Parents who share kid custody - how do you handle clothes?
October 18, 2022 3:41 AM Subscribe
My girls (10 & 13) are with me about 1/3 of the time. Since the split 5 years ago--when I originally had them only 2 weekends a month--they've kept their clothes at their mom's and packed overnight bags for when they're with me. As the split has become more even, I've bought them more clothes, but they're starting to not want to pack bags at all--and demanding (echoing their mom) that I buy them an entirely new set for my house. Is this as unreasonable as it sounds?
Communications between their mom and I are strained at best, which complicates things. In a perfect world we could just say "let's each spend X" or "I got them Y, how about you get them Z?" and problem solved. But now it's mostly some version of "you don't buy them/us anything," which is irritatingly untrue.
Buying two entire wardrobes seems wasteful to me, when they have more than enough clothes already. And even if I did get more, I suspect things would eventually migrate to mom's, which is what happens with the almost all the clothes I do get them already.
Am I just being impractical and/or obstinate? Is there some kind of compromise that might work?
Communications between their mom and I are strained at best, which complicates things. In a perfect world we could just say "let's each spend X" or "I got them Y, how about you get them Z?" and problem solved. But now it's mostly some version of "you don't buy them/us anything," which is irritatingly untrue.
Buying two entire wardrobes seems wasteful to me, when they have more than enough clothes already. And even if I did get more, I suspect things would eventually migrate to mom's, which is what happens with the almost all the clothes I do get them already.
Am I just being impractical and/or obstinate? Is there some kind of compromise that might work?
It's probably unreasonable for them to expect to have 2N clothes where N is the amount that someone with only one home needs for a functioning wardrobe. However, it's not unreasonable at all for them to want to be able to keep a set of clothes in a home that is theirs half the time; and I think it's also not unreasonable for them to think that some number of clothes greater than N would be really helpful given that they're distributing their time across two homes. Hell, I thought about buying a few extra wardrobe staples for myself when I had an apartment I was visiting once a month. Two relocations a week? I definitely want two bathrobes.
I'm puzzled when you say that all clothes wind up migrating to their mother's place. Why do you think this is? What is your laundry arrangement with your daughters?
posted by eirias at 4:04 AM on October 18, 2022 [20 favorites]
I'm puzzled when you say that all clothes wind up migrating to their mother's place. Why do you think this is? What is your laundry arrangement with your daughters?
posted by eirias at 4:04 AM on October 18, 2022 [20 favorites]
Do they wear the same size? My kids are a week short of two years apart and at that age, they shared clothes for the most part. I don't think it's unreasonable to ask each of them to choose two weeks' worth of clothing from their mother's house to stay at your house. Then, if you're feeling generous, take them to a consignment store to fill in the gaps. Maybe give them $50-100 each, if you can spring it. Someplace like Plato's Closet has shirts for less than $10 and jeans for less than $20. I used to get my kid's leggings, t-shirts, socks, underwear, and fleeces at Target and Costco.
This is also prime time to teach them how to do laundry if they don't know yet. Seriously. Both my kids learned at that age and have been doing it since then. There is absolutely no reason that they can't sort by color, and throw their clothes in with some detergent and color bleach. If they suck at folding, have them watch YouTube and maybe get them one of those folding board things to make it easy. They *will* thank you one day. My eldest is a sophomore in college now and just the other day told me that she's shocked at how many kids have no clue how to wash their clothes.
posted by dancinglamb at 4:05 AM on October 18, 2022 [4 favorites]
This is also prime time to teach them how to do laundry if they don't know yet. Seriously. Both my kids learned at that age and have been doing it since then. There is absolutely no reason that they can't sort by color, and throw their clothes in with some detergent and color bleach. If they suck at folding, have them watch YouTube and maybe get them one of those folding board things to make it easy. They *will* thank you one day. My eldest is a sophomore in college now and just the other day told me that she's shocked at how many kids have no clue how to wash their clothes.
posted by dancinglamb at 4:05 AM on October 18, 2022 [4 favorites]
I can't speak to what's common in divorces but I think you have a great opportunity here to educate your children on budgets.
I'd say yes, but give them a (reasonable - this will depend on your climate and whether they need coats/boots/etc.) budget (my son's fall/winter budget was $350 here in Toronto, didn't include boots) and challenge them to get that whole wardrobe within the budget. You could have a lot of fun with them looking for sales and thrifting.
