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Wait, that's illegal. So what, everyone does it here. No one cares.
August 8, 2012 10:23 AM   Subscribe

I'm curious. Are there illegal, but acceptable, practices in your neck of the woods?

Here's the thing, while stopped at a traffic light a month or so ago, I watched a person in the lane to my right (kitty corner to me) who was waiting for his left turn arrow to turn green just give up waiting and turn left on red. I was like, "Whoa, he totally ran a red light." I chalked it up to an impatient driver and moved on. Then, about two weeks ago, while walking my dog, I watched four cars do the same thing... They all just drove right through a left red arrow -- one right after the other. So I asked my honey about it and he said, "Yeah, they do that here." I've traveled a lot through the U.S. of A. and I've never seen that before. It got me thinking...

On the East Coast, and especially in the South where much of it is rural, it's no big thing to walk across the street any ol' where and against the light, but where I grew up (Northern Cali), we crossed at the light and when the light was green because jaywalking is a thing. I remember a friend of mine from the East Coast getting pissed for getting fined for jaywalking while in CA. I've seen people on the West Coast, esp. in the Pacific North West, wait in the rain on a deserted corner for the light to change so they can cross the road. Heck, I've waited in the rain on a deserted corner for the light to change... It's just how I was taught. But I've lived in the South for too long, I'll cross the street on red now.

I think that walking against the light or in the middle of the street is technically illegal in the South (the code for MS just mentions crossing at intersections, but Virginia specifically mentions pedestrians entering the street with disregard to traffic), but it's accepted. Just as I'm pretty sure that turning left against a red arrow is illegal here, but it seems to be acceptable to do so (my guy says he's gotten honked at for *not* turning on red). So my question is, are there practices (I'm thinking traffic-wise, but I'll take others) in your area that are not legal per se, but are acceptable? I'm not talking about things like American Blue Laws, but real, enforceable laws that people in your area just chose to ignore.
posted by patheral to Society & Culture (112 answers total) 17 users marked this as a favorite
 
In Massachusetts, it's illegal to text while driving. But it's not illegal to talk on the phone (sans headset) while driving, and cops can't tell the difference. So they don't enforce it, and people ignore it. (And a subway driver almost killed someone because of it.)
posted by Melismata at 10:29 AM on August 8, 2012 [1 favorite]


In Los Angeles it's completely acceptable and expected that after the light turns red TWO (only two!) cars in the left turn lane can freely turn and the traffic in the opposite direction will allow this. Without this unwritten rule no one would get anywhere and it's so common that people do it in front of cops.
posted by banannafish at 10:30 AM on August 8, 2012 [22 favorites]


California stop?
posted by RandlePatrickMcMurphy at 10:31 AM on August 8, 2012


I've seen the Pittsburgh Left (where the first person turning left at a stoplight does so as soon as the light turns green, before oncoming cars go) pretty frequently since moving up here ... I'm even getting fairly decent at it myself!
posted by DingoMutt at 10:31 AM on August 8, 2012 [5 favorites]


In suburban Maryland it's relatively common for people waiting to turn left on a busy 4-lane to just pull out and block the near lanes until they can continue into the far lanes. I wouldn't describe it as "acceptable" but I've never seen anyone get in trouble for it.

When I was driving in Chicago, an otherwise mild-mannered local friend yelled at me for not doing a Pittsburgh Left.
posted by mindsound at 10:33 AM on August 8, 2012


Practically every municipality has laws requiring motorcycles to have mufflers, and also general noise ordinances prohibiting noise over a certain number of decibels. When you hear a really loud motorcycle, it's been illegally modified to be that way--they come from the factory relatively quiet. So everyone with a loud motorcycle has ignored the muffler and noise ordinances, and the cops virtually never enforce them. It's not really a local thing as it seems to be the way it is everywhere, but if you're looking for real, enforceable laws that people just choose to ignore, that's my pick, because it drives me fucking insane.
posted by HotToddy at 10:36 AM on August 8, 2012 [18 favorites]


In a lot of places, underage drinking & marijuana possession laws. Are those too obvious? I'm in the Netherlands and often have to remind curious Americans that it's technically illegal to purchase and possess marijuana here.
posted by knile at 10:38 AM on August 8, 2012 [2 favorites]


When I went to school in Cleveland around 1998, cars would creep way into the intersection especially when there were no cars and the light was about to turn green.
posted by wongcorgi at 10:38 AM on August 8, 2012


I was taught in driver's ed that you can turn left on red IF you are on a one-way street, turning onto another one-way street. But I generally see people here turn left on red any time they are on a one-way street, even if they're turning on to a two-way street.
posted by Ausamor at 10:38 AM on August 8, 2012 [1 favorite]


I've traveled a lot too and my observation is that local culture really influences this stuff. The South, for instance, has a rebel tradition that can make it almost a point of pride to assert one's individuality on the highway. Road-rage central. On the other hand, there's a tradition of good citizenship and consideration in the Pacific NW that leans the other way. I lived a long time in Miami where the combination of Southern and Latin individualism and resistance to authority was heightened by Hurricane Andrew, which trashed the traffic lights for weeks. So people got used to justifying individualistic intersection behavior. And the first time I drove in Seattle, after Miami, I noticed signs saying No Horns, Let Pedestrians Cross, and got the evil eye when my Miami habits overcame me and I broke both commandments.
But I quickly adapted and much much prefer the good citizen model.
Miami is the worst U.S. city to drive in.
By far.
posted by fivesavagepalms at 10:38 AM on August 8, 2012 [2 favorites]


In Texas, the law specifically says that when making a left or right turn into a multi-lane roadway you must enter the closest lane. (So when turning right, you must turn right into the rightmost lane on the road you're entering.) The "Texas Turn" is when someone turns right and ends up in the leftmost lane. Bonus points if it's a jacked up pickup truck, bonus points if the road is at least three lanes in each direction.
posted by SpecialK at 10:39 AM on August 8, 2012 [3 favorites]


Loose dogs. I live out in the country and it's technically illegal but nobody cares.
posted by workerant at 10:40 AM on August 8, 2012 [2 favorites]


Unless it's quota time and/or you're being really flagrant about it, cops in NYC don't tend to bug people* about drinking beer in brown paper bags, having their feet up on subway seats, sleeping on subway benches and so on.

