This was originally going to be about the brake lines of a 2006 Ford Taurus
September 11, 2007 5:46 PM Subscribe
How might you break a furnace, and make it look like an accident?
I live across the street from my in-laws. They own the rental property my wife and I reside in. Over the last three years our gas furnace has had a few problems, and my father-in-law always insists on hiring an old plummer friend to fix it (he's completely unreliable, and when he does show he always does a crappy job). For the past two winters, whenever the furnace would fail to start, I would have to go into the basement and hit, kick or wiggle the wiring to get it to start again. This is not fun. Especially at 2am. The plummer can't figure out what's wrong with it and so last summer, my frugal father-in-law bought a used furnace as a replacement, but it has yet to be installed because he can never get the cheap plummer to come to install it. My wife is not looking forward to this winter, as she and I will be working opposite shifts, and she refuses to enter our dank spider infested basement.
Over the course of this summer, while our furnace was still not being replaced, my sister-in-law moved in to the upstairs apartment. Her parents paid to have the floors refinished and for a brand new kitchen. We have tried not to be filled with jealous rage, but my wife's little sister has always gotten more attention and just about anything she wants (Including moving into the apartment with her "older" boyfriend, which her parents were dead set against. But now she gets the extreme home makeover? WTF?).
Today, the plummer shows up. Not surprisingly, he spent the entire day dealing with little sister's new kitchen. He's due to spend all day tomorrow doing much of the same. So my wife paid her father a visit and asked about our furnace. I mean, we DO pay rent. She came home in tears. Apparently our furnace "still works" and her sister is the priority because she pays more money in rent (which was the result of a bluff her parents made to dissuade her from moving in. She called the bluff, obviously). Our heat this winter is not on the top of his list.
I know the real solution here is to move out and get away from this black pit of dysfuncionality, but it's not an option right now. I've come to the conclusion that the only way to get the plummer in the basement to fix our furnace, is to break it entirely. Although I imagine I could get him to come quicker, if I broke my sister-in-law's furnace instead.
So how can I break something like that without leaving any physical evidence?
I live across the street from my in-laws. They own the rental property my wife and I reside in. Over the last three years our gas furnace has had a few problems, and my father-in-law always insists on hiring an old plummer friend to fix it (he's completely unreliable, and when he does show he always does a crappy job). For the past two winters, whenever the furnace would fail to start, I would have to go into the basement and hit, kick or wiggle the wiring to get it to start again. This is not fun. Especially at 2am. The plummer can't figure out what's wrong with it and so last summer, my frugal father-in-law bought a used furnace as a replacement, but it has yet to be installed because he can never get the cheap plummer to come to install it. My wife is not looking forward to this winter, as she and I will be working opposite shifts, and she refuses to enter our dank spider infested basement.
Over the course of this summer, while our furnace was still not being replaced, my sister-in-law moved in to the upstairs apartment. Her parents paid to have the floors refinished and for a brand new kitchen. We have tried not to be filled with jealous rage, but my wife's little sister has always gotten more attention and just about anything she wants (Including moving into the apartment with her "older" boyfriend, which her parents were dead set against. But now she gets the extreme home makeover? WTF?).
Today, the plummer shows up. Not surprisingly, he spent the entire day dealing with little sister's new kitchen. He's due to spend all day tomorrow doing much of the same. So my wife paid her father a visit and asked about our furnace. I mean, we DO pay rent. She came home in tears. Apparently our furnace "still works" and her sister is the priority because she pays more money in rent (which was the result of a bluff her parents made to dissuade her from moving in. She called the bluff, obviously). Our heat this winter is not on the top of his list.
I know the real solution here is to move out and get away from this black pit of dysfuncionality, but it's not an option right now. I've come to the conclusion that the only way to get the plummer in the basement to fix our furnace, is to break it entirely. Although I imagine I could get him to come quicker, if I broke my sister-in-law's furnace instead.
So how can I break something like that without leaving any physical evidence?
