is marijuana controlling my seizures and will the CA DMV let me keep my license?
January 20, 2009 9:21 PM Subscribe
Why have I had 3 seizures, spaced years apart? Does is have anything to do with marijuana? And does this HAVE to mean a loss of drivers license in California?
I'm a female in my mid twenties. No family history of seizures. My medical history has always been unsolved stomach issues: stomach aches from infancy to present, random waves of nausea over the past 6 years, mono, anemia, ruptured ovarian cyst, etc.
While home alone in 2005, laying on my bed and maybe dozing off, I stood up and walked over to my front door to look out the peephole. I was probably standing up for about a minute. I started to feel a headrush and my vision started to tunnel. The next thing I knew, I was on the ground staring at the corner of my couch. I couldn't recognize what I was looking at, or figure out where I was or who I was. I also couldn't hear anything, and felt TERRIFIED. Once my eyes hit my cat, I knew he was familiar, and suddenly the carpet, walls, couch, started to become familiar. My entire body felt like pins and needles, and I tried to stay as still as possible. I was sweating, my heart was beating fast, and my breathing was shallow and panicked. As my hearing started to come back, I calmed and my breathing and heart rate returned to normal. I thought, "Is that what happens when you pass out? How long was I out for? I hope that never happens again." I've always been a picky eater and know I don't always get the proper nutrients, so I thought it might have been a weird blood sugar issue.
A year later I was dozing on my couch. I might have been asleep for an hour or less, when I woke up and decided to go to the kitchen. I walked about 20 feet to the kitchen, got something out of the fridge and started to feel like I was going to pass out. The next thing I knew, I was laying on my side, staring at the bottom of my fridge. Coming out of this was as awful as the first time, but it took me longer to recognize the objects around me. I crawled to the couch. My roommate was in her room with the door closed, and I wanted to yell to her, but I couldn't. My hearing returned and I thought, wtf?
I went to the doctor (kaiser at the time) and explained it. I told him I didn't know if I passed out, or had a seizure, or even how long I was out for. He put a heart monitor on me for 24 hours, then declared a clean bill of health.
2.5 years later, I was at home, having fallen asleep watching tv. My two friends came home, and I woke up and talked to them for about a minute. Then I got up and went into the kitchen, had time to open the fridge, get a drink, get a cup...as I was pouring my drink, I started to feel a headrush and set the drink down. My last thought was "uh oh". I came to with my friends faces looking down at me. This time I was able to quickly recognize their faces, had no pins and needles feeling, could hear, and wasn't sweating. I said "this has happened before. what did I do while I was out?" My friends then explained that I had a seizure. They heard my body hit the ground, came into the room and found me laying at an angle (because we have a narrow kitchen and I knocked my head against the fridge). They said my eyes were open and I was staring straight ahead. I didn't look at them when they said my name, and I was making a weird gurgling/choking sound in my throat. When they attempted to straighten out my body, I came to, and focused on them and started talking again.
The next day I went to the only neurologist who would see me on such short notice. His office was very rundown, and the nurse who took my medical history didn't speak fluent english, and seemed to have trouble writing down what I was telling her. I was honest with the doctor about the fact that I smoke marijuana (I live in California and have a medical marijuana card, given to me due to my problems with nausea). I have smoke almost daily for the past 5 years, at least a year before the first seizure. The doctor informed me that it must be the marijuana, that lots of people have seizures from marijuana. I said, "Even if I smoke daily and the seizures were spaced years apart?" He said yes. I pointed out that I've never had a seizure right after taking a hit of marijuana. It's usually 2 or 3 hours later. He then told me that he is required to report me to the DMV and that I won't be able to drive. He said that he'd risk his license and not report me if I promised to stop smoking marijuana. He still wanted me to get an MRI and EEG in a few days.
I'm not confident that a doctor has a medical license, once he starts risking it for a patient he doesn't even know. Clearly this was a shady doctor and I needed to see a neurologist in a major hospital. I went home and googled "marijuana seizures" and found that a ton of people use marijuana to control seizures. In fact, seizures and seizures due to epilepsy are actual medical conditions that qualify you for a medical marijuana card in the state of California! A lot of people found that they were able to space their seizures out more when smoking pot on a regular basis.
Then I started reading about California law, and how if you have 1 seizure, they will take away your license. You must be without seizures for at least 3 months before they give it back, but they aren't required to give it back. I am not visiting another neurologist because of this. I'm in my mid twenties, and I would have to move home to live with my parents (out of state) so they could drive me everywhere. Public transportation is not plentiful in my city.
If I thought I was a risk to anyone I would not drive. My seizures seem to be isolated to very specific circumstances:
1- it must be nighttime
2 - I have to have been sleeping for a short amount of time, maybe even in and out of sleep
3 - it happens within minutes of waking up from this semi-sleep.
I know that some people have seizures because their brain has trouble coming out of sleep. Are those people allowed to drive, or are they stuck with the same law?
