Pregnant, Chinese, and Frustrated with the System
March 6, 2007 5:54 PM Subscribe
Immigration law, pregnancy, and aid: I've got a Chinese friend living in San Fransisco, about to have a baby, with a visa that expires in April, a due date somewhere in June, a boyfriend with permanent residency (also Chinese) who doesn't really want to get married (neither does she at this point), and unappealing options back in the home country. So San Fran residents, China law experts, and California lawyers, we need ya.
Ah, the joys of trying to live your life in a mire of immigration laws.
My friend, who I met back in 2005 in Tianjin, moved to San Fran to be with her boyfriend in 2006. He was a graduate student, and then went into importing/exporting. I'm honestly not sure what kind of visa she's on, but somehow she's managed to stay for this long without breaking any laws, and she's not too keen on doing so now. Her visa, which is a "b1b2" (I myself am completely ignorant about any of this visa stuff in the US), expires in April, and I'm not sure of possibilities to extend it, but I'm in the middle of researching that and will post updates as I find info. They're still together, and as couples are wont to do at times, they've managed to generate a baby.
The problem is this: if she comes back to China to have the baby, and they're not married, and she has a baby, it's against the law, and what they'll do is both fine her and deny her child (and possibly her, depending on the nature of the "infraction") a residence permit (there's a residency system in the PRC called the hukou, which determines where you're legally allowed to live and get social services from). Based on what I know about the law, the fines are steep and not having a hukou sets the kid up for a lifetime of administrative grief and paying out of pocket for things people with hukous get for free (like public school). Essentially, this could cripple the kid's opportunities, because the parents aren't awash in cash, nor will they be anytime soon, what with parents to take care of (gotta love that children-as-social-security thing they do over here). I also am not an expert in these laws, but as soon as I get in touch with my lawyer pals over here I will be. As far as I know though, if the child is born a US citizen, he'll qualify for some resettlement programs the Chinese government has for overseas Chinese and be able to get his hukou or equivalent social benefits that way.
They don't really want to get married yet, because, well...there's a whole host of personal issues that might make it a bad marriage and they're trying to work that out. At any rate, she doesn't want to settle in the US, but she does want to give this relationship an honest try, and I commend her for that. She also basically only speaks survival English. Between that, the pregnancy, and the unpermanent nature of her visit to the US, getting a job and the accompanying work visa isn't an appealing option either.
In addition to all that, there's the fact that hospitals in the US are expensive ($10,000 for all the necessary care, she tells me) and she never got insurance. The boyfriend's remitted most of his savings to his parents so they can buy a house. So once we get this visa thing settled, she's also looking at massive hospital bills.
Is there any way out of this debacle? Any aid she can get? Any advocacy groups we can put her in touch with? Something?
Ah, the joys of trying to live your life in a mire of immigration laws.
My friend, who I met back in 2005 in Tianjin, moved to San Fran to be with her boyfriend in 2006. He was a graduate student, and then went into importing/exporting. I'm honestly not sure what kind of visa she's on, but somehow she's managed to stay for this long without breaking any laws, and she's not too keen on doing so now. Her visa, which is a "b1b2" (I myself am completely ignorant about any of this visa stuff in the US), expires in April, and I'm not sure of possibilities to extend it, but I'm in the middle of researching that and will post updates as I find info. They're still together, and as couples are wont to do at times, they've managed to generate a baby.
The problem is this: if she comes back to China to have the baby, and they're not married, and she has a baby, it's against the law, and what they'll do is both fine her and deny her child (and possibly her, depending on the nature of the "infraction") a residence permit (there's a residency system in the PRC called the hukou, which determines where you're legally allowed to live and get social services from). Based on what I know about the law, the fines are steep and not having a hukou sets the kid up for a lifetime of administrative grief and paying out of pocket for things people with hukous get for free (like public school). Essentially, this could cripple the kid's opportunities, because the parents aren't awash in cash, nor will they be anytime soon, what with parents to take care of (gotta love that children-as-social-security thing they do over here). I also am not an expert in these laws, but as soon as I get in touch with my lawyer pals over here I will be. As far as I know though, if the child is born a US citizen, he'll qualify for some resettlement programs the Chinese government has for overseas Chinese and be able to get his hukou or equivalent social benefits that way.
They don't really want to get married yet, because, well...there's a whole host of personal issues that might make it a bad marriage and they're trying to work that out. At any rate, she doesn't want to settle in the US, but she does want to give this relationship an honest try, and I commend her for that. She also basically only speaks survival English. Between that, the pregnancy, and the unpermanent nature of her visit to the US, getting a job and the accompanying work visa isn't an appealing option either.
In addition to all that, there's the fact that hospitals in the US are expensive ($10,000 for all the necessary care, she tells me) and she never got insurance. The boyfriend's remitted most of his savings to his parents so they can buy a house. So once we get this visa thing settled, she's also looking at massive hospital bills.
