Is this Ok, Cupid?
February 25, 2016 11:46 AM
Hello, hivemind. Please use my personal website link on my MeFi user page to see my OkCupid profile. I would really appreciate any advice or criticisms!
I've been sending and receiving a couple messages every day, but the "date-through" rate (or even the rate at which it gets far enough to exchange phone numbers/emails/Skype handles) so far is still only about one per month.
The 'About Me' section is basically the same text of my Tinder and Bumble profiles, as well, though presently I get much, much less activity there than on OkCupid (probably because Bumble is not too widely used even in the Bay Area and I have to deal with Tinder's daily swipe limit since I don't feel comfortable giving the founders any money). So, advice for that is welcome too.
Thank you very much for taking the time to read it!
I've been sending and receiving a couple messages every day, but the "date-through" rate (or even the rate at which it gets far enough to exchange phone numbers/emails/Skype handles) so far is still only about one per month.
The 'About Me' section is basically the same text of my Tinder and Bumble profiles, as well, though presently I get much, much less activity there than on OkCupid (probably because Bumble is not too widely used even in the Bay Area and I have to deal with Tinder's daily swipe limit since I don't feel comfortable giving the founders any money). So, advice for that is welcome too.
Thank you very much for taking the time to read it!
Well, to be honest...if you mainly created this profile to show us all your OKCupid profile, then your username is a really big turn-off for me if I was looking for a relationship.
posted by tamitang at 11:52 AM on February 25, 2016
posted by tamitang at 11:52 AM on February 25, 2016
Well, to be honest...if you mainly created this profile to show us all your OKCupid profile, then your username is a really big turn-off for me if I was looking for a relationship.
Ahh! I totally didn't think of that. (And ironically I spend a really long time trying to decide what names to sign up to things with.) But no--I'm just looking for advice on here, not a date.
posted by I'm Only Happy When It Rains On Your Wedding Day at 11:57 AM on February 25, 2016
Ahh! I totally didn't think of that. (And ironically I spend a really long time trying to decide what names to sign up to things with.) But no--I'm just looking for advice on here, not a date.
posted by I'm Only Happy When It Rains On Your Wedding Day at 11:57 AM on February 25, 2016
When I work with clients on their dating profiles, I see a lot of "See how smart I am!" or "Look how quirky I am!", and I always try to get them to dial it back and just be honest and sincere.
I met my wife on Match.com, so I know whereof I speak.
Instead of a first paragraph telling us what you're NOT into, tell us what you ARE into.
What brings you joy? What makes you happy? Who makes you happy? Why?
Don't make them jump through hoops or pass imaginary tests, make it easy for them to get to know you.
Your current profile, to me, doesn't reveal a great deal about your dreams and goals and what you're looking for. Don't be afraid to be, as I said, honest and sincere. Don't yell at them, whisper to them.
posted by Major Matt Mason Dixon at 12:00 PM on February 25, 2016
I met my wife on Match.com, so I know whereof I speak.
Instead of a first paragraph telling us what you're NOT into, tell us what you ARE into.
What brings you joy? What makes you happy? Who makes you happy? Why?
Don't make them jump through hoops or pass imaginary tests, make it easy for them to get to know you.
Your current profile, to me, doesn't reveal a great deal about your dreams and goals and what you're looking for. Don't be afraid to be, as I said, honest and sincere. Don't yell at them, whisper to them.
posted by Major Matt Mason Dixon at 12:00 PM on February 25, 2016
Your photos all look like they were taken by someone you didn't know was there, and I can't see what you look like (other than your very impressive long hair) in any of them.
Your responses to the questions on the site are a little flippant. I would suggest opening up a little bit and concentrating less on being funny/cute and really getting into who you are and what you want in a partner.
posted by xingcat at 12:00 PM on February 25, 2016
Your responses to the questions on the site are a little flippant. I would suggest opening up a little bit and concentrating less on being funny/cute and really getting into who you are and what you want in a partner.
posted by xingcat at 12:00 PM on February 25, 2016
If you're not interested in casual sex/open relationships/whatever, there are questions you can answer/boxes you can tick to indicate that. When you devote valuable profile space to this, you just kind of look like a jerk for assuming people are going to ignore your questions just to propose something you're not into. Which, sure, they may, but just ignore those messages. It's better that your profile be positive and approachable for the people who want what you want.
If you wouldn't say "woke" aloud in your white dude life, drop it. Even if you would, maybe still drop it?
posted by hollyholly at 12:00 PM on February 25, 2016
If you wouldn't say "woke" aloud in your white dude life, drop it. Even if you would, maybe still drop it?
posted by hollyholly at 12:00 PM on February 25, 2016
I like the content of your profile - I think we'd probably get along like a house afire, and if I weren't a fortyish transmasculine person living far away I'd totally contact you.
However!
1. I understand the urge to start with a negative, but probably don't immediately cut to what you're not interested in. Better to frame that positively - you're looking for a committed monogamous relationship [add in "loving" or some other adjectives; modify "committed" as needed. Despite the "we can totally be friends" disclaimer, I think it comes across as really negative toward poly people, etc, and the kids today all seem to be very poly-friendly even if not poly. (At least, like, literally every friend I have under 30 is in an open relationship, and almost no one over thirty is.)
