My employer wants me to return to the office
February 24, 2023 7:21 PM Subscribe
I don't want to. I have feelings -lot's of feelings- help me?
I've been remote since starting my job early pandemic. I have a good work set-up at home that I've developed over time, and quite frankly I like the flexibility, staying close to my young kids, being able to step away to run an errand - all the work from home things. I also like not commuting and the time that it's given me with my family- probably most of all. I don't want to lie though, I start work late and end early, and take walks and run errands. I even take a break a couple of days a week to pick up my kid from school and take him to his aftercare - I cherish that time with him.
I am still extremely productive even with all of that, mostly because when I work from home I can focus and get a lot done! I always have my messages/chat turned on, and answer questions within a few minutes even when I'm out running an errand. I don't ever want to go back into the office full-time. Ever.
I'm also still covid-cautious. I got covid and thought that I would die. Afterwards I've had to go see a medical specialist and the doctor thought for a bit that I had emphysema, so I'm not messing around with covid - still.
My job has a new ED and he is gung-ho about everyone getting back into the office as soon as possible. He doesn't have young kids and has a wife at home who cares for all his needs - he is in an extremely privileged position to be making decisions for others and it makes me very angry.
My work has a remote work policy that is now in question, and at the very least even if it stays in place it sounds like senior management (which I am) is going to be forced to go back in. I am by far the most productive person in my department - it's quantifiably by real numbers in the work we do, and I've done the math - I oversee about 60% of total work. My team works well, thrives under my leadership and seems to like me. My boss keeps handing me more responsibility.
My boss is also dramatic, a flake, and really hard to gauge on anything. She is hinting very strongly that we will all be back in the office soon and told me explicitly I needed to start making a plan for what that would look like. On it's surface it seems like I could just go to my boss and ask that I work part-time from home or negotiate an accommodation, but my boss is really slippery and I feel like she'll say yes and then change her mind, or just keep harping/hinting that I should be more present in the office - and basically weaponize anything wrong that ever happens as centering around me not being in the office.
Even if my boss okays me working part-time from home - I still don't love this, because of the commute and having more control right now over my work hours. But I could try to negotiate this option. But again, see the weaponizing above.
I've been looking for other work, but it doesn't appear that there is that much remote available - apparently everyone wants to be in an office again??
I keep going around and around in circles on this and am so anxious and unhappy about it, I might just quit on the spot with nothing lined up and before any demands are even made. I just need either a constructive outside perspective or (and possibly even better) someone to share a story of something similar and how they handled it.
I've been remote since starting my job early pandemic. I have a good work set-up at home that I've developed over time, and quite frankly I like the flexibility, staying close to my young kids, being able to step away to run an errand - all the work from home things. I also like not commuting and the time that it's given me with my family- probably most of all. I don't want to lie though, I start work late and end early, and take walks and run errands. I even take a break a couple of days a week to pick up my kid from school and take him to his aftercare - I cherish that time with him.
I am still extremely productive even with all of that, mostly because when I work from home I can focus and get a lot done! I always have my messages/chat turned on, and answer questions within a few minutes even when I'm out running an errand. I don't ever want to go back into the office full-time. Ever.
I'm also still covid-cautious. I got covid and thought that I would die. Afterwards I've had to go see a medical specialist and the doctor thought for a bit that I had emphysema, so I'm not messing around with covid - still.
My job has a new ED and he is gung-ho about everyone getting back into the office as soon as possible. He doesn't have young kids and has a wife at home who cares for all his needs - he is in an extremely privileged position to be making decisions for others and it makes me very angry.
My work has a remote work policy that is now in question, and at the very least even if it stays in place it sounds like senior management (which I am) is going to be forced to go back in. I am by far the most productive person in my department - it's quantifiably by real numbers in the work we do, and I've done the math - I oversee about 60% of total work. My team works well, thrives under my leadership and seems to like me. My boss keeps handing me more responsibility.
My boss is also dramatic, a flake, and really hard to gauge on anything. She is hinting very strongly that we will all be back in the office soon and told me explicitly I needed to start making a plan for what that would look like. On it's surface it seems like I could just go to my boss and ask that I work part-time from home or negotiate an accommodation, but my boss is really slippery and I feel like she'll say yes and then change her mind, or just keep harping/hinting that I should be more present in the office - and basically weaponize anything wrong that ever happens as centering around me not being in the office.
Even if my boss okays me working part-time from home - I still don't love this, because of the commute and having more control right now over my work hours. But I could try to negotiate this option. But again, see the weaponizing above.
I've been looking for other work, but it doesn't appear that there is that much remote available - apparently everyone wants to be in an office again??
I keep going around and around in circles on this and am so anxious and unhappy about it, I might just quit on the spot with nothing lined up and before any demands are even made. I just need either a constructive outside perspective or (and possibly even better) someone to share a story of something similar and how they handled it.
I'm senior management and transitioning the team from remote to in office - and honestly, I think you're better off looking for a new role that embraces remote. People should want to be in the right culture for them, and it seems like you know what you love! I don't agree with NotLost that it's only senior management. We've found while recruiting that some people are really energized by being in the office (and some people at the company are thrilled, while others are not happy). I think it's just a way of working, and people should end up at the companies that embrace one or the other.
To that end, I will also say if even if you are granted an exception to be remote, it will be hard to be part of an in office culture while being remote. It also depends on how big the company is. It's a huge difference if it's a big company (with a lot more remote workers) vs. a small company (probably more painful if you are one of the few not in the office). Good luck with the job search!
Also I think you have more time than you think. If you are the most productive person on the time they have a lot more to lose than gain by letting you go. I would stand your ground about being remote and then find a better role.
posted by treetop89 at 8:06 PM on February 24, 2023 [23 favorites]
To that end, I will also say if even if you are granted an exception to be remote, it will be hard to be part of an in office culture while being remote. It also depends on how big the company is. It's a huge difference if it's a big company (with a lot more remote workers) vs. a small company (probably more painful if you are one of the few not in the office). Good luck with the job search!