*Well, white people, at least.
posted by griphus at 10:41 AM on August 8, 2012


I've seen the Pittsburgh Left (where the first person turning left at a stoplight does so as soon as the light turns green, before oncoming cars go) pretty frequently since moving up here ... I'm even getting fairly decent at it myself!
Oh my goodness. I didn't know this was "bad"! I do it all of the time. I do it in Buffalo, too; it's even easier there because the suburbs are all 4-8 lane highways, and I can get left before the other traffic makes it halfway across. I guess it's probably not too appreciated. I will have to stop now. Of course, a "Buffalo left" is a freaking U-turn and then turning right, so it evens out.
posted by peacrow at 10:41 AM on August 8, 2012 [1 favorite]


*I learned to drive in Pittsburgh...
posted by peacrow at 10:42 AM on August 8, 2012 [1 favorite]


I've seen people on the West Coast, esp. in the Pacific North West, wait in the rain on a deserted corner for the light to change so they can cross the road.

I hear & read this all the time, and it boggles my mind. I'm not sure where in Portland people see this behavior. Maybe the eastside, where you'd be killed instantly trying to jaywalk?

I was actually going to chime in with jaywalking - it's pretty much Portland's official religion. I went to school downtown for 4 years, and worked downtown for 9; walked several miles a week through downtown. 99.9% of pedestrians jaywalk. I rarely see someone wait for a walk signal unless it's otherwise impossible to cross due to vehicle traffic.
posted by peep at 10:43 AM on August 8, 2012 [1 favorite]


Eating a grape from the produce aisle is technically stealing, but generally acceptable.

Eating a watermelon isn't.
posted by xingcat at 10:44 AM on August 8, 2012 [10 favorites]


peep, I've never lived in Porland, I lived in the Puget Sound area, worked in Seattle, and lived in Northern Cali. That's were I observed the waiting at the red lights... Portland is a force unto itself.
posted by patheral at 10:45 AM on August 8, 2012


Bicyclists here in San Francisco almost universally ignore stop signs.
posted by gyusan at 10:46 AM on August 8, 2012 [1 favorite]


Also, I don't think I have ever heard of anyone I know getting fined for either disobeying leash laws (which is rare) or not cleaning up dogshit (which is really common.)
posted by griphus at 10:46 AM on August 8, 2012


Woah, I didn't know that Pittsburgh Left was famous enough for its own wikipedia page. Pittsburgh parking chairs are of questionable legality. Additionally, you're supposed to park your car on the right side of the street (ie, your passenger side is to the curb) because to do otherwise is to essentially be going against traffic, but I have never seen this enforced in any small-town residential neighborhoods.
posted by specialagentwebb at 10:46 AM on August 8, 2012 [4 favorites]


Loose dogs. I live out in the country and it's technically illegal but nobody cares.

Also loose cats. They're often included in leash laws, but pretty much everywhere in the US has outside cats hanging out.
posted by itsamermaid at 10:47 AM on August 8, 2012 [1 favorite]


Smoking marijuana in British Columbia. (In one city where I used to live, every year on April 20th the park right next to City Hall is full of so many people smoking pot that visibility is almost a concern.)
posted by snorkmaiden at 10:47 AM on August 8, 2012 [3 favorites]


In the Kansai region of Japan (Osaka, Kobe, Kyoto) it is perfectly ok to run red lights. There's a 1~2 second free zone for it. The lights for all directions stay red for a few seconds before giving the green to traffic that has been waiting and the traffic being stopped abuses this. It is such a part of the driving culture here that if you don't do it it could cause an accident because the person behind you assumes that you'll run the red. It took me a while to get use to it and it's troublesome when driving back in the USA.
posted by sleepytako at 10:47 AM on August 8, 2012 [2 favorites]


Yeah, marijuana is a big one. Unless there is another crime involved, or you get caught selling, use is *pretty* much ignored in Portland (and was also in New York when I lived there).

Growing up in Iowa, we did a lot of really illegal things that were acceptable. We made a lot of relatively large explosives and set them off in public places, launched them from homemade trebuchets, drove around in cars and launched bottle rockets at each other while driving. This type of behavior amongst high school kids was pretty common and no one ever got in any kind of legal trouble. In fact, the only time we had a run-in with the police for blowing stuff up outside of our church was because someone thought someone was trying to break in. The cops just let us go, despite having a large supply of Iowa-illegal fireworks and other IED type things with us. (This behavior would never fly in the city, however).

Also, internet porn at large.
posted by Lutoslawski at 10:47 AM on August 8, 2012 [3 favorites]


The town just north of me mandates gun ownership, but I don't believe that law has ever been enforced.
posted by deadmessenger at 10:47 AM on August 8, 2012 [1 favorite]


In NYC, it is totally common and normal to touch the bumpers of cars with your car when you are parallel parking. People may not like it, but its common enough that you often see cars parked with bumper guards. This is unheard of in the South (seriously, every southerner to whom I've mentioned it has had their jaw drop), and I think many people would almost consider it an automobile accident.
posted by kimdog at 10:56 AM on August 8, 2012 [8 favorites]


Fireworks.

In Ohio, it is legal to purchase them but it is illegal to set them off. You even have to sign a form stating that you'll be taking them outside the state of Ohio.
The extent to which the police turn a blind eye really depends on the particular municipality that you're in and when you're doing it. A few blocks away where some friends live, several police officers who live on their block set off the fireworks on 4th of July night.
posted by fizzix at 10:56 AM on August 8, 2012 [1 favorite]


In Texas, the law specifically says that when making a left or right turn into a multi-lane roadway you must enter the closest lane.

I thought this was true, SpecialK, but in defensive driving, I found out that in fact drivers are entitled to turn into any open lane and now I do it myself without compunction.

http://www.statutes.legis.state.tx.us/Docs/TN/htm/TN.545.htm
Sec. 545.101.2
2) after entering the intersection, turn left, leaving the intersection so as to arrive in a lane lawfully available to traffic moving in the direction of the vehicle on the roadway being entered.
posted by mattbucher at 10:57 AM on August 8, 2012 [1 favorite]


As backup to kimdog, I grew up in NYC (and do not drive, but my mom did) and had no idea that people don't do that.
posted by griphus at 10:57 AM on August 8, 2012


Speeding. Everywhere.
posted by tommyD at 11:02 AM on August 8, 2012 [8 favorites]


I found out that in fact drivers are entitled to turn into any open lane and now I do it myself without compunction.