2. Talk more about your writing - what do you want to achieve? Resist the urge to quote the Smiths because it will be obscure to many and "Frankly Mr. Shankley" is after all a bit mean-spirited, IMO. I mean, lots of people would be over the moon having their way paid and their souls corroded, at least in this economy.
3. Maybe don't offer to teach people to code in your actual profile? You risk sounding like you're going to be one of those annoying dudes who is always pushing his partner to, like, optimize her life. Not that learning to code isn't fun.
I think your profile is quietly hilarious, but my own dating history suggests to me that you're really cutting into your market.
posted by Frowner at 12:01 PM on February 25, 2016
However!
1. I understand the urge to start with a negative, but probably don't immediately cut to what you're not interested in. Better to frame that positively - you're looking for a committed monogamous relationship [add in "loving" or some other adjectives; modify "committed" as needed. Despite the "we can totally be friends" disclaimer, I think it comes across as really negative toward poly people, etc, and the kids today all seem to be very poly-friendly even if not poly. (At least, like, literally every friend I have under 30 is in an open relationship, and almost no one over thirty is.)
2. Talk more about your writing - what do you want to achieve? Resist the urge to quote the Smiths because it will be obscure to many and "Frankly Mr. Shankley" is after all a bit mean-spirited, IMO. I mean, lots of people would be over the moon having their way paid and their souls corroded, at least in this economy.
3. Maybe don't offer to teach people to code in your actual profile? You risk sounding like you're going to be one of those annoying dudes who is always pushing his partner to, like, optimize her life. Not that learning to code isn't fun.
I think your profile is quietly hilarious, but my own dating history suggests to me that you're really cutting into your market.
posted by Frowner at 12:01 PM on February 25, 2016
Your "essays" seem rushed and like you didn't put much (if any) thought into them. Poor grammar and lack of punctuation always makes me question how serious the person is, and as a writer I would expect it to be aces. I think the best way to get to know someone online is through anecdotes -- it humanizes you and makes people feel like they have a sense of who you are. Who you really are, not just facts about you.
Your profile in general seems to push away more than invite in. You want people to feel invited in to your life. Your opening statement is what you don't want. Your photos have no eye contact, and are not great quality.
posted by DoubleLune at 12:07 PM on February 25, 2016
Your profile in general seems to push away more than invite in. You want people to feel invited in to your life. Your opening statement is what you don't want. Your photos have no eye contact, and are not great quality.
posted by DoubleLune at 12:07 PM on February 25, 2016
I'm going to be blunt, because I've been on okcupid a lot the past few days, and am slightly jaded.
1. Your photos need to be better. The one with you holding a cat is okay, and the bookstore is interesting, but you don't seem approachable or warm in any of them. Good lighting, looking at the camera, looking happy - these are must-haves.
2. Your profile is a little bland. Talking to cats is something fine to add further down if everything else is great, but there are a lot of turn-offs in your profile. Negativity, the use of woke, I'm not quite sure what you're about after reading about you - it seems a little thrown-together.
Also, as a woman, okcupid is quite frankly overwhelming with messages. What are the messages you send like? Short, funny or warm notes that reference something in their profile are more likely to get attention.
It's a scary world out there, so you've got to do a great job of advertising yourself. Right now, your profile is selling yourself short.
posted by umwhat at 12:10 PM on February 25, 2016
1. Your photos need to be better. The one with you holding a cat is okay, and the bookstore is interesting, but you don't seem approachable or warm in any of them. Good lighting, looking at the camera, looking happy - these are must-haves.
2. Your profile is a little bland. Talking to cats is something fine to add further down if everything else is great, but there are a lot of turn-offs in your profile. Negativity, the use of woke, I'm not quite sure what you're about after reading about you - it seems a little thrown-together.
Also, as a woman, okcupid is quite frankly overwhelming with messages. What are the messages you send like? Short, funny or warm notes that reference something in their profile are more likely to get attention.
It's a scary world out there, so you've got to do a great job of advertising yourself. Right now, your profile is selling yourself short.
posted by umwhat at 12:10 PM on February 25, 2016
It sort of feels like you're trying to impress people. I understand the urge to do that, but I would avoid it.
This is like selling a house, not selling a work of art:
1) Identify and advertise your distinctive structural features, i.e. the big things about you that will draw people in. You don't need many. How many rooms do you have? I mean what do you like doing?
2) Plain white walls. Don't put in a load of stuff that is extraneous to what you're fundamentally like. You'll be different with every person you meet, and it's not worth putting people off by making something that may never be a big part of your friendship sound like a big deal.
3) Keep it clean. This is self-explanatory.
posted by howfar at 12:11 PM on February 25, 2016
This is like selling a house, not selling a work of art:
1) Identify and advertise your distinctive structural features, i.e. the big things about you that will draw people in. You don't need many. How many rooms do you have? I mean what do you like doing?
