What should I do with my car?
June 21, 2013 5:47 AM Subscribe
I have a 2001 Honda Civic with 110k miles that I need to decide if I should keep or sell. I'm not sure how to weigh all the important factors. Can you help?
Social factors:
I drive this car very little because I take the subway to work and we have another comparable car that is the primary family vehicle. I need a car every weekend but typically use the other car. There are maybe a time or two a month when we need (or it would be convenient to have) two cars.
We also have a small kid in the house and I have some concern about having him home without a vehicle present for emergencies, which would happen regularly at least once a week.
Mechanical/car factors:
The car runs well, and I replaced the timing belt last year.
The AC compressor is shot and would cost ~$5-600 to replace.
The rear bumper needs to be replaced, along with, probably, some minor bodywork on the back of the car where someone hit it while parked.
One rear taillight cover needs to be replaced due to the same accident.
I figure it would cost ~$1000 to fix everything wrong with the car. I pay ~$800 in insurance a year.
I could sell the car for maybe $3500 as is. Maybe only 3k.
My basic concern is that were we to actually need a second car, we would likely buy one in the $10-12k range, rather than something as old as what I've got.
How do I balance possible (completely hypothetical) future need against my current situation?
[Writing this all out makes selling the car seem like the right thing to do, but I would still like advice from other people who may have considered other factors in a situation like this.]
Social factors:
I drive this car very little because I take the subway to work and we have another comparable car that is the primary family vehicle. I need a car every weekend but typically use the other car. There are maybe a time or two a month when we need (or it would be convenient to have) two cars.
We also have a small kid in the house and I have some concern about having him home without a vehicle present for emergencies, which would happen regularly at least once a week.
Mechanical/car factors:
The car runs well, and I replaced the timing belt last year.
The AC compressor is shot and would cost ~$5-600 to replace.
The rear bumper needs to be replaced, along with, probably, some minor bodywork on the back of the car where someone hit it while parked.
One rear taillight cover needs to be replaced due to the same accident.
I figure it would cost ~$1000 to fix everything wrong with the car. I pay ~$800 in insurance a year.
I could sell the car for maybe $3500 as is. Maybe only 3k.
My basic concern is that were we to actually need a second car, we would likely buy one in the $10-12k range, rather than something as old as what I've got.
How do I balance possible (completely hypothetical) future need against my current situation?
[Writing this all out makes selling the car seem like the right thing to do, but I would still like advice from other people who may have considered other factors in a situation like this.]
Sell the car for $3k, put in a CD or some other savings vehicle where it's semi liquid. Do the same monthly with the insurance money, and some gas money, say 100.00 a month.
If you need a second car, dip into that to rent car by the day or zip car or buy dinner for a friend whose car you borrow a weekend; if you NEED a second car, you have a good chunk salted away by then.
posted by tilde at 5:59 AM on June 21, 2013 [2 favorites]
If you need a second car, dip into that to rent car by the day or zip car or buy dinner for a friend whose car you borrow a weekend; if you NEED a second car, you have a good chunk salted away by then.
posted by tilde at 5:59 AM on June 21, 2013 [2 favorites]
Not clear if the comparable car is more or less the same age. If so, seems to make sense to at least have a back-up car if/when the main one has problems or needs maintenance.
Also, given the infrequent use, living without the A/C sounds bearable.
Dunno if the body damage needs to be fixed to pass inspection or if you can get away with just replacing the tail-light cover.
Without knowing more about the other car, I'd spend as little as possible to keep the Civic on the road for a back-up and for the convenience. Renting a car for a day or two, on short notice, can be a pain and expensive.
(And with infrequent use, the repair maintenance costs should be tiny.)
posted by ambient2 at 6:37 AM on June 21, 2013
Also, given the infrequent use, living without the A/C sounds bearable.
Dunno if the body damage needs to be fixed to pass inspection or if you can get away with just replacing the tail-light cover.
Without knowing more about the other car, I'd spend as little as possible to keep the Civic on the road for a back-up and for the convenience. Renting a car for a day or two, on short notice, can be a pain and expensive.
