Coping with borderline (BPD) spouse?
December 27, 2023 12:02 PM Subscribe
I'm looking for practical, specific tips, from experience, for preserving my own composure and health in a repationship with a BPD (my amateur diagnosis which I don't want to dispute here) spouse and our two pre-teens.
I'm looking for ideas to help my own mental / emotional health primarily, and our family relationships secondarily.
Yes, you are not a therapist. Yes, I am actively trying to get us into family therapy (again).
After over a decade and plenty of therapy for myself, I (independently) arrived at my own working hypothesis that she has BPD as a result of childhood traumas (no details will be given here). Certainly the symptoms match from my reading. She won't get her own therapy but she was willing to come along to couples' counselling. It was a failure but that was before I realized it could be BPD holding us back. I will try again.
Some of the key behaviours I want to understand & deal with better are
- lack of day to day communication from her side
- constant, low-level conflicts about everyday matters
- procrastination and poor self-care (hers)
- escalation of minor disagreements (I believe they call it splitting?)
- reenacting conflicts that I strongly suppose must have happened in her family of origin and casting me as the bad guy to be defended against
- lack of trust and consequently her taking over every aspect of family life, leading to her overworking, burning out, and blaming me for it
- general negative view of life and low self-esteem (hers; I'm dealing with my own!)
- tendency to split the family into husband bad (me), wife and kids good
Again, I am looking for coping strategies and insights, not judgement or disputes about my ability to diagnose (I am already aware I am not a psychiatrist).
I'm looking for ideas to help my own mental / emotional health primarily, and our family relationships secondarily.
Yes, you are not a therapist. Yes, I am actively trying to get us into family therapy (again).
After over a decade and plenty of therapy for myself, I (independently) arrived at my own working hypothesis that she has BPD as a result of childhood traumas (no details will be given here). Certainly the symptoms match from my reading. She won't get her own therapy but she was willing to come along to couples' counselling. It was a failure but that was before I realized it could be BPD holding us back. I will try again.
Some of the key behaviours I want to understand & deal with better are
- lack of day to day communication from her side
- constant, low-level conflicts about everyday matters
- procrastination and poor self-care (hers)
- escalation of minor disagreements (I believe they call it splitting?)
- reenacting conflicts that I strongly suppose must have happened in her family of origin and casting me as the bad guy to be defended against
- lack of trust and consequently her taking over every aspect of family life, leading to her overworking, burning out, and blaming me for it
- general negative view of life and low self-esteem (hers; I'm dealing with my own!)
- tendency to split the family into husband bad (me), wife and kids good
Again, I am looking for coping strategies and insights, not judgement or disputes about my ability to diagnose (I am already aware I am not a psychiatrist).
IF she truly IS BPD: 1. Don’t react. Don’t fuel the fire. 2. Prepare for it to get worse anyway. 3. Prepare an exit plan because although I don’t know the specifics of your marriage, but my (officially diagnosed — she fired that shrink immediately, a tell-tale indicator, actually) BPD ex-wife just escalated and escalated until there was no other option but to leave, and then spent a couple months alternately trying to win me back and throwing tantrums. From Sept. when I began my exit until February when I hired a divorce lawyer were some of the most traumatic months of my life, and even after all these years there’s not a damn thing I can think of that I might have done to make it less bad.
Don’t stay for the kids. We split when my daughter was five, and by the time she was six, she was telling me how glad she was the fighting had stopped.
posted by Devils Rancher at 12:18 PM on December 27, 2023 [16 favorites]
Don’t stay for the kids. We split when my daughter was five, and by the time she was six, she was telling me how glad she was the fighting had stopped.
posted by Devils Rancher at 12:18 PM on December 27, 2023 [16 favorites]
Autistic and ADHD women often get misdiagnosed with BPD and supports known to be helpful for autism and ADHD can often dramatically reduce symptoms. In case that helps with your web searching!
posted by The Last Sockpuppet at 12:24 PM on December 27, 2023 [24 favorites]
posted by The Last Sockpuppet at 12:24 PM on December 27, 2023 [24 favorites]
NPD also gets misdiagnosed as BPD, and is even more resistant to obtaining help.
Please don't stay for the kids. Even well-treated BPD can be incredibly damaging for them.
The best thing you can do to cope is to go into it with a willingness to try... but with the understanding that if she is not putting in even more effort than you are, that trying will not accomplish anything but harm.
It's not a failure on your part to refuse to subject yourself and your children to the sunk cost fallacy... and it sounds like you may already be playing with that particular grenade.
posted by stormyteal at 1:23 PM on December 27, 2023 [5 favorites]
Please don't stay for the kids. Even well-treated BPD can be incredibly damaging for them.
The best thing you can do to cope is to go into it with a willingness to try... but with the understanding that if she is not putting in even more effort than you are, that trying will not accomplish anything but harm.
