Is it worth the price for an expensive electric cargo bike?
July 15, 2023 11:34 AM Subscribe
Can you help us choose an electric cargo bike for cycling with children? From the 'cheaper' Babboe to the premium Batavus or Bakfiet?
We've decided we'd like to invest in a two-wheel cargo bike to make trips around town easier and reduce the use of our car. The 'cheaper' options are around 3000 Euro (Babboe second hand, or new ones that look very cheaply made). The premium options look like either the Batavus Fier 2 or the Bakfiet Long Steps. Those go for around 5000 Euro.
Normally I like the idea of buying quality that lasts, but this is a big sum of money for us so I don't want to do it unnecessarily. We'll only be cycling short distances, so a higher top speed or going 80 instead of 60kms on a single charge doesn't actually make that much difference to us. But we want it to last. Reviews for the Babboe and other cheaper ones are mixed - some people have them for years without a problem, others seem to have no end of trouble with them.
What would you recommend? Is the Batavus/Bakfiet worth almost double the price of the Babboe?
We've decided we'd like to invest in a two-wheel cargo bike to make trips around town easier and reduce the use of our car. The 'cheaper' options are around 3000 Euro (Babboe second hand, or new ones that look very cheaply made). The premium options look like either the Batavus Fier 2 or the Bakfiet Long Steps. Those go for around 5000 Euro.
Normally I like the idea of buying quality that lasts, but this is a big sum of money for us so I don't want to do it unnecessarily. We'll only be cycling short distances, so a higher top speed or going 80 instead of 60kms on a single charge doesn't actually make that much difference to us. But we want it to last. Reviews for the Babboe and other cheaper ones are mixed - some people have them for years without a problem, others seem to have no end of trouble with them.
What would you recommend? Is the Batavus/Bakfiet worth almost double the price of the Babboe?
I can't speak to those brands or market but will share my similar recent experience. In the US, I shopped for cargo e-bikes in the $1.5-5k range last year. I ended up spending around $3k on a mid range, and I really like it a lot!
Except 1) it's very heavy, almost like an electric moped, and 2) it's difficult to add accessories because it's enough different from acoustic bike( semi-)standards.
Overall it depends on how tight the money is. I like mine so much that I now plan on eventually buying a more expensive bike made by a company with long experience making acoustic cargo bikes. I think the level of polish and reliability, lighter weights etc will be worth it, and I mildly regret not going all-in at the start. But it's a tough gamble, good luck!
posted by SaltySalticid at 1:06 PM on July 15, 2023
Except 1) it's very heavy, almost like an electric moped, and 2) it's difficult to add accessories because it's enough different from acoustic bike( semi-)standards.
Overall it depends on how tight the money is. I like mine so much that I now plan on eventually buying a more expensive bike made by a company with long experience making acoustic cargo bikes. I think the level of polish and reliability, lighter weights etc will be worth it, and I mildly regret not going all-in at the start. But it's a tough gamble, good luck!
posted by SaltySalticid at 1:06 PM on July 15, 2023
Response by poster: Sorry, to be clear we're only looking for two wheeled bikes, for the reasons you mention daveliepmann. Babboe do a two-wheeled version as well.
Thanks for the advice so far!
posted by twirlypen at 1:24 PM on July 15, 2023 [1 favorite]
Thanks for the advice so far!
posted by twirlypen at 1:24 PM on July 15, 2023 [1 favorite]
I would test ride all of these; a lot of this comes down to personal feel and how you like to ride. It's a fairly big purchase, and worth testing out. I would test ride each of these multiple times to get a feel for them, trying your best to replicate real world trips and loads that you would travel and carry.
I have a fishtail cargo bike (xtracycle edgerunner, no longer in production, not an ebike); I commuted about 16 miles round trip on it for several years, hauling a single kid on back, and using it for most in-neighborhood errands. It was the best option for us at the time, because it was cheaper than an ebike, and the fishtail style is generally cheaper. If I had to do it over again, I would get a frontloader. They ride different, but I vastly prefer it over a fishtail.