Only when turning left. The rule for turning right is in subsection (a): "To make a right turn at an intersection, an operator shall make both the approach and the turn as closely as practicable to the right-hand curb or edge of the roadway."
posted by grouse at 11:03 AM on August 8, 2012


In Michigan, pedestrians technically have the right of way in an unsignaled crosswalk (as long as they are already in the crosswalk; there's some fuzziness about intention of entering the crosswalk and particular city ordinances.) But I don't think most motorists know this; I've been nearly run down more than once trying to cross a street near my home.
posted by nat at 11:04 AM on August 8, 2012 [1 favorite]


When I lived for a year in a small town in South Dakota, in the winter it was expected that once the light turned red, several cars in that lane would slowly slide through the intersection. You just waited for them to go because it was safer than people slamming their brakes on when the light turned yellow or red as the roads were solid ice with a bit of sand for traction at that point. I witnessed this happening in front of police cars several times.

Nobody drove faster than about 15 mph either, because a fender bender was inevitable at some point. However, the one person I could not believe was on the road was someone who'd cleared away only enough snow from their windshield to leave a square about a foot on either side to peer through. Snow on the side and back windows? Solid. I stayed far, far away from them.
posted by telophase at 11:06 AM on August 8, 2012


In San Francisco lots of idiots park on the sidewalk since they are too lazy to find legal parking.
posted by bottlebrushtree at 11:10 AM on August 8, 2012


So, I didn't know this, but it appears that some form of left turn on red is actually legal in most of the US.
In the U.S., 37 states and Puerto Rico allow left turns on red only if both the origin and destination streets are one way. Six other states, namely Alaska, Florida, Idaho, Michigan, Oregon and Washington, allow left turns on red onto a one-way street even from a two-way street. In Washington, freeway on-ramps are considered one-way streets for the purposes of the left turn on red law. The following states and territories ban left turns on red: South Dakota (unless permitted by local ordinance), Connecticut, Maine, Missouri, New Hampshire, North Carolina, the District of Columbia, and Guam. New York City also prohibits left turn on red lights, unless a sign indicates otherwise.

In Canada, left turn on red light from a one-way road into a one-way road is permitted except in some areas of Quebec, New Brunswick, and Prince Edward Island. Left turn on red light from a two-way road into a one-way road is permitted in British Columbia, but only if the driver turns onto the closest lane and yields to pedestrians and cross traffic.
posted by beagle at 11:19 AM on August 8, 2012 [2 favorites]


Drivers in Northern Virginia universally ignore pedestrians in crosswalks, even with those specialized stand-up signs noting it's a law to stop for pedestrians. This includes police officers who drive through them when pedestrians are obviously trying to cross the road.
posted by the foreground at 11:20 AM on August 8, 2012 [1 favorite]


I was going through the charters of every city in Michigan last summer for school and found one that required the city to maintain no less than five hitching posts, to include one at City Hall and one at the city limits on each road into town. I found that so hilarious that I called the city clerk and asked whether it was still being done. Ever had someone roll their eyes so hard you could hear it over the phone? Apparently she's been trying to get that amended for thirty years, but no one can be arsed to put it on a ballot.
posted by Etrigan at 11:23 AM on August 8, 2012 [2 favorites]


Bicyclists here in San Francisco almost universally ignore stop signs.

Cyclists in SF are pretty sure they have all the rights of both pedestrians and vehicles, with the restrictions of neither.
posted by fleacircus at 11:23 AM on August 8, 2012 [19 favorites]


I have never seen more drivers either go straight from a turn-only lane or turn left from a straight-only lane than in San Antonio, TX. I think it's a combination of the widespread frontage road system with semi-inconsistent lane rules (whether the second lane is left-turn-only, left-straight, or straght-only) and poor signage.

On the other hand, the 4-way-stop law in SA seems to be "If you approach a stop sign and you can see another car anywhere near the intersection, stop and wait for them to reach their stop sign before negotiating with hand-signals who should go first."
posted by muddgirl at 11:24 AM on August 8, 2012 [3 favorites]


Wisconsinites routinely "hang out" in the left lane despite this law:
Upon all roadways of sufficient width the operator of a vehicle shall drive on the right half of the roadway and in the right-hand lane of a 3-lane highway, except [...]
(b) When overtaking and passing under circumstances in which the rules relating to overtaking and passing permit or require driving on the left half of the roadway [...]
I didn't realize it was abnormal until my husband moved here from Illinois. Every single day you see people driving in the left lane, often 5 miles under the speed limit, for no apparent reason. Until five minutes ago I wasn't sure it was an actual law.

(Also, drinking and driving here is much more socially acceptable - and thus, common - than it is in other areas. I wouldn't say it's encouraged, exactly, but most people don't look at you like you're a horrible monster. I probably know a dozen people with DUIs.)
posted by desjardins at 11:25 AM on August 8, 2012 [2 favorites]


Massive fireworks displays with projectile fireworks in DC on the Fourth of July (which is actually pretty fabulous). Also failing to clean up dog turds.
posted by Cocodrillo at 11:25 AM on August 8, 2012


Here in the Twin Cities, it's generally accepted to speed through a changing light even if it's already fully red. This can also manifest as 2 or 3 cars turning left after the light has turned red.

This is not driving related, but many of my neighbors seem to feel no shame in raking their leaves onto the street the night before the street sweeper comes. I know that in some places this is legal and that some towns have cool leaf vacuum things. St. Paul does not, and it is specifically illegal to do so.
posted by cabingirl at 11:27 AM on August 8, 2012


On many Detroit-area highways it's generally accepted that the actual speed limit is 5-10 mph higher than the posted signs say. Even the cops will impatiently pass you if you go slower.

Also it's been my experience that in Manhattan pedestrians routinely and universally ignore all street signs, cross walks, oncoming traffic, and all other pedestrian laws in general and there don't seem to be any consequences (other than compromised personal safety).
posted by Vorteks at 11:27 AM on August 8, 2012 [1 favorite]


To offer a non-traffic-law example...

Most states that have a sales tax also have what's called "use tax." This tax applies to purchases where the sales tax was not levied at the point of purchase, regardless of where the purchase was made. The use tax rate is almost always equivalent to the sales tax rate.

