ELI5: Buying an EV in 2022.
June 5, 2022 4:55 PM Subscribe
I've made it to my mid-30s without having to own a car. Now I need one, and I have *no* *idea* what I'm doing. Bonus points: I would like it to be fully electric.
I'm overwhelmed by the amount of information out there about cars. I'm licensed and have driven other folks' cars before, but I really dislike driving and have lived in major cities with public transit throughout my adult life. Unfortunately, I'm moving to the suburbs and will be literally housebound without one.
In no particular order, here are my questions:
-I'm looking for a non-fancy commuter EV, absolutely maximally safe. There's a built-in charger where I'm moving, so that won't be an issue. I've heard Nissan Leaves recommended, but they're 4/5 stars on the crash test ratings I'm finding. Can I do better?
-Where would I go to purchase said car? Is Carvana real...? I'm also told one can lease cars, rather than buying them outright. Is that a good idea for an EV?
-I gather that buying a car during the pandemic, and perhaps buying an EV during gas price gouging, is going to be extra expensive. Are there ways to mitigate this? Unfortunately I'm the stereotypical feminine ciswoman walking into a dealership with no idea what I'm doing. Are there known ways to go about finding a trustworthy seller?
-Anything else I should know?
I know all of these questions are exceedingly basic - I promise I've googled, but any slightly more filtered information would be most welcome. Thanks!
I'm overwhelmed by the amount of information out there about cars. I'm licensed and have driven other folks' cars before, but I really dislike driving and have lived in major cities with public transit throughout my adult life. Unfortunately, I'm moving to the suburbs and will be literally housebound without one.
In no particular order, here are my questions:
-I'm looking for a non-fancy commuter EV, absolutely maximally safe. There's a built-in charger where I'm moving, so that won't be an issue. I've heard Nissan Leaves recommended, but they're 4/5 stars on the crash test ratings I'm finding. Can I do better?
-Where would I go to purchase said car? Is Carvana real...? I'm also told one can lease cars, rather than buying them outright. Is that a good idea for an EV?
-I gather that buying a car during the pandemic, and perhaps buying an EV during gas price gouging, is going to be extra expensive. Are there ways to mitigate this? Unfortunately I'm the stereotypical feminine ciswoman walking into a dealership with no idea what I'm doing. Are there known ways to go about finding a trustworthy seller?
-Anything else I should know?
I know all of these questions are exceedingly basic - I promise I've googled, but any slightly more filtered information would be most welcome. Thanks!
The Chevy Bolt actually just got a price cut. It's a combination of terrible PR around the battery recall (spontaneous fires!) and being based on the last-generation EV platform which reduced demand for this specific vehicle.
I think the main complaint about the Bolt is its slow charging speed (50kW), which makes it fine as a commuter car but lacking if you're on a road trip and need to charge on the road.
posted by meowzilla at 5:32 PM on June 5, 2022 [2 favorites]
I think the main complaint about the Bolt is its slow charging speed (50kW), which makes it fine as a commuter car but lacking if you're on a road trip and need to charge on the road.
posted by meowzilla at 5:32 PM on June 5, 2022 [2 favorites]
This is such a tough time to buy a car. I used to recommend looking at used Leafs as they depreciated rapidly due to the big improvements in new models, but nowadays the prices for used are through the roof! Based on what I see on craigslist right now, I could sell my 2015 Leaf, purchased used in 2018, for more than I originally paid for it!
Anyway, I love the Leaf, gets me everywhere in town, basically zero maintenance.
posted by rouftop at 5:34 PM on June 5, 2022 [3 favorites]
Anyway, I love the Leaf, gets me everywhere in town, basically zero maintenance.
posted by rouftop at 5:34 PM on June 5, 2022 [3 favorites]
I love my Chevy Bolt. It is a simple, no-nonsense, four door car. It has fine safety ratings. It gets 200 miles on a charge, which is fine for our purposes. It is wonderfully responsive and is just really fun to drive. It requires zero maintenance.
We decided to lease the Bolt because we have a lot of carnertia, and tend to hold onto cars longer than we should. So in a year, we'll be forced to make an active decision: keep the Bolt, or return and buy something else. The finances of leasing and buying tend to be the same -- the difference being who assumes the risk/benefit of any deviation from the projected value at the end of 3 years.
Good luck, and thanks for going all electric.
posted by Winnie the Proust at 6:01 PM on June 5, 2022 [1 favorite]
We decided to lease the Bolt because we have a lot of carnertia, and tend to hold onto cars longer than we should. So in a year, we'll be forced to make an active decision: keep the Bolt, or return and buy something else. The finances of leasing and buying tend to be the same -- the difference being who assumes the risk/benefit of any deviation from the projected value at the end of 3 years.
