Home irrigation systems are an abomination
June 3, 2018 1:05 PM Subscribe
One or more of the zones in my home irrigation setup will not turn off. I am at my wit's (and body's) end trying to solve this problem. Details of long suffering inside.
Last year I discovered that the house I moved into had an irrigation setup and couldn't figure out how to control it; AskMeFi got me on the right track. It ran fine all of last year. This year it ran fine until one day we noticed a huge soggy part of our front . . . rocks (the yard is xeriscaped, so lots of rocks, bushes, etc.). Dug it up to find a leaking pipe, which I replaced. Turned the system back on to find some hoses gushing in the back; they appear to have gotten pinched and burst at some point. Replaced those, prepared to bask in my success, turned the system back on to run the sprinkler controller's test program . . . and the system wouldn't turn off again. At least two areas of the yard have hoses dripping whenever the irrigation water supply is open, one in front and one in back. At least one area does not run when the water supply is open, as is correct.
Some system details:
- There are no actual sprinklers, it's all dripper hoses in various parts of the yard, most importantly the vegetable planter box.
- The water supply shutoff for the irrigation system is in the front, close to the street. The sprinkler controller is in the back, in the garage.
- From the way things are plugged into the sprinkler controller, there appear to be three zones. However, it was setup to run six zones for some reason. I don't know which one of us was wrong.
- The sprinkler controller is from 2004 so I'm guessing the system was installed around then.
- I don't have information about who owned the home at that time or who installed the system and I couldn't find a permit for it on the county website.
Here's what I have discovered and tried:
- A couple of hoses and cables run out the side of the garage and appear to wind their way along the side of the yard, back and side of the house, and into the front yard. I lose track of them there because they end up buried under fabric, rocks, and plants that are beyond me to remove without significantly upsetting the landscape.
- I have been able to dig up an 18-gauge wire clearly labeled as a sprinkler wire near the back corner of the house, which then appears to surface again on the side of the house before going too far under fabric and rocks to follow.
- There is a section of this wire that is split above ground and joined together by a bunch of twist-on wire connectors. That seems like subpar design but there is nothing obviously wrong with them from a quick glance (and knowing essentially nothing about wiring, granted).
- I have tried unplugging and removing the battery from the controller in the hopes that it was somehow just pumping electricity to the solenoids constantly for some reason and that killing its power would stop that. No effect.
It has been nice and rainy of late so the situation is not dire but we are about to embark on a long stretch of murderous heat and no rain (Salt Lake City summers are a real treat). I would keep going at this if I could but I am now beyond my capacity to dig things up with a trowel and see what there is to see.
So what do I do? My best guess as to what is wrong based on searching things on the internet and talking to friends and neighbors is that I am hunting for a box with valves/solenoids, one or more of which is stuck open for reasons to be determined upon inspection. Which leads to the following questions:
- Could it be something else? What?
- Is there anything else I can try to do to fix it that doesn't involve digging up the yard?
- Should I just give up and call a pro?
- Is there somebody cheaper than an irrigation repair service who could probably handle this?
Help me, AskMeFi. My tomatillos depend on it.
Last year I discovered that the house I moved into had an irrigation setup and couldn't figure out how to control it; AskMeFi got me on the right track. It ran fine all of last year. This year it ran fine until one day we noticed a huge soggy part of our front . . . rocks (the yard is xeriscaped, so lots of rocks, bushes, etc.). Dug it up to find a leaking pipe, which I replaced. Turned the system back on to find some hoses gushing in the back; they appear to have gotten pinched and burst at some point. Replaced those, prepared to bask in my success, turned the system back on to run the sprinkler controller's test program . . . and the system wouldn't turn off again. At least two areas of the yard have hoses dripping whenever the irrigation water supply is open, one in front and one in back. At least one area does not run when the water supply is open, as is correct.
Some system details:
- There are no actual sprinklers, it's all dripper hoses in various parts of the yard, most importantly the vegetable planter box.
- The water supply shutoff for the irrigation system is in the front, close to the street. The sprinkler controller is in the back, in the garage.
- From the way things are plugged into the sprinkler controller, there appear to be three zones. However, it was setup to run six zones for some reason. I don't know which one of us was wrong.
- The sprinkler controller is from 2004 so I'm guessing the system was installed around then.
- I don't have information about who owned the home at that time or who installed the system and I couldn't find a permit for it on the county website.
Here's what I have discovered and tried:
- A couple of hoses and cables run out the side of the garage and appear to wind their way along the side of the yard, back and side of the house, and into the front yard. I lose track of them there because they end up buried under fabric, rocks, and plants that are beyond me to remove without significantly upsetting the landscape.
- I have been able to dig up an 18-gauge wire clearly labeled as a sprinkler wire near the back corner of the house, which then appears to surface again on the side of the house before going too far under fabric and rocks to follow.
- There is a section of this wire that is split above ground and joined together by a bunch of twist-on wire connectors. That seems like subpar design but there is nothing obviously wrong with them from a quick glance (and knowing essentially nothing about wiring, granted).
- I have tried unplugging and removing the battery from the controller in the hopes that it was somehow just pumping electricity to the solenoids constantly for some reason and that killing its power would stop that. No effect.
It has been nice and rainy of late so the situation is not dire but we are about to embark on a long stretch of murderous heat and no rain (Salt Lake City summers are a real treat). I would keep going at this if I could but I am now beyond my capacity to dig things up with a trowel and see what there is to see.
