Bad apples really do spoil the bunch. What to do?
July 29, 2013 11:16 AM Subscribe
I'm part of an adult amateur softball league. There is some very bad behavior going on amongst a few people, and I'd like some help brainstorming what to do about it.
So, I'm part of the local gay softball league. This league is the first time in a while where I've found a team I really like and gel with, and playing in this particular league gives me access to a lot of regional weekend tournaments that I otherwise wouldn't have any access to, so I'm trying to avoid the obvious option of "quit" here.
I've been playing for years and have dealt with plenty of borderline-unsportsmanlike teams in the past, but there are a couple of individual people and one team in particular who have completely crossed the line. I just got back from a weekend tournament where most of the bad actors were present on a single team. They won the tournament, probably in no small part due to their ability to humiliate and frustrate other teams by jeering, making fun of, threatening to protest them (players are rated and a protest could conceivably result in an entire team being banned from the tournament), etc etc. The other teams' reactions to their behavior helped me realize just how far over the line they've crossed.
The people in question are well aware of the effects of their actions and indeed seem to enjoy hurting others. I have been targeted in particular because I pitch and so am very visible, and also I think because I am female (the league is in theory open to all gay people, but in practice is mostly gay men). Any reaction to them only serves to let them know that they've gotten under your skin and they respond by increasing the intensity of their verbal attacks. I have so far not reacted much outwardly, but I leave every game with them seething with frustration and the stress is really killing my enjoyment of the game.
There is a league code of conduct which many of the actions are in clear violation of, but the league board so far seems unwilling to enforce the rules. The problematic conduct is almost entirely verbal, but so far they don't seem to have violated harassment laws, so legal avenues are out. My normal response to people like this would be to wash my hands of it and them, but I don't want to do that until I've tried to find other ways to handle it.
I would like to find ways to deal with their behavior that don't involve stooping to their level. The best option I've come up with so far is to attempt to make a coalition with several other league teams to agree to forfeit every game with the team in question, but I am uncertain that I could actually make this happen. Other options I've considered are personally refusing to play against them (would totally screw over my team), or to try to find a way to convince the board to enforce their code of conduct. The league mission is in part to give gay people (who are often bullied out of sports in high school) a chance to play team sports, so framing the issue in terms of bullying may have an impact. Quitting entirely is the final option, but I really enjoy playing with my team and league except for this one problem, so I am trying to find less severe solutions first.
Has anybody had success dealing with bad actors in a situation like this where everyone is on equal footing and the higher-ups are unwilling to step in?
So, I'm part of the local gay softball league. This league is the first time in a while where I've found a team I really like and gel with, and playing in this particular league gives me access to a lot of regional weekend tournaments that I otherwise wouldn't have any access to, so I'm trying to avoid the obvious option of "quit" here.
I've been playing for years and have dealt with plenty of borderline-unsportsmanlike teams in the past, but there are a couple of individual people and one team in particular who have completely crossed the line. I just got back from a weekend tournament where most of the bad actors were present on a single team. They won the tournament, probably in no small part due to their ability to humiliate and frustrate other teams by jeering, making fun of, threatening to protest them (players are rated and a protest could conceivably result in an entire team being banned from the tournament), etc etc. The other teams' reactions to their behavior helped me realize just how far over the line they've crossed.
The people in question are well aware of the effects of their actions and indeed seem to enjoy hurting others. I have been targeted in particular because I pitch and so am very visible, and also I think because I am female (the league is in theory open to all gay people, but in practice is mostly gay men). Any reaction to them only serves to let them know that they've gotten under your skin and they respond by increasing the intensity of their verbal attacks. I have so far not reacted much outwardly, but I leave every game with them seething with frustration and the stress is really killing my enjoyment of the game.
There is a league code of conduct which many of the actions are in clear violation of, but the league board so far seems unwilling to enforce the rules. The problematic conduct is almost entirely verbal, but so far they don't seem to have violated harassment laws, so legal avenues are out. My normal response to people like this would be to wash my hands of it and them, but I don't want to do that until I've tried to find other ways to handle it.
I would like to find ways to deal with their behavior that don't involve stooping to their level. The best option I've come up with so far is to attempt to make a coalition with several other league teams to agree to forfeit every game with the team in question, but I am uncertain that I could actually make this happen. Other options I've considered are personally refusing to play against them (would totally screw over my team), or to try to find a way to convince the board to enforce their code of conduct. The league mission is in part to give gay people (who are often bullied out of sports in high school) a chance to play team sports, so framing the issue in terms of bullying may have an impact. Quitting entirely is the final option, but I really enjoy playing with my team and league except for this one problem, so I am trying to find less severe solutions first.