(And with infrequent use, the repair maintenance costs should be tiny.)
posted by ambient2 at 6:37 AM on June 21, 2013
If you really do need to have a second car regularly and are considering a newer car to replace this one, keep this one. Fix the taillight, and the a/c if you really need it. The bodywork, eh, if you don't mind driving with some scuffs, who cares? What you have here is a mechanically sound vehicle that's just had the most expensive regular maintenance item taken care of. Change the oil, and that car will make twice its current mileage.
(I *bought* a Honda with 180k on the clock for 3 grand a couple years ago. They're that solid.)
posted by notsnot at 6:38 AM on June 21, 2013 [5 favorites]
(I *bought* a Honda with 180k on the clock for 3 grand a couple years ago. They're that solid.)
posted by notsnot at 6:38 AM on June 21, 2013 [5 favorites]
Sell your car to me!
Seriously, Honda Civics are great cars and worth hanging onto. I can't think of another make and model that matches the Civic on both reliability and gas mileage. It's difficult to find good used Civics at a reasonable price anymore because people hang onto them forever (they'll last for 300,000 miles or more) and the few that do make it onto the used market are often snapped up and tricked out by amateur racing enthusiasts. The last two times I shopped for a Honda Civic I had to settle for a Hyundai Accent instead because Civics in my price range were too scarce. I'm still in mourning for my old Civic that I sold 8 years ago when I moved out of the country.
If it were mine (and oh do I wish it was), I'd keep it.
posted by Jacqueline at 6:45 AM on June 21, 2013 [1 favorite]
Seriously, Honda Civics are great cars and worth hanging onto. I can't think of another make and model that matches the Civic on both reliability and gas mileage. It's difficult to find good used Civics at a reasonable price anymore because people hang onto them forever (they'll last for 300,000 miles or more) and the few that do make it onto the used market are often snapped up and tricked out by amateur racing enthusiasts. The last two times I shopped for a Honda Civic I had to settle for a Hyundai Accent instead because Civics in my price range were too scarce. I'm still in mourning for my old Civic that I sold 8 years ago when I moved out of the country.
If it were mine (and oh do I wish it was), I'd keep it.
posted by Jacqueline at 6:45 AM on June 21, 2013 [1 favorite]
Relative to the year in general, I think older Civics stand out well against similar cars from the same year. Very new Civics not so much though.
posted by ZeusHumms at 7:02 AM on June 21, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by ZeusHumms at 7:02 AM on June 21, 2013 [1 favorite]
Our situation is not completely parallel, but there are several similarities (including location), and in our case we've elected to keep the reliable beater 2nd car. I actually drive the beater as my primary car because it gets better gas mileage than the newer vehicle.
1. I think you are right to consider that your current rhythm of life may change in the future and you may find yourself with a greater need for a second car. When the Wiselet gets a little older you will likely have more complicated lives and will be spending more time away from home, often going in different directions and doing things beyond simply going to work or the grocery store.
2. Even if you're only using zipcar or some other form of rental a couple times a month, the savings over the annual cost of keeping your current 2nd car are not that huge (I'm estimating about $2000/year to keep your current car insured, gassed, and in minimal operating condition, vs. about $1000/year to use a Zipcar about 8 hour a month). If you're 5 minutes from the Metro, that savings could conceivably be worth the minor inconvenience. If you're 15 minutes from Metro, ask yourself whether you want to add 30 minutes to every trip you need to make using a 2nd vehicle.
3. You don't need to fix everything that's wrong with your car. In your situation, I would fix the light and possibly fix the AC, but if the bumper doesn't need to be fixed I would forgo that and I would certainly forgo fixing any dings or dents. Don't forget that driving a fuel efficient old beater is a point of pride in TP. (Exhibit A: the circa 1981 2x4 Roof Rack Subaru on Cedar Ave.).
posted by drlith at 7:05 AM on June 21, 2013
1. I think you are right to consider that your current rhythm of life may change in the future and you may find yourself with a greater need for a second car. When the Wiselet gets a little older you will likely have more complicated lives and will be spending more time away from home, often going in different directions and doing things beyond simply going to work or the grocery store.
