Too much, or just right?
January 6, 2011 12:11 PM Subscribe
Yesterday, I stepped up the intensity of my near-daily workout, and I'm really feeling it. I was ravenous all day yesterday, and particularly ravenous for the kinds of high-carb high-fat foods I've worked so hard to cut out of my diet. Also, I was very brain-tired; I was foggy and had trouble concentrating all day. Are these post-workout effects a sign of overdoing it, or of doing it right?
I'm roughly a hundred pounds overweight and two months postpartum. While I was pregnant, I lost about thirty-five pounds, and I was determined to make a real difference in my health, for my own sake and for the sake of my kids. I've continued making an effort to eat lower carb, and on the advice of my nutritionist, I've been making a real commitment to getting to the gym five days a week, though in practice it's more like 3-4 days.
Because I have an infant in the gym day care, I can't do a truly extended workout. (Particularly right now, when he's literally eating every hour, hour and a half.) What I've been doing is 30 minutes of cardio + a five minute cooldown, and then one 12-rep set each on five or six different weight machines, depending on what I'm working on. I do lower body weights once a week, upper body and core weights each twice a week, roughly. I've been doing my cardio on the elliptical machine, aiming for a heart rate at 75-85% of max. But one day all the "good" elliptical machines were taken, and I decided to try the first week's workout of the C25K on the treadmill.
That's when I discovered that I can't jog for sixty seconds at a shot without feeling like I want to die. That's right, I'm too out of shape for the "no previous exercise apart from Wii Bowling" level of the C25K. What I can do is run for thirty seconds and then walk for two and a half minutes, and so that's what I did. Running for thirty seconds puts me at 90-95% my max heart rate, it recovers to my "normal" level after about 90 seconds.
After a half hour of that, I felt OK -- it was definitely a bigger deal than the elliptical workout, but I wasn't so exhausted that I couldn't do my weight routine as normal. But all day yesterday, I was really, REALLY hungry. My normal lunch? Totally didn't touch it. I could have had a cheeseburger for an afternoon snack, cheerfully. I took seconds at dinner because I was just so fucking hungry. Not only that, but I had trouble thinking and concentrating all day long, like I forgot how to use the debit card POS system at the grocery store where I've shopped approximately half a million times. Also just now I spelled "use" as "youse."
So, from what little I know about nutrition and metabolism, I'm guessing that I have a normal reserve of blood glycogen or whatever that my usual exercise routine uses up a lot of but doesn't exhaust. And I'm guessing that my workout yesterday -- which might sound pathetic, but I tell you what, YOU try going for a jog while carrying twelve gallons of milk -- was enough to not just exhaust those stores but to push me beyond some metabolic point. So my question is, should I cut back? Or is this exactly the sort of thing I need to do in order to poke my liver into getting less stingy with the fat-burning already? I did it again today, and again, I'm frickin RAVENOUS, already.
Probably-relevant information: I'm nursing a two month old baby, who eats about one million^H^H^H twelve times a day. My last fasting glucose reading, a couple of years ago, was 103. I'm 5'2" and weigh 235 pounds. I am clinically hypothyroid, and take 112mcg of Synthroid a day, which keeps my TSH at about 0.8. While I'd like to continue losing weight, my real looming goal is to reverse this insulin resistance and avoid ever getting Type II diabetes.
I'm roughly a hundred pounds overweight and two months postpartum. While I was pregnant, I lost about thirty-five pounds, and I was determined to make a real difference in my health, for my own sake and for the sake of my kids. I've continued making an effort to eat lower carb, and on the advice of my nutritionist, I've been making a real commitment to getting to the gym five days a week, though in practice it's more like 3-4 days.
Because I have an infant in the gym day care, I can't do a truly extended workout. (Particularly right now, when he's literally eating every hour, hour and a half.) What I've been doing is 30 minutes of cardio + a five minute cooldown, and then one 12-rep set each on five or six different weight machines, depending on what I'm working on. I do lower body weights once a week, upper body and core weights each twice a week, roughly. I've been doing my cardio on the elliptical machine, aiming for a heart rate at 75-85% of max. But one day all the "good" elliptical machines were taken, and I decided to try the first week's workout of the C25K on the treadmill.
That's when I discovered that I can't jog for sixty seconds at a shot without feeling like I want to die. That's right, I'm too out of shape for the "no previous exercise apart from Wii Bowling" level of the C25K. What I can do is run for thirty seconds and then walk for two and a half minutes, and so that's what I did. Running for thirty seconds puts me at 90-95% my max heart rate, it recovers to my "normal" level after about 90 seconds.
After a half hour of that, I felt OK -- it was definitely a bigger deal than the elliptical workout, but I wasn't so exhausted that I couldn't do my weight routine as normal. But all day yesterday, I was really, REALLY hungry. My normal lunch? Totally didn't touch it. I could have had a cheeseburger for an afternoon snack, cheerfully. I took seconds at dinner because I was just so fucking hungry. Not only that, but I had trouble thinking and concentrating all day long, like I forgot how to use the debit card POS system at the grocery store where I've shopped approximately half a million times. Also just now I spelled "use" as "youse."
So, from what little I know about nutrition and metabolism, I'm guessing that I have a normal reserve of blood glycogen or whatever that my usual exercise routine uses up a lot of but doesn't exhaust. And I'm guessing that my workout yesterday -- which might sound pathetic, but I tell you what, YOU try going for a jog while carrying twelve gallons of milk -- was enough to not just exhaust those stores but to push me beyond some metabolic point. So my question is, should I cut back? Or is this exactly the sort of thing I need to do in order to poke my liver into getting less stingy with the fat-burning already? I did it again today, and again, I'm frickin RAVENOUS, already.
