About to get kicked out in Superior with nowhere to go, need some advice
August 15, 2024 6:37 PM Subscribe
My adult daughter and her boyfriend are unexpectedly getting kicked out of the place they've been staying. They have absolutely nowhere to go and I'm panicking. Details inside.
For the last couple of years, they've been staying with the boyfriend's mom "Loretta" who is in section 8 housing. Apparently she's not supposed to have anyone else living with her, but the landlord has let it slide although they haven't been happy about it. Loretta's other daughter "Beth" and Beth's boyfriend also live there, and they are not being asked to leave. The landlord apparently is willing to lie to the section 8 housing people and say that Loretta lives alone, so Beth is being allowed to stay but the landlord doesn't like my daughter and wants them out.
They were initially told they needed to be out by October 1, but somehow the situation has deteriorated and Beth is now telling them that she wants them gone now and "I can use law enforcement to remove you as she [Loretta] is on section 8 and has a lease she does not need to evict as yall are considered squatters and there are no squatters rights here".
This is in Superior, WI. Do they have ANY rights at all in this situation? I have no idea if Beth is correct and I wouldn't put it past her to lie. They have a whole room full of stuff that they need to move, and I don't know how she expects them to make arrangements for that with no notice. We can get them a truck and a storage unit but it will take a few days to arrange and we're afraid they'll start throwing their stuff on the lawn in the meantime. My daughter does have a car, which they use to do food delivery.
Any thoughts on what they can do? What rights they might have, who can help them? Resources in Superior for situations like this?
They are on a waiting list for subsidized housing but they talked to the caseworker today and it doesn't look like that is going to pan out any time soon.
For the last couple of years, they've been staying with the boyfriend's mom "Loretta" who is in section 8 housing. Apparently she's not supposed to have anyone else living with her, but the landlord has let it slide although they haven't been happy about it. Loretta's other daughter "Beth" and Beth's boyfriend also live there, and they are not being asked to leave. The landlord apparently is willing to lie to the section 8 housing people and say that Loretta lives alone, so Beth is being allowed to stay but the landlord doesn't like my daughter and wants them out.
They were initially told they needed to be out by October 1, but somehow the situation has deteriorated and Beth is now telling them that she wants them gone now and "I can use law enforcement to remove you as she [Loretta] is on section 8 and has a lease she does not need to evict as yall are considered squatters and there are no squatters rights here".
This is in Superior, WI. Do they have ANY rights at all in this situation? I have no idea if Beth is correct and I wouldn't put it past her to lie. They have a whole room full of stuff that they need to move, and I don't know how she expects them to make arrangements for that with no notice. We can get them a truck and a storage unit but it will take a few days to arrange and we're afraid they'll start throwing their stuff on the lawn in the meantime. My daughter does have a car, which they use to do food delivery.
Any thoughts on what they can do? What rights they might have, who can help them? Resources in Superior for situations like this?
They are on a waiting list for subsidized housing but they talked to the caseworker today and it doesn't look like that is going to pan out any time soon.
Caveat: every jurisdiction has its own rental regulations!!! This stuff is tricky!!!
I'm confused. Beth is neither the landlord nor a tenant on the lease. She can't throw anyone out. Or is the "she wants" in that quote the landlord?
That said, Loretta is not merely likely violating Section 8 rules on long-term guests but is also, if your daughter/boyfriend have any income at all, engaged in flagrant fraud on the program. This is a bad situation for everyone and not one you want coming to any official attention. The landlord might get in trouble, too, but Loretta has a lot more to lose.
posted by praemunire at 6:57 PM on August 15 [7 favorites]
I'm confused. Beth is neither the landlord nor a tenant on the lease. She can't throw anyone out. Or is the "she wants" in that quote the landlord?
That said, Loretta is not merely likely violating Section 8 rules on long-term guests but is also, if your daughter/boyfriend have any income at all, engaged in flagrant fraud on the program. This is a bad situation for everyone and not one you want coming to any official attention. The landlord might get in trouble, too, but Loretta has a lot more to lose.
posted by praemunire at 6:57 PM on August 15 [7 favorites]
OK, I looked it up and it appears that there are several self-storage places in Superior that will rent units online, including U-Haul. I don't know the area so can't say how close they are, how safe the location, etc., but in theory you can rent a unit tonight and have them pick up keys tomorrow.
