How to seek asylum?
February 12, 2025 6:58 AM Subscribe
I’m Canadian, and I’m growing increasingly worried that some time in the next four years or so, a hostile and powerful country might invade Canada. What steps can I take to set my family up to flee the country if necessary?
I think the best place to flee to might be Australia - I have some extended family there. But I’ve never been there and wouldn’t know where to go or where to start. Could I exchange some CDN to AUD and hold it in a bank account there?
So, if you were planning to flee your country due to an invasion, how would you prep for this? I have 3 small children. And I have access to around $100kCDN in quick cash if I need, though it’s currently sitting in the bank. Should I pull some out now and put it under the mattress?
I also welcome reassuring comments to help quiet my anxiety here. I feel like I’m the only one I know who is worried or preoccupied about this possible outcome. Am I just being paranoid? Or am I being proactive?
I think the best place to flee to might be Australia - I have some extended family there. But I’ve never been there and wouldn’t know where to go or where to start. Could I exchange some CDN to AUD and hold it in a bank account there?
So, if you were planning to flee your country due to an invasion, how would you prep for this? I have 3 small children. And I have access to around $100kCDN in quick cash if I need, though it’s currently sitting in the bank. Should I pull some out now and put it under the mattress?
I also welcome reassuring comments to help quiet my anxiety here. I feel like I’m the only one I know who is worried or preoccupied about this possible outcome. Am I just being paranoid? Or am I being proactive?
This is my speculative fiction answer.
First, I think the most likely war will be economic, and then also probably an information war similar to Russia interfering in elections. So strengthening your own ability to navigate through a recession or a depression is probably a better 'spend' for your anxiety-driven-hours than trying to figure out how to flee. In my family I have a 19 year old who is on a term off and he's taking woodworking and first aid, because he wants to, but also those are pretty great practical skills for life regardless.
Also on the practical end, one thing to remember is that when you're fleeing, it depends on which countries are accepting refugees (see: Ukraine.) So I wouldn't put money in an account in a particular country foreign to me because that might make it more difficult to move around, unless it's something like a Swiss bank account that exists in order to make money easier to move around. But see my point above - I think it's more likely that more of us will lose our jobs, and those of us with jobs will have to contribute more for EI etc., than that your money needs to be highly mobile worldwide.
Second, letting Mad King Donnie (thank you Canadaland) rule your thoughts is a tough one. I live right on the cliffs facing the US so if the US navy steams across my home will literally be first bombed and like many Gen-Xers, it is a big part of my net worth (if I'm not in an American internment camp inside Canada first as I'm a dual citizen.) My oldest is conscription-aged and my youngest will be during this President's term. So I do have those thoughts. But that is how we lose. What we need to do is be strong as a country right now, so please do what makes you strong here - build your community, extend your skills when you can, take care of your beautiful kids and sit out in the sun with them and enjoy our country.
posted by warriorqueen at 7:18 AM on February 12 [9 favorites]
First, I think the most likely war will be economic, and then also probably an information war similar to Russia interfering in elections. So strengthening your own ability to navigate through a recession or a depression is probably a better 'spend' for your anxiety-driven-hours than trying to figure out how to flee. In my family I have a 19 year old who is on a term off and he's taking woodworking and first aid, because he wants to, but also those are pretty great practical skills for life regardless.
Also on the practical end, one thing to remember is that when you're fleeing, it depends on which countries are accepting refugees (see: Ukraine.) So I wouldn't put money in an account in a particular country foreign to me because that might make it more difficult to move around, unless it's something like a Swiss bank account that exists in order to make money easier to move around. But see my point above - I think it's more likely that more of us will lose our jobs, and those of us with jobs will have to contribute more for EI etc., than that your money needs to be highly mobile worldwide.
Second, letting Mad King Donnie (thank you Canadaland) rule your thoughts is a tough one. I live right on the cliffs facing the US so if the US navy steams across my home will literally be first bombed and like many Gen-Xers, it is a big part of my net worth (if I'm not in an American internment camp inside Canada first as I'm a dual citizen.) My oldest is conscription-aged and my youngest will be during this President's term. So I do have those thoughts. But that is how we lose. What we need to do is be strong as a country right now, so please do what makes you strong here - build your community, extend your skills when you can, take care of your beautiful kids and sit out in the sun with them and enjoy our country.
posted by warriorqueen at 7:18 AM on February 12 [9 favorites]
I'm Canadian by birth, but entitled to a UK passport through my dad. I've had one before and have been considering re-applying, although risking putting my cat in quarantine doesn't appeal.
Supporting parties likely to hold the line against economic incursions is probably a better bet than putting money under the mattress. There's a small but noisy minority in Canada who would love to be living in the 51st state, and some of them have had the ear of the Tories. Let's push back against that, shall we?
posted by zadcat at 7:28 AM on February 12 [7 favorites]
Supporting parties likely to hold the line against economic incursions is probably a better bet than putting money under the mattress. There's a small but noisy minority in Canada who would love to be living in the 51st state, and some of them have had the ear of the Tories. Let's push back against that, shall we?
posted by zadcat at 7:28 AM on February 12 [7 favorites]
Keep in mind that many countries limit the amount of cash you're allowed to cross the border with, as an anti-money-laundering thing.
It's also worth thinking about what exact threats you're protecting yourself against. Are you worried about the Canadian government seizing your assets, or making it illegal to send your assets overseas? About specific Canadian banks collapsing? About CDN quickly losing value (a.k.a. hyperinflation)? The ways you protect yourself against these things are different.
posted by Birds, snakes, and aeroplanes at 7:36 AM on February 12 [3 favorites]
It's also worth thinking about what exact threats you're protecting yourself against. Are you worried about the Canadian government seizing your assets, or making it illegal to send your assets overseas? About specific Canadian banks collapsing? About CDN quickly losing value (a.k.a. hyperinflation)? The ways you protect yourself against these things are different.
posted by Birds, snakes, and aeroplanes at 7:36 AM on February 12 [3 favorites]
zadcat, just to say: it's now pretty easy to bring a cat into the UK without risk of quarantine if you do the prep beforehand. I brought a cat and a dog in and it was fine.
posted by Rhedyn at 7:49 AM on February 12 [3 favorites]
posted by Rhedyn at 7:49 AM on February 12 [3 favorites]
More generally: getting out in a total emergency and leaving the country in an organized way are two different projects. It may make sense two have two or three different plans, one for "oops, people are actually shooting each other right now" and one for "we have a few months to plan but shit looks increasingly bad" and maybe one in between.
The "oops, actual shooting" plan, to be useful, should be pretty fleshed-out. The other ones can be vague ideas.
I don't think it makes you paranoid to have those plans. I do think unless there's an imminent threat, they can be like a fire extinguisher: get a good one, check every once in a while to make sure it's still good, otherwise don't spend a bunch of time thinking about it.
posted by Birds, snakes, and aeroplanes at 7:57 AM on February 12 [1 favorite]
The "oops, actual shooting" plan, to be useful, should be pretty fleshed-out. The other ones can be vague ideas.
