Recommendations for Good, Non-Pricy Coffee Grinder, Top-of-Line Gourmet Coffee?
November 20, 2004 6:26 AM Subscribe
I'm looking for recommendations for a good, relatively inexpensive (hopefully around $30) coffee grinder, and some top of the line gourmet coffee to go along with it for a gift for Mom. She usually drinks Folgers, but was quite impressed with Jamaican Blue Mountain. Forgive the cluelessness, I'm more of a tea girl.
(I should mention -- if you're looking at High Mountain coffee, try to get coffee grown on the Baronhall Estate, if you can.)
posted by Jairus at 6:49 AM on November 20, 2004
posted by Jairus at 6:49 AM on November 20, 2004
I've had one of the standard low-end Braun models for over 20 years and the thing works like a trooper every morning.
...as for the coffee, sorry to pimp the corporate masters, but pretty much anything from Starbucks is real good - and they'll let you taste 'em before buying.
I've had awesome Kona in Hawaii, but any packaged ones on the mainland never seem to retain the subtle wine-esque magic.
posted by fairmettle at 6:49 AM on November 20, 2004
...as for the coffee, sorry to pimp the corporate masters, but pretty much anything from Starbucks is real good - and they'll let you taste 'em before buying.
I've had awesome Kona in Hawaii, but any packaged ones on the mainland never seem to retain the subtle wine-esque magic.
posted by fairmettle at 6:49 AM on November 20, 2004
"top of the line gourmet coffee"
"anything from Starbucks is real good"
*head explodes*
posted by Jairus at 7:01 AM on November 20, 2004
"anything from Starbucks is real good"
*head explodes*
posted by Jairus at 7:01 AM on November 20, 2004
For around US$30, you are going to be getting a blade grinder, like the second grinder on this page. Tom (owner of Sweet Maria's) also roasts excellent coffee. Most blade grinders are basically the same. Burr grinders are better, but really are not necessary for most methods of making coffee, and there are many expensive but shoddy burr grinders out there.
Most Jamaican Blue Mountain isn't, or rather has one or two Jamaican beans in the bag. Any artisinally roasted coffee, from Sweet Marias, Peet's, or elsewhere will be a better buy, and tastier. I've had good luck with Papua New Guinea and Ethiopians with folks accustomed to Folger's et al, but most people will recommend a Columbian or Brazillian for new specialty coffee drinkers.
Age is the critical thing with roasted coffee. Most coffees are best 24-48 hours after roasting.
For reviews of coffee gear, it is hard to beat the Coffee Geek.
You didn't ask, but should you wish to roast green coffee for your Mom, it is actually pretty easy. There are instructions for several methods on the Sweet Maria's page. I generally use a hot air popcorn popper.
On preview, you aren't getting a Zass for this kind of money, even on ebay. I have 3 Zasses, and use one every day. They rock, but are perhaps overkill for introducing a mom to good coffee.
posted by QIbHom at 7:04 AM on November 20, 2004
Most Jamaican Blue Mountain isn't, or rather has one or two Jamaican beans in the bag. Any artisinally roasted coffee, from Sweet Marias, Peet's, or elsewhere will be a better buy, and tastier. I've had good luck with Papua New Guinea and Ethiopians with folks accustomed to Folger's et al, but most people will recommend a Columbian or Brazillian for new specialty coffee drinkers.
Age is the critical thing with roasted coffee. Most coffees are best 24-48 hours after roasting.
For reviews of coffee gear, it is hard to beat the Coffee Geek.
You didn't ask, but should you wish to roast green coffee for your Mom, it is actually pretty easy. There are instructions for several methods on the Sweet Maria's page. I generally use a hot air popcorn popper.