Good luck, and thanks for going all electric.
posted by Winnie the Proust at 6:01 PM on June 5, 2022 [1 favorite]
I also have a Bolt, a 2022 EUV model. It is, without question, the coolest thing I've ever driven. Nearly all of my driving is around town, so the range profile (~220 miles, even with the recall-imposed charging cap of 80%) is more than sufficient for me. I'm still waiting for my battery replacement, but it honestly hasn't impacted me too badly. GM footed the bill for a 220V setup in the garage so we could use the L1 charger they included with the vehicle. It's been perfect.
We took a road trip earlier this year which required one fast-charging stop. I'm not sure if I'd take it much further than that, to be honest. The experience has been good enough, though, that when we need to replace our other vehicle (a Honda Pilot), it will absolutely be another fully-electric car. For us there's just no going back.
posted by jquinby at 6:40 PM on June 5, 2022 [1 favorite]
We took a road trip earlier this year which required one fast-charging stop. I'm not sure if I'd take it much further than that, to be honest. The experience has been good enough, though, that when we need to replace our other vehicle (a Honda Pilot), it will absolutely be another fully-electric car. For us there's just no going back.
posted by jquinby at 6:40 PM on June 5, 2022 [1 favorite]
The most important thing to consider for me with an electric car is what does a worst day range look like?
For me, it was a freezing day, where I drop the kids off at school, drive to work, and then get a call that a kid is sick, and have to drive right back to pick them up, with no chance to recharge. I feel like I always need that amount of charge available during the week.
Have that value in mind, especially if you want to buy a used vehicle. All the EV's have rather pleasant communities around them, and you can find detailed advice on how to gauge the battery charge history of a used vehicle.
posted by nickggully at 6:51 PM on June 5, 2022 [3 favorites]
For me, it was a freezing day, where I drop the kids off at school, drive to work, and then get a call that a kid is sick, and have to drive right back to pick them up, with no chance to recharge. I feel like I always need that amount of charge available during the week.
Have that value in mind, especially if you want to buy a used vehicle. All the EV's have rather pleasant communities around them, and you can find detailed advice on how to gauge the battery charge history of a used vehicle.
posted by nickggully at 6:51 PM on June 5, 2022 [3 favorites]
If range is a really serious issue, consider the many plug in hybrids on the market that allow you to go 20-30 miles without turning their internal combustion engine on at all.
posted by nickggully at 6:53 PM on June 5, 2022
posted by nickggully at 6:53 PM on June 5, 2022
This is a pretty open ended question but we're happy with the electric Hyundai Kona we bought used. It has about 250 mile range, charges in about 30 minutes on a fast charger, and is comfortable. Safety standards get stronger every year and my understanding is basically all mid size cars of the last few years have around the same safety for the people in the car? (SUVs are less safe for the people around you). Others can correct me if I have that wrong.
posted by latkes at 7:06 PM on June 5, 2022
posted by latkes at 7:06 PM on June 5, 2022
I've also driven a Bolt for work and it's a bit lower to the ground and with slightly less storage in the back but also otherwise totally satisfactory.
posted by latkes at 7:06 PM on June 5, 2022
posted by latkes at 7:06 PM on June 5, 2022
If you want a maximally safe EV, as StrikeTheViol noted, you want a Tesla. I don't know what your range needs are, but if you went with their lowest cost model 3, they are all as safe as the others. Benefit of buying a Tesla is there are no dealerships, so you never have to worry that you are missing out on a potential deal - the price really is the price, whomever you are, though you can also look to see if they have any used models available. This is an absolutely crappy time to be buying a vehicle, no matter what you buy, so good luck
posted by birdsquared at 7:12 PM on June 5, 2022 [1 favorite]
posted by birdsquared at 7:12 PM on June 5, 2022 [1 favorite]
The Bolt is far cheaper than a Tesla Model 3 and has very good safety ratings (even if they are slightly worse than the Model 3's). Fast charging speed is not as good as other options, but would only be an issue if you take a lot of road trips and the chargers along your route can supply more than 50Kw (many cannot). The Kona is another option that has a little more room and significantly better fast charging, but costs a little bit more.
The Leaf is not a great deal because it has a significantly shorter range and similarly slow fast charging to the Bolt. Even the upgraded model has worse range than a Kona or Bolt, even though it costs more. The upgraded model does charge faster than a Kona, but I think the additional range is much more important for most people than the slightly faster fast charging (which again only matters if the fast charger you're connected to can supply that much power).
