Would I be bike theif?
March 16, 2006 5:15 AM Subscribe
What are the ethics of taking an abandoned bicycle?
I want to build my girlfriend a bike, and there is a very nice Motobecan frame that looks like it's been chained to a tree for at least a year. This frame has been almost completely stripped, but that's ok as I would have replaced the wheels, cranks, pedals etc.. anyway.
What are the ethics of me going over to it, clipping the chain and walking off? Is there a danger in me doing this from people watching? (it's in the middle of harlem)
Can I speak to any organization responsible for cleaning up these abandoned bikes around the city?
I want to build my girlfriend a bike, and there is a very nice Motobecan frame that looks like it's been chained to a tree for at least a year. This frame has been almost completely stripped, but that's ok as I would have replaced the wheels, cranks, pedals etc.. anyway.
What are the ethics of me going over to it, clipping the chain and walking off? Is there a danger in me doing this from people watching? (it's in the middle of harlem)
Can I speak to any organization responsible for cleaning up these abandoned bikes around the city?
If you take it, make sure the frame isn't completely tweaked out as well.
If it really is abandoned, and you aren't just rationalizing yourself into thinking so (not in a bad way, but just in that way that can be too easy to do), then I say it's worth rescuing the frame and making it into a bike again. Bikes want to be ridden. If it were me, I'd clip the chain during the day, but when it isn't too busy. I'd try and look like I wasn't doing anything wrong or out of the ordinary.
posted by OmieWise at 5:30 AM on March 16, 2006
If it really is abandoned, and you aren't just rationalizing yourself into thinking so (not in a bad way, but just in that way that can be too easy to do), then I say it's worth rescuing the frame and making it into a bike again. Bikes want to be ridden. If it were me, I'd clip the chain during the day, but when it isn't too busy. I'd try and look like I wasn't doing anything wrong or out of the ordinary.
posted by OmieWise at 5:30 AM on March 16, 2006
Yeah, go for it. After a year of abandonment, you're doing the city a favor by cleaning up a persistent eyesore.
posted by saladin at 5:31 AM on March 16, 2006
posted by saladin at 5:31 AM on March 16, 2006
You can probably take it. I would knock on the nearest door and ask if anyone knows anything about it first.
posted by fire&wings at 5:48 AM on March 16, 2006
posted by fire&wings at 5:48 AM on March 16, 2006
I agree that ethically you're in the clear BUT the frame still belongs to someone -- either the original owner or the city, probably -- and it clearly still has value or you wouldn't be stealing it. So I'd worry about some neighbour seeing you do this and not realizing it was an abandoned frame. They call the cops and some jerk-off arrives and starts asking you what the fuck you're doing, and if the frame belongs to you and so on. At this point you either lie or confess to, essentially, stealing something. Worse, you have a tool (the bolt cutter) which is usually very bad news in the eyes of the courts.
Or -- worse -- you get the frame and build a new bike but the frame was reported stolen by the original owner and someplace the frame number has been recorded. You give the bike to your girlfriend but you break up and she tries to sell it. The store checks the frame number. It comes up stolen and they call the cops. Your (by now bitter and twisted) gf pins it on you and you are arrested for the theft not of the frame but the original bicycle. Nobody buys your schtick about the abandoned frame.
Of course these a paranoid idea BUT a friend of mine pulled a frame out of the canal in Oxford, built a bike around it, and was subsequently arrested and convicted for theft in the second scenario.
If you have any kind of a criminal record, this stuff gets exponentiallly more likely to happen.
posted by unSane at 5:49 AM on March 16, 2006
Or -- worse -- you get the frame and build a new bike but the frame was reported stolen by the original owner and someplace the frame number has been recorded. You give the bike to your girlfriend but you break up and she tries to sell it. The store checks the frame number. It comes up stolen and they call the cops. Your (by now bitter and twisted) gf pins it on you and you are arrested for the theft not of the frame but the original bicycle. Nobody buys your schtick about the abandoned frame.
Of course these a paranoid idea BUT a friend of mine pulled a frame out of the canal in Oxford, built a bike around it, and was subsequently arrested and convicted for theft in the second scenario.
