Am I at the most expensive dance studio in town?
May 20, 2011 8:01 AM Subscribe
Taking my dance classes to the next level...am I at the most expensive dance studio in town?
I started a beginner program at an Arthur Murray dance studio in Canada and have very much enjoyed it so far. Their program includes a combination of private lessons, group lessons, and these events called practice parties. I am coming to the end of my beginner program and my dance instructor is in the midst of designing a more long term program for me.
I've indicated that the three main reasons I want to take lessons is to develop self confidence (I'm a litigator and want more presence in the courtroom), for stress releif purposes and to get some exercise. I do not intend to become a recreational pro.
My dance instructor has indicated that he thinks the best program for me is a "social ease" program that will allow me more time to get comfortable with dancing. More comfortable means more private lessons. The package is $1800-2000 Cdn for 12-15 lessons and unlimited group lessons and practice parties. If I do lessons twice a week this package will last me anywhere between 6 and 7 weeks.
Am I going to the most expensive studio in town? I've not tried anywhere else and want to get an idea if this is the going rate for other studios with similar programs. I'd like to continue at this current studio but this is starting to become a prohibitively expensive hobby. I plan on speaking to the head of the studio to see if there are other programs I can do that are less expensive but in the meantime I'd appreciate any input on how much other peoples' dance habits cost them. FYI, I am doing standard ballroom dancing, swing, tango, cha cha and am doing it solo (i.e. without Mr. laroodles).
I started a beginner program at an Arthur Murray dance studio in Canada and have very much enjoyed it so far. Their program includes a combination of private lessons, group lessons, and these events called practice parties. I am coming to the end of my beginner program and my dance instructor is in the midst of designing a more long term program for me.
I've indicated that the three main reasons I want to take lessons is to develop self confidence (I'm a litigator and want more presence in the courtroom), for stress releif purposes and to get some exercise. I do not intend to become a recreational pro.
My dance instructor has indicated that he thinks the best program for me is a "social ease" program that will allow me more time to get comfortable with dancing. More comfortable means more private lessons. The package is $1800-2000 Cdn for 12-15 lessons and unlimited group lessons and practice parties. If I do lessons twice a week this package will last me anywhere between 6 and 7 weeks.
Am I going to the most expensive studio in town? I've not tried anywhere else and want to get an idea if this is the going rate for other studios with similar programs. I'd like to continue at this current studio but this is starting to become a prohibitively expensive hobby. I plan on speaking to the head of the studio to see if there are other programs I can do that are less expensive but in the meantime I'd appreciate any input on how much other peoples' dance habits cost them. FYI, I am doing standard ballroom dancing, swing, tango, cha cha and am doing it solo (i.e. without Mr. laroodles).
Franchise dance studios are definitely more expensive -- their success is based on their ability to market and sell profitable packages of lessons to adult students, and then "upgrade" those students to a more advanced level with another package, ad nauseum. It can be difficult to make money off adult students otherwise, especially when there are so many who just want a handful of lessons so that they are competent enough to dance at a wedding or special event.
Check out some of your local independent studios. I'm confident you'll find a better rate, and good instruction too.
posted by BurntHombre at 8:26 AM on May 20, 2011
Check out some of your local independent studios. I'm confident you'll find a better rate, and good instruction too.
posted by BurntHombre at 8:26 AM on May 20, 2011
Well BurntHombre beat me to it, and said it much more concisely. But I'll blather at you anyway in case you want a similar but wordier opinion.
I have taken many many ballroom dance lessons (not Arthur Murray/'American Style', but International Style, which is what is danced more commonly all over the globe - so I have no clue what AM guys typically charge). But I can tell you I have seen what the top top pros charge.
Based on what some individual top pros charge, that's about what this guy wants to charge you (assuming your private lessons are at least an hour) - NOT counting the group lessons & practices. If we say, divide the $1800 Cdn / 12 private lessons, that comes out to $150 cdn. Even with the included group lessons, I don't think I'd pay that much from AM.
Personally, I would not pay anyone who is not pro caliber that much money for lessons. But I am a picky picky guy when it comes to paying for private lesson teachers. I mean, I don't care if they're currently world-ranked, I just want them to really know their stuff.
Now, do I think you are being charged a ridiculous, unheard-of, super-gouging-you-amount more? No (I'm attempting to ballpark, accounting for only private-lessons-per-hour, some imaginary idea of what Toronto-area costs are, and whether the package is marked up due to being an AM franchise). Also, there's always the 'beggars can't be choosers' scenario - are there lots of dance studios in your town? What do they charge, comparatively? And, in your opinion, how good are those teachers, comparatively, for the price? Then there's things like driving distance, when/how often classes are given, will they let you make up a class if you miss one, etc..