On preview, you aren't getting a Zass for this kind of money, even on ebay. I have 3 Zasses, and use one every day. They rock, but are perhaps overkill for introducing a mom to good coffee.
posted by QIbHom at 7:04 AM on November 20, 2004
Response by poster: Now that I have a little feedback, I'm going to revise the parameters of this question a little. I had been planning on spending more on the coffee than the grinder, but now I'm thinking that it would be a waste to get great coffee and a mediocre grinder. So what's the best grinder/coffee package I could get for around $100?
posted by ferociouskitty at 7:10 AM on November 20, 2004
posted by ferociouskitty at 7:10 AM on November 20, 2004
Ferociouskitty, may I suggest a slight further revision? As a tea drinker, you must know that method is critical. It is with coffee, too. Drip is ok, but it isn't really optimal.
I'd suggest spending US$20 on the Bodum C Mill I linked above, another US$10 or so on a Swiss One Cup gold filter and US$9 on a pound of whatever Tom is roasting this week.
Add shipping, and you are getting away for under US$50, and your mother will have many excellent cups of coffee. The Swiss One Cup thingie is easy, makes incredibly good coffee and is a snap to clean up.
If your mother really enjoys this gift, then you can go for a Zass or a conical burr grinder, a press pot, a vacuum pot, thermal mugs, scales, measuring scoops and all the other detrius that accumulates in the lives of coffee snobs.
posted by QIbHom at 7:22 AM on November 20, 2004
I'd suggest spending US$20 on the Bodum C Mill I linked above, another US$10 or so on a Swiss One Cup gold filter and US$9 on a pound of whatever Tom is roasting this week.
Add shipping, and you are getting away for under US$50, and your mother will have many excellent cups of coffee. The Swiss One Cup thingie is easy, makes incredibly good coffee and is a snap to clean up.
If your mother really enjoys this gift, then you can go for a Zass or a conical burr grinder, a press pot, a vacuum pot, thermal mugs, scales, measuring scoops and all the other detrius that accumulates in the lives of coffee snobs.
posted by QIbHom at 7:22 AM on November 20, 2004
Cook's Illustrated recommends blade grinders by Capresso or Krups most highly; Mr. Coffee and and Braun models were also recommended. They all cost around twenty bucks. Buy two and you can use the other one for grinding spices.
I respectfully submit that the whole burr grinder thing is almost certainly overkill for the level and style of coffee consumption you're talking about, both in price and in sacrifice of counter space (my Krups grinder is about the size of a can of vegetables; most of the burr grinders I've seen are almost as big as a drip coffee maker).
posted by bcwinters at 7:28 AM on November 20, 2004
I respectfully submit that the whole burr grinder thing is almost certainly overkill for the level and style of coffee consumption you're talking about, both in price and in sacrifice of counter space (my Krups grinder is about the size of a can of vegetables; most of the burr grinders I've seen are almost as big as a drip coffee maker).
posted by bcwinters at 7:28 AM on November 20, 2004
Grinder: America's Test Kitchen did a large roundup, and rated the Krups very highly. The Krups and Braun have the same basic design (blade chopper); I've used a Braun or a Krups for years, and don't really recall a preference.
Most coffeesnobs afficionados will tell you to go out and get a burr grinder. They do give a more even grind, but they're a lot more expensive, and if you give your blade grinder a shake or two while grinding, you can get a much more even grind. (I also like to turn it upside-down for a second before I shut it off. I think it helps prevent coffee from caking above (below) the blades.)
As for coffee... the very idea that anyone chooses Starbucks coffee for the quality is ... troubling to me. I don't like Starbucks much for a lot of reasons, but even if I thought it was a wonderful place in every other regard, I still wouldn't go there, because I HATE THEIR COFFEE. Really. It's awful: It's all burnt, harsh, leaves a taste like day-old cigarettes in my mouth, and all those burnt-bean by-products give me a wicked headache.
