Help a storyteller/very conceptual person get a little better at "tl;dr"
November 21, 2023 3:31 PM Subscribe
I just got some feedback that rings true to me that I would be more effective managing up if I got better at getting to the point, and that I'd be more effective at managing around if I were less conceptual in my interactions. I could use some resources.
Most corporate sorting hats correctly identify me as someone who uses a lot of storytelling to get ideas across. I also like to talk about the ideas and concepts behind things. I can tell that I lose people, but in past workplaces it has been bucketed more under "charming quirk." Now I've gotten some pointed feedback at the six month mark at a new place: "Everyone loves your work, people say you're our best recent hire, but the feedback from executives and peers is 'less story-telling, faster to the tl;dr.'"
I think some of this is a self-confidence issue: I didn't come up the "normal" way in my industry and don't have a lot of management acculturation. I feel that acutely and like to "show my work." Some of this is just what my comfort zone is: I like to think out loud, explain my thinking, disclose my premises, etc. I majored in philosophy, not in senior management at pre-IPO tech companies. Some of this is a little perfectionism: I like to just get through the interaction with as little ambiguity as possible.
I'm okay with not being in my comfort zone, and I want to communicate in a way that's useful to the people around me. I'm looking for advice, ideas, books. etc. that can help me be a more direct, to-the-point communicator who doesn't lean as heavily on setting up a story or taking people on a conceptual journey. Some of that could just be hearing other peoples' expectations.
Most corporate sorting hats correctly identify me as someone who uses a lot of storytelling to get ideas across. I also like to talk about the ideas and concepts behind things. I can tell that I lose people, but in past workplaces it has been bucketed more under "charming quirk." Now I've gotten some pointed feedback at the six month mark at a new place: "Everyone loves your work, people say you're our best recent hire, but the feedback from executives and peers is 'less story-telling, faster to the tl;dr.'"
I think some of this is a self-confidence issue: I didn't come up the "normal" way in my industry and don't have a lot of management acculturation. I feel that acutely and like to "show my work." Some of this is just what my comfort zone is: I like to think out loud, explain my thinking, disclose my premises, etc. I majored in philosophy, not in senior management at pre-IPO tech companies. Some of this is a little perfectionism: I like to just get through the interaction with as little ambiguity as possible.
I'm okay with not being in my comfort zone, and I want to communicate in a way that's useful to the people around me. I'm looking for advice, ideas, books. etc. that can help me be a more direct, to-the-point communicator who doesn't lean as heavily on setting up a story or taking people on a conceptual journey. Some of that could just be hearing other peoples' expectations.
Best answer: I got better at this working in grants, because for each project you might be applying for a dozen grants that have radically different word limits. So I had versions of each project description, and versions of the overall org mission, that were two or three pages long, a page long, a couple paragraphs, a paragraph, and a sentence or two. It’s still a great exercise even though I’m no longer in that industry, and I find that gradual paring-down much easier to get my head around than just “make it an elevator pitch.”
posted by showbiz_liz at 3:47 PM on November 21, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by showbiz_liz at 3:47 PM on November 21, 2023 [2 favorites]
Best answer: Try the inverted pyramid. Put your conclusion up front and only then consider if you need to explain further. This is a powerful form of storytelling.
Very few people want you to think out loud in a meeting. Are you preparing in advance? Try making sure you have a summary before you meet. I never do that here on MF, because it’s my hobby, but at work I edit, edit, edit everything.
If you are presenting with slides, be extremely ruthless in getting those to single short points, with visuals.
If you’re writing email keep to the F-scan pattern and bullet points.
Most importantly, trust that people will ask if they want the backstory, rationale, or expertise. If you enter expecting a conversation, rather than trying to control the outcome through verbiage, your meetings will improve. Have confidence that you can supply that extra if needed.
posted by warriorqueen at 3:47 PM on November 21, 2023 [23 favorites]
Very few people want you to think out loud in a meeting. Are you preparing in advance? Try making sure you have a summary before you meet. I never do that here on MF, because it’s my hobby, but at work I edit, edit, edit everything.
If you are presenting with slides, be extremely ruthless in getting those to single short points, with visuals.
If you’re writing email keep to the F-scan pattern and bullet points.