(Illegal drug use can also jeopardize your voucher so if you care about Loretta's well-being at all, uh, you definitely don't want the cops coming and finding any of that stuff.)
posted by praemunire at 7:10 PM on August 15 [2 favorites]
(Illegal drug use can also jeopardize your voucher so if you care about Loretta's well-being at all, uh, you definitely don't want the cops coming and finding any of that stuff.)
posted by praemunire at 7:10 PM on August 15 [2 favorites]
It would be a very bad idea for anyone in this situation to involve law enforcement; if Beth does that, she could end up homeless herself. So it's unlikely that will happen (though people do foolish things all the time).
Most likely, if your daughter demonstrates movement towards getting out of there, they will not make her situation a lot worse over the next few days.
(Even if it were viable to legally fight to stay, it's not a good or safe situation to be in, so I don't recommend that path.)
If you can, help them with a truck and storage and maybe a week in a motel while they figure out a long term plan, and if you're good with your daughter staying with you, offer a bus ticket too.
posted by metasarah at 7:48 PM on August 15 [8 favorites]
Most likely, if your daughter demonstrates movement towards getting out of there, they will not make her situation a lot worse over the next few days.
(Even if it were viable to legally fight to stay, it's not a good or safe situation to be in, so I don't recommend that path.)
If you can, help them with a truck and storage and maybe a week in a motel while they figure out a long term plan, and if you're good with your daughter staying with you, offer a bus ticket too.
posted by metasarah at 7:48 PM on August 15 [8 favorites]
I agree that this seems unlikely to wind up involving the law because everyone involved seems to be breaking the law, and I agree they should get out as soon as possible. That said, if they need a few more days or a week, have you considered offering “rent” to Beth/Loretta to buy a few days of breathing room? You don’t say if they are paying anything now, and it sounds like they do not. I wonder if for less than the cost of a hotel room they could stay for a week or so while they work things out. Paying mean people sucks, but it may be the simplest/surest way to get a few more days of time and avoid a panicked/rushed exit in which they potentially lose some of their property. Of course, only they can decide whether it is safe enough to try something like this and/or whether they trust Beth/Loretta enough for it.
posted by Mid at 8:09 PM on August 15 [4 favorites]
posted by Mid at 8:09 PM on August 15 [4 favorites]
Response by poster: Thanks for the suggestions. Yes, it is a shitty situation all around, and I think the reason everyone is freaking out and being a dick is because they are afraid of Loretta losing her housing. I'm hoping they understand it would be risky for everyone to have the cops come.
They will be looking into a UHaul and a storage unit tomorrow morning. I guess they are at least being allowed to stay tonight, and as metasarah suggested, if they show they are working on getting out that may buy them a couple of days. Still no idea where they are going to live though. Working on figuring that out.
posted by sock puppy at 8:29 PM on August 15
They will be looking into a UHaul and a storage unit tomorrow morning. I guess they are at least being allowed to stay tonight, and as metasarah suggested, if they show they are working on getting out that may buy them a couple of days. Still no idea where they are going to live though. Working on figuring that out.
posted by sock puppy at 8:29 PM on August 15
In many jurisdictions 211 is a viable link to services ex. homeless shelters and case management. Looks like there are options in Superior but I am not from there so I don't know. 211 is usually staffed by nice operators who know the resources well. Good luck.
posted by blnkfrnk at 9:02 PM on August 15 [1 favorite]
posted by blnkfrnk at 9:02 PM on August 15 [1 favorite]
> "I can use law enforcement to remove you as she [Loretta] is on section 8 and has a lease she does not need to evict as yall are considered squatters and there are no squatters rights here"
You could have your kid call this person's bluff.
