Support for “out of sync” child
November 20, 2024 8:42 PM
What kind of exercises / videos / books would you propose to help a kid who seems out of sync in terms of non verbal communication and inadvertently gives off intense or defensive vibes to other kids, thus missing genuine opportunities for connection.
Presume said kid is waitlisted for everything - all the therapists and assessments. What exercises, videos or books would you do with them in the mean time? Imagine the kid is terrified of rejection (even though kids at school are by all accounts kind and tolerant), and the kid doesn’t seem to be “at home” in their own skin but lives in their head a lot. So when paired with groups at school the feedback is that the kid is standoffish and tense and as such, missing genuine opportunities to connect with others. Kid may also fixate on topics of personal interest and can be exhausting for others. 9 years old.
Presume said kid is waitlisted for everything - all the therapists and assessments. What exercises, videos or books would you do with them in the mean time? Imagine the kid is terrified of rejection (even though kids at school are by all accounts kind and tolerant), and the kid doesn’t seem to be “at home” in their own skin but lives in their head a lot. So when paired with groups at school the feedback is that the kid is standoffish and tense and as such, missing genuine opportunities to connect with others. Kid may also fixate on topics of personal interest and can be exhausting for others. 9 years old.
Martial arts? I feel like martial arts could be good for creating a little more integration and calm in the body?
posted by vunder at 9:02 PM on November 20, 2024
posted by vunder at 9:02 PM on November 20, 2024
What NotLost said: this reminds me of my little-kid autistic self. I have a sort of orthogonal suggestion: in addition to exercises/videos/books could you arrange social interactions to set them up for success?
That is to say, a cooperative, clearly-defined task, goal, or game set for the kids, instead of open-ended group time. Basically, the big-kid equivalent of "parallel play." I was also "not at home in my own skin," and the hardest part about social interaction was stepping into a group of people, not being able to read the body language vibes, not knowing what to do/say, overthinking the fact that I didn't know what to do/say, and thus freezing up and seeming standoffish.
However, in settings where there were obviously defined rules, I was fine. If I was working on a group project and some preliminary goals/materials were made clear, I could start talking about that, instead of casting about for small talk and getting tense about it. If there was a board game, I could start setting up or explaining the board game. Instead of inviting a kid over "to play," which could end up being anything and would involve a lot of small talk and negotiation to decide, invite a kid over to watch a movie, and have that ready to go when they get there.
To be completely honest, I still rely on all of these strategies as an adult. They're camouflaged as "normal" adult behaviours (like having a book club, so that I have a defined topic to focus on at dinner if you run out of things to say) but they're exactly the same. When you have a set of guidelines, e.g. This Is What We're Doing, it's easier to figure out how to interact with a group of people, and if you're working on something together, it's easier to be focused on a third object than to be trying to read and respond to the other person's nonverbal communication. And then positive interactions often come naturally as a result of working on a goal together, which helps both people relax and increase rapport.
Hope I'm not too off with my interpretation here! I think these strategies could help in a lot of different cases, like anxiety and depression, not just autism (or, similarly, ADHD).
posted by fire, water, earth, air at 9:13 PM on November 20, 2024
That is to say, a cooperative, clearly-defined task, goal, or game set for the kids, instead of open-ended group time. Basically, the big-kid equivalent of "parallel play." I was also "not at home in my own skin," and the hardest part about social interaction was stepping into a group of people, not being able to read the body language vibes, not knowing what to do/say, overthinking the fact that I didn't know what to do/say, and thus freezing up and seeming standoffish.
However, in settings where there were obviously defined rules, I was fine. If I was working on a group project and some preliminary goals/materials were made clear, I could start talking about that, instead of casting about for small talk and getting tense about it. If there was a board game, I could start setting up or explaining the board game. Instead of inviting a kid over "to play," which could end up being anything and would involve a lot of small talk and negotiation to decide, invite a kid over to watch a movie, and have that ready to go when they get there.
