Post-World War II American Novels

May 13, 2005 8:33 AM

Please help me arrange a list of Post-World War II American Novels for a bookgroup.

I teach a long running book group/seminar for which I choose the texts every year. This year they are Tristram Shandy and Don Quixote, in past years we've read Faulkner, Proust, Joyce, Dostoevsky, etc. Quality authors all, and some were quite difficult. Next year I'd like to do post-war American fiction. I need eight or nine books, readable in a month (hence V instead of Gravity's Rainbow).

On my list so far: Catch 22, One Flew, Invisible Man, Wise Blood, All the Kings Men, V. I'd like maybe a Bellow book (which?), maybe a Philip Roth book (Plot...America?), a Vietnam novel (The Short-timers? I think it's OP). Lolita or Pale Fire? Is the Ginger Man worth the list? The Fixer? Go Tell It On the Mountain? What other great female novelists (I'm not convinced by Morrison)? Who should I be embarrassed to be missing?

Thanks.

posted by OmieWise to media & arts (32 comments total)

Are you looking for Post WWII to present-day?

Jon Hassler: Staggerford (1977-ish)
Tim O'Brien: The Things They Carried (p. 1990 - about Vietnam)
posted by unixrat at 8:43 AM on May 13, 2005

My book club selection this month is Last Exit to Brooklyn. Very American. Very Post War. A great read.
posted by Wolfie at 8:49 AM on May 13, 2005

For a Vietnam novel, I would suggest "Going after Cacchiato."

Also, instead of Ginger Man, how 'bout "Confederacy of Dunces?"

And for shorter, more readable Pynchon, I'm more of a "Crying of Lot 49" kinda guy, personally.

And I've always been a big fan of Richard Yates' "Revolutionary Road" as the classic novel of 1950's suburban angst.

Exley's "Fan's Notes" is also a postwar classic, in my opinion.
posted by dersins at 8:50 AM on May 13, 2005

> What other great female novelists (I'm not convinced by Morrison)?

Rose Macauley, The Towers of Trebizond. The deepest witty book, the wittiest deep book you are likely to encounter. In technique it is an unreliable-narrator novel to compare to As I Lay Dying, though its effect on the reader is utterly unlike the Faulkner, which left me feeling soiled.
posted by jfuller at 8:51 AM on May 13, 2005

For a Bellow book, I'd recommend "The Victim". A short, sweet novel of post WW-II paranoia, set in a gritty summer in New York.
posted by saladin at 8:59 AM on May 13, 2005

BTW, "The Things They Carried" is by Tim O'Brien, not Hassler.

I've read every Bellow novel and think the obvious best is "Mr. Sammler's Planet" but for 2nd choice would pick "More Die of Heartbreak." I found many of his "classics" to be overrated.

For Nabokov, I think "Lolita" is more approachable than "PF."

"Ginger Man" was a letdown. "Confed. of Dunces" is good replacement. How about Franzen's "The Corrections?"

For women authors, how about "Poisonwood Bible" by Barbara Kingsolver? Or some Margaret Atwood? Or you could go international and do "God of Small Things" by Arundhati Roy.

If your readers like verbal wordplay and conundrums, try the cult classic "Riddley Walker" by Russell Hoban. Or "A Clockwork Orange."
posted by nancoix at 9:03 AM on May 13, 2005

Do you have any specific themes you'd like to zero in on in addition to focusing on a certain time period and geography? I'd recommend checking into Don Delillo's White Noise, Underworld, or Libra depending on what in his work you'd like to highlight.

As much as I love Gravity's Rainbow, I'm thrilled to see V. in the list instead (it's such a fantastic and, to my mind, underappreciated Pynchon book).
posted by safetyfork at 9:04 AM on May 13, 2005

My suggestions:

Re: female writers: Marilynne Robinson: either "Housekeeping" or the more recent "Gilead." "Augie March" and "The Human Stain." I second "Going After Cacciato" if you're determined to have a Vietnam book, although I'm not sure that it's a truly great work of literature compared to the other books you've talked about.

