Does this ever get better?

February 12, 2013 8:31 AM

I am having a very difficult time dealing with PTSD, especially as it relates to having close relationships with men. I am in my early 40's and for most of my life I didn't realize why I had such a hard time being able to trust others and allow myself to get close to people. Over the past couple of years, I was diagnosed with PTSD stemming from emotional, verbal, and physical abuse during my childhood. I have to say that it was good to discover why I have been screwed up emotionally for so long. At the same time, I am able to see that the kind of men I tend to gravitate toward are either abusive or emotionally not present (just like my parents). I have been in therapy ever since my diagnosis, and am working on building my self-esteem too. I am an awesome woman with a lot to offer and I have come a long way over the years. I can't seem to stop attracting men who hurt me in some way. I want to find a life partner and I know that I deserve to be in a loving and nurturing relationship. But love equals pain even after years of therapy and working on myself. Is there life after PTSD and how do I break this cycle? How can I find a man who loves me for me and wants to be supportive, PTSD and all? Thanks.
posted by strelitzia to human relations (12 answers total)

I can't seem to stop attracting men who hurt me in some way.

You can (subconsciously or not) attract them all you want, just don't date them.

That's not meant to be as flip as it sounds: I (and other women I know) sometimes still "read" as someone who will tolerate bad behavior or take part in a certain sort of dynamic, but boy are those men surprised when I turn them down. Consistently.

Your job is to just worry about this part, which actually is under your control:

I am able to see that the kind of men I tend to gravitate toward are either abusive or emotionally not present (just like my parents).
posted by availablelight at 9:00 AM on February 12 [7 favorites]

A couple of things off the top of my head:

1. Read Why Love Hurts by Eva Illouz. This won't give you any solutions, but it may help you understand causes outside of yourself of why the dating scene is so fraught with pain. I don't disagree with your seeking answers in your background or getting therapy, but I think this issue plagues so many women (and some men) that it can't be purely psychological in origin.
2. Live as though this issue does not preoccupy you at all. That means doing things with female (or gay male) friends or on your own. The issue may still preoccupy you; that's OK. Just don't put your life on hold till you find someone.
3. Stop actively looking for partners. This may mean a long period of nothing. If you're anything like me, that will be preferable to yet another crap relationship.
4. If you do get asked out, pay close attention to any little feelings that tell you that you're in for another go-round. Some things may be resolvable via open communication (even people who are decent partner material will screw up occasionally); some won't. Be prepared to bail decisively.

Seconding availablelight's comment on consistently turning down the ones who show signs of being bad actors.
posted by Currer Belfry at 9:10 AM on February 12 [4 favorites]

One thing is to think about attraction differently. It's not an unstoppable force. All of us, I think, feel an attraction now and then to inappropriate or unhealthy partners. When you're younger and/or unaware of how things are likely to play out with those people, you dive right into those attractions and end up enduring all the misery related to that choice.

But one advantage of time and greater self-knowledge is that you can foresee exactly what all that would be like, having gone there and tried it out. You can notice and even enjoy a bit of that attraction, while at the same time letting your calm, mature brain have a say. He is hot/charming/funny/strong, isn't he. But he's a lot like [dude from the past that turned out to be bad for me. Fun as it is to feel the butterflies, I think I'll let this one fly by.

Attraction is just a feeling. It comes and it goes. It doesn't have to be acted on. It doesn't really demand that we do anything about it. And it certainly doesn't have to dictate your decisions (or no monogamous partnerships would ever make it ever on earth anywhere).

Instead of focusing on the negative ("I must stop being attracted to the bad kind of guy!") I think you need instead to develop some standards and criteria for the good kind of guy you'd like to be with. That way you can be on the lookout for positives instead of negatives, and you'll have a measuring stick for knowing when someone is falling short as well as when they're measuring up. Perhaps with your therapist, sit down and make a list of criteria you seek in a partner. Don't overlook the basics - can manage his money, employed or otherwise appropriately engaged in life, keeps himself presentable. But be sure to add the positive character qualities that you observe in healthy relationships and would choose for yourself: kindness. Politeness. Thoughtfulness. Loyalty. Good relationships with friends and family.