As Burnt says, I'd shop around, if you can.
posted by bitterkitten at 8:39 AM on May 20, 2011
I have taken many many ballroom dance lessons (not Arthur Murray/'American Style', but International Style, which is what is danced more commonly all over the globe - so I have no clue what AM guys typically charge). But I can tell you I have seen what the top top pros charge.
Based on what some individual top pros charge, that's about what this guy wants to charge you (assuming your private lessons are at least an hour) - NOT counting the group lessons & practices. If we say, divide the $1800 Cdn / 12 private lessons, that comes out to $150 cdn. Even with the included group lessons, I don't think I'd pay that much from AM.
Personally, I would not pay anyone who is not pro caliber that much money for lessons. But I am a picky picky guy when it comes to paying for private lesson teachers. I mean, I don't care if they're currently world-ranked, I just want them to really know their stuff.
Now, do I think you are being charged a ridiculous, unheard-of, super-gouging-you-amount more? No (I'm attempting to ballpark, accounting for only private-lessons-per-hour, some imaginary idea of what Toronto-area costs are, and whether the package is marked up due to being an AM franchise). Also, there's always the 'beggars can't be choosers' scenario - are there lots of dance studios in your town? What do they charge, comparatively? And, in your opinion, how good are those teachers, comparatively, for the price? Then there's things like driving distance, when/how often classes are given, will they let you make up a class if you miss one, etc..
As Burnt says, I'd shop around, if you can.
posted by bitterkitten at 8:39 AM on May 20, 2011
Arthur Murray is known everywhere as being more expensive. Those prices seem insanely expensive. Check around to see what other studios have to offer that aren't franchises. At this point you may want to pick the dance you like most and find a studio known for teaching that dance.
posted by JJ86 at 8:55 AM on May 20, 2011
posted by JJ86 at 8:55 AM on May 20, 2011
You are paying far, far too much. Regular private lessons are great if you are completely unable to dance with a group or if you want to compete and thus need to perfectly polish moves which are beyond a normal group class. Otherwise group lessons are the way to go, with maybe an occasional private lesson or dance clinic or something to spice things up. Also, go OUT and dance.
posted by anaelith at 9:00 AM on May 20, 2011
posted by anaelith at 9:00 AM on May 20, 2011
I googled "ballroom dance class Toronto" (that's where your profile indicates that you live). I got a list of a dozen or so places to take classes. The average advertised rate seems to be about $15 a class for groups of 6-10 people, or about $60 a class for private lessons for 1-2 people. So depending on the size of your class, you are paying 2-10 times more than what appears to be average for your city. That, to me, is way too much.
posted by decathecting at 9:11 AM on May 20, 2011
posted by decathecting at 9:11 AM on May 20, 2011
I know nothing about dancing, but I teach music lessons. The one concept that carries over (besides the concept of rhythm) is that often people, especially self-conscious adults, want the ratio of instruction to practice to be higher than it should be. IOW, they want someone to show them a lot of stuff over and over, because they're afraid to just get out there and make mistakes. I don't know if this is you, but a lesson on anything twice a week seems counter to your idea that you just want to get good enough to enjoy the activity on a social level.
I'd see if they'd let me pay the money and spread the lessons out more. A lot more. More like a lesson every 1 or 2 weeks, depending on how you're progressing. That may not be what they want to do, since a) they want to collect money more often and b) this would have the effect of allowing you to potentially show up at a lot more of their unlimited functions. But it should be all right for them, since space on their floor is presumably cheap and 1 on 1 time is expensive. But you'll learn as much or more at this stage by just getting out there and practicing with other students as spending a higher ratio of time with instructors.
I always tell my students that I can show them stuff during lessons, but they LEARN it by practicing.
posted by randomkeystrike at 9:30 AM on May 20, 2011 [1 favorite]
I'd see if they'd let me pay the money and spread the lessons out more. A lot more. More like a lesson every 1 or 2 weeks, depending on how you're progressing. That may not be what they want to do, since a) they want to collect money more often and b) this would have the effect of allowing you to potentially show up at a lot more of their unlimited functions. But it should be all right for them, since space on their floor is presumably cheap and 1 on 1 time is expensive. But you'll learn as much or more at this stage by just getting out there and practicing with other students as spending a higher ratio of time with instructors.
I always tell my students that I can show them stuff during lessons, but they LEARN it by practicing.
posted by randomkeystrike at 9:30 AM on May 20, 2011 [1 favorite]
I agree that you're paying too much for social lessons and the pricing is on par with what competitively ranked pros are charging on the east coast (US) for private lessons. It's also more than double what I paid for a few one-off private lessons in Ottawa last year. To get more comfortable with dancing, I would suggest more group lessons at a studio that runs lessons in series to meet some ppl, which will make you more comfortable going to social dances to dance with a wider range of leads. Dancing with different ppl at socials will make you more comfortable with dancing in general (it's also a form of practicing), whereas more privates will likely make you more comfortable with dancing with one person of a relatively fixed skill level.