In other words, under the law in most states, you still owe tax on all of your Amazon purchases, even if Amazon doesn't collect that tax at the time of purchase. There is typically a line on the state's income tax form where you are supposed to report and pay any use tax owed on the previous year's purchases. For a more physical example, residents of Massachusetts who drive to New Hampshire to make purchases still technically owe a 6.25% use tax to Massachusetts on all of those NH purchases. But virtually no one pays up.
posted by Nothlit at 11:28 AM on August 8, 2012 [4 favorites]


[Folks, it would be terrific if you could just give the OP examples of what they are looking for and don't start arguing with other commenters or talking about what is/isn't safe. Thank you.]
posted by jessamyn at 11:29 AM on August 8, 2012


Here in the Twin Cities, it's generally accepted to speed through a changing light even if it's already fully red. This can also manifest as 2 or 3 cars turning left after the light has turned red.

Here in the Twin Cities, this is not as generally accepted as you might think. I don't know anyone who thinks this is okay.

However, when driving during a snow storm, all bets are off re: traffic laws and general rules of the road. Some grudgingly accept this (me), some revel in it (screw those A-holes).
posted by VTX at 11:32 AM on August 8, 2012


Nothlit, here in Texas the state cares very much if you skip your Use Tax. However, only companies, and only over a certain size, get checked.

I know because I am dealing with a 5 year audit right now.

Now, about parking over the sidewalk...
posted by Midnight Skulker at 11:32 AM on August 8, 2012


Smoking pot and pirating music/movies/TV shows. I'm a student, though, so it's a different sort of "neck of the woods" than what most people are talking about.
posted by naturalog at 11:37 AM on August 8, 2012 [1 favorite]


when i lived in colorado, the light would turn red and 3-4 more cars would go through it. in fact, my boyfriend's mother sent me one of those "you know you live in colorado when..." e-mail forwards, and it was like, #5 or something. being from northern CA, it freaked me out for the longest time, and i got honked at many times for, you know, actually STOPPING when the light turned red. THE SHAME. whatever.

the stop light/sign blowing is not exclusive to SF bicyclists - it extends all the way down to the peninsula and the south bay.
posted by koroshiya at 11:39 AM on August 8, 2012


In Chicago: Riding a bicycle on the sidewalk (depends on the neighborhood how often you see it), you're supposed to have a white front bike light after dark, not following various traffic laws (riding the wrong way down one-way streets, not stopping at stop lights/signs, illegal turns, locking bikes to private property). I blew stop signs in front of cops 3 times today and they didn't even blink—I usually try to stop around cops but I was on an unfamiliar street.

Fireworks are illegal but there's so many around the 4th that nobody enforces it.

I had some people from Germany visiting a few years back and my brazen jaywalking blew their minds. They wanted to wait for the light, go to the corner, etc. and it took me a while to convince them it's okay (even though it's technically illegal).

It's also illegal not to shovel snow on your sidewalk in front of your business or home but I've never heard of that being enforced. Apparently there's a $50-500 per day fine.
posted by Bunglegirl at 11:40 AM on August 8, 2012


I live really really far north and it seems like different rules apply up here for most things. Couple of quick examples:

Where I live, it's quite common for employees to smoke while working in industrial shops (and sometimes in the offices too). The police overlook this regularly.

In the oilpatch that surrounds my town, there are serious safety regulations that are laid out by OH&S. Oil companies have extremely strict and stringent safety requirements, and hold subcontractors to those standards as well. That is, until something breaks. As soon as the rig is down (at the operational cost of over $14,000 per hour, not including the lost income), the rig must be fixed, and NOTHING ELSE MATTERS. No safety ticket? Dangerous working conditions? Nobody cares, as long as someone's solving the problem.
posted by mireille at 11:41 AM on August 8, 2012


I live in New York. My boyfriend lived in the US southeast until he moved in with me. Things he is astounded we get away with on the roads here:

* Slipping past cars waiting to turn left by swerving around them on the right (on a road with a single lane in each direction, and no turning lane). Apparently if you did this in his home state, you would be slapped, hard, with a massive ticket.

*Jaywalking, and the concomitant yielding to pedestrians. It blows his mind that when we're in Manhattan, people just step out in front of oncoming cars on the (apparent?) basis of "What? If you hit me, you know you're the one going to jail, so suck it up and brake!"

*Use of the rightmost highway lane as the "doing the speed limit" lane. Where he comes from, you drive in the right lane if you're doing under the speed limit, and the middle lane if you're doing the speed limit. Around here, doing the speed limit in the middle lane is pretty much completely unacceptable and you'll find yourself tailgated and maybe flipped off by frustrated drivers.
posted by badgermushroomSNAKE at 11:43 AM on August 8, 2012


Philadelphia: crosswalks appear to be optional, even if the road is four lanes across. Parking chairs are parking space savers. Sometimes, the sidewalk is a parking lane. You can do anything involving a phone while driving. In the suburbs, turn signals appear to be optional, and frequently cars turning left will continue for three + cars even after their arrow has gone red. Passing on red is a great option.
posted by jetlagaddict at 11:45 AM on August 8, 2012


"California stop?"

This is fairly widespread and many places just call it "[city/town name here] Stop"
posted by mikepop at 11:48 AM on August 8, 2012


When I lived in Atlanta, the speed limit on some of the major interstates was 55-65 and you would literally die if you tried to drive that slow. 75-80 was the minimum, at least when things weren't backed up, if you didn't want to be run over.

Fireworks were illegal in the the town I grew up in, which meant that the cop that lived across the street always gave awesome fireworks shows with all the confiscated fireworks he'd gotten on the job. And yeah, the sky regularly looked like an artillery display. But technically, it was all illegal.
posted by Ghostride The Whip at 11:51 AM on August 8, 2012 [1 favorite]


I learned to drive in Texas and when I first moved to Saint Louis I freaked quite a few passengers out by turning left on red on one-ways. They thought I was crazy; I think they're crazy. I'll still fight it if I'm ever ticketed, don't know if it's legal here or not. I always assumed it is and they just didn't know.
Also I moved here from San Diego and wanted so badly to take a picture and send it back when I saw two cops jaywalking downtown with the Gateway Arch framed perfectly behind them.
Also maybe it's changed but I've seen police toss cigarette butts out the car window in Houston. I seem to remember littering was anything but butts.
posted by hypersloth at 11:52 AM on August 8, 2012


Slipping past cars waiting to turn left by swerving around them on the right

What? That's totally okay! (Chicago)
posted by goethean at 12:04 PM on August 8, 2012 [4 favorites]


Here in the Twin Cities, this is not as generally accepted as you might think. I don't know anyone who thinks this is okay.