Also I think you have more time than you think. If you are the most productive person on the time they have a lot more to lose than gain by letting you go. I would stand your ground about being remote and then find a better role.
posted by treetop89 at 8:06 PM on February 24, 2023 [23 favorites]
but my boss is really slippery and I feel like she'll say yes and then change her mind, or just keep harping/hinting that I should be more present in the office
When you have a slippery boss you need to memorialize important conversations. After your calls you send a summary email to them with your personal email bcc'd saying, essentially,
"Thank you for taking the time to speak through our process for x. As discussed during our call: you advised a and b. I would like to clarify my understanding of c. Please confirm z and y so that I can continue in my productive work toward project. Thank you and I always appreciate your guidance!"
Basically you want to capture all the salient points and send them with a quick hook for them to respond affirmatively immediately after your conversation (don't give them time to reflect or speak with anyone else).
Also, don't fret about this until it actually happens. And if/when it actually happens, just don't go in. Continue to be productive from home. If it causes a problem, well, you're ready to quit over this anyway, so let them fire you. If you're as good an employee as you say you are, let them enter the fuck around and find out stage themselves. The worst case scenario here is you end up without the job you don't want to do.
And then if that DOES happen, if you're worried about how being fired will make you look to a future employer, well, don't. Why did you leave your last job? "Well, new leadership came in and decided to require our remote team to work from the office instead. I was delivering above expectations on all of my metrics, and received documented approval from my manager to continue to work from home. So I did just that. Leadership pressed again, and I was let go for not returning to in-office work. Remote work is a priority for me, and I am excited to work for [company] that understands and values an employee's at home productivity." Getting fired for this is only going to underscore for your next employer that remote work is absolutely non negotiable for you, and you can request them to literally write it into your offer letter before you sign.
posted by phunniemee at 8:11 PM on February 24, 2023 [55 favorites]
When you have a slippery boss you need to memorialize important conversations. After your calls you send a summary email to them with your personal email bcc'd saying, essentially,
"Thank you for taking the time to speak through our process for x. As discussed during our call: you advised a and b. I would like to clarify my understanding of c. Please confirm z and y so that I can continue in my productive work toward project. Thank you and I always appreciate your guidance!"
Basically you want to capture all the salient points and send them with a quick hook for them to respond affirmatively immediately after your conversation (don't give them time to reflect or speak with anyone else).
Also, don't fret about this until it actually happens. And if/when it actually happens, just don't go in. Continue to be productive from home. If it causes a problem, well, you're ready to quit over this anyway, so let them fire you. If you're as good an employee as you say you are, let them enter the fuck around and find out stage themselves. The worst case scenario here is you end up without the job you don't want to do.
And then if that DOES happen, if you're worried about how being fired will make you look to a future employer, well, don't. Why did you leave your last job? "Well, new leadership came in and decided to require our remote team to work from the office instead. I was delivering above expectations on all of my metrics, and received documented approval from my manager to continue to work from home. So I did just that. Leadership pressed again, and I was let go for not returning to in-office work. Remote work is a priority for me, and I am excited to work for [company] that understands and values an employee's at home productivity." Getting fired for this is only going to underscore for your next employer that remote work is absolutely non negotiable for you, and you can request them to literally write it into your offer letter before you sign.
posted by phunniemee at 8:11 PM on February 24, 2023 [55 favorites]
My work went to part-time in office last year. Some people have accommodations that allow them to work from home full-time. I also know people who left to fully remote jobs. Your industry may vary (I am in tech), but if you know WFH is right for you, I’d start casually looking at what else is out there as well as look at proposing arrangements at your current job — the fact that you had emphysema and were badly affected by Covid seem like pretty valid reasons for accommodations.
posted by vanitas at 8:21 PM on February 24, 2023 [4 favorites]
posted by vanitas at 8:21 PM on February 24, 2023 [4 favorites]
I don’t know what industry you’re in, which matters quite a lot, but I can guarantee there is a job out there that you want and which will let you be remote, it’s just a matter of putting in the (hideous and terrible) work of finding it. There are lots of smaller companies that have pivoted to fully-remote, in my industry it’s mostly the big guys that are trying to do the RTO thing.
So start looking intensively now.
Once you get something, quit immediately without notice, and be sure to tell them why. You’re working for idiots; find smarter bosses.
(I’m not saying this will be easy, only that it is fully possible. I don’t know about other countries, but in the US economists are confused about the “missing workers” and they’re only confused because economists are fundamentally idiots)
posted by aramaic at 8:23 PM on February 24, 2023 [4 favorites]
So start looking intensively now.
Once you get something, quit immediately without notice, and be sure to tell them why. You’re working for idiots; find smarter bosses.
(I’m not saying this will be easy, only that it is fully possible. I don’t know about other countries, but in the US economists are confused about the “missing workers” and they’re only confused because economists are fundamentally idiots)
posted by aramaic at 8:23 PM on February 24, 2023 [4 favorites]
I'm really sorry. This is hard and shitty.
I think you should keep looking for another job. *Possibly* even one you don't really want but are willing to take if you must, and use as leverage to negotiate with your current job. I don't generally recommend that strategy and it's *very* dependent on both current boss and potential new job. But personally, the reason I was able to negotiate an exception to my workplace's hybrid move was that I had an offer and was willing to leave if I had to. In my specific case I had a lot of capital to burn and immediate management who very much wanted to let me stay remote but had their hands tied by upper management, and they were really glad that I handed them the leverage to get me that accommodation. It doesn't sound like your management will be as supportive but it may still be an option.
In the interim do you have any options your doctor might support to write you either an accommodations letter or even recommend a temporary leave for you, depending on your current medical status? If you're on the verge of walking out anyway, it's worth seriously considering taking some leave while you job hunt if your doctor will get you the documentation you need for that and your workplace policies allow it.
posted by Stacey at 8:41 PM on February 24, 2023 [5 favorites]
I think you should keep looking for another job. *Possibly* even one you don't really want but are willing to take if you must, and use as leverage to negotiate with your current job. I don't generally recommend that strategy and it's *very* dependent on both current boss and potential new job. But personally, the reason I was able to negotiate an exception to my workplace's hybrid move was that I had an offer and was willing to leave if I had to. In my specific case I had a lot of capital to burn and immediate management who very much wanted to let me stay remote but had their hands tied by upper management, and they were really glad that I handed them the leverage to get me that accommodation. It doesn't sound like your management will be as supportive but it may still be an option.