Are you committed to novels? There is a lot of great American post-WWII short fiction, by Raymond Carver, John Cheever, J. C. Oates, Updike, etc. If you want to go a little further afield, you could teach Edmund White's book "Forgetting Elena," which is amazing, and which was one of Nabokov's favorite American novels; and you could teach Amy Hempel's "Tumble Home," which is a great example of the '80s interest in novellas and short, linked stories.

Nabokov-wise, I think "Lolita" is a better reading-group choice than "Pale Fire," but both are, obviously, genius. Your seminar sounds great by the way!
posted by josh at 9:06 AM on May 13, 2005

On re-reading your post, I see you wanted American only. Sorry about the int'l suggestions. (Your reference to "Ginger Man" threw me off -- that's Irish, not American.) But Russell Hoban, surprisingly, is American.
posted by nancoix at 9:09 AM on May 13, 2005

In a similar vein to Amy Hempel: how about Lorrie Moore? There is also Doris Lessing's "The Golden Notebook."
posted by josh at 9:13 AM on May 13, 2005

V is perfect.

Lolita is certainly more accessible, but I think Pale Fire is so brilliant and underappreciated/underread that I'd be tempted to go that way.

For a Vietnam book, may I suggest Michael Herr's Dispatches. It's a fine example of functional post-modern pastiche, and it's writing from a primary source (embedded reporter for Esquire I think), while the shit was hitting the fan all around him.
posted by drpynchon at 9:17 AM on May 13, 2005

josh writes "if you're determined to have a Vietnam book, although I'm not sure that it's a truly great work of literature compared to the other books you've talked about."

That's why I was hesitant to include O'Brien. The Ed. White suggestion is interesting. I keep meaning to read Robinson. Does she hold up in this company?

I'm also not sure Confed. Dunces holds up in this company. It could use a good edit and rewrite, even though it's enjoyable.

I have no particular theme in mind, but people tend to prefer 'proven' books that they feel are 'worth it.' I wish that weren't necessarily so. I am pretty willing to be loose about the American (Donleavy was born in NYC, making Ginger Man an American book for my purposes; Nabokov was born in Russia but wrote here...), but I would like to have the novelists be American.

Great suggestions, thanks, and keep them coming.
posted by OmieWise at 9:19 AM on May 13, 2005

Also: John Barth, Donald Barthelme, William Gaddis all have potential for inclusion. Do you have a cut off date? Otherwise, there's that whole crop of writers who've digested much of the Pynchon, DeLillo, Barth, Gaddis set, e.g. David Foster Wallace, J.Franzen, D.Eggers, M.Chabon, William T. Vollmann.

I'd rethink including Morrison even if you're not convinced by her: this tension could lead to interesting discussion. Also, how about Kathy Acker? or would she miss because of a cut-off date? On preview: she may not be proven enough -- though I think Empire of the Senseless is 'readable' and a decent introduction to her program.
posted by safetyfork at 9:25 AM on May 13, 2005

If you don't mind a suggestion from a Brit - Paul Auster? The New York Trilogy, and 'Leviathan', spring to mind as ones I've enjoyed. I also really loved 'Underworld' by Don DeLillo, though I understand it wasn't everybody's cup of tea.
posted by altolinguistic at 9:28 AM on May 13, 2005

Drpynchon, marry me? You literally posted the exact suggestions I was going to make. I would always choose Pale Fire over Lolita...Lolita is clever and well-written, but Pale Fire is so brilliantly twisted and subversive. I think it's the perfect example of Nabokov's mastery of narrative and his ability to play with his readers...The Real Life of Sebastian Knight is another good example.

If you're going for Vietnam fiction, Dispatches is, in my opinion, the best book out there.

DeLillo is another good American choice. White Noise would be my suggestion, as it's so concerned with American culture.

I would also recommend at least one book of short stories: anything by Raymond Carver, Birds of America by Lorrie Moore, or Demonology by Rick Moody.

Finally, I think Plainsong by Kent Haruf is a beautiful meditation on life in middle America.
posted by Bella Sebastian at 9:29 AM on May 13, 2005

Bad Acker link. My apologies.
Also, of the younger set: Chuck Palahniuk.
posted by safetyfork at 9:29 AM on May 13, 2005

I don't think Confederacy of Dunces or O'Brien is really top-shelf literature.... Robinson's novel "Gilead" though is really excellent; it's as good as Coetzee's "Disgrace" and McEwan's "Atonement," both of which were on my graduate program's reading list for my English Ph.D. general orals.

