Early vax for under 5
February 11, 2022 8:11 PM
If you had the opportunity to get your <5yo vaccinated now, would you?
I may have the opportunity to get my 27 month a 3mcg dose of Pfizer now. Assume everything is on the up and up, except, well, vaccine approval. I'm aware the 2 dose 3mcg trial is leading to only 60% of the desired immune response. My impression is that there are no significant safety issues, but obviously I have no inside track on the trials.
I feel reasonably comfortable with the risks. What might your concerns be?
I may have the opportunity to get my 27 month a 3mcg dose of Pfizer now. Assume everything is on the up and up, except, well, vaccine approval. I'm aware the 2 dose 3mcg trial is leading to only 60% of the desired immune response. My impression is that there are no significant safety issues, but obviously I have no inside track on the trials.
I feel reasonably comfortable with the risks. What might your concerns be?
Yes because of the risk of long covid, not covid itself.
posted by dorothyisunderwood at 8:38 PM on February 11, 2022
posted by dorothyisunderwood at 8:38 PM on February 11, 2022
I lied about my 3 year-old's age and got her both shots. She had no side effects. I'd do it again in a heartbeat.
posted by arrmatie at 8:39 PM on February 11, 2022
posted by arrmatie at 8:39 PM on February 11, 2022
Yes, there is no worry about the safety - only that they have made the dose so small (to improve safety) that it might not be as effective as it otherwise might.
But with the 3rd dose (or possibly 4th, I suppose) it's likely to be good enough. In the meanwhile it's better than nothing.
Also the 3rd dose is going to involve a wait of months, so the sooner the 1st shots get underway the sooner you'll have better protection with the 3rd shot.
posted by flug at 8:41 PM on February 11, 2022
But with the 3rd dose (or possibly 4th, I suppose) it's likely to be good enough. In the meanwhile it's better than nothing.
Also the 3rd dose is going to involve a wait of months, so the sooner the 1st shots get underway the sooner you'll have better protection with the 3rd shot.
posted by flug at 8:41 PM on February 11, 2022
Absolutely, unless you suspect the circumstances under which you'd be able to get it might make it difficult to get doses 2 and 3 down the road for some reason.
If you happen to be in the Seattle area and know someone handing out 3mcg vaccine doses to 27 month olds memail me.
posted by potrzebie at 8:55 PM on February 11, 2022
If you happen to be in the Seattle area and know someone handing out 3mcg vaccine doses to 27 month olds memail me.
posted by potrzebie at 8:55 PM on February 11, 2022
The only major concern I would have would be paperwork. I think there is a good chance you will need documentation of your kid completing the vaccine series for school or something else someday. Is this shot going to be documented or added to your state vaccine registries? Assuming it was, or that documentation would otherwise not be a problem, I'd certainly consider getting the shot now.
posted by mjcon at 9:18 PM on February 11, 2022
posted by mjcon at 9:18 PM on February 11, 2022
I don’t have children, but I do have a nephew >5 who currently has covid, and two nephews <5
I would light myself on fire to get them vaccinated now.
posted by punchtothehead at 10:06 PM on February 11, 2022
I would light myself on fire to get them vaccinated now.
posted by punchtothehead at 10:06 PM on February 11, 2022
So… this is complicated for me. If I had kids, I would 100% do it.
But as a physician who has spent the last two years in various states of lockdown and talking to people on a daily basis about vaccine hesitation, I can totally understand why things are happening the way that they are. It is absolutely imperative that this happens the right way to avoid any possibility of undermining the credibility of the studies. I feel certain that the vaccine is safe and that certainly any risk of vaccination is outweighed by the benefits of avoiding acute and chronic COVID related issues. The bigger question is in the efficacy. So I would presume that the shots are low risk in terms of short and long term harm but run the possibility of less efficacy than we have seen in other populations.
posted by honeybee413 at 11:37 PM on February 11, 2022
But as a physician who has spent the last two years in various states of lockdown and talking to people on a daily basis about vaccine hesitation, I can totally understand why things are happening the way that they are. It is absolutely imperative that this happens the right way to avoid any possibility of undermining the credibility of the studies. I feel certain that the vaccine is safe and that certainly any risk of vaccination is outweighed by the benefits of avoiding acute and chronic COVID related issues. The bigger question is in the efficacy. So I would presume that the shots are low risk in terms of short and long term harm but run the possibility of less efficacy than we have seen in other populations.