I'm guessing this Superior is the WI one. While Wisconsin doesn't use time of dwelling to bestow tenants' rights (probably what the other person incorrectly considers "squatters' rights), there are other distinctions that come into play about valid vs invalid tenants that I guarantee you aren't going to something the local cops that show are going want to deal with. Even if the cops did want to insert themselves into a civil matter like this, the landlord has to the one declaring your kid isn't a "holdover" tenant or whatever. If the landlord has to come out and deal with the cops, or even better go to court, then I perhaps this Section 8 tenant isn't worth keeping around let alone lying for.
posted by Back At It Again At Krispy Kreme at 9:38 AM on August 16 [2 favorites]
You could have your kid call this person's bluff.
I'm guessing this Superior is the WI one. While Wisconsin doesn't use time of dwelling to bestow tenants' rights (probably what the other person incorrectly considers "squatters' rights), there are other distinctions that come into play about valid vs invalid tenants that I guarantee you aren't going to something the local cops that show are going want to deal with. Even if the cops did want to insert themselves into a civil matter like this, the landlord has to the one declaring your kid isn't a "holdover" tenant or whatever. If the landlord has to come out and deal with the cops, or even better go to court, then I perhaps this Section 8 tenant isn't worth keeping around let alone lying for.
posted by Back At It Again At Krispy Kreme at 9:38 AM on August 16 [2 favorites]
The problem here is that the one person who loses nothing by calling law enforcement is the landlord.
Section 8 housing rules are deeply, deeply unjust and unfair, but Loretta can in fact lose her section 8 permanently by having your daughter living there.
I suspect that “now” just means “way before Oct 1” rather than “right this instant”. But I really, really wouldn’t play chicken with this situation. This is how permanent family feuds get born. If your daughter is the cause of losing Loretta her section 8, that relationship is always going to have cracks.
I suspect that saying “Hey, I know this is really frustrating for everyone, we can be out in a week” would go a long way (if true). Giving a hard and firm date usually helps in these types of situations. I do not think this is a situation that would be improved by bringing court proceedings into it.
posted by corb at 6:41 PM on August 16 [5 favorites]
Section 8 housing rules are deeply, deeply unjust and unfair, but Loretta can in fact lose her section 8 permanently by having your daughter living there.
I suspect that “now” just means “way before Oct 1” rather than “right this instant”. But I really, really wouldn’t play chicken with this situation. This is how permanent family feuds get born. If your daughter is the cause of losing Loretta her section 8, that relationship is always going to have cracks.
I suspect that saying “Hey, I know this is really frustrating for everyone, we can be out in a week” would go a long way (if true). Giving a hard and firm date usually helps in these types of situations. I do not think this is a situation that would be improved by bringing court proceedings into it.
posted by corb at 6:41 PM on August 16 [5 favorites]
The problem here is that the one person who loses nothing by calling law enforcement is the landlord.
Landlord can get in trouble, too, but the trouble of becoming ineligible for Section 8 is much worse for tenant than for landlord.
posted by praemunire at 8:50 PM on August 16 [1 favorite]
Landlord can get in trouble, too, but the trouble of becoming ineligible for Section 8 is much worse for tenant than for landlord.
posted by praemunire at 8:50 PM on August 16 [1 favorite]
« Older Another help-me-find-a-comic question. Ridiculous... | Tech for participatory democracy? Newer »
You are not logged in, either login or create an account to post comments
The section 8 voucher and eviction court are going to be two different things with different reporting systems and consequences.
Eviction is going to fall under the eviction rules for your city and county, these are going to be highly local and I can't speak to them. In some places the landlord said so is pretty much enough, and law favors landlords. In other places things can be very tenant leaning. Check local laws carefully.
Now the section 8 voucher. The section 8 voucher can be terminated for having unapproved people live there. This means that the person can permanently loose access to subsidized housing through section 8. As it is the biggest public housing program around it effectively removes access to subsidized housing for many people. This is a serious deal and the landlord can decide at any time informing section 8 would make their lives easier and do it.
Someone who looses their voucher still has landlord tenant protections for an eviction. These are essentially two seperate things.
Lutheran Social Services has a fairly large presence in Superior,WI. They might not be the exact place but they would likely know who to talk to.
posted by AlexiaSky at 6:54 PM on August 15 [8 favorites]