Help us decide where to live!
June 3, 2008 9:46 AM Subscribe
Help us decide where to live!
My wife and I are at a place in our lives where we can move wherever we want - she just graduated from college and is taking a year off before grad school, and I'm taking coursed online, so I'm pretty portable. We're currently in Annapolis, MD, but our lease ends at the end of July and we really don't want to stay here. Help us decide!
Things we're looking for:
-Fairly low cost of living. We're paying about $1000 for a crappy 2-bedroom here, and would like to pay a little bit less where we end up.
-We like being in urban areas, but we don't NEED that big-city feeling. Kansas City is amazing, for this reason, but that's where she's from and she doesn't want to move back there any time soon.
-A decent music scene, or at least a reasonable proximity to one. I'm a musician, and would like to be able to book shows where I end up.
-A decent visual arts scene - like the above, but for her.
-She hates the southwest.
Any ideas?
My wife and I are at a place in our lives where we can move wherever we want - she just graduated from college and is taking a year off before grad school, and I'm taking coursed online, so I'm pretty portable. We're currently in Annapolis, MD, but our lease ends at the end of July and we really don't want to stay here. Help us decide!
Things we're looking for:
-Fairly low cost of living. We're paying about $1000 for a crappy 2-bedroom here, and would like to pay a little bit less where we end up.
-We like being in urban areas, but we don't NEED that big-city feeling. Kansas City is amazing, for this reason, but that's where she's from and she doesn't want to move back there any time soon.
-A decent music scene, or at least a reasonable proximity to one. I'm a musician, and would like to be able to book shows where I end up.
-A decent visual arts scene - like the above, but for her.
-She hates the southwest.
Any ideas?
Raleigh/Chapel Hill, N.C.
Minneapolis (can't speak to the cost of living there, though)
posted by Airhen at 10:00 AM on June 3, 2008
Minneapolis (can't speak to the cost of living there, though)
posted by Airhen at 10:00 AM on June 3, 2008
Go South! Athens, Georgia or Birmingham, Alabama are nice and fairly inexpensive. They both have lively arts communities (Athens is a better music market than Birmingham, but Birmingham is surprisingly hip). Both are big enough that you won't get bored but aren't too big-city-ish.
posted by jrichards at 10:01 AM on June 3, 2008
posted by jrichards at 10:01 AM on June 3, 2008
Minneapolis-St Paul
If you can endure the weather- it's a great place to live and meets nearly all of your criteria - I'm not sure if the rents are as low as you need- I'd say check St Paul first.
You might also consider Roanoke, VA.
posted by InstantSanitizer at 10:02 AM on June 3, 2008
Last weekend I heard an NPR story on the music scene in Omaha. Not my cup of tea but if you like KC, then maybe this might be a place to checkout.
posted by Taken Outtacontext at 10:12 AM on June 3, 2008
posted by Taken Outtacontext at 10:12 AM on June 3, 2008
Chicago.
posted by c:\awesome at 10:13 AM on June 3, 2008
posted by c:\awesome at 10:13 AM on June 3, 2008
Do you have any idea where your wife is considering going to grad school? If it were me and I knew that was on the horizon, I'd want to factor that into possible locations. Unless you really don't mind moving again after a year.
posted by otherwordlyglow at 10:20 AM on June 3, 2008
posted by otherwordlyglow at 10:20 AM on June 3, 2008
I fully endorse the South! In addition to the cities mentioned, you may want to consider Asheville, NC, though that is smaller than most of the places already mentioned. Also, I lived in tha ATL for years with a pretty decent cost-of-living/standard-of-living ratio.
I endorse the South even though I now live in (and love) Philadelphia. This is because, even though Phila is comparatively cheap to live in when you consider its size, location, and amenities, it's not quite the bargain I think you're in the market for.
posted by killerinsideme at 10:26 AM on June 3, 2008
I endorse the South even though I now live in (and love) Philadelphia. This is because, even though Phila is comparatively cheap to live in when you consider its size, location, and amenities, it's not quite the bargain I think you're in the market for.
posted by killerinsideme at 10:26 AM on June 3, 2008
Here is a New York Times article on the arts and music scene in Omaha. Really, it sums it up better than I could. Saddle Creek Records is here. The area around Saddle Creek is nice.You can get champagne on tap at The Homy Inn.