It's not a failure on your part to refuse to subject yourself and your children to the sunk cost fallacy... and it sounds like you may already be playing with that particular grenade.
posted by stormyteal at 1:23 PM on December 27, 2023 [5 favorites]
> She won't get her own therapy
My mom has untreated, unmanaged BPD, so the immediate alarm bell that rings out to me in your post is that you have two pre-teens in the same predicament that I was. Let me tell you what I wish my dad would have done for me:
I wish he would have been a consistent calming presence in MY life. But he wasn't. He was totally absent from my life because he was spending all his time and energy trying to manage my mother (or avoiding her). In comparison to my mother, we (his children) were easy and calm and happy, much more in control of our own lives and emotions than she was. So he considered us to be a "solved problem" and didn't check in.
> She won't get her own therapy
My mom didn't get her own therapy. She didn't think she needed it. So my dad was "it". He couldn't have checked in on his kids even if he wanted to and had thought it necessary. Why? Because he burnt himself out trying to deal with my mom 100% of the time. He thought it was his duty to tiptoe around her, being careful not to set her off, and shushing us if we seemed to be in danger of setting her off. And when she inevitably got triggered and went off for whatever reason, he would spend a lot of time and energy engaging with her, trying to soothe her, trying to talk sense into her, trying to get her to understand, etc. Or.... he would argue with her, lose his temper with her, shout and yell right back at her, and then go off on his own to calm down.
> She won't get her own therapy
My mom didn't get her own therapy, so my dad felt responsible for her. I wish that my dad had instead separated himself from my mother (if not physically and legally then at least emotionally). I wish he had *mentally* let her go, let her be, and left her alone to manage herself at least 90% of the time. I wish that he hadn't bothered to tiptoe around her. I wish that when my mom was on a rampage, he would have taken his kids to get ice cream or gone with us for a walk, instead of engaging with her or trying to calm her down. I wish my dad had understood the concept of emotional boundaries: that her emotions are HERS to resolve, not his duty to soothe.
I wish he would have reclaimed his time and energy to focus on himself and his children. (It would have been impossible for him to focus on his kids without also taking enough time and energy to focus on himself.) I literally had to wait until age 37 and finding an amazing therapist before I understood that it was possible for a person in a caretaking role towards me to be kind towards me, thoughtful of my needs, and make space for my personality or feelings. My dad had the capacity to be that kind of parent, but he chose not to. He chose to burn out taking care of my mom.
> She won't get her own therapy
My mom didn't get her own therapy. My dad knew she needed it, but he never acknowledged that out loud to us, his kids. As a result, we grew up thinking my mom's treatment of us was normal. That there was nothing wrong with us being her designated parents. That it was painful but normal that she beat us up because we drank milk at the wrong speed. That it was understandable that she threw me against the wall one minute, making me split my foreheard open, and the next minute she worshipped me like a goddess, kissing my feet and telling me I was divine and she was sorry.
I wish my dad would have acknowledged my mother's instability to us, his kids, in open and explicit words. He could have said, "Yeah, I know how your mother gets sometimes. What's it like for you?" or he could have asked, "I'm wondering, does your mother ever get irrationally angry with you?" But my dad was too busy being loyal to my mom to ever voice such a thing to us, and he was too busy being in denial about how out of control my mother was to let himself consider the possibility that his children were being seriously harmed by her. He closed his eyes to the abuse we were suffering. She lied to him and pretended to be a good mom in front of him.
> She won't get her own therapy
Let me just say this as clearly and unambiguously as I can:
IF YOUR WIFE HAS UNTREATED BPD, SHE IS NOT A SAFE PARENT FOR YOUR CHILDREN. Take your children and leave. If you can't, then the least you can do is stop focusing 100% of your energies on managing her, make it more like 10%. Set hard limits on how much time you will spend per day solving your wife and her triggers and her needs and her outbursts. Make a very deliberate and focused practice of spending *more* time than what you allocate to your wife, on yourself, and at least double that amount on your children. Stop making your wife the focus of your life and your attention.
posted by MiraK at 1:39 PM on December 27, 2023 [62 favorites]
My mom has untreated, unmanaged BPD, so the immediate alarm bell that rings out to me in your post is that you have two pre-teens in the same predicament that I was. Let me tell you what I wish my dad would have done for me:
I wish he would have been a consistent calming presence in MY life. But he wasn't. He was totally absent from my life because he was spending all his time and energy trying to manage my mother (or avoiding her). In comparison to my mother, we (his children) were easy and calm and happy, much more in control of our own lives and emotions than she was. So he considered us to be a "solved problem" and didn't check in.
> She won't get her own therapy
My mom didn't get her own therapy. She didn't think she needed it. So my dad was "it". He couldn't have checked in on his kids even if he wanted to and had thought it necessary. Why? Because he burnt himself out trying to deal with my mom 100% of the time. He thought it was his duty to tiptoe around her, being careful not to set her off, and shushing us if we seemed to be in danger of setting her off. And when she inevitably got triggered and went off for whatever reason, he would spend a lot of time and energy engaging with her, trying to soothe her, trying to talk sense into her, trying to get her to understand, etc. Or.... he would argue with her, lose his temper with her, shout and yell right back at her, and then go off on his own to calm down.