Also, is there a reason that I didn't experience the same awful symptoms when my friends "woke" me up? No loss of hearing, pins and needles, etc. I'm also curious if anyone has any experience with seizures and marijuana. How about with the CA DMV law about seizures? Any way to restrict driving to daytime or something?
Thanks so much!
I'm a female in my mid twenties. No family history of seizures. My medical history has always been unsolved stomach issues: stomach aches from infancy to present, random waves of nausea over the past 6 years, mono, anemia, ruptured ovarian cyst, etc.
While home alone in 2005, laying on my bed and maybe dozing off, I stood up and walked over to my front door to look out the peephole. I was probably standing up for about a minute. I started to feel a headrush and my vision started to tunnel. The next thing I knew, I was on the ground staring at the corner of my couch. I couldn't recognize what I was looking at, or figure out where I was or who I was. I also couldn't hear anything, and felt TERRIFIED. Once my eyes hit my cat, I knew he was familiar, and suddenly the carpet, walls, couch, started to become familiar. My entire body felt like pins and needles, and I tried to stay as still as possible. I was sweating, my heart was beating fast, and my breathing was shallow and panicked. As my hearing started to come back, I calmed and my breathing and heart rate returned to normal. I thought, "Is that what happens when you pass out? How long was I out for? I hope that never happens again." I've always been a picky eater and know I don't always get the proper nutrients, so I thought it might have been a weird blood sugar issue.
A year later I was dozing on my couch. I might have been asleep for an hour or less, when I woke up and decided to go to the kitchen. I walked about 20 feet to the kitchen, got something out of the fridge and started to feel like I was going to pass out. The next thing I knew, I was laying on my side, staring at the bottom of my fridge. Coming out of this was as awful as the first time, but it took me longer to recognize the objects around me. I crawled to the couch. My roommate was in her room with the door closed, and I wanted to yell to her, but I couldn't. My hearing returned and I thought, wtf?
I went to the doctor (kaiser at the time) and explained it. I told him I didn't know if I passed out, or had a seizure, or even how long I was out for. He put a heart monitor on me for 24 hours, then declared a clean bill of health.
2.5 years later, I was at home, having fallen asleep watching tv. My two friends came home, and I woke up and talked to them for about a minute. Then I got up and went into the kitchen, had time to open the fridge, get a drink, get a cup...as I was pouring my drink, I started to feel a headrush and set the drink down. My last thought was "uh oh". I came to with my friends faces looking down at me. This time I was able to quickly recognize their faces, had no pins and needles feeling, could hear, and wasn't sweating. I said "this has happened before. what did I do while I was out?" My friends then explained that I had a seizure. They heard my body hit the ground, came into the room and found me laying at an angle (because we have a narrow kitchen and I knocked my head against the fridge). They said my eyes were open and I was staring straight ahead. I didn't look at them when they said my name, and I was making a weird gurgling/choking sound in my throat. When they attempted to straighten out my body, I came to, and focused on them and started talking again.
The next day I went to the only neurologist who would see me on such short notice. His office was very rundown, and the nurse who took my medical history didn't speak fluent english, and seemed to have trouble writing down what I was telling her. I was honest with the doctor about the fact that I smoke marijuana (I live in California and have a medical marijuana card, given to me due to my problems with nausea). I have smoke almost daily for the past 5 years, at least a year before the first seizure. The doctor informed me that it must be the marijuana, that lots of people have seizures from marijuana. I said, "Even if I smoke daily and the seizures were spaced years apart?" He said yes. I pointed out that I've never had a seizure right after taking a hit of marijuana. It's usually 2 or 3 hours later. He then told me that he is required to report me to the DMV and that I won't be able to drive. He said that he'd risk his license and not report me if I promised to stop smoking marijuana. He still wanted me to get an MRI and EEG in a few days.
I'm not confident that a doctor has a medical license, once he starts risking it for a patient he doesn't even know. Clearly this was a shady doctor and I needed to see a neurologist in a major hospital. I went home and googled "marijuana seizures" and found that a ton of people use marijuana to control seizures. In fact, seizures and seizures due to epilepsy are actual medical conditions that qualify you for a medical marijuana card in the state of California! A lot of people found that they were able to space their seizures out more when smoking pot on a regular basis.
Then I started reading about California law, and how if you have 1 seizure, they will take away your license. You must be without seizures for at least 3 months before they give it back, but they aren't required to give it back. I am not visiting another neurologist because of this. I'm in my mid twenties, and I would have to move home to live with my parents (out of state) so they could drive me everywhere. Public transportation is not plentiful in my city.
If I thought I was a risk to anyone I would not drive. My seizures seem to be isolated to very specific circumstances:
1- it must be nighttime
2 - I have to have been sleeping for a short amount of time, maybe even in and out of sleep
3 - it happens within minutes of waking up from this semi-sleep.
