Multitasking distresses me. What's up with my brain?
February 17, 2022 5:44 AM Subscribe
I am a grad student. My job has a list of meetings (4-5 per week) that I am supposed to attend every week in addition to my lab work. I've missed two of these meetings over the last week because it DISTRESSES ME when I am focused on one task and then my focus is interrupted. It is difficult and stressful, so much so that I will angrily turn off my phone alarm instead of even looking at what it's reminding me to do in 10 minutes. Folks, what is up with my brain?
I am not really asking for helpful tips to fix this. Entire libraries have been written about that. What I am asking for is a potential explanation for why my mind experiences THIS MUCH STRESS over multitasking. You are not my mental health professional (I do have one who helps me with other stuff), but does this sound consistent with some type of neurodiversity? It doesn't seem like interrupting my lab work for a daily Zoom meeting should make me this miserable, but it really does. Like, this one problem is so bad that it's causing me to hate my job and my research. And I *like* my research!
(Also, this is not a recent development. Multitasking has been stressful for me for a very long time, it's just that it has gotten worse during grad school because I have to do so much of it, like every single day.)
I am not really asking for helpful tips to fix this. Entire libraries have been written about that. What I am asking for is a potential explanation for why my mind experiences THIS MUCH STRESS over multitasking. You are not my mental health professional (I do have one who helps me with other stuff), but does this sound consistent with some type of neurodiversity? It doesn't seem like interrupting my lab work for a daily Zoom meeting should make me this miserable, but it really does. Like, this one problem is so bad that it's causing me to hate my job and my research. And I *like* my research!
(Also, this is not a recent development. Multitasking has been stressful for me for a very long time, it's just that it has gotten worse during grad school because I have to do so much of it, like every single day.)
I'm not entirely sure what you are asking for since you already have a mental health professional who, I hope, will have far greater insight into your personality than anybody on this website, but here are my guesses as a someone who is neither a, nor your, mental health professional:
1. Difficulty switching tasks is a symptom of ADD, ADHD, Autism, and potentially other disabilities. It is possible that you fit one or more of these definitions.
2. As a grad student, it is possible that your lab work has become something of great importance to you, such that you resent the interruption itself, the friction that you experience due to the interruption, or both, in a deeper way than you may have resented the ordinary friction of switching tasks in earlier phases of your life.
3. It's possible that being in your state of focus is an emotional respite for you from, well, everything else that's going on, and that you resent having to be pulled back into the real world.
4. Anecdotally and in reporting, a lot of people are experiencing some flavor of executive functioning disorder or onset attention deficit due to, again, everything else that's going on, and I don't believe that folks who already had some form of these things are having an easier go of it than folks who were not experiencing them. So whatever base-level you might have been at a few years ago, in terms of having difficulty task-switching, regaining focus after an interruption, &c., it's possible that those difficulties have become more significant recently.
I hope you will talk to your mental health professional about these things, not because there is anything wrong with you but because it can be helpful to know and to have strategies for dealing with these things.
posted by gauche at 6:09 AM on February 17, 2022 [12 favorites]
1. Difficulty switching tasks is a symptom of ADD, ADHD, Autism, and potentially other disabilities. It is possible that you fit one or more of these definitions.
2. As a grad student, it is possible that your lab work has become something of great importance to you, such that you resent the interruption itself, the friction that you experience due to the interruption, or both, in a deeper way than you may have resented the ordinary friction of switching tasks in earlier phases of your life.
3. It's possible that being in your state of focus is an emotional respite for you from, well, everything else that's going on, and that you resent having to be pulled back into the real world.
4. Anecdotally and in reporting, a lot of people are experiencing some flavor of executive functioning disorder or onset attention deficit due to, again, everything else that's going on, and I don't believe that folks who already had some form of these things are having an easier go of it than folks who were not experiencing them. So whatever base-level you might have been at a few years ago, in terms of having difficulty task-switching, regaining focus after an interruption, &c., it's possible that those difficulties have become more significant recently.
I hope you will talk to your mental health professional about these things, not because there is anything wrong with you but because it can be helpful to know and to have strategies for dealing with these things.
posted by gauche at 6:09 AM on February 17, 2022 [12 favorites]
1. To a certain extent this is normal — getting interrupted in the middle of a task is disruptive to anyone, and most people greatly underestimate how disruptive it is.
2. But, I would also say this is consistent with ADHD. As someone with ADHD I find it very difficult to get into a “flow” state of focused work, and very frustrating to be pulled out of that state once I get there. On its own this doesn’t define ADHD but it’s worth investigating whether you identify with any other adult ADHD symptoms.
posted by mekily at 6:13 AM on February 17, 2022 [8 favorites]
2. But, I would also say this is consistent with ADHD. As someone with ADHD I find it very difficult to get into a “flow” state of focused work, and very frustrating to be pulled out of that state once I get there. On its own this doesn’t define ADHD but it’s worth investigating whether you identify with any other adult ADHD symptoms.
posted by mekily at 6:13 AM on February 17, 2022 [8 favorites]
I can't speak to neurodiversity and reasons. But on a practical level your day is going to consist of a range of different activities. Some you'll enjoy more and find more absorbing than others. But functioning adults will have a range of things they need to do in a day.