Then they can learn how to do the laundry and keep those things at your place.
I would personally hate packing a bag every week, especially as a teen with all the school stuff, instruments, etc.
posted by warriorqueen at 4:08 AM on October 18, 2022 [10 favorites]
I'd say yes, but give them a (reasonable - this will depend on your climate and whether they need coats/boots/etc.) budget (my son's fall/winter budget was $350 here in Toronto, didn't include boots) and challenge them to get that whole wardrobe within the budget. You could have a lot of fun with them looking for sales and thrifting.
Then they can learn how to do the laundry and keep those things at your place.
I would personally hate packing a bag every week, especially as a teen with all the school stuff, instruments, etc.
posted by warriorqueen at 4:08 AM on October 18, 2022 [10 favorites]
I do want to note that when I say pick two weeks of clothes, you said your kiddos have a ton of clothes. I'm imagining they have the amount of stuff my girls had at that age (and still have).
posted by dancinglamb at 4:08 AM on October 18, 2022
posted by dancinglamb at 4:08 AM on October 18, 2022
My parents had 50/50 split custody of me starting at age 6 where I'd switch houses every week, and I had a bit more than a week's worth of clothes at each place so I didn't have to pack up every time.
posted by LionIndex at 4:14 AM on October 18, 2022 [8 favorites]
posted by LionIndex at 4:14 AM on October 18, 2022 [8 favorites]
My partner has 50/50 custody with his ex of their 6 year old. Each house has its own wardrobes. There is some migration of clothes. At 6 he tries to send her back to mom’s in mom’s clothes but it’s not 100%. I think they both kind of feel like the other is taking all “their” clothes and that “their” clothes are superior for various reasons. They ask each other to send back specific items and most of the time follow through on those requests.
With older kids it’s even harder to manage what they wear but you can try to get them into a routine of wearing mom’s clothes back to mom’s house. Or just accept that as long as they aren’t packing bags back and forth you’ll have a roughly equivalent amount of clothes at your house regardless of whether they were bought by you or the ex.
But yeah it’s reasonable for you to provide them clothes at your house just like you provide food and furniture. The suggestions about creating a budget and getting them involved above are great.
posted by jeoc at 4:28 AM on October 18, 2022 [11 favorites]
With older kids it’s even harder to manage what they wear but you can try to get them into a routine of wearing mom’s clothes back to mom’s house. Or just accept that as long as they aren’t packing bags back and forth you’ll have a roughly equivalent amount of clothes at your house regardless of whether they were bought by you or the ex.
But yeah it’s reasonable for you to provide them clothes at your house just like you provide food and furniture. The suggestions about creating a budget and getting them involved above are great.
posted by jeoc at 4:28 AM on October 18, 2022 [11 favorites]
Don’t die on this hill. Your house isn’t a hotel where they should have to bring their own stuff; it’s their home too where they should get to keep their things. You don’t have to buy them a full wardrobe but having enough clothes for a visit with you, plus some extra for fun and comfort, is a very reasonable request.
If they keep taking stuff back to their other home that’s a separate problem and can be tackled in other ways, but treating them like temporary guests in their own home doesn’t seem like the right way.
posted by Stacey at 4:29 AM on October 18, 2022 [69 favorites]
If they keep taking stuff back to their other home that’s a separate problem and can be tackled in other ways, but treating them like temporary guests in their own home doesn’t seem like the right way.
posted by Stacey at 4:29 AM on October 18, 2022 [69 favorites]
Just chiming in to say that suggestions that they share clothes would be a hard no in most sibling relationships, even if they are similar in size. Many kids at that age are really into clothes for social/identity reasons, packing is a pain, and their request is not unreasonable.
posted by emd3737 at 4:45 AM on October 18, 2022 [17 favorites]
posted by emd3737 at 4:45 AM on October 18, 2022 [17 favorites]
Also maybe an opportunity to educate on the enormous ethical and environmental costs of a lot of the clothing pushed at them. Lots of magazine type articles about this eg here, also plenty of scholarly research available eg here. Do they know most of their clothing is made in sweatshops? Lots of kids are really interested in ethics and justice around this age. Also this is around when some kids turn on to shopping at thrift stores to get more from their budget and get a more unique style than available at Gap or Target or whatever this season. That might even be something fun to do together!
posted by SaltySalticid at 4:52 AM on October 18, 2022 [1 favorite]
posted by SaltySalticid at 4:52 AM on October 18, 2022 [1 favorite]
Yes, things not packed / left at the other parents house do not get replaced. That’s a great life lesson, as well as the budgeting and clothes wash above.
