, get her to take it! Yes, the chances are minimal that she's pregnant but at least you can put this out of your mind (and use a condom next time!)
posted by liquorice at 4:53 PM on May 15, 2008

Fertilisation can occur between 5 days before and 2 days after ovulation. Ovulation is generally on the 14th day of the menstrual cycle but that can vary.
If this occurred within that timeframe there's a chance that she'd get pregnant.
posted by jouke at 4:54 PM on May 15, 2008

The first thing you should do is figure out where she is in her cycle. It does not sound as though this is part of your calculations.

The MAP is serious medicine, and shouldn't be taken for no reason.
posted by Riverine at 5:06 PM on May 15, 2008

The morning after pill is blunt-force weapon- it will make her miserable for at least 24 hours while she menstruates and becomes pretty ill. Ask her to consider taking it if you're scared, but make sure she knows the repercussions. There's only a very small chance that she'd become pregnant from this situation you've described, but if you'd rather be safe than sorry, it's one of your few sure-fire options.
posted by pedmands at 5:09 PM on May 15, 2008

it will make her miserable for at least 24 hours while she menstruates and becomes pretty ill.

I'm sorry, what? I didn't realise the morning after pill caused menstruation?
posted by liquorice at 5:17 PM on May 15, 2008

By which I mean, taking EC does not guarantee any of the side-effects you outline. It only may do those things.
posted by liquorice at 5:19 PM on May 15, 2008

For a randomly timed episode of full penetrative intercourse the rate of conception is somewhere between 2% and 5%. However at the most fertile time, the rate of conception from a single episode of penetrative intercourse is somewhere between 10% and 30%.

The chances in this case are lower because intercrural sex is less effective at delivering sperm towards the cervix. However it is possible, and in fact I have seen a case, which I wrote up for the British Journal of O&G here.

If you know this girl well enough to ask her when her last period began, and how long her menstrual cycle is, it might therefore offer you some further reassurance. If she has a regular 28 day cycle, and her last period began either less than 6 days before you had sex, or more than 20 days before, you can more or less stop worrying. Either way you have nothing to lose by helping her to seek appropriate medical advice and/or emergency contraception. If she is going to get oral emergency contraception she should do it as soon as possible though.
posted by roofus at 5:24 PM on May 15, 2008 [12 favorites]

you are being waaaay too paranoid. less than 1 on a 1-10 scale.
posted by gnutron at 5:29 PM on May 15, 2008

pedmands: "The morning after pill is blunt-force weapon- it will make her miserable for at least 24 hours while she menstruates and becomes pretty ill."

I've taken the morning-after pill, and that wasn't my experience at all. I didn't feel at all cruddy, as far as I recall, and I certainly didn't menstruate and become "pretty ill."

She should go to Planned Parenthood or a similar clinic and tell them what happened. They'll advise her what to do. Here's their fact sheet about emergency contraception.

You should go with her to the clinic, or else she will resent you and you won't get near the opening of her vagina again.
posted by The corpse in the library at 5:29 PM on May 15, 2008

Wow. Cool, roofus. Clearly, YAAD.

I'm with moxiedoll here: the chances are minuscule. Find out what's going on with her in the next few weeks, or at least until her next menstrual cycle (which will stop if but not only if she's pregnant). And pick a smarter place to ejaculate next time!
posted by svolix at 5:31 PM on May 15, 2008

I'm sorry that I'm monopolizing your thread, but I'm going to suggest that you think about a couple of things - your question, as it is posed, is a good one. And the answer is, yes it's possible, but the odds are vanishingly small. Personally, I wouldn't call coming on a girl's leg "russian roulette" - and contrary to what some have suggested, using a condom wouldn't solve your problem. Because even if you had had intercourse with a condom and no unprotected touching? there'd still be a non-zero chance of pregnancy. If you're going to be sexually active (and there's nothing wrong with deciding you aren't emotionally ready to handle these uncertainties), the best you can do is reduce risk (and you can reduce various risks to an enormous degree). You might do well to read up on pregnancy and merits of different forms of birth control.... it might surprise you to learn that your "ten" option - "almost certainly" - wouldn't be the right answer even if you'd had unprotected sex one week before her period. (although the risk would be much higher than the current situation - a real risk). Anyway, I can tell you one thing that's not a good idea, and that's to fool around with girls and then try to "get them" to take the morning after pill. (But - I'd suggest - that the solution is also not to decide that the whole thing is impossibly dangerous). You can manage things such that you're dealing with small risks and great rewards.
posted by moxiedoll at 5:35 PM on May 15, 2008 [3 favorites]

The morning after pill is blunt-force weapon- it will make her miserable for at least 24 hours while she menstruates and becomes pretty ill.