"Forgetting Elena" is, IMO, a drastically under-read work that deserves to be read as a Great Novel. It's his first novel and not his most 'mature,' or what have you, but it's also very beautifully written and enigmatic.

I think drpynchon is right on with "Dispatches."

And lastly--I would choose D.F. Wallace over anything else in the D.F. Wallace school (for example, over Dave Eggers); the problem is that his only really great book is 1,100 pages long, and nothing else remotely compares.... Maybe he should be on the 'optional reading' list!

P.S.: I too would really get behind at least one book of short fiction; I would suggest anything by Hempel, or "Birds of America." Hempel is another drastically under-read great writer. I would also lean towards Cheever's short fiction more than to anything else if you want something that is from the '50s.
posted by josh at 9:36 AM on May 13, 2005

Don't tempt me Bella. You're within jogging distance.
posted by drpynchon at 9:44 AM on May 13, 2005

You could stretch and call Bobbie Ann Mason's In Country a Vietnam book, and it's not too long. I think it's difficult to come up with female post-WW2 novelists (except perhaps for Flannery O'Connor, whom you've already got) that cry out to be included. I do think that Morrison's Song of Solomon is fascinating and would be a good inclusion, and it's not too long. I happen to think that some of Anne Tyler's better work (Earthly Possessions for instance, which is not too long) reads like Jane Austen filtered through Flannery O'Connor, but I think I'm in the minority on that one. I think you should just pick something written in the last fifteen years that you really liked.
posted by anapestic at 9:52 AM on May 13, 2005

What? No beat poets/writers? On the Road seems like an easy post-WW2 choice.
posted by Civil_Disobedient at 10:03 AM on May 13, 2005

Oh, and for a somewhat offbeat but thoroughly enjoyable female author, I'd recommend Maxine Hong Kingston's Tripmaster Monkey.
posted by saladin at 10:25 AM on May 13, 2005

I second lots of these recommendations, especially The Things They Carried (I taught it a year ago and the kids LOVED it- it nearly tortured them that the narrator wouldn't say what was "true" and what wasn't!) and Joyce Carol Oates.

I'm reading The Plot Against America right now- it's very good and yes, the thought crossed my mind, "this might be a good book to teach"; however, I am no longer teaching for the forseeable future.

Other suggestions cross my mind but, as it happens, I'm on my way out the door.
posted by elisabeth r at 10:41 AM on May 13, 2005

I'm very surprised no one has recommended an Updike novel. Is he that out of favor now? His Rabbit novels are nearly perfect, and to my mind the most important American writing of the mid-to-late 20th. Roth, Updike, Bellow -- these are necessary, everything else is up for debate.
posted by _sirmissalot_ at 10:55 AM on May 13, 2005

How about John Irving (maybe A Prayer for Owen Meany), James Ellroy (L.A. Confidential), Tom Wolfe (The Right Stuff*), or Margaret Atwood (The Handmaid's Tale)?

I love Tim O'Brien's The Things They Carried (and recommend it over his Going after Cacchiato ). It's about storytelling almost as much as it's about Vietnam.

* Both The Right Stuff and Michael Herr's Dispatches blur the line between fiction and nonfiction.
posted by kirkaracha at 11:24 AM on May 13, 2005

Wolfie, I wouldn't inflict Last Exit to Brooklyn on anybody (but then, I'm a sensitive guy). If a Vietnam novel is indicated, how about Tobias Wolff's In Pharaoh's Army? (Although I consider This Boy's Life the better book; maybe you should just do that one.) And how 'bout some Tom Wolfe? Like The Bonfire of the Vanities? Or (on preview) The Right Stuff? (Yeah!)
posted by Rash at 11:31 AM on May 13, 2005

And you must include some Raymond Chandler on that list, if only a short story or two.
posted by saladin at 11:50 AM on May 13, 2005

David Foster Wallace: meh. I enjoyed two-thirds of Infinite Jest and slogged through the end because I'm too obstinate to quit. Everything else I've read of his has been fairly mediocre [although I've heard his new infinity book is good] and I feel as if he's something of a one-trick pony, and certainly a little much for a monthly book group. The challenge for him might be to write a book without footnotes.