Another nice thing about Omaha is the statewide smoking ban. This means that bars, pool halls, music venues etc. are much more tolerable. If you don't smoke, that is. If you do, I guess you're outta luck.
Omaha is big on public art projects. The Bemis Center is really cool.
The Slowdown is something that you would probably like. Same with The Waiting Room. And the Sokol Underground.
The drawbacks are that Omaha has very little public transportation - you will need a car. Property taxes are high, but if you are renting that shouldn't be a problem. We do get snow, but nothing worse than KC.
My sister pays around $600 for an 1 bedroom, 850 square foot apartment. You should be able to get a really, really nice 2 bedroom place for less than you are paying now.
posted by Ostara at 10:28 AM on June 3, 2008
Another nice thing about Omaha is the statewide smoking ban. This means that bars, pool halls, music venues etc. are much more tolerable. If you don't smoke, that is. If you do, I guess you're outta luck.
Omaha is big on public art projects. The Bemis Center is really cool.
The Slowdown is something that you would probably like. Same with The Waiting Room. And the Sokol Underground.
The drawbacks are that Omaha has very little public transportation - you will need a car. Property taxes are high, but if you are renting that shouldn't be a problem. We do get snow, but nothing worse than KC.
My sister pays around $600 for an 1 bedroom, 850 square foot apartment. You should be able to get a really, really nice 2 bedroom place for less than you are paying now.
posted by Ostara at 10:28 AM on June 3, 2008
Some areas of Chicago are nice. You'd fall in love with Lincoln Square.
posted by LSK at 10:33 AM on June 3, 2008
posted by LSK at 10:33 AM on June 3, 2008
if you don't mind the rain, portland OR is a beautiful city with a fantastic music scene and a lot of outdoorsy things to do.
posted by blapst at 10:49 AM on June 3, 2008 [1 favorite]
posted by blapst at 10:49 AM on June 3, 2008 [1 favorite]
1. Chicago
2. Minneapolis
I have a special place in my heart for both those places. Omaha? Not so much. And yes, I've lived there ... though I try to never think about it.
posted by notjustfoxybrown at 10:55 AM on June 3, 2008
2. Minneapolis
I have a special place in my heart for both those places. Omaha? Not so much. And yes, I've lived there ... though I try to never think about it.
posted by notjustfoxybrown at 10:55 AM on June 3, 2008
Yay. I came in to say, "Ahem. Birmingham's pretty cool, no srsly." and was gratified to see it already mentioned.
Pluses:
1. Cost of living: downtown lofts are reasonably priced (and enormous), gas is cheaper than the national average, as are groceries and utilities.
2. We are home to some of the best food and best bars in the US. Eat dinner at Highlands Bar and Grill, have a pint beneath the wisteria at The Garage Cafe, and catch a band at the legendary rock club, The Nick. Then end the night and start your morning at Marty's, a friendly, laid-back club that closes at 6 AM and makes a kickass cheeseburger.
3. There's an active, growing music scene that embraces everything from punk to blues to jazz to country. You'd be surprised at the bands and performers that play here, week in and week out.
4. Great medical care at UAB Hospital, one of the nation's top research hospitals.
5. An afternoon drive puts you at the beach, in the Smokies, or *shudder* in Atlanta, if you must.
6. A burgeoning art scene.
7. Open-mike night somewhere, 7 days a week. Did I mention we have a bunch of great bars?
Minuses:
1. Still plenty of rednecks to deal with (but the more people who move here, the more that pool is diluted).
2. Completely ineffective and corrupt state and local government. Kind of a plus, since by and large we just ignore them and do what we were going to do anyway.
3. The legacy of heavy industry has led to some polluted land and water. But air quality has improved dramatically since they closed the last steel mill down. It was in the middle of downtown....
