Does shortest always take the middle?
April 13, 2011 10:38 AM Subscribe
Who gets the middle seat on family road trips?
I am the oldest of three girls. The middle is my biological sister and the youngest is our stepsister. They are both late teens, early twenties. I am closer to mid twenties.
As kids, the rule was the oldest gets their preferred seat. The problem is that I, the oldest, am now also the shortest.
Stepsis and I are very easy going, whereas Sis is very high strung, so for shorter trips, I take the middle seat in the backseat of the car. It's uncomfortable, but not a big deal. However, we occasionally take trips that require a significant car ride, and this is where problems arise.
I have arthritis in my knees, and sitting on the hump seat with my legs squished for hours on end is incredibly painful. Stepsis has offered to take the middle seat but she is legitimately too tall (closer to 6 ft while I'm just over 5 ft). Sis, however, refuses to ever sit in the middle although she is only two inches taller than me. I've tried suggesting trading off but she will not budge.
We take family trips of varying length probably four to five times a year. Taking separate cars is not an option, given gas prices. This seems like a petty problem but the stiffness in my knees will persist all day after a long car ride, thus ruining my day (most trips involve a lot of walking).
Suggestions for what I can do/say to get my sister to agree to trading off? Or is she right that shortest person should take the middle seat always? Thanks in advance.
I am the oldest of three girls. The middle is my biological sister and the youngest is our stepsister. They are both late teens, early twenties. I am closer to mid twenties.
As kids, the rule was the oldest gets their preferred seat. The problem is that I, the oldest, am now also the shortest.
Stepsis and I are very easy going, whereas Sis is very high strung, so for shorter trips, I take the middle seat in the backseat of the car. It's uncomfortable, but not a big deal. However, we occasionally take trips that require a significant car ride, and this is where problems arise.
I have arthritis in my knees, and sitting on the hump seat with my legs squished for hours on end is incredibly painful. Stepsis has offered to take the middle seat but she is legitimately too tall (closer to 6 ft while I'm just over 5 ft). Sis, however, refuses to ever sit in the middle although she is only two inches taller than me. I've tried suggesting trading off but she will not budge.
We take family trips of varying length probably four to five times a year. Taking separate cars is not an option, given gas prices. This seems like a petty problem but the stiffness in my knees will persist all day after a long car ride, thus ruining my day (most trips involve a lot of walking).
Suggestions for what I can do/say to get my sister to agree to trading off? Or is she right that shortest person should take the middle seat always? Thanks in advance.
I don't know your family dynamics, but can't you also trade off with driving? Meaning, maybe it isn't always the three of you in the back seat.
posted by kellyblah at 10:44 AM on April 13, 2011
posted by kellyblah at 10:44 AM on April 13, 2011
once everyone is over about 14 years old, the middle seat should be traded off every couple hours, maybe even trading with whoever sits up front and/or drives.
also - if you're taking this many trips, maybe you guys should rent an SUV or van. it saves the miles on your parents' car and gives everyone a little more space.
posted by nadawi at 10:45 AM on April 13, 2011 [14 favorites]
also - if you're taking this many trips, maybe you guys should rent an SUV or van. it saves the miles on your parents' car and gives everyone a little more space.
posted by nadawi at 10:45 AM on April 13, 2011 [14 favorites]
The person for whom the least discomfort will result from sitting there. Normally this would mean the shortest person, but your arthritis disqualifies you. Therefore it falls to Middle Sis, who, unless she also has a legitimate health complaint, is acting like a brat and needs to suck it up.
posted by milk white peacock at 10:46 AM on April 13, 2011 [24 favorites]
posted by milk white peacock at 10:46 AM on April 13, 2011 [24 favorites]
Can you rent a van?
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 10:49 AM on April 13, 2011 [1 favorite]
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 10:49 AM on April 13, 2011 [1 favorite]
I'm with renting a bigger vehicle. Or suck it up and take a second car. Or take your own vacation like an independent adult. Stuffed in like sardines is no way to spend your vacation.
Otherwise set up an ironclad system for trading off, giving everyone equal misery.
posted by Forktine at 10:56 AM on April 13, 2011 [3 favorites]
Otherwise set up an ironclad system for trading off, giving everyone equal misery.
posted by Forktine at 10:56 AM on April 13, 2011 [3 favorites]
Of course your sister is not right. But if she refuses to act like a grownup despite the fact that she's an adult, don't know what alternative you have other than to take twice as many cars on half as many trips each year.
posted by SomeTrickPony at 10:57 AM on April 13, 2011
posted by SomeTrickPony at 10:57 AM on April 13, 2011
You are older and you have arthritis. Her 2 inches taller don't trump that. Stand your ground, she's acting like a child.
posted by Neekee at 10:58 AM on April 13, 2011 [3 favorites]
posted by Neekee at 10:58 AM on April 13, 2011 [3 favorites]
Response by poster: Clarifying points:
Stepdad and mom are in front. Stepdad is 6.5 feet tall and can't fit in the back. Mom has knee brace that prevents bending and can't really sit in the back. Also out of respect, I don't feel comfortable sitting in front and making a parent sit in the back.