I'm desperately trying to find a job slightly closer to home so that I can pull the trigger on an Harry vs Larry e-Bullitt; they're by far the most comfortable, maneuverable, and lightest ebikes I've been able to get my butt on a test ride of. They are between 24-30kg based on options and basket fit-out, with all the other options you've listed being more than double that weight at 55-75kg based on options. If your battery does crap out, this makes a huge difference. If you have to haul it up a set of even short stairs, this makes a huge difference. Even just pushing it around to get on and off it, this weight makes a huge difference.
It is a glorious ride, and one of the only machines that I've been like, giddy to ride.The frame has very little flex, and feels very sturdy and firm, where other cargo bikes do feel a bit wobbly or just a little unweildly; they corner like 'real' bikes. They are expensive, and are a true car replacement if your typical commute is under 10 miles or so. Anything over that, and a car starts to make sense at least in terms of commute time (this may vary based on your local bike infrastructure). A friend of mine has a non-electrified version, and they are really good cargo bikes, and extremely comfortable and much more maneuverable than fishtail cargo bikes. If you're mostly going to be on flat terrain, I would consider getting a non-electrified version.
There are a few other minor advantages that they have to other cargo bikes and e-bikes, but they're all very negotiable. The only one worth mentioning is how quickly they can be adjusted for different riders; most cargo bikes are notably harder to switch between rider sizes. My buddy is shorter than I am, and we had the bike resized for a test drive in 5 minutes flat; with my current cargo bike that is at least a 30m affair. I'm not sure exactly on the specifics of others you've listed, but it's worth checking into if you're going to be switching riders frequently.
posted by furnace.heart at 2:18 PM on July 15, 2023
I have a fishtail cargo bike (xtracycle edgerunner, no longer in production, not an ebike); I commuted about 16 miles round trip on it for several years, hauling a single kid on back, and using it for most in-neighborhood errands. It was the best option for us at the time, because it was cheaper than an ebike, and the fishtail style is generally cheaper. If I had to do it over again, I would get a frontloader. They ride different, but I vastly prefer it over a fishtail.
I'm desperately trying to find a job slightly closer to home so that I can pull the trigger on an Harry vs Larry e-Bullitt; they're by far the most comfortable, maneuverable, and lightest ebikes I've been able to get my butt on a test ride of. They are between 24-30kg based on options and basket fit-out, with all the other options you've listed being more than double that weight at 55-75kg based on options. If your battery does crap out, this makes a huge difference. If you have to haul it up a set of even short stairs, this makes a huge difference. Even just pushing it around to get on and off it, this weight makes a huge difference.
It is a glorious ride, and one of the only machines that I've been like, giddy to ride.The frame has very little flex, and feels very sturdy and firm, where other cargo bikes do feel a bit wobbly or just a little unweildly; they corner like 'real' bikes. They are expensive, and are a true car replacement if your typical commute is under 10 miles or so. Anything over that, and a car starts to make sense at least in terms of commute time (this may vary based on your local bike infrastructure). A friend of mine has a non-electrified version, and they are really good cargo bikes, and extremely comfortable and much more maneuverable than fishtail cargo bikes. If you're mostly going to be on flat terrain, I would consider getting a non-electrified version.
There are a few other minor advantages that they have to other cargo bikes and e-bikes, but they're all very negotiable. The only one worth mentioning is how quickly they can be adjusted for different riders; most cargo bikes are notably harder to switch between rider sizes. My buddy is shorter than I am, and we had the bike resized for a test drive in 5 minutes flat; with my current cargo bike that is at least a 30m affair. I'm not sure exactly on the specifics of others you've listed, but it's worth checking into if you're going to be switching riders frequently.
posted by furnace.heart at 2:18 PM on July 15, 2023
I live in the middle of bicycle land in the most bicycle friendly city in Australia. It's certainly not Amsterdam but I see a heap of cargo bikes getting around every day and ride my own cobbled together affair (which I wouldn't recommend).
95% of what's on the road here are various variations on long tail bikes, Yuba and Tern probably being the most prominent well known brands. Both are well supported and people I speak to love them. I have a good friend with a bike more like what you've named, with the box in the front, and I've ridden it a few times. That style is much harder to park on the street and heavier, it's not where I'd head, nor him if he had his time again.
