A dignified way to ask to split the dinner bill

December 30, 2022 7:01 AM

What is the most gracefully direct way to ask one or more couples to join you for dinner, and pay our own way?

My wife and I have had many situations — mostly dinner with siblings and other family members — where hesitation and awkwardness upon the arrival of the bill led to us picking up the tab. We’ve even had times that we agreed in advance to split the bill and in the awkwardness I was left holding the bill.

While I don’t really keep track, the luster of my generosity is quickly forgotten — e.g. within hours. And because it’s spread across multiple people/families, and not reciprocated in any way… I’m left feeling somewhat resentful.

This is further complicated by the fact that my wife — who was born and raised poor in an Asian culture — does not want us (me) to appear “stingy”. So I end up feeling a confusing mix of pressures to perform.

I could use suggestions on how to agree and communicate on “going Dutch” before, during and after in these situations with dignity and grace .

posted by nandaro to Human Relations (26 answers total)

When the check comes, whether it comes to you or to someone else, hold up either the check or your wallet as a visual prop and say, "are we all putting in equally, or do you want to see the bill to split it up?"

The choice then isn't do we split yes/no, it's: we are splitting, do you want to split by process A or B?
posted by phunniemee at 7:15 AM on December 30, 2022 [38 favorites]

When the server comes to take everyone's order ask in voice that can be clearly heard by all if they can do separate checks.
posted by brookeb at 7:22 AM on December 30, 2022 [26 favorites]

We’ve even had times that we agreed in advance to split the bill and in the awkwardness I was left holding the bill.

If you've agreed in advance that you're splitting the bill, can you just ask the server for separate tabs up front? (I know this is easier/more acceptable in some places than others.)

Otherwise, I think you need to be matter-of-fact rather than awkward when the check arrives. You can say, "OK, looks like it's $50 per couple" or "OK, Joe had the steak and a Heineken, Judy had the cobb salad, Peter had the etc. etc. so it's $45 for you guys and $60 for us."

I do think that if you don't want to pay for the whole tab it's important to set expectations though about who's paying BEFORE you arrive at the restaurant, especially if you're out with people with different financial situations (and priorities), or if you're out with people who generally do not split the check with you. But it sounds like you've done this before, you just freeze up when the check arrives. Just be matter-of-fact! It will be OK!

The stinginess vs. feeling taken advantage of thing you probably need to discuss with your wife. Sounds like you have different values in this area but there's probably a way you can find a happy medium.
posted by mskyle at 7:23 AM on December 30, 2022 [4 favorites]

After you look at the check, put it back on the table and say:

“Do you guys want just Venmo me?”
Or
“Should we just split this?”
posted by cakelite at 7:33 AM on December 30, 2022 [1 favorite]

I would also take into account when it’s worth reconsidering this approach. If part of this is your wife’s culture (even if this feels unfair to you) I probably wouldn’t fight it. However, among friends or perhaps younger more “westernized” relatives, perhaps it would be fine to lay out the expectations.

There have also been many an ask in a similar vein, and I think it’s worth taking it all with a grain of salt. Maybe someone is taking advantage of you, maybe someone thinks very highly of you but forgets or is embarrassed to thank you directly but always mentions your generosity to others, maybe someone just expects it and it’s just the role they think you should play. All that to say, I find it easier to tell the story that “oh, the other couple must be on hard times, how silly of us to expect them to pay” instead of “wow they have taken me for a ride.”

But back to your actual question, when your wife’s relations are involved, ask her how you’d both like to handle it. When it comes to friends you could likely use some of the scripts above and then ask the server for separate checks when ordering. Or, if this is happening too often, not dining out with certain people until they’ve asked you out first
posted by raccoon409 at 7:40 AM on December 30, 2022 [13 favorites]

This is the original question:

"What is the most gracefully direct way to ask one or more couples to join you for dinner, and pay our own way?"

The asker wants to know how to INVITE other people to join them for dinner without it looking as if they're inviting them to be their GUESTS.

The answers given presume that this has already been done and situates all these people at a restaurant table, trying to avoid UNdoing the conversation that has already been achieved BEFORE the date of the dinner.

Nobody has said HOW to ask people to have dinner with you, making it clear during this initial conversation, how to phrase it so that the others know they will be paying for themselves.

The answer? I have no idea. I'd like to know too!