posted by honeybee413 at 11:37 PM on February 11, 2022
Yep. We have tried to enroll our kids in trials for this reason. (No luck, we are not the only parents to have come to with this idea presumably.)
posted by february at 4:07 AM on February 12, 2022
posted by february at 4:07 AM on February 12, 2022
As a parent of a 3.5 year old if some magic opportunity on the up and up appeared my kid would be vaxxed.
posted by AlexiaSky at 4:52 AM on February 12, 2022
posted by AlexiaSky at 4:52 AM on February 12, 2022
As a grandparent of a 2-year-old yes, yes, yes. I want to protect my husband with stage 4 cancer. I want to protect myself (I have asthma and I'm 70). I want to support my kid and their partner who, along with us, have been working from home and avoiding possible infection since the grandkid came home from the NICU just before things went sideways. I want to protect everyone against all the people who, because they are "over it," are giving up their N95 masks and their restrictions just as we're starting to get a handle on everything. And oddly enough, I want to protect the anti-vaccination people from their own fears and doubts.
I want my grandkid to get this vaccination because he has been getting every other vaccination since he was born, like clockwork. And just as I insisted that my reluctant doctor give me the MMR vaccination I requested when the grandkid was born. (The doctor insisted I have a blood test done before letting me, because he assumed I had antibodies to it all; it turned out I had never had mumps).
I fear long COVID. I fear the vanishingly small possibilities of death for the kid. Yes, I fear possible side effects of the vaccine, too. But overall, I'd get the kid vaccinated in an instant.
posted by Peach at 6:02 AM on February 12, 2022
I want my grandkid to get this vaccination because he has been getting every other vaccination since he was born, like clockwork. And just as I insisted that my reluctant doctor give me the MMR vaccination I requested when the grandkid was born. (The doctor insisted I have a blood test done before letting me, because he assumed I had antibodies to it all; it turned out I had never had mumps).
I fear long COVID. I fear the vanishingly small possibilities of death for the kid. Yes, I fear possible side effects of the vaccine, too. But overall, I'd get the kid vaccinated in an instant.
posted by Peach at 6:02 AM on February 12, 2022
Yes I absolutely would (I have a 27m old too). The vaccine is safe, just not as effective as would be ideal - but given everything we know about covid vaccines so far, it probably still has excellent protection against severe disease (just not great protection against infection / mild disease).
posted by maleficent at 6:11 AM on February 12, 2022
posted by maleficent at 6:11 AM on February 12, 2022
If it was on the up and up legally, I would absolutely get my 21-month-old vaccinated.
posted by abeja bicicleta at 6:25 AM on February 12, 2022
posted by abeja bicicleta at 6:25 AM on February 12, 2022
I would be very very tempted. I would however think about whether this was taking a spot that could otherwise go to someone at greater risk of getting COVID in the first place and/or greater likelihood of transmitting it (+/- "to vulnerable populations") due to their socioeconomic status and/or racism etc. And also whether this would be going against the purpose of the distribution program by enrolling a very healthy, low-risk child who has lovely nice masks and is surrounded by only a limited selection of vaccinated people in lovely nice masks (if they are! I'm literally just saying what was true of my kid when they were young enough to qualify for studies prior to public availability) in what was meant to be a study of kids actually exposed to significant levels of circulating virus (if it is).
posted by teremala at 6:46 AM on February 12, 2022
posted by teremala at 6:46 AM on February 12, 2022
Probably not, unless it was part of a trial. The medical records are important, as is getting the vaccines at the approved dosage and spacing. You may end up having to redo the whole sequence. Given that kids are very low risk and approval will just be in another few months, I wouldn’t do it unless advised by a pediatrician due to higher risk for my kid.
Also, a major motivation for me getting my kid vaxxed was to be able to skip quarantine as a close contact at school. Getting the dose early doesn’t have that benefit. And if you have to redo the sequence later you’re just postponing the time to get the added benefits of reduced/no quarantine at school or daycare that I assume will be put in place for under 5s after the EUA.