Oh, for heaven's sake. First off, it doesn't make you menstruate immediately, and it doesn't necessarily cause any unpleasant side effects. I've taken Plan B before (curse you, broken condom!) and I felt completely fine -- no nausea, no cramps, nothing. The only result was that my period arrived a couple of days early.

OP: if your partner does decide to take it and is worried she might have a reaction, though, she can take something like Dramamine to help minimize the risk of nausea/vomiting.

Good info about how emergency contraception works and how to get it here.
posted by scody at 5:39 PM on May 15, 2008 [3 favorites]

I was just reporting personal experience. If it wasn't the norm, I apologize for being misleading. However, it certainly happened that way and therefore I take that to mean it could happen again. Is it not right to assume worst-case scenarios in a situation like this?
posted by pedmands at 6:13 PM on May 15, 2008

thanks for all the replies... the threat level went from red to orange...

I mean i know it only takes one sperm, but there was very little on her (what i think i understand to be called) her labia (aka. opening). and i wiped it immediately.

problem tho is she has a heart condition where she has to take meds every day, so i'm not sure if the morning after pill is even an option...

she says she should have her period around the first of june.
posted by FireStyle at 6:17 PM on May 15, 2008

You sound like a gambling type. I like that in a guy. Your odds are great that she isn't pregnant. Likewise your odds are great that you don't have an STD. Still, there is a nonzero chance that she maybe preggers. (And a nonzero chance that your dick will rot off.)

You have two options:

1. Emergency contraception.

2. Wait it out.

If you choose option one, you've zeroed out her chance for being pregnant (well, with rare exception.)

If you choose option two, well, you're probably still okay, but if she is pregnant you're going to be faced with two more choices:

1. Abortion.

2. Fatherhood.

RU486 is a pain in the ass, and not that cheap, but it is an option of last resort for zeroing out the chance of her being pregnant very early on.

Fatherhood... meh... probably not so good for you right now.

You've got to ask yourself a question: Do I feel lucky? Well, do ya, punk?
posted by wfrgms at 6:19 PM on May 15, 2008

Fertilisation can occur between 5 days before and 2 days after ovulation.

This is inaccurate. Please, please be really sure on your facts before passing along incorrect information that can have consequences for other people.

And for all the other people suggesting that risk be assessed based on trying to calculate the menstrual cycle of the young women in question: bad science. The cycles of young women are notoriously unreliable, and an accurate ovulation date can only be estimated retrospectively - ie, after she gets (or doesn't get) her period. Which, assuming she has not already ovulated, will now probably be delayed due to stress, so...yeah, really bad method for estimating risk.

FireStyle, the short and real answer to your question is that yes, you guys have a pregnancy risk. It is low, but it exists. If you folks are absolutely not in a position to deal with an unplanned pregnancy, please get emergency contraception immediately. You will find this information to be, well, informative.

As to your concerns about your partner's heart condition, EC should have no effect on that. (I am not a doctor, but I am basing that on the fact that there are no contraindications for progestin-only pills, which is what Plan B is. If she is taking medication for a heart condition, however, she should let the doctor or pharmacists know. In contrast, labor or general anesthesia for a termination are potentially much more risky, depending on her situation.
posted by DarlingBri at 6:19 PM on May 15, 2008

Why in the world is almost everyone saying there's nothing to worry about?? NO WAY can you say she won't get pregnant from this. Yeah, it's less likely than if he came inside her, but "minimal insertion" and ejaculation "right in the opening" does indeed carry risk!

Emergency Contraception is available over the counter, at least in the US. If she's under 18, then it's by prescription (which really annoys me...it's safe). As far as I know, there's no problem with taking it for a heart condition, and dealing with an unintended pregnancy is FAR worse than any side effects Plan B might give her.

/sex educator
posted by Stewriffic at 6:34 PM on May 15, 2008

Is it not right to assume worst-case scenarios in a situation like this?