To be completely honest, I still rely on all of these strategies as an adult. They're camouflaged as "normal" adult behaviours (like having a book club, so that I have a defined topic to focus on at dinner if you run out of things to say) but they're exactly the same. When you have a set of guidelines, e.g. This Is What We're Doing, it's easier to figure out how to interact with a group of people, and if you're working on something together, it's easier to be focused on a third object than to be trying to read and respond to the other person's nonverbal communication. And then positive interactions often come naturally as a result of working on a goal together, which helps both people relax and increase rapport.
Hope I'm not too off with my interpretation here! I think these strategies could help in a lot of different cases, like anxiety and depression, not just autism (or, similarly, ADHD).
posted by fire, water, earth, air at 9:13 PM on November 20, 2024
This is going to be very dependent on the kid whether or not it works with them, but I discovered it did with mine.
I legit EXPLAINED the body language. Like I was talking to an alien who'd never heard of the concept of body language.
It started one time when mine was about 13. He was hyperfocusing and talking someone's ear off, after youth group, and the person was giving off every vibe possible that "I need to end this conversation and go" and my kiddo was picking up on exactly none of it.
I interrupted and TOLD him we had to go, then in the car on the way home, I asked him if he'd noticed certain specific things that the person he was talking to was doing. (I don't remember now what the particular cues were in that moment; just assume they are very obvious ones that anyone else would understand.) He said yes, he'd noticed this and that. I asked if why they were doing those things. He said he saw them doing them, but didn't know why they were doing them. And so I explained that those are hints, a way to say something without words, that the person needed to end the conversation. And that the person was using those sort of as a way to not be rude and just say "Shut up, I have to leave" or just randomly walk off while he was talking.
Most importantly, I told him that if he saw people doing the same thing again, they *probably* meant the same thing by it - and he could find out by asking something like "oh, do you need to leave?" and then letting them. And (importantly) that by paying attention to and respecting those hints, he'd be making it so people would be *more likely* to want to talk to him again, because they'd feel more comfortable because they'd know he would respect when they needed to stop talking, too.
I was quite surprised, believe me, when it actually WORKED. Just that one thing made a huge difference in the way he interacted with others... and all I did was realize that it was a skill he could be taught - but it really had to be broken down into its parts like that, because he had zero baseline understanding to start with.
Saying this now, it reminds me a lot of the way a much smaller kid has to have things explained to them - like "don't say mean things, it hurts people's feelings and they might not want to play with you" - but where the average kid needs the subtle things explained, those like my son need it ALL explained.
In other words - my son is so literal that despite all the activities and groups he was involved in, he was never, ever going to naturally absorb the meanings of body language. But teaching him, in detail - that worked.
posted by stormyteal at 10:50 PM on November 20, 2024
I legit EXPLAINED the body language. Like I was talking to an alien who'd never heard of the concept of body language.
It started one time when mine was about 13. He was hyperfocusing and talking someone's ear off, after youth group, and the person was giving off every vibe possible that "I need to end this conversation and go" and my kiddo was picking up on exactly none of it.
I interrupted and TOLD him we had to go, then in the car on the way home, I asked him if he'd noticed certain specific things that the person he was talking to was doing. (I don't remember now what the particular cues were in that moment; just assume they are very obvious ones that anyone else would understand.) He said yes, he'd noticed this and that. I asked if why they were doing those things. He said he saw them doing them, but didn't know why they were doing them. And so I explained that those are hints, a way to say something without words, that the person needed to end the conversation. And that the person was using those sort of as a way to not be rude and just say "Shut up, I have to leave" or just randomly walk off while he was talking.
Most importantly, I told him that if he saw people doing the same thing again, they *probably* meant the same thing by it - and he could find out by asking something like "oh, do you need to leave?" and then letting them. And (importantly) that by paying attention to and respecting those hints, he'd be making it so people would be *more likely* to want to talk to him again, because they'd feel more comfortable because they'd know he would respect when they needed to stop talking, too.