2) Plain white walls. Don't put in a load of stuff that is extraneous to what you're fundamentally like. You'll be different with every person you meet, and it's not worth putting people off by making something that may never be a big part of your friendship sound like a big deal.
3) Keep it clean. This is self-explanatory.
posted by howfar at 12:11 PM on February 25, 2016
i would stop reading at the immediate negative. if i had made it past that, i would have closed the tab at the "don't be shy" part (even though, yes, i know it's a smiths lyric - maybe not the best woo'ers ever), it comes off as both negging and like you'd want me to do all the work in driving our communications/opening up/etc.
posted by nadawi at 12:11 PM on February 25, 2016
posted by nadawi at 12:11 PM on February 25, 2016
I think your photos are fine. You like cats! I'm not super crazy about the YouTube links in the end; I don't want to have to watch a video to get a sense of your personality.
You do need to write more, and fill out the entire profile. Especially since you say writing is your thing! If you enjoy writing and are good at it, make an effort with your profile and have a little fun.
A few specific sentences that stuck out to me:
Sorry, but to be up front, I have no interest in fwb, ons, hooking up, or open relationship/marriage.
It's generally bad form to talk about what you're not looking for. If you feel like you must weed these people out before even looking at their profiles, rephrase it in the positive: "I'm looking for something long-term."
Tell me what book you're reading :-)
No thanks. I get that you're trying to start a conversation, but this combines two of my pet peeves: putting the conversational burden squarely on the recipient, and having an implied "you must be this intellectual to go out with me" bar. If you want a good hook for a conversation, flesh out your profile with interesting stuff instead, and ask potential matches about the stuff in their profiles.
how to sound woke on this profile without coming across as a brocialist, Male Feminst, &c.
I only sort of get what you're talking about here, and I'm not sure if our social and political opinions would mesh or clash. You also misspelled "feminist."
Don't be shy--shyness is nice, but shyness can stop you from doing all the things in life you'd like to.
Ditch this. You're on the internet, and I'm guessing you like women who are well-educated, bookish, and a little nerdy. A lot of those women consider themselves a little shy, even if they're adventurous or socially adept. This is another negative that you could rephrase as a positive: "[you should message me if] you are adventurous and curious" or whatever. (On preview: it's a Smiths lyric? That doesn't make it better: it's also a "you should be familiar with this reference" test. And, once again, I don't want to have to watch a video.)
posted by Metroid Baby at 12:17 PM on February 25, 2016
You do need to write more, and fill out the entire profile. Especially since you say writing is your thing! If you enjoy writing and are good at it, make an effort with your profile and have a little fun.
A few specific sentences that stuck out to me:
Sorry, but to be up front, I have no interest in fwb, ons, hooking up, or open relationship/marriage.
It's generally bad form to talk about what you're not looking for. If you feel like you must weed these people out before even looking at their profiles, rephrase it in the positive: "I'm looking for something long-term."
Tell me what book you're reading :-)
No thanks. I get that you're trying to start a conversation, but this combines two of my pet peeves: putting the conversational burden squarely on the recipient, and having an implied "you must be this intellectual to go out with me" bar. If you want a good hook for a conversation, flesh out your profile with interesting stuff instead, and ask potential matches about the stuff in their profiles.
how to sound woke on this profile without coming across as a brocialist, Male Feminst, &c.
I only sort of get what you're talking about here, and I'm not sure if our social and political opinions would mesh or clash. You also misspelled "feminist."
Don't be shy--shyness is nice, but shyness can stop you from doing all the things in life you'd like to.
Ditch this. You're on the internet, and I'm guessing you like women who are well-educated, bookish, and a little nerdy. A lot of those women consider themselves a little shy, even if they're adventurous or socially adept. This is another negative that you could rephrase as a positive: "[you should message me if] you are adventurous and curious" or whatever. (On preview: it's a Smiths lyric? That doesn't make it better: it's also a "you should be familiar with this reference" test. And, once again, I don't want to have to watch a video.)
posted by Metroid Baby at 12:17 PM on February 25, 2016
You really need some new pictures, particularly ones with eye contact and smiling. I like guys that look at me, not the air around me. That's a huge initial put off. I hate having my picture taken and you'll still see about a billion pictures of me looking at the camera. Eye contact is crucial.
Your self summary comes across as not really engaged. It just seemed like you got online, wanted to see pictures of women, and didn't want to put in the effort of telling anything about yourself. Maybe instead of telling the viewer to tell you what they're reading, you tell them what book you've got open right now. You talk to cats? What about? You write? Tell a story. A lot of people aren't interested in FWB, hooking up, or open marriages. Maybe instead of putting that there just talk about how you're open to make all kinds of friends.
You should make the 'What I’m doing with my life' section at least two lines. When it cuts off like that it just looks like you rushed it. What are you writing? It feels like you don't really like that you're writing.
I am not impressed by the fact that you know everything on the internet ever. That makes it seem like you would be glued to the computer/phone and that is a turn-off. Don't brag about interneting.
Your favorites are good! I saw those and then I was surprised this was the same person. This is your most thoughtful section.
Brocialist? Dude, just say feminist. Total eyeroll.