> She won't get her own therapy
My mom didn't get her own therapy, so my dad felt responsible for her. I wish that my dad had instead separated himself from my mother (if not physically and legally then at least emotionally). I wish he had *mentally* let her go, let her be, and left her alone to manage herself at least 90% of the time. I wish that he hadn't bothered to tiptoe around her. I wish that when my mom was on a rampage, he would have taken his kids to get ice cream or gone with us for a walk, instead of engaging with her or trying to calm her down. I wish my dad had understood the concept of emotional boundaries: that her emotions are HERS to resolve, not his duty to soothe.
I wish he would have reclaimed his time and energy to focus on himself and his children. (It would have been impossible for him to focus on his kids without also taking enough time and energy to focus on himself.) I literally had to wait until age 37 and finding an amazing therapist before I understood that it was possible for a person in a caretaking role towards me to be kind towards me, thoughtful of my needs, and make space for my personality or feelings. My dad had the capacity to be that kind of parent, but he chose not to. He chose to burn out taking care of my mom.
> She won't get her own therapy
My mom didn't get her own therapy. My dad knew she needed it, but he never acknowledged that out loud to us, his kids. As a result, we grew up thinking my mom's treatment of us was normal. That there was nothing wrong with us being her designated parents. That it was painful but normal that she beat us up because we drank milk at the wrong speed. That it was understandable that she threw me against the wall one minute, making me split my foreheard open, and the next minute she worshipped me like a goddess, kissing my feet and telling me I was divine and she was sorry.
I wish my dad would have acknowledged my mother's instability to us, his kids, in open and explicit words. He could have said, "Yeah, I know how your mother gets sometimes. What's it like for you?" or he could have asked, "I'm wondering, does your mother ever get irrationally angry with you?" But my dad was too busy being loyal to my mom to ever voice such a thing to us, and he was too busy being in denial about how out of control my mother was to let himself consider the possibility that his children were being seriously harmed by her. He closed his eyes to the abuse we were suffering. She lied to him and pretended to be a good mom in front of him.
> She won't get her own therapy
Let me just say this as clearly and unambiguously as I can:
IF YOUR WIFE HAS UNTREATED BPD, SHE IS NOT A SAFE PARENT FOR YOUR CHILDREN. Take your children and leave. If you can't, then the least you can do is stop focusing 100% of your energies on managing her, make it more like 10%. Set hard limits on how much time you will spend per day solving your wife and her triggers and her needs and her outbursts. Make a very deliberate and focused practice of spending *more* time than what you allocate to your wife, on yourself, and at least double that amount on your children. Stop making your wife the focus of your life and your attention.
posted by MiraK at 1:39 PM on December 27, 2023 [62 favorites]
Take care of yourself and your kids. That's your priority. This is a LOT of work to try to understand and reason with your spouse. I really want to encourage you to do everything you can to shield your kids but also not try to get her to be different, because that's out of your control. She won't be different unless she wants to, and even then, it'll be a slog.
You are the parent your kids need. You will not make them better by working on her.
Maybe embrace being the bad guy, but not actually, by walking away with those kids, to give them a safer and more emotionally nourishing home. Our responsibilities are to our young kids more than our spouses, and kids benefit from a stable home.
posted by bluedaisy at 2:02 PM on December 27, 2023 [3 favorites]
You are the parent your kids need. You will not make them better by working on her.
Maybe embrace being the bad guy, but not actually, by walking away with those kids, to give them a safer and more emotionally nourishing home. Our responsibilities are to our young kids more than our spouses, and kids benefit from a stable home.
posted by bluedaisy at 2:02 PM on December 27, 2023 [3 favorites]
Best answer: I want to add some concrete steps you can take to follow the advice I gave above:
- Stop researching your wife's condition. Stop trying to understand her issues. Stop trying to figure out what's going on in her head. Stop trying to work out the magic set of words and behaviors that will keep her happy.
--------> How can you stop? By breaking your habit of focusing all your thoughts on her. Keep a journal on your notes app on your phone. Make a note every time you find yourself thinking about her or researching her etc. Count up how many times you think of her each day, for a whole week. The next week, try to reduce that number by 10%. Then 20% cut the week after. And so on. Substituting the habit with a different one works better than berating yourself, so, every time you become aware that you're thinking about how to solve your wife, do five pushups.
- Practice emotional detachment from your wife. Her issues are her own. Her feelings are her own. Her trauma is her own. Her low self esteem is her own. Etc. None of these are your problem or your burden. Practice being kind and loving to her without getting emotionally involved with her drama du jour, and without taking on her sorrows as your own. Separate yourself emotionally. A concrete way to do this is, when she's coming at you with all her upset feelings, to say to yourself inside your head, "SHE is feeling upset. *I* am feeling quite happy because I had a great day at work." As you breathe in, focus on the sensation of your own happiness. Look your wife in the eyes, nod, and say out loud to her, "Yes, I see why you're upset. That would make me very angry too." Then go get yourself a cup of tea. You don't have to engage any more than that with her feelings.
- When she's triggered, physically leave the house or at least the room. Take the kids with you. Take deep breaths, calm yourself physically and mentally, and remind yourself that your feelings are not her feelings, you feel fine, and she alone is responsible for getting herself to a place of equilibrium. Teach your kids these practices and ideas, so that they, too, learn not to feel responsible for someone else's meltdown, and they too can keep themselves safe when someone else is having big feelings at them.