Do you have an actual written lease? That states that all apliances must be in working condition?
Also, most states have laws about what temperatures landlords have to keep properties in the winter - check that out. This dude sounds like he needs a bit of legalese shoved at hime to make him move on this.
posted by tristeza at 5:59 PM on September 11, 2007 [1 favorite]
Also, most states have laws about what temperatures landlords have to keep properties in the winter - check that out. This dude sounds like he needs a bit of legalese shoved at hime to make him move on this.
posted by tristeza at 5:59 PM on September 11, 2007 [1 favorite]
To the excellent advice above, I might add that fooling around with large, service-by-licensed-technicians-only natural gas appliances can't be very safe at all. Why can't you just call your own plumber?
posted by goingonit at 6:00 PM on September 11, 2007
posted by goingonit at 6:00 PM on September 11, 2007
The brake lines of a 2006 Ford Taurus?
Man, you sound like you need a massage.
Okay, how about this! It's not cold yet, so before your next rent check, sent a formal, spell-checked, polite letter to your landlord, reiterating that your furnace is unreliable, and that you require it to be fixed before cold weather strikes. If your city has a code for the heating of rental properties, mention it here.
If there's no response, your next rent check goes into a savings account. DO NOT SPEND IT. Put it aside. Instead of mailing or dropping off your check, you give a polite but firm follow-up letter that explains that until your furnace has been fixed (to code, if applicable), your rent checks will go into a separate account. As soon as the furnace has been fixed or replaced, they will be turned over to your landlord, and renting will continue amicably.
And then you immediately start plotting to move out, of course.
I am not a lawyer! The above is not legal advice! But if I were renting from my father-in-law and in your shoes, it's what I think I would do.
posted by thehmsbeagle at 6:00 PM on September 11, 2007 [2 favorites]
Man, you sound like you need a massage.
Okay, how about this! It's not cold yet, so before your next rent check, sent a formal, spell-checked, polite letter to your landlord, reiterating that your furnace is unreliable, and that you require it to be fixed before cold weather strikes. If your city has a code for the heating of rental properties, mention it here.
If there's no response, your next rent check goes into a savings account. DO NOT SPEND IT. Put it aside. Instead of mailing or dropping off your check, you give a polite but firm follow-up letter that explains that until your furnace has been fixed (to code, if applicable), your rent checks will go into a separate account. As soon as the furnace has been fixed or replaced, they will be turned over to your landlord, and renting will continue amicably.
And then you immediately start plotting to move out, of course.
I am not a lawyer! The above is not legal advice! But if I were renting from my father-in-law and in your shoes, it's what I think I would do.
posted by thehmsbeagle at 6:00 PM on September 11, 2007 [2 favorites]
Also, if that's your real name and real location in your profile, and you're plotting acts of violence against someone else's property, perhaps you would like to remove or disguise those identifiers?
posted by thehmsbeagle at 6:02 PM on September 11, 2007
posted by thehmsbeagle at 6:02 PM on September 11, 2007
Your conclusion is not a good one. Breaking your furnace and trying to trick your FIL is just playing his silly game which you realize is a "black pit of dysfunctionality." It's also illegal and will open a pretty nasty can of worms if you don't do a good job making it look like an accident. Don't deal with him like he's your father in law, deal with him like he's your landlord.
I don't know what what the rules are in NY, but in CA, if a landlord refuses to have a crucial appliance (a furnace would count) you can hire someone else to fix it and deduct the bill from your next month's rent. It's not as easy as just attaching the bill to your month's check, so check what rules your state has and take this route if you can.
This is a plumbing issue, and it would be a good idea to treat it as such. If you have to go down and fiddle with the furnace to make it do what it's supposed to do, that counts as "not working." Simply explain to your landlord what you plan on doing and let him be the one to contemplate irrational and unseemly ideas. What's the worst that could happen? He treats you and your wife like crap? Seems to me he's already doing that. You might as well get a working furnace out of the deal.
posted by Doublewhiskeycokenoice at 6:05 PM on September 11, 2007
I don't know what what the rules are in NY, but in CA, if a landlord refuses to have a crucial appliance (a furnace would count) you can hire someone else to fix it and deduct the bill from your next month's rent. It's not as easy as just attaching the bill to your month's check, so check what rules your state has and take this route if you can.