I know that some people have seizures because their brain has trouble coming out of sleep. Are those people allowed to drive, or are they stuck with the same law?
Also, is there a reason that I didn't experience the same awful symptoms when my friends "woke" me up? No loss of hearing, pins and needles, etc. I'm also curious if anyone has any experience with seizures and marijuana. How about with the CA DMV law about seizures? Any way to restrict driving to daytime or something?
Thanks so much!
IANAD. But your episodes sound more like orthostatic hypotension than seizures. The fact that all three episodes happened almost immediately after getting up, and were preceded by a "head rush," makes me think it's a low blood pressure issue. Your friends may have mistaken your post-fainting state for a post-ictal state.
This happened to me a lot when I was a teenager; my doctor actually told me to eat more salt, oddly enough.
Check in with your primary care doctor; there's a simple test they can do in the office (involving taking your blood pressure sitting down and then standing, and calculating the difference, if any).
posted by charmcityblues at 9:44 PM on January 20, 2009
This happened to me a lot when I was a teenager; my doctor actually told me to eat more salt, oddly enough.
Check in with your primary care doctor; there's a simple test they can do in the office (involving taking your blood pressure sitting down and then standing, and calculating the difference, if any).
posted by charmcityblues at 9:44 PM on January 20, 2009
The fact that your prior seizures only happened in certain situations doesn't prove that will be the case in the future. "f I thought I was a risk to anyone I would not drive." You are a risk. It's time to stop denying it.
If you drive, and have a seizure, and kill someone, how will you feel afterwards? Will you be able to look at yourself in the mirror?
You seem to want us to bless your decision to try to keep driving. I don't do so. Many laws are stupid, but that one makes sense. Obey it.
posted by Chocolate Pickle at 9:46 PM on January 20, 2009 [3 favorites]
If you drive, and have a seizure, and kill someone, how will you feel afterwards? Will you be able to look at yourself in the mirror?
You seem to want us to bless your decision to try to keep driving. I don't do so. Many laws are stupid, but that one makes sense. Obey it.
posted by Chocolate Pickle at 9:46 PM on January 20, 2009 [3 favorites]
I've never heard of marijuana causing seizures, and would be more suspicious of what got into it along the way than anything else (I'd guess with a card in California you're getting pretty fresh homegrown weed, though, right?)
But, from what you've described, the marijuana sticks out as a big question-mark. If you were taking aspirin every day and having random inexplicable seizures, I'd guess you should try not taking aspirin for awhile and see what happens. People react to all kinds of chemicals differently, and even in California there's got to be a lot of variation of what you wind up smoking. Occam's Razor etc. etc.
posted by Bokononist at 10:02 PM on January 20, 2009
But, from what you've described, the marijuana sticks out as a big question-mark. If you were taking aspirin every day and having random inexplicable seizures, I'd guess you should try not taking aspirin for awhile and see what happens. People react to all kinds of chemicals differently, and even in California there's got to be a lot of variation of what you wind up smoking. Occam's Razor etc. etc.
posted by Bokononist at 10:02 PM on January 20, 2009
As you can see from the (rather complicated) California Department of Motor Vehicle charts, the DMV has a wide range of actions it may take when alerted that a driver experiences seizures.
Depending upon the seizure's type, functional impairment, and severity, the DMV may decide to place no restrictions at all upon the driver or, in the other extreme, revoke the driver's license.
But in accordance with California Motor Vehicle Code Section 14250, if a driver with seizure or lapse of consciousness disorder demonstrates extended periods of non-seizure activity, the driver can be placed on Medical Probation in lieu of license suspension or revocation. And:
"No probation is needed for drivers who have achieved six or more months of control and there are no coexisting medication conditions that would aggravate the driver's seizures or impair the driver's ability to safely operate a motor vehicle."
As for your seizure episodes, please get the MRI, EEG, and a full workup. One cannot predict future seizures' periodicity and severity based on prior episodes. You also need to secure a diagnosis of your condition.
Although it is true that according to California Health & Safety Code Section 103900, physicians must report lapse of consciousness disorders to local health officers (who in turn report to the DMV), you may be endangering yourself and others by attempting to hide your condition. (IANYL, IANAD)
posted by terranova at 10:04 PM on January 20, 2009
Depending upon the seizure's type, functional impairment, and severity, the DMV may decide to place no restrictions at all upon the driver or, in the other extreme, revoke the driver's license.
But in accordance with California Motor Vehicle Code Section 14250, if a driver with seizure or lapse of consciousness disorder demonstrates extended periods of non-seizure activity, the driver can be placed on Medical Probation in lieu of license suspension or revocation. And:
"No probation is needed for drivers who have achieved six or more months of control and there are no coexisting medication conditions that would aggravate the driver's seizures or impair the driver's ability to safely operate a motor vehicle."
As for your seizure episodes, please get the MRI, EEG, and a full workup. One cannot predict future seizures' periodicity and severity based on prior episodes. You also need to secure a diagnosis of your condition.