Probably-relevant information: I'm nursing a two month old baby, who eats about one million^H^H^H twelve times a day. My last fasting glucose reading, a couple of years ago, was 103. I'm 5'2" and weigh 235 pounds. I am clinically hypothyroid, and take 112mcg of Synthroid a day, which keeps my TSH at about 0.8. While I'd like to continue losing weight, my real looming goal is to reverse this insulin resistance and avoid ever getting Type II diabetes.
Response by poster: frickin four and a half mph. My husband walks at that pace. I'm not sure it can get a lot slower and still be considered "jogging."
posted by KathrynT at 12:24 PM on January 6, 2011
posted by KathrynT at 12:24 PM on January 6, 2011
Congrats on choosing a healthier life! I too had concentration/memory issues when I was doing high-intensity workouts early on, but mostly just for the duration of the workout. Then, I tried low-carb and the fog was there most of the time. Part of this is ketoadaptation - when your glycogen is out and you are not taking in glucose, the liver has to manufacture ketones that the brain can run on instead. This is not a bad thing for most people, but because your brain is used to glucose it will take some time to get used to the new fuel. You could try easing yourself onto lower-carb eating, as both exercise and low-carb are major transitions that place demands on your body that you're not used to.
FWIW, I wound up finding the "paleo" paradigm more useful than "low-carb", but both can be great tools.
The hunger may well be from your muscles trying to grow - starting intervals or weight training is a powerful stimulus for this positive change in body composition. I'm not an expert on this one, but I say eat more but keep it clean - no grains, sugars, or vegetable oils.
posted by Earl the Polliwog at 12:25 PM on January 6, 2011
FWIW, I wound up finding the "paleo" paradigm more useful than "low-carb", but both can be great tools.
The hunger may well be from your muscles trying to grow - starting intervals or weight training is a powerful stimulus for this positive change in body composition. I'm not an expert on this one, but I say eat more but keep it clean - no grains, sugars, or vegetable oils.
posted by Earl the Polliwog at 12:25 PM on January 6, 2011
Oh, and the intervals are a very good thing, as is weight lifting - longer periods of jogging are not as good for the metabolic and muscular changes you want, so don't bother with them unless you like 'em!
posted by Earl the Polliwog at 12:27 PM on January 6, 2011
posted by Earl the Polliwog at 12:27 PM on January 6, 2011
This isn't uncommon. Eat right after exercising (this can be difficult to do) and snack throughout the day - washed down with plenty of water (no energy drinks or soda). It's WHAT you eat and snack on that counts. Eat fruits, vegetables and 3 balanced meals. It's also a psychological battle - crappy food is addictive.
posted by rotifer at 12:28 PM on January 6, 2011 [3 favorites]
posted by rotifer at 12:28 PM on January 6, 2011 [3 favorites]
I would check how much you are eating. It sounds like you could be crashing. "Brain fog" can be typical for a few weeks while moving away from a high carb diet though so you could also just try sticking it out for a bit.
You don't mention what you are eating but that's the biggest part that matters in all of this...all your hard work in the gym can be reversed with just 1 or 2 cookies.
Based on your weight:
You would probably need around 2200 calories a day to maintain if you aren't active.
With your workout you'd probably need about 2500 calories to maintain.
What I would do is eat maybe 1850-2000 calories a day every day but on workout days add in a 150-250 calorie protein shake directly after training.
This should set you up for long consistent weight loss. Log what you're eating and see what numbers you are coming in at.
posted by zephyr_words at 12:30 PM on January 6, 2011
You don't mention what you are eating but that's the biggest part that matters in all of this...all your hard work in the gym can be reversed with just 1 or 2 cookies.
Based on your weight:
You would probably need around 2200 calories a day to maintain if you aren't active.
With your workout you'd probably need about 2500 calories to maintain.
What I would do is eat maybe 1850-2000 calories a day every day but on workout days add in a 150-250 calorie protein shake directly after training.
This should set you up for long consistent weight loss. Log what you're eating and see what numbers you are coming in at.
posted by zephyr_words at 12:30 PM on January 6, 2011
I'd like to make a side note that breastfeeding, in and of itself, can make you ravenously hungry. I know you've been at it for two months (congrats!) but I didn't find that the intense hunger kicked in until my son was a few months old. I also resumed a fairly vigorous exercise regimen around that time and I just ate, ate, ate. So it's probably a combo of the two.
posted by tetralix at 12:33 PM on January 6, 2011 [1 favorite]
posted by tetralix at 12:33 PM on January 6, 2011 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: ARGH I knew I'd forget something! According to the nutritionist (whom I like a lot, btw), between my borked metabolism and the fact that I'm losing 500-800 calories a day feeding this baby, it's really important for me to not spend a lot of time hungry. Like "Hm, I could eat" is OK, but once I start fantasizing about food, it's a bad sign -- not just metabolically but because I'm setting myself up to fail.
I've actually been doing the lower-carb thing for about seven months, following a sketchy glucose reading for gestational diabetes. I fell off the wagon a bit over the holidays, but I'm determined to get back into it. I've done a really good job of having my regular meals and snacks be lower-carb and high protein and vegetables, and I don't drink caloric beverages except for the occasional latte; I drink about three liters of water a day. (Again, I have to. I lose nearly that much fluid nursing.) It's fantastic for my health, my sleep, my energy levels, and my mood, I have every reason to keep it up.
posted by KathrynT at 12:36 PM on January 6, 2011
I've actually been doing the lower-carb thing for about seven months, following a sketchy glucose reading for gestational diabetes. I fell off the wagon a bit over the holidays, but I'm determined to get back into it. I've done a really good job of having my regular meals and snacks be lower-carb and high protein and vegetables, and I don't drink caloric beverages except for the occasional latte; I drink about three liters of water a day. (Again, I have to. I lose nearly that much fluid nursing.) It's fantastic for my health, my sleep, my energy levels, and my mood, I have every reason to keep it up.
posted by KathrynT at 12:36 PM on January 6, 2011
What I've been doing is 30 minutes of cardio + a five minute cooldown, and then one 12-rep set each on five or six different weight machines, depending on what I'm working on. I do lower body weights once a week, upper body and core weights each twice a week, roughly. I've been doing my cardio on the elliptical machine, aiming for a heart rate at 75-85% of max. But one day all the "good" elliptical machines were taken, and I decided to try the first week's workout of the C25K on the treadmill.