This is a plumbing issue, and it would be a good idea to treat it as such. If you have to go down and fiddle with the furnace to make it do what it's supposed to do, that counts as "not working." Simply explain to your landlord what you plan on doing and let him be the one to contemplate irrational and unseemly ideas. What's the worst that could happen? He treats you and your wife like crap? Seems to me he's already doing that. You might as well get a working furnace out of the deal.
posted by Doublewhiskeycokenoice at 6:05 PM on September 11, 2007
WTF is he calling a "plummer" (it's plum*b*er!) to fix an HVAC problem?
Make it so the heat from the furnace (you don't say if it's radiator heat, steam, hot water, forced air, what, so I can't recommend how methods) doesn't make it to the sis-in-laws space. It'll get fixed.
posted by notsnot at 6:10 PM on September 11, 2007
Make it so the heat from the furnace (you don't say if it's radiator heat, steam, hot water, forced air, what, so I can't recommend how methods) doesn't make it to the sis-in-laws space. It'll get fixed.
posted by notsnot at 6:10 PM on September 11, 2007
I know the real solution here is to move out and get away from this black pit of dysfuncionality
You've answered your own question.
posted by ambrosia at 6:17 PM on September 11, 2007
You've answered your own question.
posted by ambrosia at 6:17 PM on September 11, 2007
don't be an idiot, as satisfying as it might momentarily be. move.
posted by thinkingwoman at 6:18 PM on September 11, 2007 [1 favorite]
posted by thinkingwoman at 6:18 PM on September 11, 2007 [1 favorite]
In the spirit of those who complain when folks don't directly answer AskMe questions (and the Darwin Awards) here's some ideas, garnered from my personal adventures with furnace repair.
As with all appliances, you want to make sure the electricity and gas are off before you start tinkering with it. Seriously. Double check. Go upstairs and turn the unit on, and make sure it won't start before you mangle yourself. Then go up again and turn it off.
Many furnaces have a belt between the fan motor and the fan. If you tighten the adjustment of the belt, it'll eat the bearings on the motor or the fan. Also, many of them have hard-to-replace low-voltage control boards - If you attach a lamp cord securely to the power inputs, apply high voltage BRIEFLY, then reconnect it back the way it was, it'll look like a regular failure to normal repair types.
None of this will keep him from buying an even-worse replacement. The GOOD solutions to this problem are elsewhere in this thread.
posted by Orb2069 at 6:27 PM on September 11, 2007 [1 favorite]
As with all appliances, you want to make sure the electricity and gas are off before you start tinkering with it. Seriously. Double check. Go upstairs and turn the unit on, and make sure it won't start before you mangle yourself. Then go up again and turn it off.
Many furnaces have a belt between the fan motor and the fan. If you tighten the adjustment of the belt, it'll eat the bearings on the motor or the fan. Also, many of them have hard-to-replace low-voltage control boards - If you attach a lamp cord securely to the power inputs, apply high voltage BRIEFLY, then reconnect it back the way it was, it'll look like a regular failure to normal repair types.