I was quite surprised, believe me, when it actually WORKED. Just that one thing made a huge difference in the way he interacted with others... and all I did was realize that it was a skill he could be taught - but it really had to be broken down into its parts like that, because he had zero baseline understanding to start with.
Saying this now, it reminds me a lot of the way a much smaller kid has to have things explained to them - like "don't say mean things, it hurts people's feelings and they might not want to play with you" - but where the average kid needs the subtle things explained, those like my son need it ALL explained.
In other words - my son is so literal that despite all the activities and groups he was involved in, he was never, ever going to naturally absorb the meanings of body language. But teaching him, in detail - that worked.
posted by stormyteal at 10:50 PM on November 20, 2024
Defined activities were definitely helpful for me. I enjoyed various art classes, as well as individual sports (swimming, ice skating; as opposed to things like soccer).
I probably would have loved rock climbing, I certainly do as an adult, but it wasn’t a thing then. Physical activities that have more odd people (juggling, other circus arts like trapeze, etc) may be nice.
posted by nat at 11:35 PM on November 20, 2024
I probably would have loved rock climbing, I certainly do as an adult, but it wasn’t a thing then. Physical activities that have more odd people (juggling, other circus arts like trapeze, etc) may be nice.
posted by nat at 11:35 PM on November 20, 2024
Interestingly, there is a type of systematized therapy for this called DBT-RO. It’s designed for adults but the general principle—very broadly—is to gently and lightheartedly model and encourage (1) play, silliness, spontaneity and (2) expressions of vulnerability and approachability.
I know that is not super helpful. But maybe think about any games you can play as a family that include being spontaneous in front of an audience and make sure they are enjoyable and not stressful. Zero pressure.
posted by knobknosher at 12:41 AM on November 21, 2024
I know that is not super helpful. But maybe think about any games you can play as a family that include being spontaneous in front of an audience and make sure they are enjoyable and not stressful. Zero pressure.
posted by knobknosher at 12:41 AM on November 21, 2024
Also, this isn’t to minimize autism as a possible cause/contributor or “get rid” of autism. Moreso to help them be comfortable being who they are around others.
posted by knobknosher at 12:46 AM on November 21, 2024
posted by knobknosher at 12:46 AM on November 21, 2024
Just a couple of questions for consideration. How much is this something the kid has identified as a problem, versus other people just wanting to connect with the kid the same way they do with others like themselves? And, how much has anyone tried working with the other kids to help them actually understand that sometimes the signals they think they perceive don't actually mean those things? Yes it's entirely possible that this kid could learn to interact more like the others expect, but the others are the ones starting from a position of relative strength and aptitude here.
posted by teremala at 2:39 AM on November 21, 2024
posted by teremala at 2:39 AM on November 21, 2024
Ugh. Honestly, as a socially awkward, way-too-smart kid (now middle-aged adult) myself, this whole pathologizing normal kid interactions gives me the creeps. To be out of sync with peers is 100% OKAY. i get that you want to help your kid, but believe me when I say that you are setting up your whole family for disappointment.
Once more with feeling: IT'S OKAY FOR A KID TO BE WEIRD and weird kids sometimes make the world a better place.
posted by acridrabbit at 2:55 AM on November 21, 2024
Once more with feeling: IT'S OKAY FOR A KID TO BE WEIRD and weird kids sometimes make the world a better place.
posted by acridrabbit at 2:55 AM on November 21, 2024
Seconding finding activities that they like and that work for them interacting with other kids. For my son at that age it was kids theatre. Being in play productions with lots of other kids.