- Take an hour or at least thirty minutes every day purely for your own self care. Meditate, do a hobby, boost yourself, make yourself feel good about you and about being alive. Daily practice keeps you strong and capable of giving your kids what they need.
- Give your kids as much time as you possibly can with you alone, minimum one hour per day, having normal, calm, even-keeled parenting interactions. Show them that it's possible to hang out with a parent in a relaxed manner, without underlying tension. Show them what a normal disagreement between parent and child looks like. Show them what normal discipline works like. Show them that children are supposed to have feelings at parents, and not the other way around. Show them how parents are supposed to make room for children and focus on children's needs, without asking for caretaking or appeasement from child to parent in return. Show them that a normal parent doesn't become dysregulated and devastated just because a child says something unloving. Show them over and over and over and over. Thousands of times. You need to work extra hard to counteract the messages they have received from their mother.
posted by MiraK at 2:05 PM on December 27, 2023 [42 favorites]
- Stop researching your wife's condition. Stop trying to understand her issues. Stop trying to figure out what's going on in her head. Stop trying to work out the magic set of words and behaviors that will keep her happy.
--------> How can you stop? By breaking your habit of focusing all your thoughts on her. Keep a journal on your notes app on your phone. Make a note every time you find yourself thinking about her or researching her etc. Count up how many times you think of her each day, for a whole week. The next week, try to reduce that number by 10%. Then 20% cut the week after. And so on. Substituting the habit with a different one works better than berating yourself, so, every time you become aware that you're thinking about how to solve your wife, do five pushups.
- Practice emotional detachment from your wife. Her issues are her own. Her feelings are her own. Her trauma is her own. Her low self esteem is her own. Etc. None of these are your problem or your burden. Practice being kind and loving to her without getting emotionally involved with her drama du jour, and without taking on her sorrows as your own. Separate yourself emotionally. A concrete way to do this is, when she's coming at you with all her upset feelings, to say to yourself inside your head, "SHE is feeling upset. *I* am feeling quite happy because I had a great day at work." As you breathe in, focus on the sensation of your own happiness. Look your wife in the eyes, nod, and say out loud to her, "Yes, I see why you're upset. That would make me very angry too." Then go get yourself a cup of tea. You don't have to engage any more than that with her feelings.
- When she's triggered, physically leave the house or at least the room. Take the kids with you. Take deep breaths, calm yourself physically and mentally, and remind yourself that your feelings are not her feelings, you feel fine, and she alone is responsible for getting herself to a place of equilibrium. Teach your kids these practices and ideas, so that they, too, learn not to feel responsible for someone else's meltdown, and they too can keep themselves safe when someone else is having big feelings at them.
- Take an hour or at least thirty minutes every day purely for your own self care. Meditate, do a hobby, boost yourself, make yourself feel good about you and about being alive. Daily practice keeps you strong and capable of giving your kids what they need.
- Give your kids as much time as you possibly can with you alone, minimum one hour per day, having normal, calm, even-keeled parenting interactions. Show them that it's possible to hang out with a parent in a relaxed manner, without underlying tension. Show them what a normal disagreement between parent and child looks like. Show them what normal discipline works like. Show them that children are supposed to have feelings at parents, and not the other way around. Show them how parents are supposed to make room for children and focus on children's needs, without asking for caretaking or appeasement from child to parent in return. Show them that a normal parent doesn't become dysregulated and devastated just because a child says something unloving. Show them over and over and over and over. Thousands of times. You need to work extra hard to counteract the messages they have received from their mother.
posted by MiraK at 2:05 PM on December 27, 2023 [42 favorites]
Best answer: I want to provide a somewhat different perspective. I think it's entirely possible to manage a relationship with someone with BPD if you are the primary person they go to in their life. I've done this and it has been okay. I believe in BPD forums and such they refer to this as "favorite person" stuff - that people with BPD tend to have one person that they center a lot of their emotion around. If you are in this position to your wife, then you have a lot of influence and a lot of ability to control behavior through requests. If you are not in this position, it is harder.
One big help is something called 'dear man' dbt communication. Don't try to judge your wife, talk about how things impact you in a matter of fact sort of way, and reward when she does the things that are good and helpful and healing in the relationship. BPD people tend to act up when things activate their perceived fears - if you are able to reassure them in their fears and avoid major triggers, it's quite possible to have a relatively stable relationship.
Another thing that can help is asking for the evidence for various beliefs - not in an accusatory way, but just in a "hey, these things you are thinking and feeling, I don't think they're right, but I want to understand why you feel this way". If she can break down why she thinks those things to their root causes, you may be able to understand and actually solve the root issues and get on a much more stable basis moving forward.
posted by corb at 2:23 PM on December 27, 2023 [9 favorites]
One big help is something called 'dear man' dbt communication. Don't try to judge your wife, talk about how things impact you in a matter of fact sort of way, and reward when she does the things that are good and helpful and healing in the relationship. BPD people tend to act up when things activate their perceived fears - if you are able to reassure them in their fears and avoid major triggers, it's quite possible to have a relatively stable relationship.