Renting a car is a bit expensive for us, also I don't feel comfortable forcing an extra expense on the family for my benefit. Trips are expensive enough as is. I can't afford to spring for it myself either. Times are tough.
I've tried just plopping down in the seat I want, which results in a fit of epic proportions from Sis. This ruins everyone's day.
posted by tequila sunrise at 10:59 AM on April 13, 2011
Stepdad and mom are in front. Stepdad is 6.5 feet tall and can't fit in the back. Mom has knee brace that prevents bending and can't really sit in the back. Also out of respect, I don't feel comfortable sitting in front and making a parent sit in the back.
Renting a car is a bit expensive for us, also I don't feel comfortable forcing an extra expense on the family for my benefit. Trips are expensive enough as is. I can't afford to spring for it myself either. Times are tough.
I've tried just plopping down in the seat I want, which results in a fit of epic proportions from Sis. This ruins everyone's day.
posted by tequila sunrise at 10:59 AM on April 13, 2011
Perhaps your mother needs to tell your sister that she is acting like an immature ass?
posted by kellyblah at 11:01 AM on April 13, 2011 [23 favorites]
posted by kellyblah at 11:01 AM on April 13, 2011 [23 favorites]
Even with some minor arthritis I'm betting you should be able to take them in a fight.
Or on a serious note, I'm 6'3"+. If I can suck it up on the hump seat, so can your sister. If you want to pro-rate length on the hump by height - that's fine - but everybody takes a turn in the land of the uncomfortable. There is no trial by height, age, nor injury. Get in the car, sit down, and let your sister complain. Let her complain the whole car ride - do not cave into her whining. The key to this one is EQUAL misery.
Heck, if its a saturday morning, call Car Talk - they'd love this one.
posted by Nanukthedog at 11:02 AM on April 13, 2011 [4 favorites]
Or on a serious note, I'm 6'3"+. If I can suck it up on the hump seat, so can your sister. If you want to pro-rate length on the hump by height - that's fine - but everybody takes a turn in the land of the uncomfortable. There is no trial by height, age, nor injury. Get in the car, sit down, and let your sister complain. Let her complain the whole car ride - do not cave into her whining. The key to this one is EQUAL misery.
Heck, if its a saturday morning, call Car Talk - they'd love this one.
posted by Nanukthedog at 11:02 AM on April 13, 2011 [4 favorites]
Your sister is being a brat. Your parents need to tell her she either sits in the middle the whole time, because she's the shortest person without any mobility issues, or you all trade off for short periods. If she pitches a fit, then they need to reiterate that only adults or people who act like adults are invited on the trip.
posted by booknerd at 11:02 AM on April 13, 2011 [2 favorites]
posted by booknerd at 11:02 AM on April 13, 2011 [2 favorites]
Best answer: I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that you needto discuss this as a family and say something like "we need to find a new way to travel as a family or travel shorter distances, or I'm not going to be able to go."
You guys have literally outgrown your family vacations!
You need to be clear that you are not threatening a tantrum. You'll be disappointed not to go, but will wish.them a good time.
And be clear about being in too much pain. The easiest thingfor them would be to convince you that your pain isn't so bad. A goodresponse would be "I'm not going to argue about whether or notmy arthritis meets the right threshold in your opinion. These are the only knees I've got and I'm bringing it up because I've met my threshold of tolerance for these rides."
posted by vitabellosi at 11:07 AM on April 13, 2011 [40 favorites]
You guys have literally outgrown your family vacations!
You need to be clear that you are not threatening a tantrum. You'll be disappointed not to go, but will wish.them a good time.