Most importantly, trust that people will ask if they want the backstory, rationale, or expertise. If you enter expecting a conversation, rather than trying to control the outcome through verbiage, your meetings will improve. Have confidence that you can supply that extra if needed.
posted by warriorqueen at 3:47 PM on November 21, 2023 [23 favorites]
Best answer: ^^^^ BLUF, bottom line up front.
posted by j_curiouser at 4:20 PM on November 21, 2023 [8 favorites]
posted by j_curiouser at 4:20 PM on November 21, 2023 [8 favorites]
Best answer: Something clicked for me when someone said something to the effect of “I believed you the first time.” I thought I was being thorough, showing my work as you say, communicating in a winningly offbeat narrative way (lol,) and while I knew not everyone was fan, I had no idea I was actually overexplaining—which came across as wildly insecure. (Yes, I did grow up in a house where almost everything I said was mocked and/or disbelieved and/or interrogated. That’s where I developed the skill/defense mechanism, and I was mortified that instead of my manner hiding my childhood scars, it was highlighting them.)
What trained me out of it was that my boss and a lot of people up the chain are lawyers, who tend to take indirect speech as a dodge, and will not be shy about redirecting me. So, imagine you’re talking to a savvy but not especially gregarious lawyer who only has 10 minutes for you.
Another thing that trained me out of it was that sometimes, several of my direct reports would do something incorrectly, and since they’re not morons, I could only conclude my instructions hadn’t been clear enough. Humbling.
I compose scripts for myself if I know I am going to be talking to an exec, or have to explain something complicated. That way I can edit out 99% of the color commentary before it spews out of me.
Here is what I learned: at work, it’s usually a multiple choice question. Not an essay question.
You can still scratch the ramblin’ itch at coffees, mentoring convos, or by finding another one of us and saving it all up for them.
posted by kapers at 4:46 PM on November 21, 2023 [11 favorites]
What trained me out of it was that my boss and a lot of people up the chain are lawyers, who tend to take indirect speech as a dodge, and will not be shy about redirecting me. So, imagine you’re talking to a savvy but not especially gregarious lawyer who only has 10 minutes for you.
Another thing that trained me out of it was that sometimes, several of my direct reports would do something incorrectly, and since they’re not morons, I could only conclude my instructions hadn’t been clear enough. Humbling.
I compose scripts for myself if I know I am going to be talking to an exec, or have to explain something complicated. That way I can edit out 99% of the color commentary before it spews out of me.
Here is what I learned: at work, it’s usually a multiple choice question. Not an essay question.
You can still scratch the ramblin’ itch at coffees, mentoring convos, or by finding another one of us and saving it all up for them.
posted by kapers at 4:46 PM on November 21, 2023 [11 favorites]
I am coaching one of my team members on this point right now! You've received some great advice so far, and I'll be poaching some of it for my own team :)
My guidance to my team member is to know your audience. A CEO is going to need a different level of detail to a mid-manager to a peer. It's OK, even expected, that you'll communicate differently with different people. A peer might need the full story so they can understand the background of a decision; a manager might need just the bullet points on process and risk so they can help steer you differently if needed; C-suite are thinking about risk and opportunity, so the information they need/want is most related to that.
I really enjoy your style of writing, I can tell you're a good storyteller and I would likely enjoy talking to you at length. You don't need to change your style, just adapt your talking points to different needs.
posted by third word on a random page at 5:06 PM on November 21, 2023 [4 favorites]
My guidance to my team member is to know your audience. A CEO is going to need a different level of detail to a mid-manager to a peer. It's OK, even expected, that you'll communicate differently with different people. A peer might need the full story so they can understand the background of a decision; a manager might need just the bullet points on process and risk so they can help steer you differently if needed; C-suite are thinking about risk and opportunity, so the information they need/want is most related to that.
I really enjoy your style of writing, I can tell you're a good storyteller and I would likely enjoy talking to you at length. You don't need to change your style, just adapt your talking points to different needs.
posted by third word on a random page at 5:06 PM on November 21, 2023 [4 favorites]
Best answer: most of my “how do i do better and get along better at work” development comes from podcasts during my commute, so i’ll offer up:
posted by tamarack at 5:07 PM on November 21, 2023 [2 favorites]
- short sounds confident - episode from “the look and sound of leadership (there is also a transcript if you’d prefer to read)
- the way to make sense for others - episode from coaching for leaders (though featuring the host of the first podcast!)
posted by tamarack at 5:07 PM on November 21, 2023 [2 favorites]
Best answer: Start acting as if you have one minute max to communicate your point. Share only who, what, when, and how, as needed for the particular point you're making.
"We need to market the teapot more persuasively with soda drinkers. Billboards on beaches this summer is the current proposal."
"You're responsible for getting the teapot budget to the team by the 15th. Please distribute hard copies too."