We helped the kids come up with a list of things that needed to be transferred from house to house, and we spent the time to be with them during packing up to make sure that “here” things stayed here — or, if they really wanted to take a Here item to the other parents house, that they left a comparable item at our house so they’d have enough of that item for the following week with us.
The lists were printed out and put in the away bag every week (and included places to write in special school items for each week). When they got older and had phones, we could text them the list the day of transition, with questions around special school assignments or dress-up days or what not, to help them prepare well.
Rules and limits around this are fine. Introducing places where the kids need to make choices and plan for the short-term (two week or one month) future is fantastic. But it’s a learned skill, and they need you to help them understand the implications and make wise choices. Do not leave your kids in a vacuum during the transition phases. In our situation, the other parent did - the old yelling up the stairs without actually assisting - and it lead to forgotten critical things not packed and lots of tears and bedtime or morning “I forgot this at X’s house!” crises.
Budget time for the packing up, and Be There to help your kids learn planning and self-reliance.
posted by Silvery Fish at 5:15 AM on October 18, 2022 [6 favorites]
We helped the kids come up with a list of things that needed to be transferred from house to house, and we spent the time to be with them during packing up to make sure that “here” things stayed here — or, if they really wanted to take a Here item to the other parents house, that they left a comparable item at our house so they’d have enough of that item for the following week with us.
The lists were printed out and put in the away bag every week (and included places to write in special school items for each week). When they got older and had phones, we could text them the list the day of transition, with questions around special school assignments or dress-up days or what not, to help them prepare well.
Rules and limits around this are fine. Introducing places where the kids need to make choices and plan for the short-term (two week or one month) future is fantastic. But it’s a learned skill, and they need you to help them understand the implications and make wise choices. Do not leave your kids in a vacuum during the transition phases. In our situation, the other parent did - the old yelling up the stairs without actually assisting - and it lead to forgotten critical things not packed and lots of tears and bedtime or morning “I forgot this at X’s house!” crises.
Budget time for the packing up, and Be There to help your kids learn planning and self-reliance.
posted by Silvery Fish at 5:15 AM on October 18, 2022 [6 favorites]
And even if I did get more, I suspect things would eventually migrate to mom's, which is what happens with the almost all the clothes I do get them already.
This is just a reminder that the clothes are theirs, not yours, and whether they are at their mom's house or yours should not matter to you. It sounds like you're not complaining to the kids about this, which is good, but it's really best to let go of thinking of anything you buy for the kids as somehow yours - unless there's something weird going on like you buying them expensive stuff and their mom selling it.
(My ex did choose this as a hill to die on - so that clothes and toys given to the kids by his relatives had to stay at his house. I drew a line by refusing to make sure the kids went back to his house wearing the underwear and socks he bought them. This pettiness was not lost on the kids, and let's just say that neither has a great relationship with him now. It's not the only reason, but it didn't help.)
posted by FencingGal at 5:24 AM on October 18, 2022 [26 favorites]
This is just a reminder that the clothes are theirs, not yours, and whether they are at their mom's house or yours should not matter to you. It sounds like you're not complaining to the kids about this, which is good, but it's really best to let go of thinking of anything you buy for the kids as somehow yours - unless there's something weird going on like you buying them expensive stuff and their mom selling it.
(My ex did choose this as a hill to die on - so that clothes and toys given to the kids by his relatives had to stay at his house. I drew a line by refusing to make sure the kids went back to his house wearing the underwear and socks he bought them. This pettiness was not lost on the kids, and let's just say that neither has a great relationship with him now. It's not the only reason, but it didn't help.)
posted by FencingGal at 5:24 AM on October 18, 2022 [26 favorites]
Transitioning between houses is not easy on kids, and reducing that friction as much as possible is kind to them. Having your home fully stocked for their needs also makes you seem more like a full parent rather than a "weekend dad."
posted by metasarah at 5:49 AM on October 18, 2022 [27 favorites]
posted by metasarah at 5:49 AM on October 18, 2022 [27 favorites]
Your house isn’t a hotel where they should have to bring their own stuff; it’s their home too where they should get to keep their things. You don’t have to buy them a full wardrobe but having enough clothes for a visit with you, plus some extra for fun and comfort, is a very reasonable request.