I don't think it makes you paranoid to have those plans. I do think unless there's an imminent threat, they can be like a fire extinguisher: get a good one, check every once in a while to make sure it's still good, otherwise don't spend a bunch of time thinking about it.
posted by Birds, snakes, and aeroplanes at 7:57 AM on February 12 [1 favorite]
Since you said you're welcoming reassuring comments, here's mine:
I'm in the US, and I'm very alarmed and worried about a lot of things that are happening now and may happen in the next four years. I'm not really worried about war with Canada. The things that worry me are things that can be done by either one person or a small group of people. My feeling is that too many people would have to go along with an invasion for it to happen. My sense from down here is that this is just some crazy shit that he's saying to try to get a better trade deal.
Now if y'all wanted to grab New York state as an additional province, I for one would greet you as liberators.
posted by Ragged Richard at 7:59 AM on February 12 [26 favorites]
I'm in the US, and I'm very alarmed and worried about a lot of things that are happening now and may happen in the next four years. I'm not really worried about war with Canada. The things that worry me are things that can be done by either one person or a small group of people. My feeling is that too many people would have to go along with an invasion for it to happen. My sense from down here is that this is just some crazy shit that he's saying to try to get a better trade deal.
Now if y'all wanted to grab New York state as an additional province, I for one would greet you as liberators.
posted by Ragged Richard at 7:59 AM on February 12 [26 favorites]
My view as a dual citizen who has watched news on both sides of the border closely for years:
This is actually really low -- really low -- on the list of things likely to happen. He likes to talk. He likes to get good deals. He likes to gain leverage. I don't see a sustained and strong movement to actually annex Canada.
This is, with all respect to my fellow Canadians, the kind of statement that gets a lot of oxygen in Canada because, "hey! he mentioned us!" And, yes, it would be great to support political positions that give no comfort to this nonsense. And obviously it would be great if he mentioned us NOT in the context of annexing us.
But if it helps quiet your anxiety, consider that he is full of shit.
posted by fruitslinger at 8:42 AM on February 12 [16 favorites]
This is actually really low -- really low -- on the list of things likely to happen. He likes to talk. He likes to get good deals. He likes to gain leverage. I don't see a sustained and strong movement to actually annex Canada.
This is, with all respect to my fellow Canadians, the kind of statement that gets a lot of oxygen in Canada because, "hey! he mentioned us!" And, yes, it would be great to support political positions that give no comfort to this nonsense. And obviously it would be great if he mentioned us NOT in the context of annexing us.
But if it helps quiet your anxiety, consider that he is full of shit.
posted by fruitslinger at 8:42 AM on February 12 [16 favorites]
We're not thrilled Trump mentioned us, fruitslinger. We've just watched over the years as he has said he's going to do some awful thing, followed by everyone chiming in saying he'd never do that awful thing, long established norms would hold him back from doing the awful thing, the judiciary or the armed forces would stop him doing the awful thing, he was just making noise and trying to spook people by mentioning the awful thing.
And then, he does the awful thing.
Please don't try to normalize what Trump is doing to his own country and trying to do to the rest of the world.
posted by zadcat at 9:49 AM on February 12 [14 favorites]
And then, he does the awful thing.
Please don't try to normalize what Trump is doing to his own country and trying to do to the rest of the world.
posted by zadcat at 9:49 AM on February 12 [14 favorites]
Most people won't get to leave, so many people will be staying and fighting regardless what happens. But what has happened so far is mostly that a bunch of exhausting messes have been made that will eventually have to be cleaned up. I'm not saying harm hasn't been done, but what's happening right now is not refugee-level disruption. Like, I spoke plenty of doom in advance of inauguration and at this point I'd at best rate this as a Three Stooges Coup that's going to run out of steam against even the weak-sauce North American version of resistance.
I do think it's embarrassing, on the world stage, the number of North Americans who have not exhausted a single search engine search saying "I guess I'll go to Australia! I've got a passport and some AUD$." Have you googled Australia politics at all? Looked at a map? Looked up a single bit of information about asylum in that country and what they do to poor people who want it? That's a line you want to cut?
(I have the same questions about the UK, so slow down before you pivot. They were SO RACIST they ejected themselves from the continent-wide trade union and aren't going to be able to defend themselves when some other emerging superpower comes for them. We also share pretty much all the same oligarchs.)
I guess my number one piece of advice is that the answers to your questions can be obtained with your keyboard and once you get them you will understand why asking out loud is a poor first decision.
You're going to want to work on a Plan B where you stay, because that is likely your only option.
posted by Lyn Never at 10:20 AM on February 12 [10 favorites]
I do think it's embarrassing, on the world stage, the number of North Americans who have not exhausted a single search engine search saying "I guess I'll go to Australia! I've got a passport and some AUD$." Have you googled Australia politics at all? Looked at a map? Looked up a single bit of information about asylum in that country and what they do to poor people who want it? That's a line you want to cut?
(I have the same questions about the UK, so slow down before you pivot. They were SO RACIST they ejected themselves from the continent-wide trade union and aren't going to be able to defend themselves when some other emerging superpower comes for them. We also share pretty much all the same oligarchs.)
I guess my number one piece of advice is that the answers to your questions can be obtained with your keyboard and once you get them you will understand why asking out loud is a poor first decision.
You're going to want to work on a Plan B where you stay, because that is likely your only option.
posted by Lyn Never at 10:20 AM on February 12 [10 favorites]
also welcome reassuring comments
First Peoples helped defeat an earlier invasion [warmuseum.ca]
posted by HearHere at 10:54 AM on February 12 [2 favorites]
First Peoples helped defeat an earlier invasion [warmuseum.ca]
posted by HearHere at 10:54 AM on February 12 [2 favorites]
Our super stupid Prez says many things just to rile people up, so i wouldn't be too worried that an invasion is part of his plan. Of the many things he is, a warmonger isn't really one of them. He really really wants a Nobel Peace Prize (cause Obama has one!), so making war would undermine that.
Sure, he's trying to get loyalists in the military, but it's also unlikely that any strategist will agree that an incursion into the north will yield anything but grief.
posted by OHenryPacey at 11:01 AM on February 12 [1 favorite]
Sure, he's trying to get loyalists in the military, but it's also unlikely that any strategist will agree that an incursion into the north will yield anything but grief.
posted by OHenryPacey at 11:01 AM on February 12 [1 favorite]
frankly there's a lot of other stuff to be worried about first. i don't know if that's reassuring or not.
posted by AlbertCalavicci at 11:38 AM on February 12 [1 favorite]
posted by AlbertCalavicci at 11:38 AM on February 12 [1 favorite]
I think the big problem is that the only country we share an accessible land border with is the USA so you'd be flying or taking a boat to whichever country you'd want to escape to and I'd imagine there would be many people with similar thoughts if an invasion actually looked imminent. My spouse and kids are Japanese citizens have family/support there so I guess that would be where we'd bolt to if we had to leave but I don't see myself abandoning my country. I don't see myself being particularly useful to its defence either but sometimes numbers are enough.