"I will focus on reducing teapot time-to-market this quarter and then we can reassess."
Then stop and LISTEN.
STOP. LISTEN.
Are they asking for clarification? No? You're done. "Cool, thanks, have a great rest of the day."
Are they asking why this request or statement? No? You're done. "Cool, thanks, have a great rest of the day."
Are they asking for a metaphor or conceptual foray together? No? "Cool, thanks, have a great rest of the day."
One of the best ways to practice this is outside of work. Practice saying one sentence, maybe two tops, in conversation with friends. And then STOP. LISTEN. Let there be some silence. Let the other person notice if they have more to say. LISTEN. Then you can talk again.
I know quite a few philosophers. It may be that your conversational thinking and speaking style is helping you create meaning or value in your work beyond the actual teapot making. But an unintended consequence is that you're using up all the oxygen in the room. Other people need some of that to breathe and speak their own needs.
posted by cocoagirl at 5:13 PM on November 21, 2023 [18 favorites]
"We need to market the teapot more persuasively with soda drinkers. Billboards on beaches this summer is the current proposal."
"You're responsible for getting the teapot budget to the team by the 15th. Please distribute hard copies too."
"I will focus on reducing teapot time-to-market this quarter and then we can reassess."
Then stop and LISTEN.
STOP. LISTEN.
Are they asking for clarification? No? You're done. "Cool, thanks, have a great rest of the day."
Are they asking why this request or statement? No? You're done. "Cool, thanks, have a great rest of the day."
Are they asking for a metaphor or conceptual foray together? No? "Cool, thanks, have a great rest of the day."
One of the best ways to practice this is outside of work. Practice saying one sentence, maybe two tops, in conversation with friends. And then STOP. LISTEN. Let there be some silence. Let the other person notice if they have more to say. LISTEN. Then you can talk again.
I know quite a few philosophers. It may be that your conversational thinking and speaking style is helping you create meaning or value in your work beyond the actual teapot making. But an unintended consequence is that you're using up all the oxygen in the room. Other people need some of that to breathe and speak their own needs.
posted by cocoagirl at 5:13 PM on November 21, 2023 [18 favorites]
Some of this is a little perfectionism: I like to just get through the interaction with as little ambiguity as possible.This part struck me out of everything that you wrote. Is it possible that what you're doing could be attempting a form of control? Like if you explain every detail then people will understand and know that what you've done is "correct"? How well do you take other feedback? For example, if you work on a report (or whatever it is you do) and someone has suggestions, do you listen to them and incorporate them? Or do you try to defend what you've done and talk them out of the suggestions?
I have no answers but it might be a good exercise for you to sit with these questions a bit.
posted by dawkins_7 at 5:20 PM on November 21, 2023 [3 favorites]
Best answer: Know what you want.
Say what you want.
Trust that the organization knows you’re intelligent.
You don’t have to prove you’re a thoughtful reasonable person. That’s a given !
posted by St. Peepsburg at 5:55 PM on November 21, 2023 [3 favorites]
Say what you want.
Trust that the organization knows you’re intelligent.
You don’t have to prove you’re a thoughtful reasonable person. That’s a given !
posted by St. Peepsburg at 5:55 PM on November 21, 2023 [3 favorites]
Best answer:
In writing it involves editing and reediting your work until you've stripped it of everything but what the reader will be interested in.(*) Fortunately you can split the difference and give a tight summary up front followed by more meandering prose.
Speech is tougher. Right now you are trying to serve your audience by anticipating their questions and answering them in advance, but your predictions are sometimes off -- and in turn you have wasted their time by giving them information they're not interested in.
Most of the uninteresting information is, I suspect, driven by your desire to make things precisely clear. I say uninteresting instead of unimportant because a lot of very important information is boring as hell. On the other hand, presenting that information to people is frequently futile because their brains have already left the building. It's not an ideal situation and the only way I've found to deal with it is to sacrifice some clarity and trust that people will double check with me before making any large decisions.
So taking the time that Blaise Pascal didn't to shorten your writing and scaling back your target of perfect communication will probably both be well received.
(*) As for knowing what the reader will be interested in... well, that's the real trick of managing up.
posted by Tell Me No Lies at 6:21 PM on November 21, 2023 [2 favorites]
“I have only made this letter longer because I have not had the time to make it shorter.”Being concise takes time and work.
— Blaise Pascal
In writing it involves editing and reediting your work until you've stripped it of everything but what the reader will be interested in.(*) Fortunately you can split the difference and give a tight summary up front followed by more meandering prose.