If you have any kind of a criminal record, this stuff gets exponentiallly more likely to happen.
posted by unSane at 5:49 AM on March 16, 2006
The chance of a neighbor seeing you taking the frame and NOT knowing it's been there for a year, isn't likely, in my opinion. The neighbor as had to look at thing as long as everyone else. No one is going to care. I think your concerns are genuine, but I wouldn't sweat it. Just go take it... like ripping off a band-aid. Once it's over, it's over.
posted by Witty at 6:03 AM on March 16, 2006
posted by Witty at 6:03 AM on March 16, 2006
Best answer: I'm surprised the city didn't pull it after a year.
IMNSHO, if the frame sits for a month after being stripped, it's abandoned.
However, it's also untrustworthy. Salvage it, but check it carefully. 1) Anything carbon is toast -- that long in the sun, with the UV attacking the epoxy? Forget it. If it is just a fork, replace it. If it's a mixed frame, don't bother. 2) Anything that's a bearing is toast. Never, ever, ever, ever try to save a bearing. They're just too cheap to be worth the effort. The right answer to "oops, I dropped that ball bearing" is to reach into the jar and get another.
Aluminum will be a bit dicey as well, esp. around weld lines, because of thermal cycles. Check those carefully when you get it home. Grab the tube on each side and shake. Any creaking is a failed joint. Steel, of course, may have rusted out of water got into the tubes. If you can weld alumnium, you could reweld it, but if you're good at welding aluminum, you can afford a new frame.
Next, is the frame still true? If yes, clean it up, maybe repaint, and build out. If not, it's trash -- unless it is steel. You can "cold set" a steel frame. Cold set is a fancy term for "bend". Sheldon Brown has a page on resizing the rear triangle (for newer hubs) that has a good bit on using string to check the basic rear triangle alignment here.
The critical line is the fork-bottom bracket-dropout line. That needs to be straight, with the mounts perpendicular. The other line that has to be right is the headtube -- if it's canted, the whole front wheel is as well.
If they're straight, then hey, a frame. Clean it out as best as you can, retap the threads on the head tube (if threaded) and bottom bracket, and paint it out.
For a steel frame, you'll want to take a scrub pad on a stick and scrub the inside of the tubes. You'll probably only be able to get the seat and head tubes -- but those are the ones most likely to have seen water. The problem child will be the down tube, and there's nothing much you can do. Then, spray the insides with something to keep the rust back.
Legally, it's almost certainly abandoned property. For maximum protection, document the state of the frame when you salvaged it. If someone should try to play the "that's my bike" frame, you'll have enough proof that they intentionally abandonded the bike, and that you did a public good by removing the wreckage from public lands.
Finally, this is New York. The reason it is still there may well be that it has a very good chain on it, and nobody's been able to clip it. If it's one of those ultra hard, twisted and hex shaped link chains (like the Kryptonite
Fahgettaboudit) you'll need an angle grinder and some time to cut it. I've see 4' lock cutter break on that chain.
posted by eriko at 6:04 AM on March 16, 2006
IMNSHO, if the frame sits for a month after being stripped, it's abandoned.
However, it's also untrustworthy. Salvage it, but check it carefully. 1) Anything carbon is toast -- that long in the sun, with the UV attacking the epoxy? Forget it. If it is just a fork, replace it. If it's a mixed frame, don't bother. 2) Anything that's a bearing is toast. Never, ever, ever, ever try to save a bearing. They're just too cheap to be worth the effort. The right answer to "oops, I dropped that ball bearing" is to reach into the jar and get another.
Aluminum will be a bit dicey as well, esp. around weld lines, because of thermal cycles. Check those carefully when you get it home. Grab the tube on each side and shake. Any creaking is a failed joint. Steel, of course, may have rusted out of water got into the tubes. If you can weld alumnium, you could reweld it, but if you're good at welding aluminum, you can afford a new frame.
Next, is the frame still true? If yes, clean it up, maybe repaint, and build out. If not, it's trash -- unless it is steel. You can "cold set" a steel frame. Cold set is a fancy term for "bend". Sheldon Brown has a page on resizing the rear triangle (for newer hubs) that has a good bit on using string to check the basic rear triangle alignment here.
The critical line is the fork-bottom bracket-dropout line. That needs to be straight, with the mounts perpendicular. The other line that has to be right is the headtube -- if it's canted, the whole front wheel is as well.
If they're straight, then hey, a frame. Clean it out as best as you can, retap the threads on the head tube (if threaded) and bottom bracket, and paint it out.
For a steel frame, you'll want to take a scrub pad on a stick and scrub the inside of the tubes. You'll probably only be able to get the seat and head tubes -- but those are the ones most likely to have seen water. The problem child will be the down tube, and there's nothing much you can do. Then, spray the insides with something to keep the rust back.