Practically speaking I'd look into seeing if you are eligible for citizenship in another country as they'd be able to help you once you managed to make it out of North America. Also, maybe move to Newfoundland or PEI so that you can more easily take a boat to the French Islands off the coast.
posted by any portmanteau in a storm at 12:12 PM on February 12
Practically speaking I'd look into seeing if you are eligible for citizenship in another country as they'd be able to help you once you managed to make it out of North America. Also, maybe move to Newfoundland or PEI so that you can more easily take a boat to the French Islands off the coast.
posted by any portmanteau in a storm at 12:12 PM on February 12
I think the big problem is that the only country we share an accessible land border with is the USA so you'd be flying or taking a boat to whichever country you'd want to escape to and I'd imagine there would be many people with similar thoughts if an invasion actually looked imminent.
Seconding this. I've been gaming out how to flee the US since approximately kindergarten (probably don't tell your dual citizen kids that's why they have two birth certificates...) and step one has always been "get to Canada" (well, except I now live closer to the Mexican border).
posted by hoyland at 12:30 PM on February 12 [1 favorite]
Seconding this. I've been gaming out how to flee the US since approximately kindergarten (probably don't tell your dual citizen kids that's why they have two birth certificates...) and step one has always been "get to Canada" (well, except I now live closer to the Mexican border).
posted by hoyland at 12:30 PM on February 12 [1 favorite]
We've just watched over the years as he has said he's going to do some awful thing, followed by everyone chiming in saying he'd never do that awful thing, long established norms would hold him back from doing the awful thing, the judiciary or the armed forces would stop him doing the awful thing, he was just making noise and trying to spook people by mentioning the awful thing.
And then, he does the awful thing.
Please don't try to normalize what Trump is doing to his own country and trying to do to the rest of the world.
I don't think anyone here is normalizing Trump or what he's doing.
But the number of awful things he does is much smaller than the number of awful things he says he might do.
Obviously, the trick is in figuring out which things he might actually do, and which are bullshit. But I'd agree with others here that the U.S. invading Canada is extremely far down on the list of probable occurrences. There is no real constituency for this, even among his supporters.
posted by Artifice_Eternity at 12:55 PM on February 12 [4 favorites]
And then, he does the awful thing.
Please don't try to normalize what Trump is doing to his own country and trying to do to the rest of the world.
I don't think anyone here is normalizing Trump or what he's doing.
But the number of awful things he does is much smaller than the number of awful things he says he might do.
Obviously, the trick is in figuring out which things he might actually do, and which are bullshit. But I'd agree with others here that the U.S. invading Canada is extremely far down on the list of probable occurrences. There is no real constituency for this, even among his supporters.
posted by Artifice_Eternity at 12:55 PM on February 12 [4 favorites]
For our American Mefites - to clarify we’re not excited to be mentioned in this context. We’re mad, and terrified, because like Alderaan we’re peaceful and have no (substantial) weapons with which to defend ourselves. We’re easy pickings. There I said the quiet part out loud. We trusted you, and our borders, and our historically good relationship and now we’re screwed. And even if we wanted to buy weapons - USA is the main place we’d buy them from. We are wholly screwed.
If we’re actually invaded we are wholly dependent on NATO to save our ass and then it’s more than Canada who will suffer; all humans will suffer from that act. Like, that is a world-defining shared history act.
I agree the fight will actually be economic, and social. This also terrifies us because our financial situation is pretty dire already with the cost of living being horrendous. But we are tough and resourceful and community minded and so I’m optimistic about weathering some medium amount of this. But in the long term - drain the business until you can buy it at a good price might be a strategy for them.
I think it is most likely the US will attack itself from within first - marginalized groups etc, and just bully us economically.
On the positive side - this will bring us closer to Europe, and to each other. Nothing unites like a common enemy.
All this is to say I do think you are worried about a 9sigma event when the nearer events are more likely. So you can worry about having space for other people evacuating here first, I think. Like, set up a room for visitors kind of thing.
posted by St. Peepsburg at 3:06 PM on February 12 [5 favorites]
If we’re actually invaded we are wholly dependent on NATO to save our ass and then it’s more than Canada who will suffer; all humans will suffer from that act. Like, that is a world-defining shared history act.
I agree the fight will actually be economic, and social. This also terrifies us because our financial situation is pretty dire already with the cost of living being horrendous. But we are tough and resourceful and community minded and so I’m optimistic about weathering some medium amount of this. But in the long term - drain the business until you can buy it at a good price might be a strategy for them.
I think it is most likely the US will attack itself from within first - marginalized groups etc, and just bully us economically.
On the positive side - this will bring us closer to Europe, and to each other. Nothing unites like a common enemy.
All this is to say I do think you are worried about a 9sigma event when the nearer events are more likely. So you can worry about having space for other people evacuating here first, I think. Like, set up a room for visitors kind of thing.
posted by St. Peepsburg at 3:06 PM on February 12 [5 favorites]
PS even Stephen Harper thinks getting absorbed into the US is bullshit and you know he’d be the first person in line if he thought that was a good idea.
Oddly enough that made me feel a LOT better.
posted by St. Peepsburg at 3:16 PM on February 12 [1 favorite]
Oddly enough that made me feel a LOT better.
posted by St. Peepsburg at 3:16 PM on February 12 [1 favorite]
I'm going to start by answering your question about getting your family out of Canada, answering as if I think preparing to emigrate is a prudent thing to do. I'll address whether I think it's smart or not later.
My first thought was, with the damage being done to the economy in the US and in Canada, there may be some serious inflation or deflation, and thus the exchange rate could do anything whatsoever in the next couple of years. I would be leery of assuming that $100,000 Canadian will be useful to you at a time when Canada is in imminent danger of invasion, whether you have it in a financial institution or in a lock box. Increasing large numbers of places no longer accept cash, but when your cash exists only in electronic form, it is extremely easy to lose a way to access it.
Whatever may be going to happen, I would invest in my family's health, and in transferable skills. I'd make bloody sure everyone had all their dental work done, that they were taking excellent care of their teeth and that they were in optimal health and fitness, capable of doing such things as walking all day and carrying stupid amounts of stuff. Even if the worst disruption you experience over the next decade is the public transit system becoming unreliable, good health and fitness and stamina is a worthwhile investment.
Take some family trips, so you know the minimum you need to take with you, and how to work around your family's specific needs. Go camping this summer. You want to know if someone has back problems and absolutely cannot under any circumstances sleep on the ground. You want the kids thinking that sleeping out under canvas is not a scary experience. You want them to be at ease with taking trains.