So perhaps play with how your transitions work. If a 10 min timer isn't enough to allow you to transition from one segment to the next perhaps you need to organize your day differently and allow more time for the transitions between segments.
Perhaps not all transitions require the same amount of time. Perhaps going from lab work to other things needs a longer gap, perhaps also encompassing a break to grab a drink or whatever? Perhaps going from admin work to work you love needs less of a break. Experiment with that and see if you hit on a winning formula.
posted by koahiatamadl at 6:18 AM on February 17, 2022 [3 favorites]
So perhaps play with how your transitions work. If a 10 min timer isn't enough to allow you to transition from one segment to the next perhaps you need to organize your day differently and allow more time for the transitions between segments.
Perhaps not all transitions require the same amount of time. Perhaps going from lab work to other things needs a longer gap, perhaps also encompassing a break to grab a drink or whatever? Perhaps going from admin work to work you love needs less of a break. Experiment with that and see if you hit on a winning formula.
posted by koahiatamadl at 6:18 AM on February 17, 2022 [3 favorites]
I've never loved being interrupted, but I really truly hate it on a whole new level when I am already stressed out and tired. I hear that grad school can involve a wee bit of those things.
posted by february at 6:20 AM on February 17, 2022 [8 favorites]
posted by february at 6:20 AM on February 17, 2022 [8 favorites]
I'm not an expert in psychology, but I do have this same issue and I think it's important to emphasize that this isn't a pathology in itself. In my case, it's a trait that I formerly atempted to resist--without success, and to my detriment--for a very long time. Instead, it's now something that I plan for and accomodate as much as possible with how I structure my workflow. This means blocking out time so that, rather than switching gears constantly, I have multi-hour blocks dedicated to specific tasks (including some of those blocks structured as "time to accept that I will be frazzled because a lot of unstructured requests will come my way every day").
I work better in deep, detailed dives into a given project at once. "Multitasking" takes me out of this strength of mine--the ability for deep, creative, valuable focus--and leaves me frayed, forgetful, panicked, and the work quality suffers. "Neurodiversity" is a catchall term that I think captures perfectly how this is just how the mind and attention works for some of us. I make sure my employer is aware of this--I'm happy to handle a bunch of rapidly changing material, but I'm going to need access to staff to whom I can delegate components of that work, and an editor to refine it, because the strengths you pay me for require that I have access to structured time for focusing on the real work. It's been a long road to get here, but it's been rewarding to learn this about myself. I recognize that this is a hard thing to seek agency over as a student or in your early career, but asserting this kind of self-awareness to your colleagues and employers is not a bad idea. See what you can do to improve the circumstances until they better resemble a work flow that doesn't leave you feeling so distressed.
posted by late afternoon dreaming hotel at 6:28 AM on February 17, 2022 [7 favorites]
I work better in deep, detailed dives into a given project at once. "Multitasking" takes me out of this strength of mine--the ability for deep, creative, valuable focus--and leaves me frayed, forgetful, panicked, and the work quality suffers. "Neurodiversity" is a catchall term that I think captures perfectly how this is just how the mind and attention works for some of us. I make sure my employer is aware of this--I'm happy to handle a bunch of rapidly changing material, but I'm going to need access to staff to whom I can delegate components of that work, and an editor to refine it, because the strengths you pay me for require that I have access to structured time for focusing on the real work. It's been a long road to get here, but it's been rewarding to learn this about myself. I recognize that this is a hard thing to seek agency over as a student or in your early career, but asserting this kind of self-awareness to your colleagues and employers is not a bad idea. See what you can do to improve the circumstances until they better resemble a work flow that doesn't leave you feeling so distressed.
posted by late afternoon dreaming hotel at 6:28 AM on February 17, 2022 [7 favorites]
I don't have a diagnosis, but a professional has pointed me firmly in the direction of autism, and I often react with distress and/or anger to computer and phone alerts when I'm busy doing something. That said, I've discovered that if the interruption is subtle (silent, and signalled with an icon change rather than a popup), I usually handle it just fine. It's not so much that I hate being interrupted as that I hate being startled.
posted by ManyLeggedCreature at 6:38 AM on February 17, 2022 [3 favorites]
posted by ManyLeggedCreature at 6:38 AM on February 17, 2022 [3 favorites]
Doing difficult intellectual work involves holding a lot of details in your brain at once. Every time you switch to a different task, and then switch back, you lose some of those details and the have to load them back in. You have limited time to spend concentrating on the work that interests you, and you're being forced to waste a significant portion of that time just running in place.
I'm no expert, I have no idea what other individual factors might contribute, but I think it's perfectly 100% normal for that process to be painful.
I may be in a minority, but I personally think 4-5 Zoom meetings a week is unreasonable for someone in your situation.
Sorry, I know you're not asking for tips, but I'd be thinking hard about how to unload and/or consolidate some of those meetings.
posted by bfields at 6:42 AM on February 17, 2022 [4 favorites]
I'm no expert, I have no idea what other individual factors might contribute, but I think it's perfectly 100% normal for that process to be painful.