In the interim do you have any options your doctor might support to write you either an accommodations letter or even recommend a temporary leave for you, depending on your current medical status? If you're on the verge of walking out anyway, it's worth seriously considering taking some leave while you job hunt if your doctor will get you the documentation you need for that and your workplace policies allow it.
posted by Stacey at 8:41 PM on February 24, 2023 [5 favorites]
I just took a new job in large part due to a better telework policy, but I truthfully don’t think 100% remote is going to be possible in the longterm for most of us. 1-2 days in the office is more realistic.
posted by haptic_avenger at 8:53 PM on February 24, 2023 [4 favorites]
posted by haptic_avenger at 8:53 PM on February 24, 2023 [4 favorites]
Perhaps telework would be a reasonable accommodation if you are at high risk for Covid.
posted by oceano at 9:57 PM on February 24, 2023 [3 favorites]
posted by oceano at 9:57 PM on February 24, 2023 [3 favorites]
I have no concrete advice but just wanted to validate your feelings. They are fools, and you're not wrong for feeling anxious and unhappy about this.
posted by mydonkeybenjamin at 10:01 PM on February 24, 2023 [9 favorites]
posted by mydonkeybenjamin at 10:01 PM on February 24, 2023 [9 favorites]
I got forced to go back hybrid. I can live with it. They let me use my own private office space with the door closed, I wear a mask every time I leave the private office, I eat in the office or outside if the weather is fine, I've got a portable HEPA filter if necessary, still haven't caught it yet. I hate having to drag ass into the office and wake up early twice a week and go out in cold weather, but going in 2 days a week is doing pretty well these days since a lot of other offices at my giant org are making people come in more than that. Giant Org in general is fine with whatever works for each office, but some are more "in person" than others. I'm basically there because they want an adult sitter.
I don't know how feasible it is to be able to find 100% remote work at this point since the hot new trend is to force everyone back and pretend that everything is normal again. I don't think I'd just quit on the spot with no job right now over this--put up with it while job hunting, practice precautions when you have to go in, and keep on looking. I say "don't quit over this" because I think job hunting isn't going to go too easily these days and I'd rather have the income and put up with the crap of going in, than be freaking out every day about having no money coming in.
posted by jenfullmoon at 10:22 PM on February 24, 2023 [2 favorites]
I don't know how feasible it is to be able to find 100% remote work at this point since the hot new trend is to force everyone back and pretend that everything is normal again. I don't think I'd just quit on the spot with no job right now over this--put up with it while job hunting, practice precautions when you have to go in, and keep on looking. I say "don't quit over this" because I think job hunting isn't going to go too easily these days and I'd rather have the income and put up with the crap of going in, than be freaking out every day about having no money coming in.
posted by jenfullmoon at 10:22 PM on February 24, 2023 [2 favorites]
First: You are seen and your feelings are valid.
Malicious compliance would be my strategy in your position. Well, that’s not true: first force them to force you back to the office after asking for reasonable accommodation. Then either force them to fire you over it, or wear a full-face respirator back to the office if you need this job. I promise no one wants that and they’ll likely accommodate you.
You are (your labor is) a valuable resource and they are likely bluffing.
posted by supercres at 10:33 PM on February 24, 2023 [9 favorites]
Malicious compliance would be my strategy in your position. Well, that’s not true: first force them to force you back to the office after asking for reasonable accommodation. Then either force them to fire you over it, or wear a full-face respirator back to the office if you need this job. I promise no one wants that and they’ll likely accommodate you.
You are (your labor is) a valuable resource and they are likely bluffing.
posted by supercres at 10:33 PM on February 24, 2023 [9 favorites]
If working from home is what works for you, you enjoy working for your company, and they highly value your work, you could fight the RTO. There is risk involved of course, but that's true for any path you take.
If you are dead set on continuing to wfh exclusively, start working the political game. Talk to select people in a position to influence your boss and let them know your feelings. Write a document describing why it is best for the company for you to continue WFH and be prepared to share it with those people. I expect your boss reports to someone, even if it is the board.
Include in the doc why you are valuable to the company: overseeing 60% of work, the success of the company under your leadership, your track record, work that is ongoing and planned that you are uniquely qualified to lead. Compare your performance when you worked in the office versus wfh (hopefully wfh is as good as or better) with whatever metrics are available.
If you can get others to be sympathetic to your cause they may be able to influence your boss.
And if it comes down to it, have a blunt, private conversation with your boss. Let her know that RTO is a deal breaker for you and that you'll be giving notice if forced to return. If it doesn't go well, send that doc to her and whoever she reports to. If you're senior enough, share it with the board and the C-suite folks. Be prepared for this to go badly of course, but I have learned that if I don't ask for what I want nobody will give it to me. And fairly often people will give me what I ask for if I pitch it as genuinely being in their best interest (absolutely not in a threatening way).
This is all from a stranger on the internet, so take it all with grain(s) of salt, but I thought I'd throw that out there.
About a year ago I was in a work situation that I could no longer stand. I was completely ready to quit and went to my boss. We talked about what I needed and he was very accommodating. He proposed a solution I hadn't considered, which worked out great for both of us. It was very different situation of course. Good people are hard to find. It can easily take 6 months to a year to find the right person and then it takes another 6 months for them to learn the job and really get up to speed. It's vastly preferable to be a little flexible to keep genuinely good people. And it sounds like you are one of them.
I wish you all the best with this.
posted by DrumsIntheDeep at 11:24 PM on February 24, 2023 [10 favorites]
If you are dead set on continuing to wfh exclusively, start working the political game. Talk to select people in a position to influence your boss and let them know your feelings. Write a document describing why it is best for the company for you to continue WFH and be prepared to share it with those people. I expect your boss reports to someone, even if it is the board.