If it were me, I'd pull back and just do one thing a day or an amended set of two things (fifteen minutes of walking, 2 or 3 lifts) each day and go for thirty minutes total at the gym.
I would take what you're describing as an indication that you were asking too much of your body and needed to go a little slower. You won't be stuck at that level forever -- but I think your exceeding your fuel reserves as things stand today. As you gain muscle, it'll get better.
I wanted to run a marathon -- I wound up not being able to do it this year after breaking my toe -- but when I was training I was hungrier than in my entire life. I was throwing croutons into blue cheese dressing and eating that with a fork on a nightly basis. Since I stopped training that hard I haven't felt like doing that since. (Although now that I think about it....delicious.)
posted by A Terrible Llama at 12:37 PM on January 6, 2011
If it were me, I'd pull back and just do one thing a day or an amended set of two things (fifteen minutes of walking, 2 or 3 lifts) each day and go for thirty minutes total at the gym.
I would take what you're describing as an indication that you were asking too much of your body and needed to go a little slower. You won't be stuck at that level forever -- but I think your exceeding your fuel reserves as things stand today. As you gain muscle, it'll get better.
I wanted to run a marathon -- I wound up not being able to do it this year after breaking my toe -- but when I was training I was hungrier than in my entire life. I was throwing croutons into blue cheese dressing and eating that with a fork on a nightly basis. Since I stopped training that hard I haven't felt like doing that since. (Although now that I think about it....delicious.)
posted by A Terrible Llama at 12:37 PM on January 6, 2011
A few other things - snack and hydrate (this is where you can have an energy drink) one hour before exercise and every hour or so during exercise. This will help quite a bit. The rule of thumb is that you eat today for the work you will do tomorrow. You are in very poor physical condition, take your time and be patient. Another rule of thumb, you will notice improvements in performance every two weeks or so. Good luck.
posted by rotifer at 12:37 PM on January 6, 2011
posted by rotifer at 12:37 PM on January 6, 2011
First of all, YOU ROCK. You're accomplishing a ton and you get about a million brownie points for doing it all while being a nursing mom. I'd give you a gold medal just for that.
I have had a similar situation occur -- and let me just say I'm really similar to you in height and weight. For me, one thing that helped was eating 1/2 a Balance bar right before my workout and the other 1/2 right afterwards. For some reason that staves off both the "ravenous/shaky/brain dead low blood sugar post-workout" syndrome and also the "starving the rest of the day" syndrome.
posted by BlahLaLa at 12:37 PM on January 6, 2011
I have had a similar situation occur -- and let me just say I'm really similar to you in height and weight. For me, one thing that helped was eating 1/2 a Balance bar right before my workout and the other 1/2 right afterwards. For some reason that staves off both the "ravenous/shaky/brain dead low blood sugar post-workout" syndrome and also the "starving the rest of the day" syndrome.
posted by BlahLaLa at 12:37 PM on January 6, 2011
Don't beat yourself up, and don't try to starve, either. I'm not familiar with the C25K (I assume that's couch to 5K; heard of it but know nothing about it), but running is strenous, period. Nursing a baby also takes its toll. If you're really hungry, EAT quality foods. I've resumed a workout regime after a couple of years of inactivity (and the years before that weren't great, either), and you have to listen to your own body, not go by the numbers that others are telling you you should be hitting. Everyone is different, and nothing about your condition sounds like you're someone who can't improve. But you have to start where you are.
Give yourself a light day if you're tired/foggy. Slower/shorter/less resistance on the cardio, and lighter on the weight training (or skip all or some of the exercises that day).
posted by randomkeystrike at 12:38 PM on January 6, 2011
Give yourself a light day if you're tired/foggy. Slower/shorter/less resistance on the cardio, and lighter on the weight training (or skip all or some of the exercises that day).
posted by randomkeystrike at 12:38 PM on January 6, 2011
I'm not going to answer your hunger question, because I'm still trying to figure out what works best for me food-wise after a year and a half and 100 pounds lost.
I am going to tell you that you are AMAZING for going to the gym and starting C25k. You ran for 30 seconds without stopping, you rested, and then you did it again. That's fantastic! How long did you run last week? How many intervals did you complete? You're already ahead of where you were. And you'll be surprised by how much easier your next 30 second run will be.
Now, if you don't enjoy running intervals and are only trying to get into running for the caloric burn, I'd suggest that you work on walking on inclines rather than trying to go fast. There's less impact that way (which I imagine might be more comfortable for you since you're nursing) and you still burn calories pretty quickly.
FWIW, I started out in the same boat as you--running for 30 seconds nonstop was extremely difficult, forget 60. I was at a point where I was running for 2-3 minutes a pop before I was told not to run because of my knee problems.
I know this doesn't directly answer your question, but it might help!
posted by Aleen at 12:40 PM on January 6, 2011
I am going to tell you that you are AMAZING for going to the gym and starting C25k. You ran for 30 seconds without stopping, you rested, and then you did it again. That's fantastic! How long did you run last week? How many intervals did you complete? You're already ahead of where you were. And you'll be surprised by how much easier your next 30 second run will be.
Now, if you don't enjoy running intervals and are only trying to get into running for the caloric burn, I'd suggest that you work on walking on inclines rather than trying to go fast. There's less impact that way (which I imagine might be more comfortable for you since you're nursing) and you still burn calories pretty quickly.
FWIW, I started out in the same boat as you--running for 30 seconds nonstop was extremely difficult, forget 60. I was at a point where I was running for 2-3 minutes a pop before I was told not to run because of my knee problems.