I may be in a minority, but I personally think 4-5 Zoom meetings a week is unreasonable for someone in your situation.
Sorry, I know you're not asking for tips, but I'd be thinking hard about how to unload and/or consolidate some of those meetings.
posted by bfields at 6:42 AM on February 17, 2022 [4 favorites]
It is difficult and stressful, so much so that I will angrily turn off my phone alarm instead of even looking at what it's reminding me to do in 10 minutes. Folks, what is up with my brain?
I'm just going to throw out some thoughts randomly and I hope they are helpful to you.
1. The times I have most felt like what you're describing is after a series of months when I was either not getting enough sleep, not getting enough time for what I refer to as "well-filling" activities (activities that bring me either joy or comfort), or both. Once my well is empty, every. demand. sets off that sort of snap feeling of OH MY GOD. So my first question is, does your grad school schedule include some personal time to do things you love on Sundays or whatever time that would be? And are you getting enough sleep and eating good food?
2. For me this also can be a control issue around time.
If the meetings to which I am summoned feel less important or if they really are at a bad time, that would result in that kind of feeling. For example, I'm most productive really between 10 am-3 or 4 pm and an ideal schedule for me is exercise in the morning, a shower, a late-ish start at my desk around 9:45, and then no meetings until 3 pm, at which time I am quite happy to be around other people and take notes. That doesn't mean I get that schedule. In fact, other people usually want meetings out of the way earlier. But I know if someone schedules a daily meeting at 12:30 that kind of blows my day up. For other people, end of the day meetings are THE WORST. So we all flex.
Addendum: I don't know if your meetings are like that but if they are at a particularly bad time, it might be worth asking politely if there's flexibility - you may not be the only person.
3. Part of what it sounds like is going on -- understandably, with so much happening in the world -- is that you are having trouble regulating your emotions that get set off when the meeting alarm comes along. I don't know if this is your first set of "daily meetings that keep me from my work" or an endless group exercise or something but it probably won't be the last.
I was working on a very stressful project where the meetings were frankly hell at one point and this is probably one of the few times I really really was actually able to do this but I would schedule for myself a trip up and down 4 flights of stairs before that meeting, and a coffee run outside the building afterwards, because I knew the whole thing was going to spike my adrenaline. Right now I have a daily stand up that at times feels onerous and I always make a favourite tea to have during it to make it more of a treat-time.
My husband is a meditator and he does deep breaths on the days his day turns into endless meetings.
So if it's just a case of your adrenal glands are shot right now due to, well, Everything, you might want to try to build some elements into your day to help that spike.
Sorry this went to advice but I'm trying to express really that understanding your feelings may indeed help a lot, but it may also be just - feeling them and letting them pass that will give you time to develop that understanding.
posted by warriorqueen at 6:57 AM on February 17, 2022 [3 favorites]
I'm just going to throw out some thoughts randomly and I hope they are helpful to you.
1. The times I have most felt like what you're describing is after a series of months when I was either not getting enough sleep, not getting enough time for what I refer to as "well-filling" activities (activities that bring me either joy or comfort), or both. Once my well is empty, every. demand. sets off that sort of snap feeling of OH MY GOD. So my first question is, does your grad school schedule include some personal time to do things you love on Sundays or whatever time that would be? And are you getting enough sleep and eating good food?
2. For me this also can be a control issue around time.
If the meetings to which I am summoned feel less important or if they really are at a bad time, that would result in that kind of feeling. For example, I'm most productive really between 10 am-3 or 4 pm and an ideal schedule for me is exercise in the morning, a shower, a late-ish start at my desk around 9:45, and then no meetings until 3 pm, at which time I am quite happy to be around other people and take notes. That doesn't mean I get that schedule. In fact, other people usually want meetings out of the way earlier. But I know if someone schedules a daily meeting at 12:30 that kind of blows my day up. For other people, end of the day meetings are THE WORST. So we all flex.
Addendum: I don't know if your meetings are like that but if they are at a particularly bad time, it might be worth asking politely if there's flexibility - you may not be the only person.
3. Part of what it sounds like is going on -- understandably, with so much happening in the world -- is that you are having trouble regulating your emotions that get set off when the meeting alarm comes along. I don't know if this is your first set of "daily meetings that keep me from my work" or an endless group exercise or something but it probably won't be the last.
I was working on a very stressful project where the meetings were frankly hell at one point and this is probably one of the few times I really really was actually able to do this but I would schedule for myself a trip up and down 4 flights of stairs before that meeting, and a coffee run outside the building afterwards, because I knew the whole thing was going to spike my adrenaline. Right now I have a daily stand up that at times feels onerous and I always make a favourite tea to have during it to make it more of a treat-time.
My husband is a meditator and he does deep breaths on the days his day turns into endless meetings.
So if it's just a case of your adrenal glands are shot right now due to, well, Everything, you might want to try to build some elements into your day to help that spike.
Sorry this went to advice but I'm trying to express really that understanding your feelings may indeed help a lot, but it may also be just - feeling them and letting them pass that will give you time to develop that understanding.
posted by warriorqueen at 6:57 AM on February 17, 2022 [3 favorites]
It's because "multitasking" is straight bullshit. OSHA did a study on what the concept did to American business after the first 5-10 years and found that "multitasking" cost American businesses over 5 Billion dollars in losses and caused over 50,000 people to lose their lives (distracted drivers/air traffic controllers, etc).