I don't know anyone who thinks it's okay either, but that doesn't mean it doesn't happen all.the.damned.time. It's much more common here than anywhere else I have lived, and the cops don't ever seem to do anything about it.
posted by cabingirl at 12:04 PM on August 8, 2012


In NYC, it is totally common and normal to touch the bumpers of cars with your car when you are parallel parking.

I'm from Philadelphia. That's what bumpers are for.
posted by madcaptenor at 12:05 PM on August 8, 2012 [5 favorites]


I live in North Carolina, very close to the SC border. Fireworks that are legal in SC are illegal in NC, so of course there are huge fireworks stores just over the state line. Everyone in my neighborhood gets fireworks for the 4th of July and New Years, and the annoying people shoot them all year round. Never heard of anyone getting in trouble for it.
posted by Daily Alice at 12:06 PM on August 8, 2012


Also, I don't think I have ever heard of anyone I know getting fined for either disobeying leash laws (which is rare)

In my middle-class/UMC neighborhood this is pretty common - some people just let their pets out to do their business in the front yard or in their neighbor's front yard off-leash (yes, we all have backyards). I don't know of anyone getting fined because our Animal Control department is underfunded and overworked, and I don't even know if cops can legally enforce the animal control laws, or if they're just unwilling to.
posted by muddgirl at 12:07 PM on August 8, 2012


Bicyclists here in San Francisco almost universally ignore stop signs.

And at least half of them habitually ride on the sidewalk.
posted by trip and a half at 12:13 PM on August 8, 2012


Here in Ottawa, Ontario;
1) Cyclists not obeying the rules of the road (running stop signs, not signaling, etc.) despite being considered "vehicles" in Ontario Traffic Law
2) Accelerating through a yellow light when driving
3) Routinely driving about 20 km above the speed limit
4) Shovelling snow from a driveway out into the street during the winter
posted by LN at 12:19 PM on August 8, 2012 [1 favorite]


In New Mexico, drivers often do not use their turn indicators. Perhaps is is legal to not do so there; enough people skip it to make me wonder. Driving in the Southwest is scary.

In D.C., it is illegal to ride a bike on the sidewalk in certain parts of town during certain hours. You'd never know it, though.
posted by jgirl at 12:22 PM on August 8, 2012


In San Francisco - smoking pot on the street.
posted by bendy at 12:25 PM on August 8, 2012


It's fairly common around here to skip your turn at a four-way stop if your path doesn't intersect with the person whose turn it is - i.e., both people are facing each other and going straight, so you can both go at the same time without colliding. I'm pretty sure that's illegal, but it sure is expedient. Perhaps relevant is that most of these four way stops I'm thinking of have two branches that are rarely traveled.

There are also a few one-way bridges in my town, and it's widely understood that three cars may go in one direction at a time before yielding to oncoming waiting traffic. Not illegal, but it's a cool unspoken convention that has become the rule.
posted by qxntpqbbbqxl at 12:35 PM on August 8, 2012


Boston doesn't really have traffic police. I have (twice) seen cars make left turns from the right lane of a two-lanes-each-way street. The attitude is, if they do it quickly and get out of my way, why get bothered?
posted by benito.strauss at 1:00 PM on August 8, 2012


In Toronto (and most parts of Canada), weed is ostensibly still illegal, but you'd have to try really hard to get arrested for simple possession or even smoking outside.

Also in Toronto, driving like an asshole is sort of a local pass time- running a late red is pretty common, and plenty of people like to pop into the right-hand lane when they approach an intersection with a line of stopped cars, and then pop in front of the lead car as soon as the light has changed.

In Chicago, if you shovel the snow from a parking spot near your residence, you can place an old chair or similar object there while you are away, to reserve it for your return. If someone else parks there you can key their car or put a brick through their windshield. This practice was even condoned by the Mayor.
posted by TheWhiteSkull at 1:06 PM on August 8, 2012 [1 favorite]


Something I noticed after moving to NYC was that people make u-turns at red lights. Confusing for a pedestrian trying to cross the street.

Double parking, while technically illegal in NYC, happens so much that I don't think it is enforced. You'll drive down some streets and there are more than five cars double parked - this is not just for opposite side street parking either - and sometimes there will be cars double parked on both sides of the street forcing a driver to slalom.
posted by sciencegeek at 1:13 PM on August 8, 2012


There are asshole drivers illegally parked in approximately every bike lane in New York City. Cops especially.
posted by akgerber at 1:20 PM on August 8, 2012 [2 favorites]


Double parking is so accepted in NYC that I've heard flashing hazard lights referred to as "double parking lights". [Well, okay, it was in a cartoon. "But officer, I had my double parking lights on.". But it's got to be reflective of some reality.]
posted by benito.strauss at 1:22 PM on August 8, 2012


Kitchener, Ontario: people failing to signal their exit out of a roundabout.
posted by jamincan at 1:56 PM on August 8, 2012


The parking chair phenomenon in Chicago is called "dibs" and is a citywide institution. (This dibs photo blog always cracks me up.)

In South Philadelphia, there are streets where it is acceptable to park in the middle of the street (on major four-lane roads that also have parking down both sides of the street), and in certain South Philly neighborhoods cars double-park down the entire length of a block. I can't imagine either of these practices is actually legal, but I've never heard of anyone being ticketed or towed for either one.
posted by jessypie at 2:16 PM on August 8, 2012 [1 favorite]


I was at a local (Chicago area) training conference with many folks from other states (most from the US east coast, but can't remember which particular areas). They were amazed that around here, when turning left onto a busy 4-lane road that has a median strip, it's ok and encouraged to first pull out onto the median when the traffic from the left permits it, and then wait for a chance to pull into the traffic coming from the right, sort of a two-part left turn. I guess where most of them were from, you had to wait for it to be clear in both directions before pulling out, and you would get ticketed otherwise.

Also, there are a lot of ordinances related to one's property that aren't enforced around my area unless someone [repeatedly] complains, like burning leaves or having a large bonfire, noise, building a fence or outbuilding too close to the property line, parking your RV on the street, raising chickens, owning more than a certain number of dogs, etc.
posted by SuperSquirrel at 2:32 PM on August 8, 2012


Slipping past cars waiting to turn left by swerving around them on the right (on a road with a single lane in each direction, and no turning lane).

In many of the Michigan roads near where I live, an otherwise gravelly shoulder will be paved across from a T junction to facilitate this. Just enough pavement to get around a car waiting to turn left.

