Mystery loan denial
October 31, 2022 4:00 AM Subscribe
I was going through my deceased father's filing cabinet to determine what could be thrown out and what might need to be kept to get financial things in order. I found a Statement of Credit Denial for a "signature loan" of $7000 from his credit union from 20 years ago. That sounds normal enough, except getting a loan is absolutely out of character for him and there is an unknown person's name on the form.
1. The address on it is my parents' address, but under my father's name, above the street address, is the name of a woman who we don't know. Googling tells me that she is a local real estate appraiser.
2. My father had strong feelings about borrowing money. He just didn't do it. My parents paid cash for everything -- including houses, education, and cars. They may have had a credit card at that time, paid off each month, because it had become impossible to do some transactions without one, but that would be the only use of credit.
3. The reason given for denial of the loan request was "Amount of Unsecured Debt Outstanding." Since my parents have never borrowed money, this is surprising.
What is going on here? Did he try to cosign a loan for a stranger? He did not suffer from dementia at that time.
1. The address on it is my parents' address, but under my father's name, above the street address, is the name of a woman who we don't know. Googling tells me that she is a local real estate appraiser.
2. My father had strong feelings about borrowing money. He just didn't do it. My parents paid cash for everything -- including houses, education, and cars. They may have had a credit card at that time, paid off each month, because it had become impossible to do some transactions without one, but that would be the only use of credit.
3. The reason given for denial of the loan request was "Amount of Unsecured Debt Outstanding." Since my parents have never borrowed money, this is surprising.
What is going on here? Did he try to cosign a loan for a stranger? He did not suffer from dementia at that time.
I'd say it's likely that woman was not a stranger, and then I'd say - let it go. Some mysteries are better left alone.
posted by Sweetie Darling at 4:16 AM on October 31, 2022 [19 favorites]
posted by Sweetie Darling at 4:16 AM on October 31, 2022 [19 favorites]
Had your mother passed by the time the loan was signed?
I ask because my father co-signed a car loan and credit card for a woman he was dating after my mother's passing. Just as out-of-character for him as for your father. It ended poorly, though not as poorly as it might have.
Loneliness can be as out-of-character-inducing as dementia, I think.
posted by humbug at 4:51 AM on October 31, 2022 [7 favorites]
I ask because my father co-signed a car loan and credit card for a woman he was dating after my mother's passing. Just as out-of-character for him as for your father. It ended poorly, though not as poorly as it might have.
Loneliness can be as out-of-character-inducing as dementia, I think.
posted by humbug at 4:51 AM on October 31, 2022 [7 favorites]
Could be that the appraiser tried identity fraud by linking herself to your parents' address, got caught, and this is the remaining evidence of it.
posted by Dashy at 5:08 AM on October 31, 2022 [2 favorites]
posted by Dashy at 5:08 AM on October 31, 2022 [2 favorites]
Your Dad may have been doing a kindness by so-signing a loan for someone.
posted by theora55 at 6:10 AM on October 31, 2022 [7 favorites]
posted by theora55 at 6:10 AM on October 31, 2022 [7 favorites]
Yes, it sounds like he was co-signing for someone. The investopedia entry for "signature loans" mentions co-signers as being a common feature for people who have poor credit. The denial for too much debt outstanding would line up with the idea of this unknown person having poor credit.
posted by Mid at 6:39 AM on October 31, 2022 [1 favorite]
posted by Mid at 6:39 AM on October 31, 2022 [1 favorite]
I'm with the people guessing that he was probably helping someone out. The reasons for why he would help them in that way may be lost to time, however.
More generally, if you are in the position of going through someone's papers after their death, you are likely to encounter any number of surprises. Something I wasn't really expecting (because no one really talks about any of this) is how much of that I felt obligated to continue to keep private -- the person chose to keep it private during their life, and frequently it is a kindness to their survivors to continue that privacy. But every time you find something, it becomes a decision (possibly a complicated decision) about whether or not to look into it more deeply, and whether or not to discuss it with any survivors.
posted by Dip Flash at 6:58 AM on October 31, 2022 [4 favorites]
More generally, if you are in the position of going through someone's papers after their death, you are likely to encounter any number of surprises. Something I wasn't really expecting (because no one really talks about any of this) is how much of that I felt obligated to continue to keep private -- the person chose to keep it private during their life, and frequently it is a kindness to their survivors to continue that privacy. But every time you find something, it becomes a decision (possibly a complicated decision) about whether or not to look into it more deeply, and whether or not to discuss it with any survivors.
posted by Dip Flash at 6:58 AM on October 31, 2022 [4 favorites]
Absent other information I would assume he was helping someone he knew and I did not, kept it quiet out of respect for her privacy or his own, and I would honor that choice he made by letting that sleeping dog lie.
posted by Stacey at 8:29 AM on October 31, 2022 [2 favorites]
posted by Stacey at 8:29 AM on October 31, 2022 [2 favorites]
I disagree that parents after becoming deceased are entitled to privacy. They're dead. No such entitlement exists. They don't care. My parents were abusive and hurtful to me, and only through going through their shit after they died did I understand some of the contributing factors to their behavior. This would not have been possible without going through notes from psychiatrists and such. This has helped me overcome my own issues.
posted by Geckwoistmeinauto at 8:59 AM on October 31, 2022 [16 favorites]
posted by Geckwoistmeinauto at 8:59 AM on October 31, 2022 [16 favorites]
No deceased person has a legal right to privacy. Only you can say if you have a personal obligation to respect your father's privacy.