4. No public transportation. None. Zero. Zip. You must own a car to get around.
5. Local media are lapdogs of the Christian right. But we're not unique in this, I'm sure.
6. The suburbs suck. Again, not a problem unique to Birmingham.
7. Bad local schools. But you guys don't have kids yet, right?
posted by BitterOldPunk at 11:00 AM on June 3, 2008
Pluses:
1. Cost of living: downtown lofts are reasonably priced (and enormous), gas is cheaper than the national average, as are groceries and utilities.
2. We are home to some of the best food and best bars in the US. Eat dinner at Highlands Bar and Grill, have a pint beneath the wisteria at The Garage Cafe, and catch a band at the legendary rock club, The Nick. Then end the night and start your morning at Marty's, a friendly, laid-back club that closes at 6 AM and makes a kickass cheeseburger.
3. There's an active, growing music scene that embraces everything from punk to blues to jazz to country. You'd be surprised at the bands and performers that play here, week in and week out.
4. Great medical care at UAB Hospital, one of the nation's top research hospitals.
5. An afternoon drive puts you at the beach, in the Smokies, or *shudder* in Atlanta, if you must.
6. A burgeoning art scene.
7. Open-mike night somewhere, 7 days a week. Did I mention we have a bunch of great bars?
Minuses:
1. Still plenty of rednecks to deal with (but the more people who move here, the more that pool is diluted).
2. Completely ineffective and corrupt state and local government. Kind of a plus, since by and large we just ignore them and do what we were going to do anyway.
3. The legacy of heavy industry has led to some polluted land and water. But air quality has improved dramatically since they closed the last steel mill down. It was in the middle of downtown....
4. No public transportation. None. Zero. Zip. You must own a car to get around.
5. Local media are lapdogs of the Christian right. But we're not unique in this, I'm sure.
6. The suburbs suck. Again, not a problem unique to Birmingham.
7. Bad local schools. But you guys don't have kids yet, right?
posted by BitterOldPunk at 11:00 AM on June 3, 2008
What about Baltimore? It has all those things. And you can buy a house for $1000/month.
posted by electroboy at 11:04 AM on June 3, 2008
posted by electroboy at 11:04 AM on June 3, 2008
I think the requirements you give mean you almost certainly want to focus on NC/SC/GA/TN/AL.
Memphis has good food, low cost of living, convenient airline flights on Northwest, good bar and music scene, and decent weather except for July/August.
I also hear good things about Charleston but have never been there.
posted by charlesv at 11:07 AM on June 3, 2008
Memphis has good food, low cost of living, convenient airline flights on Northwest, good bar and music scene, and decent weather except for July/August.
I also hear good things about Charleston but have never been there.
posted by charlesv at 11:07 AM on June 3, 2008
Portland, OR is definitely a place you should consider.
Although it's not as cheap as places like Omaha or Birmingham, rents are still pretty resasonable. You can definitely find a nice 2BR apartment in a great part of town for less than what you're paying now.
Although it's an urban area, with all a city has to offer, Portland is (mostly) divided up in to wonderful neighborhoods with a mixture of residential and commercial spaces. In many ways it feels like a series of smaller towns butted up right against each other, each with its coffee shops, restaurants, bars, grocery stores, etc. And it's all amazingly compact and walkable. Or bikeable. Or bussable. Or driveable.
The arts and music scene in Portland may not measure up to, say, Chicago, but there are tons of local bands with tons of places for them to play (although touring bands do sometimes complain about the lackadaisical attitude of Portland crowds...) , and there are plenty of art galleries at both the high and low end of the market, plus a lot of post-college and post-graduate school musicians and artists forming a community.
Of course there are some drawbacks:
It can be difficult to find work here beyond the typical service-industry type stuff. Very difficult. You're competing with a ton of similar people for the same jobs.
And of course, the weather. It doesn't rain quite as much as people say, but it is pretty gray and drizzly for most of the year. That said, it never gets too cold (we get snow maybe once or twice a winter, but the mountains are right there if you've got the craving for the frozen white stuff), and rarely gets too hot or humid. The summers here are just about the best weather I've experienced- three or four months of 85 degrees with clear blue skies, low humidity and a slight breeze.
