I love my girlfriend, but I don't want to go south of the border

December 15, 2007 5:27 PM

My girlfriend is having second thoughts about what she wants out of life. This could lead to a change and possible end our relationship. I'm scared.

I'm 29 and she's 25. She just graduated from college last May, and is now attending further classes so she can get into a nursing masters program. The city she currently lives in bores her, and she's feeling like she needs to move on (her words).

She's Catholic and I'm not. I've already agreed that if we get married, she can raise the kids Catholic. I'm not terribly religious. Recently, she says that she's concerned about whether she can have a proper Catholic family when one of the parents is not Catholic.

She said that she wants to live in a big city. I may have to take another bar exam (I'm an attorney), but I'm fine with that too. I've always wanted to live in the city.

Now, she says she wants to live in Mexico (she's half-Mexican). I don't have any desire to live in Mexico. I don't know the language or culture, and have no idea if I could get a decent job down there.

I feel like I've given a lot up here, and that she should also compromise. I've told her this, and she said that she's got a lot of thinking to do. She's being extremely rigid on this living in Mexico issue.

I love this girl and want to be married to her. I'm willing to do a lot, but I don't want to convert to Catholicism or live in Mexico.

Any advice as to how I can talk to her and make her understand my feelings would be appreciates.

posted by anonymous to human relations (27 comments total)

I think at this point, your goal should be listening to her and finding out what the feelings motivating her desires are. Of course you're going to have your own desires and goals, and those should be part of the conversation, but if either of you start out with the goal of making the other one understand, you'll polarize the debate from the beginning.

Take a step back, find out what's going on with her. After she tells you her underlying concerns, tell her what your underlying concerns are (not, "I don't want to move to Mexico or convert," but "I'm worried about moving to Mexico because... and I'm worried about our religious differences because..."). Figure out what each of you is thinking, don't try to change each other's minds.
posted by occhiblu at 5:35 PM on December 15, 2007

Not to jump to the worst conclusion here, but do you think it's at all possible she might be having second thoughts about your relationship, especially if it's marriage-level serious, and she doesn't want to be the one to end it? If she keeps pushing you with unrealistic demands until you draw the line or give an ultimatum, then the onus for ending the relationship is on you and not her. (Don't know if she's that type, the passive aggressive non-confrontational type. If she's not, ignore this.)

Either way you have a right to speak up for your needs, because if you end up moving to Mexico for her, there's going to be a lot of resentment when things get rough, as they always do during major life changes. Also 25 is "quarter life crisis" year, so she might be being extra rigid about the Mexico thing because she's not ready to settle down and wants to feel like she is still in full control of her life. Which she is. But she has to make some tough priority-decisions now. Good luck!
posted by np312 at 5:38 PM on December 15, 2007 [2 favorites has favorites]

Now, she says she wants to live in Mexico (she's half-Mexican). I don't have any desire to live in Mexico. I don't know the language or culture, and have no idea if I could get a decent job down there.

Frankly, it sounds like she doesn't care much about you. Any one of these changes she asking of you might be acceptable; but this business about moving to Mexico when you are a U.S.-educated attorney is taking it a little far. When you don't know the language, it is going to be a long time before you can hope to practice law there, and that's without even considering the difficulty of getting credentials as an attorney there. It really seems that doesn't give a shit about your professional future. It sounds like it's all about her. She sounds like an immature person who is perfectly fine letting her preferences take precedence in your relationship. That isn't very loving of her.

I think you really need to just tell her what you have told us.
posted by jayder at 5:50 PM on December 15, 2007 [3 favorites has favorites]

talk to her.

and rest assured that, as painful as it can sometimes be, in certain circumstances breaking up is often the best thing that can happen -- better sooner than later. it's Ok to have different goals and tastes and desires. good luck.
posted by matteo at 6:14 PM on December 15, 2007

Well, she can always find another boyfriend, but there's only one Mexico.