Sometimes the brain has to override the pelvis in these sorts of things. Having a list of criteria that you've thought through can really help train your brain to look for those things and respond positively when you see them. Be patient. If you don't immediately feel gut-level drawn to a new guy, but he's otherwise a decent person who meets your standards, give him some time and get to know him. Attraction may grow. And when you feel a strong attraction to someone you know little about and doesn't promise to be good for you, smile, and let it subside. That's not who you are any more. You can feel it without acting on it, because you have something more important in mind.
posted by Miko at 9:22 AM on February 12 [7 favorites]

It sounds like you're making progress but your tone, to me, seems like you think of yourself as someone who is a victim. Victims attract people that prey on them.

Put your victimhood and PTSD in the past. Look at how you phrased your queston, "how can I find a man who loves me for me and wants to be supportive, PTSD and all?" Don't be a three-legged dog or a one-eyed cat looking for a good home. Be a self confident, self assured, emotionally mature grown up woman looking for the same (in a man). No guy is looking for an emotionally damaged woman to support.

You may not be ready yet for the relationship that you want but you are obviously insightful enough to see your own troubling patterns and that is major progress. You might be better served by focusing on friendships and being socially active. This may give you more confidence in yourself and lead you to better people.

Past trauma doesn't have to define your present. You can be someone who was a victim who is now tough and resilient and can recognize a loser when she meets him.
posted by shoesietart at 10:03 AM on February 12 [3 favorites]

I am an awesome woman with a lot to offer and I have come a long way over the years. I can't seem to stop attracting men who hurt me in some way. I want to find a life partner and I know that I deserve to be in a loving and nurturing relationship. But love equals pain even after years of therapy and working on myself.

One thing I would caution you against it blaming all past relationships on the PTSD. There is a very real degree to which all relationships fail, all partners suck and cause hurt, and all love equals pain... until it doesn't and things work out.

Instead of addressing this as a PTSD issue, I would encourage you to look for general audience resources on developing healthy goals and criteria for dating and relationships. Getting the Love You Want and Theory of Love are often recommended for people both in and looking for relationships.
posted by DarlingBri at 10:40 AM on February 12 [2 favorites]

I'm an early 30's woman who has suffered through PTSD stemming from early childhood abuse. Reading and connecting with other people working through PTSD and abuse-related issues has helped me tremendously in my recovery journey. It has helped me on the LONG process of separating what is ME from what is the appropriate trauma response to the past situation that I was never allowed to express the pain of or heal from before. It has helped me to move from an identity of shame ("I do X because of XYZ in childhood") to an identity of creative resilience ("I do X because I thought the situation reminded me of XYZ, but now I'm going to do ABC because that's what I really wanted to be doing instead").

While I have read many books in my recovery journey, recently I found "A General Theory of Love" gave me great hope and understanding for what's happening limbicly when I attract weirdos/a**holes. From page 163: "... The young man with a fondness for faultfinding lovers... must [first] contend with the mental mechanism that leads him with uncanny precision to a woman who is herself critical. Second, his presence will magnify whatever minatory tendencies his current paramour may possess. ...their limbic Attractors are complementary."

So basically, because of my pre-programming, there IS something in me on a behavioral/neurobiological level that does signal asshats/weirdos to start circling. However, the more work I do on myself and the more self-aware I become (not in the hyperarousal response way that is symptomatic of PTSD, but in the self-reflective kind of way), the better I am able to realize this signalling process when it's happening and then SHUT IT DOWN. Where I used to chastise myself heavily ("I must have done something to make this person behave like X"), I no longer beat myself up or use it as automatic evidence for how god-awful humanity is "yet again".

I've also found self-therapy writing techniques quite beneficial, like those prescribed for depression by David Burns (focuses on cognitive distortions) and affirmations (used in the way John Bradshaw talks about, as a way to overwrite obselete tracks of "you must have done something to deserve it" from childhood imprinting). I also read up on Carl Jung's individuation process. As I'm moving forward in my life now, there's an interesting split in the temptation to regress to past comforts and anxious fear of the new unknown. Being a more genuine you (instead of a collection of anxiety-riddled responses) takes real courage. So does being open to a more genuine relationship enriched with self-honesty by both partners.

I am an awesome woman with a lot to offer...

Don't ever lose sight of this, ever. Even with your unresolved PTSD, your awesomeness is still there. It burns beneath the layers of shit you accumulated from childhood abuse --abuse heaped on to you by adults who, even then, could not bear the tension of your awesomeness, which is why they had to try their damndest (whether consciously or unconsciously) to stamp it out.

