redirecting an amazon addiction
March 24, 2023 11:16 AM Subscribe
An elderly relative of mine discovered online shopping during the pandemic, and it has developed into a bit of an addiction/compulsion. Critically: they are recovering from another much more directly harmful addiction, so I know that we need to tread lightly. What are some ways we (their kids, and the rest of us) can help them address this?
I would love to just indulge this whole thing as a healthier substitution for their more harmful previous addiction, but they are on a fixed income, first of all. Second of all, they keep getting lite-scammed by ripoffs of clothing and licensed stuff. Finally, they are filling not only their own home but everyone else's home with a nonstop flood of junk, because when they can no longer justify buying something for themselves they justify it as gifts for the grandkids etc.
They are a little bit aware that this is some kind of coping mechanism for them, and occasionally try to do other online things instead to scratch the same itch, but tend to find those more stressful/disheartening.
Things that didn't work:
-looking at Zillow listings (the high prices/nicer houses stress them out about their shitty financial position)
-social media (they were sucked into those data-scammy Facebook pages with quizzes and random questions and got themselves hacked, so they now refuse to do social media -- no real complaints here about that, tbh.)
So I guess what we're looking for is: some kind of way they can self-soothe online that hits some of the same buttons as "buying socks for X" or "buying a nice[citation needed] thing for me." Unfortunately due to their health it does kind of have to be an online/sedentary thing; they cannot get around easily or do a lot of exercise or go somewhere to distract themselves.
I would love to just indulge this whole thing as a healthier substitution for their more harmful previous addiction, but they are on a fixed income, first of all. Second of all, they keep getting lite-scammed by ripoffs of clothing and licensed stuff. Finally, they are filling not only their own home but everyone else's home with a nonstop flood of junk, because when they can no longer justify buying something for themselves they justify it as gifts for the grandkids etc.
They are a little bit aware that this is some kind of coping mechanism for them, and occasionally try to do other online things instead to scratch the same itch, but tend to find those more stressful/disheartening.
Things that didn't work:
-looking at Zillow listings (the high prices/nicer houses stress them out about their shitty financial position)
-social media (they were sucked into those data-scammy Facebook pages with quizzes and random questions and got themselves hacked, so they now refuse to do social media -- no real complaints here about that, tbh.)
So I guess what we're looking for is: some kind of way they can self-soothe online that hits some of the same buttons as "buying socks for X" or "buying a nice[citation needed] thing for me." Unfortunately due to their health it does kind of have to be an online/sedentary thing; they cannot get around easily or do a lot of exercise or go somewhere to distract themselves.
Pinterest? Create inspo-boards for decor/holiday outfits/etc.?
posted by DoubleLune at 11:33 AM on March 24, 2023 [5 favorites]
posted by DoubleLune at 11:33 AM on March 24, 2023 [5 favorites]
That sounds like someone who would thrive in making righteous corrections to Wikipedia articles, finding and vetting citations, etc.
It *also* sounds like someone who could be lured into that activity by being shown a place where someone is blatantly, correctably wrong - and how easy it might be to correct the wrongness.
(It's replacing an addiction with another addiction, but perhaps a less harmful one.)
posted by Shunra at 11:34 AM on March 24, 2023 [5 favorites]
It *also* sounds like someone who could be lured into that activity by being shown a place where someone is blatantly, correctably wrong - and how easy it might be to correct the wrongness.
(It's replacing an addiction with another addiction, but perhaps a less harmful one.)
posted by Shunra at 11:34 AM on March 24, 2023 [5 favorites]
I think part of the question is what need is your relative fulfilling? (Need to have things / collect things / press a button / press a button and share ), but if your relative leans towards the books on Amazon with a PC, here is a possible alternative.
If they use chrome as their browser, there is a library extension that can be installed. It needs to be set up to link with your particular library. Then, when they find books they like / love / and want, the extension tells you if it is in the library. Perhaps try to turn that into an addiction because at least my local library lets you make a list of books you want and for ebooks. Some of them you grab instantly or go onto a waitlist.