And be clear about being in too much pain. The easiest thingfor them would be to convince you that your pain isn't so bad. A goodresponse would be "I'm not going to argue about whether or notmy arthritis meets the right threshold in your opinion. These are the only knees I've got and I'm bringing it up because I've met my threshold of tolerance for these rides."
posted by vitabellosi at 11:07 AM on April 13, 2011 [40 favorites]
I've often been stuck in the middle (having three tall brothers) and I'm 5'10". What makes that seat work for me is putting my feet on either side of the hump (which means your seatmates need to give you a smidge more space). You can stretch out fairly well like that. Take your sister-in-law up on her offer, or try sitting like that yourself--it might help. Note that this doesn't mean the main point here isn't your sister's unreasonable and childish behaviour, but if you don't want to tackle that fair enough.
posted by Go Banana at 11:11 AM on April 13, 2011
posted by Go Banana at 11:11 AM on April 13, 2011
I've tried just plopping down in the seat I want, which results in a fit of epic proportions from Sis
Unless your sister is four, that's unacceptable.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 11:11 AM on April 13, 2011 [9 favorites]
Unless your sister is four, that's unacceptable.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 11:11 AM on April 13, 2011 [9 favorites]
Best answer: Your sister is being unreasonable, and really unempathetic. In fact, she's being really freakin' bratty. Who does that? Insist that her sister with mobility issues be in pain because she doesn't like sitting on the hump? really?
since you all are basically adults, it's time to sit down and talk about it as a whole family. Your parents and sisters, as well as yourself should all look at this and come up with a solution. After talking about it as a family, (assuming that your parents and step sister will agree that her refusal to trade off is unreasonable) she will have the option of acting like an adult or staying home.
If they won't back you up, stay home.
posted by Blisterlips at 11:13 AM on April 13, 2011 [2 favorites]
since you all are basically adults, it's time to sit down and talk about it as a whole family. Your parents and sisters, as well as yourself should all look at this and come up with a solution. After talking about it as a family, (assuming that your parents and step sister will agree that her refusal to trade off is unreasonable) she will have the option of acting like an adult or staying home.
If they won't back you up, stay home.
posted by Blisterlips at 11:13 AM on April 13, 2011 [2 favorites]
Growing up I was always the one who took the middle seat for two reasons. One, I was able to sleep with my head on my knees where my younger brother and sister needed a door to lean on; two, they fought like cats and dogs on car trips. Sitting in the middle was a pain, but it kept the peace.
I was the tallest at 5'8", and sitting in the middle was a pain in the literal sense too. My parents would let me put my legs up on the console in between their seats, then whoever was driving would put a small pillow or a folded blanket over my legs and use me as an arm rest. I would have to switch positions every once in a while, but it helped. Would it be possible for you to do something similar?
As for saying something to your sister, maybe this is a discussion to have well before the trip. Then she has time to have her theatrics and get used to the idea before the actual time of departure. Having a medical condition trumps childish behavior no matter how old you are.
posted by TooFewShoes at 11:14 AM on April 13, 2011 [1 favorite]
I was the tallest at 5'8", and sitting in the middle was a pain in the literal sense too. My parents would let me put my legs up on the console in between their seats, then whoever was driving would put a small pillow or a folded blanket over my legs and use me as an arm rest. I would have to switch positions every once in a while, but it helped. Would it be possible for you to do something similar?
As for saying something to your sister, maybe this is a discussion to have well before the trip. Then she has time to have her theatrics and get used to the idea before the actual time of departure. Having a medical condition trumps childish behavior no matter how old you are.
posted by TooFewShoes at 11:14 AM on April 13, 2011 [1 favorite]
I have arthritis in my knees, and sitting on the hump seat with my legs squished for hours on end is incredibly painful.
Incredible pain trumps your sister's "I WANT!" Talk to your parents. It's their responsibility to tell their teenage daughter to suck it up and sit in the middle seat so that you don't have to endure increased arthritis pain.
posted by Meg_Murry at 11:21 AM on April 13, 2011 [1 favorite]
Incredible pain trumps your sister's "I WANT!" Talk to your parents. It's their responsibility to tell their teenage daughter to suck it up and sit in the middle seat so that you don't have to endure increased arthritis pain.
posted by Meg_Murry at 11:21 AM on April 13, 2011 [1 favorite]
This is bizarre. Why does your sister pitching a fit ruin the trip, but you being in pain and unable to hike not? Why do your parents -- who presumably own the car and pay for the trip -- not say anything? I think all three of you should trade off spaces, but I am fairly sure your sister is unlikely to listen to a bunch of strangers from the internet.
At this point, you have four choices:
1. Keep going as is. This will keep the peace.
2. Insist on going in 2 cars. You'll go on fewer trips and upset people, but probably less than if you do 3.
3. Refuse to go on the next trip unless all three of you trade off spots in the back seat. You can refuse nicely, but you should refuse.
