What do you call this kind of hat, and this way of dressing?
June 2, 2007 7:42 AM Subscribe
What is this kind of hat called, and what was the "look" that went with it called? Sort of a leather version of a Greek fisherman's cap, sort of reminiscent of SS uniforms. I can remember seeing them worn in the 1970s and 1980s by gay leathermen, gay and straight people at punk shows in Europe, maybe some bikers, too.
Prompted by this post in the blue. You can see a small group of guys wearing the hats surrounding the singer at about minute 2:00 in the video here.
So I've always wondered: what are those hats called? Was there a specific term for the look that often went with it, both for men and for women, which I recall as incorporating elements of punk, nazi, biker, and other subculture fashion?
Bonus points for pointing me to a good set of photographs, online or in a book, documenting that scene at the time. It was a look that made a big impact on me as a young wanna-be punk rocker in the early 1980s, but I was always too wussy to actually talk to people I found so intimidating as a 14 year old. I wouldn't be intimidated now, but I never see them anymore.
Prompted by this post in the blue. You can see a small group of guys wearing the hats surrounding the singer at about minute 2:00 in the video here.
So I've always wondered: what are those hats called? Was there a specific term for the look that often went with it, both for men and for women, which I recall as incorporating elements of punk, nazi, biker, and other subculture fashion?
Bonus points for pointing me to a good set of photographs, online or in a book, documenting that scene at the time. It was a look that made a big impact on me as a young wanna-be punk rocker in the early 1980s, but I was always too wussy to actually talk to people I found so intimidating as a 14 year old. I wouldn't be intimidated now, but I never see them anymore.
Best answer: You are thinking of what I call a `Leather biker's cap'. I don't know if it has any more specific a name than that.
Something like this?
posted by tomble at 8:17 AM on June 2, 2007
Something like this?
posted by tomble at 8:17 AM on June 2, 2007
Best answer: In my opinion, there's not one 'look' that conflates punk, Nazi, biker and leatherman, but rather several distinct looks (and subculture identities) with a lot of commonalities between them. While leathermen, punks and bikers all enjoyed, say, black boots and motorcycle jackets, there were equally-significant differences between the styles. Moustachioed leathermen versus clean-shaven punks versus bearded bikers, for example (I think I saw that movie once). Leathermen were much more into piercings than punks or bikers (at the time), punks didn't wear a lot of chaps, and, while both punks and bikers were known to modify their garments with patches and paint and whatnot, this wasn't nearly as popular among the leather set. Punks and leathermen both wore BDSM-inspired stuff, but I've never seen a biker wearing one of those studded Conan-the-Barbarian chest harness deals.
Of course, Billy Idol and Rob Halford and people like that tended to combine elements from these disparate styles. But I always figured that was just for marketing purposes.
posted by box at 9:17 AM on June 2, 2007
Of course, Billy Idol and Rob Halford and people like that tended to combine elements from these disparate styles. But I always figured that was just for marketing purposes.
posted by box at 9:17 AM on June 2, 2007
Didn't James Dean and his pals wear these in Rebel Without a Cause? It's just a biker's cap, popular before helmets became compulsory, and stolen by gay culture as a male stereotype (see also the Village People). If you wore it now, people would assume you are gay. This might or might not be a good thing.
posted by humblepigeon at 10:06 AM on June 2, 2007
posted by humblepigeon at 10:06 AM on June 2, 2007
Response by poster: You are thinking of what I call a `Leather biker's cap'. I don't know if it has any more specific a name than that.
Thanks! I had all the key words; I just wasn't combining them in a way that produced a good result when searching.
Leathermen were much more into piercings than punks or bikers (at the time), punks didn't wear a lot of chaps, and, while both punks and bikers were known to modify their garments with patches and paint and whatnot, this wasn't nearly as popular among the leather set. Punks and leathermen both wore BDSM-inspired stuff, but I've never seen a biker wearing one of those studded Conan-the-Barbarian chest harness deals.
I think you are right, in that it was the BDSM stuff that was the connection. It was a much more radical look then than now, now that there are piercing shops everywhere and so on. At the time I found it both sexy (leather! piercings! attitude!) but also kind of repellent (the Nazi insignia, mostly). The FgtH video reminded me of it for the first time in ages.
If you wore it now, people would assume you are gay. This might or might not be a good thing.
I'm not looking to buy one, just trying to figure out what they were called, and then thinking about the people who wore those hats who I would see at punk shows back in the day. If I wore a hat like that today, I wouldn't look gay -- I'd look ridiculous.
Which still leaves me wondering -- are there good photo or other documentation of leather/bdsm/??? culture of that era? Ideally including the overlap with punk, but I'm interested in anything.
posted by Forktine at 10:26 AM on June 2, 2007
Thanks! I had all the key words; I just wasn't combining them in a way that produced a good result when searching.