I know this doesn't directly answer your question, but it might help!
posted by Aleen at 12:40 PM on January 6, 2011
Oh, and regarding the insulin resistance thing, you may find this study interesting.
posted by Earl the Polliwog at 12:40 PM on January 6, 2011
posted by Earl the Polliwog at 12:40 PM on January 6, 2011
You have a brand new baby, so I'm imagining you aren't getting all that much sleep. A big sleep deficit can contribute to you feeling more hungry.
posted by smalls at 12:41 PM on January 6, 2011
posted by smalls at 12:41 PM on January 6, 2011
I'm about as overweight as you are. When I started C25k, I damn near died after the first run, and I thought I had been active! For the first, gosh, 3 or 4 weeks, I collapsed in a chair and the end of every session and didn't move for an hour, and then only to drag myself into the shower.
It got better. I had to repeat a few weeks, but slowly I got to the point where I could complete the workouts and then continue my day without collapsing into exhaustion. I wouldn't sweat it too much, you're doing something that's really hard for your body. Take a granola bar to eat right afterward, and be patient.
Oh, and congrats on all the hard work. You are like a super-ninja-mom.
posted by zug at 12:48 PM on January 6, 2011
It got better. I had to repeat a few weeks, but slowly I got to the point where I could complete the workouts and then continue my day without collapsing into exhaustion. I wouldn't sweat it too much, you're doing something that's really hard for your body. Take a granola bar to eat right afterward, and be patient.
Oh, and congrats on all the hard work. You are like a super-ninja-mom.
posted by zug at 12:48 PM on January 6, 2011
I was ravenous all day yesterday, and particularly ravenous for the kinds of high-carb high-fat foods I've worked so hard to cut out of my diet.
Since you're eating a low-carb diet, you need fats; they're the body's primary non-carb source of energy. Compensate for those tempting high-carb high-fat foods with some small, frequent doses of low-carb high-fat foods, like dairy, nuts, and even meat. Almonds/almond butter, full-fat yogurt, or string cheese might make good, small snacks throughout the day, for instance.
Also, if you're not drinking a shake with protein powder and milk immediately after every workout, I'd suggest starting there. Post-workout protein is a must.
Are these post-workout effects a sign of overdoing it, or of doing it right?
They're a sign that you did more than usual, and your body isn't used to it. Any major change in the gym tends to hit you hard -- I took a few weeks off, for example, came back on Monday, and sure enough, even something much lighter than my usual workout wrecked me. When I first started weightlifting I had to drink a bottle of orange juice just to make it through the workout, and now that seems like a mystery to me... but it really was a necessity back then. And so on. You're not just training your muscles, you're training your brain, your metabolism, etc.
In short: if you eat well, get rest, and stick with your workout, your body will adjust to what you're doing... but if the brain fog is really killing you, go ahead and take it down a notch. It might be easier for you to adjust in stages, and that's OK -- it is always more important to keep working than it is to work at any particular pace. Burnout is the enemy!
posted by vorfeed at 12:52 PM on January 6, 2011 [1 favorite]
Since you're eating a low-carb diet, you need fats; they're the body's primary non-carb source of energy. Compensate for those tempting high-carb high-fat foods with some small, frequent doses of low-carb high-fat foods, like dairy, nuts, and even meat. Almonds/almond butter, full-fat yogurt, or string cheese might make good, small snacks throughout the day, for instance.
Also, if you're not drinking a shake with protein powder and milk immediately after every workout, I'd suggest starting there. Post-workout protein is a must.
Are these post-workout effects a sign of overdoing it, or of doing it right?
They're a sign that you did more than usual, and your body isn't used to it. Any major change in the gym tends to hit you hard -- I took a few weeks off, for example, came back on Monday, and sure enough, even something much lighter than my usual workout wrecked me. When I first started weightlifting I had to drink a bottle of orange juice just to make it through the workout, and now that seems like a mystery to me... but it really was a necessity back then. And so on. You're not just training your muscles, you're training your brain, your metabolism, etc.
In short: if you eat well, get rest, and stick with your workout, your body will adjust to what you're doing... but if the brain fog is really killing you, go ahead and take it down a notch. It might be easier for you to adjust in stages, and that's OK -- it is always more important to keep working than it is to work at any particular pace. Burnout is the enemy!
posted by vorfeed at 12:52 PM on January 6, 2011 [1 favorite]
Best answer: It sounds like the way you feeling might have something to do with intervals. The whole point is to push your body to it's absolute limit for 30 seconds or whatever, and then slow down. (30 seconds at full speed and 90 slowing down is actually perfect!) Intervals are the best way to lose weight! When I finish an interval workout on the treadmill I want to throw up and die. It also sometimes makes me feel a little shakey for the rest of the day. The "brain fog" might be due to the workout OR having a newborn baby.
The ravenous hunger might have something to do with your metabolism getting higher--due to either working out more intensely, breastfeeding, or both.
At any rate, keep on doing what you're doing! You're doing fantastic, and you just pushed yourself to a new limit--don't look for any excuse to back down!! It doesn't sound like you've done anything "too much" that will harm you. Exercise is not supposed to be easy. Especially when you have a lot to lose Good luck :)
And happy new baby!!
posted by katypickle at 12:59 PM on January 6, 2011
The ravenous hunger might have something to do with your metabolism getting higher--due to either working out more intensely, breastfeeding, or both.
At any rate, keep on doing what you're doing! You're doing fantastic, and you just pushed yourself to a new limit--don't look for any excuse to back down!! It doesn't sound like you've done anything "too much" that will harm you. Exercise is not supposed to be easy. Especially when you have a lot to lose Good luck :)
And happy new baby!!
posted by katypickle at 12:59 PM on January 6, 2011
Response by poster: You don't mention what you are eating but that's the biggest part that matters in all of this...all your hard work in the gym can be reversed with just 1 or 2 cookies.