This. Your house needs to be a home to them.
Also, my kids hated having to bring wardrobe stuff with them to school, underlining that the other home was not a real home.
If you don't like stuff "disappearing" at the other home, then have the clothes they came in clean and ready in the morning the day they leave. We did this because at my house everyone wore black or white for an easier laundry situation, while the other parents/stepparents found that strategy absurd.
posted by mumimor at 5:54 AM on October 18, 2022 [15 favorites]
This. Your house needs to be a home to them.
Also, my kids hated having to bring wardrobe stuff with them to school, underlining that the other home was not a real home.
If you don't like stuff "disappearing" at the other home, then have the clothes they came in clean and ready in the morning the day they leave. We did this because at my house everyone wore black or white for an easier laundry situation, while the other parents/stepparents found that strategy absurd.
posted by mumimor at 5:54 AM on October 18, 2022 [15 favorites]
This is just a reminder that the clothes are theirs, not yours, and whether they are at their mom's house or yours should not matter to you.
Well, yeah, it matters if the clothes only ever take one-way trips to mom’s, forcing dad to endlessly purchase replacements for clothes he has already bought and that they still own
posted by showbiz_liz at 5:55 AM on October 18, 2022 [12 favorites]
Well, yeah, it matters if the clothes only ever take one-way trips to mom’s, forcing dad to endlessly purchase replacements for clothes he has already bought and that they still own
posted by showbiz_liz at 5:55 AM on October 18, 2022 [12 favorites]
Guys it doesn’t sound like he doesn’t want them keeping ANY CLOTHES at his house, it sounds like they HAVE clothing storage at both houses and the mom is saying that instead of distributing those clothes between the houses, dad should buy a full new wardrobe for both kids?
posted by showbiz_liz at 5:58 AM on October 18, 2022 [1 favorite]
posted by showbiz_liz at 5:58 AM on October 18, 2022 [1 favorite]
They should not have to pack bags of clothes at all! Of course they shouldn't. It's their home!
Exactly how you do it is up to you. Maybe give them a budget. Maybe tell them that to start you'd like them to bring 3 outfits from their mom's and you'll shop for 3 outfits together.
Also something important to think about when kids (or anyone) are complaining about something that isn't technically true: they are communicating an emotional need, not a telling you a fact. "You never get me anything" is most likely letting you know that your kids do not feel special and appreciated by you. You can think of many low-cost ways to do that (show them you care by spending time doing things they love). But when your kids are telling you their emotional needs, you have a great opportunity to recognize that and step up to improve your relationship with them.
posted by medusa at 6:27 AM on October 18, 2022 [33 favorites]
Exactly how you do it is up to you. Maybe give them a budget. Maybe tell them that to start you'd like them to bring 3 outfits from their mom's and you'll shop for 3 outfits together.
Also something important to think about when kids (or anyone) are complaining about something that isn't technically true: they are communicating an emotional need, not a telling you a fact. "You never get me anything" is most likely letting you know that your kids do not feel special and appreciated by you. You can think of many low-cost ways to do that (show them you care by spending time doing things they love). But when your kids are telling you their emotional needs, you have a great opportunity to recognize that and step up to improve your relationship with them.
posted by medusa at 6:27 AM on October 18, 2022 [33 favorites]
And even if I did get more, I suspect things would eventually migrate to mom's, which is what happens with the almost all the clothes I do get them already.
Of course they do, because you have established a system whereby they don't normally keep clothes at your home, but instead pack a bag and bring it. So then they pack a bag and take it away again, why would you expect anything else?
Also, what is the laundry situation at your house? Are they currently packing in clean clothes and packing home dirty clothes to be washed when they get home?
FWIW, I don't think what they are suggesting is particularly unreasonable, unless it is truly not in your budget. If they truly have a lot of clothes -- like, they could wear different outfits for several weeks in a row without doing laundry -- ask them to choose a few days worth to bring to your house and then buy them some extras. I, as a grown adult have started splitting time between two homes in two different cities, and I keep a near complete wardrobe in each one. I pack a few of my favourite, most comfortable and flattering things back and forth, but most things I have divided up between them based on climate and things I typically do in each. I travel between them by airplane only every few months so it's not like I can just stop home and grab something I'm missing, so, for example, I keep walking/hiking shoes, casual shoes and dress shoes in each places. I also have a complete interview ready power suit in both places because packing it back and forth is annoying when I rarely need it but I also never know when I might need it. That presumably doesn't apply to your kids and you don't need duplicate fancy party dresses for events that can be planned for but if there are things they might informally get invited to do at the last minute they should have appropriate clothing for it. So, like, if their friends like to go swimming, they should have a swimsuit in both houses. Or hiking boots in both places if they hike.