Email all the dealers who could have the car you're interested in, tell them what you want to buy, that you'll be paying cash (if you're financing, best to arrange it separately) and that you're planning to buy the best deal you get from all the dealers you've emailed on whatever date you want the car for. Then you don't have to walk into a dealership and try to negotiate. Unfortunately, right now EVs are in high demand and I suspect you'll be paying full price no matter what you do.
posted by ssg at 8:30 PM on June 5, 2022 [2 favorites]
The Leaf is not a great deal because it has a significantly shorter range and similarly slow fast charging to the Bolt. Even the upgraded model has worse range than a Kona or Bolt, even though it costs more. The upgraded model does charge faster than a Kona, but I think the additional range is much more important for most people than the slightly faster fast charging (which again only matters if the fast charger you're connected to can supply that much power).
Email all the dealers who could have the car you're interested in, tell them what you want to buy, that you'll be paying cash (if you're financing, best to arrange it separately) and that you're planning to buy the best deal you get from all the dealers you've emailed on whatever date you want the car for. Then you don't have to walk into a dealership and try to negotiate. Unfortunately, right now EVs are in high demand and I suspect you'll be paying full price no matter what you do.
posted by ssg at 8:30 PM on June 5, 2022 [2 favorites]
Which EV is right for you is really going to depend a lot on the following:
- what is your budget? There is definitely a premium for EVs and this has been exacerbated by the increase in gas prices globally (largely due to the war in Ukraine). Depending on where you live there are decent incentives. I believe the US has a $7500 rebate and here in Canada we have a $5000 rebate on most models.
- what range do you need? Do you only need short range only (less than 100km per charge) or something longer range? The long range vehicles (typically > 300km) have much larger batteries and cost quite a bit more.
- where do you live? Do you need an AWD or SUV/crossover to handle winter conditions?
- you say there is built-in charging where you are moving to - but what kind of charging is this? If it just a standard 120V Level 1 charger, this can take a very long time to charge a long range vehicle (think days). Short range vehicles are probably fine on Level 1 though. Just to give you an idea, our PHEV takes about 12-14 hours to charge at 120V/10A for 53km range.
- When do you need this vehicle? The market is a bit nuts right now. A lot of the car manufacturers are playing catch-up because of supply-chain shortages. For example, here in Canada right now, you can't even order certain EVs for delivery before 2024. I'm sure it is better in the US, but still something to take into account. Tesla may be more immune to this because of their supply chain, but which EV you end up getting may depend largely on when you will need it. If you are willing to consider second hand you may have more options. If you are feeling unsure about that route, there are mechanics you can take cars for inspections before purchase and you can check the car history (liens, accidents etc..) using various companies for a fee.
good luck!
posted by piyushnz at 9:39 PM on June 5, 2022 [2 favorites]
- what is your budget? There is definitely a premium for EVs and this has been exacerbated by the increase in gas prices globally (largely due to the war in Ukraine). Depending on where you live there are decent incentives. I believe the US has a $7500 rebate and here in Canada we have a $5000 rebate on most models.
- what range do you need? Do you only need short range only (less than 100km per charge) or something longer range? The long range vehicles (typically > 300km) have much larger batteries and cost quite a bit more.
- where do you live? Do you need an AWD or SUV/crossover to handle winter conditions?
- you say there is built-in charging where you are moving to - but what kind of charging is this? If it just a standard 120V Level 1 charger, this can take a very long time to charge a long range vehicle (think days). Short range vehicles are probably fine on Level 1 though. Just to give you an idea, our PHEV takes about 12-14 hours to charge at 120V/10A for 53km range.
- When do you need this vehicle? The market is a bit nuts right now. A lot of the car manufacturers are playing catch-up because of supply-chain shortages. For example, here in Canada right now, you can't even order certain EVs for delivery before 2024. I'm sure it is better in the US, but still something to take into account. Tesla may be more immune to this because of their supply chain, but which EV you end up getting may depend largely on when you will need it. If you are willing to consider second hand you may have more options. If you are feeling unsure about that route, there are mechanics you can take cars for inspections before purchase and you can check the car history (liens, accidents etc..) using various companies for a fee.
good luck!
posted by piyushnz at 9:39 PM on June 5, 2022 [2 favorites]
Yeah, this would be much easier to answer meaningfully if we would know in which country you are. Prices and availability of cars are not at all the same internationally.
posted by Too-Ticky at 3:12 AM on June 6, 2022
posted by Too-Ticky at 3:12 AM on June 6, 2022
I don't own one but I'm 100% onboard with new Chevy Bolt. It's a good deal. And they've been through hell with LG on the battery issue. It's addressed and you can take advantage of the PR hit meaning slightly less demand than for most other similar things on the market. They may even offer a decent lease deal.