But love equals pain even after years of therapy and working on myself.

I'm still single, so I can't confirm being able to find the love without pain part, though I will suggest that pain part is always going to be part of the love. I don't think it's possible to truly love without simultaneously risking your vulnerability to possible pain.

Is there life after PTSD and how do I break this cycle?

Perhaps part of breaking the cycle is coming to terms with your own vulnerability and accepting it (as that vulnerability researcher Brene Brown would likely say). You may date again and the next guy might morph into an asshat. Accept this is a possible outcome regardless of your PTSD --it certainly is for "normal" people. Then hone your boundaries and keep moving forward. After some time you may start to recognize that these asshats are always circulating in the general public, and that it's not so much that there is something about YOU attracting them as the pre-programming that is abundantly available due to the prevalence of unaddressed child abuse in society. Gradually develop what strategy you need to transcend them.

Kk I think I've gone on long enough, though feel free to message me if you have any questions. Best of luck!
posted by human ecologist at 10:52 AM on February 12 [9 favorites]

After some time you may start to recognize that these asshats are always circulating in the general public, and that it's not so much that there is something about YOU attracting them as the pre-programming that is abundantly available due to the prevalence of unaddressed child abuse in society. Gradually develop what strategy you need to transcend them.

Agree 100% with human ecologist here. At least with people in my age group and older, I would say there were more who had abusive parenting (on some level) than not. This is anecdotal, not scientific, but that is my experience. So please don't feel that you are uniquely damaged or that other women have some magic Good Man Attractant pixie dust that you don't. Or, for that matter, happy loving childhoods.

A couple more books I recommend that have helped me: Attached - The New Science of Adult Attachment describes attachment styles and how they affect your dating and love life. One thing it mentions is that there are more "avoidant" people (which you can translate as "asshole") in the dating pool because avoidants tend to be commitmentphobic and so there are more of them single and in circulation.

Not a dating advice book but an excellent look at why and how society produces abusers: In Search of Human Nature by Mary E. Clark (more general evolution and biology but noting attachment disorders).

Specific advice on abusers: Why Does He Do That? by Lundy Bancroft.

On dating: One thing that might help a bit is to be sure you have a lot of options - online dating, church or synagogue if you are religious (or maybe Unitarian Universal fellowship if you aren't; atheists, pagans and eclectics are welcome there), socializing, just plain getting out of the house and meeting people. The more options you feel you have, the less constrained you will feel to lower your standards and Not Be So Picky and think, "He always puts me down/drinks a lot/ can't hold down a job, but...he's the best I can do because good men are scarce." Don't buy into the scarcity mentality. I see this as a HUGE factor in women giving away their power in relationships.
posted by Rosie M. Banks at 11:37 AM on February 12 [3 favorites]

If you haven't yet, I strongly recommend reading work by Bessel van der Kolk, who is a fantastic resource when it comes to explaining the mechanisms of PTSD and the myriad ways it affects your decision-making, subconscious and conscious.

The most helpful book I've read on this precise issue is Women Who Hurt Themselves, which describes a sort of habit the author refers to as 'Trauma Reenactment Syndrome.' I'm definitely of the opinion that methodically pathologizing human behavior in order to neatly sort it into syndromes and disorders is not particularly helpful, but her descriptions of TRS lines up so precisely with my lived experience that reading the book irrevocably changed my perspective and my life. If you read it, there will likely be a lot of "Holy shit! I do that! And I've done that, and that, and that..." It helps you to recognize patterns in the past and present, particularly things you didn't even realize were patterns at all, which is the first step in figuring out what to do next. Trauma and Recovery is another great tome related to PTSD recovery in general.

(On a deeper than intellectual level, I still struggle with this on a regular basis. After a very long period of purposeful celibacy, the first man I timidly agreed to enter into an ostensibly romantic interaction with ended up being a histrionic, manipulative, boundary-destroying, disrespectful douchebag with some expertly hidden sociopathic tendencies... eerily similar to every other man I've ever dated. Oops! This happened after years of study and deep thought, years of therapy and meditation and yoga and long talks with understanding friends -- it's clear that some part of me still isn't Getting It, which means it's back to the drawing board (and celibacy, unfortunately) until I can figure out a way to get it right.)