I need to work through this for you. Basic fact: The most important ingredient of a good pot of coffee is good quality coffee. But there are things you can do to narrow the difference between good beans and bad beans, and there are two main tricks that a volume coffee seller does to do that:
posted by lodurr at 7:32 AM on November 20, 2004
Most coffee
As for coffee... the very idea that anyone chooses Starbucks coffee for the quality is ... troubling to me. I don't like Starbucks much for a lot of reasons, but even if I thought it was a wonderful place in every other regard, I still wouldn't go there, because I HATE THEIR COFFEE. Really. It's awful: It's all burnt, harsh, leaves a taste like day-old cigarettes in my mouth, and all those burnt-bean by-products give me a wicked headache.
I need to work through this for you. Basic fact: The most important ingredient of a good pot of coffee is good quality coffee. But there are things you can do to narrow the difference between good beans and bad beans, and there are two main tricks that a volume coffee seller does to do that:
- Flavor it -- stuff like hazelnut, raspberry, etc., they hope, will cover up the bad notes, or disguise the fact that the coffee doesn't have much flavor. People got wise to this years ago; real coffee afficionados rarely buy flavored coffee, and when they do, it's from a place that they know and trust.
- French [Dark] Roast it. This is the most egregious violation, and this is what Starbucks does to disguise the poor quality of their coffee. I think it's actually kind of central to their rapid growth over the past 15 years or so. Think about it: They've increased the volume of their sales radically; if they really had good quality coffee, the quality of coffee generally available shoudl have gone down. But it hasn't -- it's gotten better. So they must be using poorer quality beans.
posted by lodurr at 7:32 AM on November 20, 2004
... oh, and, types of coffee: I think something cool to do for this would be to get a few half-pounds of different varieties with different character -- make a bit of an adventure out of it, in other words. For example, maybe get some High Mountain, some Kenya AA, maybe even some Ygracheffe (though I haven't seen that around in years, I think it must have been negatively impacted by warfare or something). If you live in a town of any size, there will be a coffee store around there somewhere; they often even brew up some of their more unusual stuff for you to sample.
posted by lodurr at 7:40 AM on November 20, 2004
posted by lodurr at 7:40 AM on November 20, 2004
Heed QIbHom's words, though the equivalent Braun at that pricepoint (I think Cuisinart makes one as well). They're available everywhere. If she's a Folger's drinker, she's honestly probably not going to notice the difference that grinding makes in her coffee. If anything, she's more likely to muck up a batch of good beans, since higher-end burr grinders require more fiddling. A basic grinder has one button and is almost impossible to screw up if you're making drip coffee.
Some hard-core coffee nerds swear by the French Press method. Some people also drink Vietnamese coffee beans that have been swallowed by and then shat out of a weasel, too.
Kona, if you can find some whole beans that don't look like they've been sitting around a long time, is an amazingly delicious bean. Make sure it's not a blend, though- same goes for any high-end stuff like Blue Mountain as well.
posted by mkultra at 7:42 AM on November 20, 2004
Some hard-core coffee nerds swear by the French Press method. Some people also drink Vietnamese coffee beans that have been swallowed by and then shat out of a weasel, too.
Kona, if you can find some whole beans that don't look like they've been sitting around a long time, is an amazingly delicious bean. Make sure it's not a blend, though- same goes for any high-end stuff like Blue Mountain as well.
posted by mkultra at 7:42 AM on November 20, 2004
Lodurr, Yirgacheffe is around. I'm drinking some now. Then again, I don't buy roasted coffee. Like other Ethiopians, it varies widely. Yirg and Harrar are seldom boring, though.
Press pots are lovely, and hard to mess up. They come in many sizes. They don't take too much futzing. But, some people get freaked by sediment in the bottom of their cup. Some of them are a bit of a pain to clean properly.
And I'd third that a burr grinder is overkill for this particular project.
Kona and JBM...well, I've had them both, the real stuff, not blended, roasted them myself and I wasn't too impressed. But I like the wilder coffees.
Starbucks tends to be stale, at best. It is fashionable to hate them, but they are the ones who got me started on the good coffee trip. Their coffee is better than Folger's, but if you want something really special, get something that Ken Davids recommends.