Has anybody had success dealing with bad actors in a situation like this where everyone is on equal footing and the higher-ups are unwilling to step in?
Best answer: Has anybody had success dealing with bad actors in a situation like this where everyone is on equal footing and the higher-ups are unwilling to step in?
Yeah. You band together with other people who are being affected by the bad actors and you apply steady pressure to the powers that be until they conclude that actually enforcing the rules will be less of a pain in the ass than not enforcing them.
This takes time and work and organizing skills. You have to be persistent and patient. You have to be willing to recruit recruit recruit. You have to be very clear about what your goal is, and you need to communicate that.
These are techniques that get politicians unelected. They get laws changed or passed. It isn't easy, but it can work.
posted by rtha at 11:39 AM on July 29, 2013 [9 favorites]
Yeah. You band together with other people who are being affected by the bad actors and you apply steady pressure to the powers that be until they conclude that actually enforcing the rules will be less of a pain in the ass than not enforcing them.
This takes time and work and organizing skills. You have to be persistent and patient. You have to be willing to recruit recruit recruit. You have to be very clear about what your goal is, and you need to communicate that.
These are techniques that get politicians unelected. They get laws changed or passed. It isn't easy, but it can work.
posted by rtha at 11:39 AM on July 29, 2013 [9 favorites]
I like insectosaurus' idea. Take it one step further and youtube them! Do a mash up video with their bad behavior. Once it goes viral in your town, things will either get better or really really worse, but at least you will be having more fun.
posted by myselfasme at 11:47 AM on July 29, 2013 [3 favorites]
posted by myselfasme at 11:47 AM on July 29, 2013 [3 favorites]
The best option I've come up with so far is to attempt to make a coalition with several other league teams to agree to forfeit every game with the team in question, but I am uncertain that I could actually make this happen. Other options I've considered are personally refusing to play against them (would totally screw over my team), or to try to find a way to convince the board to enforce their code of conduct.
So you've considered getting a group of teams together to forfeit, and you've considered trying to convince the board on your own- but have you considered going to each team you think would be amenable and asking each of them to file a complaint to the board?
You say the board seems unwilling to enforce the rules, but if people representing every other team came to them with complaints, maybe they'd start caring.
A video will do nothing, as these people enjoy their own bad behavior.
posted by showbiz_liz at 12:16 PM on July 29, 2013 [2 favorites]
So you've considered getting a group of teams together to forfeit, and you've considered trying to convince the board on your own- but have you considered going to each team you think would be amenable and asking each of them to file a complaint to the board?
You say the board seems unwilling to enforce the rules, but if people representing every other team came to them with complaints, maybe they'd start caring.
A video will do nothing, as these people enjoy their own bad behavior.
posted by showbiz_liz at 12:16 PM on July 29, 2013 [2 favorites]
Best answer: I really doubt a video would be effective. However, asking each team to register a complaint would be, I bet. Mail them, don't just email.
Is your league associated with a national organization? Because you could also CC both the hard copy and the email to the regional board.
posted by spunweb at 12:31 PM on July 29, 2013 [3 favorites]
Is your league associated with a national organization? Because you could also CC both the hard copy and the email to the regional board.
posted by spunweb at 12:31 PM on July 29, 2013 [3 favorites]
back when I used to play beer league hockey, there was one team who was, well, just dirty. They'd stick you in the corners, slash your calves etc etc.
There were maybe 6 teams in the league, always playing the 11pm ice slots etc. Finally, at one draft, ALL the other captains said "we won't play any more unless they don't". Got the leagues attention, and they did change.
So, yeah, you need to get the league to deal with it, en mass tends to work better than one voice. Know that the end result may be you finding some other league to play in if the league is unwilling or unable to do it right.
posted by k5.user at 12:45 PM on July 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
There were maybe 6 teams in the league, always playing the 11pm ice slots etc. Finally, at one draft, ALL the other captains said "we won't play any more unless they don't". Got the leagues attention, and they did change.
So, yeah, you need to get the league to deal with it, en mass tends to work better than one voice. Know that the end result may be you finding some other league to play in if the league is unwilling or unable to do it right.
posted by k5.user at 12:45 PM on July 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
Video is a good idea. Include a link to it in a letter to the board outlining the scope of these a-holes' behavior and its impact on your enjoyment of the game. The anti-bullying message sounds like a good one.