On a calories-in calories-out basis, yes. But taking in calories and burning them with exercise is different for your body than just not eating and sitting on the couch. Losing weight isn't my primary goal.
I have no idea how many calories I'm eating, but between the working out and the nursing, I'd need to eat about 800-1000 calories over my baseline just to maintain. Breakfast is either raw veg or raw fruit + a protein source; nuts, ry-krisp and cheese, or cold cuts. Post-workout snack is raw fruit or veg. Lunch is a fancy salad, afternoon snack is veg and hummus, and dinner is protein, one green vegetable, one non-green vegetable. There are grains in there too, but not a lot, less than four servings a day.
Yesterday? not so much. I couldn't even begin to tell you what I ate yesterday. I remember fixing a grilled cheese sandwich, and I remember putting the empty plate in the dishwasher, but I think I may have been so hungry I just absorbed it through my skin.
as for getting rest. . . oh man. the baby has the 11PM feed and then wakes up at 3:30 and eats, I'm not shitting you, until 6 AM. not just comfort nursing either. I'm feeding him right now for the third time since i posted the question. It's a growth spurt, it'll end. . . someday. . .
posted by KathrynT at 1:03 PM on January 6, 2011
On a calories-in calories-out basis, yes. But taking in calories and burning them with exercise is different for your body than just not eating and sitting on the couch. Losing weight isn't my primary goal.
I have no idea how many calories I'm eating, but between the working out and the nursing, I'd need to eat about 800-1000 calories over my baseline just to maintain. Breakfast is either raw veg or raw fruit + a protein source; nuts, ry-krisp and cheese, or cold cuts. Post-workout snack is raw fruit or veg. Lunch is a fancy salad, afternoon snack is veg and hummus, and dinner is protein, one green vegetable, one non-green vegetable. There are grains in there too, but not a lot, less than four servings a day.
Yesterday? not so much. I couldn't even begin to tell you what I ate yesterday. I remember fixing a grilled cheese sandwich, and I remember putting the empty plate in the dishwasher, but I think I may have been so hungry I just absorbed it through my skin.
as for getting rest. . . oh man. the baby has the 11PM feed and then wakes up at 3:30 and eats, I'm not shitting you, until 6 AM. not just comfort nursing either. I'm feeding him right now for the third time since i posted the question. It's a growth spurt, it'll end. . . someday. . .
posted by KathrynT at 1:03 PM on January 6, 2011
Yes, generally, if you're craving high-carb foods like mad it means you likely overtrained - but being at the start of your program, that might be ok. To underscore what others have said, get 15g of healthy carbs within a half hour before the start of your workout - half a banana is my go-to for that - and some healthy protein after. I worked out for, like, 8 years, and lost 75 pounds before I learned to eat something before my workouts, and it makes a Huge Difference to how I feel and how my body reacts. Tons of protein (hard-boiled eggs, no-fat yogurt) also have helped me build muscle and slay hunger.
Go you, and keep working with that nutritionist - sounds like you're on a good path!
posted by ldthomps at 1:05 PM on January 6, 2011 [1 favorite]
Go you, and keep working with that nutritionist - sounds like you're on a good path!
posted by ldthomps at 1:05 PM on January 6, 2011 [1 favorite]
Best answer: Maybe switch the afternoon snack and the post-workout snack, you probably need more than the fruit or veggie after your workout.
posted by teragram at 1:08 PM on January 6, 2011 [1 favorite]
posted by teragram at 1:08 PM on January 6, 2011 [1 favorite]
Just a suggestion, but for the post workout snack, a raw fruit or veg might not be enough. If I do a particularly intense workout, I find that eating right afterwards helps A LOT. I can often be found in the change room, taking off sweaty clothes and demolishing a granola bar at the same time. Something with a bit of protein and fat is also good after a workout and helps me to stave off that insatiable-deep-cavernous-hunger that can sometimes occur - something like almonds/chocolate chips/dried cranberries or some cheese (babybels are perfect for this) works wonders on not fading off into spacey lightheadedness.
Also, you rock for taking charge of your fitness and health so decisively! Your kids are lucky to have you - not only are you helping yourself you are modeling good behaviour for them as they grow up :)
posted by hepta at 1:23 PM on January 6, 2011
Also, you rock for taking charge of your fitness and health so decisively! Your kids are lucky to have you - not only are you helping yourself you are modeling good behaviour for them as they grow up :)
posted by hepta at 1:23 PM on January 6, 2011
Eating a low-carb diet and working out is asking for trouble. You may as well eat nothing and work out. The "paleo" diet of high protein low carb a myth as our ancestors very likely developed fire for cooking carbohydrate-rich tubers. Our ancestors that subsided mainly on protein (and we did have some) died out pretty quickly. Homo sapiens got to where we are very likely by eating a lot of carbs and then some scavenged meat and found nuts.
After working out eat something with easily absorbed carbs - like a banana or apple. The sugar is easily absorbed and will balance out your blood levels. If you want eat something with protein and fat (maybe some nuts) to sustain satisfaction (you mentioned balancing diabetes, though, so keep in mind how best to work this with that).
Overall people who eat high healthy carb diets vs those who eat low carb diets do not show less weight loss. However they are less likely to develop the "fog" that low carb dieters experience as, as mentioned above more politely, switching to low carb diets, even while eating proteins and fats, is really akin to starving yourself until your body switches over to gluconeogenesis. Furthermore large amounts of the by-products of gluconeogenesis may be harmful in the long wrong, causing ketoacidosis.
posted by Lt. Bunny Wigglesworth at 1:37 PM on January 6, 2011
After working out eat something with easily absorbed carbs - like a banana or apple. The sugar is easily absorbed and will balance out your blood levels. If you want eat something with protein and fat (maybe some nuts) to sustain satisfaction (you mentioned balancing diabetes, though, so keep in mind how best to work this with that).