But if you'd like something in the DFW vein, I loved Mark Danielewski's House of Leaves. It's a little gimmicky but mesmerizing once you get into it, very readable, and better/less pretentious than most post-pomo novels out there.

[drpynchon: I accept! You bring the tunes, I'll bring my running shoes, and we'll bring culture to this town yet.]
posted by Bella Sebastian at 11:52 AM on May 13, 2005

I know I'm late to the party — how the hell did I miss a book thread? — so I'm not going to do a lot of brainstorming here. I just have two points:

1. I've been running a book group for nearly a decade now. We read a wide range, from fluff to Proust. Our most popular author? John Irving. I'm not a huge fan, but everyone else in the group seems to be. Consider him. (I know Irving fans love Owen Meany, but I find it lacking. Really, most of his books are quite similar; read Cider House, or Hotel New Hampshire, or Garp...)

2. You say you've already selected One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest by Ken Kesey. I urge you to consider instead Kesey's Sometimes a Great Notion. It's a masterpiece. I'm a life-long (35+ years) Oregonian, and I can honestly say I've never found a book that better captures Oregon. The characters are strong. The story — once you get past the first 75 or so baffling pages — is compelling. Our book group's favorite read in the past decade is the Mutiny on the Bounty trilogy. Sometimes a Great Notion is a strong second. (And I prefer it to the former.) Please: give it strong consideration.

Oops. I just though of a third.

3. Why has nobody mentioned Wallace Stegner? Stegner's influence on contemporary American literature is astonishing. He taught Edward Abbey, Wendell Berry, Ken Kesey, Ernest Gaines, and Larry McMurtry. He won the Pulitzer for Angle of Repose. Many in our group loved that novel, but I was non-plused. All of us loved Crossing to Safety though.

There you have it: my two strongest recommendations are Sometimes a Great Notion and Crossing to Safety.

(p.s. I just can't post. I keep thinking of other things. I now Willa Cather's pre-WW2, but if you haven't read her, put her on the list for future consideration. She's awesome.)
posted by jdroth at 6:06 PM on May 13, 2005

Took an undergrad course in postmodern, post-WWII novel -- didn't anyone else? If so, what did you read? Strikingly absent from this thread are non-American/English-speaking writers -- Grass, Calvino, Garcia-Marquez, Borges' "Labyrinths"...

Also, what point(s) are you trying to make? What's your take on the era -- that'll narrow your list somewhat, right? The class was one of my favorites, by the way.
posted by rleamon at 9:51 PM on May 13, 2005

Strikingly absent from this thread are non-American/English-speaking writers

That's probably because the poster asked for American Novels (in bold face, just like that). Which reminds me, I love Towers of Trebizond but Rose Macauley wasn't American either.

I second Lolita (a greater and more approachable novel than Pale Fire), and I'd like to put in a strong recommendation for Richard Powers, a criminally underappreciated novelist. Galatea 2.2 is not only wonderfully written, it's thought-provoking and deeply moving. I'd think your book group would eat it up.
posted by languagehat at 2:52 PM on May 14, 2005

Interesting - this reminded me that two of my (post-wwII) favorite women writers are not American (Doris Lessing, Margaret Atwood). I'd second the suggestionof Poisonwood Bible, or Barbara Kingsolver's Prodigal Summer . Or how about Ursula Le Guin - or maybe she's not literary enough. I think she's incredible -
Left Hand of Darkness
posted by judybxxx at 4:05 PM on May 14, 2005

And I'd throw in an argument against anything by Kingsolver: overwrought, liberal pap. (And that's coming from a liberal!)

Seriously, Kingsolver's stuff — especially The Poisonwood Bible — is not particularly noteworthy. I know she has a fan-base, including many of my friends, but her writing is average at best.

LeGuin, on the other hand, is fantastic.
posted by jdroth at 11:10 AM on May 26, 2005