I would select several target countries to research, and get an idea what kind of work the adults in the family could do, if they were to arrive in that country. And then I'd get proficient at that kind of work. Bookkeeping used to be that job in many countries, because every small business person or person who had to file taxes would potentially need help with their accounting. I don't think it's that way now, because of bookkeeping programs. Butchering was one of several invaluable life skills after the break up of the Soviet Union. Plumbing has similarly been a skill that ensured there was a place for you in almost any community. Music is something to consider, and so is dental hygienist. Assume you'll be working under the table, but pick occupations that are not illegal to do on a friendly bartering basis. A lot of people have found advanced degrees useless. Experienced surgeons have become busboys. Getting the credentials to work professionally after emigrating is likely to be extremely difficult. Remember the goal is to be flexible and have back up sources of income, or skills to barter.
I would make connections in all of the target countries that you decide are potential destinations. If you pick Australia, but Australia gets overwhelmed with refugees from the US two years before you set out, chances are Australia will have closed its doors by the time you apply and you'll need a back up nation that will accept your family as immigrants. So pick maybe five countries and get into virtual friendships with people in those countries. You'll have much more information about what direction you want to run and what to expect when you try to get there, and how to cope after you get there. Look for Canadian ex-pat on-line communities in your target countries that you can join. Learn about different countries and cities.
Otto Frank did everything right, except that after he found a refuge, he invested all his capital into building a new decent life for his family, and when the German's rolled over his new home, he wasn't able to pull up stakes again and run. His capital was all tied up in his business and he couldn't withdraw it. So I would keep in mind that you may need to keep going for far longer than you expect. Many refugees end up spending many years on their journey. Some thrive and end up with more wealth than when they set out. Others never make it to safety, even though they survive several years before they run out of luck and resources.
I'd learn enough Spanish, or Chinese, or other potentially useful languages, to enable myself to buy groceries and take the bus, and muddle through a day or two of interacting with people without English, even if I didn't know enough of the language to get my future and past tenses right. I may not be intending to settle in Singapore, but if I have to spend two weeks there while my visa gets processed, I'd like to be able to understand a little bit of the local language. It's not out of the question that you could successfully emigrate to Australia, but still end up spending four months in Bangkok waiting for your youngest kid's medical certificate. You may very well never actually need any language but English, but you will be better off if you feel comfortable and confident that you can interact with people who don't speak English. Keep in mind how many Jews stayed in Germany because they didn't speak any other language, and were paralyzed at the idea of starting over abroad.
*** ***
All that said, I am now going to address your fear of being in the path of an invading army and of living under occupation. I personally doubt you are better off fleeing Canada, because if things get so unstable that this country is a bad place to bring up kids, the chances are the entire world has dissolved into chaos and nobody will be accepting refugees anyway. We now live in interesting times (Except Trump. Everything he says is boring, because he is a one trick pony who can only bluster offensively.) There may be, and probably will be very big changes long before your kids have grown up.
Trump is frightening everyone, and being unpredictable. That's by design. Today he's got a bunch of premiers coming to visit him in the US, who will only get to see his lackeys, while they try to muster explanations and arguments and pleas that Trump will never listen to. They've just played completely into his hands, revealing that they are terrified of him and can be pushed around.
Trump is a chronic liar, so rather than listen to what comes out of his mouth, I think the thing to do is look at his past history. Going by that, right now he is doing his best to raise a huge amount of money which he can transfer from its designated use into his own personal investment capital. The oligarchs helping him are doing the same. They are pillaging the heck out of the US. What's going on is basically a shakedown.
It's probably going to be a few months before we know if the wealthy kleptocrats running the poor USA will get stopped and even arrested for their spree, or how soon they might be stopped if they are. I don't imagine there will be a free election in four years, as the stated goal of the US Right since the 1980's has been to destroy fair elections and stack the courts; they have made excellent progress, working away patiently to destroy their own country. Who is going to end up on top is a big question. Usually in a situation like this whoever has the best hit team wins, so Thiel could end up winning control, or Musk, or Trump, or the head of some right wing militia we don't know much about right now. A consortium of governors and judges who lean left could win control. The US could also end up being under military rule, or embroiled in a civil war, or essentially in a stand off, with the Federal government unable to wrest control from several States who are being led by their Governors. Even the police may turn into a faction that goes rogue, given how well armed they are, and their habitual assumption that they are above the law.
Historically after everything easy to grab has been grabbed, the people who are doing the pillaging look around and decide their fellow thieves are their rivals. They all want to defend their piece of the pie, or to steal the other fellow's, and you end up with internal faction wars. They are more likely to start fighting over control of resources in the USA itself before they aim to seize control of resources beyond their borders.
There is a whole lot that could happen and a whole lot more that has to happen before the US Military is sent to invade Canada; I strongly suspect they will end up far too busy in the USA itself to be going to war with their northern neighbour. What we are looking at here is probably very similar to the collapse of the Soviet Union. There isn't enough social cohesion for the old system of running things to work anymore, and a free for all of grabbing stuff before anyone else gets it is going on. This means that the US Military is perhaps more likely to be quelling civil unrest at home than they are invading Canada. (They might also end up helping with the harvest to prevent critical food shortages, like the Russian Army did.) It's not like the US Military is immune to the pillaging party that is going on, nor that Trump will spare them, since he sees them as a potential threat to his power. He wants them weak so they can't threaten him with a military coup, or refuse to obey his executive orders.
The Oligarchs currently in power are going to have to get a much, much firmer grip on power before they have the leisure and spare resources to seriously invade some other country. They are also going to have to purge the military - and in doing so they will cripple it, because they will have to eliminate or intimidate the high ranking officers, and discharge and disarm any and all service persons who might want to obey the US Constitution. Yes, there are already some puppy-Nazis in their ranks, but I don't think the Oligarchs will trust the military until they have done some major purges. The military does not love Trump. The last thing the Oligarchs want is to order an invasion before they are sure they have completely control, or the military helicopters they order launched will be landing on the White House Lawn to take the president into protective custody.
You may be right that the USA is on a track to invade Canada within four years... Meanwhile, Canada might very well have joined some treaty organization, newly formed to check the power of a USA gone rogue. Would China consider offering to defend Canada, in return for Canada offering them cut price mineral resources? (Resources that we can no longer sell to the US, cos the US tariffs made them too expensive for the US to buy.) How about if we also offer to buy a quarter of a million $12,000 Chinese electric cars over the next four years? I honestly think your chances of owning a cheap electric car from China is now higher than your chances of seeing an invasion.
And if you don't like that scenario, consider that Trump is threatening everybody, not just Canada; the EU is already engaged in talks on how to block the US threat. They might be very happy to include Canada and Mexico in their alliances, regarding it as getting it right this time around, and equivalent to preventing the annexation of the Sudetenland.