Although it is true that according to California Health & Safety Code Section 103900, physicians must report lapse of consciousness disorders to local health officers (who in turn report to the DMV), you may be endangering yourself and others by attempting to hide your condition. (IANYL, IANAD)
posted by terranova at 10:04 PM on January 20, 2009
A friend of mine had an almost identical experience to one of your seizures. I witnessed it firsthand and while by no means am I a doctor, I did a lot of research afterwards and it step-for-step matched the symptoms of a grand mal seizure. She had smoked that day, and at one point when grabbing a drink, her body started locking up, followed by a drop to the floor, convulsions, and then a blank, wide-eyed stare for about thirty seconds. Needless to say, it scared the hell out of both of us. She said it had never happened before and she is a frequent smoker.
Upon mentioning marijuana use to the doctor, she told me that they told her it was a result of the drug and most likely not even a seizure, neither of which seemed to be particularly true. While almost everything I've read online seems to suggest marijuana use decreases and is used to prevent seizures, I've anecdotally seen the opposite occur. Regardless, I think it's definitely worth it for tests at a larger hospital. While doctors may have a legitimate point in trying to get you to quit what they believe to be harmful, it's another thing to immediately point to it as the root for what could very well be an unrelated problem. Either way, it could point to a larger health issue which you would probably want resolved.
posted by HonorShadow at 10:49 PM on January 20, 2009
Upon mentioning marijuana use to the doctor, she told me that they told her it was a result of the drug and most likely not even a seizure, neither of which seemed to be particularly true. While almost everything I've read online seems to suggest marijuana use decreases and is used to prevent seizures, I've anecdotally seen the opposite occur. Regardless, I think it's definitely worth it for tests at a larger hospital. While doctors may have a legitimate point in trying to get you to quit what they believe to be harmful, it's another thing to immediately point to it as the root for what could very well be an unrelated problem. Either way, it could point to a larger health issue which you would probably want resolved.
posted by HonorShadow at 10:49 PM on January 20, 2009
You need a neurologist with experience in seizure disorders. Doctors see all kinds of patients with all sorts of medical conditions, medical marijuana cards, etc. etc., and shouldn't be judgmental of you.
The DMV, on the other hand, has a responsibility to everyone to make sure that you're OK to be on the road, based on what your experienced professional neurologist thinks after evaluating your condition.
Fairytale Dad first discovered his seizure disorder behind the wheel on the drive back from my grandfather's funeral. My uncle, an experienced race driver, was in the front seat and managed to regain control of the vehicle, saving himself and my parents. This is not the sort of experience I'd wish on anyone else, really, and I'd venture that you'd prefer to avoid it too. The only way to do that reliably is to seek a trusted doctor's care and let him or her help you run the DMV gauntlet.
posted by fairytale of los angeles at 11:22 PM on January 20, 2009
The DMV, on the other hand, has a responsibility to everyone to make sure that you're OK to be on the road, based on what your experienced professional neurologist thinks after evaluating your condition.
Fairytale Dad first discovered his seizure disorder behind the wheel on the drive back from my grandfather's funeral. My uncle, an experienced race driver, was in the front seat and managed to regain control of the vehicle, saving himself and my parents. This is not the sort of experience I'd wish on anyone else, really, and I'd venture that you'd prefer to avoid it too. The only way to do that reliably is to seek a trusted doctor's care and let him or her help you run the DMV gauntlet.
posted by fairytale of los angeles at 11:22 PM on January 20, 2009
you have symptoms similar to myself. this has happened to me a few times, too. do you ever get loss of vision that returns quickly? it's the same thing. i think it may be an iron deficiency (IANAD) but i know that it happened to me a few times (and i hurt myself pretty badly) before i realized that it always happened when i got up quickly after having been lying down. i simply paused before standing and, poof. all gone.
sounds like the same to me. don't report yourself, youre not epileptic, and even my sister (who is epileptic, i am not) only has to not drive for 6 months post seizure. nobody takes away her license.
you're okay.
posted by big open mouth at 11:35 PM on January 20, 2009
sounds like the same to me. don't report yourself, youre not epileptic, and even my sister (who is epileptic, i am not) only has to not drive for 6 months post seizure. nobody takes away her license.
you're okay.
posted by big open mouth at 11:35 PM on January 20, 2009
Get thee to a doctor! This is 100% worth the money, even if you never learned what happen. At least you'll know what it's NOT.
Also, listen to what other people say about the driving. You could very well kill or hurt someone, and they'd have every right to sue you. You're putting everyone's life in danger.
Finally, consider this: you mention that sometimes pot is used to control seizures. Perhaps all this time you have been self medicating for some underlying disease! That is, your seizures might be a lot more frequent if you cut out the once a day pot habit. There might be better drugs to control the seizures though, even make it safe to drive, but you won't know until a professional looks at you and runs tests.
posted by sbutler at 11:50 PM on January 20, 2009
Also, listen to what other people say about the driving. You could very well kill or hurt someone, and they'd have every right to sue you. You're putting everyone's life in danger.