Not when the worst-case scenario is misleadingly presented as the only scenario, particularly when that misleading info might actually dissuade someone from using EC. There is an important factual difference between saying "she will become miserably ill" vs. "some women have side effects -- when I used it, I was miserably ill."
posted by scody at 7:02 PM on May 15, 2008

Thought I'd just jump in and say that I've used Plan B before - twice actually - without noticeable side effect. The risk of pregnancy is slight, but what do you lose if you use Plan B? A little bit of money and risk of side effect. What do you gain? Peace of mind.

And for the record, an abortion will be a lot more expensive and a lot more painful than Plan B will. Childbirth trumps all the choices of course, in terms of cost and pain.
posted by reebear at 7:34 PM on May 15, 2008

The chances that a pregnancy will result are staggeringly low as previous people have suggested.

I have not run the stats or anything but on first read it seems almost that your level of worry after this instance of sexual activity should approach that after any sexual activity occurs regardless of the use of a condom, or another form of birth control.

The possibility that she is pregnant is so remote that (I think in my experience anyway) most would not consider it at all. Though it will provide for more carefulness in the future.
posted by skinnydipp at 7:45 PM on May 15, 2008

Sorry I didn't specifically answer your question.

1
posted by skinnydipp at 7:46 PM on May 15, 2008

Personally, I'd get the woman some EC. It's not that big of a deal. It's just some extra progestin. While I'm not a doctor, it's worth talking to one, since it seems rather unlikely that it would have any effect whatsoever on a heart condition.

The stress will likely have more of an effect on her.

And also, I just want to chime in and say that EC isn't bad for everyone. My SO is prone to nausea and didn't have an issue with it when she had to take it many years ago. I seemed to remember her getting somewhat ill, but she forcefully insists that she wasn't. At. All, so don't let that dissuade you from doing the safe thing here.

I'm in agreement that it's very unlikely she'll get pregnant from you ejaculating on her inner thigh near her vagina, but I was having regular intercourse with a woman for over six months with no protection and didn't get her pregnant, so my idea of the risks may be rather off. Despite that, I'd suggest EC just for the peace of mind.
posted by wierdo at 8:01 PM on May 15, 2008

Uh, if her period is due June 1 and she is on a regular 28 day cycle, that would mean that this week was her most fertile. I am not trying to scare you back into the red zone. Plan B it, and do your best to ensure that she's ok for the 24 hours after she takes it - I have known some women who have been very ill from Plan B (not everyone, but some) so she might want some support, like say someone to bring her gingerale and advil. Or she might want to be left alone.

Yes, many of us have had near misses or might think that it's not likely, but how certain are you that there was no pre-ejaculate? By minimal insertion, do you mean none, or some? Because in the prime of ones fertility, it is very easy to get pregnant even when it "didn't really count." Play it on the safe time and try to learn from this. If you wait too long Plan B will not be an option, and then you will have to play the waiting game which is not fun.
posted by SassHat at 8:37 PM on May 15, 2008

er, "safe side"
posted by SassHat at 8:38 PM on May 15, 2008

i am almost 100% certain there was no pre-ejaculate. Truth be told, I was not even aroused enough anyway. there was insertion a few times, but i could count on one hand how many times that happened. i thought "outercourse" which i learned the name of during the course of this discussion, was a good way to fool around without worry. The worry derives from a very tiny bit of semen that found its way onto her labia (or opening, or lips.... whatever its called) that i did wipe off with a dry paper towel until it was dry. But I will be calling her doctor re: plan b to make sure it is safe for her to take and get it right away... that is the best bet given the situation.
posted by FireStyle at 9:45 PM on May 15, 2008

But I will be calling her doctor re: plan b to make sure it is safe for her to take and get it right away... that is the best bet given the situation.

If she's 18 or older, she doesn't need a doctor -- she can get Plan B directly from a pharmacy.

If she still requires a doctor's involvement (i.e., she's not yet 18, and/or is concerned about her other health issues) you should know that her doctor most certainly won't discuss her medical situation with you -- it would be a violation of federal privacy laws. She will have to speak to her doctor herself.
posted by scody at 11:40 PM on May 15, 2008

I'm not a whinger at all and it WAS 8 years ago. I'd taken some anti-nausea thingy with it but just quietly it made me sick as a dog! ...I was travelling in a car at the time though? So for the love of god - take it easy for that day and don't awaken the beast! (...ugh!!)

(And dude, you're creeping me out. You're talking about her like she's a child. She's a big girl. Isn't she??)
posted by mu~ha~ha~ha~har at 11:57 PM on May 15, 2008

i am almost 100% certain there was no pre-ejaculate.