2. Even if you're only using zipcar or some other form of rental a couple times a month, the savings over the annual cost of keeping your current 2nd car are not that huge (I'm estimating about $2000/year to keep your current car insured, gassed, and in minimal operating condition, vs. about $1000/year to use a Zipcar about 8 hour a month). If you're 5 minutes from the Metro, that savings could conceivably be worth the minor inconvenience. If you're 15 minutes from Metro, ask yourself whether you want to add 30 minutes to every trip you need to make using a 2nd vehicle.
3. You don't need to fix everything that's wrong with your car. In your situation, I would fix the light and possibly fix the AC, but if the bumper doesn't need to be fixed I would forgo that and I would certainly forgo fixing any dings or dents. Don't forget that driving a fuel efficient old beater is a point of pride in TP. (Exhibit A: the circa 1981 2x4 Roof Rack Subaru on Cedar Ave.).
posted by drlith at 7:05 AM on June 21, 2013
Keep it.
Don't get me wrong, selling the car makes some degree of sense. But I pretty much guarantee there will be at least one moment over the next year where you will go "Damn it, I wish I hadn't sold the car." Perhaps your partner will have a need to start driving more, and it becomes more difficult to use the main car. Perhaps *you'll* need to start driving more. Perhaps there will be a change in schooling, daycare or extracurricular activities for your child that makes scheduling more difficult with one car. Perhaps one of those emergencies will happen.
I speak from experience. Back in 2008, I was in an almost identical situation. I did the math, I sold the car, I signed up with car sharing services. In 2009, to protect my sanity after a few of the above things happened, had an awful experience with one of the car sharing services and then had several deeply annoying experiences with another, I bought a used car to replace the one I sold.
posted by eschatfische at 7:16 AM on June 21, 2013
Don't get me wrong, selling the car makes some degree of sense. But I pretty much guarantee there will be at least one moment over the next year where you will go "Damn it, I wish I hadn't sold the car." Perhaps your partner will have a need to start driving more, and it becomes more difficult to use the main car. Perhaps *you'll* need to start driving more. Perhaps there will be a change in schooling, daycare or extracurricular activities for your child that makes scheduling more difficult with one car. Perhaps one of those emergencies will happen.
I speak from experience. Back in 2008, I was in an almost identical situation. I did the math, I sold the car, I signed up with car sharing services. In 2009, to protect my sanity after a few of the above things happened, had an awful experience with one of the car sharing services and then had several deeply annoying experiences with another, I bought a used car to replace the one I sold.
posted by eschatfische at 7:16 AM on June 21, 2013
If I were in your position, I'd do this:
1. Don't sell the car. Yet.
2. Keep a diary of how often I NEEDED to use the car, for three months.
3. Find out how much a car rental, including license, insurance and taxes, would have cost for that three months.
If the cost for rental were noticeably less than the cost to keep the second car (NOT counting damage and AC repair), I'd sell the car as-is.
If the cost for rental were noticeably more than the cost to keep the second car, I'd keep the second car and not fix any of the damage/AC.
posted by davejay at 7:26 AM on June 21, 2013
1. Don't sell the car. Yet.
2. Keep a diary of how often I NEEDED to use the car, for three months.
3. Find out how much a car rental, including license, insurance and taxes, would have cost for that three months.
If the cost for rental were noticeably less than the cost to keep the second car (NOT counting damage and AC repair), I'd sell the car as-is.
If the cost for rental were noticeably more than the cost to keep the second car, I'd keep the second car and not fix any of the damage/AC.
posted by davejay at 7:26 AM on June 21, 2013
Well, I live in LA, where not having a car makes life very difficult. So that's full disclosure of my bias. Also, I have a kid and I worry too about not having a vehicle when I'm alone with him, in the case of an emergency, or if we just need to get out for some reason.