Another thing that can help is asking for the evidence for various beliefs - not in an accusatory way, but just in a "hey, these things you are thinking and feeling, I don't think they're right, but I want to understand why you feel this way". If she can break down why she thinks those things to their root causes, you may be able to understand and actually solve the root issues and get on a much more stable basis moving forward.
posted by corb at 2:23 PM on December 27, 2023 [9 favorites]
reenacting conflicts that I strongly suppose must have happened in her family of origin and casting me as the bad guy to be defended against
if you are sufficiently educated and invested in psychotherapy/psychiatric terminology to understand and like BPD as an explanatory concept/relational framework, you should also know or believe that everyone does this. you, her, everyone. believing that everyone, including you, does this when under stress is the foundation of traditional psychotherapeutic practice. since you have been in therapy this should already have been made very clear to you. transference and so forth. I am sure you are right that she does this (because everyone does when they momentarily forget themselves, disordered or not) but you must understand that you are also doing it.
for instance, people who have overcome the universal unconscious drive to re-enact formative but unhealthy relationship structures do not, typically, end up in long-lasting, power-struggling, mutually distrustful marriages to untreated BPD sufferers. though there are exceptions to all such rules.
anyway you don't have to be a psychiatrist to recognize patterns and correctly apply DSM terminology, no. far from it. and your spouse doesn't have to accept that specific psychiatric classification before she can engage productively in couples therapy either. but you do have to share some basic mutual understanding of real events in order to have any real relationship that isn't just you managing, manipulating, and "coping" with her.
like, say you bring up some specific escalation or overreaction she had, does she say a) Yeah I said that but I wasn't "overreacting," it was fully warranted because (whatever)? or b) Yeah I said that, and it's your fault because of what you said first? or c)You're lying, you know I never said that.
a) and b) you can work on together no matter what her diagnosis is or what you think it is. c), you can't.
posted by queenofbithynia at 5:05 PM on December 27, 2023 [12 favorites]
if you are sufficiently educated and invested in psychotherapy/psychiatric terminology to understand and like BPD as an explanatory concept/relational framework, you should also know or believe that everyone does this. you, her, everyone. believing that everyone, including you, does this when under stress is the foundation of traditional psychotherapeutic practice. since you have been in therapy this should already have been made very clear to you. transference and so forth. I am sure you are right that she does this (because everyone does when they momentarily forget themselves, disordered or not) but you must understand that you are also doing it.
for instance, people who have overcome the universal unconscious drive to re-enact formative but unhealthy relationship structures do not, typically, end up in long-lasting, power-struggling, mutually distrustful marriages to untreated BPD sufferers. though there are exceptions to all such rules.
anyway you don't have to be a psychiatrist to recognize patterns and correctly apply DSM terminology, no. far from it. and your spouse doesn't have to accept that specific psychiatric classification before she can engage productively in couples therapy either. but you do have to share some basic mutual understanding of real events in order to have any real relationship that isn't just you managing, manipulating, and "coping" with her.
like, say you bring up some specific escalation or overreaction she had, does she say a) Yeah I said that but I wasn't "overreacting," it was fully warranted because (whatever)? or b) Yeah I said that, and it's your fault because of what you said first? or c)You're lying, you know I never said that.
a) and b) you can work on together no matter what her diagnosis is or what you think it is. c), you can't.
posted by queenofbithynia at 5:05 PM on December 27, 2023 [12 favorites]
Best answer: Dialectical behavioral therapy is the "gold standard" for BPD treatment. Perhaps you could try to introduce some techniques from BPD worksheets into co-regulating strategies with your spouse.
What you describe as "splitting" is not splitting -- splitting is binary thinking, everything is black or white, idealized or demonized. I am sure it can lead to escalation of minor disagreements, but it is, definitionally, something other than the escalation you describe. In both cases, some of the DBT "scrips" as well as frameworks from MBT (mentalization based therapy) can be helpful to create a vocabulary between yourself and your spouse that objectifies her dysregulated feelings into something she can, through understanding them as processes (hopefully) feel in control of, rather than feel controlled by.
I know nothing about your marriage, so I have no idea whether trying to incorporate strategies from DBT and MBT would be helpful. In some relationships it could be. If you already have a dynamic in your relationship where she feels pathologized by you (possibly reading between the lines of her refusing therapy that you suggested), she might not be open to it.
I would also encourage you to self-reflect on how your history and personality intersect and interact with your spouse's BPD. What informed your partner selection in this case? Do you have tendencies (for example, passive-aggression or avoidance) that may interlock with some of the affects and behaviors of BPD (volatility, fear of abandonment)? Are you interested in changing them as one of the strategies of mitigating your spouse's triggers and thus creating a more peaceful home life for yourself? Those are all things you can discuss with your own therapist. Do you have a history of being codependent in relationships? Do you have a history of relationships with addicts? BPD is not that different from addiction in how it affects family dynamics, in centering said family dynamics around an unpredictable and potentially volatile person. Perhaps something in CODA or Al-Anon literature may be of use to you.