Speech is tougher. Right now you are trying to serve your audience by anticipating their questions and answering them in advance, but your predictions are sometimes off -- and in turn you have wasted their time by giving them information they're not interested in.
Most of the uninteresting information is, I suspect, driven by your desire to make things precisely clear. I say uninteresting instead of unimportant because a lot of very important information is boring as hell. On the other hand, presenting that information to people is frequently futile because their brains have already left the building. It's not an ideal situation and the only way I've found to deal with it is to sacrifice some clarity and trust that people will double check with me before making any large decisions.
So taking the time that Blaise Pascal didn't to shorten your writing and scaling back your target of perfect communication will probably both be well received.
(*) As for knowing what the reader will be interested in... well, that's the real trick of managing up.
posted by Tell Me No Lies at 6:21 PM on November 21, 2023 [2 favorites]
Best answer: Summarizing is a form of storytelling, just sadly one rarely practised.
Practise it.
Make a 2 column table.
Headings:
- long
- short
Start a daily habit of writing for yourself.
Do a long version, as long as you feel like.
Then summarize as bullet points.
Each point must answer a specific, closed question.
You will become a true artist.
posted by KMH at 2:32 AM on November 22, 2023 [2 favorites]
Practise it.
Make a 2 column table.
Headings:
- long
- short
Start a daily habit of writing for yourself.
Do a long version, as long as you feel like.
Then summarize as bullet points.
Each point must answer a specific, closed question.
You will become a true artist.
posted by KMH at 2:32 AM on November 22, 2023 [2 favorites]
I used to do the whole show-my-work thing too, and I got dinged for it too. Turns out, most people don't give a fuck about your work. All they want is a fast answer.
Most of the people who display that attitude (and it's super common inside businesses) don't even give a fuck about whether the answers they get from you make any sense. You think the CEO got to be CEO on the basis of any skill beyond projecting an air of extreme confidence while making unsupported assertions on topics they have no clue about? Think again.
Being a business "team player" does not involve anything like actual collaboration. It involves being a hard-wearing interchangeable cog that runs silent and never requires lubrication.
They pay you to understand the things you understand, exactly so that understanding those things doesn't drip the oil stains of reasonable uncertainty all over their jobs.
posted by flabdablet at 6:34 AM on November 22, 2023 [1 favorite]
Most of the people who display that attitude (and it's super common inside businesses) don't even give a fuck about whether the answers they get from you make any sense. You think the CEO got to be CEO on the basis of any skill beyond projecting an air of extreme confidence while making unsupported assertions on topics they have no clue about? Think again.
Being a business "team player" does not involve anything like actual collaboration. It involves being a hard-wearing interchangeable cog that runs silent and never requires lubrication.
They pay you to understand the things you understand, exactly so that understanding those things doesn't drip the oil stains of reasonable uncertainty all over their jobs.
posted by flabdablet at 6:34 AM on November 22, 2023 [1 favorite]
Best answer: FWIW, I’ve also found it helpful to take a pause before speaking in order to summarize my own thoughts in my head. If I launch into an answer immediately, I’m much more likely to “think out loud” and reason as I go. If I pause for 5 seconds before saying anything, I’m more likely to be concise.
Extra bonus: I’ve had feedback that this makes me appear more thoughtful and worth listening to.
Failure mode: in a forum with multiple fast talkers, “pause first” can make it hard to get a word in edgewise. But that situation is also more likely to result in me becoming flustered and speak imprecisely, so silence may be better…
posted by learning from frequent failure at 7:02 AM on November 22, 2023 [3 favorites]
Extra bonus: I’ve had feedback that this makes me appear more thoughtful and worth listening to.
Failure mode: in a forum with multiple fast talkers, “pause first” can make it hard to get a word in edgewise. But that situation is also more likely to result in me becoming flustered and speak imprecisely, so silence may be better…
posted by learning from frequent failure at 7:02 AM on November 22, 2023 [3 favorites]
Response by poster: So, imagine you’re talking to a savvy but not especially gregarious lawyer who only has 10 minutes for you.
I don't even need to imagine: That's one of the folks who provided the feedback.
There are a lot of good ideas in these answers. I've got plenty to think about and some good steps to try.
posted by Pudding Yeti at 7:54 AM on November 22, 2023 [1 favorite]
I don't even need to imagine: That's one of the folks who provided the feedback.
There are a lot of good ideas in these answers. I've got plenty to think about and some good steps to try.
posted by Pudding Yeti at 7:54 AM on November 22, 2023 [1 favorite]
Share only who, what, when, and how, as needed for the particular point you're making.