Legally, it's almost certainly abandoned property. For maximum protection, document the state of the frame when you salvaged it. If someone should try to play the "that's my bike" frame, you'll have enough proof that they intentionally abandonded the bike, and that you did a public good by removing the wreckage from public lands.
Finally, this is New York. The reason it is still there may well be that it has a very good chain on it, and nobody's been able to clip it. If it's one of those ultra hard, twisted and hex shaped link chains (like the Kryptonite
Fahgettaboudit) you'll need an angle grinder and some time to cut it. I've see 4' lock cutter break on that chain.
posted by eriko at 6:04 AM on March 16, 2006
Maybe your could snap a quick photo of it still chained to the tree. It may come in handy in the unlikely event that an issue over this surfaces.
posted by Witty at 6:16 AM on March 16, 2006
posted by Witty at 6:16 AM on March 16, 2006
Or even a set of photos of the refurb, that you could present alongside the finished bike.
posted by handee at 6:39 AM on March 16, 2006
posted by handee at 6:39 AM on March 16, 2006
Seriously, a year? Not only can you clip it, you should — if not to take it for yourself, then at least to throw it in the garbage.
posted by cribcage at 7:58 AM on March 16, 2006
posted by cribcage at 7:58 AM on March 16, 2006
After you rescue it, run a post on Craigslist, Village Voice, New York Press, etc. in the lost and found sections (the Press and other free papers run their lost & found sections for free). Say you rescued an abandoned bike frame, that you're not sure if it was stolen, and wouldn't mind returning it to the owner. Let it run for a couple of weeks before you start working on the bike. Most likely, no one will respond. In the unlikely case the owner does respond - hey, you just got them their (stolen? lost key? too drunk to remember where you left it?) bike back.
posted by hellbient at 8:46 AM on March 16, 2006
posted by hellbient at 8:46 AM on March 16, 2006
Best answer: You might want to wear one of these while you're clipping the chain, just to make it look all legit and stuff
posted by soundslikeobiwan at 8:48 AM on March 16, 2006
posted by soundslikeobiwan at 8:48 AM on March 16, 2006
If you wanted to be 100% in the clear, you could contact the city first.
posted by drezdn at 9:39 AM on March 16, 2006
posted by drezdn at 9:39 AM on March 16, 2006
eriko writes "If it's one of those ultra hard, twisted and hex shaped link chains (like the Kryptonite
"Fahgettaboudit) you'll need an angle grinder and some time to cut it. I've see 4' lock cutter break on that chain."
A gas powered abrasive chop saw is the correct tool to extract this frame if it can't be clipped. You can rent them fairly cheap by the hour.
posted by Mitheral at 10:12 AM on March 16, 2006
"Fahgettaboudit) you'll need an angle grinder and some time to cut it. I've see 4' lock cutter break on that chain."
A gas powered abrasive chop saw is the correct tool to extract this frame if it can't be clipped. You can rent them fairly cheap by the hour.
posted by Mitheral at 10:12 AM on March 16, 2006
"If it's one of those ultra hard, twisted and hex shaped link chains (like the Kryptonite
"Fahgettaboudit) you'll need an angle grinder and some time to cut it. I've see 4' lock cutter break on that chain."
Or you might get lucky and be able to use one of these instead.
posted by ducksauce at 1:42 PM on March 16, 2006
"Fahgettaboudit) you'll need an angle grinder and some time to cut it. I've see 4' lock cutter break on that chain."
Or you might get lucky and be able to use one of these instead.
posted by ducksauce at 1:42 PM on March 16, 2006
"If it's one of those ultra hard, twisted and hex shaped link chains (like the Kryptonite
"Fahgettaboudit) you'll need an angle grinder and some time to cut it. I've see 4' lock cutter break on that chain."
Or you might get lucky and be able to use one of these instead.
That's not the same type of lock. It's not even a chain.
posted by cellphone at 2:44 PM on March 16, 2006
"Fahgettaboudit) you'll need an angle grinder and some time to cut it. I've see 4' lock cutter break on that chain."
Or you might get lucky and be able to use one of these instead.
That's not the same type of lock. It's not even a chain.
posted by cellphone at 2:44 PM on March 16, 2006
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by TheOnlyCoolTim at 5:19 AM on March 16, 2006