Also for yourself, probably mindfulness practices, and other distress tolerance skills, could make this a smoother ride.
posted by virve at 5:32 PM on December 27, 2023 [8 favorites]
What you describe as "splitting" is not splitting -- splitting is binary thinking, everything is black or white, idealized or demonized. I am sure it can lead to escalation of minor disagreements, but it is, definitionally, something other than the escalation you describe. In both cases, some of the DBT "scrips" as well as frameworks from MBT (mentalization based therapy) can be helpful to create a vocabulary between yourself and your spouse that objectifies her dysregulated feelings into something she can, through understanding them as processes (hopefully) feel in control of, rather than feel controlled by.
I know nothing about your marriage, so I have no idea whether trying to incorporate strategies from DBT and MBT would be helpful. In some relationships it could be. If you already have a dynamic in your relationship where she feels pathologized by you (possibly reading between the lines of her refusing therapy that you suggested), she might not be open to it.
I would also encourage you to self-reflect on how your history and personality intersect and interact with your spouse's BPD. What informed your partner selection in this case? Do you have tendencies (for example, passive-aggression or avoidance) that may interlock with some of the affects and behaviors of BPD (volatility, fear of abandonment)? Are you interested in changing them as one of the strategies of mitigating your spouse's triggers and thus creating a more peaceful home life for yourself? Those are all things you can discuss with your own therapist. Do you have a history of being codependent in relationships? Do you have a history of relationships with addicts? BPD is not that different from addiction in how it affects family dynamics, in centering said family dynamics around an unpredictable and potentially volatile person. Perhaps something in CODA or Al-Anon literature may be of use to you.
Also for yourself, probably mindfulness practices, and other distress tolerance skills, could make this a smoother ride.
posted by virve at 5:32 PM on December 27, 2023 [8 favorites]
What you described doesn’t necessarily sound like BPD to me. (My partner has been diagnosed with it.) What you wrote could reflect any number of diagnoses, or, honestly, a reaction to an unhappy relationship between two poorly matched people. I’ve seen a lot of men diagnose their female partners with BPD when they’re worlds apart in terms of communication and needs, doesn’t mean BPD has anything to do with it.
Maybe there’s more you haven’t shared but I don’t see it here and would be cautious about a big diagnosis like that.
For BPD though, validating what makes sense about their emotions (whether or not they’re rational according to you, or reality-based) is the quickest way to calm someone down.
posted by cotton dress sock at 6:28 PM on December 27, 2023 [16 favorites]
Maybe there’s more you haven’t shared but I don’t see it here and would be cautious about a big diagnosis like that.
For BPD though, validating what makes sense about their emotions (whether or not they’re rational according to you, or reality-based) is the quickest way to calm someone down.
posted by cotton dress sock at 6:28 PM on December 27, 2023 [16 favorites]
I left my spouse with serious mental illness. My daughter’s grades improved immediately, and she participated more in hobbies and sport.
You might be afraid that she will self-harm if you leave. That is outside your control. My spouse ultimately did die of suicide. It was not the end of the world.
I left to teach my daughter that verbal abuse is not ok. We had a terrible outcome and I am still confident that I made the right decision.
Your spouse is responsible for managing her mental health. If she refuses to do so it’s ultimatum time. Your kids deserve the time and energy that you’re currently pouring into an adult.
posted by shock muppet at 8:02 PM on December 27, 2023 [11 favorites]
You might be afraid that she will self-harm if you leave. That is outside your control. My spouse ultimately did die of suicide. It was not the end of the world.
I left to teach my daughter that verbal abuse is not ok. We had a terrible outcome and I am still confident that I made the right decision.
Your spouse is responsible for managing her mental health. If she refuses to do so it’s ultimatum time. Your kids deserve the time and energy that you’re currently pouring into an adult.
posted by shock muppet at 8:02 PM on December 27, 2023 [11 favorites]
Gently, it seems like applying this amateur diagnosis places the blame for all of the problems that you’re seeing on her and her mental health. Instead of showing accountability and trying to recognize and address the ways you’ve contributed to this dynamic, you seem to be labeling her as a problem you have to deal with. Some examples:
Constant, low-level conflicts: the implication seems to be that she is making a big deal about small things, basically creating conflict for conflicts sake. But being a heterosexual woman in a marriage with kids is hard, and what you see as petty conflicts over day to day matters could actually be rooted in something that’s a big deal and causing big problems for her. I see such a tendency in men to be so quick to label women as overreacting instead of trying to see where they’re coming from. What is your role here? Are you truly trying to understand where she’s coming from, or are you deflecting and blaming?
Lack of trust and taking over your family life: this is so common because sometimes, as a wife and mother, you get it done because you have to and nobody else will. It’s well known that so much of the emotional labor falls on women, and sometimes delegating jobs or waiting for your spouse to step up is harder, more time consuming, and causes more problems in the long run than doing it yourself. What is the division of emotional labor in your household? When was the last time you asked your wife how she’s handling the work and stress of motherhood and really took the time to listen to her answer?
I don’t say this to be harsh, but I want you to be really cautious about labeling her as the problem and crazy one and absolving yourself of responsibility in the process.