And the code thing? You want a date, not a pupil, right? I get the shyness thing but it felt on par with "smile, girl" style comments and is a total negging move.
I want to know who you are, not what you're not. What do you like? Who are you? Why should I go on a date with you?
posted by Marinara at 12:18 PM on February 25, 2016
Your self summary comes across as not really engaged. It just seemed like you got online, wanted to see pictures of women, and didn't want to put in the effort of telling anything about yourself. Maybe instead of telling the viewer to tell you what they're reading, you tell them what book you've got open right now. You talk to cats? What about? You write? Tell a story. A lot of people aren't interested in FWB, hooking up, or open marriages. Maybe instead of putting that there just talk about how you're open to make all kinds of friends.
You should make the 'What I’m doing with my life' section at least two lines. When it cuts off like that it just looks like you rushed it. What are you writing? It feels like you don't really like that you're writing.
I am not impressed by the fact that you know everything on the internet ever. That makes it seem like you would be glued to the computer/phone and that is a turn-off. Don't brag about interneting.
Your favorites are good! I saw those and then I was surprised this was the same person. This is your most thoughtful section.
Brocialist? Dude, just say feminist. Total eyeroll.
And the code thing? You want a date, not a pupil, right? I get the shyness thing but it felt on par with "smile, girl" style comments and is a total negging move.
I want to know who you are, not what you're not. What do you like? Who are you? Why should I go on a date with you?
posted by Marinara at 12:18 PM on February 25, 2016
The "I accept all free shirts" photo and comment should go.
I'm not sure what a relationship with you would involve other than bookstores and food which doesn't necessarily have to be vegetarian. Give some more details of stuff that you'd do on a date.
posted by Candleman at 12:25 PM on February 25, 2016
I'm not sure what a relationship with you would involve other than bookstores and food which doesn't necessarily have to be vegetarian. Give some more details of stuff that you'd do on a date.
posted by Candleman at 12:25 PM on February 25, 2016
I'm a smidge older than your demographic, so maybe take this with a grain of salt.
I didn't recognize the authors you named and it made me feel bad. If it is very important to you that you're with someone that is into the literary scene that you're into, that's cool - but if that's not essential, you may be alienating people that you would get along with but merely don't read what you do.
The photos were not of great quality, posed, and seemed to send a message "I AM INTELLECTUAL AND SENSITIVE." Why not use some decent photos of your face along with some photos of you doing more things that you like. I think that a photo of someone outside is usually a good sign.
posted by k8t at 12:41 PM on February 25, 2016
I didn't recognize the authors you named and it made me feel bad. If it is very important to you that you're with someone that is into the literary scene that you're into, that's cool - but if that's not essential, you may be alienating people that you would get along with but merely don't read what you do.
The photos were not of great quality, posed, and seemed to send a message "I AM INTELLECTUAL AND SENSITIVE." Why not use some decent photos of your face along with some photos of you doing more things that you like. I think that a photo of someone outside is usually a good sign.
posted by k8t at 12:41 PM on February 25, 2016
I would have been in your target group back when I was dating. So, that's my angle on this.
+ You want to be a writer. Cool. Write a bit more in your profile. Give me some hooks. Your self summary is 13 words + an emoji long. Well, 7 words long if we remove the bit where you want a response. You need more than that. 7 words need not be a waste of time, but don't do anything generic.
+ So, you work in software & want to be a sci-fi author. Okay. Could you expand on that? Do you do creative writing workshops or do any self-publishing? What kind of software are you writing? Any hook would be great.
+ Favourite books & music: now we are talking. Could you give a broad overview for people who may not be into the same stuff (e.g. "I like indie music with jangly guitars - it would be great travelling back to London circa 1993).
+ The "I'm thinking about" section is a perfect place to place HOOKS and INVITE PEOPLE IN. So, why are you writing down self-defensive meta-commentary?
+ No YT links - write rather than deflect. Bookstores, yay! What kind of bookstore? Do you go to authors' nights? Book signings? Open mic nights? And you are CLEARLY looking for long term happiness, amirite?
TL;DR: place some hooks, open up and stop deflecting.
posted by kariebookish at 12:42 PM on February 25, 2016
+ You want to be a writer. Cool. Write a bit more in your profile. Give me some hooks. Your self summary is 13 words + an emoji long. Well, 7 words long if we remove the bit where you want a response. You need more than that. 7 words need not be a waste of time, but don't do anything generic.
+ So, you work in software & want to be a sci-fi author. Okay. Could you expand on that? Do you do creative writing workshops or do any self-publishing? What kind of software are you writing? Any hook would be great.
+ Favourite books & music: now we are talking. Could you give a broad overview for people who may not be into the same stuff (e.g. "I like indie music with jangly guitars - it would be great travelling back to London circa 1993).
+ The "I'm thinking about" section is a perfect place to place HOOKS and INVITE PEOPLE IN. So, why are you writing down self-defensive meta-commentary?
+ No YT links - write rather than deflect. Bookstores, yay! What kind of bookstore? Do you go to authors' nights? Book signings? Open mic nights? And you are CLEARLY looking for long term happiness, amirite?