We currently have a newer car that we use for family outings, and a super old car (older than yours, and not a Honda, would that it were) that is doing just fine, but we are very good about keeping up the maintenance on it.
Every once in a while we kick around the idea of selling it / replacing it, but our decision comes down to this: 1. It's paid for; 2. The yearly maintenance and insurance are still way less than if we had to make a car payment; 3. Every month we sock away the equivalent of a car payment towards a future purchase, with the goal that we will eventually purchase a vehicle for cash and not have a car payment.
Things are simply not built the way they used to be, and I firmly believe that whatever I buy in the future will be more maintenance headaches that an older car. That's capitalism. So we figure we hold on to what we've got while it's relatively inexpensive to maintain.
If the car needed 50% or more of its value in repairs, I might change my mind. If I had to pay storage, or if parking was an unbelievable headache I might change my mind. But, again being from LA, the convenience of having a car outweighs the small amount of money I would save in your scenario.
posted by vignettist at 7:37 AM on June 21, 2013
We currently have a newer car that we use for family outings, and a super old car (older than yours, and not a Honda, would that it were) that is doing just fine, but we are very good about keeping up the maintenance on it.
Every once in a while we kick around the idea of selling it / replacing it, but our decision comes down to this: 1. It's paid for; 2. The yearly maintenance and insurance are still way less than if we had to make a car payment; 3. Every month we sock away the equivalent of a car payment towards a future purchase, with the goal that we will eventually purchase a vehicle for cash and not have a car payment.
Things are simply not built the way they used to be, and I firmly believe that whatever I buy in the future will be more maintenance headaches that an older car. That's capitalism. So we figure we hold on to what we've got while it's relatively inexpensive to maintain.
If the car needed 50% or more of its value in repairs, I might change my mind. If I had to pay storage, or if parking was an unbelievable headache I might change my mind. But, again being from LA, the convenience of having a car outweighs the small amount of money I would save in your scenario.
posted by vignettist at 7:37 AM on June 21, 2013
I could sell the car for maybe $3500 as is. Maybe only 3k.
I guess it depends where you live, but I recently bought Honda Civic a few years older than yours with 130K miles on it for about that. My car didn't come with body damage, but the AC has never been great and it may be the same problem. I think you could probably get more than $3000 for it, maybe $4000, if you fixed the bumper and taillight.
Re sell vs. keep, I'm torn. On the one hand, a Honda Civic is a great car and yours will probably run forever. On the other hand, that very fact means that you could probably get a not insignificant amount of money if you sold it.
I agree that you don't absolutely need a second car, and I like tilde's car slush fund suggestion.
posted by Sara C. at 8:11 AM on June 21, 2013
I guess it depends where you live, but I recently bought Honda Civic a few years older than yours with 130K miles on it for about that. My car didn't come with body damage, but the AC has never been great and it may be the same problem. I think you could probably get more than $3000 for it, maybe $4000, if you fixed the bumper and taillight.
Re sell vs. keep, I'm torn. On the one hand, a Honda Civic is a great car and yours will probably run forever. On the other hand, that very fact means that you could probably get a not insignificant amount of money if you sold it.
I agree that you don't absolutely need a second car, and I like tilde's car slush fund suggestion.
posted by Sara C. at 8:11 AM on June 21, 2013
Don't sell it. Fix the tail light. Deal with the dings and the nonfunctioning AC. It's a Honda, and it will still be running when your kid is ready to learn to drive. I don't know how old the kid is, but as people have said above, circumstances may change (you may get a job where you'll need the primary car for the commute; your spouse may start working regularly once the kid is older) and you will not be able to buy a comparable car for anything like the same money. You've got money in it, it runs well and it costs 800 a year to insure; that's nothing.