Trump and his Oligarchs are turning the poor USA into a pariah nation. It's all bluster, threat, demand, insult. And the world is PISSED. Yes, scared, but also disgusted and contemptuous. The world reaction is very much like when a two year old has grabbed a loaded gun. Naturally you don't just stride in there and try to wrestle it away from the kid. Everyone is pausing while they figure out the best strategy. You're not wrong to be afraid - but the situation is still so volatile, there is absolutely no way to know who, and where anyone is actually at risk. It's not at all impossible that Canada is the very safest place for you to be. You're not wrong to be watching, and preparing to be agile. A two-year-old is wildly waving a loading gun in the next house. But you still have time, and you and your kids almost certainly have a future that won't involve fleeing the US Army.
posted by Jane the Brown at 3:48 PM on February 12 [110 favorites]
My first thought was, with the damage being done to the economy in the US and in Canada, there may be some serious inflation or deflation, and thus the exchange rate could do anything whatsoever in the next couple of years. I would be leery of assuming that $100,000 Canadian will be useful to you at a time when Canada is in imminent danger of invasion, whether you have it in a financial institution or in a lock box. Increasing large numbers of places no longer accept cash, but when your cash exists only in electronic form, it is extremely easy to lose a way to access it.
Whatever may be going to happen, I would invest in my family's health, and in transferable skills. I'd make bloody sure everyone had all their dental work done, that they were taking excellent care of their teeth and that they were in optimal health and fitness, capable of doing such things as walking all day and carrying stupid amounts of stuff. Even if the worst disruption you experience over the next decade is the public transit system becoming unreliable, good health and fitness and stamina is a worthwhile investment.
Take some family trips, so you know the minimum you need to take with you, and how to work around your family's specific needs. Go camping this summer. You want to know if someone has back problems and absolutely cannot under any circumstances sleep on the ground. You want the kids thinking that sleeping out under canvas is not a scary experience. You want them to be at ease with taking trains.
I would select several target countries to research, and get an idea what kind of work the adults in the family could do, if they were to arrive in that country. And then I'd get proficient at that kind of work. Bookkeeping used to be that job in many countries, because every small business person or person who had to file taxes would potentially need help with their accounting. I don't think it's that way now, because of bookkeeping programs. Butchering was one of several invaluable life skills after the break up of the Soviet Union. Plumbing has similarly been a skill that ensured there was a place for you in almost any community. Music is something to consider, and so is dental hygienist. Assume you'll be working under the table, but pick occupations that are not illegal to do on a friendly bartering basis. A lot of people have found advanced degrees useless. Experienced surgeons have become busboys. Getting the credentials to work professionally after emigrating is likely to be extremely difficult. Remember the goal is to be flexible and have back up sources of income, or skills to barter.
I would make connections in all of the target countries that you decide are potential destinations. If you pick Australia, but Australia gets overwhelmed with refugees from the US two years before you set out, chances are Australia will have closed its doors by the time you apply and you'll need a back up nation that will accept your family as immigrants. So pick maybe five countries and get into virtual friendships with people in those countries. You'll have much more information about what direction you want to run and what to expect when you try to get there, and how to cope after you get there. Look for Canadian ex-pat on-line communities in your target countries that you can join. Learn about different countries and cities.
Otto Frank did everything right, except that after he found a refuge, he invested all his capital into building a new decent life for his family, and when the German's rolled over his new home, he wasn't able to pull up stakes again and run. His capital was all tied up in his business and he couldn't withdraw it. So I would keep in mind that you may need to keep going for far longer than you expect. Many refugees end up spending many years on their journey. Some thrive and end up with more wealth than when they set out. Others never make it to safety, even though they survive several years before they run out of luck and resources.
I'd learn enough Spanish, or Chinese, or other potentially useful languages, to enable myself to buy groceries and take the bus, and muddle through a day or two of interacting with people without English, even if I didn't know enough of the language to get my future and past tenses right. I may not be intending to settle in Singapore, but if I have to spend two weeks there while my visa gets processed, I'd like to be able to understand a little bit of the local language. It's not out of the question that you could successfully emigrate to Australia, but still end up spending four months in Bangkok waiting for your youngest kid's medical certificate. You may very well never actually need any language but English, but you will be better off if you feel comfortable and confident that you can interact with people who don't speak English. Keep in mind how many Jews stayed in Germany because they didn't speak any other language, and were paralyzed at the idea of starting over abroad.
*** ***
All that said, I am now going to address your fear of being in the path of an invading army and of living under occupation. I personally doubt you are better off fleeing Canada, because if things get so unstable that this country is a bad place to bring up kids, the chances are the entire world has dissolved into chaos and nobody will be accepting refugees anyway. We now live in interesting times (Except Trump. Everything he says is boring, because he is a one trick pony who can only bluster offensively.) There may be, and probably will be very big changes long before your kids have grown up.
Trump is frightening everyone, and being unpredictable. That's by design. Today he's got a bunch of premiers coming to visit him in the US, who will only get to see his lackeys, while they try to muster explanations and arguments and pleas that Trump will never listen to. They've just played completely into his hands, revealing that they are terrified of him and can be pushed around.
Trump is a chronic liar, so rather than listen to what comes out of his mouth, I think the thing to do is look at his past history. Going by that, right now he is doing his best to raise a huge amount of money which he can transfer from its designated use into his own personal investment capital. The oligarchs helping him are doing the same. They are pillaging the heck out of the US. What's going on is basically a shakedown.
It's probably going to be a few months before we know if the wealthy kleptocrats running the poor USA will get stopped and even arrested for their spree, or how soon they might be stopped if they are. I don't imagine there will be a free election in four years, as the stated goal of the US Right since the 1980's has been to destroy fair elections and stack the courts; they have made excellent progress, working away patiently to destroy their own country. Who is going to end up on top is a big question. Usually in a situation like this whoever has the best hit team wins, so Thiel could end up winning control, or Musk, or Trump, or the head of some right wing militia we don't know much about right now. A consortium of governors and judges who lean left could win control. The US could also end up being under military rule, or embroiled in a civil war, or essentially in a stand off, with the Federal government unable to wrest control from several States who are being led by their Governors. Even the police may turn into a faction that goes rogue, given how well armed they are, and their habitual assumption that they are above the law.
Historically after everything easy to grab has been grabbed, the people who are doing the pillaging look around and decide their fellow thieves are their rivals. They all want to defend their piece of the pie, or to steal the other fellow's, and you end up with internal faction wars. They are more likely to start fighting over control of resources in the USA itself before they aim to seize control of resources beyond their borders.