Finally, sometimes it just doesn’t work. If you’re at the point of diagnosing your wife with a serious mental illness behind her back, and she’s straight up refusing therapy, what are you supposed to do? You can’t change, fix, or manage her. Reading between the lines it seems like there’s some resentment here. You cannot fix her and it feels problematic to me to even try. Sometimes you just have to walk away.
Good luck!
posted by Amy93 at 8:17 PM on December 27, 2023 [32 favorites]
Constant, low-level conflicts: the implication seems to be that she is making a big deal about small things, basically creating conflict for conflicts sake. But being a heterosexual woman in a marriage with kids is hard, and what you see as petty conflicts over day to day matters could actually be rooted in something that’s a big deal and causing big problems for her. I see such a tendency in men to be so quick to label women as overreacting instead of trying to see where they’re coming from. What is your role here? Are you truly trying to understand where she’s coming from, or are you deflecting and blaming?
Lack of trust and taking over your family life: this is so common because sometimes, as a wife and mother, you get it done because you have to and nobody else will. It’s well known that so much of the emotional labor falls on women, and sometimes delegating jobs or waiting for your spouse to step up is harder, more time consuming, and causes more problems in the long run than doing it yourself. What is the division of emotional labor in your household? When was the last time you asked your wife how she’s handling the work and stress of motherhood and really took the time to listen to her answer?
I don’t say this to be harsh, but I want you to be really cautious about labeling her as the problem and crazy one and absolving yourself of responsibility in the process.
Finally, sometimes it just doesn’t work. If you’re at the point of diagnosing your wife with a serious mental illness behind her back, and she’s straight up refusing therapy, what are you supposed to do? You can’t change, fix, or manage her. Reading between the lines it seems like there’s some resentment here. You cannot fix her and it feels problematic to me to even try. Sometimes you just have to walk away.
Good luck!
posted by Amy93 at 8:17 PM on December 27, 2023 [32 favorites]
The book ”Stop walking on eggshells” often gets recommended here for people with loved ones with BPD.
- lack of trust and consequently her taking over every aspect of family life, leading to her overworking, burning out, and blaming me for it
Take some time to think about whether there’s anything you’re contributing to this. In a heterosexual relationship, there’s a good chance that you are. In any case, make sure you’re taking initiative dealing with the daily grind and life logistics. Notice the problems and things that need to be done, organized, tidied, cleaned, prepared, planned, bought, talked about, booked, etc. Think through those and come up with solutions proactively, tell her about what you’re doing unless it’s a small thing you can just fix right away and where telling her would only be a bother for her. Then, follow through and do the thing. Set reminders for yourself, don’t wait to be told what to do and when. Be reliable and thorough. Communicate clearly and nicely.
It may take some time to work and to affect her trust. Unless you’re part of a statistically small group of men in heterosexual relationships that do all this already, and if so, enjoy the validation, it may have a big positive impact on your relationship, regardless of diagnoses.
posted by meijusa at 2:54 AM on December 28, 2023 [7 favorites]
- lack of trust and consequently her taking over every aspect of family life, leading to her overworking, burning out, and blaming me for it
Take some time to think about whether there’s anything you’re contributing to this. In a heterosexual relationship, there’s a good chance that you are. In any case, make sure you’re taking initiative dealing with the daily grind and life logistics. Notice the problems and things that need to be done, organized, tidied, cleaned, prepared, planned, bought, talked about, booked, etc. Think through those and come up with solutions proactively, tell her about what you’re doing unless it’s a small thing you can just fix right away and where telling her would only be a bother for her. Then, follow through and do the thing. Set reminders for yourself, don’t wait to be told what to do and when. Be reliable and thorough. Communicate clearly and nicely.
It may take some time to work and to affect her trust. Unless you’re part of a statistically small group of men in heterosexual relationships that do all this already, and if so, enjoy the validation, it may have a big positive impact on your relationship, regardless of diagnoses.
posted by meijusa at 2:54 AM on December 28, 2023 [7 favorites]
Best answer: Read Margalis Fjelstad's "Stop Caretaking the Borderline or Narcissist" over "Stop Walking on Eggshells," hands down.
posted by wormtales at 6:21 AM on December 28, 2023 [3 favorites]
posted by wormtales at 6:21 AM on December 28, 2023 [3 favorites]
Best answer: Also, without wanting to negate anyone's individual experience I do want to say that the idea that being the primary attachment figure offers a layer protection or influence is, in general, extremely misguided. If this really is untreated BPD, a hallmark of the disorder is that if you are that person, you can throw your life away trying to head off their dysregulation or soothe it once it inevitably blows up and you will still end up being cast as the cause of their pain and turned, over time, into the wrongdoer and often "abuser" in your BPD partner's view. It is a losing game. (Couples counseling is generally a nonstarter in these cases, fwiw.)