You cannot be at all certain of that. Pre-ejaculate is very hard to detect or to distinguish from other people's body fluids when everyone's bits are busy, well, making fluids.

Truth be told, I was not even aroused enough anyway.

Considering your next statement, you were aroused enough.

there was insertion a few times, but i could count on one hand how many times that happened.

Dude, we could have used this information about 38 comments ago. This significantly ups your risk factor in this situation. If you inserted your penis into her vagina, you had unprotected intercouse. You absolutely can get pregnant from this, even if you withdraw before ejaculation. As millions of people can tell you, even when properly executed, withdrawal is a terrible method of birth control. It should be filed in your mental filing cabinet under EPIC FAIL.

i thought "outercourse" which i learned the name of during the course of this discussion, was a good way to fool around without worry.

No, CONDOMS are a good way to fool around without worry. Here is a basic rule of thumb:

If your penis is erect and within a foot of anyone's vagina, put a condom on. Obviously, you're going to have situations where that is not warrented, like say walking through a shopping mall, but start with that as your basic premise and work backwards from there and you'll be a lot safer.

In any case, the story of your situation has changed and you have moved from a low rish level to a much higer risk level. EC is absolutely warrented here. If you are seeking advice from a healthcare practitioner, your partner should not tell Planned Parenthood "my boyfriend ejaculated a small amount around my labia" because that is not the full story. "My boyfirend and I had unprotected intercouse, followed by withdrawal" because a) that is what has happened here, and b) that is the situation they need to respond to.
posted by DarlingBri at 4:49 AM on May 16, 2008 [1 favorite]

thanks for all the replies... the threat level went from red to orange...

She's not pregnant. The threat level isn't even orange, it's seafoam green or something.
posted by srrh at 5:32 AM on May 16, 2008

Listen to DarlingBri. Your partner needs to take the morning after pill IMMEDIATELY (it's effective for a couple of days after the fact). And both of you need to educate yourselves on the basic facts of reproduction ASAP. Ask your local family planning clinic for literature or inquire about a course.

A friend of mine got pregnant from doing what you two did. She was under the impression that "no one gets pregnant from Pre-E". WRONG. Some people do. Her, for instance.
posted by orange swan at 6:23 AM on May 16, 2008

RU486 is a pain in the ass, and not that cheap, but it is an option of last resort for zeroing out the chance of her being pregnant very early on.

Just to clarify: RU486 causes an abortion and will only be prescribed if a woman is in the early stages of pregnancy. It is NOT the morning-after pill and is not available over the counter. In fact, it usually requires two doctor's visits. It can cause some pretty unpleasant side effects and bleeding.

Plan B, the morning after pill, can be purchased over the counter and is used as "back-up" contraception. In my experience, the side effects are minimal, although it will screw up her cycles for a month or two.

FWIW, I think you're both in the clear. Don't stress but buy some condoms.
posted by jrichards at 6:39 AM on May 16, 2008

MeTa thread.
posted by DarlingBri at 7:09 AM on May 16, 2008

Sorry, but no one here can give you odds. The only important thing is that the risk is not zero, and you are clearly concerned about it. The only course of action right now it to obtain emergency contraception as soon as possible. If you're in the United States and are 18 (and have ID), you can go to the pharmacy counter and purchase it. The pharmacist can consult you about side effects and possible interactions.

Also know that EC is for just that, emergencies. It should not be relied on for consistent pregnancy protection, and it also does not prevent STDs. Please read up on contraception to prevent pregnancy and STDs in the future.
posted by ALongDecember at 8:24 AM on May 16, 2008

Odds are remote, but you may want to get EC anyway, even if only for peace of mind.

As for the side effects of the EC -- okay, yeah, there are some. But not to the point that I'd consider it a "blunt force weapon" as some would call it. Yes, it's a "blunt force" thing in the sense that it's a megadose of regular birth control pills -- but that doesn't mean that you will be bedridden as a result. She will NOT instantaneously start her period when she takes it, unless her period was due at that precise second anyway.

All of the following is based on my own experiences with EC (I've had to go that route about three times over the past 20 years). There may be some nausea; but not projectile-vomiting scale, just a low-grade "bleah" feeling. The current formulation may not even cause any nausea at all. It may monkey with her regular cycle for a month or two -- but I've heard more instances of EC making your periods LATE than early. It may crank whatever PMS symptoms she gets that month up an extra notch (slight moodiness is one of my occasional things, and one of the very few instances of a fight I've had with my current SO happened during a month I'd taken EC).