But let's get the question straight first.
posted by DMelanogaster at 7:59 AM on December 30, 2022 [23 favorites]

"do you wanna get food here with us" "do you want to split pizza and drinks at bar pepps" "wanna split some apps at Applebee's"
posted by bbqturtle at 8:03 AM on December 30, 2022 [1 favorite]

Nobody has said HOW to ask people to have dinner with you, making it clear during this initial conversation, how to phrase it so that the others know they will be paying for themselves.

ok to be clear that question had multiple parts, and people are addressing the easiest part

But here I am addressing the hard part: NORMALIZE LOSING FACE

The easiest and most expedient way to solve this is to say to your friends (the people you like and trust, remember, that's what a friend is), "I would love to see you guys. I can't afford to foot the whole bill, so let's find a place to go out where we can all comfortably split."

There is no honor in going broke trying to impress people. Just be honest. Be kind. Tell the truth. You want to see them but you can't foot the bill.

It's not hard. (Well, it's psychically hard if your ego and appearance are the most important things to you. But it's not technically hard.)

You have GOT to get this straight with your spouse ahead of time though. Align those values first, and the rest can follow.
posted by phunniemee at 8:12 AM on December 30, 2022 [28 favorites]

One way to word an invite might be to agree to pay for part of the meal up front, implying that you WON’T be paying for the rest. For example:

Let’s all go out to dinner. First bottle of wine is on me.

You could also try:
I’ve been wanting to check out this restaurant, it’s kind of expensive though. Are you cool paying about XX.00 a person? If so, I’ll make the reservation.
posted by you'rerightyou'rerightiknowyou'reright at 8:31 AM on December 30, 2022 [8 favorites]

There might be an element of family hierarchy at play here, if you or your wife are the oldest or most outwardly successful of the siblings (and yes, perhaps whitest). As a result, the siblings and other family members, however subconsciously, are giving you high status in the family. If one of them jumped up and paid, that would in fact be tremendously disrespectful.

If this is the case, they are probably also showing you all sorts of deference that you may not have noticed.

So... consider that you might be the accidental "godfather" in this family. I am offering this by way of a diagnostic insight, though I don't really know how you can bow out of that position or change the dynamic.

I guess one way is to identify the next in status, and ask them beforehand if they'd like to "host" the meal. Or do a few fly-bys, where you stop by for a drink or a snack and leave before the check comes, just to get people into the habit.
posted by dum spiro spero at 9:15 AM on December 30, 2022 [2 favorites]

Unless someone said “I/we want to take you out to dinner.” I would assume that everyone is splitting it. I think that might be why it seems awkward to try to figure out how to say it. I would guess that, even though you have regularly paid the whole bill in the past, most of the other people would not assume you would always do this. I suppose some phrasing like “meet up for dinner” would make it extra clear you are not planning to “take them out.”
posted by snofoam at 9:19 AM on December 30, 2022 [6 favorites]

Trying to split the check when the bill comes can lead to all kinds of awkwardness, as some people will want to split equally (despite very unequal orders) and others are trying to do math to figure out how much they owe. It can also result in people feeling tense during the meal because they don't know if they're expected to pay their own way or might, as you have, end up paying for everyone. For that reason, I follow the advice above to ask for separate checks at the beginning of the meal. I have never had a server say no or suggest in any way that it's an imposition (not saying that can't happen, just that in the US, I've never experienced it). As soon as the server shows up, you just say, "May we have separate checks please?"

As for the invitation itself, if you're all arriving on your own, I'd suggest, "Would you like to meet us for dinner at Restaurant?" If you're traveling together, try "M and I are going to dinner at Restaurant. Would you like to come along?" If these are people you see regularly and you always ask for separate checks, they will eventually figure out that you're not offering to treat them.

Also, it sounds like your wife is the best person to talk to about the cultural issues - you haven't been specific about the culture, so even people who might be knowledgeable about your particular cultural issues won't know for sure. Maybe you've already talked to her in depth about her concerns about stinginess, but if you haven't, that might be worthwhile. It could spring from all kinds of things, some highly personal, such as childhood memories of everyone talking about Uncle Stingy behind his back.
posted by FencingGal at 9:23 AM on December 30, 2022 [3 favorites]

Step 1: Make your intentions clear during the "invitation" phase, perhaps using any of the suggestions above.

Step 2: Look at the bill when it comes and pay your portion in cash. Just pull exactly what you want to pay out of your wallet, put it in the center of the table, and say "this is for Mrs. Nandaro and me." This requires your figuring out in advance the highest amount you might need to contribute, and having a good assortment of 20s, 10s, 5s, and 1s (50s? 100s?), so you don't have to ask for change. You can even get up and go to the washroom after you've done this. Your part is done!