Is there any way out of this debacle? Any aid she can get? Any advocacy groups we can put her in touch with? Something?
One place to start might be the Asian Pacific American Legal Center, which which offers pro bono legal services. They're in LA, but I bet they can point you to someone doing similar work in the Bay Area. Good luck!
posted by hwickline at 6:35 PM on March 6, 2007
posted by hwickline at 6:35 PM on March 6, 2007
One thing about returning to China: she's about to bump into a stage in her pregnancy after which most airlines won't let her fly.
posted by The corpse in the library at 7:07 PM on March 6, 2007
posted by The corpse in the library at 7:07 PM on March 6, 2007
I couldn't begin to say on the legal/immigration issues, but the 10K for having the baby sounds like an expense that could get reduced with some footwork. The out-of-pocket costs for a hospital delivery with the nurse-midwifery practice I went through four years ago were around 3K (barring any complications, of course) so 10K sounds high to me. Granted, that was NY, not Cali, but still. I would almost guarantee she'd pay more going into a hospital through emergency than she would if she set up care beforehand, and she can work out payment plans with her care provider and the hospital. Try looking around for providers used to working with low-income patients (my midwives had a bunch of clients without insurance) and price-compare. This will be harder the closer she gets to the due date - how has she been handling her prenatal care? (Nurse-midwives take on low-risk pregnancies and are usually cheaper than OB/GYNs if she can find a practice there willing to take her this far along.)
posted by Melinika at 7:32 PM on March 6, 2007
posted by Melinika at 7:32 PM on March 6, 2007
There's also the Asian Law Caucus in San Francisco which might be able to provide some help. Per their website, they have an Immigration Clinic on the first and third Thursdays of each month.
From what you've said, it sounds like the best situation for the future baby is to either be born in the U.S. and/or for the parents to marry. As far as hospital bills are concerned, if she's planning on returning to China anytime soon after the child is born, I wouldn't worry so much... I doubt the hospital's bill collectors will be chasing her all the way back to China. Otherwise, is there any possibility of the two of them agreeing to a "temporary" civil marriage with the understanding that it's primarily for the benefit of the baby and/or immigration status. Is it easy to get divorced in China? Would it affect the child's China benefits if the parents are married at birth but subsequently divorce?
posted by mahamandarava at 7:36 PM on March 6, 2007
From what you've said, it sounds like the best situation for the future baby is to either be born in the U.S. and/or for the parents to marry. As far as hospital bills are concerned, if she's planning on returning to China anytime soon after the child is born, I wouldn't worry so much... I doubt the hospital's bill collectors will be chasing her all the way back to China. Otherwise, is there any possibility of the two of them agreeing to a "temporary" civil marriage with the understanding that it's primarily for the benefit of the baby and/or immigration status. Is it easy to get divorced in China? Would it affect the child's China benefits if the parents are married at birth but subsequently divorce?
posted by mahamandarava at 7:36 PM on March 6, 2007
When my son was born I was broke. Unemployed. Just barely making rent and / food through creative use of credit cards. My expenses for the birth, midwifery leading up to it, classes etc... was 0$. This was in WA / Seattle by the way.
posted by Riemann at 8:04 PM on March 6, 2007
posted by Riemann at 8:04 PM on March 6, 2007
Some midwives (and possibly medical practices) have sliding scale fees for delivering a low risk pregnancy. Not all midwives are associated with hospitals and may have more latitude in fee structure. Contact a midwifery association? websites? Much of this is local I know (and I'm not in that vicinity)
posted by kch at 8:19 PM on March 6, 2007
posted by kch at 8:19 PM on March 6, 2007
Not just midwives, check with Planned Parenthood. They handle the whole spectrum of reproductive services. And regardless of where she's going to be when she has the baby, she should be seeing someone for prenatal care now. They have a sliding scale depending on income, and it's quite reasonable.
posted by Kellydamnit at 8:34 PM on March 6, 2007
posted by Kellydamnit at 8:34 PM on March 6, 2007
Check out some of the Family Health Insurance programs on this page: http://www.ihps-ca.org/resources/ca_c_h_programs.html Some of these have no immigration requirements except California residency.
posted by firstdrop at 8:41 PM on March 6, 2007
posted by firstdrop at 8:41 PM on March 6, 2007
Medi-Cal covers virtually any low-income pregnant woman in the state. Citizenship/residency is not required.
posted by nakedcodemonkey at 10:13 PM on March 6, 2007
posted by nakedcodemonkey at 10:13 PM on March 6, 2007
Disclaimer: This is not official legal advice. Please go see an immigration lawyer.
I practice as an immigration law attorney, and unfortunately, your friend likely has no recourse to stay in the U.S. without getting married.