For added impact, get the rest of your team to sign it. Even better, get members of other teams to sign. The more signatures at the bottom of the letter, the less likely that the board will be able to ignore the issue.
posted by ottereroticist at 1:02 PM on July 29, 2013
For added impact, get the rest of your team to sign it. Even better, get members of other teams to sign. The more signatures at the bottom of the letter, the less likely that the board will be able to ignore the issue.
posted by ottereroticist at 1:02 PM on July 29, 2013
Back in the mid-ninties, I was a seminarian at Duke, and I was part of a church softball league in Western North Carolina. We went through something similar to what you are describing. The idea was to build fellowship among local churches and across denominations. In fact, there were even rules that stated that your roster had to be comprised of people who had attended your church a couple of times in a month.
The church I was a part of obeyed the rules and the spirit of the league, but we played teams who were comprised of guys who were in a competitive league, who treated our league basically as an opportunity to beat up on inferior players.
Things came to a head when people on our team were hitting pop-ups to the infield and the other team's players were doing silly stuff like trying to catch the ball behind their backs. It was humiliating to our people, who thought they were joining a team for pure fun.
What ended up happening was that we appealed to the umpires, who were ultimately responsible for not only enforcing the rules of softball on the field, but for keeping people honest to the spirit of the league.
We really didn't change anything, and I am not sure the league lasted much longer. Having said all of that, I think your options are to speak to the umps, speak to the organizers of the league, or to create a new league, where the purpose of the league is clearly stated and the consequences of not abiding by the rules are very, very, clear.
I have even heard of leagues of mixed gender, where men would intentionally walk a man to pitch to a woman. Crap like that.
I guess you could have a meeting of the teams (or their coaches) just before the game, where the ideals behind the league are reiterated, but in my experience, it is difficult to deal with people who act like everything they do is being broadcast on ESPN.
Good luck. I really hope this works out for you.
posted by 4ster at 1:51 PM on July 29, 2013
The church I was a part of obeyed the rules and the spirit of the league, but we played teams who were comprised of guys who were in a competitive league, who treated our league basically as an opportunity to beat up on inferior players.
Things came to a head when people on our team were hitting pop-ups to the infield and the other team's players were doing silly stuff like trying to catch the ball behind their backs. It was humiliating to our people, who thought they were joining a team for pure fun.
What ended up happening was that we appealed to the umpires, who were ultimately responsible for not only enforcing the rules of softball on the field, but for keeping people honest to the spirit of the league.
We really didn't change anything, and I am not sure the league lasted much longer. Having said all of that, I think your options are to speak to the umps, speak to the organizers of the league, or to create a new league, where the purpose of the league is clearly stated and the consequences of not abiding by the rules are very, very, clear.
I have even heard of leagues of mixed gender, where men would intentionally walk a man to pitch to a woman. Crap like that.
I guess you could have a meeting of the teams (or their coaches) just before the game, where the ideals behind the league are reiterated, but in my experience, it is difficult to deal with people who act like everything they do is being broadcast on ESPN.
Good luck. I really hope this works out for you.
posted by 4ster at 1:51 PM on July 29, 2013
"threatening to protest them (players are rated and a protest could conceivably result in an entire team being banned from the tournament), etc etc. The other teams' reactions to their behavior helped me realize just how far over the line they've crossed."
Can you expand on what "protest[ing]" means? If the other teams noticed and reacted to the bad behavior, maybe you could contact them and ask them to protest the bad apples with you?
posted by coupdefoudre at 2:14 PM on July 29, 2013
Can you expand on what "protest[ing]" means? If the other teams noticed and reacted to the bad behavior, maybe you could contact them and ask them to protest the bad apples with you?
posted by coupdefoudre at 2:14 PM on July 29, 2013
Response by poster: Thanks guys, lots of good stuff in here. I've got some thinking to do about my options.
To answer your question, coupdefoudre, every player gets a number based on their hitting, fielding, throwing, and running ability. The scores are totaled to give each player a skill rating. The divisions are broken up by ratings cutoffs, so you don't have very skilled players playing in the rec league or vice versa. You can protest that somebody is misrated, and if the protest is upheld the team forfeits every game in which that player played.
Slightly underrating players, especially at the cutoff point between divisions, is pretty common and mostly overlooked although it's technically against the rules. Basically they were saying that if they couldn't win fairly, they were going to win by protest. In other words, they were being major arseholes.