None of this will keep him from buying an even-worse replacement. The GOOD solutions to this problem are elsewhere in this thread.
posted by Orb2069 at 6:27 PM on September 11, 2007 [1 favorite]
You don't owe rent for time when the furnace isn't working in most states. Your best option is to move because the typical advice is to sue for damages. I don't think you'll be wanting to do that.
posted by TeatimeGrommit at 6:50 PM on September 11, 2007 [1 favorite]
posted by TeatimeGrommit at 6:50 PM on September 11, 2007 [1 favorite]
Perhaps hire a licensed fixit person to come and just give an estimate to fix it. They usually don't charge for that if I remember correctly. Heck get several estimations in writing. Take that to the landlord. Maybe then he will understand that he is wasting his money on a fix it guy bandaging the problem rather than fix it properly...Once when I rented from a private individual once, I needed a small repair done, the landlord had me pay for it then just pay the difference for that months rent. I just gave him a copy of the receipt.
posted by meeshell at 7:22 PM on September 11, 2007
posted by meeshell at 7:22 PM on September 11, 2007
If you care about the relationship with your FIL, call and pay for your own technician. If you don't care about it, research your options under the lease and local renters rights.
Really though, I think you should just find some way to move out, even if it sucks. Not because 'OMG adults living with family are losers!' (which there's a faint whiff of above), but because this situation sounds really shitty and stressful. You may be kind of sticking it to them a little if you move out too - they might have to treat a non family tenant better and shell out some money.
posted by crabintheocean at 7:25 PM on September 11, 2007
Really though, I think you should just find some way to move out, even if it sucks. Not because 'OMG adults living with family are losers!' (which there's a faint whiff of above), but because this situation sounds really shitty and stressful. You may be kind of sticking it to them a little if you move out too - they might have to treat a non family tenant better and shell out some money.
posted by crabintheocean at 7:25 PM on September 11, 2007
Here is something that worked for me in the past with a (non-relative) landlord:
(1) Write a polite letter saying that you expect the furnace to be in working condition and to adequately supply heat to your apartment this winter.
(2) In that letter, clearly state that if, at any time, the furnace stops providing adequate heat, you will notify the landlord and expect that adequate heat be restored within 24 hours (or some other period of time that you think is fair).
(3) Also clearly state that, if no repair has been done in this time period, you will hire someone to perform the repair and deduct the cost from the next month's rent.
(4) Follow through on these clearly stated steps if and when the need arises, no matter how awkward it may feel.
I should caution that this strategy worked in a different state some years ago, so it may not necessarily be perfectly legal in your locale, so you may need to amend it somewhat. However, the benefit of this approach is that it outlines, ahead of time and in impersonal language, a course of action that you will take given specific circumstances, with potential financial ramifications for your landlord. This will help you to let go of all the interpersonal drama and treat this more like a landlord-tenant relationship.
posted by googly at 7:26 PM on September 11, 2007
(1) Write a polite letter saying that you expect the furnace to be in working condition and to adequately supply heat to your apartment this winter.
(2) In that letter, clearly state that if, at any time, the furnace stops providing adequate heat, you will notify the landlord and expect that adequate heat be restored within 24 hours (or some other period of time that you think is fair).
(3) Also clearly state that, if no repair has been done in this time period, you will hire someone to perform the repair and deduct the cost from the next month's rent.
(4) Follow through on these clearly stated steps if and when the need arises, no matter how awkward it may feel.
I should caution that this strategy worked in a different state some years ago, so it may not necessarily be perfectly legal in your locale, so you may need to amend it somewhat. However, the benefit of this approach is that it outlines, ahead of time and in impersonal language, a course of action that you will take given specific circumstances, with potential financial ramifications for your landlord. This will help you to let go of all the interpersonal drama and treat this more like a landlord-tenant relationship.
posted by googly at 7:26 PM on September 11, 2007
Is there treasure in the basement? No? Move.
posted by poweredbybeard at 7:37 PM on September 11, 2007
posted by poweredbybeard at 7:37 PM on September 11, 2007
Look in yellow pages, call plumber, deduct cost of plumber from rent, invite FIL over for a few beers, explain that you are a man and have to make provisions to take care of your wife, hand him bill for plumber and this months rent, wish him a good day.
posted by kanemano at 7:52 PM on September 11, 2007 [3 favorites]
posted by kanemano at 7:52 PM on September 11, 2007 [3 favorites]
AC to the control board as per Orb2069 was my first thought.
posted by trevyn at 7:55 PM on September 11, 2007
posted by trevyn at 7:55 PM on September 11, 2007
Ok this is rather sinister and probably won't work because I don't know anything about furnaces. But furnaces have natural gas right? Well the smell from natural gas, if I'm correct, is actually added as a safety measure. Now if you could get your hands on some of that additive, you could fake a really dangerous gas leak. Even better if you and the lil' sister share some air vents, I would release it near it so her apartment smells like gas and that can be traced to your apartment. Your inlaws will be so concerned up her being blown up they'll immediately have to fix your furnace.