Finally, consider this: you mention that sometimes pot is used to control seizures. Perhaps all this time you have been self medicating for some underlying disease! That is, your seizures might be a lot more frequent if you cut out the once a day pot habit. There might be better drugs to control the seizures though, even make it safe to drive, but you won't know until a professional looks at you and runs tests.
posted by sbutler at 11:50 PM on January 20, 2009
IANAD but these do not sound like seizures at all to me...and I have had a grand mal seizure. I lean more toward the low blood pressure/hypotension hypothesis or something in that genre, based on the points that big open mouth and charmcityblues made, which jibe w/ my experiences. I can't speak to the issue of any correlation w/ the marijuana but I think the other long-standing issues of stomach problems, mono, and anemia could be correlated. Bringing all of your symptoms to the attention of your GP, for starters, and insisting on followup with specialists if necessary until an answer is found are definitely called for, for your safety, peace of mind, and the well-being of those sharing the roads w/ you.
I seriously doubt you'll need to move home and be driven around by your parents. Just tell your story to a good doc and let them do the doctor thing to figure it out with you.
posted by mumstheword at 12:10 AM on January 21, 2009
I seriously doubt you'll need to move home and be driven around by your parents. Just tell your story to a good doc and let them do the doctor thing to figure it out with you.
posted by mumstheword at 12:10 AM on January 21, 2009
These really, really don't sound like seizures. Find a neurologist who takes your history properly. As charmcityblues says, they sound like orthostatic hypotension - basically just a severe headrush. Google 'orthostatic hypotension marijuana' and you'll see that it's a recognised association. When I was a kid of about 10 and first started getting headrushes, I was convinced I had a terrible neurological disorder and was too frightened to tell anyone. Once I even passed out, and it was very much like what you describe. It was only after years of background terror that I realised that these were just headrushes, and everyone got them, and they were no big deal. It can be frightening to watch for someone who doesn't understand what's going on.
Again, I say: find a neurologist who takes your history properly, mention orthostatic hypotension along with seizures as a possible cause of your loss of consciousness, and let them do the tests. If you are epileptic - and I think you're not - neglecting it could have far worse consequences than the loss of your driving licence. You could end up brain-damaged or dead, you could kill someone while driving, you could seriously injure yourself.
posted by Acheman at 12:11 AM on January 21, 2009
Again, I say: find a neurologist who takes your history properly, mention orthostatic hypotension along with seizures as a possible cause of your loss of consciousness, and let them do the tests. If you are epileptic - and I think you're not - neglecting it could have far worse consequences than the loss of your driving licence. You could end up brain-damaged or dead, you could kill someone while driving, you could seriously injure yourself.
posted by Acheman at 12:11 AM on January 21, 2009
This question is kind of like "is it ok if I drive around while I'm *blindingly* drunk a couple times every couple years?" And the answer to that would be no, so this is kind of the same.
Either these are real seizures or they're not, and strangers on the internet can't diagnose that. You need to go see a real doctor. A good one. And one who believes in the usefulness of medical marijuana (so your usage won't bias the diagnosis). And most of all, one who will take time with you and do a thorough history. Book a long appointment to make sure there's time to do it thoroughly- the stakes are high (your license) so you wanna make sure you get a full appointment and a detailed discussion of what happened. Talk to your friends, separately and in-person, before you go to the neurologist's. Have each friend *really* clearly describe what you did while unconscious that time- ask them to do impressions of you before you responded to them (to see if you were shaking or eyes rolled back or whatever). Get really detailed accounts: not "you had a seizure" but "your body was stiff, spine arched, eyes rolled back, mouth open, jerking and vibrating like this... " or whatever.
If, after a detailed history and some further examination, a doctor you trust diagnoses your symptoms as real seizures that could recur, then your license will, and should be revoked. Which totally sucks but if it happened while you were driving... it's as bad as driving reeeally drunk once in a while- maybe worse because you'd have no way to even control what part of town you were in or how fast you were going.
But! If you go to a good doctor and whatever happened turns out to NOT be real seizures, then you'll feel so relieved! And maybe you'll also find out how to prevent whatever-it-is from happening ever again, because falling and whacking your head on the fridge or tub or whatever is also kind of dangerous, so you wanna not do that any more if possible.