Leathermen were much more into piercings than punks or bikers (at the time), punks didn't wear a lot of chaps, and, while both punks and bikers were known to modify their garments with patches and paint and whatnot, this wasn't nearly as popular among the leather set. Punks and leathermen both wore BDSM-inspired stuff, but I've never seen a biker wearing one of those studded Conan-the-Barbarian chest harness deals.
I think you are right, in that it was the BDSM stuff that was the connection. It was a much more radical look then than now, now that there are piercing shops everywhere and so on. At the time I found it both sexy (leather! piercings! attitude!) but also kind of repellent (the Nazi insignia, mostly). The FgtH video reminded me of it for the first time in ages.
If you wore it now, people would assume you are gay. This might or might not be a good thing.
I'm not looking to buy one, just trying to figure out what they were called, and then thinking about the people who wore those hats who I would see at punk shows back in the day. If I wore a hat like that today, I wouldn't look gay -- I'd look ridiculous.
Which still leaves me wondering -- are there good photo or other documentation of leather/bdsm/??? culture of that era? Ideally including the overlap with punk, but I'm interested in anything.
posted by Forktine at 10:26 AM on June 2, 2007
Best answer: humblepigeon
They weren't 'stolen' by gay culture. The gay biker scene evolved at the same time as the straight biker scene - disafected queer WWII veterans had many of the same interests as disafected straight ones, but even more interest in hanging out in clubs with other guys.
The leather/SM scene grew out of gay male biker culture, and hence the hat stayed with the gay leather scene as it evolved.
There are a lot of images of these hats along with (yes you are correct Forktine) Nazi inspired uniforms and clothing in Gay male popular art.
Sorry this comment came off as a mini-screed. I'm mostly just writing fast before my kids get home.
posted by serazin at 11:07 AM on June 2, 2007 [2 favorites]
They weren't 'stolen' by gay culture. The gay biker scene evolved at the same time as the straight biker scene - disafected queer WWII veterans had many of the same interests as disafected straight ones, but even more interest in hanging out in clubs with other guys.
The leather/SM scene grew out of gay male biker culture, and hence the hat stayed with the gay leather scene as it evolved.
There are a lot of images of these hats along with (yes you are correct Forktine) Nazi inspired uniforms and clothing in Gay male popular art.
Sorry this comment came off as a mini-screed. I'm mostly just writing fast before my kids get home.
posted by serazin at 11:07 AM on June 2, 2007 [2 favorites]
humblepigeon writes "Didn't James Dean and his pals wear these in Rebel Without a Cause?
You're thinking of Marlon Brando in "the Wild One". Here's a pic.
posted by kuujjuarapik at 2:21 PM on June 2, 2007
You're thinking of Marlon Brando in "the Wild One". Here's a pic.
posted by kuujjuarapik at 2:21 PM on June 2, 2007
My circle of friends used to refer to them as "Cruising Caps", but maybe that was just us.
posted by goshling at 3:25 AM on June 3, 2007
posted by goshling at 3:25 AM on June 3, 2007
Oh dear, oh dear. The silly hat.
It's a very long story, but the gist of it is that this guy in my local bdsm group claimed to have received a hat like this in a "capping ceremony" which he claimed was a tradition handed down from the "old guard" leathermen (the post WWII bikers). Unfortunately, it's not uncommon for BDSM folks to make claims like this; kind of like middle class suburbanites buying a coat of arms.
So anyway... this friend of mine - who thought the first guy was completely full of shit - did a little digging. He wanted to know whether there was any truth to this claim that the "silly hat" (as he called it) had ever had some special significance. He got his answer from a somewhat well known BDSM writer who was around back in the old days. I'm pretty sure it was Jack Rinella, but I could be wrong. Also, I don't know whether he found this in an article or book or whether he emailed the guy and asked him directly. Anyway, the writer said that no, the cap had no significance, really. He said the gay leather guys of the era had seen Marlon Brando wear one in The Wild One and thought he was very attractive, so they emulated him. End of story.
posted by Clay201 at 5:27 AM on June 3, 2007
It's a very long story, but the gist of it is that this guy in my local bdsm group claimed to have received a hat like this in a "capping ceremony" which he claimed was a tradition handed down from the "old guard" leathermen (the post WWII bikers). Unfortunately, it's not uncommon for BDSM folks to make claims like this; kind of like middle class suburbanites buying a coat of arms.
So anyway... this friend of mine - who thought the first guy was completely full of shit - did a little digging. He wanted to know whether there was any truth to this claim that the "silly hat" (as he called it) had ever had some special significance. He got his answer from a somewhat well known BDSM writer who was around back in the old days. I'm pretty sure it was Jack Rinella, but I could be wrong. Also, I don't know whether he found this in an article or book or whether he emailed the guy and asked him directly. Anyway, the writer said that no, the cap had no significance, really. He said the gay leather guys of the era had seen Marlon Brando wear one in The Wild One and thought he was very attractive, so they emulated him. End of story.
posted by Clay201 at 5:27 AM on June 3, 2007
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by purephase at 7:58 AM on June 2, 2007