I realize this is probably not feasible for many many reasons, but it was a fun idea to come up with.
posted by whoaali at 8:05 PM on September 11, 2007
I realize this is probably not feasible for many many reasons, but it was a fun idea to come up with.
posted by whoaali at 8:05 PM on September 11, 2007
Add poison to the furnace's wine. It'll never know what hit it.
But before you do that, get a grip man. Living in a place your in-laws own, even if you pay rent, is a recipe for trouble.
posted by IronLizard at 8:25 PM on September 11, 2007 [2 favorites]
But before you do that, get a grip man. Living in a place your in-laws own, even if you pay rent, is a recipe for trouble.
posted by IronLizard at 8:25 PM on September 11, 2007 [2 favorites]
Response by poster: Thanks for the positive comments.
I see there was some concern over the legality of such an action I was suggesting (the title was of course meant in jest). The way I look at it, it's already not working and the replacement has already been paid for. I would only be speeding up the inevitable.
No, we do not have a lease. And I wouldn't have asked for one for the same reason I won't pursue any of the excellent legal action that was suggested above. Despite how I feel about my father-in-law, he is family.
Like I said, and like some of you were smart to point out, moving out is the best solution to the larger problem. Unfortunately it's not something we can do at this time. We are working towards it though.
I will have to concede that sabotaging my own furnace would be very foolish, and that perhaps holding back the rent might be the smarter approach. Perhaps even using that money to hire an HVAC installer.
Thank you again for the creative solutions to my problem. I will update on what happens.
posted by sweetwildandmad at 8:25 PM on September 11, 2007
I see there was some concern over the legality of such an action I was suggesting (the title was of course meant in jest). The way I look at it, it's already not working and the replacement has already been paid for. I would only be speeding up the inevitable.
No, we do not have a lease. And I wouldn't have asked for one for the same reason I won't pursue any of the excellent legal action that was suggested above. Despite how I feel about my father-in-law, he is family.
Like I said, and like some of you were smart to point out, moving out is the best solution to the larger problem. Unfortunately it's not something we can do at this time. We are working towards it though.
I will have to concede that sabotaging my own furnace would be very foolish, and that perhaps holding back the rent might be the smarter approach. Perhaps even using that money to hire an HVAC installer.
Thank you again for the creative solutions to my problem. I will update on what happens.
posted by sweetwildandmad at 8:25 PM on September 11, 2007
Look, a furnace is a serious piece of equipment. Ive maintained one for an apartment. What you are asking is askin to asking "Teach me arson so I can set my FIL house on fire." In sitcoms your plan would backfire with hilarious consequences, in real life this is what happens:
1. You cause a gas leak. You and your wife die in your sleep or the house explodes while youre at work.
2. You screw with it, dont manage to break, it and use it all winter. One winter day your handiwork results in too much carbon monoxide. You and your wife die in your sleep.
3. You screw with it and get badly burned. You go to jail for arson.
4. You screw with it and your FIL sues you. Or you go to jail or arson. Or both.
5. You screw with it, break it, and any semi-competent hvac guy will know exactly what happened. You get sued, kicked out, or go to jail.
6. You screw with it, screw up the igniters, and it explodes at some random time. You go to jail for arson. Someone probably dies. You never get out of jail.
7. You screw with it, break the thermostat, and it overheats the water, exploding all the steamers. Everything you own is destroyed from the water. The floors are ruined. You probably go to jail.