Around my area at non franchise studios, 1 hour of group lessons for a 6 week series of any particular dance usually goes for ~$10-$15/hour and obviously one could take a bunch of different dances in the same week. Definitely don't get sucked into paying a lot if you don't really want to.
For exhaustive back and forths about franchise experiences vs independent studios, learning from private lessons vs group, and anecdotal costs you can do some searches in the ballroom dance forums. It's weighted somewhat towards the competitive than social scene but quite a lot of posters either started out in or have tried franchises like AM.
posted by tangaroo at 10:33 AM on May 20, 2011
Around my area at non franchise studios, 1 hour of group lessons for a 6 week series of any particular dance usually goes for ~$10-$15/hour and obviously one could take a bunch of different dances in the same week. Definitely don't get sucked into paying a lot if you don't really want to.
For exhaustive back and forths about franchise experiences vs independent studios, learning from private lessons vs group, and anecdotal costs you can do some searches in the ballroom dance forums. It's weighted somewhat towards the competitive than social scene but quite a lot of posters either started out in or have tried franchises like AM.
posted by tangaroo at 10:33 AM on May 20, 2011
Arthur Murray and similar studios charge more, yeah, and their demographic is people like you who don't have experience outside their studio.
The first thing you should do is go to some other studios. Right now, you're flying blind, and you can feel it.
For best value, I look for a studios that cater heavily to competitive dancers. This is because competitive dancers:
1. Are serious and in the for the long haul, so it matters to them that they get high quality at a good price.
2. They know the area and the dance community well, and so know where good instructors are at good prices, in studios that don't screw them.
In your case I'd also add 3. Unlike Arthur Murray, which mainly caters to social, weddings, etc, competitive dancers are entirely focused on developing their presence to become as super-human as it can possibly get.
You might want to consider working towards competition actually - the kind of dance instruction you get differs when your goal in competition. It becomes much more focused on presentation.
But step one is to break the bubble wall of your franchise studio and meet the dance community. One way to do that is to go do some social dancing at evenings held in places other than your studio, and talk to people you meet there. Ask them where they take classes and lessons, who they like, why.
As for me, my dancing habit cost about what yours does when I was in your shoes (inside the bubble). After I broke out, I started paying less and getting higher quality instruction.
In my area right now, lessons with local champion, world-class current-international-ranking competitive dancers, costs about 70% of a lesson from a part-timer at a franchise studio.
posted by -harlequin- at 4:06 PM on May 20, 2011
The first thing you should do is go to some other studios. Right now, you're flying blind, and you can feel it.
For best value, I look for a studios that cater heavily to competitive dancers. This is because competitive dancers:
1. Are serious and in the for the long haul, so it matters to them that they get high quality at a good price.
2. They know the area and the dance community well, and so know where good instructors are at good prices, in studios that don't screw them.
In your case I'd also add 3. Unlike Arthur Murray, which mainly caters to social, weddings, etc, competitive dancers are entirely focused on developing their presence to become as super-human as it can possibly get.
You might want to consider working towards competition actually - the kind of dance instruction you get differs when your goal in competition. It becomes much more focused on presentation.
But step one is to break the bubble wall of your franchise studio and meet the dance community. One way to do that is to go do some social dancing at evenings held in places other than your studio, and talk to people you meet there. Ask them where they take classes and lessons, who they like, why.
As for me, my dancing habit cost about what yours does when I was in your shoes (inside the bubble). After I broke out, I started paying less and getting higher quality instruction.
In my area right now, lessons with local champion, world-class current-international-ranking competitive dancers, costs about 70% of a lesson from a part-timer at a franchise studio.
posted by -harlequin- at 4:06 PM on May 20, 2011
For dance classes in Toronto, check out this page. A lot of the studios offer free classes which you could drop in on and try out to get a feel for the space and the instructors. I haven't studied myself in Toronto, but I know people who go to Anna's Dance Centre on Bloor and love it -- I think they also have $5 drop-in nights on Tuesdays (or used to, that may have changed). The price you've quoted seems awfully high, especially considering you aren't currently pursuing competitive dancing. The link I've provided is also good for finding social dance nights where you can get in more practice and exercise to supplement the lessons you take. One place not listed where you can look for lessons and dance nights is Dovercourt House, which I believe has dance classes followed by social dancing several nights a week.
posted by Felicity Rilke at 4:16 PM on May 20, 2011
posted by Felicity Rilke at 4:16 PM on May 20, 2011
Response by poster: Thanks everyone, sounds like I will be trying out other places and group lessons!
posted by laroodles at 2:25 PM on May 23, 2011
posted by laroodles at 2:25 PM on May 23, 2011
« Older MovieFilter: Medieval Civilization vs. Aliens From... | Audio Synching tips for FCP? Newer »
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by laroodles at 8:07 AM on May 20, 2011