To those suggesting Zipcar/taxis: car share services are wonderful if you live in the heart of a big city, need a car twice or once a week and are a short walk from one, but the OP sounds like a suburb dweller, and in that case you're talking about taking the kid to the car and back, which is a huge inconvenience. Also, Zipcars and taxis are expensive as hell if you use them with any regularity: I just bought a new car after a year of relying on Zipcars and taxis, and I'm paying much less per month, even including my insurance and gas costs. Granted, I paid cash so I have no payments (inheritance) but even with a payment I'd be coming out ahead.
posted by jrochest at 8:45 AM on June 21, 2013
To those suggesting Zipcar/taxis: car share services are wonderful if you live in the heart of a big city, need a car twice or once a week and are a short walk from one, but the OP sounds like a suburb dweller, and in that case you're talking about taking the kid to the car and back, which is a huge inconvenience. Also, Zipcars and taxis are expensive as hell if you use them with any regularity: I just bought a new car after a year of relying on Zipcars and taxis, and I'm paying much less per month, even including my insurance and gas costs. Granted, I paid cash so I have no payments (inheritance) but even with a payment I'd be coming out ahead.
posted by jrochest at 8:45 AM on June 21, 2013
Seconding davejay's advice. We did this and turned out not to need the second car, but we don't have a child in the house and my husband can walk home from work if he misses the bus. On the other hand, I do have an aged parent in town whom I have to drive to medical appointments as well as visiting her regularly, and that does require a car.
(FWIW, I have a car2go membership--similar to Zipcar--and have not had to use it yet, though I have had to rearrange appointments a few times. I live in Austin near a major bus route but if I need to go places, I would generally have to drive.)
posted by immlass at 9:53 AM on June 21, 2013
(FWIW, I have a car2go membership--similar to Zipcar--and have not had to use it yet, though I have had to rearrange appointments a few times. I live in Austin near a major bus route but if I need to go places, I would generally have to drive.)
posted by immlass at 9:53 AM on June 21, 2013
To those suggesting Zipcar/taxis: car share services are wonderful if you live in the heart of a big city, need a car twice or once a week and are a short walk from one, but the OP sounds like a suburb dweller
The OP says that she commutes to work by subway, and otherwise doesn't mention whether she lives in an urban or suburban landscape.
I agree that it probably depends exactly how dense her area is and the question of whether one "needs" a second car is a really nebulous one that depends on unknowns like the age of her kid or how practical a zipcar or taxi would be.
I think looking into a car-share system would probably be worthwhile. When I lived in New York it was a godsend to have zipcar available. Here in Los Angeles I used it once in an emergency but will probably be canceling my account soon. I think the OP can probably tell whether it's workable or not.
posted by Sara C. at 10:03 AM on June 21, 2013
The OP says that she commutes to work by subway, and otherwise doesn't mention whether she lives in an urban or suburban landscape.
I agree that it probably depends exactly how dense her area is and the question of whether one "needs" a second car is a really nebulous one that depends on unknowns like the age of her kid or how practical a zipcar or taxi would be.
I think looking into a car-share system would probably be worthwhile. When I lived in New York it was a godsend to have zipcar available. Here in Los Angeles I used it once in an emergency but will probably be canceling my account soon. I think the OP can probably tell whether it's workable or not.
posted by Sara C. at 10:03 AM on June 21, 2013
One more anecdata point: I drive a 2000 Honda Civic I've had for 8 years now, it's got 138k on it, and the A/C is shot, too, but apart from the A/C it runs like it's going to run forever. 110k is nothing on a 2001 Civic. There are few more reliable cars and at least you know the history with yours.
posted by fiercecupcake at 10:37 AM on June 21, 2013
posted by fiercecupcake at 10:37 AM on June 21, 2013
Don't sell it. Honda Civics last forever, particularly when maintained, and you just replaced the biggest weak link -- the timing belt. If you discover you need a second car after you sell it, you won't be able to replace it without spending much more money, as you've noted.
It is possible you could sell it for more than $3500, especially if you live where I think you live, largely because of some of the state requirements for used cars in this state. And it's feasible to get by without a second car in this area as well, as long as you need to go where the public transit goes. But if you need to go where a car is required, it'll be ZipCar (doable if you're walking distance to one, but can be difficult on short notice), Car2Go (so far, only in the city, though), and cabs (which, ugh, you've basically got to call a cab to get you).