It's similar to feminine hygiene products, which I imagine at least your elder daughter is using at this point. Ideally she wouldn't have to remember to bring them in case her period starts, they should just be there waiting for her because she lives there. Same with, like, socks. Remembering to bring socks with you every damn week just sounds low key emotionally draining over the long term. Divorce is tough on kids and this is one way you can make it a teeny bit easier.
posted by jacquilynne at 6:33 AM on October 18, 2022 [32 favorites]
Of course they do, because you have established a system whereby they don't normally keep clothes at your home, but instead pack a bag and bring it. So then they pack a bag and take it away again, why would you expect anything else?
Also, what is the laundry situation at your house? Are they currently packing in clean clothes and packing home dirty clothes to be washed when they get home?
FWIW, I don't think what they are suggesting is particularly unreasonable, unless it is truly not in your budget. If they truly have a lot of clothes -- like, they could wear different outfits for several weeks in a row without doing laundry -- ask them to choose a few days worth to bring to your house and then buy them some extras. I, as a grown adult have started splitting time between two homes in two different cities, and I keep a near complete wardrobe in each one. I pack a few of my favourite, most comfortable and flattering things back and forth, but most things I have divided up between them based on climate and things I typically do in each. I travel between them by airplane only every few months so it's not like I can just stop home and grab something I'm missing, so, for example, I keep walking/hiking shoes, casual shoes and dress shoes in each places. I also have a complete interview ready power suit in both places because packing it back and forth is annoying when I rarely need it but I also never know when I might need it. That presumably doesn't apply to your kids and you don't need duplicate fancy party dresses for events that can be planned for but if there are things they might informally get invited to do at the last minute they should have appropriate clothing for it. So, like, if their friends like to go swimming, they should have a swimsuit in both houses. Or hiking boots in both places if they hike.
It's similar to feminine hygiene products, which I imagine at least your elder daughter is using at this point. Ideally she wouldn't have to remember to bring them in case her period starts, they should just be there waiting for her because she lives there. Same with, like, socks. Remembering to bring socks with you every damn week just sounds low key emotionally draining over the long term. Divorce is tough on kids and this is one way you can make it a teeny bit easier.
posted by jacquilynne at 6:33 AM on October 18, 2022 [32 favorites]
I think you should establish a capsule wardrobe that stays at your house no matter what. It can be composed of clothes they already have, but if you're going to institute a new regimen it's nice to start by picking out a few new things. Keep a checklist. Wash those clothes for them. You may have to do a sales pitch that you explain, as in, "Won't it be nice not to have to pack?" This is the kind of thing that's trendy with adults now-- designing your life for greater simplicity and convenience. Which, of course, turns out to cost money but it doesn't have to be THAT much money. And some of the things people have said above-- both homes are their homes, they should be able to transition seamlessly, are things they might appreciate hearing.
posted by BibiRose at 6:49 AM on October 18, 2022 [5 favorites]
posted by BibiRose at 6:49 AM on October 18, 2022 [5 favorites]
Having a capsule wardrobe & set of basics at your place let’s them bring favorites back & forth if the basics are covered. Update it when sizes change. Figure out where your best thrift shop is in your neighborhood and fill in some gaps or play with style without breaking the bank. Thrift shops get a lot of play with Halloween, if it’s a new concept for them. Having clothes at your house makes it more like home. They need to leave some clothes in the nest to come back to. They can leave stuff behind because they will be back to wear it. And do laundry with them, it’s a natural way to check in - you wore that to X, that color really brings out your eyes, etc., all while sorting & checking on fit with growing kiddos.
posted by childofTethys at 6:49 AM on October 18, 2022
posted by childofTethys at 6:49 AM on October 18, 2022
I don't think you all should obligate them to pack a bag. Beyond the symbolic implications, that's a lot of logistical hassle. Kids are just not at that level of executive function, and if you can't support them alongside your ex, it gets messy.
I have a pretty similar situation, my daughter spends half her time with me and clothes go missing all the time; but she also has a ton of clothes that are here, so she doesn't need to pack bags. In this age of fast fashion and thrift stores, it should be easy enough to make sure the kids have clothes at your place available.