Building off of Acridrabbit also being really in touch with what the kid wants. Be cautious of creating trauma for a kid when just trying to help.
posted by creiszhanson at 4:02 AM on November 21, 2024
Building off of Acridrabbit also being really in touch with what the kid wants. Be cautious of creating trauma for a kid when just trying to help.
posted by creiszhanson at 4:02 AM on November 21, 2024
To be out of sync with peers is 100% OKAY
Until it’s not. I’m not going to info dump horrifying stats, but there is a documented pediatric and teen mental health epidemic, a loneliness epidemic, a terrible landscape of polarization - and as OP mentions there are months or years long waitlists for even base level supports and assessments. It is possible to care deeply about a weird kid’s well-being, love them exactly how they are, and also be appropriately concerned when they show signs of struggling socially.
A kid described as “terrified of rejection” and “not at home in their own skin” deserves targeted supports and empathetic interventions - not to make them “not weird” but so they can accommodate themselves throughout their life in the times that they struggle with connection, rejection, etc.. It’s not helpful to start judging OP for seeking supports proactively.
Signed, another weird kid turned adult who is unbelievably glad that I finally got access to strengths based, human-centered intervention (DBT and speech therapy for emotion regulation and auditory and social processing). They infinitely changed my life for the better and btw I’m weirder than ever now.
posted by seemoorglass at 4:05 AM on November 21, 2024
Until it’s not. I’m not going to info dump horrifying stats, but there is a documented pediatric and teen mental health epidemic, a loneliness epidemic, a terrible landscape of polarization - and as OP mentions there are months or years long waitlists for even base level supports and assessments. It is possible to care deeply about a weird kid’s well-being, love them exactly how they are, and also be appropriately concerned when they show signs of struggling socially.
A kid described as “terrified of rejection” and “not at home in their own skin” deserves targeted supports and empathetic interventions - not to make them “not weird” but so they can accommodate themselves throughout their life in the times that they struggle with connection, rejection, etc.. It’s not helpful to start judging OP for seeking supports proactively.
Signed, another weird kid turned adult who is unbelievably glad that I finally got access to strengths based, human-centered intervention (DBT and speech therapy for emotion regulation and auditory and social processing). They infinitely changed my life for the better and btw I’m weirder than ever now.
posted by seemoorglass at 4:05 AM on November 21, 2024
I had model rocketry as a kid and it was good as it was the first time I found likeminded peeps. Social interactions there were fine as wow! there are people as or more weird than me!
I’m 60 and my new therapist is DBT based and I’m just now learning skills and techniques around emotional regulation which I WISH I had access to as a kid. For example, there are well-outlined rules for social engagement/validation which are really teaching this old dog new tricks.
I’m sure your kiddo will be fine - I know this because you clearly care to be present and advocating for your kid which is so important - just being there.
I’m weird; it got channeled into a masters in comp sci when I got a posse of nerds around me late teens.
Let the freak flag fly.
posted by whatevernot at 4:31 AM on November 21, 2024
I’m 60 and my new therapist is DBT based and I’m just now learning skills and techniques around emotional regulation which I WISH I had access to as a kid. For example, there are well-outlined rules for social engagement/validation which are really teaching this old dog new tricks.
I’m sure your kiddo will be fine - I know this because you clearly care to be present and advocating for your kid which is so important - just being there.
I’m weird; it got channeled into a masters in comp sci when I got a posse of nerds around me late teens.
Let the freak flag fly.
posted by whatevernot at 4:31 AM on November 21, 2024
I legit EXPLAINED the body language. Like I was talking to an alien who'd never heard of the concept of body language.
Seconding this. My wife, who is not autistic (as far as we can tell) but is both very far down to the ADHD spectrum and would have been better socialized if she'd be raised by actual wolves, had very few tools to anticipate or understand people's reactions and it made her both anxious and awkward. I, on the other hand, was raised by a therapist and also professionally studied human behavior patterns and was perfectly happy to endlessly explain body language, social conventions, variations in culture around language, whatever - I'm a nerd about it. And she found it both comforting and super helpful, and has gotten vastly more confident and successful at social interactions because all she really needed was the context that no one ever gave her.