TL;DR: place some hooks, open up and stop deflecting.
posted by kariebookish at 12:42 PM on February 25, 2016
how to sound progressive on this profile without coming across as a brocialist, Male Feminist, &c.
Just say you're a progressive and/or what your actual politics are. FWIW, in case you're shying away from using the term "feminist" specifically -- I like seeing it when a guy describes himself as a feminist on his profile (because I, too, am a feminist).
You need a photo of yourself smiling while looking into the camera, so people will know what you actually look like. It's OK if it's a selfie, and it doesn't have to be the most flattering shot possible. It just needs to be something direct and not-mysterious.
I love cats and have a cat, but you have A LOT of mentions of cats on your profile. Maybe knock it down to just 1-2? That said, the picture of you holding the cat is adorable.
posted by rue72 at 12:52 PM on February 25, 2016
Just say you're a progressive and/or what your actual politics are. FWIW, in case you're shying away from using the term "feminist" specifically -- I like seeing it when a guy describes himself as a feminist on his profile (because I, too, am a feminist).
You need a photo of yourself smiling while looking into the camera, so people will know what you actually look like. It's OK if it's a selfie, and it doesn't have to be the most flattering shot possible. It just needs to be something direct and not-mysterious.
I love cats and have a cat, but you have A LOT of mentions of cats on your profile. Maybe knock it down to just 1-2? That said, the picture of you holding the cat is adorable.
posted by rue72 at 12:52 PM on February 25, 2016
I see you've made some updates already. While your profile is undoubtedly better than it was, it still feels pretty light as far as showcasing who you are, the kinds of things you like to do with your time, and what's important to you. Include details. Make it interesting. Give people something specific that they can ask you about. All I can tell about you from this is that you write, make software, and read. That's...not a lot to go on for a first impression.
Also, better pictures. The cat pics are cute, but your profile pic is grainy, you're not looking at the camera in any of them (you should have at least one where you are), and the photo in the bookstore with you in sweats and messy hair ... probably not your best choice. You seem to be a nice-looking guy, so have a talented friend take some better shots of you, ideally a few where you're out doing something fun with other people.
Also, it's hard for guys on OKC. There are tons and tons of people messaging women, so without something really compelling in your message or profile, you're just getting lost in the crowd. Make yourself stand out. Have you tried reading other guys' profiles in you area to get an idea of the kinds of things they are saying?
Good luck :) You might also want to try Match.com. I hear a lot of people have moved over there since OKC started getting a bit crowded. It also caters more to people looking for longer relationships as opposed to hookups.
posted by ananci at 12:53 PM on February 25, 2016
Also, better pictures. The cat pics are cute, but your profile pic is grainy, you're not looking at the camera in any of them (you should have at least one where you are), and the photo in the bookstore with you in sweats and messy hair ... probably not your best choice. You seem to be a nice-looking guy, so have a talented friend take some better shots of you, ideally a few where you're out doing something fun with other people.
Also, it's hard for guys on OKC. There are tons and tons of people messaging women, so without something really compelling in your message or profile, you're just getting lost in the crowd. Make yourself stand out. Have you tried reading other guys' profiles in you area to get an idea of the kinds of things they are saying?
Good luck :) You might also want to try Match.com. I hear a lot of people have moved over there since OKC started getting a bit crowded. It also caters more to people looking for longer relationships as opposed to hookups.
posted by ananci at 12:53 PM on February 25, 2016
Also, I'd recommend trying out some of the paid features. Most women are inundated with messages, spending a few bucks to help with your targeting is likely worth it.
posted by Candleman at 1:01 PM on February 25, 2016
posted by Candleman at 1:01 PM on February 25, 2016
Thank you, everyone who's commented so far. I've been making some changes based on your inputs.
Brocialist? Dude, just say feminist. Total eyeroll.
The "I'm thinking about" section is a perfect place to place HOOKS and INVITE PEOPLE IN. So, why are you writing down self-defensive meta-commentary?
Just say you're a progressive and/or what your actual politics are. FWIW, in case you're shying away from using the term "feminist" specifically -- I like seeing it when a guy describes himself as a feminist on his profile (because I, too, am a feminist).
So, while I see where you all are coming from here, the reason I don't come out and just say that I'm political is because just about everything I read on the internet about leftist activism is about how white people and especially men within the movement(s) are especially terrible and oppressive. And I don't say this out of resentment at all! I'm just saying, as a leftist fellow traveler I'm pretty leery of attending protests/activist events because I'm too self-conscious about unwittingly perpetuating oppression and so forth. So, I'd ideally like a partner who is just as political, but among that set of people, I'm worried I'll turn most of them off if I just sound like Every Other Awful Man In The Activist Scene and that I'm not at all self-critical. Does that make sense? (I guess I'm asking, do you have any suggestions on how to get something like that across in a text field on an internet dating profile...?)
posted by I'm Only Happy When It Rains On Your Wedding Day at 1:09 PM on February 25, 2016
Brocialist? Dude, just say feminist. Total eyeroll.
The "I'm thinking about" section is a perfect place to place HOOKS and INVITE PEOPLE IN. So, why are you writing down self-defensive meta-commentary?