This. You want to be somewhere between elevator pitch and executive summary level of detail. If your audience wants more on some or all of it they will ask.
So practice covering the who/what/when/how in no more than one bullet each.
If you can't make it that concise ask yourself why? Are you getting lost in the detail? Do you need more information? Do you need to brainstorm with somebody or bounce ideas off them? That's all fine but people need to know that's the purpose of the conversation and they are typically 1:1 conversations, not your presentation to the team/customer/big cheese.
Even very complicated topics can be boiled down to their essence. Are you omitting a boatload of nuance and details - yes. Do most people care about that, no. Sometimes you do need people to understand the nuances but that would typically be a specific conversation, set up with the purpose of walking through a problem and suggested solution.
I have a person reporting to me who is moderately senior, very experienced, they are perfectly capable of getting to the correct conclusions and recommendations without significant input from my side. So my expectation would be a brief summary and request for approval, by email so we have a record for compliance. Instead they insist lengthy meetings where they walk me through every aspect of their thinking. When I asked them what the purpose of these meetings is, they said they want to avoid blame if I approve and later it turns out that we have missed something.
I have a great many more demands on my time than they do and I simply do not have time to discuss things that don't need discussing. A more junior person would get that time from me because they require coaching to get to these conclusions. This person doesn't. We are working through how to communicate more effectively with each other.
posted by koahiatamadl at 7:56 AM on November 22, 2023
This. You want to be somewhere between elevator pitch and executive summary level of detail. If your audience wants more on some or all of it they will ask.
So practice covering the who/what/when/how in no more than one bullet each.
If you can't make it that concise ask yourself why? Are you getting lost in the detail? Do you need more information? Do you need to brainstorm with somebody or bounce ideas off them? That's all fine but people need to know that's the purpose of the conversation and they are typically 1:1 conversations, not your presentation to the team/customer/big cheese.
Even very complicated topics can be boiled down to their essence. Are you omitting a boatload of nuance and details - yes. Do most people care about that, no. Sometimes you do need people to understand the nuances but that would typically be a specific conversation, set up with the purpose of walking through a problem and suggested solution.
I have a person reporting to me who is moderately senior, very experienced, they are perfectly capable of getting to the correct conclusions and recommendations without significant input from my side. So my expectation would be a brief summary and request for approval, by email so we have a record for compliance. Instead they insist lengthy meetings where they walk me through every aspect of their thinking. When I asked them what the purpose of these meetings is, they said they want to avoid blame if I approve and later it turns out that we have missed something.
I have a great many more demands on my time than they do and I simply do not have time to discuss things that don't need discussing. A more junior person would get that time from me because they require coaching to get to these conclusions. This person doesn't. We are working through how to communicate more effectively with each other.
posted by koahiatamadl at 7:56 AM on November 22, 2023
As someone who frequently gets trapped with stemwinders I really appreciate someone who can bottom line it (in my line of work, it's conclusion + because + reasons) and then let me know what else they have (process details, discarded alternative options, philosophical underpinnings, etc.) if I want more. Sometimes I have questions and then I do need more.
I find the completist mode of communication kind of excruciating to listen to at work because it's more about the speaker and their performance than the audience who only needs enough to make an informed decision. Because I've been doing this a while, I may not need a lot because it's similar to something I've done before or I've read every relevant item on that issue. There's a lot of background I already have and if someone starts in with "first there was darkness, then there was light," it can feel like they think I don't know anything, which is not a great feeling either.
posted by *s at 8:23 AM on November 22, 2023 [1 favorite]
I find the completist mode of communication kind of excruciating to listen to at work because it's more about the speaker and their performance than the audience who only needs enough to make an informed decision. Because I've been doing this a while, I may not need a lot because it's similar to something I've done before or I've read every relevant item on that issue. There's a lot of background I already have and if someone starts in with "first there was darkness, then there was light," it can feel like they think I don't know anything, which is not a great feeling either.
posted by *s at 8:23 AM on November 22, 2023 [1 favorite]
Best answer: "How to Give a Status Update To Executives" by MeFi's Own jacobian is an excellent guide here, with a specific guide on how to do this, plus some context:
at the top of an organization, there tends to be a shift away from this kind of “proof” towards a general assumption of information-sharing on a need-to-know basis. Executives, especially at large organizations, need to synthesize a truly staggering amount of information, and so effective executives learn to value people who filter for “what you need to know.” The assumption becomes: if you didn’t mention it it’s because it doesn’t warrant mention, not because you don’t know it.posted by brainwane at 11:37 AM on November 22, 2023 [3 favorites]
Best answer: Here’s a technique I use with my lawyer boss since you mentioned you’ve gotten this feedback from lawyers.