Your father chose to keep a Statement of Credit Denial for a signature loan for him and a woman you do not know, and chose to keep it for 20 years. Apparently his feelings about this particular loan request were much stronger than his well-known negative feelings about borrowing.
posted by desert exile at 2:16 PM on October 31, 2022
Your father chose to keep a Statement of Credit Denial for a signature loan for him and a woman you do not know, and chose to keep it for 20 years. Apparently his feelings about this particular loan request were much stronger than his well-known negative feelings about borrowing.
posted by desert exile at 2:16 PM on October 31, 2022
My theory is that your dad went against his anti-loan principle to help an old schoolmate qualify for a mortgage (with your mom's permission, assuming he and she were still in the same house...).
Is the appraiser the same age as your dad? As you? Maybe arrange to bump into this appraiser at a chamber of commerce mixer and say her name seems familiar.
My further theory is that your dad paid the loan officer a small amount under the table to turn him and his friend down for the loan.
posted by at at 4:47 PM on October 31, 2022
Is the appraiser the same age as your dad? As you? Maybe arrange to bump into this appraiser at a chamber of commerce mixer and say her name seems familiar.
My further theory is that your dad paid the loan officer a small amount under the table to turn him and his friend down for the loan.
posted by at at 4:47 PM on October 31, 2022
They may have had a credit card at that time, paid off each month, because it had become impossible to do some transactions without one, but that would be the only use of credit.
and
3. The reason given for denial of the loan request was "Amount of Unsecured Debt Outstanding."
Sounds like he had a high balance on his credit card at the time of applying for the loan. Doesn't matter if he paid it off every month. I had this happen to me--excellent credit and years of on time payments, but was denied for a credit increase because my current balance was something like 2k due to a large purchase a few days ago, which I was going to pay off later in the month (I just wanted the $20 in rewards points), which was the only reason I wanted a credit increase anyway. I didn't realize they cared about that, I thought only the revolving balance mattered, but apparently that was a problem.
Everyone else's theories about co-signing sound correct as well, but that may explain the "unsecured debt" bit.
posted by brook horse at 5:08 PM on October 31, 2022
and
3. The reason given for denial of the loan request was "Amount of Unsecured Debt Outstanding."
Sounds like he had a high balance on his credit card at the time of applying for the loan. Doesn't matter if he paid it off every month. I had this happen to me--excellent credit and years of on time payments, but was denied for a credit increase because my current balance was something like 2k due to a large purchase a few days ago, which I was going to pay off later in the month (I just wanted the $20 in rewards points), which was the only reason I wanted a credit increase anyway. I didn't realize they cared about that, I thought only the revolving balance mattered, but apparently that was a problem.
Everyone else's theories about co-signing sound correct as well, but that may explain the "unsecured debt" bit.
posted by brook horse at 5:08 PM on October 31, 2022
If he was a co-signer, could it have been the amount of unsecured debt SHE had which made his credit union look askance at the loan? I would imagine they would take into consideration the debt load of all the parties involved.
posted by Larry David Syndrome at 5:48 PM on October 31, 2022
posted by Larry David Syndrome at 5:48 PM on October 31, 2022
No deceased person has a legal right to privacy. Only you can say if you have a personal obligation to respect your father's privacy.
I would suggest separating that question into two parts. First, you have to decide if this is something you want to dig into and learn, or just leave it alone as an unexplained mystery. Second, assuming you chose to and were able to find the answers, you have to decide if this is something you would ever reveal to others and if so, how. Particularly for the second question, it's not just about whatever privacy you might or might not feel your father deserves, but also what impact might hearing about this have on anyone still living?
There's no easy answers to any of this, in my experience.
posted by Dip Flash at 10:30 AM on November 1, 2022
I would suggest separating that question into two parts. First, you have to decide if this is something you want to dig into and learn, or just leave it alone as an unexplained mystery. Second, assuming you chose to and were able to find the answers, you have to decide if this is something you would ever reveal to others and if so, how. Particularly for the second question, it's not just about whatever privacy you might or might not feel your father deserves, but also what impact might hearing about this have on anyone still living?
There's no easy answers to any of this, in my experience.
posted by Dip Flash at 10:30 AM on November 1, 2022
If your father was having an affair or there was something else shady going on, would he keep a record of a denied loan application with that person among all his other files for 20 years?
I’m with everyone else who is saying he probably tried to help someone by co-signing a loan. Or less likely but still I guess plausible that he was keeping evidence against them after they did something fraudulent.
posted by cali59 at 11:07 AM on November 1, 2022 [2 favorites]
I’m with everyone else who is saying he probably tried to help someone by co-signing a loan. Or less likely but still I guess plausible that he was keeping evidence against them after they did something fraudulent.
posted by cali59 at 11:07 AM on November 1, 2022 [2 favorites]
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by telegraph at 4:12 AM on October 31, 2022 [7 favorites]