Technically, you're supposed to come to a complete stop at a STOP sign. Hardly anyone does that; most of the time one just slows down, especially if there is no contention for the intersection and there is good visibility. Even if there is a lot of traffic for the intersection, if there is a clear rhythm going on (e.g. alternating North/South, East/West), drivers will time their arrival with their turn and may not completely stop.

There is an official precedence order for who goes first when multiple cars reach a 3 or 4 way stop at the same time. If one driver hesitates, someone is likely to go for it regardless of those rules. Either that or everyone will stop and use hand signals.

Most intersections have these thick stop lines that you're supposed to stop behind. They're actually these textured plastic sheets glued to the road, not paint. If there is a marked crosswalk, it's separate and way in front of that. They are taken as suggestions and sometimes cars actually stop such that the entire car is in front of the stop line. It's really a pain when you're making a left turn and have to get around someone in the left turn lane to your left doing that. Luckily, the intersections seem to have a big margin around them so cross traffic doesn't get blocked by doing that.

I usually stop at or near the stop lines, unless I'm planning to make a right turn after a stop, in which case I'll stop far enough up so that I have a clear view of the intersection without sticking out. This can easily put half the car over the line.
posted by Foolhardy at 2:36 PM on August 8, 2012


Oh also, Michigan law says you're supposed to stay in the rightmost lane unless there's continuous traffic or you are passing or about to turn left. Lots of people just drive in the left lane, even if they're going slower than the rest of the traffic.
posted by Foolhardy at 2:39 PM on August 8, 2012


Massachusetts.

Double parking in certain neighborhoods of Boston is de rigeur. Sometimes you will get a ticket but usually you will just get a warning.

Jaywalking everywhere in the state. Not really illegal I guess because pedestrians have the right of way. Can always tell someone is a tourist by whether or not they wait for the light before crossing the street.

Marijuana. State just passed a law that basically says if you have under an ounce you get a slap on the wrist ($100 fine). Police in the city occasionally go after smokers but they have bigger things to worry about.

Fireworks. Totally illegal here in the state but go out at night anytime near the fourth of July and it's chaos in the skies. At least where I live.

Passing in the slow lanes on the highway. I was told that was legal but I don't think that's the case. Add to that, people travelling in the passing lanes. Also driving in the breakdown lanes when there is unexpected traffic. Really pisses me off but people do it a lot and usually get away with it. Also blocking the box. It's illegal but NEVER enforced like it is in other cities. Happens constantly and is just a fact of life. I could go on about driving for awhile but won't bother.
posted by WickedPissah at 2:59 PM on August 8, 2012


Fireworks (like, the big 4th of July kind) are illegal in North Carolina but tons of people drive down to buy them in South Carolina (where they are legal) and bring them back home in time for the 4th.
posted by krakus at 3:18 PM on August 8, 2012


There's a move I call the "Maryland Swivel" I see here ALL THE TIME.

Cars approach a red light on a four lane road. One lane has four cars, the other one car. The last driver(s) in the lane with more cars swivel over to the lane with fewer cars right as they approach the stopping point.

In Virginia, the lanes have solid white lines for like 40 ft from a stop light. No Maryland Swivel in VA.

I actually have a song about this I've been wanting to post to mefi music.
posted by frecklefaerie at 3:27 PM on August 8, 2012 [1 favorite]


What DingoMutt called the Pittsburgh Left happens all the time in western Massachusetts. It dumbfounded me when I moved there from Chicago. Now I find myself tempted to do it, especially at a wide intersection where it's obvious that the first car or two turning left could clear the intersection before the oncoming traffic arrives. However, I resist, because there's always the chance that the first oncoming driver is a jerk with a big engine.
posted by brianogilvie at 3:55 PM on August 8, 2012


Double-parking on Sunday in the Mission district in SF is tolerated as it's assumed that the cars belong to church goers. At least, that's what our real estate agent told us when we were trying to find a legal sport to park.
posted by peripathetic at 4:06 PM on August 8, 2012


Holy cow - I moved to MI recently and noticed this left-on-red insanity. I, too, have been honked at several times for refusing to break the freaking law.

A law I frequently break, in full knowledge of it, without much regret or guilt, is biking on the sidewalk. It is illegal in many cities, however if I consider it unsafe to bike on the street (many streets by my house have no shoulders or very pitted/gravely shoulders) I will bike on the sidewalk (I never bike near peds on the sidewalk, though - I always exit the sidewalk or dismount before getting within several meters of them).


Also (which has been brought up on MeFi twice now), failing to zipper merge, or when cars/trucks sit in the middle/closing lane and physically prevent people from zipper merging. This actually obstructs the flow of traffic (illegal!), but for some reason people do it anyway.
posted by Lt. Bunny Wigglesworth at 4:14 PM on August 8, 2012


okay - on review, beagle's made me feel bad for holding up all those people! Oops!
posted by Lt. Bunny Wigglesworth at 4:21 PM on August 8, 2012


Various laws about sex exist but are ignored all over the world.
posted by The corpse in the library at 4:27 PM on August 8, 2012 [1 favorite]


The parking in the middle of the street/turn lane thing in Philly - I think some churches in my neighborhood have actual permission to do that (but I may be making that up). They literally park their cars in the middle of the street, in a turn lane.

Also:

That's why they are called "bumpers;" and
* Slipping past cars waiting to turn left by swerving around them on the right (on a road with a single lane in each direction, and no turning lane). Apparently if you did this in his home state, you would be slapped, hard, with a massive ticket.

was something we were taught in driver's ed - you use the shoulder to go around someone turning left in a two lane road (Delaware Driver's Ed, circa 1991).
posted by Pax at 4:29 PM on August 8, 2012


I see a lot of people practice what I like to call the "rural left turn lane" when we're on a 2-lane country road. If you're turning left and the opposing traffic lane is empty, you just complete your turn out of that, letting the driver behind you continue without having to brake very much.
posted by zizania at 4:31 PM on August 8, 2012 [1 favorite]


Rural Ohio: we see lots of non-road-legal (unlicensed) vehicles on the roads. Golf carts, ATV's, gators, 4-wheelers, dirt bikes.. the farm families use them, and stretch the point of taking them on the roads.
posted by LaBellaStella at 5:03 PM on August 8, 2012


I fucking hate it when people riding bikes do any of the following, because they should get ticketed for it but likely never will:

- don't stop at stop lights and stop signs
- wait at a crosswalk *while on the bike* and expect me to stop for them
- ride on the wrong side of the road... in a bike lane

In Western Mass. it's extremely common at a stop light for the person up front to take a left turn and cut off the first person going in the opposite direction as soon as the light turns green. I say 'fuck them' and immediately gun it if the person in the opposite lane has their left turn signal on because I just know they're going to try to pull that shit.
posted by imagineerit at 5:04 PM on August 8, 2012 [2 favorites]


I don't know if anyone else calls it a "Chicago left," but in Chicago I noticed that if you're at a light trying to turn left and either there is no left turn arrow or you missed it, the driver pulls out into the intersection so that when the light turns red and the oncoming traffic stops they have nowhere to go but left.