So what do I do? My best guess as to what is wrong based on searching things on the internet and talking to friends and neighbors is that I am hunting for a box with valves/solenoids, one or more of which is stuck open for reasons to be determined upon inspection. Which leads to the following questions:
- Could it be something else? What?
- Is there anything else I can try to do to fix it that doesn't involve digging up the yard?
- Should I just give up and call a pro?
- Is there somebody cheaper than an irrigation repair service who could probably handle this?
Help me, AskMeFi. My tomatillos depend on it.
I have the same problem, which I solved by turning off the main shutoff and just not having an irrigation system. There will be some valve boxes in the ground, likely visible, and possibly filled with mud and/or dead earthworms. At some point you replace the defective valves, but I have not gotten to that point yet.
Fun tip: when you shut off the water at the main shutoff valve(s), apparently there’s a drain you should empty or an expensive brass part will be split in twain when it freezes.
posted by Huffy Puffy at 2:51 PM on June 3, 2018
Fun tip: when you shut off the water at the main shutoff valve(s), apparently there’s a drain you should empty or an expensive brass part will be split in twain when it freezes.
posted by Huffy Puffy at 2:51 PM on June 3, 2018
Reiterating the valve issue. I've had valves get stuck open, usually because some soil got into them. This can happen if the system has a leak elsewhere and the soil gets back into the valves. The valves will continue to allow water to flow even if the power is shut off, since they are being held open by the debris.
Also some valves work with springs and diaphragms and these can leak or fail.
posted by Zedcaster at 3:02 PM on June 3, 2018
Also some valves work with springs and diaphragms and these can leak or fail.
posted by Zedcaster at 3:02 PM on June 3, 2018
The way the controller and valves work is simple enough: by default, a spring holds the valve closed, and when the controller turns "on" it powers a magnet that overpowers the spring and opens the valve. When the controller turns "off" again, the spring in the valve should return the valve to the closed position.
Clearly, in your system, this is not happening. Step one: turn off the water supply to the system and water things by hand until you have time to troubleshoot. Step two, when you get around to it, is call a pro to do the troubleshooting or grab a hand trowel and start exposing/following the controller lines to the valves, figure out which zones power which valves, which valve is the bad one, and then call a pro to fix that valve.
posted by davejay at 11:30 PM on June 3, 2018
Clearly, in your system, this is not happening. Step one: turn off the water supply to the system and water things by hand until you have time to troubleshoot. Step two, when you get around to it, is call a pro to do the troubleshooting or grab a hand trowel and start exposing/following the controller lines to the valves, figure out which zones power which valves, which valve is the bad one, and then call a pro to fix that valve.
posted by davejay at 11:30 PM on June 3, 2018
I think I would just have a sprinkler company come out and at least diagnose and give me an estimate for the repairs. In my case I had a couple of bad riser pipes (they broke off where they teed into the buried water supply lines. He fixed the two broken risers and the whole thing came to $100.
It sounds like your repairs probably involve more expensive bits, but you'll need to buy those regardless of whether you replace them or a sprinkler company replaces them. But it seems like sooner or later, you're going to need an expert.
You may try to fix it yourself, but if you think it's likely you'll still need to call in a professional, you'll probably save time, money and aggravation but just going with the pro right from the start. You may feel that the money spent won't be worth the time the expert is there, but you're not paying him for his time as much as you are for his expertise and experience.
posted by Doohickie at 10:57 AM on June 4, 2018
It sounds like your repairs probably involve more expensive bits, but you'll need to buy those regardless of whether you replace them or a sprinkler company replaces them. But it seems like sooner or later, you're going to need an expert.
You may try to fix it yourself, but if you think it's likely you'll still need to call in a professional, you'll probably save time, money and aggravation but just going with the pro right from the start. You may feel that the money spent won't be worth the time the expert is there, but you're not paying him for his time as much as you are for his expertise and experience.
posted by Doohickie at 10:57 AM on June 4, 2018
Oh, one other thought: You may be able to identify the bad solenoids if you can find them, but how will you repair them? Will you just get new replacement solenoid valves? Maybe it will just need new springs or something; an expert would be able to zero in on the exact problem and perhaps come up with a repair that doesn't require as many of those expensive bits to be replaced, which would save you money in the long run.
posted by Doohickie at 11:05 AM on June 4, 2018
posted by Doohickie at 11:05 AM on June 4, 2018
If you have a metal detector or a really good/sensitive touchless voltmeter (the former would be far easier, and wouldn't require the wires be energized) you should be able to trace the wires easily enough without digging them up. Once you find the valves you can see if it is within your ken to clean/repair/replace them on your own or not.
Even if you end up calling in a pro and it saves you no money, it may at least make that person's job a little easier since you will be able to tell them where the valves are.
posted by wierdo at 7:33 PM on June 4, 2018
Even if you end up calling in a pro and it saves you no money, it may at least make that person's job a little easier since you will be able to tell them where the valves are.
posted by wierdo at 7:33 PM on June 4, 2018
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If you absolutely can’t find the valves then you may need a pro. Irrigation stuff usually isn’t complicated in a technical way, but it is almost always installed either by a homeowner doing it for the first time, or by minimum wage guys working for a lawn care business, so things get done in super screwy ways all the time.
posted by Dip Flash at 1:23 PM on June 3, 2018