There is a whole lot that could happen and a whole lot more that has to happen before the US Military is sent to invade Canada; I strongly suspect they will end up far too busy in the USA itself to be going to war with their northern neighbour. What we are looking at here is probably very similar to the collapse of the Soviet Union. There isn't enough social cohesion for the old system of running things to work anymore, and a free for all of grabbing stuff before anyone else gets it is going on. This means that the US Military is perhaps more likely to be quelling civil unrest at home than they are invading Canada. (They might also end up helping with the harvest to prevent critical food shortages, like the Russian Army did.) It's not like the US Military is immune to the pillaging party that is going on, nor that Trump will spare them, since he sees them as a potential threat to his power. He wants them weak so they can't threaten him with a military coup, or refuse to obey his executive orders.
The Oligarchs currently in power are going to have to get a much, much firmer grip on power before they have the leisure and spare resources to seriously invade some other country. They are also going to have to purge the military - and in doing so they will cripple it, because they will have to eliminate or intimidate the high ranking officers, and discharge and disarm any and all service persons who might want to obey the US Constitution. Yes, there are already some puppy-Nazis in their ranks, but I don't think the Oligarchs will trust the military until they have done some major purges. The military does not love Trump. The last thing the Oligarchs want is to order an invasion before they are sure they have completely control, or the military helicopters they order launched will be landing on the White House Lawn to take the president into protective custody.
You may be right that the USA is on a track to invade Canada within four years... Meanwhile, Canada might very well have joined some treaty organization, newly formed to check the power of a USA gone rogue. Would China consider offering to defend Canada, in return for Canada offering them cut price mineral resources? (Resources that we can no longer sell to the US, cos the US tariffs made them too expensive for the US to buy.) How about if we also offer to buy a quarter of a million $12,000 Chinese electric cars over the next four years? I honestly think your chances of owning a cheap electric car from China is now higher than your chances of seeing an invasion.
And if you don't like that scenario, consider that Trump is threatening everybody, not just Canada; the EU is already engaged in talks on how to block the US threat. They might be very happy to include Canada and Mexico in their alliances, regarding it as getting it right this time around, and equivalent to preventing the annexation of the Sudetenland.
Trump and his Oligarchs are turning the poor USA into a pariah nation. It's all bluster, threat, demand, insult. And the world is PISSED. Yes, scared, but also disgusted and contemptuous. The world reaction is very much like when a two year old has grabbed a loaded gun. Naturally you don't just stride in there and try to wrestle it away from the kid. Everyone is pausing while they figure out the best strategy. You're not wrong to be afraid - but the situation is still so volatile, there is absolutely no way to know who, and where anyone is actually at risk. It's not at all impossible that Canada is the very safest place for you to be. You're not wrong to be watching, and preparing to be agile. A two-year-old is wildly waving a loading gun in the next house. But you still have time, and you and your kids almost certainly have a future that won't involve fleeing the US Army.
posted by Jane the Brown at 3:48 PM on February 12 [110 favorites]
Holy cow, Jane the Brown nailed it. The US will tear itself apart first.
posted by Kitteh at 5:34 PM on February 12 [8 favorites]
posted by Kitteh at 5:34 PM on February 12 [8 favorites]
For whatever reassurance this is worth:
I can no longer say that there aren't enough insane, malicious or stupid people in my country to do this. I thought Trump couldn't ever be elected because there wasn't sufficient malice, insanity or stupidity in the universe. I was wrong.
Nevertheless, an invasion of another country isn't something he can do by Executive Order. Too many agencies and too many other people would have to participate. Can he purge all the rational people from the military in time to bring this off? I don't know.
But I will tell you this: my grandfather went to Canada to join up when the U.S. wasn't getting involved in WWI fast enough to suit him. A U.S. invasion would send me to Canada as fast as I could go, to beg to be allowed to join the Canadian military and fight the Marching Morons.
That's if I don't join millions of others to fight a Fifth Column action here in the states.
Neighbor, some of us still have your back !
posted by wjm at 5:55 PM on February 12 [8 favorites]
I can no longer say that there aren't enough insane, malicious or stupid people in my country to do this. I thought Trump couldn't ever be elected because there wasn't sufficient malice, insanity or stupidity in the universe. I was wrong.
Nevertheless, an invasion of another country isn't something he can do by Executive Order. Too many agencies and too many other people would have to participate. Can he purge all the rational people from the military in time to bring this off? I don't know.
But I will tell you this: my grandfather went to Canada to join up when the U.S. wasn't getting involved in WWI fast enough to suit him. A U.S. invasion would send me to Canada as fast as I could go, to beg to be allowed to join the Canadian military and fight the Marching Morons.
That's if I don't join millions of others to fight a Fifth Column action here in the states.
Neighbor, some of us still have your back !
posted by wjm at 5:55 PM on February 12 [8 favorites]
I have lived in half a dozen countries outside the US, where I am from, and I want to reinforce how excellent Jane the Brown’s advice above, about how to think about this as a family living both today and in the future, really is: investing in yourselves by learning new skills and developing existing talents isn’t just an insurance policy for some future catastrophe; it’s a purposeful, joyful and healthy way to spend each day.
To give you one small example: think of all the people around the world who study English after work or school or online. All the Hungarians and Tunisians and Paraguayans and Laotians studying English for two hours every Tuesday night at a local language school aren’t planning to move to Britain or Singapore or Nigeria next week, aren’t studying for their New Zealand literature or Irish history exams next semester, and aren’t starting a business in Jamaica or Canada or Australia or the US next year. They might be doing it because it seems like a good idea, or because they have a practical need, even if it’s not immediately obvious: better English means they can talk to people who don’t speak their languages when on vacation with their partner with much better English so the partner doesn’t need to constantly translate what a museum brochure or restaurant menu says; better English means they can buy the right widgets for their company from a Chinese seller on AliExpress or the right lens for their dad’s weird old film camera from the Soviet Union from a guy in Ukraine on eBay. Will better English help people move abroad? Absolutely — but just because that might be what happens doesn’t mean that was what they planned at the outset.
It may not be possible to envision what your family’s equivalent of this would be, but it sort of doesn’t matter, really: if there is a practical skill or area of knowledge you want to develop anyway for your own reasons, you should invest the time in doing so. Maybe there will be a great need for it later and it will assist you in migrating elsewhere; maybe there will only be the joy it brings you in the process of personal growth. Either way, it is worth doing.
In terms of actually answering your question, there are a surprisingly large number of ways to live elsewhere as a Canadian without seeking asylum, right now. Here are some avenues to explore:
- If you or your partner’s ancestors came from outside Canada, even if it was many generations ago, some countries offer a smoother pathway to legal residency or citizenship because of this. The Wikipedia article on jus sanguinis is helpful in identifying options you may not have considered. For example, if one of you is a descendant of a person who had Lithuanian citizenship before June 15, 1940, you could apply for a “certificate attesting the right to reinstate citizenship of the Republic of Lithuania”, which would entitle you, after some paperwork and an embassy visit, to the right to live and work there and apply for citizenship; Lithuania is an EU member state, so Lithuanian citizenship gives you the right to live and work anywhere in the EU. The “I want to become a citizen of the Republic of Lithuania” section on the Lithuanian Migration Department’s website here explains in detail who qualifies and what you’d need to do. Many European countries, especially those which have a relatively large diaspora in the Americas, have something similar to this, and while you might not be able to get a passport in a few weeks, you might be able to get preferential access to residency or longer-validity work visas.