I'd better shut up. I'll cheerfully talk coffee until everyone falls asleep.
posted by QIbHom at 7:57 AM on November 20, 2004
Press pots are lovely, and hard to mess up. They come in many sizes. They don't take too much futzing. But, some people get freaked by sediment in the bottom of their cup. Some of them are a bit of a pain to clean properly.
And I'd third that a burr grinder is overkill for this particular project.
Kona and JBM...well, I've had them both, the real stuff, not blended, roasted them myself and I wasn't too impressed. But I like the wilder coffees.
Starbucks tends to be stale, at best. It is fashionable to hate them, but they are the ones who got me started on the good coffee trip. Their coffee is better than Folger's, but if you want something really special, get something that Ken Davids recommends.
I'd better shut up. I'll cheerfully talk coffee until everyone falls asleep.
posted by QIbHom at 7:57 AM on November 20, 2004
Related question: how long do you keep the beans grinding? I just bought a coffee grinder the other day, and I'v enoticed that the longer I grind the darker it gets--is thirty seconds too long? Or is it just personal preference?
posted by josh at 8:57 AM on November 20, 2004
posted by josh at 8:57 AM on November 20, 2004
You might consider buying some Kona direct from the source, peaberry would be my choice. Be sure your mom knows how to keep her coffeepot clean, I'm always amazed at how many people will spend the money on high quality beans and then filter through rancid oils. Ick.
posted by cali at 9:07 AM on November 20, 2004
posted by cali at 9:07 AM on November 20, 2004
Josh, from here;
Achieve the finest grind possible without clogging the paper filter, or, if using a presspot, releasing too much sediment into the cup. I find that people do not usually grind fine enough. The purpose of grinding is to effectively increase the surface area of the coffee exposed to the water so as much of the flavor oils can enter the brew. Fine grinds result in more flavorful, economical coffee. If it's so fine that it produces undesirable sediment in the cup, or the brewing time is lengthened because the paper filter clogs, you have gone too far.
posted by QIbHom at 9:17 AM on November 20, 2004
Achieve the finest grind possible without clogging the paper filter, or, if using a presspot, releasing too much sediment into the cup. I find that people do not usually grind fine enough. The purpose of grinding is to effectively increase the surface area of the coffee exposed to the water so as much of the flavor oils can enter the brew. Fine grinds result in more flavorful, economical coffee. If it's so fine that it produces undesirable sediment in the cup, or the brewing time is lengthened because the paper filter clogs, you have gone too far.
posted by QIbHom at 9:17 AM on November 20, 2004
Best answer: Fourth that you do not need to give your mother a burr grinder, etc. Basically, what you said is "My mom likes wine from a box; I want to get her something nicer" and Jairus said "Try this Chateau Margaux 1995."
You don't have to escalate that far. A good blade grinder, like the Krups or Braun, and a nice $10 or $12 bag of coffee, and she'll really notice the difference.
Frankly, what everyone else said about the burr grinder not being for newbs, etc. My guess is that if you got your mom a $30 bag of coffee and an $80 burr grinder and a $70 high-end French press machine, she would keep all of it in the cupboard and still drink her Folger's, whereas if you got her a decent bag of coffee and a high-quality blade grinder, she might actually make herself real coffee in her trusty drip machine.
posted by Sidhedevil at 9:26 AM on November 20, 2004
You don't have to escalate that far. A good blade grinder, like the Krups or Braun, and a nice $10 or $12 bag of coffee, and she'll really notice the difference.
Frankly, what everyone else said about the burr grinder not being for newbs, etc. My guess is that if you got your mom a $30 bag of coffee and an $80 burr grinder and a $70 high-end French press machine, she would keep all of it in the cupboard and still drink her Folger's, whereas if you got her a decent bag of coffee and a high-quality blade grinder, she might actually make herself real coffee in her trusty drip machine.
posted by Sidhedevil at 9:26 AM on November 20, 2004
My little Krups grinder is now approaching age 23. It's outlived televisions, stereos, several computers, a sofa sleeper, lots of residences, who knows how many pairs of socks...and half-a-dozen coffee makers, a couple of which were themselves Krups.