Either way, do some research in your area to find a good neurologist- in fact, someone on here can probably help you with that. Good luck- I can totally understand your resistance, but I think you realize it's the right thing to do.
posted by pseudostrabismus at 12:29 AM on January 21, 2009
Either these are real seizures or they're not, and strangers on the internet can't diagnose that. You need to go see a real doctor. A good one. And one who believes in the usefulness of medical marijuana (so your usage won't bias the diagnosis). And most of all, one who will take time with you and do a thorough history. Book a long appointment to make sure there's time to do it thoroughly- the stakes are high (your license) so you wanna make sure you get a full appointment and a detailed discussion of what happened. Talk to your friends, separately and in-person, before you go to the neurologist's. Have each friend *really* clearly describe what you did while unconscious that time- ask them to do impressions of you before you responded to them (to see if you were shaking or eyes rolled back or whatever). Get really detailed accounts: not "you had a seizure" but "your body was stiff, spine arched, eyes rolled back, mouth open, jerking and vibrating like this... " or whatever.
If, after a detailed history and some further examination, a doctor you trust diagnoses your symptoms as real seizures that could recur, then your license will, and should be revoked. Which totally sucks but if it happened while you were driving... it's as bad as driving reeeally drunk once in a while- maybe worse because you'd have no way to even control what part of town you were in or how fast you were going.
But! If you go to a good doctor and whatever happened turns out to NOT be real seizures, then you'll feel so relieved! And maybe you'll also find out how to prevent whatever-it-is from happening ever again, because falling and whacking your head on the fridge or tub or whatever is also kind of dangerous, so you wanna not do that any more if possible.
Either way, do some research in your area to find a good neurologist- in fact, someone on here can probably help you with that. Good luck- I can totally understand your resistance, but I think you realize it's the right thing to do.
posted by pseudostrabismus at 12:29 AM on January 21, 2009
Next time you feel the "headrush", sit down immediately and put your head between your legs. If this successfully averts the collapse, bingo! low blood pressure issue.
posted by emilyw at 12:42 AM on January 21, 2009
posted by emilyw at 12:42 AM on January 21, 2009
I've always been a picky eater and know I don't always get the proper nutrients, so I thought it might have been a weird blood sugar issue.
Not only that, it's a mineral imbalance issue. In addition to orthostatic hypotension, google "vasovagal syncope + marijuana" too. Why? Many studies have shown marijuana depletes zinc levels, which in turn totally impairs your adrenal function. If you're low on iron as well-- and most women are--your adrenal system really takes a hit.
"Thousands of people suffer from constant fatigue unrelieved by rest and sleep. This is the main symptom of adrenal burnout. Other symptoms may include a craving for sweets, low blood pressure and low blood sugar, irritability and depression."
While you're at the neurologist, ask him to run tests on your iron, zinc, serum sodium and potassium levels. A thryoid panel and ACTH (Cortrosyn) baseline and challenge couldn't hurt either. The very least you could do is take a solid multivitamin-multimineral with extra C and zinc.
The next time you feel light-headed and the tunnel starts to close in, the best way to keep from passing out is to bend over and put your head between your legs to increase blood flow to your brain. Anytime you get light-headed, bananas and Pedialyte/Gatorade are a good way to get your minerals up. Not too long ago, Walgreens started to make pediatric electrolyte strips, and it's not a bad idea to have some on you if you think fainting might be a problem.
posted by aquafortis at 1:03 AM on January 21, 2009
Not only that, it's a mineral imbalance issue. In addition to orthostatic hypotension, google "vasovagal syncope + marijuana" too. Why? Many studies have shown marijuana depletes zinc levels, which in turn totally impairs your adrenal function. If you're low on iron as well-- and most women are--your adrenal system really takes a hit.
"Thousands of people suffer from constant fatigue unrelieved by rest and sleep. This is the main symptom of adrenal burnout. Other symptoms may include a craving for sweets, low blood pressure and low blood sugar, irritability and depression."
While you're at the neurologist, ask him to run tests on your iron, zinc, serum sodium and potassium levels. A thryoid panel and ACTH (Cortrosyn) baseline and challenge couldn't hurt either. The very least you could do is take a solid multivitamin-multimineral with extra C and zinc.
The next time you feel light-headed and the tunnel starts to close in, the best way to keep from passing out is to bend over and put your head between your legs to increase blood flow to your brain. Anytime you get light-headed, bananas and Pedialyte/Gatorade are a good way to get your minerals up. Not too long ago, Walgreens started to make pediatric electrolyte strips, and it's not a bad idea to have some on you if you think fainting might be a problem.
posted by aquafortis at 1:03 AM on January 21, 2009
I just noticed something I missed the first time around: did your doctor tell you if you have iron-deficiency anemia, or macrocytic (B12) anemia? Is it still a problem, and are you taking anything for it? Adrenal fatigue and syncope can be very, very common in iron-deficiency anemics. Pot killing your zinc levels isn't helping, in any event...getting your blood tested in addition seeing a neurologist makes sense to me.
posted by aquafortis at 1:27 AM on January 21, 2009
posted by aquafortis at 1:27 AM on January 21, 2009
Obviously I am not a doctor, but anecdotally I've had lots of stomach problems, cysts like you've had, all sorts of medication for ulcers in my early teens, became a picky vegan eater in my teens, and had those exact headrush - blackout - deafness - where the hell am I kind of faints. They'd come on after a bath or after a nap but once or twice after just sitting down for a long time (math class to be specific)
I say faints because witnesses say I was not out long, maybe 35-40 seconds, did not jerk about but I made a 'peeping noise' (all air was leaving my lungs like I was saying 'aaaaah'), and my eyes were open.