You could look into whether there's any hire schemes in your area, one of the reasons there are so many Terns around here is a company that leases them and then looks after all repairs and maintenance, which takes any question of reliability away.
posted by deadwax at 3:29 PM on July 15, 2023
95% of what's on the road here are various variations on long tail bikes, Yuba and Tern probably being the most prominent well known brands. Both are well supported and people I speak to love them. I have a good friend with a bike more like what you've named, with the box in the front, and I've ridden it a few times. That style is much harder to park on the street and heavier, it's not where I'd head, nor him if he had his time again.
You could look into whether there's any hire schemes in your area, one of the reasons there are so many Terns around here is a company that leases them and then looks after all repairs and maintenance, which takes any question of reliability away.
posted by deadwax at 3:29 PM on July 15, 2023
This guy reviews all categories of ebikes. He rates the Xtracycle Edgerunner ($4500) as one of the best. There’s certainly less expensive cargo ebikes (as well as more expensive) but check out why he’s rated this first.
https://electricbikereview.com/best-electric-cargo-bikes/
posted by artdrectr at 4:36 PM on July 15, 2023
https://electricbikereview.com/best-electric-cargo-bikes/
posted by artdrectr at 4:36 PM on July 15, 2023
I will say that e-bikes hold their value really well in the second-hand market, so even if you do make a mistake, you could probably recoup a fair bit of that money. I have seen e-bikes that are several years old go for 60-70% of their RRP.
Personally I love the Urban Arrow and would be my first choice, but unfortunately have to stick with a mid tail Tern due to storage constraints. Definitely recommend a couple of test rides first!
posted by moiraine at 1:57 AM on July 16, 2023
Personally I love the Urban Arrow and would be my first choice, but unfortunately have to stick with a mid tail Tern due to storage constraints. Definitely recommend a couple of test rides first!
posted by moiraine at 1:57 AM on July 16, 2023
We purchased a second hand Cangoo two-wheel box bike in early 2022 when the market was even tighter as a result of pandemic supply chain issues. We also went unmotorised for much the same reasons and knew our everyday cycle to childcare, work and home didn't have significant hills. Neither the cheaper bike or lack of motor were our first options but we were able to get mobile with kid and stuff. We are happy enough because it was cheap and available when we needed it and it gets us on around on our everyday needs but we are still considering upgrade options especially as the kid is getting heavier and we don't go on longer rides as we might with a smoother experience.
The cheaper bikes will still get you around but we and our cargo bike specialist mechanics have observed that the build quality is lacking compared to similar aged premium cargo bikes. Bolts which should have been stainless are rusting, the plywood is delaminating and fastenings for rain coverings have snapped off. The original harness buckles were near useless so we changed them over to a bakfiets magnetic harness. There was a rain cover included but it is too low for the kid to sit under comfortably.
Buying accessories (eg better covers) is harder as the brand is less widely supported. Everything is just clankier in quality and experience, braking continues to be a problem despite retrofits and the stand is really noisy. And that is just unmotorised. I can't even imagine the problems a cheaper motor and battery system might introduce. However it is a functional bike. When we are not in kid wrangling mode and get on our old normal bikes iwith way better build quality it just feels smoother (regardless of the size).
So... if you have the possibility go for the better quality bike get it. You will ride happier, further and more frequently with your kid and have more opportunities to modify and resell down the line.
posted by pipstar at 3:58 AM on July 16, 2023
The cheaper bikes will still get you around but we and our cargo bike specialist mechanics have observed that the build quality is lacking compared to similar aged premium cargo bikes. Bolts which should have been stainless are rusting, the plywood is delaminating and fastenings for rain coverings have snapped off. The original harness buckles were near useless so we changed them over to a bakfiets magnetic harness. There was a rain cover included but it is too low for the kid to sit under comfortably.
Buying accessories (eg better covers) is harder as the brand is less widely supported. Everything is just clankier in quality and experience, braking continues to be a problem despite retrofits and the stand is really noisy. And that is just unmotorised. I can't even imagine the problems a cheaper motor and battery system might introduce. However it is a functional bike. When we are not in kid wrangling mode and get on our old normal bikes iwith way better build quality it just feels smoother (regardless of the size).