A good way to start with this might be reality tv - we spend a lot of time playing "which of these Bakeoff contestents would stab Noel in an alley and leave his corpse to rot" and it's super fun. Sub in a show about something your kid is actually interested in - there are tons - and it's a good way to start the conversation in a zero-stakes way.
posted by restless_nomad at 5:01 AM on November 21, 2024
Seconding this. My wife, who is not autistic (as far as we can tell) but is both very far down to the ADHD spectrum and would have been better socialized if she'd be raised by actual wolves, had very few tools to anticipate or understand people's reactions and it made her both anxious and awkward. I, on the other hand, was raised by a therapist and also professionally studied human behavior patterns and was perfectly happy to endlessly explain body language, social conventions, variations in culture around language, whatever - I'm a nerd about it. And she found it both comforting and super helpful, and has gotten vastly more confident and successful at social interactions because all she really needed was the context that no one ever gave her.
A good way to start with this might be reality tv - we spend a lot of time playing "which of these Bakeoff contestents would stab Noel in an alley and leave his corpse to rot" and it's super fun. Sub in a show about something your kid is actually interested in - there are tons - and it's a good way to start the conversation in a zero-stakes way.
posted by restless_nomad at 5:01 AM on November 21, 2024
Until it’s not. I’m not going to info dump horrifying stats, but there is a documented pediatric and teen mental health epidemic, a loneliness epidemic, a terrible landscape of polarization - and as OP mentions there are months or years long waitlists for even base level supports and assessments. It is possible to care deeply about a weird kid’s well-being, love them exactly how they are, and also be appropriately concerned when they show signs of struggling socially.
I currently work with a C&A psychiatrist whose job is to work with ASD w/ID kids, a lot of whom are non-verbal. And seeing that St. Peepsburg is in Canada too, I am only too aware of the backlogs for assessments/assistance needed by exhausted parents. I think it's a sign of an engaged parent who wants their child to thrive despite the challenges.
St. Peepsburg, I hope you find some solutions or options here. It is so hard in healthcare these days. We need so much more funding.
posted by Kitteh at 5:23 AM on November 21, 2024
I currently work with a C&A psychiatrist whose job is to work with ASD w/ID kids, a lot of whom are non-verbal. And seeing that St. Peepsburg is in Canada too, I am only too aware of the backlogs for assessments/assistance needed by exhausted parents. I think it's a sign of an engaged parent who wants their child to thrive despite the challenges.
St. Peepsburg, I hope you find some solutions or options here. It is so hard in healthcare these days. We need so much more funding.
posted by Kitteh at 5:23 AM on November 21, 2024
I'm starting to think my (extreme?) interest in animals and their behaviour was a way with coping with my own (waves hands) uncomfortableness. But it was super helpful to learn how to read animal behaviour (wild or domestic) and then think about how that applied to humans. I will save my primate vs canid lecture. Animal training is also a great focused task for a certain kind of kid. I'd suggest dog but maybe rat or bird.
posted by hydrobatidae at 5:27 AM on November 21, 2024
posted by hydrobatidae at 5:27 AM on November 21, 2024
Seconding tae kwon do. Look into sensory brushing. Some kids like it, some hate it. Epsom salt baths at night before bed. Cedar oil in a diffuser if the family can tolerate it. Try avoiding artificial dyes to see if it helps. Consider joining a trampoline place, as that can really help with regulation. And join a local group for kids on the spectrum and meet up with them and get to know their parents. The book Neutrotribes was also a little helpful. Keep advocating for getting those assessments and supports. It's ok to be "that parent" here and will only help you in the long run.
posted by luckdragon at 5:37 AM on November 21, 2024
posted by luckdragon at 5:37 AM on November 21, 2024
Improv, or role play or social stories. When you do these things you hugely exaggerate the mannerisms and tropes involved, making it easier for a kid to understand them, learn to analyze them, and learn to take initiative in a social situation.