Humans have one track. We're not going to evolve another anytime soon. When you are distracted from a task it takes a full 15 minutes to get 'back in the groove' as they say. That 'groove' is a trance state and humans spend about 75% of their waking time in one trance or another (your deepest trance state is at the grocery store b/c SOO much information, also FOOD). Time your stuff to end before the fixed-time meetings or start it after. Avoid/refuse multitasking is your best bet. Once you realize it's "bullshit to be avoided at best" you'll find that you're about twice as productive as the people around you jumping from thing to thing like distracted fleas.
posted by sexyrobot at 7:05 AM on February 17, 2022 [12 favorites]
Humans have one track. We're not going to evolve another anytime soon. When you are distracted from a task it takes a full 15 minutes to get 'back in the groove' as they say. That 'groove' is a trance state and humans spend about 75% of their waking time in one trance or another (your deepest trance state is at the grocery store b/c SOO much information, also FOOD). Time your stuff to end before the fixed-time meetings or start it after. Avoid/refuse multitasking is your best bet. Once you realize it's "bullshit to be avoided at best" you'll find that you're about twice as productive as the people around you jumping from thing to thing like distracted fleas.
posted by sexyrobot at 7:05 AM on February 17, 2022 [12 favorites]
An attempt at an alternative explanation instead of making assumptions about neurodiversity:
The only persons who took the liberty of interrupting my childhood Lego binges, reading sprees or drawing marathons were my parents and especially my mom. Mostly this went together with having to stop more or less instantly and consider less pleasurable things to do instead of the thing I already had decided to do. Even though my parents were mostly thoughtful and ok parents, this was something that could strike at any given time: even though I was (and felt) secure in our home, I was never truly safe from being interrupted.
The result: I still get ragey now (at 62) when I'm ripped out of something I decided was worth doing; frustrated and stressed when a given day's schedule is too fragmented; blocked and non-productive when I know I will be interrupted at a scheduled time.
For me personally, this seems to be less about any kind of neurodiversity (as far as I know) but rather about plain old psychology; unprocessed crud that's left over from how I was treated as a child.
No idea whether this speaks to you, but you could consider searching in your memory in that direction (whatever: a sibling regularly interrupting you with what you were doing, household chores intruding, stuff from high school, it could be anything...).
posted by Namlit at 7:18 AM on February 17, 2022 [4 favorites]
The only persons who took the liberty of interrupting my childhood Lego binges, reading sprees or drawing marathons were my parents and especially my mom. Mostly this went together with having to stop more or less instantly and consider less pleasurable things to do instead of the thing I already had decided to do. Even though my parents were mostly thoughtful and ok parents, this was something that could strike at any given time: even though I was (and felt) secure in our home, I was never truly safe from being interrupted.
The result: I still get ragey now (at 62) when I'm ripped out of something I decided was worth doing; frustrated and stressed when a given day's schedule is too fragmented; blocked and non-productive when I know I will be interrupted at a scheduled time.
For me personally, this seems to be less about any kind of neurodiversity (as far as I know) but rather about plain old psychology; unprocessed crud that's left over from how I was treated as a child.
No idea whether this speaks to you, but you could consider searching in your memory in that direction (whatever: a sibling regularly interrupting you with what you were doing, household chores intruding, stuff from high school, it could be anything...).
posted by Namlit at 7:18 AM on February 17, 2022 [4 favorites]
It doesn't seem like interrupting my lab work for a daily Zoom meeting should make me this miserable, but it really does.
For me, with similar experiences, this is a big part of it. The Buddist concept of the "second arrow" applies here. I get upset by the interruption and then I get upset about my reaction, which feels involuntary and unwelcome. It's also sort of like chronic pain, where the pain has created its own neural pathways. The excessive reaction and the feeling that I am wasting time having this reaction drive me nuts.
Sometimes it helps to accept that whatever it is that keeps coming up is really quite annoying and move on. I don't know about you, but I'm finding Zoom meetings themselves extremely stressful by virtue of the format, and you have a lot of them.
posted by BibiRose at 7:37 AM on February 17, 2022 [6 favorites]
For me, with similar experiences, this is a big part of it. The Buddist concept of the "second arrow" applies here. I get upset by the interruption and then I get upset about my reaction, which feels involuntary and unwelcome. It's also sort of like chronic pain, where the pain has created its own neural pathways. The excessive reaction and the feeling that I am wasting time having this reaction drive me nuts.
Sometimes it helps to accept that whatever it is that keeps coming up is really quite annoying and move on. I don't know about you, but I'm finding Zoom meetings themselves extremely stressful by virtue of the format, and you have a lot of them.
posted by BibiRose at 7:37 AM on February 17, 2022 [6 favorites]
I'm autistic and I experience this to some degree.