But it is true that the low gray ceiling over the Willamette valley for much of the rest of the year is not for everybody...
posted by dersins at 11:19 AM on June 3, 2008 [1 favorite]
Although it's not as cheap as places like Omaha or Birmingham, rents are still pretty resasonable. You can definitely find a nice 2BR apartment in a great part of town for less than what you're paying now.
Although it's an urban area, with all a city has to offer, Portland is (mostly) divided up in to wonderful neighborhoods with a mixture of residential and commercial spaces. In many ways it feels like a series of smaller towns butted up right against each other, each with its coffee shops, restaurants, bars, grocery stores, etc. And it's all amazingly compact and walkable. Or bikeable. Or bussable. Or driveable.
The arts and music scene in Portland may not measure up to, say, Chicago, but there are tons of local bands with tons of places for them to play (although touring bands do sometimes complain about the lackadaisical attitude of Portland crowds...) , and there are plenty of art galleries at both the high and low end of the market, plus a lot of post-college and post-graduate school musicians and artists forming a community.
Of course there are some drawbacks:
It can be difficult to find work here beyond the typical service-industry type stuff. Very difficult. You're competing with a ton of similar people for the same jobs.
And of course, the weather. It doesn't rain quite as much as people say, but it is pretty gray and drizzly for most of the year. That said, it never gets too cold (we get snow maybe once or twice a winter, but the mountains are right there if you've got the craving for the frozen white stuff), and rarely gets too hot or humid. The summers here are just about the best weather I've experienced- three or four months of 85 degrees with clear blue skies, low humidity and a slight breeze.
But it is true that the low gray ceiling over the Willamette valley for much of the rest of the year is not for everybody...
posted by dersins at 11:19 AM on June 3, 2008 [1 favorite]
i just moved back to nashville after many years in new york. there's plenty of good music (not just country), an arts scene, a good economy, decent-to-good restaurants, and it's easy to find a good 2-bedroom for less than $1000.
it lacks decent public transit and for some reason big bands tend not to come through, opting instead for atlanta, but that never bothered me.
posted by thinkingwoman at 11:23 AM on June 3, 2008
it lacks decent public transit and for some reason big bands tend not to come through, opting instead for atlanta, but that never bothered me.
posted by thinkingwoman at 11:23 AM on June 3, 2008
If I wasn't in Minneapolis I'd want to be in Seattle.
Actually, damn near any reasonably-sized city that also has a reasonably-sized university nearby would probably be worth a shot - but yeah, think about where you may end up, grad school-wise. No sense falling in love with a place that you're going to leave in a year now, is there?
posted by caution live frogs at 11:47 AM on June 3, 2008
Actually, damn near any reasonably-sized city that also has a reasonably-sized university nearby would probably be worth a shot - but yeah, think about where you may end up, grad school-wise. No sense falling in love with a place that you're going to leave in a year now, is there?
posted by caution live frogs at 11:47 AM on June 3, 2008
What about St. Louis? Might be nice to be closer to her family, as well?
posted by cider at 11:54 AM on June 3, 2008
posted by cider at 11:54 AM on June 3, 2008
Being from Minneapolis I may be biased, but I really can't say enough about it. I also think you could reasonably find a decent apartment for less than $1000.
posted by triggerfinger at 11:59 AM on June 3, 2008
posted by triggerfinger at 11:59 AM on June 3, 2008
Austin, TX.
One book that might help you is Rich Karlgaard's book Life 2.0: How People Across America are Transforming Their Lives by Finding the Where of Their Happiness. He goes into details on about 150 small-medium sized cities.
posted by mattbucher at 12:12 PM on June 3, 2008
One book that might help you is Rich Karlgaard's book Life 2.0: How People Across America are Transforming Their Lives by Finding the Where of Their Happiness. He goes into details on about 150 small-medium sized cities.
posted by mattbucher at 12:12 PM on June 3, 2008
Birmingham or Nashville. If you're going to winter-over then go for B'ham. Agree with all the previous posters on the pro's and con's.