Include in the doc why you are valuable to the company: overseeing 60% of work, the success of the company under your leadership, your track record, work that is ongoing and planned that you are uniquely qualified to lead. Compare your performance when you worked in the office versus wfh (hopefully wfh is as good as or better) with whatever metrics are available.
If you can get others to be sympathetic to your cause they may be able to influence your boss.
And if it comes down to it, have a blunt, private conversation with your boss. Let her know that RTO is a deal breaker for you and that you'll be giving notice if forced to return. If it doesn't go well, send that doc to her and whoever she reports to. If you're senior enough, share it with the board and the C-suite folks. Be prepared for this to go badly of course, but I have learned that if I don't ask for what I want nobody will give it to me. And fairly often people will give me what I ask for if I pitch it as genuinely being in their best interest (absolutely not in a threatening way).
This is all from a stranger on the internet, so take it all with grain(s) of salt, but I thought I'd throw that out there.
About a year ago I was in a work situation that I could no longer stand. I was completely ready to quit and went to my boss. We talked about what I needed and he was very accommodating. He proposed a solution I hadn't considered, which worked out great for both of us. It was very different situation of course. Good people are hard to find. It can easily take 6 months to a year to find the right person and then it takes another 6 months for them to learn the job and really get up to speed. It's vastly preferable to be a little flexible to keep genuinely good people. And it sounds like you are one of them.
I wish you all the best with this.
posted by DrumsIntheDeep at 11:24 PM on February 24, 2023 [10 favorites]
I've worked remotely (as a database developer) for the past 16 years. I absolutely refuse to work in an office unless it's to exchange technology or for a couple of weeks for initial on-boarding. None of the jobs that I've ever gotten in these past 16 years were advertised as remote positions; I negotiated a telecommute provision when a job offer was made by offering my employer the option of either accepting the offered salary and also working fully remote (or sometimes 1 day in-office per week), or working fully in-office but at the offered salary + 20-30% (or whatever). Never have I had an employer turn down the telecommute offer because they'd much rather pay the lower salary.
So my advice to you is to decide how much more money (or PTO or other benefits) you'd need in order to make returning to the office tolerable and then add it to your current compensation. If your employer pushes for you to return to the office you can tell them that you will, but only at the higher salary/benefits. Otherwise you'd be willing to stay at your current salary and come in 1 day a week (or whatever is acceptable to you). Let them choose between those 2 options and if neither works for them, let them fire you. But I doubt that they'll go that route.
posted by mezzanayne at 11:28 PM on February 24, 2023 [9 favorites]
So my advice to you is to decide how much more money (or PTO or other benefits) you'd need in order to make returning to the office tolerable and then add it to your current compensation. If your employer pushes for you to return to the office you can tell them that you will, but only at the higher salary/benefits. Otherwise you'd be willing to stay at your current salary and come in 1 day a week (or whatever is acceptable to you). Let them choose between those 2 options and if neither works for them, let them fire you. But I doubt that they'll go that route.
posted by mezzanayne at 11:28 PM on February 24, 2023 [9 favorites]
Next time boss says you'll have to come into the office, say: Oh is that the direction this company is taking? I was hoping to continue working here for X more years, but I guess this forces my hand and I'll have to start looking for a job that is fully remote.
Then don't say anything. Clam up. Stay silent. Too often we fill an uncomfortable silence in an effort to alleviate discomfort - both ours and that of the other person. Instead, bask in the uncomfortable silence and allow your boss to experience the full weight of her decision, and yours.
Also, look for another job.
posted by lulu68 at 12:00 AM on February 25, 2023 [7 favorites]
Then don't say anything. Clam up. Stay silent. Too often we fill an uncomfortable silence in an effort to alleviate discomfort - both ours and that of the other person. Instead, bask in the uncomfortable silence and allow your boss to experience the full weight of her decision, and yours.
Also, look for another job.
posted by lulu68 at 12:00 AM on February 25, 2023 [7 favorites]
Here to validate your feelings and also offer another perspective from someone who has worked remotely off and on since 1997.
Since you are senior management and a valued employee, you have a responsibility to yourself and to those you lead to fight to establish remote work as a norm at your workplace. I’ve done this from the same vantage point both before and during the pandemic. Don’t just wait for things to happen. Write it up as a proposal. Start transparent discussions. Record leadership decisions in writing. Be the squeaky wheel. Advocate openly and loudly for your needs and your team’s needs. Use the privilege of your rank to make remote work the policy for everyone.
My most recent example of doing this: After being hired fully remote in June 2021, I knew this day would come for me too. It did. I told them I have many employment options—which they know because they themselves recruited me away from my old position when I wasn’t in the market. And that I will never go back to daily or even weekly office commutes (this one is a brutal 1.5-2 hrs for 30 miles because Transit Reasons) because it’s terrible for the environment, my mental health, and my work productivity. I advocated not just for myself but for our entire business unit. I talked openly and non-threateningly. Just stated the facts. “I won’t be doing that. No one should have to.” We have ended up at a once monthly in office day. I do like seeing my colleagues. I get very little done on those days except bond through chitchat during and between endless meetings.
posted by ImproviseOrDie at 12:08 AM on February 25, 2023 [26 favorites]
Since you are senior management and a valued employee, you have a responsibility to yourself and to those you lead to fight to establish remote work as a norm at your workplace. I’ve done this from the same vantage point both before and during the pandemic. Don’t just wait for things to happen. Write it up as a proposal. Start transparent discussions. Record leadership decisions in writing. Be the squeaky wheel. Advocate openly and loudly for your needs and your team’s needs. Use the privilege of your rank to make remote work the policy for everyone.
My most recent example of doing this: After being hired fully remote in June 2021, I knew this day would come for me too. It did. I told them I have many employment options—which they know because they themselves recruited me away from my old position when I wasn’t in the market. And that I will never go back to daily or even weekly office commutes (this one is a brutal 1.5-2 hrs for 30 miles because Transit Reasons) because it’s terrible for the environment, my mental health, and my work productivity. I advocated not just for myself but for our entire business unit. I talked openly and non-threateningly. Just stated the facts. “I won’t be doing that. No one should have to.” We have ended up at a once monthly in office day. I do like seeing my colleagues. I get very little done on those days except bond through chitchat during and between endless meetings.
posted by ImproviseOrDie at 12:08 AM on February 25, 2023 [26 favorites]
Remember that you can work for so many more companies now. The pool is much bigger than "only jobs in your local area." My employer is 3 states away.