Used Nissan Leaf used to be a standard answer and they used to be cheap. They aren't anymore. Anything cheap has a looming battery pack replacement. For someone who just wants a working EV for commuting and local trips in suburbia and doesn't care about having the best performance specs or fast charging, a Bolt at the new price (which you might actually stand a chance of paying, whereas so many cars are now marked up ABOVE MSRP) is an easy call.
posted by spitbull at 5:40 AM on June 6, 2022
Used Nissan Leaf used to be a standard answer and they used to be cheap. They aren't anymore. Anything cheap has a looming battery pack replacement. For someone who just wants a working EV for commuting and local trips in suburbia and doesn't care about having the best performance specs or fast charging, a Bolt at the new price (which you might actually stand a chance of paying, whereas so many cars are now marked up ABOVE MSRP) is an easy call.
posted by spitbull at 5:40 AM on June 6, 2022
One thing to consider - there are 3 or 4 apps out there that will let you find charging stations for their particular networks: ChargePoint, EVGo, Electrify America, Blink, etc. As you might expect, they don't show competing network stations.
PlugShare, though, is crowdsourced and I've found it to be pretty complete and up-to-date. It even shows the free chargers set up by municipalities, utilities, and so on. Whichever EV you land on, it's good to know where the chargers are in a pinch, even if you're charging overnight at home most of the time.
If you are interested in taking road trips, A Better Route Planner seems to be the go-to. You set up your car in the app, and it'll account for terrain and everything else as it plots a course and determines where you'll need to stop for a charge (and for how long). If you really want to nerd out (and readers, I confess that I did), ABRP will sync with a BLE OBD2 dongle and read real-time consumption as you're driving, then adjust itself accordingly.
posted by jquinby at 5:51 AM on June 6, 2022 [1 favorite]
PlugShare, though, is crowdsourced and I've found it to be pretty complete and up-to-date. It even shows the free chargers set up by municipalities, utilities, and so on. Whichever EV you land on, it's good to know where the chargers are in a pinch, even if you're charging overnight at home most of the time.
If you are interested in taking road trips, A Better Route Planner seems to be the go-to. You set up your car in the app, and it'll account for terrain and everything else as it plots a course and determines where you'll need to stop for a charge (and for how long). If you really want to nerd out (and readers, I confess that I did), ABRP will sync with a BLE OBD2 dongle and read real-time consumption as you're driving, then adjust itself accordingly.
posted by jquinby at 5:51 AM on June 6, 2022 [1 favorite]
+1 for the Bolt. The Tesla's better, sure, but is it $20k better?
The Leaf "Plus" has more range (225-ish) miles. I think it still qualifies for the federal tax credit, so if you pay a lot of federal taxes the "plus" version of the Leaf and the Bolt are about the same price at the end of the day.
The Kia EV6 and Hyundai Ioniq 5 also qualify and they are "in between" options - decent range available, nice cars.
If it were me, I'd go for the Bolt. Tesla has the charging network, the skosh of safety, the coolness factor, etc. I wouldn't pay the extra $20k (or more), but it might be worth it to you.
posted by everythings_interrelated at 8:07 AM on June 6, 2022
The Leaf "Plus" has more range (225-ish) miles. I think it still qualifies for the federal tax credit, so if you pay a lot of federal taxes the "plus" version of the Leaf and the Bolt are about the same price at the end of the day.
The Kia EV6 and Hyundai Ioniq 5 also qualify and they are "in between" options - decent range available, nice cars.
If it were me, I'd go for the Bolt. Tesla has the charging network, the skosh of safety, the coolness factor, etc. I wouldn't pay the extra $20k (or more), but it might be worth it to you.
posted by everythings_interrelated at 8:07 AM on June 6, 2022
Response by poster: Sorry, forgot to specify I'm in the USA. Thanks for the answers so far, everyone!
posted by fast ein Maedchen at 8:14 AM on June 6, 2022 [1 favorite]
posted by fast ein Maedchen at 8:14 AM on June 6, 2022 [1 favorite]
2022 Bolt EUV owner here. Got it because it was the second smallest electric of the ~250 mile range class cars (the smallest being the straight-up Bolt) available later last year. And because it wasn't a Tesla (concerns about vehicle quality and personality). From riding in friends' Tesla's it feels like the Tesla is a car designed by software people and the Bolt is a car designed by hardware people (overly complex UI). But, battery issues aside (still waiting on the replacement), we're mostly happy with it.