For all the people that your relative wants to "share with" - perhaps the same (i.e., read a book and share an interest with the grandkid) - by reading and discussing the same book from the library.
There are also email lists for books in the public domain. Your relative could also find and download books from there, probably forever.
posted by Wolfster at 11:41 AM on March 24, 2023 [4 favorites]
If they use chrome as their browser, there is a library extension that can be installed. It needs to be set up to link with your particular library. Then, when they find books they like / love / and want, the extension tells you if it is in the library. Perhaps try to turn that into an addiction because at least my local library lets you make a list of books you want and for ebooks. Some of them you grab instantly or go onto a waitlist.
For all the people that your relative wants to "share with" - perhaps the same (i.e., read a book and share an interest with the grandkid) - by reading and discussing the same book from the library.
There are also email lists for books in the public domain. Your relative could also find and download books from there, probably forever.
posted by Wolfster at 11:41 AM on March 24, 2023 [4 favorites]
Words with Friends, Wordle, Scrabble online, some kind of puzzle with right answers for the dopamine hit and maybe a smidge of social interaction but no transactions whatsoever?
My favorite thing to do online (besides MeFi!) is read advice columns. Maybe a monthly subscription to Slate or somewhere with a variety of columns to read would scratch a similar itch. What's better than a window into other people's (sometimes questionable) life choices?
posted by Lawn Beaver at 11:42 AM on March 24, 2023 [3 favorites]
My favorite thing to do online (besides MeFi!) is read advice columns. Maybe a monthly subscription to Slate or somewhere with a variety of columns to read would scratch a similar itch. What's better than a window into other people's (sometimes questionable) life choices?
posted by Lawn Beaver at 11:42 AM on March 24, 2023 [3 favorites]
Are there simple, non-violent games they could immerse themselves into? Something that rewards effort and then trading for different goods? Thinking Animal Crossing or Minecraft in creative mode? It might also be an opportunity for joint play, if family members are willing.
If there is a yard and the physical capabilities, gardening is fantastic for directed obsessive behavior and short-circuiting addictive behavior (speaking from personal experience) - different seeds, tending plants, harvesting food and flowers, etc. It’s kind of the basis of the effort-reward systems that games are built off of.
posted by Silvery Fish at 11:43 AM on March 24, 2023 [3 favorites]
If there is a yard and the physical capabilities, gardening is fantastic for directed obsessive behavior and short-circuiting addictive behavior (speaking from personal experience) - different seeds, tending plants, harvesting food and flowers, etc. It’s kind of the basis of the effort-reward systems that games are built off of.
posted by Silvery Fish at 11:43 AM on March 24, 2023 [3 favorites]
Browsing ebooks and audiobooks from their local library in Libby or similar might scratch a similar itch to the online shopping? They could even recommend titles to kids/grandkids as a way to interact with them without filling their homes with unneeded items.
posted by abeja bicicleta at 11:44 AM on March 24, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by abeja bicicleta at 11:44 AM on March 24, 2023 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: Just popping in with one note since the responses are leaning heavily toward library/library apps: unfortunately, this person isn't a reader and none of what they buy are books. They never were terribly book-oriented, and now their eyesight is quite terrible (but they will not acknowledge this) so even the kind of occasional reading they used to do is a lot harder for them.
In terms of what button it is pushing, I really think (having witnessed in real time) that it's "had a stressful thought > distract distract distract > dopamine hit of New Thing." A video game with lots of little acquisitions might be good as long as it doesn't require a lot of detail and hand-eye coordination (again, the eyesight thing).
posted by We put our faith in Blast Hardcheese at 12:13 PM on March 24, 2023 [3 favorites]
In terms of what button it is pushing, I really think (having witnessed in real time) that it's "had a stressful thought > distract distract distract > dopamine hit of New Thing." A video game with lots of little acquisitions might be good as long as it doesn't require a lot of detail and hand-eye coordination (again, the eyesight thing).
posted by We put our faith in Blast Hardcheese at 12:13 PM on March 24, 2023 [3 favorites]
One intermediary step might be to have them build wishlists for themselves and others, and then once every so often (a quarter?) they could ask their grandkids to pick one item off the wishlist for purchase - basically add several curation steps in between what they are doing now, and the actual purchasing.