I mean, a 25 year old and a 29 year old might have different priorities about what they want from life. Fresh out of collage vs. settling down. She may want to make decisions about her life without worrying about someone else.
posted by delmoi at 6:25 PM on December 15, 2007

i would talk to her with absolute, heartbreaking honesty. it's time for all the cards to be on the table.

25 is young these days....she may be afraid she's giving certain things up by committing to you. she may be worried that marrying a noncatholic will be unacceptable to her family.

i also agree with the above that she is probably having doubts about the relationship and doesn't have the strength to end it herself. throwing lots of dealbreakers at a partner en masse like this is a classic symptom of second thoughts. she's trying to push you into leaving her. (if she is from a traditional latin culture that strongly emphasizes the importance of marriage, it may be difficult for her to initiate a breakup...in fact, she may have no idea *how* to, depending on what kind of role models she's had.)
posted by thinkingwoman at 6:28 PM on December 15, 2007 [3 favorites has favorites]

She wants to move on, but she doesn't want to hurt you. So she's trying to end this in degrees, and/or get you to end it. She's having a quarter life crisis, and unfortunately she doesn't see you in the next part of her life. Because what she is doing to you is almost exactly what I did to my bf at that age. I'm not proud of it. He was a good guy, and I really didn't want deal with ugly realities of "breaking up". We were living together and he was talking about getting married, and I suddenly realized that not only didn't I want to get married, I wanted something else entirely.

So sit her down and ask her point blank if she want to end it. Hopefully, she will tell you the truth, and you can both get on with your new lives without dragging this out for another year.
posted by kimdog at 6:28 PM on December 15, 2007 [1 favorite has favorites]

She wants you to end the relationship because she doesn't have the guts to do it herself. Move to Mexico? Come on, man. Time to lay it on the table with her.
posted by Justinian at 7:00 PM on December 15, 2007

it does rather sound like you two are at different places in your life. anyone fresh out of college is bound to want to shake things up a bit and see what else is out there before settling down. you, being headed into your 30s, are probably at the phase where you are starting to think of settling down.

i tend to agree with everyone who thinks she is trying to break up with you without having to do the actual breaking up. you need to talk to her—and really get to the root of the issue here. does she in fact see a future with you? where does she see you fitting in with all of her plans? does she need to explore different options before she feels like she's ready to settle down? don't rearrange your whole life for her unless you really believe she wants you in it.
posted by violetk at 7:06 PM on December 15, 2007

Yeah, sadly I agree with the rest. When she tells you she wants to move back to Mexico, she's not asking for you to join her there -- she's asking for you to break up with her. It's quite disingenuous, cowardly, and immature but unfortunately that's what you're up against.
posted by drpynchon at 7:09 PM on December 15, 2007 [3 favorites has favorites]

Insisting on moving to a country where you don't speak the language is sooo inconsiderate. And that's just compounded by the major reduction in quality of life that it would be imposing on you.

But what's even more disturbing is: how in the world does she expect you to be a non-Mexican-speaking lawyer in Mexico? Even if you were willing to take a crash course in the language, can you imagine how long it would take to became fluent enough to confidently deal with the legal texts and put your clients at ease? Really, try to explain, in words, how this can possibly work.

Why not look for women who want to keep living in your country and who don't have incompatible religious views? There are quite a few of them out there.
posted by jejune at 7:21 PM on December 15, 2007

Just ask her straight up, "Do you want to be with me? Because it's unlikely I can move to Mexico." She probably loves you but is just conflicted. Ask her to straighten her thoughts out before she throws more "You aren't a real Catholic" your way. She just sounds confused. It happens. She'll feel awful once she knows how she has made you feel.

Are you even engaged, btw? Maybe she wants you to propose?
posted by onepapertiger at 8:11 PM on December 15, 2007

Is she just talking about this or is there any sign of her actually taking action? I mean she's bored - she wants to live in the city - no she wants to live in Mexico - but but what about the children!!!

Did she grow up in Mexico or is she just half Mexican/American?

