Home Improvement Order of Operations
February 8, 2022 6:24 PM Subscribe
I have a bunch of work that will need to get done on and around my house's roof and electrical systems in the next fiveish years. What should I do first?
There is a bunch of different work I could have done on my house. Some of it will likely be needed in the medium-term, other items are nice-but-not-required, others may be needed later, or may not. I don't want to create re-work or make later projects more expensive by doing projects in a sub-optimal order. I'm in California, and there are some rebates being offered for some of these. It would be nice to take advantage of those, but I don't want to waste money chasing those rebates. So what order would make the most sense to do these projects, or which of them really should be bundled and done at the same time?
-My roof will likely need replacing in approximately 5 years (could be sooner, could be later, but probably not needed in the next year).
-I would like to have a rooftop solar PV system (I've been waiting because I figured putting it on top of a roof that needs to get replaced is a waste of installation money).
-I have a rooftop gas furnace/AC system that is definitely not new. I'm not sure how many years of life it has left in it. There are rebates available for replacing this with an electric heat pump unit.
-It would be nice to have an electric vehicle charging compatible power supply to the garage at some point, but I don't have an EV yet. I almost certainly will within the next 10 years, and likely within the next 5. There are rebates for this.
-My electrical panel will need to be replaced for the solar system and/or EV charging system. There are rebates for this.
None of this stuff is urgent, knock on wood, and I am not itching to spend the money, but when the time comes I want to do it in a well-planned way.
There is a bunch of different work I could have done on my house. Some of it will likely be needed in the medium-term, other items are nice-but-not-required, others may be needed later, or may not. I don't want to create re-work or make later projects more expensive by doing projects in a sub-optimal order. I'm in California, and there are some rebates being offered for some of these. It would be nice to take advantage of those, but I don't want to waste money chasing those rebates. So what order would make the most sense to do these projects, or which of them really should be bundled and done at the same time?
-My roof will likely need replacing in approximately 5 years (could be sooner, could be later, but probably not needed in the next year).
-I would like to have a rooftop solar PV system (I've been waiting because I figured putting it on top of a roof that needs to get replaced is a waste of installation money).
-I have a rooftop gas furnace/AC system that is definitely not new. I'm not sure how many years of life it has left in it. There are rebates available for replacing this with an electric heat pump unit.
-It would be nice to have an electric vehicle charging compatible power supply to the garage at some point, but I don't have an EV yet. I almost certainly will within the next 10 years, and likely within the next 5. There are rebates for this.
-My electrical panel will need to be replaced for the solar system and/or EV charging system. There are rebates for this.
None of this stuff is urgent, knock on wood, and I am not itching to spend the money, but when the time comes I want to do it in a well-planned way.
Best answer: When we added a solar system, it was trivial for them to add a charging outlet for an EV car at the same time that they were wiring the solar into the house electrical system. It wasn't compatible with our current EV but it was trivial to buy an adapter and just attach it to the hose when we are using it.
posted by metahawk at 7:16 PM on February 8, 2022
posted by metahawk at 7:16 PM on February 8, 2022
Side-remark: one of my biggest regrets is replacing my HVAC system one year before I decided to get solar. I'm a fucking moron, do not make my mistake, I could have had effectively free heat/cooling with a heat pump system but no I decided to be stupid and bought a gas system instead.
(I mean, I still love solar, but I am definitely an idiot)
...setting that aside, get an electrical service upgrade (and new box) first. Current building codes require a ridiculous number of circuits, and my box (which is the largest residential box manufactured today) was only just barely able to fit the number of circuits required by 1) California and 2) the layout of my house.
PG&E being the bastards that they are, you may also want to install a transfer switch at the same time as the utility upgrade, so that you can power your house with a generator should you eventually wish to do so.
Also, be sure your new electrical service gets properly finished off by PG&E -- in my case they "lost" my request to finalize and decided they were gonna punish me for upgrading my service without permission (my meter lacked the little "lock" dealie that they apply when they're OK with things). Fortunately for me, my city building department fucking hates PG&E and was able to provide paperwork showing that PG&E fucked up, not me, so I was not on the hook for their error and they had to come out to finalize everything the next day at no cost with no penalties.
posted by aramaic at 7:29 PM on February 8, 2022 [3 favorites]
(I mean, I still love solar, but I am definitely an idiot)
...setting that aside, get an electrical service upgrade (and new box) first. Current building codes require a ridiculous number of circuits, and my box (which is the largest residential box manufactured today) was only just barely able to fit the number of circuits required by 1) California and 2) the layout of my house.
PG&E being the bastards that they are, you may also want to install a transfer switch at the same time as the utility upgrade, so that you can power your house with a generator should you eventually wish to do so.
Also, be sure your new electrical service gets properly finished off by PG&E -- in my case they "lost" my request to finalize and decided they were gonna punish me for upgrading my service without permission (my meter lacked the little "lock" dealie that they apply when they're OK with things). Fortunately for me, my city building department fucking hates PG&E and was able to provide paperwork showing that PG&E fucked up, not me, so I was not on the hook for their error and they had to come out to finalize everything the next day at no cost with no penalties.
posted by aramaic at 7:29 PM on February 8, 2022 [3 favorites]
one thing -- I'm not your accountant, but there is an open secret that if you get solar and you "have to" get a new roof to be able to get solar, the cost of the new roof can be included in your gigantic tax credit you get for getting solar. (effectively 28% discount). So maybe those go back to back.
posted by sandmanwv at 7:45 PM on February 8, 2022 [4 favorites]
posted by sandmanwv at 7:45 PM on February 8, 2022 [4 favorites]
A contractor (who I quite liked) once advised me that you should order your repairs top down and outside in. I think it's generally good advice.
posted by brookeb at 7:58 PM on February 8, 2022
posted by brookeb at 7:58 PM on February 8, 2022
Best answer: -I would like to have a rooftop solar PV system (I've been waiting because I figured putting it on top of a roof that needs to get replaced is a waste of installation money).