I am also in tech, but many industries are remote-friendly. As hard as you work at your job, make it your job to find a better job that aligns with what you want. Document your skills and your value and market yourself like the valuable asset that you are.
posted by I_Love_Bananas at 5:08 AM on February 25, 2023 [1 favorite]
I am also in tech, but many industries are remote-friendly. As hard as you work at your job, make it your job to find a better job that aligns with what you want. Document your skills and your value and market yourself like the valuable asset that you are.
posted by I_Love_Bananas at 5:08 AM on February 25, 2023 [1 favorite]
If someone labels you as privileged because you can work productively at home, I would push back on thoughts that you don’t deserve this, or that since most don’t get to do that , you shouldn’t get to. That is a corporate friendly mindset that dissuades people from a worker friendly mindset. Are you entitled because you are allowed work less than 50 hours a week, have a safe work environment that is regulated by a government agency, get social security benefits, can get sick leave, family leave, and possibly some health insurance? While these may be considered entitlements to some, they are also earned (you have this entitlement now and are productive) and therefore no one should imply to you that you don’t deserve this entitlement because you have it while others do not. Fight the good fight for making your work life suit you and hopefully become more mainstream for others, too, rather than letting corporate convince you to get in line. There is still a skilled worker shortage so that will give you leverage.
posted by waving at 5:29 AM on February 25, 2023 [22 favorites]
posted by waving at 5:29 AM on February 25, 2023 [22 favorites]
I would honestly not waste time being angry about this, and would instead focus on finding a new, fully remote job. If this is the direction your company is going, it's a waste of time to try and fight it. You started working there during a ''not normal" time, and now we're going back to a so-called ''normal'' time. It was inevitable that the sweet setup you find yourself in was not going to last forever. There is no use in developing a grudge against your ED for having privileges. And I agree with what others have said that you're already in a very privileged position compared to most (which is why making these comparisons is sometimes useless tbh). The point is, this job no longer affords you the lifestyle you want, and since you're a senior manager your skills are already in high demand. You should start your job search by filtering out any roles that don't involve IRL work.
Just know that there may be other annoyances and inhumanities that come with fully remote work which you may not be able to anticipate.
posted by winterportage at 5:32 AM on February 25, 2023 [6 favorites]
Just know that there may be other annoyances and inhumanities that come with fully remote work which you may not be able to anticipate.
posted by winterportage at 5:32 AM on February 25, 2023 [6 favorites]
It's very likely that your boss couldn't guarantee you any sort of permanent work from home if they wanted, unless they are at the top of company leadership. If the top leadership decides they want people back in, they're not going to let lower levels of management make many exceptions, certainly not based on "I like to work from home and am nervous about COVID." The decision to bring people back to the office isn't something that works on a manager by manager basis, because it's too easy for each manager to locally optimize for their teams (and also for avoiding conflict over the matter), which overall makes the whole system break. The value for most roles of being in the office requires other people to also be there, it's really hard to make it work without that. So the decision is necessarily a bigger culture call by top management. However, you could probably more successfully negotiate a day or two a week wfh if you show that you're supportive with coming back the other days and getting your team to do the same.
If you really want to stay remote I agree with everyone else that you need to find a job that is remote, not a job that was merely remote for the pandemic. It sounds to me like this is the right call for you, and so I'd go that way.
posted by ch1x0r at 6:33 AM on February 25, 2023 [1 favorite]
If you really want to stay remote I agree with everyone else that you need to find a job that is remote, not a job that was merely remote for the pandemic. It sounds to me like this is the right call for you, and so I'd go that way.
posted by ch1x0r at 6:33 AM on February 25, 2023 [1 favorite]
I have to ask: if you are thinking of quitting on the spot, what is the risk of hard-lining your boss?
Hi Anna,
As you know, I joined XYZ Corp in Year as a fully remote employee. Since then, I have worked from home to successfully deliver A, B, and C (totalling 60% of our output); managed 10 employees with 100% retention; and grown my job responsibilities to reflect my capabilities and the needs of XYZ Corp.
While I enjoy my work, responsibilities and the XYZ team, I am unwilling to give up WFH in favour of returning to the office. I would hate to leave XYZ, but the ability to WFH is the most valuable component of my compensation package and I am unwilling to give that up.
Can we set aside some time this week to discuss?
And if your boss tries to gaslight or bully you in discussions, just keep looking sad and saying "it's really unfortunate you can't make this work."
posted by DarlingBri at 6:37 AM on February 25, 2023 [18 favorites]
Hi Anna,
As you know, I joined XYZ Corp in Year as a fully remote employee. Since then, I have worked from home to successfully deliver A, B, and C (totalling 60% of our output); managed 10 employees with 100% retention; and grown my job responsibilities to reflect my capabilities and the needs of XYZ Corp.
While I enjoy my work, responsibilities and the XYZ team, I am unwilling to give up WFH in favour of returning to the office. I would hate to leave XYZ, but the ability to WFH is the most valuable component of my compensation package and I am unwilling to give that up.
Can we set aside some time this week to discuss?
And if your boss tries to gaslight or bully you in discussions, just keep looking sad and saying "it's really unfortunate you can't make this work."
posted by DarlingBri at 6:37 AM on February 25, 2023 [18 favorites]
I’d agree that it’s one thing for management to say this and another for them to actually fire you over this. I’d keep looking for another position that’s explicitly remote or remote-first, but also give them off ramps where they can retreat and save face. Avoid ultimatums. Until they really force the issue, the clearest you have to make your position is something like “commuting would be difficult for me right now”. And they may never force the issue.