I don't actually think she has much intention of specifically doing any of these things, she seems to be kind of direction less and is just throwing stuff out there. That's not to say that I think your relationship is safe, she seems to be kind of testing you, borderline manipulating you. She wants you to do all these large and somewhat unreasonable things. Moving to the city, that's reasonable, Mexico? not so much. Converting? eh that's pretty huge and you've already conceded the kids.

I would stand your ground, do not make any huge sacrifices for her, think if we broke up in 6 months would doing this have been a big mistake, if yes, don't do it. She may stick around, she may not, I don't think it necessarily has anything to do with you, but I would not be making life altering compromises to please her.
posted by whoaali at 8:27 PM on December 15, 2007

how long does she plan to stay in mexico? if you truly care for each other, you could try a LDR. given her age and current situation, i think she's just feeling the itch to go out into the world and test her wings. i don't think it has anything to do with her being an manipulative/conniving/passive aggressive person. if you two are already serious about spending the rest of your lives with each other, time apart can give you the opportunity to test your commitment and desire for each other.
posted by tastycracker at 8:49 PM on December 15, 2007

From the way that you present the facts above, it really sounds like she is trying to push you to make some kind of a statement or stance that will be a relationship ending stance. I have a manager who is a Mexican Catholic married to a Jewish man, so it can work and she must know that.
posted by slavlin at 9:17 PM on December 15, 2007

Unlike others I don't think her desire to move to Mexico is either incredibly drastic nor cruel to you. She is 25, she is trying to figure out what she wants from life, and she recognizes there is a possibility her future doesn't include you. She is entitled to that, and I think it would be tragic if she didn't explore all the paths in life she can go down. Who would want to be 75 and look back and say, "I always wanted to live in Mexico and get more in touch with my heritage, but I never did. The guy I dated in my 20s didn't want to, and next thing I knew, I had a kid and a career and now here I am."

You feel like you've given up a lot but you haven't given up anything... all the things you name are just hypothetical. One, living in a city, you say you've always wanted to do yourself. And clearly kids are not imminent. I think you should stop looking at this as a series of negotiations or competitions and look at this as a relationship made of of two distinct and equally important lives, and recognize that (I am sorry) there may be things your girlfriend needs to experience, with or without you, before she can be in the place you already are.
posted by loiseau at 10:18 PM on December 15, 2007 [1 favorite has favorites]

you will never get religious tolerance out of someone who has cognitive dissonance. People believe in religion in order to avoid reality

Looks like there's more than one type of person you can't get "religious tolerance" out of...

Re: Anonymous: Either she wants you to break up with her or she's crazy and rude. Whichever it is, you're better off without her.
posted by hjo3 at 11:05 PM on December 15, 2007

Imagine, for a moment, if the roles were reversed, and you demanded that you and your girlfriend move to, say, Azerbaijan, convert to Sufi Islam and start over from scratch. Can you imagine her learning a new language and starting her professional career over in a country within a culture she's never been apart of?

Of course not. Neither can she.

The truth is, she wants to break up with you in the worst way. This is just her little passive-agressive way of doing so. Either that, or she's just utterly clueless. Either way, prepare yourself for a graceful relationship-ending conversation.
posted by Avenger at 12:46 AM on December 16, 2007 [1 favorite has favorites]

[a few comments removed - please try to answer the questions without insulting all catholics or all mexicans, thanks]
posted by jessamyn at 5:19 AM on December 16, 2007

I'd tell her "I am not moving to Mexico or converting. Period."

I would be very, very firm.

This is the kind of thing that miscommunication (i.e, "he said he'd think about it!") can make much, much worse.

You're not engaged or married so she's going to do what she wants.
posted by sondrialiac at 6:33 AM on December 16, 2007

I feel like I've given a lot up here, and that she should also compromise.

From what you've written, it doesn't sound like you've given up anything at all. You've agreed that hypothetical kids would be raised Catholic: unless "not terribly religious" is a euphemism for "angry tenth-generation athiest", it sounds like your letting her do something that doesn't bother you. That's not giving up anything. Moving to a big city? Sounds like you want to do that, too. That's not giving up anything either.