In my case, zinc and iron was lacking. Solution: Blutsaft a.k.a Floradix Iron + Herbs Liquid Extract Formula. Because iron pills give tummy trouble.
Meanwhile I nth the see a proper doctor for possible neurological/bloodpressure issues and take the bus there until you know exactly what is going on.
posted by dabitch at 1:58 AM on January 21, 2009
I say faints because witnesses say I was not out long, maybe 35-40 seconds, did not jerk about but I made a 'peeping noise' (all air was leaving my lungs like I was saying 'aaaaah'), and my eyes were open.
In my case, zinc and iron was lacking. Solution: Blutsaft a.k.a Floradix Iron + Herbs Liquid Extract Formula. Because iron pills give tummy trouble.
Meanwhile I nth the see a proper doctor for possible neurological/bloodpressure issues and take the bus there until you know exactly what is going on.
posted by dabitch at 1:58 AM on January 21, 2009
I'd be very surprised if these turned out to be seizures of the epileptic kind. I had many seizures as a kid, including at least one grand mal (now called tonic clonic), and one of the defining features of them is that you remember nothing.
I would start with your GP and get some bloodwork done, and a good blood pressure check, before jumping to neurology. In fact, I wouldn't use the word seizure at all. Let the doctor make that diagnosis if that's the term s/he thinks is appropriate.
posted by Hildegarde at 2:38 AM on January 21, 2009
I would start with your GP and get some bloodwork done, and a good blood pressure check, before jumping to neurology. In fact, I wouldn't use the word seizure at all. Let the doctor make that diagnosis if that's the term s/he thinks is appropriate.
posted by Hildegarde at 2:38 AM on January 21, 2009
"The fact that your prior seizures only happened in certain situations doesn't prove that will be the case in the future. "f I thought I was a risk to anyone I would not drive." You are a risk. It's time to stop denying it."
But given the history, there's virtually no indocation the same thing will happen while behind the wheel of a car.
posted by gjc at 4:33 AM on January 21, 2009
But given the history, there's virtually no indocation the same thing will happen while behind the wheel of a car.
posted by gjc at 4:33 AM on January 21, 2009
Stop reading people's wild guesses on here and see a licensed doctor. You can find out if that doctor was in fact licensed here.
posted by Brennus at 5:33 AM on January 21, 2009
posted by Brennus at 5:33 AM on January 21, 2009
OP, chiming in to say I hope you'll get a second opinion. Im just a little concerne that if you do have something, and it can be caught early, you'll miss that window of time because you're worried about the license. I'm also a little concerned that if something does happen and someone else gets hurt, you'll be held liable, because you knew you were having issues.
FYI, I also know someone who went unconscious, had a doctor report it, and basically after a period of time he got rechecked, got a clean bill of health and got his license reinstated by the DMV, lickity split.
Get thee to a doctor you trust, if you can.
posted by anitanita at 5:50 AM on January 21, 2009
FYI, I also know someone who went unconscious, had a doctor report it, and basically after a period of time he got rechecked, got a clean bill of health and got his license reinstated by the DMV, lickity split.
Get thee to a doctor you trust, if you can.
posted by anitanita at 5:50 AM on January 21, 2009
Please don't listen to any of our online diagnoses and find the best neurologist you can, stat. Please make sure to detail to him or her the medical issues that required the medical marijuana (stomach pains, nausea, etc.) so the doctor can try to put the pieces together.
posted by foxy_hedgehog at 6:01 AM on January 21, 2009
posted by foxy_hedgehog at 6:01 AM on January 21, 2009
If I thought I was a risk to anyone I would not drive. My seizures seem to be isolated to very specific circumstances
I had a neurologist tell me not to drive for three months after I had a seizure. Despite the fact that I was pretty sure I knew what caused it, my sister has epilepsy so we erred on the side of caution and I stayed off the road. I sucked it up and walked three miles to the post office and got rides from friends. It sucked, but sucked a lot less than having an unexpected seizure at the wheel of a moving vehicle which was actually the circumstance surrounding my first seizure. It was the scariest thing that has ever happened to me. Do not screw around with this.
My doctor also suggested that I not bathe alone or climb ladders for six months which I didn't pay as close attention to. Go to a reputable doctor who you trust and get this sorted and stop trying to play expert with something you don't know anythign about other than what you've been Googling.
posted by jessamyn at 6:53 AM on January 21, 2009
I had a neurologist tell me not to drive for three months after I had a seizure. Despite the fact that I was pretty sure I knew what caused it, my sister has epilepsy so we erred on the side of caution and I stayed off the road. I sucked it up and walked three miles to the post office and got rides from friends. It sucked, but sucked a lot less than having an unexpected seizure at the wheel of a moving vehicle which was actually the circumstance surrounding my first seizure. It was the scariest thing that has ever happened to me. Do not screw around with this.