8. You follow orbs advice and electrocute yourself.
etc etc.
There is no solution to this problem. Anyone who tells you there is is lying to you hoping you do something foolish they can read about at fark. FIL bullshit is not worth dying over.
posted by damn dirty ape at 9:02 PM on September 11, 2007
1. You cause a gas leak. You and your wife die in your sleep or the house explodes while youre at work.
2. You screw with it, dont manage to break, it and use it all winter. One winter day your handiwork results in too much carbon monoxide. You and your wife die in your sleep.
3. You screw with it and get badly burned. You go to jail for arson.
4. You screw with it and your FIL sues you. Or you go to jail or arson. Or both.
5. You screw with it, break it, and any semi-competent hvac guy will know exactly what happened. You get sued, kicked out, or go to jail.
6. You screw with it, screw up the igniters, and it explodes at some random time. You go to jail for arson. Someone probably dies. You never get out of jail.
7. You screw with it, break the thermostat, and it overheats the water, exploding all the steamers. Everything you own is destroyed from the water. The floors are ruined. You probably go to jail.
8. You follow orbs advice and electrocute yourself.
etc etc.
There is no solution to this problem. Anyone who tells you there is is lying to you hoping you do something foolish they can read about at fark. FIL bullshit is not worth dying over.
posted by damn dirty ape at 9:02 PM on September 11, 2007
Man up, call another plumber and get it fixed or have him install the other one, pay the nice man, and don't say a word to your FIL. Let your wife tell him. That'll make for an eventful Thanksgiving.
posted by BitterOldPunk at 9:17 PM on September 11, 2007
posted by BitterOldPunk at 9:17 PM on September 11, 2007
You don't say what part of NY you live in, but in NJ, they're required to provide this (scroll to #9). Basically from 10/1-5/1, they must provide a heating system that will maintain an ambient temp of 68 degrees.
So, short of moving out, withhold rent, get yourself an independent plumber, and deduct the cost of the labour to install the replacement unit from whatever it is you pay your FIL monthly.
Have you tried calling Con Ed (or whomever your gas/electric company is) to see if they will give you an estimate for the work? I think that once you have an estimate in hand, you will be in a better position to play hardball with your FIL. Either that, or head on over to Bed Bath and Beyond, get yourself an Aero bed and camp out on your SIL's lovely new tricked out hardwood floor.
posted by dancinglamb at 10:12 PM on September 11, 2007
So, short of moving out, withhold rent, get yourself an independent plumber, and deduct the cost of the labour to install the replacement unit from whatever it is you pay your FIL monthly.
Have you tried calling Con Ed (or whomever your gas/electric company is) to see if they will give you an estimate for the work? I think that once you have an estimate in hand, you will be in a better position to play hardball with your FIL. Either that, or head on over to Bed Bath and Beyond, get yourself an Aero bed and camp out on your SIL's lovely new tricked out hardwood floor.
posted by dancinglamb at 10:12 PM on September 11, 2007
Just found this:
Heating Requirements for NYC
posted by dancinglamb at 10:19 PM on September 11, 2007
Heating Requirements for NYC
posted by dancinglamb at 10:19 PM on September 11, 2007
Despite how I feel about my father-in-law, he is family.
Er, you're his family as well, yet he has no qualms about leaving you with no heat in the winter. Time to start either treating this like a landlord/tenant situation (as suggested above) or move (as suggested above.)
posted by davejay at 11:26 PM on September 11, 2007
Er, you're his family as well, yet he has no qualms about leaving you with no heat in the winter. Time to start either treating this like a landlord/tenant situation (as suggested above) or move (as suggested above.)
posted by davejay at 11:26 PM on September 11, 2007
I'm a landlord. Fixing a furnace is often something that is illegal to do if you are not a licensed HVAC professional.
That includes me.
That includes you.
That includes this "plumber" fellow, from what it sounds.