So... if you have the possibility go for the better quality bike get it. You will ride happier, further and more frequently with your kid and have more opportunities to modify and resell down the line.
posted by pipstar at 3:58 AM on July 16, 2023
Personally, in a similar situation (although we’re in the US and don’t have a garage, so we opted for a longtail despite loving a rental we had on an urban arrow), we opted for the used version of the higher-end bike. We’re 6 months in and no regrets. It was heavily used when we purchased (7500mes) but we’ll maintained and we have had 0 issues in the 6 months / 500km we’ve put on it since.
posted by samthemander at 9:00 AM on July 16, 2023
posted by samthemander at 9:00 AM on July 16, 2023
Don’t cut corners on brakes. These bikes are heavy and get going faster than regular bikes.
You need to have hydraulic disc brakes.
posted by bug138 at 10:58 AM on July 16, 2023
You need to have hydraulic disc brakes.
posted by bug138 at 10:58 AM on July 16, 2023
How many children? How good is the cycling infrastructure where you are? Are you going to be on roads with cars and sidewalks with pedestrians and street furniture? Or can you do door to door stuff entirely on bike paths?
posted by caek at 11:20 AM on July 16, 2023
posted by caek at 11:20 AM on July 16, 2023
Response by poster: Two children, zero bike infrastructure where we are. But we live in a little rural village, so the streets have little traffic and cycling isn't a problem.
Thanks for the answers so far!
posted by twirlypen at 1:24 PM on July 16, 2023
Thanks for the answers so far!
posted by twirlypen at 1:24 PM on July 16, 2023
Hmm. Maybe you'll be fine in your village, but I would strongly advise you to test ride a front box cargo bike before commiting to a cheap one or an expensive one. And consider instead longtail cargo bikes.
Front box cargo bikes are in my opinion too big and lack the maneuverability for busy environments without bike paths. They are great for places with an extensive network of wide bike paths. But they're too big for sidewalks (pedestrians, street furniture) and I would not feel safe on them on busy roads. They are also heavy and hard to store relative to a longtail cargo bike. Like I say, maybe they are a good fit for your village. But they're not for me, and I think it's worth at least considering the other type of cargo bike.
If you're interested in trying longtail cargo bikes, I recommend the Tern GSD.
As a general rubric, I would go high end rather than low end. The wear and tear on a cargo bike (of any style) compared to a regular bike is enormous simply due to the weight involved, and if it ends up replacing your car then you're going to put a lot of miles on it.
posted by caek at 3:35 PM on July 16, 2023
Front box cargo bikes are in my opinion too big and lack the maneuverability for busy environments without bike paths. They are great for places with an extensive network of wide bike paths. But they're too big for sidewalks (pedestrians, street furniture) and I would not feel safe on them on busy roads. They are also heavy and hard to store relative to a longtail cargo bike. Like I say, maybe they are a good fit for your village. But they're not for me, and I think it's worth at least considering the other type of cargo bike.
If you're interested in trying longtail cargo bikes, I recommend the Tern GSD.
As a general rubric, I would go high end rather than low end. The wear and tear on a cargo bike (of any style) compared to a regular bike is enormous simply due to the weight involved, and if it ends up replacing your car then you're going to put a lot of miles on it.
posted by caek at 3:35 PM on July 16, 2023
I will just throw into the mix - in a similar situation, we opted for a good quality two-child trailer and a regular bike to go with it.
I know people really love their cargo bikes, so I am not going to say anything negative at all about that option (and in our location 20+ years ago, that was not really an option), but here are the advantages of the trailer approach:
- I took it literally everywhere I felt comfortable riding my regular bicycle. Any trail, road, alley, rough, smooth, paved, dirt, whatever. If I could ride my normal bike there, I would be comfortable pulling the trailer there, too.
- We had hitches for maybe 5-6 different bikes over the years, so different people could haul the load on their preferred/best-fitting bike. This flexibility and the ability of different people to pull the trailer using their own bike they were comfortable riding was very helpful.
- Control, balance, etc is exactly as with your regular bike. There is no extra heavy weight up on the bike to balance, etc. As far as balance and handling, your bike feels like and nimble as ever. You do go a bit slower up hills and you do need to be sure your brakes are up to the task of stopping you on the way down. But I pulled this thing near-daily for 10+ years and never had a problem. We live in a very hilly area, with many, many very steep slopes to go up and down.
- It pairs equally well with a regular bike or an e-bike.