Here's a link to the AQ-10 autism screening questionnaire [web page with downloadable 1-page pdfs in various languages] used by the NHS, in case you want to "score yourself".
posted by heatherlogan at 7:39 AM on February 17, 2022 [2 favorites]
Here's a link to the AQ-10 autism screening questionnaire [web page with downloadable 1-page pdfs in various languages] used by the NHS, in case you want to "score yourself".
posted by heatherlogan at 7:39 AM on February 17, 2022 [2 favorites]
it DISTRESSES ME when I am focused on one task and then my focus is interrupted. It is difficult and stressful, so much so that I will angrily turn off my phone alarm instead of even looking at what it's reminding me to do in 10 minutes.
Me too. All my life. To the point where pretty much regardless of who was employing me I consistently drifted toward arriving at work as late in the afternoon as they'd tolerate and not leaving until the middle of the night, because FUCK THIS NOISE I HAVE WORK THAT NEEDS DOING, and now I have delayed sleep phase syndrome that's persisted several years into retirement.
Folks, what is up with my brain?
Absolutely appropriate low tolerance for bullshit managerial expectations and a completely reasonable desire to be left the fuck alone to get your complicated and demanding intellectual work done, is my diagnosis.
posted by flabdablet at 7:42 AM on February 17, 2022 [3 favorites]
Me too. All my life. To the point where pretty much regardless of who was employing me I consistently drifted toward arriving at work as late in the afternoon as they'd tolerate and not leaving until the middle of the night, because FUCK THIS NOISE I HAVE WORK THAT NEEDS DOING, and now I have delayed sleep phase syndrome that's persisted several years into retirement.
Folks, what is up with my brain?
Absolutely appropriate low tolerance for bullshit managerial expectations and a completely reasonable desire to be left the fuck alone to get your complicated and demanding intellectual work done, is my diagnosis.
posted by flabdablet at 7:42 AM on February 17, 2022 [3 favorites]
I identify with this question, and not just because we have the same job. I've spent many fruitless hours trying to search the internet for things like "hate interruptions," because the level of emotional response I have at notifications, emails, random questions, Zoom meetings, needing to make a phone call and task-switching is... significantly above average. This has been true both when I was actively doing lab work, and when I'm not. I do great in the meeting/phone call/email/troubleshooting a lab mate's question, but there's a strong pull to avoid them because of how disruptive they are to my work habits and mental state. I suspect it's because if I care at all, I'm basically always trying to be 100% present in whatever I'm doing, so the disruptions take a lot out of me because I'm not multitasking, I'm doing a complete mental 180. Anyway, the more I read things from autistic people on Twitter, the more I suspect I fall somewhere on the spectrum, but I probably don't read that way to people who don't know me well and have no interest in pursuing a diagnosis, only tips from folks whose brains work similarly on how to cope with the overwhelm.
So while I very much get the vehement desire to understand why your brain just cannot deal, I've slowly come to realize that it's a less useful question than "wtf, how can I help my brain deal, this is terrible." In that vein, unsolicited advice follows.
Things that have helped me, in no particular order:
- Getting enough sleep and regular exercise (reduces baseline stress, everything feels less fraught)
- Practicing saying no to things, especially some % of university service requests as a grad student. (I've adopted the phrase "that aligns with my values, but not my current bandwidth," for this.) Maybe not applicable to you.
- NOT trying to work during Zoom meetings. I know, I know — half the grad students on the seminar meeting are running off to pipet something every five minutes. I've been there. I'm not good at it. I can do *one* simple thing during a 1 hour meeting (check a gel, transfer some tubes from one temperature to another, you get the idea). Nothing more complicated.
- Corollary: if I find my attention has wandered enough that I'm not following the first 5 minutes of a Zoom seminar, I log off. No one's going to kick me out of grad school for it. Obviously you can't do this in a small group meeting, or if you have a program that's more, uh... attendance focused.
- Related: finding a spare office to take Zoom meetings in rather than taking them in lab. Because there's nothing worse than blocking the time and mental space to actually attend a virtual meeting, scheduling your experiments around it, and then someone walks up and asks you to pull out an earbud 10 minutes in to ask where some reagent is. UGH. Our department has a few empty offices they've left open during pandemic times, and my advisor lets us use his when he's not around.
posted by deludingmyself at 7:46 AM on February 17, 2022 [3 favorites]
So while I very much get the vehement desire to understand why your brain just cannot deal, I've slowly come to realize that it's a less useful question than "wtf, how can I help my brain deal, this is terrible." In that vein, unsolicited advice follows.
Things that have helped me, in no particular order:
- Getting enough sleep and regular exercise (reduces baseline stress, everything feels less fraught)
- Practicing saying no to things, especially some % of university service requests as a grad student. (I've adopted the phrase "that aligns with my values, but not my current bandwidth," for this.) Maybe not applicable to you.
- NOT trying to work during Zoom meetings. I know, I know — half the grad students on the seminar meeting are running off to pipet something every five minutes. I've been there. I'm not good at it. I can do *one* simple thing during a 1 hour meeting (check a gel, transfer some tubes from one temperature to another, you get the idea). Nothing more complicated.
- Corollary: if I find my attention has wandered enough that I'm not following the first 5 minutes of a Zoom seminar, I log off. No one's going to kick me out of grad school for it. Obviously you can't do this in a small group meeting, or if you have a program that's more, uh... attendance focused.