Good Luck
SandPine
posted by sandpine at 12:13 PM on June 3, 2008
While Austin is my favorite place in the world, it does not quite meet your financial needs. It is expensive and getting pricier by the year. I would live here forever if I could, but job prospects aren't that great and it is pricey. I should just move under a bridge on the Greenbelt. I digress...
So I am moving to Cleveland, Ohio (for a JOB, folks. I would not leave Austin unless it was absolutely necessary). It is on a big body of water (Lake Erie), it has wonderful metroparks and reserves (Rocky River Reserve), lots of good music (The Grog Shop, Severence Hall, Peabody's), wonderful art (The Cleveland Museum of Art and tons galleries of neat art), diversity of food and culture (Little Italy, Cleveland Heights, Shaker Heights, Lakewood, West Side Market), great art / music schools (The Cleveland Institute of Music, The Cleveland Institute of Art, Case Western Reserve University, Oberlin and Baldwin Wallace are nearby), and it is CHEAP. DIRT CHEAP. I just signed a lease on 1,200 sq ft (dining room, living room, 2 bedrooms, 1 bathroom, sunroom, kitchen, 12 foot ceilings, hardwood floors, etc.) for $750 INCLUDING HEAT in Lakewood, just two blocks from the lake, right near the Shoreway, a short jet from downtown (that's the average cost of 600 sq ft in Austin). Plus Cleveland got the 2007 award for best public transportation in the nation.
Might be worth your while if you can survive the winters (and I'm not sure I'll be able to after the 101 degree days in Austin).
posted by cachondeo45 at 12:24 PM on June 3, 2008
So I am moving to Cleveland, Ohio (for a JOB, folks. I would not leave Austin unless it was absolutely necessary). It is on a big body of water (Lake Erie), it has wonderful metroparks and reserves (Rocky River Reserve), lots of good music (The Grog Shop, Severence Hall, Peabody's), wonderful art (The Cleveland Museum of Art and tons galleries of neat art), diversity of food and culture (Little Italy, Cleveland Heights, Shaker Heights, Lakewood, West Side Market), great art / music schools (The Cleveland Institute of Music, The Cleveland Institute of Art, Case Western Reserve University, Oberlin and Baldwin Wallace are nearby), and it is CHEAP. DIRT CHEAP. I just signed a lease on 1,200 sq ft (dining room, living room, 2 bedrooms, 1 bathroom, sunroom, kitchen, 12 foot ceilings, hardwood floors, etc.) for $750 INCLUDING HEAT in Lakewood, just two blocks from the lake, right near the Shoreway, a short jet from downtown (that's the average cost of 600 sq ft in Austin). Plus Cleveland got the 2007 award for best public transportation in the nation.
Might be worth your while if you can survive the winters (and I'm not sure I'll be able to after the 101 degree days in Austin).
posted by cachondeo45 at 12:24 PM on June 3, 2008
Chicago
posted by Jason and Laszlo at 12:39 PM on June 3, 2008
posted by Jason and Laszlo at 12:39 PM on June 3, 2008
Another vote for Omaha. It's similar to KC without being KC, and has a growing arts and music scene, as has been pointed out above. I lived there for a couple of years (and have family in the area), and would gladly return if the right job came along.
posted by jal0021 at 12:50 PM on June 3, 2008
posted by jal0021 at 12:50 PM on June 3, 2008
Providence, RI.
Great arts scene with RISD and Brown, fairly low cost of living (my apt is $1400/month for two floors, two full baths and 4 bedrooms), and close to many things: NYC (3 hrs), Boston (1 hr), Cape Cod, the Berkshires, the Adirondacks, etc. Not to mention our fantastic Roller Derby teams.
For context, I was a life-long New Yorker who moved here from Brooklyn in January. Only downsides so far: parking (manageable) and the winter (can be tough). Summer is awesome though!
posted by anthropoid at 12:55 PM on June 3, 2008
Great arts scene with RISD and Brown, fairly low cost of living (my apt is $1400/month for two floors, two full baths and 4 bedrooms), and close to many things: NYC (3 hrs), Boston (1 hr), Cape Cod, the Berkshires, the Adirondacks, etc. Not to mention our fantastic Roller Derby teams.