If the plumber is mucking about with HVAC on somebody else's property, not only is he putting your lives at risk, he might even be risking his own professional credentials. (I know that sounds like bathos to put them in that order, but that seems to be how he's prioritizing things.)
Also, withholding rent is generally legal, but must be done according to law. There are notices you must send (often by registered or certified mail) and there are limits to how much you can withhold. Check your state and local laws.
You need to send a letter saying that if they don't hire an HVAC pro to do the work in the next N days, you're calling the city. That may well be enough, because the city does not want half-assed furnace repairs in rental property (one hopes), and may begin applying its own considerable pressure.
But it may be psychologically healthier -- for everyone -- if you just move.
posted by dhartung at 11:30 PM on September 11, 2007 [2 favorites]
That includes me.
That includes you.
That includes this "plumber" fellow, from what it sounds.
If the plumber is mucking about with HVAC on somebody else's property, not only is he putting your lives at risk, he might even be risking his own professional credentials. (I know that sounds like bathos to put them in that order, but that seems to be how he's prioritizing things.)
Also, withholding rent is generally legal, but must be done according to law. There are notices you must send (often by registered or certified mail) and there are limits to how much you can withhold. Check your state and local laws.
You need to send a letter saying that if they don't hire an HVAC pro to do the work in the next N days, you're calling the city. That may well be enough, because the city does not want half-assed furnace repairs in rental property (one hopes), and may begin applying its own considerable pressure.
But it may be psychologically healthier -- for everyone -- if you just move.
posted by dhartung at 11:30 PM on September 11, 2007 [2 favorites]
kanemono has the right idea. This is an FIL issue, not a landlord issue.
Otherwise, if this was a modern, forced-air gas furnace, I know what I'd do to stop it. I'm quite fond of these kinds of furnaces, having learned how to handle them. They aren't that complex, far easier than computers, to be sure, and not filthy/greasy like car engines.
And, as someone pointed out above, FIL is your family, and you are his. He doesn't treat you appropriately. Call his ass out of bed at 2am to fix the furnace!
My strongest sympathy to you! I lived for 2 years in a house owned by my partner jointly w/his mother. She lived upstairs, with his worthless sister and her daughter, we lived downstairs. The trouble mostly ended when we moved across the country, and I didn't learn his ma (Brooklyn/Italian) was still smacking him around on the phone, but only when he was at work, until after he died of a heart attack at age 46 (and this definitely contributed to his early demise).
If you want to vent and get sympathy, my email is in profile :-/ I am more fortunate now, my in-laws are decent folks I enjoy spending time with.
posted by Goofyy at 1:23 AM on September 12, 2007
Otherwise, if this was a modern, forced-air gas furnace, I know what I'd do to stop it. I'm quite fond of these kinds of furnaces, having learned how to handle them. They aren't that complex, far easier than computers, to be sure, and not filthy/greasy like car engines.
And, as someone pointed out above, FIL is your family, and you are his. He doesn't treat you appropriately. Call his ass out of bed at 2am to fix the furnace!
My strongest sympathy to you! I lived for 2 years in a house owned by my partner jointly w/his mother. She lived upstairs, with his worthless sister and her daughter, we lived downstairs. The trouble mostly ended when we moved across the country, and I didn't learn his ma (Brooklyn/Italian) was still smacking him around on the phone, but only when he was at work, until after he died of a heart attack at age 46 (and this definitely contributed to his early demise).
If you want to vent and get sympathy, my email is in profile :-/ I am more fortunate now, my in-laws are decent folks I enjoy spending time with.
posted by Goofyy at 1:23 AM on September 12, 2007
I'm pretty sure that in NY state, you can arrange for the repairs yourself and then deduct the cost from your rent. This site covers the basics pretty well, as well as outlining NY Warranty of Habitability in general. (FYI: your in-laws have to provide you with working heat even if it isn't in the lease or you don't have a lease). I think the "repair and deduct" approach would be good for you to look into: it's sufficiently non-confrontational, you get to arrange the repairs (and therefore can schedule a reliable, licensed HVAC specialist rather than some sketchy plumber), and instead of trying to get money back from your in-laws you just deduct it from your rent. Just be sure to document everything (that is crucial) and call a legal services branch/lawyer if you have any questions. (Note: if you live in NYC the process might be different.)