For non-Amazon but online things:
- curate an image feed on Google Photos, including maybe scanning and uploading family pictures if they have access to technology and the ability to do that.
- genealogy research can be fun and consuming although it does require some reading. It is the fun of the hunt though. There are sites where you can look up pictures of headstones that people have taken and categorized.
- are online classes an option? Maybe gift them a subscription to Masterclass or similar?
- could they curate Spotify lists for the family or something around music?
For offline things:
- a hobby like knitting/whittling/soap carving/rug hooking/etc. keeps hands off the keyboard
- maybe they would be into writing or building a family history or journalling - reading your update maybe through recording stories into an audio app
The more I think about it the more it sounds like novelty-seeking. Is there any kind of local group that arranges excursions for the elderly or has a seniors day where they provide transportation? Here there are some local groups that have gone completely online where seniors chat and have choir and things over Zoom.
posted by warriorqueen at 12:19 PM on March 24, 2023 [2 favorites]
For non-Amazon but online things:
- curate an image feed on Google Photos, including maybe scanning and uploading family pictures if they have access to technology and the ability to do that.
- genealogy research can be fun and consuming although it does require some reading. It is the fun of the hunt though. There are sites where you can look up pictures of headstones that people have taken and categorized.
- are online classes an option? Maybe gift them a subscription to Masterclass or similar?
- could they curate Spotify lists for the family or something around music?
For offline things:
- a hobby like knitting/whittling/soap carving/rug hooking/etc. keeps hands off the keyboard
- maybe they would be into writing or building a family history or journalling - reading your update maybe through recording stories into an audio app
The more I think about it the more it sounds like novelty-seeking. Is there any kind of local group that arranges excursions for the elderly or has a seniors day where they provide transportation? Here there are some local groups that have gone completely online where seniors chat and have choir and things over Zoom.
posted by warriorqueen at 12:19 PM on March 24, 2023 [2 favorites]
Would favoriting items be close enough to the Amazon shopping experience. Obviously Amazon has a wishlist function but I wouldn't suggest trying to replace Amazon buying with Amazon wishlisting because your relative is already in the mode of purchasing (oh! Turn off one-click shopping?)
I use Etsy.com and ShopGoodwill.com as sites where I can while away some time looking for neat objects and add them to my favorite list, so I get the dopamine hit of the hunter-gatherer successful hunt without actually buying the items.
posted by spamandkimchi at 12:21 PM on March 24, 2023 [1 favorite]
I use Etsy.com and ShopGoodwill.com as sites where I can while away some time looking for neat objects and add them to my favorite list, so I get the dopamine hit of the hunter-gatherer successful hunt without actually buying the items.
posted by spamandkimchi at 12:21 PM on March 24, 2023 [1 favorite]
And yes to warriorqueen's idea of asking grandkids to take a look at the wishlists every once in a while!
posted by spamandkimchi at 12:21 PM on March 24, 2023
posted by spamandkimchi at 12:21 PM on March 24, 2023
The antidote to addiction is connection. Triage your time, encourage other relatives to triage theirs, and prioritise spending more time (even a small increase helps!) talking with relative on the phone, engaging with them in meme-filled WhatsApp chats, etc. Triage your resources and prioritise more visits to relative, if that is useful. Validate them. Speak joy into them. Even a little goes a long way!
posted by The Last Sockpuppet at 12:30 PM on March 24, 2023 [4 favorites]
posted by The Last Sockpuppet at 12:30 PM on March 24, 2023 [4 favorites]
I don't think of Pinterest as social media, but I guess technically it is. Anyways, if this isn't out of the purview, I know several of folks in their 60s who LOVE putting together boards of various types depending on their interests, and then also showing off the boards they've created and talking about them with people IRL. My mom (65) has Pinterest boards for her professional interests, creative interests, fandom interests and even a secret board full of celebrity crushes. (She loves the "hunt" for specific pictures she's looking for to save). This could be an option, and kind of endless.