- Related: finding a spare office to take Zoom meetings in rather than taking them in lab. Because there's nothing worse than blocking the time and mental space to actually attend a virtual meeting, scheduling your experiments around it, and then someone walks up and asks you to pull out an earbud 10 minutes in to ask where some reagent is. UGH. Our department has a few empty offices they've left open during pandemic times, and my advisor lets us use his when he's not around.
posted by deludingmyself at 7:46 AM on February 17, 2022 [3 favorites]
To the point where pretty much regardless of who was employing me I consistently drifted toward arriving at work as late in the afternoon as they'd tolerate and not leaving until the middle of the night, because FUCK THIS NOISE I HAVE WORK THAT NEEDS DOING
Oh right, I forgot one: for a while I took Wednesdays off and came in on Saturdays, because hey, it's grad school, I'm not getting paid enough to not set my own damn schedule*.
*may not apply to all grad school experiences / advisors / programs
posted by deludingmyself at 7:48 AM on February 17, 2022
Oh right, I forgot one: for a while I took Wednesdays off and came in on Saturdays, because hey, it's grad school, I'm not getting paid enough to not set my own damn schedule*.
*may not apply to all grad school experiences / advisors / programs
posted by deludingmyself at 7:48 AM on February 17, 2022
Who is setting the alarms on your meeting events—you or the organizer? I can get unreasonably irritated when an alarm goes off on my phone or computer that I didn't set. I like to set meeting reminders based on the amount of time before the meeting I will need to prepare, which might be 5 minutes for some meetings and 30 for others. If I need 5 minutes, and the meeting organizer has idiotically set a reminder 15 or 30 minutes in advance, interrupting me before I need to stop what I'm doing, that can be very irritating.
Being able to choose when I'm interrupted makes a big difference, even when I can't change the meeting schedule itself. This may not apply to you, but if it does, it may prove helpful for understanding why you get upset and working out a practical solution.
posted by brianogilvie at 7:52 AM on February 17, 2022
Being able to choose when I'm interrupted makes a big difference, even when I can't change the meeting schedule itself. This may not apply to you, but if it does, it may prove helpful for understanding why you get upset and working out a practical solution.
posted by brianogilvie at 7:52 AM on February 17, 2022
I have ADHD, and even medicated, I know I've got MAYBE one good stretch of getting stuff done in me per work day. I've found that the times when I get the most upset about work interruptions or badly timed meetings, it's usually because I'm on some kind of deadline, and there is a real fear that this unnecessary meeting is about to derail me for the rest of the day and then I will not be able to finish on time. It's like compound stress.
Are there times when the meeting interruptions are worse/better? Or are they all the same level of infuriating? Possibly there are ways to mitigate some of the worst of it, but like you say, there are loads of resources for figuring out those strategies.
I have zero qualifications to say whether something is a sign of neurodivergence or not, just wanted to commiserate and support the idea of talking to your mental health professional more about this and seeing what they think.
posted by helloimjennsco at 9:48 AM on February 17, 2022 [5 favorites]
Are there times when the meeting interruptions are worse/better? Or are they all the same level of infuriating? Possibly there are ways to mitigate some of the worst of it, but like you say, there are loads of resources for figuring out those strategies.
I have zero qualifications to say whether something is a sign of neurodivergence or not, just wanted to commiserate and support the idea of talking to your mental health professional more about this and seeing what they think.
posted by helloimjennsco at 9:48 AM on February 17, 2022 [5 favorites]
It takes time to focus on a thing and get into the groove. Who wouldn't be annoyed by being interrupted?
People who bounce from topic to topic easily are people who do not have deep context for what they're doing.
You are, in a word, normal.
posted by Tell Me No Lies at 10:49 AM on February 17, 2022 [2 favorites]
People who bounce from topic to topic easily are people who do not have deep context for what they're doing.
You are, in a word, normal.
posted by Tell Me No Lies at 10:49 AM on February 17, 2022 [2 favorites]
As noted above, the attention and hyperfocus thing could be ADD, but what I didn't see mentioned is that the anger also could be.
Obviously the internet doesn't know if it's ADD or just abn of really high levels of stress or depression or whatever.
But yeah, mood lability like that could be ADD. That jumped out at me--the hyperfocus, the rage at having it broken.
posted by liminal_shadows at 12:01 PM on February 17, 2022 [1 favorite]
Obviously the internet doesn't know if it's ADD or just abn of really high levels of stress or depression or whatever.
But yeah, mood lability like that could be ADD. That jumped out at me--the hyperfocus, the rage at having it broken.
posted by liminal_shadows at 12:01 PM on February 17, 2022 [1 favorite]
There could be a little bit of maker vs. manager going on, too.
posted by emelenjr at 2:44 PM on February 17, 2022 [2 favorites]
posted by emelenjr at 2:44 PM on February 17, 2022 [2 favorites]
What is your general frustration tolerance like? Is your excessive reaction unique to being interrupted or are you equally vehement in airports and parking garages?