- It carried the kids and all their stuff, and also any other loads I needed to carry (groceries, plumbing, etc) equally well. I'm sure there are loads a cargo bike would carry and the trailer wouldn't, but it certainly covered more than 99% of our needs. Weight limit for the trailer is 100 pounds and I'm sure we pushed that a few times. Most cargo bikes can probably carry more, and also possibly bigger/odd-shaped items. But the trailer did everything we needed it to.
- Trailer + regular bike combo was quite a bit cheaper than a cargo bike. Even going top quality bike + top quality trailer, it is probably cheaper - you could likely end up with a top-quality bike and top-quality trailer for closer to the budget cargo bike price. Also, you can sell the trailer for a pretty decent price when done with it/kids outgrow it, and you still have the regular bike, which is good as ever.
- More flexible, too - basically your regular bike does double duty as a cargo bike and normal bike. When you don't need/want the cargo, just leave the trailer home.
- Trailer + bike is almost certainly lighter & easier to pull than the cargo bike.
- Post kids, the trailer still makes a great cargo hauler. Nowadays - older and lazier - we are more likely to pull it with spouse's ebike.
- When the bike tips over, the trailer still just sits there. Vs when a (big/heavy) cargo bike goes over, the kids are definitely spilling out of it.
I don't know that this combo quite replaces an automobile in the way a cargo bike can, but it's darn close for less $$$.
So, just another option to consider.
posted by flug at 6:39 PM on July 16, 2023
I know people really love their cargo bikes, so I am not going to say anything negative at all about that option (and in our location 20+ years ago, that was not really an option), but here are the advantages of the trailer approach:
- I took it literally everywhere I felt comfortable riding my regular bicycle. Any trail, road, alley, rough, smooth, paved, dirt, whatever. If I could ride my normal bike there, I would be comfortable pulling the trailer there, too.
- We had hitches for maybe 5-6 different bikes over the years, so different people could haul the load on their preferred/best-fitting bike. This flexibility and the ability of different people to pull the trailer using their own bike they were comfortable riding was very helpful.
- Control, balance, etc is exactly as with your regular bike. There is no extra heavy weight up on the bike to balance, etc. As far as balance and handling, your bike feels like and nimble as ever. You do go a bit slower up hills and you do need to be sure your brakes are up to the task of stopping you on the way down. But I pulled this thing near-daily for 10+ years and never had a problem. We live in a very hilly area, with many, many very steep slopes to go up and down.
- It pairs equally well with a regular bike or an e-bike.
- It carried the kids and all their stuff, and also any other loads I needed to carry (groceries, plumbing, etc) equally well. I'm sure there are loads a cargo bike would carry and the trailer wouldn't, but it certainly covered more than 99% of our needs. Weight limit for the trailer is 100 pounds and I'm sure we pushed that a few times. Most cargo bikes can probably carry more, and also possibly bigger/odd-shaped items. But the trailer did everything we needed it to.
- Trailer + regular bike combo was quite a bit cheaper than a cargo bike. Even going top quality bike + top quality trailer, it is probably cheaper - you could likely end up with a top-quality bike and top-quality trailer for closer to the budget cargo bike price. Also, you can sell the trailer for a pretty decent price when done with it/kids outgrow it, and you still have the regular bike, which is good as ever.
- More flexible, too - basically your regular bike does double duty as a cargo bike and normal bike. When you don't need/want the cargo, just leave the trailer home.
- Trailer + bike is almost certainly lighter & easier to pull than the cargo bike.
- Post kids, the trailer still makes a great cargo hauler. Nowadays - older and lazier - we are more likely to pull it with spouse's ebike.
- When the bike tips over, the trailer still just sits there. Vs when a (big/heavy) cargo bike goes over, the kids are definitely spilling out of it.
I don't know that this combo quite replaces an automobile in the way a cargo bike can, but it's darn close for less $$$.
So, just another option to consider.
posted by flug at 6:39 PM on July 16, 2023
This thread is closed to new comments.
If it's really just for around town, it feels OK on a test drive, and you don't mind taking turns slowly, I would totally go second-hand Babboe all the way. Roomier, less effort to park, beautiful bike, no need to spend for features you won't use.
posted by daveliepmann at 12:44 PM on July 15, 2023