If they are into fashion or furniture, there are online simulators for building outfits or designing rooms that might be of interest.
Would any of the family members be into playing simple games with this person, eg Words with Friends, trivia, or something similar? Or if interaction doesn't need to be part of it, there may be plenty of solo word or puzzle games they'd be into - again, I know people who have addictive behaviors who have replaced it with that.
(Nthing what people saying that getting out of the house is a good thing too, but I get that that's not exactly your question)
posted by nuclear_soup at 12:40 PM on March 24, 2023 [1 favorite]
If they are into fashion or furniture, there are online simulators for building outfits or designing rooms that might be of interest.
Would any of the family members be into playing simple games with this person, eg Words with Friends, trivia, or something similar? Or if interaction doesn't need to be part of it, there may be plenty of solo word or puzzle games they'd be into - again, I know people who have addictive behaviors who have replaced it with that.
(Nthing what people saying that getting out of the house is a good thing too, but I get that that's not exactly your question)
posted by nuclear_soup at 12:40 PM on March 24, 2023 [1 favorite]
A video game with lots of little acquisitions might be good as long as it doesn't require a lot of detail and hand-eye coordination (again, the eyesight thing).
Maybe simulation/collection games like Stardew Valley or Animal Crossing? The trick would be making sure to avoid ones with microtransactions, which many do have - it sounds like your relative might not be able to avoid that temptation, and they can be pretty predatory.
I can't make specific recommendations because it's not my type of game, but it might be something worth looking into if you think it might scratch a similar itch.
I used to play Flight Rising a lot (like a dragon neopets), and there is definitely fun in unlocking new patterns, hatching eggs, or even buying dragons on the marketplace (for the in-game currency you earn through playing). It's really a game centered around collection. But I haven't played in a while and never paid attention to any paid content so I don't know how many microtransactions there are now.
posted by Kutsuwamushi at 1:26 PM on March 24, 2023
Maybe simulation/collection games like Stardew Valley or Animal Crossing? The trick would be making sure to avoid ones with microtransactions, which many do have - it sounds like your relative might not be able to avoid that temptation, and they can be pretty predatory.
I can't make specific recommendations because it's not my type of game, but it might be something worth looking into if you think it might scratch a similar itch.
I used to play Flight Rising a lot (like a dragon neopets), and there is definitely fun in unlocking new patterns, hatching eggs, or even buying dragons on the marketplace (for the in-game currency you earn through playing). It's really a game centered around collection. But I haven't played in a while and never paid attention to any paid content so I don't know how many microtransactions there are now.
posted by Kutsuwamushi at 1:26 PM on March 24, 2023
I replaced Amazon browsing with my local buy nothing group- they have an app I think, though I use Facebook. I also joined a group where I can buy things for other people from their Amazon wish list. This lets me shop around and price compare, but not collect stuff. The group I’m in is for kids and families in need, but I assume there are other groups like this.
posted by Valancy Rachel at 1:33 PM on March 24, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by Valancy Rachel at 1:33 PM on March 24, 2023 [1 favorite]
It is possible (in the UK with major banks at least) to have online purchases on one’s debit card disabled. I know of people who do this and/or then get a pre-paid type cash card for online spends with the amount of money more controlled. This might help with the financial angle - it reduces impulsive online spending, or at least that’s the idea.
posted by Erinaceus europaeus at 1:36 PM on March 24, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by Erinaceus europaeus at 1:36 PM on March 24, 2023 [1 favorite]
If your relative could be a Buy Nothing angel, that would be amazing! That is, helping link people who ask to people who have offered, or to local resources that could help. I wonder also if there might be any online volunteering gigs their shopping skills could help with: managing an animal shelter’s wishlist, for example, or helping to round up donations for a food pantry.
posted by rrrrrrrrrt at 2:13 PM on March 24, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by rrrrrrrrrt at 2:13 PM on March 24, 2023 [2 favorites]
One possible way to slow her down is to ask her to post a review for every item she buys, a video review would be even better! You can probably enroll her in Amazon influencer program and make money if she will make video reviews consistently!