4. Have a family discussion to determine what happens next. Unless your parents already support you, you're going to lose on this, but you can stand fast that the options are that you trade off, you take fewer trips with more cars, or that they go on vacation without you.
posted by jeather at 11:24 AM on April 13, 2011 [2 favorites]
At this point, you have four choices:
1. Keep going as is. This will keep the peace.
2. Insist on going in 2 cars. You'll go on fewer trips and upset people, but probably less than if you do 3.
3. Refuse to go on the next trip unless all three of you trade off spots in the back seat. You can refuse nicely, but you should refuse.
4. Have a family discussion to determine what happens next. Unless your parents already support you, you're going to lose on this, but you can stand fast that the options are that you trade off, you take fewer trips with more cars, or that they go on vacation without you.
posted by jeather at 11:24 AM on April 13, 2011 [2 favorites]
Wow, the responses here are fairly mature ones. I have to say that in my family (two brothers and I, all in our twenties), last in the car gets the middle seat. Doesn't really matter who is taller or who has a minor medical condition. For really long trips we do one hour rotations.
posted by moiraine at 11:24 AM on April 13, 2011
posted by moiraine at 11:24 AM on April 13, 2011
Response by poster: Thanks for all the responses! My parents say plenty to Sis, but she bitches the whole day regardless. She's like that because our real father (an abusive alcoholic) beat up on everyone except her. She always got preferential treatment from him and it is my opinion it ruined her personality. I give in most times to avoid her tantrums, but don't feel it's right. I suppose telling my family I can't go unless we come to an agreement is the best option, though that sucks for me! The only trips I can afford to take are the ones with my family. Not all these trips are vacations, though. Many are to visit other family. Taking extra cars just isn't feasible.
posted by tequila sunrise at 11:35 AM on April 13, 2011
posted by tequila sunrise at 11:35 AM on April 13, 2011
I also meant to add that if you have the family discussion, you have to decide that you are unwilling to keep the status quo; if you are willing to keep the status quo, it will be kept, and your knees will keep hurting.
posted by jeather at 11:35 AM on April 13, 2011
posted by jeather at 11:35 AM on April 13, 2011
Response by poster: Also, luggage usually takes up foot room on either side of the hump.
posted by tequila sunrise at 11:37 AM on April 13, 2011
posted by tequila sunrise at 11:37 AM on April 13, 2011
Put the luggage in the trunk? What are you driving that can't fit 5 people's luggage in the back? If anyone's bringing more than a carry-on, then they need to be talked out of it. 4 members of this family are physically incapable of riving in this car. You really need to work out how these vacations work. Also, have you actually looked into how much car rentals cost? Round trip, weeklong, not rented at an airport car rentals are really not expensive, especially when split between 5 people.
posted by brainmouse at 11:45 AM on April 13, 2011
posted by brainmouse at 11:45 AM on April 13, 2011
Response by poster: Our trips are long in duration, since most of th extended family lives across the country. We fill the trunk but also stow smaller bags at our feet. No one is packing excessively. I plan trips for my boss often and am well aware of the cost of car rentals. It's not an option. We drive a mid-sized sedan. Trips are already very expensive for 5 people, with my parents paying for it. Neither of my sisters work so they can't chip in for a car rental. I can't afford it either and don't feel comfortable asking my parents to pay since they're already paying a lot.
posted by tequila sunrise at 11:54 AM on April 13, 2011
posted by tequila sunrise at 11:54 AM on April 13, 2011
Best answer: Brainmouse, I'm guessing that the cost of renting an SUV or minivan wouldn't break down between five separate people, but between tequila sunrise and the rest of her family (as the girls are in their late teens and, I'm assuming, probably not quite yet financially independent).
Take your stepsister up on her offer next time. She may be (willingly) cramped in the middle seat, but she won't have trouble standing up and walking when she gets out of the car.
posted by tully_monster at 11:58 AM on April 13, 2011
Take your stepsister up on her offer next time. She may be (willingly) cramped in the middle seat, but she won't have trouble standing up and walking when she gets out of the car.
posted by tully_monster at 11:58 AM on April 13, 2011
Buy a Thule or knockoff. Stop putting bags at your feet. If you only have limited space, you need to keep in the car only what you need before the next rest stop/can each carry on your own lap.
But the cost of these trips, to you, is knee pain. If it's worth it to get to see your family for no money, then it's worth it.
posted by jeather at 12:00 PM on April 13, 2011 [2 favorites]
But the cost of these trips, to you, is knee pain. If it's worth it to get to see your family for no money, then it's worth it.
posted by jeather at 12:00 PM on April 13, 2011 [2 favorites]
Best answer: Deja vu! My wife has generous, detail-oriented, travel-loving parents and a contentious, incredibly stressful sister. In our experience, vitabellosi knocked it out of the park. vita's outlook is precisely what has worked for us and it's brought us a great deal of peace.
posted by mindsound at 12:02 PM on April 13, 2011
posted by mindsound at 12:02 PM on April 13, 2011
I doubt your sis will go for this, but my friends and I call "Shogun" for road trips. It's like shotgun, but it means you don't sit in the middle.
posted by Ragged Richard at 12:20 PM on April 13, 2011 [1 favorite]
posted by Ragged Richard at 12:20 PM on April 13, 2011 [1 favorite]
The temper-tantrum sister sounds like all she really wants is to ruin everyone else's trip. Maybe you can all sneak away on vacation without her.