Consider also that California's Net Electric Metering 3 proposal is currently shelved, but will be resurrected. You want to get in under NEM2 because NEM3 will surely be less beneficial to consumers (the utilities are pushing hard to significantly increase grid fees).
posted by kdar at 9:49 PM on February 8, 2022 [2 favorites]
Consider also that California's Net Electric Metering 3 proposal is currently shelved, but will be resurrected. You want to get in under NEM2 because NEM3 will surely be less beneficial to consumers (the utilities are pushing hard to significantly increase grid fees).
posted by kdar at 9:49 PM on February 8, 2022 [2 favorites]
Best answer: Adding an electric car charging station just requires a 240v outlet to be added to your garage, which, depending on where your panel is located and how much spare capacity it has can be very cheap.
However, from what I've heard, adding a 2nd one (for 2 electric cars) almost certainly will require a panel upgrade to 200amps or higher. Higher than 200amps generally is more expensive, since most electric companies require a 'design plan' to provide 300-400 amps to a single home.
My electric panel upgrade was only $2500 + $500 to move the supply cable from one pole to the next, so not terribly expensive -but shop around because the estimates were really wide, from $2500 to $6000 for the same work.
Replacing the roof was $14,000 so yeah, panel first if you have the money.
You don't say what part of California you live in, but if you are in one of the drier parts, you can probably put off your roof replacement longer than most of us can. I would guess most of the roofs in my inlaws neighborhood are 30plus years old.
posted by The_Vegetables at 8:17 AM on February 9, 2022
However, from what I've heard, adding a 2nd one (for 2 electric cars) almost certainly will require a panel upgrade to 200amps or higher. Higher than 200amps generally is more expensive, since most electric companies require a 'design plan' to provide 300-400 amps to a single home.
My electric panel upgrade was only $2500 + $500 to move the supply cable from one pole to the next, so not terribly expensive -but shop around because the estimates were really wide, from $2500 to $6000 for the same work.
Replacing the roof was $14,000 so yeah, panel first if you have the money.
You don't say what part of California you live in, but if you are in one of the drier parts, you can probably put off your roof replacement longer than most of us can. I would guess most of the roofs in my inlaws neighborhood are 30plus years old.
posted by The_Vegetables at 8:17 AM on February 9, 2022
The EV charging is not going to make a huge difference in your draw or total consumption. I would set that aside when deciding on priorities. (As in, if you want an EV soon put charging at top of list, but if you are not buying a vehicle imminently then remove it from the list altogether.)
I would also effectively remove the panel upgrade from the list by rolling it into the solar or the heat pump install (whichever comes first) per contractor recommendation. If you try to guess now what you will need then, you might guess wrong. (Panel work has been standard part of a couple of PV projects I've done, same with an HVAC project but I have no heat pump experience.)
If the rooftop furnace is taking PV panel space, then it seems like it should be the first thing you tackle, in tandem with the roof itself.
posted by Press Butt.on to Check at 10:33 AM on February 9, 2022
I would also effectively remove the panel upgrade from the list by rolling it into the solar or the heat pump install (whichever comes first) per contractor recommendation. If you try to guess now what you will need then, you might guess wrong. (Panel work has been standard part of a couple of PV projects I've done, same with an HVAC project but I have no heat pump experience.)
If the rooftop furnace is taking PV panel space, then it seems like it should be the first thing you tackle, in tandem with the roof itself.
posted by Press Butt.on to Check at 10:33 AM on February 9, 2022
(Panel work has been standard part of a couple of PV projects I've done, same with an HVAC project but I have no heat pump experience
You've heard of upgrading the electrical panel when replacing an AC? I've never heard of that, and I've gotten my A/C replaced before, though not with a heat pump because a used condensor was only $600 and the air handler was $2500 so the cost difference substantial. And the newer one draws less far less electricity than the one from 1999 did.
posted by The_Vegetables at 12:16 PM on February 9, 2022
You've heard of upgrading the electrical panel when replacing an AC? I've never heard of that, and I've gotten my A/C replaced before, though not with a heat pump because a used condensor was only $600 and the air handler was $2500 so the cost difference substantial. And the newer one draws less far less electricity than the one from 1999 did.
posted by The_Vegetables at 12:16 PM on February 9, 2022
You've heard of upgrading the electrical panel when replacing an AC?
This was in the context of building an addition.
posted by Press Butt.on to Check at 4:55 AM on February 10, 2022
This was in the context of building an addition.
posted by Press Butt.on to Check at 4:55 AM on February 10, 2022
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1. Increase the capacity of your electric panel. Some things will be dependent upon this later, and it's a lower cost than some of the others
2. replace the rooftop system with a heat pump / central air system that is on the ground. You need this off the roof (at least temporarily) to replace the roofing
3. replace the roof, make sure your roofer knows you intend to add solar so if anything extra is needed for supporting the panels or protecting the wiring, that can happen
4. Add the solar
5. Find the EV you want
6. Install the compatible charging system (hopefully there's some standardization on charging by then, but I'd still put getting the car first just in case)
posted by TimHare at 6:48 PM on February 8, 2022 [5 favorites]