Overall people who eat high healthy carb diets vs those who eat low carb diets do not show less weight loss. However they are less likely to develop the "fog" that low carb dieters experience as, as mentioned above more politely, switching to low carb diets, even while eating proteins and fats, is really akin to starving yourself until your body switches over to gluconeogenesis. Furthermore large amounts of the by-products of gluconeogenesis may be harmful in the long wrong, causing ketoacidosis.
posted by Lt. Bunny Wigglesworth at 1:37 PM on January 6, 2011
Eating a low-carb diet and working out is asking for trouble. You may as well eat nothing and work out.
This is nonsense. Gyms are full of people doing low-carb/paleo diets. Balancing energy needs on a low-carb diet does take a little more attention to nutrition and frequency, but once you've got the knack for it, low-carb is perfectly compatible with exercise. That includes elite levels of exercise, too -- paleo wouldn't be huge among crossfitters if it were anywhere close to the same as "eat nothing and work out".
Furthermore large amounts of the by-products of gluconeogenesis may be harmful in the long wrong, causing ketoacidosis.
And large amounts of easily-absorbed carbs may be harmful in the long run, causing insulin resistance and diabetes. Given that the OP is pre-diabetic, not pre-ketoacidosic, I think a low-carb diet is quite appropriate for her... and so does her nutritionist, apparently.
posted by vorfeed at 1:58 PM on January 6, 2011
This is nonsense. Gyms are full of people doing low-carb/paleo diets. Balancing energy needs on a low-carb diet does take a little more attention to nutrition and frequency, but once you've got the knack for it, low-carb is perfectly compatible with exercise. That includes elite levels of exercise, too -- paleo wouldn't be huge among crossfitters if it were anywhere close to the same as "eat nothing and work out".
Furthermore large amounts of the by-products of gluconeogenesis may be harmful in the long wrong, causing ketoacidosis.
And large amounts of easily-absorbed carbs may be harmful in the long run, causing insulin resistance and diabetes. Given that the OP is pre-diabetic, not pre-ketoacidosic, I think a low-carb diet is quite appropriate for her... and so does her nutritionist, apparently.
posted by vorfeed at 1:58 PM on January 6, 2011
Ha, welcome to doing intervals! It's amazing how much more they kick your ass than steady-state cardio, because it doesn't always seem all that much harder after you're done. But you actually did work a lot harder, hence the hunger and brain fog!
I think the answer here is to just experiment and try not to worry too much about it. If you like doing intervals, then eat when you're ravenous after and see what happens with the scale after a week. I think you might find that intervals are a really effective way to increase your cardio capacity and lose weight, even if they make you hungry.
posted by yarly at 2:03 PM on January 6, 2011
I think the answer here is to just experiment and try not to worry too much about it. If you like doing intervals, then eat when you're ravenous after and see what happens with the scale after a week. I think you might find that intervals are a really effective way to increase your cardio capacity and lose weight, even if they make you hungry.
posted by yarly at 2:03 PM on January 6, 2011
Best answer: First of all, you are doing an incredible job! Kudos to you.
Workouts and hunger:
I'm a woman and I find that when I do a lot of cardio, it makes me raneously hungry. When I do more weight-lifting, it doesn't make me do the oh-my-god-eat-a-whole-cow-right-now thing, and I get better results. Don't forget to take days off to let your body recover. The worst motivation killer ever was when I worked out too much, too early and gave myself a (thankfully minor) injury.
Fullness and food:
You mentioned veggies and lots of protein - what about healthy fats from avocados and olive oil? These fill me up much better than carbs. Lots of research suggests breastfed babies benefit when mom eats these healthy fats, too.
Insulin resistance:
Grains - even the 'healthy' ones - cause insulin spikes. If you want to reduce your frequency of high insulin spikes, you might consider eating grains less often.
Anecdotes:
I also eat low-ish carb (no grains, some fruit, some nuts, some dark chocolate, lots of vegetables. Lots of fat and protein). I only get hungry if I don't eat enough fat. I get no brain-fog, I have more energy than ever, my fitness and other health markers are better, etc., etc. Um, I promise I eat a lot and I'm not starving and am not in ketoacidosis. Most importantly, I feel better and have sustained energy throughout my entire day. (It helps a lot with keeping up with a 4-year-old!) My health is even better now than when I ate mostly as I do now but with oatmeal and whole wheat.
In a nutshell:
Keep rocking what you're doing! Make it work for you, with your lifestyle. Don't stress about it - you're already on the right path. These are all nuts and bolts.
posted by nicodine at 2:33 PM on January 6, 2011 [1 favorite]
Workouts and hunger:
I'm a woman and I find that when I do a lot of cardio, it makes me raneously hungry. When I do more weight-lifting, it doesn't make me do the oh-my-god-eat-a-whole-cow-right-now thing, and I get better results. Don't forget to take days off to let your body recover. The worst motivation killer ever was when I worked out too much, too early and gave myself a (thankfully minor) injury.
Fullness and food:
You mentioned veggies and lots of protein - what about healthy fats from avocados and olive oil? These fill me up much better than carbs. Lots of research suggests breastfed babies benefit when mom eats these healthy fats, too.
Insulin resistance:
Grains - even the 'healthy' ones - cause insulin spikes. If you want to reduce your frequency of high insulin spikes, you might consider eating grains less often.
Anecdotes:
I also eat low-ish carb (no grains, some fruit, some nuts, some dark chocolate, lots of vegetables. Lots of fat and protein). I only get hungry if I don't eat enough fat. I get no brain-fog, I have more energy than ever, my fitness and other health markers are better, etc., etc. Um, I promise I eat a lot and I'm not starving and am not in ketoacidosis. Most importantly, I feel better and have sustained energy throughout my entire day. (It helps a lot with keeping up with a 4-year-old!) My health is even better now than when I ate mostly as I do now but with oatmeal and whole wheat.