Also my kid actually had a reaction to Pfizer - not bad but serious enough that I need to consult and allergist if/when a booster is recommended. So I would not want to be in the position of having to explain how my 3 yr old got vaccinated early. CPS has been called in some cases.
posted by haptic_avenger at 7:14 AM on February 12, 2022
Also, a major motivation for me getting my kid vaxxed was to be able to skip quarantine as a close contact at school. Getting the dose early doesn’t have that benefit. And if you have to redo the sequence later you’re just postponing the time to get the added benefits of reduced/no quarantine at school or daycare that I assume will be put in place for under 5s after the EUA.
Also my kid actually had a reaction to Pfizer - not bad but serious enough that I need to consult and allergist if/when a booster is recommended. So I would not want to be in the position of having to explain how my 3 yr old got vaccinated early. CPS has been called in some cases.
posted by haptic_avenger at 7:14 AM on February 12, 2022
Speaking for my own 25 month old, if I could get her vaccinated legally & openly then yes I would do it yesterday. If there was some kind of subterfuge or lying required, either explicitly or implicitely) then no. This is the same decision I made about my own vaccination earlier in the pandemic. The vaccine approval has been delayed for under-5 for a good and consistent reason. Yes it sucks and is disappointing but if it's not yet recommended then it's not recommended.
posted by muddgirl at 10:03 AM on February 12, 2022
posted by muddgirl at 10:03 AM on February 12, 2022
Yup. I would. My granddaughter has had Covid twice now, and been SICK both times. Not close to a hospital visit sick, but not minor cold-ish, either. Sick enough to be pretty miserable for a week or more, with the same odd temperature things I've experienced, and definite body aches. I'm pretty worried about the implications long-term, especially because I deal with autoimmune things and various health issues and am experiencing what seems to be long covid + new issues appearing after having Covid.
(If you're close to Portland, and know of some way, I want to know. I'd run it by her parent (my son) for permission, but it'd be a serious consideration at this point. Two significant bouts with Covid a year apart do NOT have me convinced that immunity by having it lasts very long at all.)
There are many vaccines where an extra dose or doses to make up timing, or just to ensure coverage, are an absolutely normal thing. I have zero concerns about the safety of it, and safety isn't why they're delaying - it's because while the immune response for under 2 is fine with just two shots, in 2-5 year olds, it isn't strong enough. Which means one of few things: either the doses for that age will be larger, there will be a longer series of shots, or both. NONE of those suggest any problem whatsoever with extra doses if possible now. It'd just mean better protection.
To me, that says that the RIGHT answer would be to hurry up and get the 2-5 year olds started on a series ASAP. But they're not doing that, because the STUPID people will use the changing recommendations to call it "not safe".
I seriously wish public school actually TAUGHT, instead of just provided daycare. The pandemic has absolutely proven that it's primary purpose is so parents can work, not to educate.
posted by stormyteal at 11:20 AM on February 12, 2022
(If you're close to Portland, and know of some way, I want to know. I'd run it by her parent (my son) for permission, but it'd be a serious consideration at this point. Two significant bouts with Covid a year apart do NOT have me convinced that immunity by having it lasts very long at all.)
There are many vaccines where an extra dose or doses to make up timing, or just to ensure coverage, are an absolutely normal thing. I have zero concerns about the safety of it, and safety isn't why they're delaying - it's because while the immune response for under 2 is fine with just two shots, in 2-5 year olds, it isn't strong enough. Which means one of few things: either the doses for that age will be larger, there will be a longer series of shots, or both. NONE of those suggest any problem whatsoever with extra doses if possible now. It'd just mean better protection.
To me, that says that the RIGHT answer would be to hurry up and get the 2-5 year olds started on a series ASAP. But they're not doing that, because the STUPID people will use the changing recommendations to call it "not safe".
I seriously wish public school actually TAUGHT, instead of just provided daycare. The pandemic has absolutely proven that it's primary purpose is so parents can work, not to educate.
posted by stormyteal at 11:20 AM on February 12, 2022
in a heartbeat. Assuming it's on the up and up? In a heartbeat.
posted by mmf at 11:53 AM on February 12, 2022
posted by mmf at 11:53 AM on February 12, 2022
This thread is closed to new comments.
What might your concerns be?
Would I go to jail? No? I would do this. Yes? I would do this.
posted by Toddles at 8:36 PM on February 11, 2022