If the latter, it seems like frustration tolerance might be a separate issue to consider.
posted by Tell Me No Lies at 3:18 PM on February 17, 2022
If the latter, it seems like frustration tolerance might be a separate issue to consider.
posted by Tell Me No Lies at 3:18 PM on February 17, 2022
Only a few people have commented that Zoom meetings are, by their very nature, horrendous and I think that needs to be considered more. Even if I am *not* focused on anything workwise, a Zoom meeting is just a net negative, most times, in a way that an in-person work meeting pre-pandemic was not. In-person work meetings meant human connection, eye contact, building relationships, and more team cohesion. They felt like a *break* from focused work to come together, instead of a vacuum that sucked up your time, energy and soul.
Zoom meetings of more than 3 people are dumb; you feel like everyone is staring at you (and they are, if they have gallery view enabled; everyone is watching everyone else simultaneously), you don't build connections with one another, and you end up feeling de-energized. Mostly everyone is tuned out. And if you're not a manager, usually Zoom meetings are taking away from the actual work that you are evaluated on! So yeah it's crankifying (this is the word I just made up to mean, induces crankiness) and draining and it totally makes sense that you would feel resistant to going, it's not just you.
Question: Do you have access to an exercise bike so you can join the meeting on your phone with your camera off and "listen" but mostly be using the time for your own workout? Also, would it be possible to attend every *other* meeting, or it is completely strict about what you have to attend? For me, I shifted around my working hours so that I can get a lot of focus work done before the Zoom meetings start, and after the meetings are over I give myself permission to go home/take a walk, I don't expect myself to focus more after.
posted by rogerroger at 5:37 PM on February 17, 2022 [5 favorites]
Zoom meetings of more than 3 people are dumb; you feel like everyone is staring at you (and they are, if they have gallery view enabled; everyone is watching everyone else simultaneously), you don't build connections with one another, and you end up feeling de-energized. Mostly everyone is tuned out. And if you're not a manager, usually Zoom meetings are taking away from the actual work that you are evaluated on! So yeah it's crankifying (this is the word I just made up to mean, induces crankiness) and draining and it totally makes sense that you would feel resistant to going, it's not just you.
Question: Do you have access to an exercise bike so you can join the meeting on your phone with your camera off and "listen" but mostly be using the time for your own workout? Also, would it be possible to attend every *other* meeting, or it is completely strict about what you have to attend? For me, I shifted around my working hours so that I can get a lot of focus work done before the Zoom meetings start, and after the meetings are over I give myself permission to go home/take a walk, I don't expect myself to focus more after.
posted by rogerroger at 5:37 PM on February 17, 2022 [5 favorites]
I agree with those saying this isn’t a “multitasking” issue but rather a “task switching” issue. Task switching requires a level of executive functioning that is exceptionally difficult for people with ADHD—the impulse to switch off an alarm without even looking because you are focused/in a flow state and constitutionally reject interruption? Classic. The cliche is that executive dysfunction causes people with ADHD to flip between activities rapidly, but it just as often induces states of intense hyperfocus, where hours pass unnoticed, appointments are missed, and interruptions are rejected, because the part of our brains that regulates awareness of everything beyond the task at hand is… not that good at being aware of things beyond the task at hand.
Also, the size and impact of your emotional response to task switching is also very common in people with ADHD. With respect to people saying that being annoyed by meetings is normal, it sounds to me like the degree of emotion and stress you are experiencing from this feels out of proportion and is severely negatively affecting you (both through the distress itself and from being unable to perform expected work functions), which is also a classic diagnostic criteria for ADHD.
posted by CtrlAltDelete at 8:26 PM on February 17, 2022 [4 favorites]
Also, the size and impact of your emotional response to task switching is also very common in people with ADHD. With respect to people saying that being annoyed by meetings is normal, it sounds to me like the degree of emotion and stress you are experiencing from this feels out of proportion and is severely negatively affecting you (both through the distress itself and from being unable to perform expected work functions), which is also a classic diagnostic criteria for ADHD.
posted by CtrlAltDelete at 8:26 PM on February 17, 2022 [4 favorites]
So, do you know how there's those wake-up alarms that either use a fitbit or a phone sitting on your mattress to try to predict when you are in deep sleep Vs light sleep, and rather than a set wake up time you give it a .5-1hr window and it'll attempt to wake you up during a light sleep stage?
So that you don't get grumpily woken up out of deep sleep?
You might need to do the same thing kinda to make sure you're switching to the zoom meetings when you're in light focus, not deep focus.
For task switching, you could set up a what may look to others like a slightly complicated system to allow you to end your *deep focus* tasks at a 'good point' before interruptions like meetings.
I would suggest trying to figure out if you have any make-work tasks like checking emails or cleaning the lab that you can keep a Todo list of, for stuff to do right before the zoom meetings, that you don't mind being interrupted in. Light focus tasks.
In order to switch to those light focus tasks from your deep focus lab work, I'd suggest having a non-intrusive alarm more like 30-40 minutes before the meeting, and by non intrusive I mean something like a lamp that is switched on by a smart powerboard, or random music switching on from Spotify but something you can keep working through.
This alarm should be enough to be vaguely aware of it but not enough to interrupt your work, but it's your - 'find the next good moment to find a good stopping point' cue. Over the next half hour say.