It’s true that if senior management wants full onsite, they’ll get it, but you’re not alone balking at the request, middle / lower management might be just as frustrated with the mandate, and hiring new people is a risk and real pain in the ass.
posted by condour75 at 6:40 AM on February 25, 2023 [4 favorites]
It’s true that if senior management wants full onsite, they’ll get it, but you’re not alone balking at the request, middle / lower management might be just as frustrated with the mandate, and hiring new people is a risk and real pain in the ass.
posted by condour75 at 6:40 AM on February 25, 2023 [4 favorites]
You have a lot of good strategy options in the thread. I'll just add one more. You could return to your boss with a proposal to become an individual contributor/move to a new job role. That would leave them free to benefit from your productivity and institutional knowledge, while being able to hire someone else for supervisory on-site work, if that's what they're worried about. In other words, craft a new job just for you.
As everyone said, looking for another job makes sense, but don't make it easy for them. go through some of these negotiation steps - it's important learning for the company to see a valued employee try to make the relationship work, but draw the line at WFH. This is data for them, and they will (presumably) want to calculate the cost of lost productivity as they lose you and have to do a hiring process to replace you, probably with someone whose productivity levels will not reach yours for years.
posted by Miko at 7:01 AM on February 25, 2023 [8 favorites]
As everyone said, looking for another job makes sense, but don't make it easy for them. go through some of these negotiation steps - it's important learning for the company to see a valued employee try to make the relationship work, but draw the line at WFH. This is data for them, and they will (presumably) want to calculate the cost of lost productivity as they lose you and have to do a hiring process to replace you, probably with someone whose productivity levels will not reach yours for years.
posted by Miko at 7:01 AM on February 25, 2023 [8 favorites]
Write up the reasons why remote work is good for your employer. What you said, plus, savings on office space, utilities, whatever. Make notes about, and fully understand, your value to the employer. Are you paid well? How hard would it be to replace you? Have this information ready for when you need it. After meetings with your manager, document what both of you said and campaign a bit for remote work. As we discussed, remote work has been quite productive for me, allowing me to reach X targets and exceed Y targets. The time and fossil fuel saved on commuting is significant.
Never, ever, say that you take walks, arrive late, leave early, etc. This is why they want you back in the office.
Yes, look for new work. Fighting with your employer is a huge drag. But having prospects ready gives you negotiating power.
Decide where your line in the sand is. Would you work at the office 2 - 3 days a week? Every day til 1:30 so you can pick up your child from school. Negotiate for that by emphasizing the benefits to your employer, and the risk of losing you.
posted by theora55 at 7:32 AM on February 25, 2023 [4 favorites]
Never, ever, say that you take walks, arrive late, leave early, etc. This is why they want you back in the office.
Yes, look for new work. Fighting with your employer is a huge drag. But having prospects ready gives you negotiating power.
Decide where your line in the sand is. Would you work at the office 2 - 3 days a week? Every day til 1:30 so you can pick up your child from school. Negotiate for that by emphasizing the benefits to your employer, and the risk of losing you.
posted by theora55 at 7:32 AM on February 25, 2023 [4 favorites]
You might benefit from looking at the Ask A Manager blog. There is a lot about companies telling employees to come back to the office.
One thing that is unfortunately happening that I see in Ask A Manager is companies claiming jobs are remote when they’re not or hiring people as remote, then saying they need to come to the office. That makes me think it might be better if you can get your current employer to let you continue as remote, since you’ve already proven your value to them.
posted by FencingGal at 7:33 AM on February 25, 2023 [4 favorites]
One thing that is unfortunately happening that I see in Ask A Manager is companies claiming jobs are remote when they’re not or hiring people as remote, then saying they need to come to the office. That makes me think it might be better if you can get your current employer to let you continue as remote, since you’ve already proven your value to them.
posted by FencingGal at 7:33 AM on February 25, 2023 [4 favorites]
There's tons of great advice above, but I wanted to raise your spirits a little by sharing this CBC article about "rage applying" [for new jobs], currently the #1 most-being-read article on CBC News.
posted by heatherlogan at 7:33 AM on February 25, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by heatherlogan at 7:33 AM on February 25, 2023 [1 favorite]
My org, which is typically really reluctant to fire people, absolutely let someone go because she had moved to a far flung suburb during the pandemic and was unwilling to come into the office two days a week once that became mandatory. She even had a good argument - one person in another department moved to an entirely different state during the pandemic and kept her job, and we have a few fully remote employees in other states as well. But they had decided that she lived close enough to our office to be required to come in, and when she didn't, they fired her.
Nothing wrong with putting your foot down, especially if you're willing to quit over this, but I just wanted to counter the confidence that you'd be fine if you just ignored an in-office mandate. Some people in the office and others remote affects how meetings are held and scheduled so it's pretty hard to go under the radar. For example, does your company have the right tech in conference rooms that those participating remotely can be seen/heard by those in the room and vice versa? My company has had that tech for a long time because we used to have two offices, and it still is a struggle.
I was really resentful when my company went "hybrid" at first, especially after I caught COVID there. And I suspect it was one or two (male) execs who pushed for it because they feel important walking around an office full of little busy minions, which makes the pill harder to wallow. But now I'm strict about masking even though no one else does, roll my eyes at the c-suite, and have gotten used to it. My commute on transit sucks because of reduced bus and train schedules (75-90 minutes each way) but I got an ebike which cuts down on the travel time and lets me get some exercise in.
I do think if you were hired as "this job is always fully remote" and they are now talking about changing that, you have a good argument. But they're gonna do what they are gonna do and unless you have a LOT of political capital there it will be hard to change the direction they are heading. Maybe arguing (and possibly organizing - are there other senior managers you think would be on your side?) for a hybrid model could work.
posted by misskaz at 8:56 AM on February 25, 2023 [5 favorites]
Nothing wrong with putting your foot down, especially if you're willing to quit over this, but I just wanted to counter the confidence that you'd be fine if you just ignored an in-office mandate. Some people in the office and others remote affects how meetings are held and scheduled so it's pretty hard to go under the radar. For example, does your company have the right tech in conference rooms that those participating remotely can be seen/heard by those in the room and vice versa? My company has had that tech for a long time because we used to have two offices, and it still is a struggle.