The child is not enough on its own to keep her here. She needs to talk to her boyfriend and get married. Even though he's only a green card holder, she can stay as his spouse. As husband and wife, they could also show how much hardship her and her child would face if sent back to China without friend's lover/kid's dad, and possibly get a waiver that would allow her to stay in spite of any violations of the immigration laws.
You also said she's on a B1/B2. I'm not sure if she was pregnant when she got here, but B1/B2 is a visitor visa and only entitles the holder up to six months of consecutive stay in the U.S. before they have to go back to their home country. So, I'm not sure if she went overseas for a few weeks and came back. If she didn't, then she has overstayed and is out of status. If this is indeed the case, and she doesn't get married to boyfriend, she faces either a 3 year or 10 year bar from re-entering the U.S. once she leaves. The amount of the bar depends on whether she's overstayed by less than 6 months or over 1 year.
I know it sounds bad, but it can be sorted. Just tell her that she and boyfriend need to sit down and really talk about this. They also have the baby's welfare to think about now.
posted by reenum at 6:14 AM on March 7, 2007 [1 favorite]
I practice as an immigration law attorney, and unfortunately, your friend likely has no recourse to stay in the U.S. without getting married.
The child is not enough on its own to keep her here. She needs to talk to her boyfriend and get married. Even though he's only a green card holder, she can stay as his spouse. As husband and wife, they could also show how much hardship her and her child would face if sent back to China without friend's lover/kid's dad, and possibly get a waiver that would allow her to stay in spite of any violations of the immigration laws.
You also said she's on a B1/B2. I'm not sure if she was pregnant when she got here, but B1/B2 is a visitor visa and only entitles the holder up to six months of consecutive stay in the U.S. before they have to go back to their home country. So, I'm not sure if she went overseas for a few weeks and came back. If she didn't, then she has overstayed and is out of status. If this is indeed the case, and she doesn't get married to boyfriend, she faces either a 3 year or 10 year bar from re-entering the U.S. once she leaves. The amount of the bar depends on whether she's overstayed by less than 6 months or over 1 year.
I know it sounds bad, but it can be sorted. Just tell her that she and boyfriend need to sit down and really talk about this. They also have the baby's welfare to think about now.
posted by reenum at 6:14 AM on March 7, 2007 [1 favorite]
saythis,
If getting married is just about the visa, marry her yourself.
Note however that my uncle’s wife has had to return to her native Vienna every six months to renew her visa... since, oh, about eight years now. Still no green card. Two American-born children, married to an American resident.
posted by kika at 7:35 AM on March 7, 2007
If getting married is just about the visa, marry her yourself.
Note however that my uncle’s wife has had to return to her native Vienna every six months to renew her visa... since, oh, about eight years now. Still no green card. Two American-born children, married to an American resident.
posted by kika at 7:35 AM on March 7, 2007
If you take kika's advice, consult an attorney before marrying her. It's my understanding that the law automatically makes a husband financially responsible for any children born during the marriage -- whether he's the biological father or not. Also, if the marriage smells like immigration fraud, your attempt at a good deed could backfire for her.
posted by nakedcodemonkey at 10:56 AM on March 7, 2007
posted by nakedcodemonkey at 10:56 AM on March 7, 2007
nakedcodemonkey makes a good point about visa fraud, and it's also a reason why you likely shouldn't marry her yourself.
The first thing USCIS looks at is whether the marriage is a legitimate one. They want lots of evidence that the marriage genuine. Things like evidence of joint back accounts, leases, e-mails to each other, photos with each other and with family, etc.
She likely has all of this and more with her child's father. The only issue is convincing him to marry her.
posted by reenum at 2:09 PM on March 7, 2007
The first thing USCIS looks at is whether the marriage is a legitimate one. They want lots of evidence that the marriage genuine. Things like evidence of joint back accounts, leases, e-mails to each other, photos with each other and with family, etc.
She likely has all of this and more with her child's father. The only issue is convincing him to marry her.
posted by reenum at 2:09 PM on March 7, 2007
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Is she trying to immigrate, or just stay long enough to have the baby? Because if it's the latter, they could probably just apply for her to stay - it wouldn't matter if she got turned down, because it would almost certainly take them longer than three months to get to her case (unless she fills out the paperwork incorrectly, and then they return it pretty quickly so you can have another go). IANAL so definitely triple-check this, but my understanding is that if you're already in the country and your status is Pending, you are allowed to stay until they get to you.
Of course she'd have to pay the hospital fees, but they have payment plans - they won't refuse to deliver her baby because she doesn't have the money up front - and it seems to me that having the baby in China would be way more expensive if it means she has to pay for its schooling from primary on.
posted by joannemerriam at 6:31 PM on March 6, 2007