-assume she’s smart(er than me,) so she doesn’t need a lot of context to grasp things—overexplaining is actually an insult to her intelligence. This works with people who are smart AND with people who think they are, which is crucial for managing up
-assume she’s absolutely not shy about asking for any needed context
-assume she trusts my conclusions are sound—that’s why she’s asking me— and doesn’t need any insight into my process or philosophies
-assume I have her attention for at best 30 seconds to 5 minutes—if she wants to chop it up (and sometimes she does!) she’ll initiate, but it’s rude to force that on her
-imagine she’s filling out a form and needs me to provide some info so she can complete the form. The form asks my staff needs for 2024. The form is multiple choice a) no new hires, b) 1 new hire, c) more than 1 new hire. That’s it, those are the only options. There isn’t a blank field to fill in that explains how I think it’s demoralizing to hire from the outside. There isn’t an option to attach the spreadsheet I made to compare our workload with 5 previous years. Multiple choice, not essay. I literally say that to myself
-I sometimes give her the OPTION to go into my thought process and research (e.g., “I’m asking for 1 new hire due to workload, let me know if you want me to send you the numbers to show the CEO”)
posted by kapers at 11:51 AM on November 22, 2023 [3 favorites]
-assume she’s smart(er than me,) so she doesn’t need a lot of context to grasp things—overexplaining is actually an insult to her intelligence. This works with people who are smart AND with people who think they are, which is crucial for managing up
-assume she’s absolutely not shy about asking for any needed context
-assume she trusts my conclusions are sound—that’s why she’s asking me— and doesn’t need any insight into my process or philosophies
-assume I have her attention for at best 30 seconds to 5 minutes—if she wants to chop it up (and sometimes she does!) she’ll initiate, but it’s rude to force that on her
-imagine she’s filling out a form and needs me to provide some info so she can complete the form. The form asks my staff needs for 2024. The form is multiple choice a) no new hires, b) 1 new hire, c) more than 1 new hire. That’s it, those are the only options. There isn’t a blank field to fill in that explains how I think it’s demoralizing to hire from the outside. There isn’t an option to attach the spreadsheet I made to compare our workload with 5 previous years. Multiple choice, not essay. I literally say that to myself
-I sometimes give her the OPTION to go into my thought process and research (e.g., “I’m asking for 1 new hire due to workload, let me know if you want me to send you the numbers to show the CEO”)
posted by kapers at 11:51 AM on November 22, 2023 [3 favorites]
I have definitely been a rambler in writing in the past -- I stopped when I realised that I was trying to anticipate and answer every possible question in advance, which was pointless and a waste of everyone's time. People can ask questions if they have questions.
I don't think that I had the same tendency when speaking to people in person, because I can really feel the passage of time when I'm conveying information verbally, and I personally get annoyed when I feel that someone is rambling and giving me a lot of unnecessary preamble when they're telling me something.
I agree with a lot of the previous comments, and my general ruthless instruction to myself is "don't try to think for other people". Don't assume that they won't understand, or won't believe you, and will require a thesis explaining your motivation. Don't assume that you can guess their questions in advance. Trust them to ask for context if they need it.
posted by confluency at 12:03 AM on November 23, 2023
I don't think that I had the same tendency when speaking to people in person, because I can really feel the passage of time when I'm conveying information verbally, and I personally get annoyed when I feel that someone is rambling and giving me a lot of unnecessary preamble when they're telling me something.
I agree with a lot of the previous comments, and my general ruthless instruction to myself is "don't try to think for other people". Don't assume that they won't understand, or won't believe you, and will require a thesis explaining your motivation. Don't assume that you can guess their questions in advance. Trust them to ask for context if they need it.
posted by confluency at 12:03 AM on November 23, 2023
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I'm a rambler and verbal processor too, so it's a struggle for me to be concise. If I had some key points or a project I needed to address in a meeting, and it was important to get to the point, I'd write out my ideas in advance, and then keep distilling them until I had three sentences or so.
I also do this on the fly in meetings. If there's an important point I want to make, I often scribble down 2-3 key points on paper before I speak.
You could practice saying some of this stuff out loud before meetings, too.
posted by bluedaisy at 3:41 PM on November 21, 2023 [11 favorites]