Just say you're a progressive and/or what your actual politics are. FWIW, in case you're shying away from using the term "feminist" specifically -- I like seeing it when a guy describes himself as a feminist on his profile (because I, too, am a feminist).
So, while I see where you all are coming from here, the reason I don't come out and just say that I'm political is because just about everything I read on the internet about leftist activism is about how white people and especially men within the movement(s) are especially terrible and oppressive. And I don't say this out of resentment at all! I'm just saying, as a leftist fellow traveler I'm pretty leery of attending protests/activist events because I'm too self-conscious about unwittingly perpetuating oppression and so forth. So, I'd ideally like a partner who is just as political, but among that set of people, I'm worried I'll turn most of them off if I just sound like Every Other Awful Man In The Activist Scene and that I'm not at all self-critical. Does that make sense? (I guess I'm asking, do you have any suggestions on how to get something like that across in a text field on an internet dating profile...?)
posted by I'm Only Happy When It Rains On Your Wedding Day at 1:09 PM on February 25, 2016
Just write, "I'm a feminist". It's not about politics. To me, the brocialist comment seems more political. Its that guy who say's he's all about equality and women's rights but only so far as to mansplain basic concepts to you. If you just say, "I'm a feminist" it's simple and I would respond to that more likely then not. Keep it simple and you're good. Get into the nitty details about leftist activism once you've started a conversation.
I see you updated your profile and it is already so much better. Looks good!
posted by Marinara at 1:29 PM on February 25, 2016
I see you updated your profile and it is already so much better. Looks good!
posted by Marinara at 1:29 PM on February 25, 2016
Do you like to have fun? Because right now, it doesn't look that way to me. Cooking on a second date? How about going out and letting someone else do the cooking!
Seconding that you need to have at least one photo where you're looking direct at the camera. One picture of you and your (adorable) cat is fine. Please cut the first pic, it is a bit strange and reminds me of Emo Philips. Pull your hair back in a neat pony and put some product (vegan product?) in it. I'm sorry this all sounds harsh, please take it with a grain of salt. Please put on a nice shirt, you're wearing all t-shirts and while I'm a BIG t-shirt fan, for these presentation photos you should show that you can dress nicely and are making an effort.
Try to throw in a mainstream author in your list - I hardly recognized anyone. Not relateable. Even just throw in David Sedaris! Just put a light, humorous author in.
It feels like you're trying to be too intellectual, this can be read as un-fun.
This is just me, but the smiley faces are too much. I'm talking about saying somthing cute and then putting in :-). Just cut those out, we get that you're joking and/or trying to be non-threatening.
Share a bit more - what's it like doing what you do? Do you like your work? How does that fit in with the writing ambition - do you write on the weekends? Etc. I just don't get if you want to ditch your job for a writing gig or what.
posted by joseph conrad is fully awesome at 1:31 PM on February 25, 2016
Seconding that you need to have at least one photo where you're looking direct at the camera. One picture of you and your (adorable) cat is fine. Please cut the first pic, it is a bit strange and reminds me of Emo Philips. Pull your hair back in a neat pony and put some product (vegan product?) in it. I'm sorry this all sounds harsh, please take it with a grain of salt. Please put on a nice shirt, you're wearing all t-shirts and while I'm a BIG t-shirt fan, for these presentation photos you should show that you can dress nicely and are making an effort.
Try to throw in a mainstream author in your list - I hardly recognized anyone. Not relateable. Even just throw in David Sedaris! Just put a light, humorous author in.
It feels like you're trying to be too intellectual, this can be read as un-fun.
This is just me, but the smiley faces are too much. I'm talking about saying somthing cute and then putting in :-). Just cut those out, we get that you're joking and/or trying to be non-threatening.
Share a bit more - what's it like doing what you do? Do you like your work? How does that fit in with the writing ambition - do you write on the weekends? Etc. I just don't get if you want to ditch your job for a writing gig or what.
posted by joseph conrad is fully awesome at 1:31 PM on February 25, 2016
("it is a bit strange" = the position of the eyeballs and the tilt of the head, is what I meant.)
posted by joseph conrad is fully awesome at 1:32 PM on February 25, 2016
posted by joseph conrad is fully awesome at 1:32 PM on February 25, 2016
So, while I see where you all are coming from here, the reason I don't come out and just say that I'm political is because just about everything I read on the internet about leftist activism is about how white people and especially men within the movement(s) are especially terrible and oppressive. And I don't say this out of resentment at all! I'm just saying, as a leftist fellow traveler I'm pretty leery of attending protests/activist events because I'm too self-conscious about unwittingly perpetuating oppression and so forth. So, I'd ideally like a partner who is just as political, but among that set of people, I'm worried I'll turn most of them off if I just sound like Every Other Awful Man In The Activist Scene and that I'm not at all self-critical. Does that make sense? (I guess I'm asking, do you have any suggestions on how to get something like that across in a text field on an internet dating profile...?)
See? You're neurotic! That's charming! But also neurotic at the same time!