Reading social fiction. Discuss why Mr. Darcy is a straight man, rather than a jerk, but Wickham is a villain. Discuss why there are conflicts in a grade four level chapter book when the two best friends squabble.
Mentoring a smaller kid. Supervised, of course. Your nine year old may simply be exhibiting the social skills of a six year old, so finding a six year old for them to spend time with and coaching them on the interactions, while they also read to their little reading buddy, and get to be the smart, mature kid can go a long way.
Debate and structured conversations are often very helpful, where they practice verbal fluency - coming up with something to say - while not falling into the trap of doing a stream of consciousness monologue.
Free range play to help them develop initiative. This can be hard to arrange. I suggest a two hour session in the evening, or a three hour session on weekends, where they explore the neighbourhood and you trail along silently a few steps back, only intervening or commenting when there is genuine danger. This means if they lacerate themself climbing a fence, or climb into a dumpster and get uck all over their shoes, you don't intervene, you just provide some first aid or whatever when they request it, but you do intervene if they are climbing the fence to get in at a yard with a potentially dangerous dog, or are about to try a dash across traffic when there is a chance they will not make it.
If you can't do free range play, then I'd suggest any activity where they develop competency outside of the abilities standard to their age. Teach them to bake, and allow them to make messes in the kitchen and destroy your baking pans. Teach them how to unblock a toilet. Teach them how house numbers work, so they can track down an address without electronic tools. Put them in a first aid course and let them learn CPR. (They won't have the strength to do it on an adult, but would on a child their own age while some other kid runs screaming for adult help.) Teach them how to paddle a canoe, or sail, or dig for clams or build a lean to/wigwam, or read a map or request that a book be added to the library's collection, or research a political issue that matters to them, like the maintenance on the skateboard park they want to use.
posted by Jane the Brown at 6:35 AM on November 21, 2024
Reading social fiction. Discuss why Mr. Darcy is a straight man, rather than a jerk, but Wickham is a villain. Discuss why there are conflicts in a grade four level chapter book when the two best friends squabble.
Mentoring a smaller kid. Supervised, of course. Your nine year old may simply be exhibiting the social skills of a six year old, so finding a six year old for them to spend time with and coaching them on the interactions, while they also read to their little reading buddy, and get to be the smart, mature kid can go a long way.
Debate and structured conversations are often very helpful, where they practice verbal fluency - coming up with something to say - while not falling into the trap of doing a stream of consciousness monologue.
Free range play to help them develop initiative. This can be hard to arrange. I suggest a two hour session in the evening, or a three hour session on weekends, where they explore the neighbourhood and you trail along silently a few steps back, only intervening or commenting when there is genuine danger. This means if they lacerate themself climbing a fence, or climb into a dumpster and get uck all over their shoes, you don't intervene, you just provide some first aid or whatever when they request it, but you do intervene if they are climbing the fence to get in at a yard with a potentially dangerous dog, or are about to try a dash across traffic when there is a chance they will not make it.
If you can't do free range play, then I'd suggest any activity where they develop competency outside of the abilities standard to their age. Teach them to bake, and allow them to make messes in the kitchen and destroy your baking pans. Teach them how to unblock a toilet. Teach them how house numbers work, so they can track down an address without electronic tools. Put them in a first aid course and let them learn CPR. (They won't have the strength to do it on an adult, but would on a child their own age while some other kid runs screaming for adult help.) Teach them how to paddle a canoe, or sail, or dig for clams or build a lean to/wigwam, or read a map or request that a book be added to the library's collection, or research a political issue that matters to them, like the maintenance on the skateboard park they want to use.
posted by Jane the Brown at 6:35 AM on November 21, 2024
Just backing up acidrabbit here. This could have been me, and this kind of intervention is clearly more about the parents than the kid. You say your kid is smart: they'll figure that part out, eventually, no matter what paternalistic narratives you sell about this kind of interference to yourself.