In D/FW, Texas a turn signal is rare, and lanes are only suggestions. I don't find this acceptable, for the record.

Also, dodging building code technicalities. In some places, you've got to get a permit to, say, replace an electrical box. Nobody does. Not even electricians.
posted by cmoj at 5:07 PM on August 8, 2012 [1 favorite]


I've heard the California stop called the "California roll". Like the "sushi".
posted by madcaptenor at 5:16 PM on August 8, 2012


If you're turning left and the opposing traffic lane is empty, you just complete your turn out of that, letting the driver behind you continue without having to brake very much.

See, the problem I'm having answering this question is that I forget that things like this are technically illegal, since they fall on the polite-and-convenient-for-all-involved side of the line.

I have done this rural left when it was safe (rural Minnesota), and I've also pulled over at speed onto the paved shoulder to let someone pass (rural Texas), and it didn't even occur to me that it was against the law, just that it was the done thing.
posted by mgar at 5:16 PM on August 8, 2012


Non car related:
Dogs are to be leashed when not in a designated dog park. This is widely and universally ignored.

Smoking is not allowed within 10 (15?) feet of a doorway/air intake/etc. This is generally held to apply to the main entrance only, side doors are fair game.

Any pot law. If you're not breaking any other law and aren't a student, you're pretty safe with any reasonable amount of pot.

In many rural places I've lived, it was technically illegal to ride any sort of ATV on the street. Never saw anyone pulled over for it.

Those backyard firepits are technically a code violation unless being used to cook food, but you see them in just about every department store.
posted by madajb at 5:17 PM on August 8, 2012


I don't know if anyone else calls it a "Chicago left," but in Chicago I noticed that if you're at a light trying to turn left and either there is no left turn arrow or you missed it, the driver pulls out into the intersection so that when the light turns red and the oncoming traffic stops they have nowhere to go but left.

Are you talking about at unprotected left-hand turns, when the driver pulls forward into the intersection to make a left, but the light turns red before there is a clear space, so they complete their left on the red? That is legal in many states (although at a protected left this would be illegal). I don't see it in the Texas driver's handbook.
posted by muddgirl at 5:22 PM on August 8, 2012 [1 favorite]


That is legal in many states.

Aw, you beat me to it! To wit, page 28 of the Minnesota Driver's Manual: "When waiting to make a left turn at a green traffic light with oncoming traffic, position the car into the intersection where your body appears even with the curb line. The only opportunity to make a left turn may occur when the green light changes to yellow."
posted by SemiSophos at 6:27 PM on August 8, 2012 [1 favorite]


In Ontario, driving 80 km/h on a highway with an 80 km/h speed limit (the standard) will often result in a cop tailgating you until you damn well speed up. 100 km/h is the standard speed for an 80 km/h zone and many drivers set their cruise control accordingly.

On the other hand a rolling stop will get you a nice ticket, as I have discovered.
posted by unSane at 7:09 PM on August 8, 2012




I don't know the legality of it, but in lots of rural places it's totally acceptable for two cars (or rather, pickup trucks) to be stopped smack dab in the middle of their lanes chatting away until prompted to move by an impatient car behind them. Also rural driving: ignoring the double yellow lines. In Vermont (at least the town I'm from) its not actually illegal to pass on a double yellow due to tractors etc on the road. And driving at night, you just take the easiest route down the middle of the road until you see headlights, then you get back in your proper lane.
posted by Grandysaur at 7:22 PM on August 8, 2012


In Singapore, people park their scooters and motorbikes on the footpath. I was told it's because of a (real or widely-believed) loophole where the parking wardens don't have jurisdiction over the footpaths, and the actual police don't make ticketing motorbikes a priority.
posted by embrangled at 7:37 PM on August 8, 2012


It's extremely common for small business owners, contractors and freelancers not to claim income and pay taxes on earnings when they are paid in cash for their services.
posted by croutonsupafreak at 8:35 PM on August 8, 2012


Small town Ontario. Apparently driving tractors on the roadway does not require a drivers liscence. Hence my in-town neighbour that infamously drove his tractor everywhere because of his driver's liscence being taken away. Outside of town most roads are simple two-lanes. When a car/pickup truck needs to turn into a driveway on the left the driver will actually move into the on-coming traffic lane to slow down before turning in order to avoid delaying the car behind them.
posted by saucysault at 9:22 PM on August 8, 2012


I had a job as a pizza delivery driver in one of the cities of the Tidewater area of Virginia (SE part of the state), and our chain would give free pizza and other foods to area police. They'd come in, they'd order, and the cashier would forget to charge them anything. You could always spot the new cop, because he'd be awkward about it.

Meanwhile, drivers from said chain, with giant illuminated signs on the roof, would get away with speeding, the occasional red light run, illegal parking in no-standing/no-stopping zones, double-parking, etc. Understand, please, that doing any of these things in an unsafe manner is a complete no-go by the drivers, and the cops were all over them if they did. But understand also that much of the driving is done on empty streets in the middle of the night, when it doesn't disrupt traffic or endanger loves to double-park on an artery, or run a red at a completely empty intersection.

I only worked one summer, so while I'd heard terrible stories, I was only present when one of my fellow drivers was assaulted by some yahoos in a car (they threw some fast-food beverages out of a fast-moving vehicle at my fellow driver, who was on foot). Were the cops more attentive to the crimes perpetrated against us, it was hard to say. They were, however, easy to access.
posted by Sunburnt at 9:49 PM on August 8, 2012 [1 favorite]


I lived in Cambridge, MA last year, and apparently, bicycling the wrong way on a one-way street is a thing there; it took me a good month (and a number of near-misses) to learn to look both ways before crossing Brattle.
posted by smirkette at 10:46 PM on August 8, 2012


That is legal in many states.