And friends with Teslas tend to keep their cars less time than we plan on keeping the Bolt, and have reported a bunch of quality issues that mostly have gotten fixed (from having the car spend the first 3 months in the paint shop getting a bad paint job fixed, to the current backup camera recall), but it reinforces that software people vs hardware people vibe.
I'm mostly just chiming in for an argument against a hybrid. We had an early BMW i3 REX that we bought as a lease return, and the range extender came in handy a few times, but mostly it was more complexity and weight to drag around and maintain. For the few road trips in your car's lifecycle that you can't plan around a charging stop, rent something.
We live in the north San Francisco Bay area, and 65-85 miles all electric on the i3 was enough to get us to events, but not to and from. It was fine for local driving. The 250 miles lets us get to Sacramento and back, and if we start to look at longer trips than that we're in the "maybe we should take the train, or fly" territory.
posted by straw at 8:15 AM on June 6, 2022
And friends with Teslas tend to keep their cars less time than we plan on keeping the Bolt, and have reported a bunch of quality issues that mostly have gotten fixed (from having the car spend the first 3 months in the paint shop getting a bad paint job fixed, to the current backup camera recall), but it reinforces that software people vs hardware people vibe.
I'm mostly just chiming in for an argument against a hybrid. We had an early BMW i3 REX that we bought as a lease return, and the range extender came in handy a few times, but mostly it was more complexity and weight to drag around and maintain. For the few road trips in your car's lifecycle that you can't plan around a charging stop, rent something.
We live in the north San Francisco Bay area, and 65-85 miles all electric on the i3 was enough to get us to events, but not to and from. It was fine for local driving. The 250 miles lets us get to Sacramento and back, and if we start to look at longer trips than that we're in the "maybe we should take the train, or fly" territory.
posted by straw at 8:15 AM on June 6, 2022
I think the widely available cars are going to be Teslas, Bolts, and Leafs. Most other things are going for above list prices right now, and are pretty hard to find anyway. I hear the Kona's great, but I've not driven one. For most use cases a Bolt is a really great car, but test drive one if you can to make sure you're ok with the oddly narrow front seats. I believe the EUV version's are better.
IMO, the Tesla is $20k better than the Bolt, but it may well be better on axes you don't care about. I got mine in midlife-crisis-red the year I turned 40, and I was a sportbike guy before I got old, so I wanted the ridiculous acceleration. I also wanted an EV I could roadtrip (in hindsight for probably entitled, "but IIII want to live in the future nooooow!" reasons), so there were no other great options. It was also cheaper when I bought it than they are now. I've had a couple of issues that were taken care of under warranty, but by far the worst thing about owning it is El*n's Twitter account.
If there's any chance that you'll need to fast charge ever, I'd go with a Bolt over a Leaf. The CHAdeMO charger standard is now only used by the Leaf, and those are less common than the CCS chargers the Bolt uses, and getting rarer. By most accounts, Electrify America are doing a good job of getting CCS chargers installed, and keeping them working. It's not as good as the supercharger network, but it is improving.
posted by rhamphorhynchus at 7:24 AM on June 8, 2022
IMO, the Tesla is $20k better than the Bolt, but it may well be better on axes you don't care about. I got mine in midlife-crisis-red the year I turned 40, and I was a sportbike guy before I got old, so I wanted the ridiculous acceleration. I also wanted an EV I could roadtrip (in hindsight for probably entitled, "but IIII want to live in the future nooooow!" reasons), so there were no other great options. It was also cheaper when I bought it than they are now. I've had a couple of issues that were taken care of under warranty, but by far the worst thing about owning it is El*n's Twitter account.
If there's any chance that you'll need to fast charge ever, I'd go with a Bolt over a Leaf. The CHAdeMO charger standard is now only used by the Leaf, and those are less common than the CCS chargers the Bolt uses, and getting rarer. By most accounts, Electrify America are doing a good job of getting CCS chargers installed, and keeping them working. It's not as good as the supercharger network, but it is improving.
posted by rhamphorhynchus at 7:24 AM on June 8, 2022
This thread is closed to new comments.
For all intents and purposes as far as the vast majority of people are concerned, however, the Nissan Leaf is fine, and much less expensive.
posted by StrikeTheViol at 5:15 PM on June 5, 2022 [1 favorite]