At the very least, wait until they request it, and support who they are and their strengths, not who you want them to be.
posted by The Master and Margarita Mix at 7:51 AM on November 21, 2024
At the very least, wait until they request it, and support who they are and their strengths, not who you want them to be.
posted by The Master and Margarita Mix at 7:51 AM on November 21, 2024
You might already be aware of Rejection Sensitivity, which is strong in many neurodivergent people. This article explains what it is, and gives some practical advice
Neurodivergent people get judged harshly because of the Double Empathy Problem so be aware of how much you might be framing this as your kid having to take all the responsibility for adapting their instinctive communication style. And find opportunities for them to socialise with other neurodivergent people (not just kids, often ND kids find great comfort in friends of all different ages).
Be aware of some of the ways neurodivergent people differ from others in how we socialise, for example, we often enjoy parallel play which might, from the outside, look as if we're not connected to others. Parallel play is when you are in the same space together, but not directly interacting eg sitting together both buildings puzzles or reading, but not talking. You might need to shift your ideas of what connection look like.
Be aware of their stims. Monologuing can be a stim - that is both physiological (the movement of the jaw is soothing ) and psychologically calming. Don't try to shut it down, but see it as an indication that they might be getting over stimulated. Help them become more self aware of their stress levels and if necessary redirect to stims that are more appropriate (eg playing with a fidget toy, etc)
Find ways to redirect that monologuing urge - encourage them to write articles, make videos, about their topic of interest. That can also help connect them to people who share their interests.
We (neurodivergent people) tend to connect socially with people who are interested in the same things we are, rather than people who happen to be in a particular space with us by chance (eg class mates).
posted by Zumbador at 7:57 AM on November 21, 2024
Neurodivergent people get judged harshly because of the Double Empathy Problem so be aware of how much you might be framing this as your kid having to take all the responsibility for adapting their instinctive communication style. And find opportunities for them to socialise with other neurodivergent people (not just kids, often ND kids find great comfort in friends of all different ages).
Be aware of some of the ways neurodivergent people differ from others in how we socialise, for example, we often enjoy parallel play which might, from the outside, look as if we're not connected to others. Parallel play is when you are in the same space together, but not directly interacting eg sitting together both buildings puzzles or reading, but not talking. You might need to shift your ideas of what connection look like.
Be aware of their stims. Monologuing can be a stim - that is both physiological (the movement of the jaw is soothing ) and psychologically calming. Don't try to shut it down, but see it as an indication that they might be getting over stimulated. Help them become more self aware of their stress levels and if necessary redirect to stims that are more appropriate (eg playing with a fidget toy, etc)
Find ways to redirect that monologuing urge - encourage them to write articles, make videos, about their topic of interest. That can also help connect them to people who share their interests.
We (neurodivergent people) tend to connect socially with people who are interested in the same things we are, rather than people who happen to be in a particular space with us by chance (eg class mates).
posted by Zumbador at 7:57 AM on November 21, 2024
You might find it helpful to read up on Rejection Sensitive Dysphoria (RSD).
posted by bluedaisy at 8:14 AM on November 21, 2024
posted by bluedaisy at 8:14 AM on November 21, 2024
I could have written this. If it is ASD or similar, this is emerging right on schedule as social stuff with peers gets harder in the run-up to puberty. I am on the fence about whether the best course is “allow natural progression” or “provide scaffolding.” We went with the second initially because Little eirias’ struggles were getting in the way of her getting her educational needs met — you may still be in the age range for the books we used at home, the Superflex series (which I learned about from this very website). In later years we have backed off and merely made sure she has access to a safe space with a regular counselor, largely because social skills therapy options in our area appear to be limited to stuff we aren’t comfortable with (clicker training, basically). And we have tried to orchestrate or encourage peer 1:1 meetups outside of school, and also to talk explicitly about social cues over dinner and such, not in a didactic or in-the-moment, you-did-it-wrong way. I do believe it is okay to be awkward (hi) but it is also okay to not want to be lonely and giving your kid options to connect is a good thing.
posted by eirias at 8:46 AM on November 21, 2024
posted by eirias at 8:46 AM on November 21, 2024
Thank you for all the ideas and input so far - feel free to write more this is all so helpful.