When you stop, and you still have time to kill before the meeting, Then you switch to say, checking emails or lab cleaning right before the zoom meeting.
You still have the 10 minute alarm before the zoom meeting as a, "you ignored the music for 30 minutes and now you really do need to stop your lab work to switch to the zoom meeting", but at least that alarm isn't out of nowhere, and you have had warning that you're going to need to pause or finish your task soon, which helps with the irritation levels.
posted by Elysum at 12:52 AM on February 18, 2022 [5 favorites]
So that you don't get grumpily woken up out of deep sleep?
You might need to do the same thing kinda to make sure you're switching to the zoom meetings when you're in light focus, not deep focus.
For task switching, you could set up a what may look to others like a slightly complicated system to allow you to end your *deep focus* tasks at a 'good point' before interruptions like meetings.
I would suggest trying to figure out if you have any make-work tasks like checking emails or cleaning the lab that you can keep a Todo list of, for stuff to do right before the zoom meetings, that you don't mind being interrupted in. Light focus tasks.
In order to switch to those light focus tasks from your deep focus lab work, I'd suggest having a non-intrusive alarm more like 30-40 minutes before the meeting, and by non intrusive I mean something like a lamp that is switched on by a smart powerboard, or random music switching on from Spotify but something you can keep working through.
This alarm should be enough to be vaguely aware of it but not enough to interrupt your work, but it's your - 'find the next good moment to find a good stopping point' cue. Over the next half hour say.
When you stop, and you still have time to kill before the meeting, Then you switch to say, checking emails or lab cleaning right before the zoom meeting.
You still have the 10 minute alarm before the zoom meeting as a, "you ignored the music for 30 minutes and now you really do need to stop your lab work to switch to the zoom meeting", but at least that alarm isn't out of nowhere, and you have had warning that you're going to need to pause or finish your task soon, which helps with the irritation levels.
posted by Elysum at 12:52 AM on February 18, 2022 [5 favorites]
Did you have the same reaction to real life interruptions (like someone comes over and asks you for something, or you have to drop what you're doing to actually do something else?)
If not, I'd venture to guess this is a Pavlovian reaction to Zoom and everything connected to Zoom, it being connected so specifically to all the BS of these past two years; in combination with a perfectly reasonable and appropriate dislike of having your flow interrupted.
If yes, then I still think you have deep flow when you work (enviable!) and hate coming out of it. I don't think there needs to be any pathology there.
I agree that setting your own, gentler "get ready" notifications to help you feel in control of your activity switching could be helpful.
posted by fingersandtoes at 1:55 PM on February 19, 2022
If not, I'd venture to guess this is a Pavlovian reaction to Zoom and everything connected to Zoom, it being connected so specifically to all the BS of these past two years; in combination with a perfectly reasonable and appropriate dislike of having your flow interrupted.
If yes, then I still think you have deep flow when you work (enviable!) and hate coming out of it. I don't think there needs to be any pathology there.
I agree that setting your own, gentler "get ready" notifications to help you feel in control of your activity switching could be helpful.
posted by fingersandtoes at 1:55 PM on February 19, 2022
Another vote for executive function issues. I’m autistic and could have written this myself. Finding out how common this is among the neurodiverse was so relieving and allowed me to ask for accommodations. No matter what happens, please be gentle with yourself. You deserve what your brain needs.
posted by drawsablank at 3:26 PM on February 19, 2022 [2 favorites]
posted by drawsablank at 3:26 PM on February 19, 2022 [2 favorites]
Rich Roll very recently (2 weeks ago?) had an interesting podcast on this topic (about 2 hours long), with Johann Hari.
During the podcast, Hari discusses his latest book, Stolen Focus: Why You Can’t Pay Attention, which is a provoking journey into the forces robbing us of our attention and a look at how we might begin to reclaim our minds, and our lives.
During the discussion Roll and Hari discuss the tremendous time cost of an interruption to a task, nearly half an hour to return to a focused state, and the consequences of these interruptions / notifications / emails / calls / etc. This may be of interest to you as well.
posted by seawallrunner at 5:53 PM on February 19, 2022 [2 favorites]
During the podcast, Hari discusses his latest book, Stolen Focus: Why You Can’t Pay Attention, which is a provoking journey into the forces robbing us of our attention and a look at how we might begin to reclaim our minds, and our lives.
During the discussion Roll and Hari discuss the tremendous time cost of an interruption to a task, nearly half an hour to return to a focused state, and the consequences of these interruptions / notifications / emails / calls / etc. This may be of interest to you as well.
posted by seawallrunner at 5:53 PM on February 19, 2022 [2 favorites]
If you don't find the other ND offerings to be quite right, maybe you fall into the Highly Sensitive Person group?
posted by evening at 11:44 AM on February 22, 2022
posted by evening at 11:44 AM on February 22, 2022
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You might be hyperfocusing on the work you love and it might be some symptom of neurodiversity, but it might be as simple as you freaking hate meetings and the administrative procedures that enable people like you to conduct the parts of the work that you love.
If this is too much of a derail, flag and I will happy accept the comment deletion.
posted by kimberussell at 6:02 AM on February 17, 2022 [5 favorites]