But the extra feature of the little blade grinders is that you can work a damp paper towel in them, clean out all the little coffee bits, and use them to grind nuts into a powder for fancy baking.
posted by gimonca at 10:12 AM on November 20, 2004
But the extra feature of the little blade grinders is that you can work a damp paper towel in them, clean out all the little coffee bits, and use them to grind nuts into a powder for fancy baking.
posted by gimonca at 10:12 AM on November 20, 2004
josh- I do it by ear. The grinder will start off loud as it chops the individual beans, then settle down as everything smooths out. Eventually, you'll only hear the whirr of the motor, which means it's not actually chopping much anymore. Give it a little shake to get anything that might have settled out of reach, and you're done. I turn mine upside-down before opening and give it a good tap to drop everything cleanly into the cup, and helps keep your base clean from build-up.
posted by mkultra at 11:07 AM on November 20, 2004
posted by mkultra at 11:07 AM on November 20, 2004
Two points re. French Press:
First, as I said, Bodum makes a very inexpensive one. The big difference between it and more expensive ones is that it doesn't have a silk or nylon filter -- it just uses a fine metal screen. I'm not crazy about the sediment in my cup, either, so unless I've got something really fresh and oily, I wrap a paper basket filter around the screen before I press. (It would filter out the lovely oils on fresh coffee, though... )
Second, and to that last point, with good, freshly roasted coffee, it gives you a nice, foamy, rich cup of coffee. Because the grounds are swimming around, you get everything they've got to give you.
Plus, they make great tea....
posted by lodurr at 11:23 AM on November 20, 2004
First, as I said, Bodum makes a very inexpensive one. The big difference between it and more expensive ones is that it doesn't have a silk or nylon filter -- it just uses a fine metal screen. I'm not crazy about the sediment in my cup, either, so unless I've got something really fresh and oily, I wrap a paper basket filter around the screen before I press. (It would filter out the lovely oils on fresh coffee, though... )
Second, and to that last point, with good, freshly roasted coffee, it gives you a nice, foamy, rich cup of coffee. Because the grounds are swimming around, you get everything they've got to give you.
Plus, they make great tea....
posted by lodurr at 11:23 AM on November 20, 2004
Be wary of Jamaican Blue Mountain -- a lot of stuff is sold under that name that isn't the real thing. I still remember the first I had (and I'm not sure it wasn't the only real JBM I've had), but I'd rather stick with my memories than spend ridiculous money for regular old coffee.
Ignore the Starbucks haters -- as I've said in other threads, they mistake their own taste for the Word of God. I'm fine with the fact that they don't like the taste, just like I don't like fish, but I don't go around claiming that "fish is awful." I just don't happen to like it. Starbucks is damn good coffee, if overpriced.
posted by languagehat at 1:27 PM on November 20, 2004
Ignore the Starbucks haters -- as I've said in other threads, they mistake their own taste for the Word of God. I'm fine with the fact that they don't like the taste, just like I don't like fish, but I don't go around claiming that "fish is awful." I just don't happen to like it. Starbucks is damn good coffee, if overpriced.
posted by languagehat at 1:27 PM on November 20, 2004
illy is good coffee, and it comes in a beautiful container. Try the medium roast. We serve illy at the coffee shop that is my part time job, and I regularly hear that it is the best coffee that someone has ever had. Williams-Sonoma carries the illy, and illy has a 'find illy' thing on their website.
posted by john m at 1:58 PM on November 20, 2004
posted by john m at 1:58 PM on November 20, 2004
I love Godiva coffee. You should be able to find it at any fine department store, and you can usually find 1 serving to 1 pound packages of it. I find it a bit too expensive to buy on a regular basis, but I've given it as gifts to co-workers, etc.
posted by sophie at 2:42 PM on November 20, 2004
posted by sophie at 2:42 PM on November 20, 2004
Most coffee on offer is vastly overpriced with little of the profit returning to the grower who is more often than not a near to subsistance farmer.