To echo MiraK, my experience as a single parent dating someone with serious mental illness is that I was significantly less present for my child as I attended to my then-partner's massive emotional needs. They overheard and witnessed things that I was not able to give them honest guidance and reflection on without contradicting the fictions constructed to keep the peace (in other words: I could not say 'I'm so sorry; what's going on here is totally unhealthy and not at all okay,' which is what needed to be said and, more than that, modeled). This was actually a major factor in finally deciding to get out. I could see what the future looked like and what staying would do to my kid's life and to our relationship, and I would never have forgiven myself if I signed us up for that life in the long term. The chaos I was for whatever reason willing to subject myself to wasn't something I could in good conscience choose for another human who was not able to consent and whose wellbeing was my greatest responsibility. It's not totally clear to me from the limited details you've shared that you're describing BPD, but if things are lining up in ways that mean damage to your kids' emotional or physical wellbeing, please consider this very seriously.
posted by wormtales at 7:00 AM on December 28, 2023 [11 favorites]
To echo MiraK, my experience as a single parent dating someone with serious mental illness is that I was significantly less present for my child as I attended to my then-partner's massive emotional needs. They overheard and witnessed things that I was not able to give them honest guidance and reflection on without contradicting the fictions constructed to keep the peace (in other words: I could not say 'I'm so sorry; what's going on here is totally unhealthy and not at all okay,' which is what needed to be said and, more than that, modeled). This was actually a major factor in finally deciding to get out. I could see what the future looked like and what staying would do to my kid's life and to our relationship, and I would never have forgiven myself if I signed us up for that life in the long term. The chaos I was for whatever reason willing to subject myself to wasn't something I could in good conscience choose for another human who was not able to consent and whose wellbeing was my greatest responsibility. It's not totally clear to me from the limited details you've shared that you're describing BPD, but if things are lining up in ways that mean damage to your kids' emotional or physical wellbeing, please consider this very seriously.
posted by wormtales at 7:00 AM on December 28, 2023 [11 favorites]
Not sure if this has been mentioned, but family therapy with the kids could be a real help. Or therapists just for the kids or therapy for you and the kids. You’ll have to ask around to find someone in your area. You could talk with your own doctor about your concerns. You could talk to your child’s pediatrician. Maybe they even have online meetings that could enable you to focus on this issue as a family issue you need help with. My family of origin was dysfunctional and the best thing my mom did was acknowledging the dysfunction. We did family therapy. Dad was openly in AA. This did not solve the problems or create a trauma-free environment but it was helpful. My mom did a lot of papering over the bad and I can see and appreciate her effort while also being sad and mad that she didn’t just remove us kids from the chaotic parent. Other people are suggesting you pivot your attentions from your spouse to yourself and your kids. I agree.
posted by amanda at 7:24 AM on December 28, 2023 [4 favorites]
posted by amanda at 7:24 AM on December 28, 2023 [4 favorites]
Best answer: Really want to echo wormtales thoughts and say please read Margalis Fjelstad's "Stop Caretaking the Borderline or Narcissist". Regardless if your partner has full-fledged diagnosed BPD, NPD, or just scores very high on these traits, the book is helpful because it focuses on your reaction to their behavior and helps you understand what's happening in their head. Seriously, I have not come across a more helpful book in all my reading.
posted by SinAesthetic at 9:35 AM on December 28, 2023 [3 favorites]
posted by SinAesthetic at 9:35 AM on December 28, 2023 [3 favorites]
Great book about dealing with someone who has Borderline Personality Disorder, also useful for dealing with anyone who has poor boundaries, is manipulative, highly dramatic, etc. Stop Walking on Eggshells. I have/had family members with Bipolar Disorder, possible Borderline Personality Disorder, Narcissism. The strategies in the book are really helpful. Manage your own behavior, respond to the spouse's behavior (not emotional content or your perception of their emotions), develop strong boundaries.
I think Borderline is a poorly defined diagnosis, but the response to it can be healthy and not unkind.
posted by theora55 at 10:54 AM on December 28, 2023 [1 favorite]
I think Borderline is a poorly defined diagnosis, but the response to it can be healthy and not unkind.
posted by theora55 at 10:54 AM on December 28, 2023 [1 favorite]
I've been thinking about this question and if I leave aside the potential diagnosis and just look at the list of things you want help with--this reads as a woman who is completely overwhelmed. When I get overwhelmed, I stop communicating. It's like one more thing I don't have the energy to do (forming words). The part about how she has taken control of every aspect of family life and then gets burnt out--usually that happens in a hetero partnership because the partner has let her down, repeatedly in small or large ways. (Things I have seen partners do: Say that you'll return that suitcase you borrowed and then forget about it for a month, say you'll empty the dishwasher and then not do it until she's huffing around the kitchen, say that you'll schedule the dentist for the kids but then ask who the dentist is or schedule it with the assumption that she'll be taking them.... It all adds up.)
So my advice for coping with this would be to get a copy of Fair Play and do the card sorting exercise. Even by yourself! If that shows that there is an imbalance of household labor (emotional or otherwise), correct it. Literally do whatever you can to make her life easier.
Also do what MiraK said above.
posted by purple_bird at 1:43 PM on December 28, 2023 [8 favorites]
So my advice for coping with this would be to get a copy of Fair Play and do the card sorting exercise. Even by yourself! If that shows that there is an imbalance of household labor (emotional or otherwise), correct it. Literally do whatever you can to make her life easier.
Also do what MiraK said above.
posted by purple_bird at 1:43 PM on December 28, 2023 [8 favorites]
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posted by KMH at 12:03 PM on December 27, 2023