My doctor also suggested that I not bathe alone or climb ladders for six months which I didn't pay as close attention to. Go to a reputable doctor who you trust and get this sorted and stop trying to play expert with something you don't know anythign about other than what you've been Googling.
posted by jessamyn at 6:53 AM on January 21, 2009
Do anything you can to see a non-Kaiser doctor for anything more serious than cold, flu, sprains or breaks, and the like.
From my answer to another post:
"Kaiser is good at health promotion education and preventative care, but the sort of thing you are talking about here is what they'd prefer to defer until you are at death's door (either physically, or, frankly, from suicide because you can't take it).
You absolutely must be firm. I've found that they tend not to be particularly bright, either, for people with so much higher education, and you absolutely have to tell them what you EXPECT them to do."
I had a Kaiser doctor who held my chart in front of me and said, "OK, what should I put down?"
posted by jgirl at 8:40 AM on January 21, 2009
From my answer to another post:
"Kaiser is good at health promotion education and preventative care, but the sort of thing you are talking about here is what they'd prefer to defer until you are at death's door (either physically, or, frankly, from suicide because you can't take it).
You absolutely must be firm. I've found that they tend not to be particularly bright, either, for people with so much higher education, and you absolutely have to tell them what you EXPECT them to do."
I had a Kaiser doctor who held my chart in front of me and said, "OK, what should I put down?"
posted by jgirl at 8:40 AM on January 21, 2009
I get these headrushes/fainting issues fairly regularly, and I don't smoke anything. Like you, it always involves getting up from a reclining position fairly quickly. Sometimes I make it into the next room, other times I'm just a few steps away from the couch/bed/recliner.
My doctor said it's because of my low-ish blood pressure, and the fainting spells can be exacerbated if you're taller and skinnier than the average person. I have no problem believing her.
As I've gotten older it's easier for me to recognize the signs of an impending unconscious crash to the ground, so I'm not afraid to sit down immediately (no matter where I am) if my hearing fades and the tunnel vision of doom sets in. This is especially important if I'm in the shower or near a stairwell! I've never experienced any issues of this while driving because in all honesty, I'd probably pass out well before finding my keys.
So see a different doctor if you'd like, but definitely listen to your body!
posted by Maarika at 11:55 AM on January 21, 2009
My doctor said it's because of my low-ish blood pressure, and the fainting spells can be exacerbated if you're taller and skinnier than the average person. I have no problem believing her.
As I've gotten older it's easier for me to recognize the signs of an impending unconscious crash to the ground, so I'm not afraid to sit down immediately (no matter where I am) if my hearing fades and the tunnel vision of doom sets in. This is especially important if I'm in the shower or near a stairwell! I've never experienced any issues of this while driving because in all honesty, I'd probably pass out well before finding my keys.
So see a different doctor if you'd like, but definitely listen to your body!
posted by Maarika at 11:55 AM on January 21, 2009
Response by poster: I'm really encouraged by the idea that these episodes could be something other than a seizure. I've always seen people faint with their eyes closed, and they fall to the ground. My eyes are open, staring and I make a choking sound--could that really be simply fainting?
posted by wannaknow at 12:00 PM on January 21, 2009
posted by wannaknow at 12:00 PM on January 21, 2009
IANAD, but I was a fainter for several years. I never really found out what caused my fainting (probably a combination of low blood pressure and low blood sugar), but I know that when I went down, my eyes were open a few times. I can't speak for the choking/gurgling sound, but the tunnel vision, hearing loss, and disorientation all sound like fainting to me.
Nthing what the others have said; go to a (better) doctor, get it checked out. Even if it is just fainting, you need to figure out how to prevent/manage it.
posted by specialagentwebb at 12:58 PM on January 21, 2009
Nthing what the others have said; go to a (better) doctor, get it checked out. Even if it is just fainting, you need to figure out how to prevent/manage it.
posted by specialagentwebb at 12:58 PM on January 21, 2009
This thread is closed to new comments.
1. "picky eater" - low blood sugar can cause fainting. Are you sure this isn't what's happening?
2. the episodes always happen after you get up from lying down. Could this be a blood pressure issue?
Go to a better doctor, or several better doctors. This is serious. Ask the above two questions, tell them everything you've told us, keep asking questions until you feel like you understand what's going on and the doctor has taken the time to rule out all possible causes.
A friend of mine had unexplained seizures and to the best of my knowledge they never were explained, so bear in mind the possibility that they may not be able to figure out what's wrong with you. But she gave up trying only after seeing *many* *good* doctors.
posted by mai at 9:43 PM on January 20, 2009