Jut kidding...sort of.
posted by pompelmo at 12:27 PM on April 13, 2011
Jut kidding...sort of.
posted by pompelmo at 12:27 PM on April 13, 2011
Vita's answer is the certainly the best and most adult, but given bratty sister's major brattiness, I wouldn't be surprised if she'd throw a tantrum during the discussion, and continue to throw tantrums the whole vacation even if pressured into taking the center seat if only half the time. Actually, to be absolutely fair, it should be a third of the time--which should be do-able for all with breaks for stretching legs and eating meals.
I can't believe that four other adults can't override her tantrums. Form a united front and tell her: Shape up or stay home, you won't ruin it for the rest of us.
If you do go the route of a family discussion, given her major brattiness, I wouldn't be surprised if she made a point that she'd prefer the window seat over your coming with the family on vacation trips. In that case, stay home the next trip, and allow her to be her ugly self. BUT next time, YOU get to go, and she stays home. I'm sure she'll REALLY bitch and moan about that decision, but who cares. You won't hear her in the car with the windows rolled up! You all could even leave a couple days early, while she's at work or in school.
Sure hope Vita's solution works for you in spite of my cynical attitude.
posted by BlueHorse at 2:22 PM on April 13, 2011 [1 favorite]
I can't believe that four other adults can't override her tantrums. Form a united front and tell her: Shape up or stay home, you won't ruin it for the rest of us.
If you do go the route of a family discussion, given her major brattiness, I wouldn't be surprised if she made a point that she'd prefer the window seat over your coming with the family on vacation trips. In that case, stay home the next trip, and allow her to be her ugly self. BUT next time, YOU get to go, and she stays home. I'm sure she'll REALLY bitch and moan about that decision, but who cares. You won't hear her in the car with the windows rolled up! You all could even leave a couple days early, while she's at work or in school.
Sure hope Vita's solution works for you in spite of my cynical attitude.
posted by BlueHorse at 2:22 PM on April 13, 2011 [1 favorite]
Have you asked Sister what qualifies her to never take the middle seat, not even her fair share of the time? "I don't want to" would not have carried much weight in my family. Giving in to a tantrum would absolutely NOT have been an option if only to avoid the kind of precedent you've allowed to be set.
If using a different vehicle isn't practical, than maybe a one-hour shift in the middle seat, 2 hours not in the middle, with 15 minute breaks to walk around and stretch, would be short enough to be endurable for all three of you.
posted by ctmf at 7:21 PM on April 13, 2011
If using a different vehicle isn't practical, than maybe a one-hour shift in the middle seat, 2 hours not in the middle, with 15 minute breaks to walk around and stretch, would be short enough to be endurable for all three of you.
posted by ctmf at 7:21 PM on April 13, 2011
Take it from another 5' woman: two inches height difference between short people is trivial. You and your sister are the same size, for the sake of argument. You should stop saying/thinking you're the shortest person in the car. You and your sister are both short, you've got health issues, so you get the good seat or just stay home.
posted by Scram at 8:36 AM on April 14, 2011
posted by Scram at 8:36 AM on April 14, 2011
Since it seems you find every alternative impossible: Don't go.
posted by spaltavian at 9:38 AM on April 14, 2011
posted by spaltavian at 9:38 AM on April 14, 2011
Our trips are long in duration, since most of the extended family lives across the country. We fill the trunk but also stow smaller bags at our feet. No one is packing excessively.
Trust me - you are packing excessively and/or using the wrong kind of bags to maximise what you can fit in the boot of your car. As part of that conversation with your family challenge the luggage arrangements. There is no reason why, staying with family, you can't do laundry if you have to once in a while for example.
posted by koahiatamadl at 6:33 AM on April 25, 2011
Trust me - you are packing excessively and/or using the wrong kind of bags to maximise what you can fit in the boot of your car. As part of that conversation with your family challenge the luggage arrangements. There is no reason why, staying with family, you can't do laundry if you have to once in a while for example.
posted by koahiatamadl at 6:33 AM on April 25, 2011
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by Iteki at 10:40 AM on April 13, 2011