Kid has said they’d like to make friends more easily and naturally and seems to sense that there’s some bits they’re missing.
We do explain body language and they’re shockingly astute and observant in this area…and also very self aware… yet somehow not able to take these insights and apply it to their next steps behaviour. Like… I see that you are tuning out because I’m rambling… so I will ramble even more to get that last bit in before you run away.
Waitlists in my area are 12-18mo as Kitteh understands.
posted by St. Peepsburg at 10:26 AM on November 21, 2024
Kid has said they’d like to make friends more easily and naturally and seems to sense that there’s some bits they’re missing.
We do explain body language and they’re shockingly astute and observant in this area…and also very self aware… yet somehow not able to take these insights and apply it to their next steps behaviour. Like… I see that you are tuning out because I’m rambling… so I will ramble even more to get that last bit in before you run away.
Waitlists in my area are 12-18mo as Kitteh understands.
posted by St. Peepsburg at 10:26 AM on November 21, 2024
If you would like my help brainstorming some homegrown methods of DBT + Speech Therapy skills / exercises while you move off the waitlist, please feel free to memail me. I could suggest some modifications of skill building that could be used at home or by family friends. I am not a therapist, speech therapist etc. but I am happy to help from a former client perspective.
posted by seemoorglass at 11:01 AM on November 21, 2024
posted by seemoorglass at 11:01 AM on November 21, 2024
nerdy activities outside of school- for me at that age it was Junior Zookeepers, a lego Mindstorm, girl scouts.
I think around age 12, my dad gave me the Dale Carnegie Book How to Win Friends and Influence people, and the hokey 1930s language was perfect for my kid brain. YMMV, but it helped me a lot.
posted by wowenthusiast at 12:27 PM on November 21, 2024
I think around age 12, my dad gave me the Dale Carnegie Book How to Win Friends and Influence people, and the hokey 1930s language was perfect for my kid brain. YMMV, but it helped me a lot.
posted by wowenthusiast at 12:27 PM on November 21, 2024
You’re a good parent trying to do what’s best for your kid. Hang in there!
posted by knobknosher at 1:56 PM on November 21, 2024
posted by knobknosher at 1:56 PM on November 21, 2024
Joel Shaul has a bunch of books that are very visual aimed at kids with autism that explain conversations and interactions. The Green Zone Conversation Book is all about finding what to talk about with someone and how your favourite subject might not be the right thing all the time. Also What Can I Say? by Catherine Newman is aimed at kids and has tips on conversations in different situations and social conventions.
posted by AnnaRat at 9:02 PM on November 21, 2024
posted by AnnaRat at 9:02 PM on November 21, 2024
My kid is like this to some degree. It has been really helpful for her to make friends with other neurodivergent kids. There are a lot of different ways to facilitate this - our local library has meetups for neurodivergent kids, there is a play space near me that is specifically aimed at families with neurodivergent kids (but open to all), and I’ve seen people post on local parent Facebook groups looking to find kids of a similar age/temperament to set up play dates.
My kid also participated in a social skills group that was private pay only (and thus had no waitlist), which I realize is something that not all families have access to, but if that kind of thing is accessible to you, I highly recommend it.
posted by maleficent at 10:32 AM on November 24, 2024
My kid also participated in a social skills group that was private pay only (and thus had no waitlist), which I realize is something that not all families have access to, but if that kind of thing is accessible to you, I highly recommend it.
posted by maleficent at 10:32 AM on November 24, 2024
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posted by NotLost at 8:50 PM on November 20, 2024