What you should do? You should go to activist things and then not be an asshole. I hear you - if you're at all prone to neurosis, tumblr can easily tip you into a horrible landscape of anxiety about Being So Awful Without Even Realizing It And Everyone Hates You But You Don't Even Know. I spent so much time in that landscape that I actually ended up going to therapy - yes, it was tumblr-generated anxiety that actually pushed me to go to therapy.
At the same time, I have spent a lot of hours in activist settings where there were plenty of cis men, and two things strike me:
One is that you can't please all the people all the time, and some people will think you're a jerk regardless. Some of my friends think some of my other friends are huge jerks. I am sure some people think I'm a huge jerk. I try not to think about it too much, but some of them probably think I'm a huge jerk specifically for things I worry about being - probably for being a typically white jerk, probably for being a typically masculine-of-center jerk, probably for being a typically soi-disant intellectual jerk. All I can do is try both to have some faith in myself and try to root out genuinely bad behaviors. Some people won't like you, and some of them will have good reasons not to like you. This is not soothing, but we have to deal with it.
Two: Most of the time, if you try not to be an asshole you'll do fine with most activists. There's no way to guarantee that someone won't think you're one of Those Guys, but if you pay attention to how much you're speaking, focus on only giving your opinion when it's solicited or when it truly has relevance, actively listen to others, and try to wait until you're really familiar with a project and have some experience before trying to make big suggestions or take a leadership role, people will generally not think you're an asshole.
Also, if you go to a thing, you can hang back on the edge for a bit until you can get a sense of whether your presence is appropriate. Honestly, I have been to many events where I felt awkward, outsider-like, useless, etc, but you have to keep pushing through that.
How to get this across on a dating profile? I think you've got to belt up and take your chances. If this were me, I'd probably say, rather than giving my politics a label, that I try to learn from [people and movements that influence you].
Also, don't waste your time being super intimidated by people who are always More Radical Than You-ing on the internet. Some of those people are great, but some of them will turn out either to be hypocrites and liars (I've gotten so that I expect that the meanest radical on the internet will turn out to have sexually assaulted her partner) or to be truthful about their beliefs but horrible humans. I know several people who come across as just awesomely humble and "woke" and all that who have committed actions I find monstrous, selfish, self-indulgent and cruel, and it can be really shocking if you take them at face value. Better an imperfect straight white guy than a talks-a-good-game abuser queer person who isolates their partner by lying about them to their social circle, that's what I say.
posted by Frowner at 1:34 PM on February 25, 2016
See? You're neurotic! That's charming! But also neurotic at the same time!
What you should do? You should go to activist things and then not be an asshole. I hear you - if you're at all prone to neurosis, tumblr can easily tip you into a horrible landscape of anxiety about Being So Awful Without Even Realizing It And Everyone Hates You But You Don't Even Know. I spent so much time in that landscape that I actually ended up going to therapy - yes, it was tumblr-generated anxiety that actually pushed me to go to therapy.
At the same time, I have spent a lot of hours in activist settings where there were plenty of cis men, and two things strike me:
One is that you can't please all the people all the time, and some people will think you're a jerk regardless. Some of my friends think some of my other friends are huge jerks. I am sure some people think I'm a huge jerk. I try not to think about it too much, but some of them probably think I'm a huge jerk specifically for things I worry about being - probably for being a typically white jerk, probably for being a typically masculine-of-center jerk, probably for being a typically soi-disant intellectual jerk. All I can do is try both to have some faith in myself and try to root out genuinely bad behaviors. Some people won't like you, and some of them will have good reasons not to like you. This is not soothing, but we have to deal with it.
Two: Most of the time, if you try not to be an asshole you'll do fine with most activists. There's no way to guarantee that someone won't think you're one of Those Guys, but if you pay attention to how much you're speaking, focus on only giving your opinion when it's solicited or when it truly has relevance, actively listen to others, and try to wait until you're really familiar with a project and have some experience before trying to make big suggestions or take a leadership role, people will generally not think you're an asshole.
Also, if you go to a thing, you can hang back on the edge for a bit until you can get a sense of whether your presence is appropriate. Honestly, I have been to many events where I felt awkward, outsider-like, useless, etc, but you have to keep pushing through that.
How to get this across on a dating profile? I think you've got to belt up and take your chances. If this were me, I'd probably say, rather than giving my politics a label, that I try to learn from [people and movements that influence you].
Also, don't waste your time being super intimidated by people who are always More Radical Than You-ing on the internet. Some of those people are great, but some of them will turn out either to be hypocrites and liars (I've gotten so that I expect that the meanest radical on the internet will turn out to have sexually assaulted her partner) or to be truthful about their beliefs but horrible humans. I know several people who come across as just awesomely humble and "woke" and all that who have committed actions I find monstrous, selfish, self-indulgent and cruel, and it can be really shocking if you take them at face value. Better an imperfect straight white guy than a talks-a-good-game abuser queer person who isolates their partner by lying about them to their social circle, that's what I say.
posted by Frowner at 1:34 PM on February 25, 2016
I'm a leftist fellow traveler I'm pretty leery of attending protests/activist events because I'm too self-conscious about unwittingly perpetuating oppression and so forth. So, I'd ideally like a partner who is just as political, but among that set of people, I'm worried I just sound like Every Other Awful Man In The Activist Scene. But hey, I'm a feminist.