In a nutshell:
Keep rocking what you're doing! Make it work for you, with your lifestyle. Don't stress about it - you're already on the right path. These are all nuts and bolts.
posted by nicodine at 2:33 PM on January 6, 2011 [1 favorite]
When I saw your mention of sub-clinical hypothyroidism, treated with Synthroid, I wondered if there was a connection. Some people find that synthetic thyroid hormones like Synthroid and Levoxyl don't quite cut it for them--leaving them symptomatic despite "normal" lab results. (I place "normal" in quotes because I'm assuming they only tested your TSH. It's hard to know what even a normal TSH test by itself means without the accompanying free T3 and free T4 tests.)
To avoid cluttering this discussion with the finer points on T3/T4 replacement, I'll simply refer you to a previous post on the subject (to which I contributed a response) that you can read if you have time.
I can't say your thyroid has anything to do with this, but it won't hurt to become more educated about your condition, since it could be related, you will probably have the condition for the rest of your life, and it will very likely worsen over time.
posted by ViolaGrinder at 2:39 PM on January 6, 2011
To avoid cluttering this discussion with the finer points on T3/T4 replacement, I'll simply refer you to a previous post on the subject (to which I contributed a response) that you can read if you have time.
I can't say your thyroid has anything to do with this, but it won't hurt to become more educated about your condition, since it could be related, you will probably have the condition for the rest of your life, and it will very likely worsen over time.
posted by ViolaGrinder at 2:39 PM on January 6, 2011
I'm not at all knowledgeable with the diet/exercise bit but when baby anachronism went through growth spurts I would eat ALL OF THE THINGS. It was INSANE. I still managed to drop 25kg in 12 months, even though there were several weeks of eating every time she did. I made sure it was high satiety stuff though - nuts or cheese. I stayed away from fruit because it fucked my blood sugar unless I ate it with the nuts/cheese. The calories out for nursing can be highly inaccurate and for me, came nowhere close for those marathon days of growth spurts.
But like your dietician/nutritionist advised, I tried really hard to not get to MUST EAT NOW. If I got to that point the recovery from the blood sugar drop was more difficult than it needed to be and I was much more likely to be unsatisfied with whatever it was I ate.
As an addendum, is the lochia done? I found the one time I super overdid things I went from usual period level to flooding and wooziness. Two months out you're probably fine but I just wanted to mention that as another complicating factor for post-partum fitness.
posted by geek anachronism at 2:48 PM on January 6, 2011
But like your dietician/nutritionist advised, I tried really hard to not get to MUST EAT NOW. If I got to that point the recovery from the blood sugar drop was more difficult than it needed to be and I was much more likely to be unsatisfied with whatever it was I ate.
As an addendum, is the lochia done? I found the one time I super overdid things I went from usual period level to flooding and wooziness. Two months out you're probably fine but I just wanted to mention that as another complicating factor for post-partum fitness.
posted by geek anachronism at 2:48 PM on January 6, 2011
Also, contrary to Lt. Bunny, paleo isn't necessarily low-carb at all, although you can do both.
posted by Earl the Polliwog at 2:52 PM on January 6, 2011
posted by Earl the Polliwog at 2:52 PM on January 6, 2011
Best answer: One of the things about breastfeeding is that the initial part is hardest, but the caloric output goes WAY up as the baby gets bigger. I am exclusively nursing a 4.5 month old (my second) and the drippy painful part is a dim memory, but the load on my body is quite a bit higher nutritionally. I think around two months is about when it ramped up for me, and it stays high until solids become a significant caloric contribution. Our pediatrician made an extra point to make sure I was taking care of myself, especially for the 4-6 month age range. So ravenous and drained feeling is not unusual. The other thing about the 2 ish months out period is that's when life starts to return to "normal" and that can be rough. No one expects a 2 week postpartum mom to do or think much of anything; at 2 months people are often working and thinking and reading and (sort of) being part of adult society. But by then the hormonal effect from nursing is higher than it was immediately postpartum. My brain fog days seem to be related to growth spurts. I can't function mentally when feeding time or a pumping session is overdue.
On the fitness side, I do crossfit 3x week (at a gym, so a full hour), a 3 mile run on the weekend, and try to eat about 80% paleo (bogus anthropology, solid science imo). I started running at 3 weeks and crossfit at 8. I basically assume that it doesn't affect nursing unless I see evidence to the contrary, which I haven't. When I was out of town for a week, not eating well or exercising, I felt particularly drained by the end of the day and low energy. So obviously I am pro intense exercise and I also think it's highly beneficial for new moms.
When it comes down to it, just eat. Hunger is no reason to scale back exercise. I will second that cardio can lead to more hunger than weightlifting will, but sometimes I get OMG hungry. I just take it to mean that I had a great workout and my muscles are busy getting bigger. I also don't think nursing moms ever need to be hungry. Go by your instincts and listen to your body if it feels like you need more food, especially if tiredness is coming with it. When breastfeeding, pretty much the worst thing that will happen if you eat to satiation is that you won't lose weight. Especially if you're also exercising. Look for higher fat foods that have a low glycemic response and cut out grains as much as possible. Then eat until you aren't hungry.
posted by pekala at 3:05 PM on January 6, 2011
On the fitness side, I do crossfit 3x week (at a gym, so a full hour), a 3 mile run on the weekend, and try to eat about 80% paleo (bogus anthropology, solid science imo). I started running at 3 weeks and crossfit at 8. I basically assume that it doesn't affect nursing unless I see evidence to the contrary, which I haven't. When I was out of town for a week, not eating well or exercising, I felt particularly drained by the end of the day and low energy. So obviously I am pro intense exercise and I also think it's highly beneficial for new moms.