- During the pandemic, a number of countries began to offer residency for digital nomads and other remote workers. Many of these programs still exist. Here, for example, is Costa Rica’s program; here is Spain’s; here is Taiwan’s. These programs really vary in quality, ease of access and cost; you might want to look at programs that make renewal easy, or that allow conversion to a normal residency or work visa if you find a job locally.
- Mexico has a huge, diverse and vibrant economy, shares its time zones with most of Canada, and is theoretically drivable if you have a vehicle. If you and your family already speak English as well as some French but don’t yet speak Spanish, you’ll probably find that Spanish is easier to pick up than you might expect. The Mexican embassy in Ottawa’s page on different types of visas the country offers is here.
- Living somewhere on a tourist visa isn’t something you would necessarily want to do, especially in places where you’d want to have things most tourists don’t have access to, like a mobile phone contract or a rental agreement for an apartment, but Canadians enjoy some very long visa-free/tourist-visa-on-arrival stay durations in a number of countries near each other with relatively low costs of living: Georgia gives Canadian citizens a full year, for example, while Armenia, right next door to Georgia, offers Canadians 180-day tourist visas. Albania, Kosovo, Bosnia and Hercegovina, North Macedonia, Moldova, Serbia, Montenegro, Northern Cyprus and Turkey each offer either 90-day or 90-days-every-180-days visas to Canadians, meaning you could spend a minimum of 44 months “travelling” in these places without needing to “visit” a country again. You also get 90 days every 180 days in the Schengen zone, which includes some less-expensive countries like Bulgaria, Romania, and Slovakia. Though it is, of course, certainly a hassle to have to move relatively often, I know a Canadian who teaches English online and has spent the last few years making a reasonable living working online in exactly these places, all of which he has really enjoyed seeing for more than just a few days or weeks. The Wikipedia page on visa requirements for Canadian citizens has a table you can sort by stay duration in the “Visa requirements map” section.
A final note: in my answer above, I have assumed that you are not descended from our continent’s indigenous people and that you are not New Canadians who have a clear pathway out of Canada to a welcoming, safe and free “home country” elsewhere that you would happily move to, so please forgive me if I have erred here. If you are descended from settlers, though, like the majority of American and Canadian citizens are, I wonder if it might be grounding (or even inspiring) for you and your family to spend time at the library or online researching your heritage and ancestry wherever your ancestors are from, both for the pure enjoyment of discovering that you really do have visible and tangible roots elsewhere, and for the reassurance of remembering that your ancestors overcame the barriers that may have existed in their minds about whether they would make their move to Canada decades or centuries ago a success. For me, doing family-history research not only revealed that I have a history in a certain town in Italy but that, miraculously, I would be allowed to become an Italian citizen, something I had never known beforehand; this has been life-changing for me personally given my career and also been a huge relief mentally: there really is somewhere else I can go — and stay. You never know what you might find!
To close: I know things certainly feel scary these days with the United States being the way it is, and you are not wrong, at all, for wanting to feel that you and your family will be safe. I hope I have been able to help you find a sense of peace in knowing a little more about some of the choices you have as Canadians in where to go if you had to leave your home — and I also hope this unsettling period in our shared history on this land passes soon. Take care.
posted by mdonley at 8:06 PM on February 12 [10 favorites]
To give you one small example: think of all the people around the world who study English after work or school or online. All the Hungarians and Tunisians and Paraguayans and Laotians studying English for two hours every Tuesday night at a local language school aren’t planning to move to Britain or Singapore or Nigeria next week, aren’t studying for their New Zealand literature or Irish history exams next semester, and aren’t starting a business in Jamaica or Canada or Australia or the US next year. They might be doing it because it seems like a good idea, or because they have a practical need, even if it’s not immediately obvious: better English means they can talk to people who don’t speak their languages when on vacation with their partner with much better English so the partner doesn’t need to constantly translate what a museum brochure or restaurant menu says; better English means they can buy the right widgets for their company from a Chinese seller on AliExpress or the right lens for their dad’s weird old film camera from the Soviet Union from a guy in Ukraine on eBay. Will better English help people move abroad? Absolutely — but just because that might be what happens doesn’t mean that was what they planned at the outset.
It may not be possible to envision what your family’s equivalent of this would be, but it sort of doesn’t matter, really: if there is a practical skill or area of knowledge you want to develop anyway for your own reasons, you should invest the time in doing so. Maybe there will be a great need for it later and it will assist you in migrating elsewhere; maybe there will only be the joy it brings you in the process of personal growth. Either way, it is worth doing.
In terms of actually answering your question, there are a surprisingly large number of ways to live elsewhere as a Canadian without seeking asylum, right now. Here are some avenues to explore:
- If you or your partner’s ancestors came from outside Canada, even if it was many generations ago, some countries offer a smoother pathway to legal residency or citizenship because of this. The Wikipedia article on jus sanguinis is helpful in identifying options you may not have considered. For example, if one of you is a descendant of a person who had Lithuanian citizenship before June 15, 1940, you could apply for a “certificate attesting the right to reinstate citizenship of the Republic of Lithuania”, which would entitle you, after some paperwork and an embassy visit, to the right to live and work there and apply for citizenship; Lithuania is an EU member state, so Lithuanian citizenship gives you the right to live and work anywhere in the EU. The “I want to become a citizen of the Republic of Lithuania” section on the Lithuanian Migration Department’s website here explains in detail who qualifies and what you’d need to do. Many European countries, especially those which have a relatively large diaspora in the Americas, have something similar to this, and while you might not be able to get a passport in a few weeks, you might be able to get preferential access to residency or longer-validity work visas.
- During the pandemic, a number of countries began to offer residency for digital nomads and other remote workers. Many of these programs still exist. Here, for example, is Costa Rica’s program; here is Spain’s; here is Taiwan’s. These programs really vary in quality, ease of access and cost; you might want to look at programs that make renewal easy, or that allow conversion to a normal residency or work visa if you find a job locally.
- Mexico has a huge, diverse and vibrant economy, shares its time zones with most of Canada, and is theoretically drivable if you have a vehicle. If you and your family already speak English as well as some French but don’t yet speak Spanish, you’ll probably find that Spanish is easier to pick up than you might expect. The Mexican embassy in Ottawa’s page on different types of visas the country offers is here.