Step 3: I would keep your portion of the tip separate (and have exact denominations for it as well), so you can leave it in front of you and wife separately. Tips can often get lost in check sharing.
posted by happy_cat at 9:28 AM on December 30, 2022 [2 favorites]

simple: let's get food; dutch treat.
posted by j_curiouser at 9:29 AM on December 30, 2022 [2 favorites]

I'm with phunniemee but I'll just share that our own solution was to stop asking people out to restaurants unless we could afford to foot the whole bill.

We've developed a whole bunch of other things to invite friends to that I hope makes up for it (like each year we spend the equivalent on one meal for 5 on a membership to the art gallery that lets us bring in guests, picnics, dessert and coffee meet ups, mini golf, festivals, readings, 'cheap but great' places that don't serve alcohol, breakfasts out, and so on). Some things we thought wouldn't fly with The Grandparents have actually been a blast.

This is very much a life stage (and culture) thing. In my 20s, it was nothing to split bills. But now, especially with family, we're often inviting people for whom the meal might be tough, especially if they are paying daycare bills etc.
posted by warriorqueen at 9:42 AM on December 30, 2022 [5 favorites]

When you ask people out for dinner, when discussing the restaurant you are going to, make sure to ask if everyone is okay with the restaurant's price point. You can also indicate at this point your own comfort level.

"Hey x, would you like to join us for dinner? We were thinking of x restaurant, what do you think? We were thinking it might be fun to splurge a little, but we could also find somewhere more budget-friendly as an option since maybe like us, you overspent over the holidays. What do you think?". (I am sure you can find a better way to say this. I am just trying to give an example of how you can include budget in your invitation).

THEN, when you get to the restaurant you ask for separate bills. Honestly, separate bills is so standard within my social circle that I wouldn't blink an eye at saying it or hearing it.
posted by nanook at 9:45 AM on December 30, 2022 [4 favorites]

N’thing the “can we get separate checks?” to the server. Honestly most places I go with other people who aren’t my partner, the server usually asks.

I am interested in your comment that, even when you agree to split in advance, you find it hard to sit in the moment the check comes.

This is something I have struggled with. Feeling like if someone is going to pay it has to be me. My therapist helped me reframe it as a matter of respect. People want to pay their share. And to jump in and always pay is taking that right away from them. They are grownups who can and should be trusted to cover their part. Heck and even sometimes cover you too.

Whenever I visit my parents, my dad takes my daughter and i to cracker barrel for breakfast and I have finally started letting him cover it, even tho it means I have to go “browse the shop” while he pays because I have a still hard time sitting with the anxiety. But it’s worth it.

All of this is to say that the key might be less about deciding how to manage everyone’s feelings and awkwardness at bill time and more just sitting with the weird feelings and trusting that everyone will be okay.
posted by missjenny at 10:16 AM on December 30, 2022 [5 favorites]

One thing that has helped is knowing (and saying) at the time of the invite -- "this place splits checks" or "this place doesn't split checks, I can cover us all and you can venmo me/get us next time/whatever?"
posted by sm1tten at 10:28 AM on December 30, 2022

Best answer: I could use suggestions on how to agree and communicate on “going Dutch” before, during and after in these situations with dignity and grace .

1. Before: I was looking at reviews and thinking of booking Pigalle, which Trip Advisor suggests would be around $100 per couple excluding drinks. Is that okay to go ahead with or do you have someplace else in mind?

2. During: This menu looks amazing, do you want to ask for separate checks or would you rather just divvy up at the end?

3. After: Here's my Venmo for whenever you get to it; do you need a copy of the bill?

All of the above is perfectly hospitable. I do want to suggest that you come to an agreement with your wife, though. That may be fine for your family and friends or colleagues, but on occasions when you two are taking your wife's family out and the expectation is that you two will pick up the bill, maybe that is something you can both agree you'll do.
posted by DarlingBri at 10:48 AM on December 30, 2022 [4 favorites]

I’m Asian and I “fight” over checks all the time with my cousins. We all sort of have an internal “ledger” and balance it each time. So I just let someone “win” if I remember paying the last time.