Maybe you should consider searching out a "fairtrade" vendor
As an example Coffee I buy in the market in Costa Rica (not one of the poorest of Coffee producing nations) costs $2 / lb; is sold for $7 / lb at the airport and retails for +/- $12 / lb in CA
posted by adamvasco at 5:00 PM on November 20, 2004
Maybe you should consider searching out a "fairtrade" vendor
As an example Coffee I buy in the market in Costa Rica (not one of the poorest of Coffee producing nations) costs $2 / lb; is sold for $7 / lb at the airport and retails for +/- $12 / lb in CA
posted by adamvasco at 5:00 PM on November 20, 2004
Ther should have been a link there
www.fairtrade.net
posted by adamvasco at 5:02 PM on November 20, 2004
www.fairtrade.net
posted by adamvasco at 5:02 PM on November 20, 2004
I present only an individual data point:
I have a Krups blade grinder that I use every morning. So does my neighbor - I recognize the sound. I have also used the Braun grinder and found it nearly identical in every particular. I make drip coffee in the morning and prefer either 100% Colombian beans, or (usually) Kenya AA. They are easy on my stomach, unlike Javanese or any robusto beans. Starbucks' strong-flavored coffees in particular are murder on my delicate gastric mucosa.
I *also* have a Pavoni burr grinder. I keep it charged with full city Italian espresso roast and use it only for the finer grind that my espresso machine requires. I've tried using it for drip and honestly it's more trouble than it's worth, again IMO.
I love Kona, but to get it on the mainland in the proper state of freshness is excruciatingly expensive - $36 a pound. You are not saving anything at all by buying stale Kona beans at $20 the pound, I find.
posted by ikkyu2 at 2:53 PM on November 21, 2004
I have a Krups blade grinder that I use every morning. So does my neighbor - I recognize the sound. I have also used the Braun grinder and found it nearly identical in every particular. I make drip coffee in the morning and prefer either 100% Colombian beans, or (usually) Kenya AA. They are easy on my stomach, unlike Javanese or any robusto beans. Starbucks' strong-flavored coffees in particular are murder on my delicate gastric mucosa.
I *also* have a Pavoni burr grinder. I keep it charged with full city Italian espresso roast and use it only for the finer grind that my espresso machine requires. I've tried using it for drip and honestly it's more trouble than it's worth, again IMO.
I love Kona, but to get it on the mainland in the proper state of freshness is excruciatingly expensive - $36 a pound. You are not saving anything at all by buying stale Kona beans at $20 the pound, I find.
posted by ikkyu2 at 2:53 PM on November 21, 2004
The December issue of Consumer Reports has an in-depth section on coffee equipment and ratings for types of coffee.
posted by JDC8 at 7:35 PM on November 21, 2004
posted by JDC8 at 7:35 PM on November 21, 2004
Yirg and Harrar are seldom boring, though.
must agree. particularly re:Sweet Marias and their outstanding green Ethiopian Harar Lot 7039 "Horse." ya gotta roast it yourself, but it's worth the extra effort: promise.
posted by RockyChrysler at 8:20 PM on November 21, 2004
must agree. particularly re:Sweet Marias and their outstanding green Ethiopian Harar Lot 7039 "Horse." ya gotta roast it yourself, but it's worth the extra effort: promise.
posted by RockyChrysler at 8:20 PM on November 21, 2004
Second the "buy-a-lot-of-different-coffees" approach -- how about Kenya AA, Costa Rican Tarrazu, some Yirg, some Colombian? Maybe a decent blend or two?
posted by Vidiot at 9:32 PM on November 24, 2004
posted by Vidiot at 9:32 PM on November 24, 2004
This thread is closed to new comments.
...and if you're looking for great coffee, you might want to try Jamaican High Mountain. It's much cheaper than Blue Mountain because it doesn't have the name recognition, and I personally think it's a better coffee.
posted by Jairus at 6:46 AM on November 20, 2004