For political reasons I don't want to fall afoul of, protesting their ratings isn't possible and isn't really where I want to go anyway. I don't want to get back at them, I just want the bad apples to either be forced to adhere to the code of conduct or to leave.
posted by zug at 3:54 PM on July 29, 2013
To answer your question, coupdefoudre, every player gets a number based on their hitting, fielding, throwing, and running ability. The scores are totaled to give each player a skill rating. The divisions are broken up by ratings cutoffs, so you don't have very skilled players playing in the rec league or vice versa. You can protest that somebody is misrated, and if the protest is upheld the team forfeits every game in which that player played.
Slightly underrating players, especially at the cutoff point between divisions, is pretty common and mostly overlooked although it's technically against the rules. Basically they were saying that if they couldn't win fairly, they were going to win by protest. In other words, they were being major arseholes.
For political reasons I don't want to fall afoul of, protesting their ratings isn't possible and isn't really where I want to go anyway. I don't want to get back at them, I just want the bad apples to either be forced to adhere to the code of conduct or to leave.
posted by zug at 3:54 PM on July 29, 2013
Best answer: Every team that plays the bad apple team should record the verbal harrassment that occurs (written), and then file a complaint (keeping a copy for their records). Every team. Every game. It establishes a pattern of behavior so that if they try something, they won't be given the benefit of the doubt, because there won't be any doubt about their true nature.
posted by rakaidan at 5:19 PM on July 29, 2013 [4 favorites]
posted by rakaidan at 5:19 PM on July 29, 2013 [4 favorites]
Okay, I know all the reasons that this might be frustrating advice but...has anyone talked to the team? Who is the captain? Is this person the ringleader? If you and a couple stand-up cohorts can approach one or two of the team's organizers and say, "Hey, everyone is starting to talk about what assholes you guys are. I realize that you think you're being silly and having a good time but you're really behaving like bullies and harming the spirit of the league. Think you can talk to your team about toning it waaaaay down and being a little more sportsmanlike?"
If this doesn't work or they seem like they aren't interested in change then go after them with both barrels. And, yeah, forfeit at the first sign of that bullshit. If the league organizers can put a stop to this, it's better for your league overall. You might even tell the powers that be that your friends who were interested in joining came to a game and were so turned off by the conduct that they decided not to get involved with the league.
posted by amanda at 9:18 PM on July 29, 2013
If this doesn't work or they seem like they aren't interested in change then go after them with both barrels. And, yeah, forfeit at the first sign of that bullshit. If the league organizers can put a stop to this, it's better for your league overall. You might even tell the powers that be that your friends who were interested in joining came to a game and were so turned off by the conduct that they decided not to get involved with the league.
posted by amanda at 9:18 PM on July 29, 2013
The fact that there's an explicit code of conduct is a real help for you, I think. Getting a specific (partial) list of code of conduct violations, not just from your team but from a few of the other teams in the league, could be a good first step.
posted by en forme de poire at 10:04 PM on July 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by en forme de poire at 10:04 PM on July 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: The organizer of their team is indeed the ringleader. He's also a board member until October, which makes it extra sticky.
I've marked a few "best answers", but everyone has given great advice. Thanks!
posted by zug at 12:54 PM on July 30, 2013
I've marked a few "best answers", but everyone has given great advice. Thanks!
posted by zug at 12:54 PM on July 30, 2013
This may not be appropriate coming from a straight white guy, but could you play up the bullying angle vis a vis it being a gay league? I mean, gay people have suffered more than enough bullying; it doesn't need to come from within the community. Perhaps that will make it more personal for the league board?
posted by notsnot at 6:56 PM on August 10, 2013
posted by notsnot at 6:56 PM on August 10, 2013
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Video would have two possible effects - they might tone down their behavior if they notice they are on camera (which is good, because you don't have to deal with it, but means you'd have to continue to video them to keep them under control). Or, they might ignore the camera, but at least you'd have their verbal harassment recorded. If you bring the video to the league board, the board may find it significantly harder to ignore than "just" your report.
Of course, this will only work if what they are doing/saying is noticeable to be picked up on camera.
Alternately, could you plus as many people as possible (on as many teams as possible) go to the league board, in person, together? It's much easier to ignore one person than say, 15 people across several teams.
posted by insectosaurus at 11:26 AM on July 29, 2013 [2 favorites]