But something else to consider -- even though the chances are indeed pretty remote, if you think there's any chance you'll be worrying anyway, MENTAL STRESS can also make a period late; so if you think you're going to get yourselves into a loop where you're worrying, and the worry makes her late, and that makes you worry more, which makes her even more late, and that makes you worry even more, and...then take EC to save yourselves that stress. I know myself well enough to know that my brain can take even a 0.5% chance of something and blow it up into mammoth proportions to the point that I convince myself that "it's obvious that I AM JUST THAT BIG OF A FLUKE OF NATURE so this MUST BE HAPPENING TO ME, oh no", so I've take EC mostly just to stop that paranoia.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 8:24 AM on May 16, 2008

FYI, if you're getting EC and the "drugs for a heart condition" includes coumadin/warfarin she should definitely tell the physician that (since she might be headed to someone besides her normal doc), and it would probably be worthwhile to check her clotting more than normal.
posted by a robot made out of meat at 9:05 AM on May 16, 2008

DarlingBri is right, DarlingBri is right, DarlingBri is right. People telling you not to do anything are wrong.

The morning after pill is blunt-force weapon- it will make her miserable for at least 24 hours

Count me among those calling BS on that. I've also taken it, and, apart from minor spotting, noticed absoutely no side effects - no nausea, no cramps, no heavy bleeding. I also felt tremendous relief. There's a short window in which it's effective (I think it's 72 hours) so don't delay.

One thing that concerns me is that your partner seems to be using you as the sole source of information on what to do. She really needs to be talking to a GYN or nurse-practitioner. Recommend that she call the nearest Planned Parenthood (it'll be totally confidential) and describe her situation. They may have her come in to get Plan B and even have an appointment to discuss other BC options and general reproductive information. She's sexually active, so she really should start getting in command of this information and learn to use resources that will help her manage her fertility.
posted by Miko at 12:00 PM on May 16, 2008

here is the conclusion to this story:

we both talked to planned parenthood, her doctors, and a GYN. they all gave her clearance to take the pill with her medical conditions. I bought her the pill and she took them in front of me so I know she did it. otherwise, i guess thats about all that can be done.

I had no intentions of doing nothing and this is why i posted this question. this is my first time really using metafilter and I am quite impressed by the sheer number of responses. I'd like to thank you all for offering your points of view and your assistance with talking to the appropriate people and finding literature on the situation.

to the person who felt i was creeping them out, i'd like to offer this. I think that I should be involved with her in this process because it takes two to tango. By hearing the story for myself, it helps me find out the best solutions. I do indeed practice safe sex. i wasn't expecting things to go where they did the other day, and I thought well if i masturbate to end it then there's no harm no foul. i do realize this is completely false and have the scare of a lifetime on my shoulders. rest assured, there will never again be a post of this nature coming from me.

thanks again, everyone for your help with all of this.
posted by FireStyle at 1:01 PM on May 16, 2008 [2 favorites]

If she is over 18, and you are in the US, have her call the nearest pharmacy and ask to speak to a pharmacist (not a technician). She can discuss the plan B pill with the pharmacist, and ask about potential interactions with her heart medications, all without having to look the pharmacist in the eye, or worry about anyone overhearing. If the pharmacist says the drugs are fine together, she can ask them to have the prescription waiting under her name at the counter. She won't have to stand in line and then say "I need the Plan B Pill" in front of a bunch of strangers, she can just say "I'm picking up an order for [hername]". It can be very discreet. It's amazing how embarrassment can keep people from asking the questions they need to ask, and getting the care they need, so please don't let that stop her.

Plan B is less effective the longer you wait to take it, so please have her do this soon. Also, she will probably have to take one pill now and another one 12 hours later. It's not fun to take a pill at 4am, but have her take the first one as soon as she gets it from the pharmacy, even if it's the middle of the afternoon. Ask her if she wants you to stay up late with her so she can take the second pill on time. Rent some funny movies that aren't about pregnancy or sex, to distract you both while you wait. Think of how scared you are, multiply it times 100, and you'll approach what she's probably feeling. Your ability to help her through this calmly, and in a well-informed manner, will speak well for you.
posted by vytae at 1:05 PM on May 16, 2008