Fixed that for you :) Now go use that in your profile.
posted by kariebookish at 1:51 PM on February 25, 2016
Fixed that for you :) Now go use that in your profile.
posted by kariebookish at 1:51 PM on February 25, 2016
Your new profile is heaps better, well done. The only small thing I would add is to consider that you've used "leftist" twice - I've noticed that when I see someone describe themself as something more than once in their profile, it can come off as being overly important at the risk of other qualities. It's fine if that's what you want, but I wanted to bring it up.
posted by umwhat at 2:26 PM on February 25, 2016
posted by umwhat at 2:26 PM on February 25, 2016
I don't know what was going on earlier, but the text you have is mostly fine, imo. (I can't see pics.) I do think, though, that you've successfully conveyed that you're mindful of your positionality viz a viz your politics in the first paragraph. With that in mind, I'm not sure you need this bit:
I enjoy going to (or would like to go to) protests/activist events. Though I'm often leery of attending because I'm so self-conscious about unwittingly perpetuating oppression and so forth.
I mean it's likely true, but having that stand for you in a profile makes it sound like you're talking the talk more than walking it, and are using self-consciousness as an excuse. (Which I don't think you actually are at all, and I think it's perfectly reasonable to question all that, and I don't think one needs to attend protests to be effective. To me, it would be a totally normal thing to drop in conversation, just sounds odd in this context.) Maybe just say something like, "I enjoy going to protests/activist events, and would like to do more of that".
If this were me, I'd probably say, rather than giving my politics a label, that I try to learn from [people and movements that influence you].
I think this is solid advice.
posted by cotton dress sock at 2:54 PM on February 25, 2016
I enjoy going to (or would like to go to) protests/activist events. Though I'm often leery of attending because I'm so self-conscious about unwittingly perpetuating oppression and so forth.
I mean it's likely true, but having that stand for you in a profile makes it sound like you're talking the talk more than walking it, and are using self-consciousness as an excuse. (Which I don't think you actually are at all, and I think it's perfectly reasonable to question all that, and I don't think one needs to attend protests to be effective. To me, it would be a totally normal thing to drop in conversation, just sounds odd in this context.) Maybe just say something like, "I enjoy going to protests/activist events, and would like to do more of that".
If this were me, I'd probably say, rather than giving my politics a label, that I try to learn from [people and movements that influence you].
I think this is solid advice.
posted by cotton dress sock at 2:54 PM on February 25, 2016
It looks like you made a lot of changes to your profile since the beginning of this thread because I didn't have nearly the same reaction that many of the other posters have. I agree that you should have more photos that are well lit where you are looking at the camera. And I also think you should just ditch talking about being a Feminist. You say you're a leftist and you say you want to get involved in activism and in protests. I therefore assume you are a feminist and so calling it out either makes you sound like you want to be congratulated or like you are devoting your life to the calling of feminism, neither of which is really true. I totally get that you are concerned about how to roll in leftist activist circles as a white male, but really the trick is to just believe in everybody's humanity, believe in fighting for the right things, don't advertise too much about it. Be results focused. Be supportive. And don't look for praise or for someone to recognize how exceptional you are.
I'm not saying that you are doing that! I think it's awesome that you are so passionate about this stuff. And this is tricky stuff. When you are dating and writing a profile, well, it really is about you. But when it comes to social justice, it's not. If you are about social justice, well, that gets confusing. But we get it. I recommend leaving the feminist part out whole hog.
Maybe instead of labels you could say instead what you believe, what goals you want to get active in to achieve?
Otherwise the changes you made are great. Please don't get discouraged. You are a unique and smart and sensitive person. This means that the throughput of people whom you really connect with will be smaller because there just aren't as many unique and smart and sensitive people out there in the sea of samey sames. It's a blessing and a curse. :)
posted by pazazygeek at 5:45 PM on February 25, 2016
I'm not saying that you are doing that! I think it's awesome that you are so passionate about this stuff. And this is tricky stuff. When you are dating and writing a profile, well, it really is about you. But when it comes to social justice, it's not. If you are about social justice, well, that gets confusing. But we get it. I recommend leaving the feminist part out whole hog.
Maybe instead of labels you could say instead what you believe, what goals you want to get active in to achieve?
Otherwise the changes you made are great. Please don't get discouraged. You are a unique and smart and sensitive person. This means that the throughput of people whom you really connect with will be smaller because there just aren't as many unique and smart and sensitive people out there in the sea of samey sames. It's a blessing and a curse. :)
posted by pazazygeek at 5:45 PM on February 25, 2016
Thanks for sharing your profile! I've only seen the updated version, but based on the comments above on the "before" version, what you have now is more appealing than your initial profile. I agree with other comments about having a photo that shows you looking directly into the camera (so that your eyes can be seen).
posted by apartment dweller at 9:18 PM on February 26, 2016
posted by apartment dweller at 9:18 PM on February 26, 2016
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