Another possibility is to show her Temu which has cheaper prices, but takes 10 plus days to get to the US. Ask her to price compare.
posted by kschang at 2:37 PM on March 24, 2023
Another possibility is to show her Temu which has cheaper prices, but takes 10 plus days to get to the US. Ask her to price compare.
posted by kschang at 2:37 PM on March 24, 2023
A video game with lots of little acquisitions might be good as long as it doesn't require a lot of detail and hand-eye coordination (again, the eyesight thing).
Absolutely Animal Crossing. About the only thing that requires good eyesight is animal acquisition (fishing, deep sea diving, bugs) but everything else is pretty clear and there are multiple shops to buy from that change every day. And they can even travel to other people's islands and shop there!
posted by creatrixtiara at 3:43 PM on March 24, 2023
Absolutely Animal Crossing. About the only thing that requires good eyesight is animal acquisition (fishing, deep sea diving, bugs) but everything else is pretty clear and there are multiple shops to buy from that change every day. And they can even travel to other people's islands and shop there!
posted by creatrixtiara at 3:43 PM on March 24, 2023
>(oh and detecting fake artwork for the museum but that's about it)
posted by creatrixtiara at 3:44 PM on March 24, 2023
posted by creatrixtiara at 3:44 PM on March 24, 2023
Introduce them to selling stuff on Poshmark. Poshmark has this system where they encourage you to “get” more Followers and to “Follow” more people for exposure and people also Share other people’s clothes so that their own clothes will be Shared. There are like millions of people on there. She will get a pretty intense dopamine hit just trying to accumulate followers. It’s kind of a lot of work. And you can encourage her to sell her stuff and thus de clutter. Win/win
Also, I self sooth by reading Reddit and buzzfeed.
posted by gt2 at 3:57 PM on March 24, 2023
Also, I self sooth by reading Reddit and buzzfeed.
posted by gt2 at 3:57 PM on March 24, 2023
Animal Crossing
posted by haptic_avenger at 5:37 AM on March 25, 2023
posted by haptic_avenger at 5:37 AM on March 25, 2023
They are recovering from another addiction, so do they have a support group? In my experience, support groups for addiction (and eating disorders, and so on) are full of people talking about how they have transferred their addiction from, let's say, liquor and pills to food and shopping. I see that they can't go out to meetings but can they join an online group?
posted by BibiRose at 7:49 AM on March 25, 2023
posted by BibiRose at 7:49 AM on March 25, 2023
I like to play Animal Restaurant on my phone. It has cute animals. You run the restaurant and collect codfish as your pay. Then you can upgrade the restaurant to attract more customers. Very low-key and fun. It might be possible to download it to a PC.
I like the mobile game, Crush Rings, too.
Also, on the cool math games website, Fuse is my current favorite.
posted by goodsearch at 10:57 AM on March 25, 2023
I like the mobile game, Crush Rings, too.
Also, on the cool math games website, Fuse is my current favorite.
posted by goodsearch at 10:57 AM on March 25, 2023
This thread is closed to new comments.
Really, really look at some kind of regular social event -- by regular, I mean 2-3x/week -- where they see and interact with people, and dress in an "outside the house" manner. BTW I am partly writing to myself here :)
There are, also, online Meetups of various kinds. Also classes (improv is one kind).
posted by amtho at 11:31 AM on March 24, 2023 [7 favorites]