What you seem to be saying is that since you agreed to raise future children Catholic, then you shouldn't feel pressured to convert to Catholicism. And since you agreed to move to a new city, that you shouldn't feel pressured to move to a new country. Compromises don't work like that.

Here's a compromise:

Her: I want [this].
Him: I don't want [this]. What about [that] instead?
Her: I guess [that] is okay if I can't have [this].

Here's what it sounds like you did:

Her: I want [this].
Him: Okay, I can do [this].
Her: Now I want [this and that].
Him: But I already agreed to [this]! You can't ask for different things just because you know I'm agreeable!

You never really had a compromise, it was just you agreeing to what she wanted and expecting her to feel grateful and not ask for more things. You need to tell her the things that you just won't do.
posted by 23skidoo at 8:25 AM on December 16, 2007

I don't really feel like religion is something to be compromised on. Likewise, moving to a country where your language and education are next-to-worthless isn't really on par with most relationship compromises.

I agree with much of what was said above; she's probably looking for a relationship-ending standoff.
posted by craven_morhead at 10:50 AM on December 16, 2007

She has compromised thus far by staying with you despite both religious incompatibility and your inability to explore a life outside the comfort of the United States. (A Catholic committing themselves to a relatively non-religious person is an incredible sacrifice -- you will not be with her in what she believes to be the afterlife. For you, this issue is an intellectual challenge/compromise, for her it is something so immensely more. That's not to say it can't work or that it should never be done, but just to make clear how big it is.) You have to consider that she may really want to stay with you but feels everything in her own plans pulling her away.

There needs not be a villain. I'll assume you are both remarkable, intelligent, caring people who care for each other deeply. You're dating though, and this is one of the reasons we date instead of just getting hitched when we're twelve.

Ask yourself: If this is what she wants to do, do you really want to force her out of it? Would either of you want to be twenty years down the road feeling stuck with something that you knew that you had the option to avoid?

Tell her what you feel you have to personally stand by; she has already told you her viewpoint. From there, you'll have to figure out what to do.

It is going to suck. There's no way around that.
posted by pokermonk at 2:18 PM on December 16, 2007

FWIW, I don't think that a Catholic committing themselves to a non-religious person is such a huge sacrifice.
posted by craven_morhead at 2:25 PM on December 16, 2007

Likewise, moving to a country where your language and education are next-to-worthless isn't really on par with most relationship compromises.

Next-to-worthless? Are you sure?

Anonymous, if her introduction of these ideas is a freaking you out, then tell her that she's freaking you out. But talking is not packing bags. Maybe she's wondering about the depth of your commitment to her. Maybe this is a warning sign that she's realizing what her dealbreakers are and she's giving you the opportunity to hit the road. But instead of just reacting with "Mexico?! Are you crazy!" why not consider the idea for real (like, get an idea of realistically what could be accomplished as an gringo with a fresh US law degree) and discuss the resultant concerns about what this will mean to you as a couple?

Also, what 23skidoo said.
posted by desuetude at 8:42 PM on December 16, 2007

you're worring about stuff you dont know anything about. whilst she's thinking. find stuff out.
could you get a job there, read about the culture. its no doubt different and would be hard at first but maybe you could get to like it. maybe go for a holiday to see. talk to a priest. Why does she want to go to mexico. Are there american cities down that way that have larger mexican communities. can she transfer her masters program to mexico. Maybe she's of the type that jumps into things and then worries about the details later. Present her with some facts and things might look different.
You cant make a balanced decision over what you're prepared or not prepared to do without information. Plus more information = more possibilities over compromise that you can offer.
posted by browolf at 10:52 AM on December 25, 2007

how in the world does she expect you to be a non-Mexican-speaking lawyer in Mexico?

Gee, I speak really good American! Of course, I should have written "non-Spanish-speaking..."
posted by jejune at 10:30 AM on April 6, 2008