For context, I was a life-long New Yorker who moved here from Brooklyn in January. Only downsides so far: parking (manageable) and the winter (can be tough). Summer is awesome though!
posted by anthropoid at 12:55 PM on June 3, 2008
Milwaukee. I don't know why people are saying Chicago. Good luck finding a two bedroom for under $1000 that's not in a scary neighborhood. You can find a nice 2 br in Milwaukee for $700-800. Milwaukee has a plethora of music festivals, including the biggest in the world, and has a thriving visual arts scene, including the coolest-looking art museum in the world.
posted by desjardins at 1:03 PM on June 3, 2008
posted by desjardins at 1:03 PM on June 3, 2008
Columbus, OH
posted by Solon and Thanks at 1:04 PM on June 3, 2008
posted by Solon and Thanks at 1:04 PM on June 3, 2008
Came in to say "Providence" and of course, it's already here.
Really, what you're looking for may be a university town. This gives you a far wider field in the US than it did for us over here, but universities on both sides of the pond tend to mean arts, live music, cheap beer, and affordable rentals. In the US you usually get the bonus of a Whole Foods.
Providence has all of this plus an east coast corridor Amtrack station, amazing beaches and exploring (Narragansett, Jamestown, Block Island, Newport), beautiful coastal towns (Wickford, Barrington), and more than enough urbanity to keep you sane. The city likes and supports the arts. There is a philharmonic, a serious music school, and I believe a ballet company. There are great restaurants and awesome neighbourhood bars. There is live music of all kinds all over the place.
It is very visually appealing, with a contemporary downtown and a Federal university residential area called the East Side. They are separated by a river, which gets lit on fire once a year. Seriously. The whole thing is walkable and bikeable.
If I did not live here, I'd live there. There are, for me, no other contenders. Caveat: I lived in NYC for 18 years and London for 10, so I've done Gotham and I'm over that.
posted by DarlingBri at 2:35 PM on June 3, 2008
Really, what you're looking for may be a university town. This gives you a far wider field in the US than it did for us over here, but universities on both sides of the pond tend to mean arts, live music, cheap beer, and affordable rentals. In the US you usually get the bonus of a Whole Foods.
Providence has all of this plus an east coast corridor Amtrack station, amazing beaches and exploring (Narragansett, Jamestown, Block Island, Newport), beautiful coastal towns (Wickford, Barrington), and more than enough urbanity to keep you sane. The city likes and supports the arts. There is a philharmonic, a serious music school, and I believe a ballet company. There are great restaurants and awesome neighbourhood bars. There is live music of all kinds all over the place.
It is very visually appealing, with a contemporary downtown and a Federal university residential area called the East Side. They are separated by a river, which gets lit on fire once a year. Seriously. The whole thing is walkable and bikeable.
If I did not live here, I'd live there. There are, for me, no other contenders. Caveat: I lived in NYC for 18 years and London for 10, so I've done Gotham and I'm over that.
posted by DarlingBri at 2:35 PM on June 3, 2008
Pittsburgh!
It's cheap, friendly, beautiful (in my opinion, especially in the spring) and all-around awesome. It's also stuffed with colleges and universities. I love it. If it was a dude, I'd marry it.
posted by the littlest brussels sprout at 4:27 PM on June 3, 2008
It's cheap, friendly, beautiful (in my opinion, especially in the spring) and all-around awesome. It's also stuffed with colleges and universities. I love it. If it was a dude, I'd marry it.
posted by the littlest brussels sprout at 4:27 PM on June 3, 2008
Knoxville Tn might work for you, I pay $649 for a 2 bedroom 1200 sqft apartment, free parking, 2 pools ect. Asheville NC is a nice place too.
posted by meeshell at 7:17 PM on June 3, 2008 [1 favorite]
posted by meeshell at 7:17 PM on June 3, 2008 [1 favorite]
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