Well shit, no wonder they do it. I thought it was smart and because of the yellow-light-lag not dangerous or inconveniencing anybody. I dunno if it's illegal, but nobody does it where I am in Texas.
posted by cmoj at 10:54 PM on August 8, 2012


In Minnesota, since 1986, there's been something called the "Dimler Amendment". This means that if you're stopped for up to 10 mph over a 55 mph speed limit or up to 5 mph over a 60 mph speed limit, that the violation can't be recorded on your driving record, and your insurance company can't be told that you received the ticket and thus your insurance rates won't increase. If you're ticketed, you still have to pay the fine, but there won't be any insurance hike penalty.

In reality what this means, is that since 1986, NO ONE gets stopped for going up to 65 mph in a 55-60 mph zone. So the defacto speed limit is 65 mph for all roads posted at 55 or 60 mph.

It's not only accepted to drive at 65 in a 55 mph zone, but you'll generally be thought of as a road hazard for going less than 65, and especially so if you're in the left lane.
posted by marsha56 at 11:03 PM on August 8, 2012 [1 favorite]


This is probably not unique to northern California, but people will drive on the highway with their high beams on for no reason. In Sacramento no one seems to know how to use their turn signals. On rural two-lane highways in CA and NV it seems to be acceptable to pass, even with a solid double line. People drive without their seatbelts, and up to 10 mph over the limit. In Davis, CA I think it's technically illegal to smoke in public (e.g. walking down the street), but I doubt it's enforced.

I've noticed that when entering a traffic circle here, people don't always yield to cars already inside. Although after Googling it, I guess that's not necessarily the law everywhere, so maybe it's not in California, I don't know (I'm from Boston originally, where traffic inside a rotary always has the right of way).
posted by désoeuvrée at 12:23 AM on August 9, 2012


DC drivers will make a U-turn anywhere. I've witnessed this several times in the middle of a block during rush hour on a major thoroughfare, even through separated bike lanes.
posted by psoas at 8:40 AM on August 9, 2012


On the subject of running red lights in the Twin Cities, I was stopped at a light today and two cars ran a red light, entering the intersection after my light had turned green.

wait at a crosswalk *while on the bike* and expect me to stop for them

Assuming it's legal to ride on the sidewalk, as a general rule, you do have to stop for them. A bike on a sidewalk basically counts as a pedestrian. It's apparently a little ambiguous in Massachusetts (see the comments), where imagineerit seems to be. But, in Washington, for example, it's explicit that cyclists on the sidewalk on in a crosswalk count as pedestrians.

Can I rant about the fact that only, oh, one car in ten stops at the crosswalk on my commute? And, oh yeah, I count as a pedestrian in Minnesota.

You also have to allow three feet when passing a cyclist here. I'm sure the letter of the law gets broken fairly frequently, but some moron nearly ran me off the road yesterday, so I'm angry about it. I suppose they'd ticket you for it if you hit a cyclist.

I've noticed that when entering a traffic circle here, people don't always yield to cars already inside.

In Minnesota, the cars on the roundabout sometimes stop to let cars enter. I've assumed that's because Minnesotans don't know how to use roundabouts. (In their defense, it's not in the rules of the road, or wasn't when I read it four years ago.)
posted by hoyland at 8:32 PM on August 9, 2012


To back up the thing in Kyoto, it's pretty much the same near me here in Chiba. Cars regularly slide through well after the light is red. As a pedestrian, I know better than to start walking when the walk light comes on.

There are a ton of laws, specifically traffic laws, that are regularly broken. Speeding especially. Also, modifications to cars and scooters that are blatantly illegal. A really common sight on heavily modified cars is a turned up license plate, where the angle of the plate makes it hard to read it. It's not only illegal, it's the driver saying "I fully intend to break your puny little laws." To me, it's the sort of thing that should cause the cops to pull th over instantly, but nope.

Two people on a bicycle, or two people on a one person (50cc) scooter is illegal, but happens all the time.

Parking is rarely enforced here. If you get back to your car while the officers are writing your ticket, they stop, and you are free to go. A lot of long distance truckers will also stop on main roads (taking up an entire lane) and sleep while waiting for the lowest tolls on the expressways. It's sort of maddening.

Also, public urination. Essentially, in Japan, if you're a guy, you can pretty much piss anywhere. Nothing like biking home from work to see a taxi driver pulled over to the side of the road taking a leak in a residential area.
posted by Ghidorah at 1:09 AM on August 10, 2012


In NYC...

Any form of jaywalking - including walking down the bus lane and a crossing the street by zigzagging through stopped cars - is acceptable. Peopl

Drivers will frequently roll part-way into intersections before stopping, especially when making a left turn (sometimes even blocking a lane of traffic). There are usually cars parked all the way to the corner, so it's often the only way to see clearly, but it's technically illegal.

There's a raging debate about this, but most people are generally OK with cyclists running red lights so long as they slow down and look first.

You can usually park a lot closer to a fire hydrant than the law allows.

I'm not sure if passing on the right is technically illegal, but it is very common and not really frowned upon.

Despite (or because of?) all the jaywalking, nobody - pedestrians and drivers alike - pays any attention to crosswalks.

Moderate speeding is entirely normal and, on highways, expected.

Non-traffic-related...pot laws are certainly enforced, but most people you talk to don't really have a problem with it. A lot of bars are pretty lax about IDing people, so long as they look around 21.

I have always been shocked by the crazy alcohol rules in some places; I am also nearly always shocked by the lack of jaywalking (I mean, seriously, you can see there's no one coming and you still wait? Whaaat?) and the presence of lane discipline on highways and big roads.
posted by breakin' the law at 6:00 AM on August 10, 2012


Drivers will frequently roll part-way into intersections before stopping, especially when making a left turn (sometimes even blocking a lane of traffic).

Oh, that reminded me. This is something they do here in NM as well, but if they see that they won't be able to turn, they often back the hell up, regardless of any cars behind them - even if they're in a left turning lane. I have never seen drivers do that anywhere else before.
posted by patheral at 7:14 AM on August 10, 2012


More NYC things.

Near police stations, the people who work there will park on the sidewalks - ie they are supposed to be parallel parked along the street, but instead will park end in with half their car on the sidewalk, and sometimes just the whole darn thing on the sidewalk. They will also park in front of hydrants.

Near public schools, the people who work there will park on the sidewalks.

Near fire stations, the people who work there will park on the sidewalks. They will also park in front of hydrants.
posted by sciencegeek at 2:56 PM on August 10, 2012


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