I won't lie: It is very, very hard to erase the well-worn -- if not necessarily comfortable -- ruts in your brain that whir and spin and scream that you deserve to suffer, that remind you to remember that love equals pain; it is even harder to flip the script entirely and truly internalize what a kind, mutually respectful relationship looks and feels like.
Above all else: Be patient, kind, and forgiving with yourself. The more inherent beauty, value, and worth you manage to recognize in and draw out of yourself, and the more obvious you make it that you will not tolerate a single ounce of manipulative bullshit from a prospective partner, the more likely it is that you will attract people who are both attracted to and respectful of your inherent beauty, value, and worth. Always remember that it is better to be alone than it is to be with someone who treats you poorly, disrespects you, or otherwise abuses you in any way. Good luck!
posted by divined by radio at 11:46 AM on February 12 [5 favorites]

Hello awesome OP! There is some great advice above. I also recommend reading Brene Brown's work on shame and scarcity. (We reduce our options when we think love is 'scarce'.)

My marriage ended in 2000. Between then and 2009 I dated some dicks who were awful game players and bad-boy egoists. They seemed to be the only guys available. The more I dated these types of guys, the more I thought I deserved them.

I dated the last one on and off for nearly three years. He was the shortest, biggest dickbag of them all. I also have a PTSD diagnosis from a grief-stricken, neglectful, abusive and violent childhood. But after dickbag's and my last off-time I decided No More! No More Dicks!

After him I decided to change my focus and think about what type of man I wanted (not what type of man I thought I could catch) and I didn't date at all. Instead I took a good long look at why I was attracting these dickbags. I read the emails from Dating without Drama and found them surprisingly useful. And I wrote a list. I wrote down all the quality characteristics I wanted in a man and prioritised them. I made sure I prioritised good qualities over 'exciting' ones.

By writing down my priority characteristics I had created a filter for myself through which I could assess possible mates. After a year or so I decided I was ready to get back on the dating game. Due to my location, internet dating was my main option. I made sure to highlight my good qualities over my exciting ones in my profile. Ie: I put out what I wanted to attract.

I now live with a warm, caring, generous and loving man. He has his faults, as do I, but I am very happy to have such a quality man in my life. He's the best mate I have ever been with and I would not have found had I not written my list.
posted by Kerasia at 3:09 PM on February 12 [2 favorites]

I would strongly suggest trying online dating, because it offers you some protection and time to reflect on what you want to say and what potential dates are saying to you. In person you might project a shy, wounded quality that makes you attractive to exactly the kind of guy you don't want to attract, and these creepy guys might draw you in despite your best intentions.

Online, you can take the time to make your profile project your best qualities, and when guys contact you, you can watch for warning signs. True, people can be very good at lying online, but it will be safer for you than meeting people in person.
posted by Ursula Hitler at 7:03 PM on February 12

This is kind of the opposite of the advice people often give, but you might consider deliberately doing a bunch of dating with an explicit rule that you don't start any serious relationships. If you feel like this would be too stressful for you, then ignore this idea. But I suggest it because the feeling of wanting a partner can be very intense, and it can make it easier to overlook warning signs because the closeness of a relationship feels so compelling. Approaching dating as practice might give you a chance to tune in to how you feel in different situations and get more confidence in your judgment. It would also give you a chance to meet more different types of men and see that you're not limited to jerks.

About self esteem: to help you get more confidence and feel less damaged, I would suggest making a list of skills you have developed because of the abuse/PTSD that are valuable or useful. This is not to say that it's great that you were abused, but that you have coping skills that are valuable in other parts of life. Some things that could go on the list:
- I'm good at reading people's body language and knowing when someone is upset, even if they don't say anything.
- I stay calm in a crisis because I can dissociate from feelings of fear/panic.
- I am loyal to my close friends.
posted by medusa at 8:14 PM on February 12 [1 favorite]

There are some wise words and great recommendations above. I've come a long way in my own journey with PTSD and relationships. It's a process. Coming to terms with my own propensity to move towards unhealthy people and relationships is a big part of this process, and Patrick Carnes' book Betrayal Bonds helped me understand why I do this, and moved me away from self-hatred and blame. I highly recommend this book.

Strelitsia, best wishes. Feel free to email me.
posted by lucyleaf at 9:53 AM on February 13