I was really resentful when my company went "hybrid" at first, especially after I caught COVID there. And I suspect it was one or two (male) execs who pushed for it because they feel important walking around an office full of little busy minions, which makes the pill harder to wallow. But now I'm strict about masking even though no one else does, roll my eyes at the c-suite, and have gotten used to it. My commute on transit sucks because of reduced bus and train schedules (75-90 minutes each way) but I got an ebike which cuts down on the travel time and lets me get some exercise in.
I do think if you were hired as "this job is always fully remote" and they are now talking about changing that, you have a good argument. But they're gonna do what they are gonna do and unless you have a LOT of political capital there it will be hard to change the direction they are heading. Maybe arguing (and possibly organizing - are there other senior managers you think would be on your side?) for a hybrid model could work.
posted by misskaz at 8:56 AM on February 25, 2023 [5 favorites]
I just want to reinforce the advice above about asking for what you want and bolstering your case with data, if possible. My husband was working at a stuffy tech-adjacent business when we had our kid. As the end of his parental leave draw close, he decided to quite because no one was allowed to work part-time at that place. So he didn't even bother asking. He just gave his boss a head's up that he was planning to give notice because he wanted to spend more time raising his kid.
Completely unexpectedly, to us, his boss got back to him really quickly to see if there was anything that might change his mind. And my husband said sure! Happy to work two days per week and no more if you can make that happen. So his boss waved her magic wand and got his status shifted from full-time employee to contractor for two days a week. He did that for maybe half a year or a year, then went up to three days per week and eventually back to full-time when our kid was two and in daycare.
My husband, like you, was the most productive employee in his department. His boss knew that, appreciated it, and figured out how to keep him. There is no guarantee that you will get what you want at your current company. But you absolutely won't if you don't ask (unless your boss is as enthusiastic about you as my spouse's boss was about him).
I don't think this is about entitlement, I think this is about your values. You know what is important to you and you want to prioritise that. Good for you! I would not quit without another job offer in writing, however. Humans are weird. Currently employed people are just more appealing to hiring managers and future bosses than unemployed folks. There is a true, documented bias against people who are not working INCLUDING THOSE WHO ARE VOLUNTARILY UNEMPLOYED. That sucks but many things do; plan accordingly. Good luck!
posted by Bella Donna at 9:24 AM on February 25, 2023 [6 favorites]
Completely unexpectedly, to us, his boss got back to him really quickly to see if there was anything that might change his mind. And my husband said sure! Happy to work two days per week and no more if you can make that happen. So his boss waved her magic wand and got his status shifted from full-time employee to contractor for two days a week. He did that for maybe half a year or a year, then went up to three days per week and eventually back to full-time when our kid was two and in daycare.
My husband, like you, was the most productive employee in his department. His boss knew that, appreciated it, and figured out how to keep him. There is no guarantee that you will get what you want at your current company. But you absolutely won't if you don't ask (unless your boss is as enthusiastic about you as my spouse's boss was about him).
I don't think this is about entitlement, I think this is about your values. You know what is important to you and you want to prioritise that. Good for you! I would not quit without another job offer in writing, however. Humans are weird. Currently employed people are just more appealing to hiring managers and future bosses than unemployed folks. There is a true, documented bias against people who are not working INCLUDING THOSE WHO ARE VOLUNTARILY UNEMPLOYED. That sucks but many things do; plan accordingly. Good luck!
posted by Bella Donna at 9:24 AM on February 25, 2023 [6 favorites]
I think you should try to follow the advice here about making your case, using your productivity data to bolster it, etc.
However, in my opinion, this whole RTO thing is the face of capitalism and the assertion of power and hierarchy. It seems like these business don't care about workers and don't even care that much about productivity and money - they just want to assert control and power over the workforce.
My former workplace is requiring people to go in even when the jobs are entirely do-able remotely. People will go in - and have meetings over zoom while sitting at their computers in their cubes! There are no in-person meetings, because of covid risk! The only reason to come in that management was able to articulate was that there are some workers (health care providers) who *have* to come in to meet with patients and that those workers would feel bad that other, administrative, workers are able to work remotely.
It's insane until you look at it through the lens of the exercise of power over the workforce. So you should give rational pursuasion a try, but, sorry to say, I just don't think this is about rationality.
posted by jasper411 at 9:53 AM on February 25, 2023 [7 favorites]
However, in my opinion, this whole RTO thing is the face of capitalism and the assertion of power and hierarchy. It seems like these business don't care about workers and don't even care that much about productivity and money - they just want to assert control and power over the workforce.
My former workplace is requiring people to go in even when the jobs are entirely do-able remotely. People will go in - and have meetings over zoom while sitting at their computers in their cubes! There are no in-person meetings, because of covid risk! The only reason to come in that management was able to articulate was that there are some workers (health care providers) who *have* to come in to meet with patients and that those workers would feel bad that other, administrative, workers are able to work remotely.
It's insane until you look at it through the lens of the exercise of power over the workforce. So you should give rational pursuasion a try, but, sorry to say, I just don't think this is about rationality.
posted by jasper411 at 9:53 AM on February 25, 2023 [7 favorites]
... but I truthfully don’t think 100% remote is going to be possible in the longterm for most of us. 1-2 days in the office is more realistic.
Just as a counter-example, where I work is completely remote (or rather, remote vs hybrid vs office status is up to the employee, with approval by supervisor). The company dumped a lot of office space already and is set to dump more. Most of the competitors have done the same, and our private-sector clients are also offering remote work. (Public sector, not so much.) The point being just that this is an "it depends" situation that varies based on what sector you are working in, what kinds of companies you are looking at, and what the competition is doing (i.e., what do they have to do to attract talent). In a very large sense, my impression is that there is a bifurcation happening, with some people likely to have remote/hybrid options for the long term, and the majority of people having the default of in-office with a possibility of hybrid.
That said, while I like the scripts people have offered above for talking to your immediate supervisor and higher management, you need to be ready to call the bluff and look for a new job. I wouldn't quit preemptively, but I would start looking casually and possibly also start putting in some applications or reaching out to people in your network.