Keep the car. Fix the things that need to be fixed so you don't get a ticket, don't worry about the other things unless they threaten the car's integrity (e.g., if rust is likely, fix that bumper). You can probably get by for at least another year without fixing the compressor, too -- just try not to drive it in July.
posted by devinemissk at 10:48 AM on June 21, 2013
It is possible you could sell it for more than $3500, especially if you live where I think you live, largely because of some of the state requirements for used cars in this state. And it's feasible to get by without a second car in this area as well, as long as you need to go where the public transit goes. But if you need to go where a car is required, it'll be ZipCar (doable if you're walking distance to one, but can be difficult on short notice), Car2Go (so far, only in the city, though), and cabs (which, ugh, you've basically got to call a cab to get you).
Keep the car. Fix the things that need to be fixed so you don't get a ticket, don't worry about the other things unless they threaten the car's integrity (e.g., if rust is likely, fix that bumper). You can probably get by for at least another year without fixing the compressor, too -- just try not to drive it in July.
posted by devinemissk at 10:48 AM on June 21, 2013
Pretend for two months you don't have that second car. Use zipcar, bikes, etc.
Does this suck? If yes, keep the car.
posted by zippy at 11:26 AM on June 21, 2013 [1 favorite]
Does this suck? If yes, keep the car.
posted by zippy at 11:26 AM on June 21, 2013 [1 favorite]
Keep it.
I've been going through this decision process recently, although it sounds like I am slightly more car-dependent than you. We have two kids that sometimes need to be taken in different directions at different times and one week out of five I need to make daily trips to the hospital 5 miles away at 6 am for work.
Here's why I kept my car: it's cheap. I hate the idea of carrying a new car payment and have you *seen* what new cars cost these days? The cost of insurance seems nominal to me. It's good for emergencies. It's good as a loaner. It's good for in-laws who come to visit and take care of my children while my wife and I go out for a date. And it's fucking convenient, I am prone to oversleeping my alarm. In our case, one car is all wheel drive for snow and mountain trips while the other car is a small city car with good fuel efficiency, so there each car fits a different role.
posted by Slarty Bartfast at 1:28 PM on June 21, 2013
I've been going through this decision process recently, although it sounds like I am slightly more car-dependent than you. We have two kids that sometimes need to be taken in different directions at different times and one week out of five I need to make daily trips to the hospital 5 miles away at 6 am for work.
Here's why I kept my car: it's cheap. I hate the idea of carrying a new car payment and have you *seen* what new cars cost these days? The cost of insurance seems nominal to me. It's good for emergencies. It's good as a loaner. It's good for in-laws who come to visit and take care of my children while my wife and I go out for a date. And it's fucking convenient, I am prone to oversleeping my alarm. In our case, one car is all wheel drive for snow and mountain trips while the other car is a small city car with good fuel efficiency, so there each car fits a different role.
posted by Slarty Bartfast at 1:28 PM on June 21, 2013
FWIW, friends in my neighborhood in DC, who live about a 15-20 minute walk to the Metro, have two kids get by just fine with no car. It amazes me, but there you go. They do rent a car on occasion.
posted by exogenous at 4:39 PM on June 21, 2013
posted by exogenous at 4:39 PM on June 21, 2013
Fix everything and sell it for $5000.00.
posted by oceanjesse at 5:28 PM on June 21, 2013
posted by oceanjesse at 5:28 PM on June 21, 2013
This thread is closed to new comments.
There's always a taxi for an emergency (or heaven forbid, and ambulance) and that would be infinitely less than the mechanical and cosmetic fixes that you'd be doing for this car, as well as the storage and insurance on it.
If you're in an urban area, perhaps a Zipcar makes sense for you.
If a time comes when you actually NEED a second car, then you can buy the one that's 100% right for you.
posted by Ruthless Bunny at 5:57 AM on June 21, 2013 [1 favorite]