When it comes down to it, just eat. Hunger is no reason to scale back exercise. I will second that cardio can lead to more hunger than weightlifting will, but sometimes I get OMG hungry. I just take it to mean that I had a great workout and my muscles are busy getting bigger. I also don't think nursing moms ever need to be hungry. Go by your instincts and listen to your body if it feels like you need more food, especially if tiredness is coming with it. When breastfeeding, pretty much the worst thing that will happen if you eat to satiation is that you won't lose weight. Especially if you're also exercising. Look for higher fat foods that have a low glycemic response and cut out grains as much as possible. Then eat until you aren't hungry.
posted by pekala at 3:05 PM on January 6, 2011
Response by poster: It is really almost embarrassing how good it makes me feel to have all you people telling me what a great job I'm doing. Thank you for that. I've really had to work hard to make going to the gym the path of least resistance, because that's the only way I'll go, and I still feel like I deserve a standing frickin ovation every time I complete a workout.
ViolaGrinder, my t4 levels have been tested and are normal at 1.55. I don't know if my t3 levels are. My hypothyroidism was detected because they wanted to find out why I was doing such a lousy job of staying pregnant -- my TSH was 8.9 when they first tested it after the fourth miscarriage.
geek anachronism, you are not kidding about the hunger. With my first, I joked that if they would just install a macaroni and cheese tap in my house, I would be satisfied. One of the reasons I started seeing the nutritionist was to figure out how to help maintain healthy eating habits through the "one horse, please, medium rare" breastfeeding hunger. The lochia is. . . well, it's hard to say; I had been spotting after workouts, but at no other time, but I had an IUD put in last week and have been spotting continuously since.
nicodine, trust me, I eat plenty of fat. (at this point I wish there was an emoticon for a wolfish grin.) Full-fat salad dressing, cheese, full-fat yogurt, I go through butter cooking for this family at an insane rate, ditto olive oil. It's been a while since I had an avocado, but just reading the word "avocado" made me want one incredibly badly, maybe I'll pick one up. My grains consumption is honestly quite limited most of the time, yesterday's grilled cheese notwithstanding. ;-)
Today I just decided to eat until I wasn't hungry, but not to eat grains or crap. I ate nuts, I ate baby carrots, I had the BIG Fancy salad -- it has bacon and a hardboiled egg in it. I had some sliced roast beef, and a cut-up pepper. I had some applesauce and a whole cucumber. I had some cheese. I drank like two liters of water and an entire pot of tea. I'm about to have more baby carrots and hummous, because I'm feeling kind of snacky. I haven't yet managed to SHOWER post-workout, between feeding the baby and feeding myself, but I am at least able to concentrate enough to play Words with Friends with a very smart friend. Maybe the answer is "just frickin eat."
posted by KathrynT at 4:06 PM on January 6, 2011 [2 favorites]
ViolaGrinder, my t4 levels have been tested and are normal at 1.55. I don't know if my t3 levels are. My hypothyroidism was detected because they wanted to find out why I was doing such a lousy job of staying pregnant -- my TSH was 8.9 when they first tested it after the fourth miscarriage.
geek anachronism, you are not kidding about the hunger. With my first, I joked that if they would just install a macaroni and cheese tap in my house, I would be satisfied. One of the reasons I started seeing the nutritionist was to figure out how to help maintain healthy eating habits through the "one horse, please, medium rare" breastfeeding hunger. The lochia is. . . well, it's hard to say; I had been spotting after workouts, but at no other time, but I had an IUD put in last week and have been spotting continuously since.
nicodine, trust me, I eat plenty of fat. (at this point I wish there was an emoticon for a wolfish grin.) Full-fat salad dressing, cheese, full-fat yogurt, I go through butter cooking for this family at an insane rate, ditto olive oil. It's been a while since I had an avocado, but just reading the word "avocado" made me want one incredibly badly, maybe I'll pick one up. My grains consumption is honestly quite limited most of the time, yesterday's grilled cheese notwithstanding. ;-)
Today I just decided to eat until I wasn't hungry, but not to eat grains or crap. I ate nuts, I ate baby carrots, I had the BIG Fancy salad -- it has bacon and a hardboiled egg in it. I had some sliced roast beef, and a cut-up pepper. I had some applesauce and a whole cucumber. I had some cheese. I drank like two liters of water and an entire pot of tea. I'm about to have more baby carrots and hummous, because I'm feeling kind of snacky. I haven't yet managed to SHOWER post-workout, between feeding the baby and feeding myself, but I am at least able to concentrate enough to play Words with Friends with a very smart friend. Maybe the answer is "just frickin eat."
posted by KathrynT at 4:06 PM on January 6, 2011 [2 favorites]
Go high fat, low carb...as long as the fat is from animals or a safe source like coconut oil or olive oil, or avocados. Your body uses fat as energy. Avoid all corn, vegetable and soybean oils, though.
posted by carlh at 5:30 PM on January 6, 2011
posted by carlh at 5:30 PM on January 6, 2011
Like several other people, what jumped right out at me was the thinness of your current post-workout snack. It's probably not on your food plan, but whatever the acceptable equivalent of chocolate milk is, have a nice quantity of that. Post-workout is *not* the time to go light. You need an energy source, and you need protein, and you need it within half an hour of ending your workout. I'm not talking about a 40-calorie apple, but I'm also not talking about a 2,500-calorie apple pie. Something substantive and proteinaceous - milk is really a perfect source. I think if you try this, you will find that it prevents some of that voracious hunger later.
Good luck, you're doing fantastic!
posted by facetious at 6:24 PM on January 6, 2011
Good luck, you're doing fantastic!
posted by facetious at 6:24 PM on January 6, 2011
This happens to me as well and I don't really have an answer other than maybe take your free day and forget about it. If it doesn't happen that often get back on the routine. If you're always haywire then something else is going on.
posted by harh07 at 6:00 AM on January 7, 2011
posted by harh07 at 6:00 AM on January 7, 2011
« Older It's still just as cold in the kitchen, only a... | How to look at a map and know the date it was... Newer »
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by teragram at 12:22 PM on January 6, 2011