- Living somewhere on a tourist visa isn’t something you would necessarily want to do, especially in places where you’d want to have things most tourists don’t have access to, like a mobile phone contract or a rental agreement for an apartment, but Canadians enjoy some very long visa-free/tourist-visa-on-arrival stay durations in a number of countries near each other with relatively low costs of living: Georgia gives Canadian citizens a full year, for example, while Armenia, right next door to Georgia, offers Canadians 180-day tourist visas. Albania, Kosovo, Bosnia and Hercegovina, North Macedonia, Moldova, Serbia, Montenegro, Northern Cyprus and Turkey each offer either 90-day or 90-days-every-180-days visas to Canadians, meaning you could spend a minimum of 44 months “travelling” in these places without needing to “visit” a country again. You also get 90 days every 180 days in the Schengen zone, which includes some less-expensive countries like Bulgaria, Romania, and Slovakia. Though it is, of course, certainly a hassle to have to move relatively often, I know a Canadian who teaches English online and has spent the last few years making a reasonable living working online in exactly these places, all of which he has really enjoyed seeing for more than just a few days or weeks. The Wikipedia page on visa requirements for Canadian citizens has a table you can sort by stay duration in the “Visa requirements map” section.
A final note: in my answer above, I have assumed that you are not descended from our continent’s indigenous people and that you are not New Canadians who have a clear pathway out of Canada to a welcoming, safe and free “home country” elsewhere that you would happily move to, so please forgive me if I have erred here. If you are descended from settlers, though, like the majority of American and Canadian citizens are, I wonder if it might be grounding (or even inspiring) for you and your family to spend time at the library or online researching your heritage and ancestry wherever your ancestors are from, both for the pure enjoyment of discovering that you really do have visible and tangible roots elsewhere, and for the reassurance of remembering that your ancestors overcame the barriers that may have existed in their minds about whether they would make their move to Canada decades or centuries ago a success. For me, doing family-history research not only revealed that I have a history in a certain town in Italy but that, miraculously, I would be allowed to become an Italian citizen, something I had never known beforehand; this has been life-changing for me personally given my career and also been a huge relief mentally: there really is somewhere else I can go — and stay. You never know what you might find!
To close: I know things certainly feel scary these days with the United States being the way it is, and you are not wrong, at all, for wanting to feel that you and your family will be safe. I hope I have been able to help you find a sense of peace in knowing a little more about some of the choices you have as Canadians in where to go if you had to leave your home — and I also hope this unsettling period in our shared history on this land passes soon. Take care.
posted by mdonley at 8:06 PM on February 12 [10 favorites]
There are things you can do specifically to prepare to emigrate. Others in this thread have said useful things about that.
The main tasks I'll mention are tasks that are already good ideas or have beneficial side effects. For example, Jane the Brown's points "invest in my family's health, and in transferable skills", "take some family trips", and "get into virtual friendships" all fall into this category.
Carina C. Zona shared a thread of advice in November aimed at US people beginning to plan to emigrate. Much of it is only applicable if you decide to leave, and some is US-specific. But Zona also suggests many things to research about countries you're considering, and shares some advice that falls into the "this would be a good idea anyway" category, such as:
If your family decides to leave Canada for an extended period of time, it's handy to have a Canadian friend who's willing to have their home serve as your Canadian mailing address. If you don't currently have close friends in Canada, now's a good time to start deepening your friendships.
As siderea articulated,
posted by brainwane at 4:46 AM on February 13 [9 favorites]
The main tasks I'll mention are tasks that are already good ideas or have beneficial side effects. For example, Jane the Brown's points "invest in my family's health, and in transferable skills", "take some family trips", and "get into virtual friendships" all fall into this category.
Carina C. Zona shared a thread of advice in November aimed at US people beginning to plan to emigrate. Much of it is only applicable if you decide to leave, and some is US-specific. But Zona also suggests many things to research about countries you're considering, and shares some advice that falls into the "this would be a good idea anyway" category, such as:
Get/renew your passport right now. If you have dual citizenship, make sure that passport is current too.....A few other things you can do to prepare:
Get duplicates of all vital records. Birth, marriage, name/gender change, etc. Also of school transcripts (both yours and your kids') and diplomas. Get each of them apostilled. You might be lucky and never need to submit these to a bureaucrat or employer, but otherwise omg is it so much less complicated to get this project done from [your home country] than from abroad. Just do it. Have them ready to hand off. Thank me later.
Gather all the medical records. Have your medical providers give you copies of everything, INCLUDING MEDICAL IMAGES, on a CD. You may have to request the images separately from the rest of the records, fyi. Even if the images didn't show anything important, doctors may find them crucial later as a Before to compare to an After.
If your family decides to leave Canada for an extended period of time, it's handy to have a Canadian friend who's willing to have their home serve as your Canadian mailing address. If you don't currently have close friends in Canada, now's a good time to start deepening your friendships.
As siderea articulated,
the best of my limited knowledge presently is that disasters come in two kinds both of which need to be prepared for, and those two kinds are "What If We Can't Stay?" and "What If We Can't Leave?"In my opinion, depending on the nature of any invasion, it makes sense to prepare for both -- and, it makes your household more resilient to other disasters as well. So: get your emergency kit together, but also, if you've been meaning to do some decluttering, go ahead and use your worry to fuel that effort. Clean, mend, sort, organize, recycle, sell, donate; make your home more ready for whatever comes next (such as long-term visitors, or departure).
posted by brainwane at 4:46 AM on February 13 [9 favorites]
Canada's really big, and even a powerful country can't invade all of it. Work with your legislators on what the contingency plans are. Know where safe places are within Canada. Maybe research towns in Australia that might be a good haven, but I think lots of countries would open refugee doors to Canadians, though I may be naive.
To be more specific, the current US President is a loose cannon - dangerous, unpredictable and with a lot of weight - but war with Canada would not be tolerable to at least 80% of USians, and I think the US Congress would not allow it to happen, even though war industries would enjoy handsome profits. To be rudely blunt, we tend not to attack white countries. Even the horrid and conservative Wall St Journal called it the stupidest trade war ever.
The plans I'd really consider are financial plans so that you could avoid frozen assets and be able to act. Jeez, this is depressing and I'm sorry and I'm working to make shit less awful to the extent that I can. Call and write your legislators, Resist. There is real strength in numbers and loud voices.
posted by theora55 at 9:06 PM on February 13 [2 favorites]
To be more specific, the current US President is a loose cannon - dangerous, unpredictable and with a lot of weight - but war with Canada would not be tolerable to at least 80% of USians, and I think the US Congress would not allow it to happen, even though war industries would enjoy handsome profits. To be rudely blunt, we tend not to attack white countries. Even the horrid and conservative Wall St Journal called it the stupidest trade war ever.
The plans I'd really consider are financial plans so that you could avoid frozen assets and be able to act. Jeez, this is depressing and I'm sorry and I'm working to make shit less awful to the extent that I can. Call and write your legislators, Resist. There is real strength in numbers and loud voices.
posted by theora55 at 9:06 PM on February 13 [2 favorites]
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posted by Kitteh at 7:03 AM on February 12 [21 favorites]