Lastly, though, a lot of what you have clearly been liking about remote work is being able to do things like start late/end early, run errands, and go pick up kids, while staying somewhat connected. A lot of people I know with remote jobs still don't have that much flexibility, because of needing to be online for meetings and conversations and high workloads and so on. So, you might find a new 100% remote job, but that doesn't give you any of the flexibility for all the things you have been valuing.
posted by Dip Flash at 10:15 PM on February 25, 2023 [1 favorite]
Just as a counter-example, where I work is completely remote (or rather, remote vs hybrid vs office status is up to the employee, with approval by supervisor). The company dumped a lot of office space already and is set to dump more. Most of the competitors have done the same, and our private-sector clients are also offering remote work. (Public sector, not so much.) The point being just that this is an "it depends" situation that varies based on what sector you are working in, what kinds of companies you are looking at, and what the competition is doing (i.e., what do they have to do to attract talent). In a very large sense, my impression is that there is a bifurcation happening, with some people likely to have remote/hybrid options for the long term, and the majority of people having the default of in-office with a possibility of hybrid.
That said, while I like the scripts people have offered above for talking to your immediate supervisor and higher management, you need to be ready to call the bluff and look for a new job. I wouldn't quit preemptively, but I would start looking casually and possibly also start putting in some applications or reaching out to people in your network.
Lastly, though, a lot of what you have clearly been liking about remote work is being able to do things like start late/end early, run errands, and go pick up kids, while staying somewhat connected. A lot of people I know with remote jobs still don't have that much flexibility, because of needing to be online for meetings and conversations and high workloads and so on. So, you might find a new 100% remote job, but that doesn't give you any of the flexibility for all the things you have been valuing.
posted by Dip Flash at 10:15 PM on February 25, 2023 [1 favorite]
Your boss is slippery and that sucks. You are also slippery and that probably sucks for them too. You don't like your bosses and you think you are more productive than most and that this means something very specific (reply to all messages within minutes, do x) when it might mean something entirely different to them, and to others. I am not sure what "privileged" means in relation to your boss exactly -- you really have no idea what a person's home life is like and are making a lot of assumptions about how happy or not their situation is relative to yours which probably makes them and others angry too -- but one thing it definitely means in the workplace is being able to provide flexibility of the sort they have been providing to you. Fully remote roles are themselves a privilege, not a right, and they could probably find someone to work fully remote for that privilege at a rate of compensation less than what they are paying you and probably find someone who won't be starting quite as late or ending quite as early or taking a few days off each week or running errands.
Anyway, there's your other perspective. This job is your choice. And theirs.
posted by desert exile at 8:07 AM on February 26, 2023 [2 favorites]
Anyway, there's your other perspective. This job is your choice. And theirs.
posted by desert exile at 8:07 AM on February 26, 2023 [2 favorites]
And if your boss tries to gaslight or bully you in discussions, just keep looking sad and saying "it's really unfortunate you can't make this work."
Framing it as THEIR problem to solve is a great angle. Oh and keep looking.
posted by I_Love_Bananas at 9:42 AM on February 26, 2023 [4 favorites]
Framing it as THEIR problem to solve is a great angle. Oh and keep looking.
posted by I_Love_Bananas at 9:42 AM on February 26, 2023 [4 favorites]
It may help you to treat this like a mechanical problem.
Don't dwell on whether or not "get asses in the seats" management is productive; that's not why executives decide to do things like this or to lay people off when the company has billions in cash. Companies are machines that are built to maximize their perceived value to their shareholders or owners. That is a slippery thing and trying to use productivity logic to explain businesses' decisions has made a lot of people, including my past self, very unhappy.
So, you can reduce this to "a machine which used to give me what I need no longer does that for reasons I can't control". You can indeed just quit if you have savings for the next few years and are comfortable using them while you find another remote job or other work. If not, you should tell yourself you're playing the game the best you can by looking for a more rewarding situation while enduring a situation that's gone bad.
If you stick around, don't do any more than you have to. Remember: it's basically a machine. It's trying to extract the most it can from you at the lowest cost to itself. It won't reward you. I have been at jobs at which I knew I was going to leave because they had gotten bad, but I still put in extra effort and time because of this idea of "professionalism". It was not worth it. If I wanted to be more professional, I should worked on skills or networking — aspects of professionalism that can be ported elsewhere.
As for whether or not you're unreasonable for wanting to work remotely, if you are, millions of others are as well. I work remotely! Do I "deserve" it or anything else I get from a job? It 100% doesn't matter. Companies will give you things if they think they need to to seem valuable to their shareholders. Otherwise, they won't!
posted by ignignokt at 7:31 PM on February 26, 2023 [2 favorites]
Don't dwell on whether or not "get asses in the seats" management is productive; that's not why executives decide to do things like this or to lay people off when the company has billions in cash. Companies are machines that are built to maximize their perceived value to their shareholders or owners. That is a slippery thing and trying to use productivity logic to explain businesses' decisions has made a lot of people, including my past self, very unhappy.
So, you can reduce this to "a machine which used to give me what I need no longer does that for reasons I can't control". You can indeed just quit if you have savings for the next few years and are comfortable using them while you find another remote job or other work. If not, you should tell yourself you're playing the game the best you can by looking for a more rewarding situation while enduring a situation that's gone bad.
If you stick around, don't do any more than you have to. Remember: it's basically a machine. It's trying to extract the most it can from you at the lowest cost to itself. It won't reward you. I have been at jobs at which I knew I was going to leave because they had gotten bad, but I still put in extra effort and time because of this idea of "professionalism". It was not worth it. If I wanted to be more professional, I should worked on skills or networking — aspects of professionalism that can be ported elsewhere.
As for whether or not you're unreasonable for wanting to work remotely, if you are, millions of others are as well. I work remotely! Do I "deserve" it or anything else I get from a job? It 100% doesn't matter. Companies will give you things if they think they need to to seem valuable to their shareholders. Otherwise, they won't!
posted by ignignokt at 7:31 PM on February 26, 2023 [2 favorites]
This thread is closed to new comments.
I would keep looking. Don't quit before you have something better lined up. Good luck.
posted by NotLost at 7:53 PM on February 24, 2023 [38 favorites]