One thing my partner and I started to do with family was having a routine get-together and set some ground rules there. So with my parents I led the convo ahead of time and said let’s try to do a meal once a month and we can split since we’re doing it so frequently. Then I just asked for split checks and it became a norm with us. With my partner’s parents, we had the conversation at a meal where we said we’ll take this one but you do the next. And then my partner reminded them the next time we were meeting and they were totally fine picking up the tab, and now we just alternate.
posted by inevitability at 12:12 PM on December 30, 2022 [3 favorites]

I’m really confused by the assumption that if you suggest going out to dinner with other couples, they’ll think you’ll be paying for them and then awkwardly sit there until you do it! Is this an American thing? I’ve never once thought that going out to dinner with other people meant they’d be covering my bill (maybe a date but even then…).

The standard thing where I’m from (Australia) is that everyone pays for themselves in one shape or form whether it’s splitting the bill evenly or paying for your meal exactly.
posted by Jubey at 7:41 AM on December 31, 2022 [2 favorites]

It sounds to me like the fact that it’s mostly family is making a difference. My (American) experience is that unrelated couples absolutely make assumptions of paying their own way, but with families, comparative ages and family hierarchy stuff comes into play, and there ends up being a dynamic where one family ends up always paying. I’m the oldest sibling and cousin and everyone involved including me assumes I’m paying for any outing that’s just in our generation. It feels like my role and I’m absolutely fine with it and see it as a pleasure to do something nice for my younger sibs/cousins since I’ve had several more years to get financially comfortable enough to be able to treat people. But if I weren’t, it would definitely take an awkward conversation to break that family dynamic.

I think probably it just has to be something as straightforward as “we’d love to see you but we’re trying to rein in our restaurant budget so we can only pay our own way this time, knowing that, would you still like to go out to dinner or shall we pick something else to do together?”

This only works well if your wife is on board, of course, so you’ll probably need to come up with an agreement there before tackling the family members.
posted by Stacey at 8:31 AM on December 31, 2022 [3 favorites]

Sounds like the bigger issue here is that you feel you're being taken advantage of. If this is the case, no need to overcomplicate the solution. There is no problem with asking people to join you for dinner and adding, "we can either split the check or do separate checks." Trying to put this slyly could lead to "confusion" and awkwardness at the time of paying, even if it's feigned awkwardness (especially if you always end up paying).
posted by Unsomnambulist at 12:16 PM on December 31, 2022

Is it your wife's expectation that the two of you *should* be taking care of the bill in most instances? And when these dinners are planned, who is doing the inviting?

If others are inviting you, then I think it's appropriate to ask at the start of the meal whether we will be doing separate checks or splitting the bill at the end of the meal? Your server will appreciate knowing this ahead of time, and it makes things much less awkward at the end of the meal. You can take on the role of polite intermediary between the table and the staff, to help smooth this experience for everyone. Often I think people's hesitation isn't about paying their share, but more about wanting someone else to divide the bill and tell them how much to put in. I have been guilty after a few drinks of waiting for someone else to do the math that I can't trust my alcohol-muddled brain to do. Since you've already established that there is a general reluctance in the group, you can get ahead of it by assuming the role of table communicator.

If you are doing the inviting, then I agree with others that you should refrain from inviting people to a restaurant that is out of their price range and you should give people a sense of the restaurant price range as $X per head, or at least ask if $X-Y price range is OK, so that people are forewarned about your expectations. I have had friends who often set up dinners at places a little out of my price range, and while I would never accept an invitation without expecting to pay, it can be socially awkward to refuse an invitation, and especially where family hierarchies are involved, it's more common that the older, senior, or most successful sibling/uncle/cousin might "treat".

I think the "we'll pay this time and you can pay next time" reciprocation only works for 2 couples/parties. Otherwise it's too hard for people to keep track of.
posted by amusebuche at 8:49 PM on December 31, 2022 [1 favorite]

I’m in Europe and if you use the word “invite” it means you are offering to pay, so I try to make sure to say meet for lunch, or have dinner together…
posted by catspajammies at 5:27 AM on January 1, 2023 [2 favorites]

So I think part of the problem that comes in with it being America is that there is no unified culture and everyone is coming to it separately. So it’s not necessarily normative that unrelated couples split, and it’s also not necessarily normative that they don’t.

Another difficulty is that socially in some of these circles, suggesting splitting creates somewhat of a social pressure on the other party to say “no, we will treat” that I personally haven’t found a way to get around.

I would suggest pre negotiating this before the moment of the invitation by discussing how you handle dining out in a non invitation space where stakes seem low.
posted by corb at 8:43 PM on January 4, 2023