Seriously though - don't do anything rash that could jeopardize your safety. There are avenues already in place to help you out of a situation like this. I know you consider your in-laws "family," but I know would never dream of letting anyone in my family go without heat in the winter if I could do anything about it. Your in-laws are the cause of your having to go without heat, and they're still not doing anything about it. Put simply: they're not treating you like family, and you need to stop giving them that leeway. And most importantly, you need to take care of the situation in a way that does not carry a serious risk of harming yourself or your wife.
IANAL.
posted by AV at 5:11 AM on September 12, 2007
Seriously though - don't do anything rash that could jeopardize your safety. There are avenues already in place to help you out of a situation like this. I know you consider your in-laws "family," but I know would never dream of letting anyone in my family go without heat in the winter if I could do anything about it. Your in-laws are the cause of your having to go without heat, and they're still not doing anything about it. Put simply: they're not treating you like family, and you need to stop giving them that leeway. And most importantly, you need to take care of the situation in a way that does not carry a serious risk of harming yourself or your wife.
IANAL.
posted by AV at 5:11 AM on September 12, 2007
My real suggestion, like that of everyone else, is to move out and not rent from your father-in-law. But if I were, say, writing a novel in which someone tries to sabotage a furnace without endangering anyone, I would have that character first turn the heat completely off at the thermostat, and then carefully disconnect the thermostat switch. Result: a seemingly fine furnace that just won't turn on, no matter what temperature appears on the thermostat dial.
posted by Faint of Butt at 7:35 AM on September 12, 2007
posted by Faint of Butt at 7:35 AM on September 12, 2007
I'd second the proposals to either pay for it yourself or move, with a strong push for the latter. I know it stinks, but it sounds best for all the relations involved.
posted by history is a weapon at 9:25 AM on September 12, 2007
posted by history is a weapon at 9:25 AM on September 12, 2007
I agree with move, but how about be patient?
It sounds like the other sister needs immediate help from the "plummer" to install her kitchen. Presumably, the plumber has limited time to help out his friend, your FIL for cheap. Also presumably, you are renting cheap, so putting up with an unreliable plumber is a trade off.
Perhaps mentioning you need the replacement installed by X date if the cheap plumber can do it, otherwise your FIL can call somebody else?
I think you mean you have already waited a year for this, if so, I wouldn't think your FIL could argue that it is unreasonable to get an alternative installer if his cheap guy can't do it by date X.
If by 'last summer' you actually mean a couple of months ago, then I agree with your FIL, the delay in installation hasn't actually inconvenienced you yet.
posted by bystander at 11:41 PM on September 16, 2007
It sounds like the other sister needs immediate help from the "plummer" to install her kitchen. Presumably, the plumber has limited time to help out his friend, your FIL for cheap. Also presumably, you are renting cheap, so putting up with an unreliable plumber is a trade off.
Perhaps mentioning you need the replacement installed by X date if the cheap plumber can do it, otherwise your FIL can call somebody else?
I think you mean you have already waited a year for this, if so, I wouldn't think your FIL could argue that it is unreasonable to get an alternative installer if his cheap guy can't do it by date X.
If by 'last summer' you actually mean a couple of months ago, then I agree with your FIL, the delay in installation hasn't actually inconvenienced you yet.
posted by bystander at 11:41 PM on September 16, 2007
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Here you go: take a sledgehammer to it. But that would not be right. Nothing anyone could suggest here to break the furnace "without leaving any physical evicence" would be right, or even legal.
Get a grip. Learn how to spell plumber. And move out.
posted by beagle at 5:53 PM on September 11, 2007 [9 favorites]