If they don't remember to bring their special top from Mom's this time, let them be disappointed, and gently remind them they *can* think ahead next time so they have what they want, if its specific.
posted by RajahKing at 6:51 AM on October 18, 2022 [4 favorites]
I have a pretty similar situation, my daughter spends half her time with me and clothes go missing all the time; but she also has a ton of clothes that are here, so she doesn't need to pack bags. In this age of fast fashion and thrift stores, it should be easy enough to make sure the kids have clothes at your place available.
If they don't remember to bring their special top from Mom's this time, let them be disappointed, and gently remind them they *can* think ahead next time so they have what they want, if its specific.
posted by RajahKing at 6:51 AM on October 18, 2022 [4 favorites]
I know two grown, if still young, men who are still hurting over being made to feel that clothes belonged to the parent (or parents partner in this case) who bought them and being micromanaged about where shirts and underwear were. It's clothes, there's bigger things coming.
posted by Iteki at 7:03 AM on October 18, 2022 [31 favorites]
posted by Iteki at 7:03 AM on October 18, 2022 [31 favorites]
My assumption was that my kids would have enough clothes at each house so they didn't have to pack a bag. I wanted them to feel like whichever house they were going to, they were going home instead of packing for a "visit."
However, after about 18 months of having clothes I bought migrating to their other parent's house, I asked them what was going on and they said their other parent only had one day's outfit for them and wouldn't buy more. So for a number of years after that, I bought them about a week's worth of clothes to bring to the other parent's house and keep there, even though I'm the lower-earning parent. It was painful for the kids once they got old enough to understand the whole picture. They have chosen to no longer spend overnights with the other parent.
posted by KneeHiSocks at 7:05 AM on October 18, 2022 [14 favorites]
However, after about 18 months of having clothes I bought migrating to their other parent's house, I asked them what was going on and they said their other parent only had one day's outfit for them and wouldn't buy more. So for a number of years after that, I bought them about a week's worth of clothes to bring to the other parent's house and keep there, even though I'm the lower-earning parent. It was painful for the kids once they got old enough to understand the whole picture. They have chosen to no longer spend overnights with the other parent.
posted by KneeHiSocks at 7:05 AM on October 18, 2022 [14 favorites]
I do find obstinance in your stance, possibly because they are “demanding” this ---something which would probably make me feel at least some resistance. But this can be an opportunity for you and your kids to work out a solution together.
Yes, buying clothes when they have an overloaded closet at their other home is annoying, but many adults, and their kids have way more clothes than they need. Since you don't have the rapport with their mom to divide stuff or whatever, this is where you are. It is not the kids' fault you two cannot work with each other.....
Also, if you are a male dad, I think it is worth mentioning a boy wardrobe can be simpler and more minimal than a girl wardrobe, and what seems ridiculous (why do you need seven different sweatshirts???), could be more about style, personal expression, etc.. So what seems reasonable to you (for example you might only have a pair of dress shoes, a pair of work shoes, a pair of sneakers or some variation of that) may not be applicable to the world of your youngsters.
I do think your annoyance with the ex is permeating this. But if you had to live in two places, wouldn’t you want the convenience and ease of not having to worry about schlepping clothes? I’m sure there will still be a good amount of stuff being hauled back and forth no matter what, but your home should be their home, no?
good luck.
posted by rhonzo at 7:34 AM on October 18, 2022 [7 favorites]
Yes, buying clothes when they have an overloaded closet at their other home is annoying, but many adults, and their kids have way more clothes than they need. Since you don't have the rapport with their mom to divide stuff or whatever, this is where you are. It is not the kids' fault you two cannot work with each other.....
Also, if you are a male dad, I think it is worth mentioning a boy wardrobe can be simpler and more minimal than a girl wardrobe, and what seems ridiculous (why do you need seven different sweatshirts???), could be more about style, personal expression, etc.. So what seems reasonable to you (for example you might only have a pair of dress shoes, a pair of work shoes, a pair of sneakers or some variation of that) may not be applicable to the world of your youngsters.
I do think your annoyance with the ex is permeating this. But if you had to live in two places, wouldn’t you want the convenience and ease of not having to worry about schlepping clothes? I’m sure there will still be a good amount of stuff being hauled back and forth no matter what, but your home should be their home, no?
good luck.
posted by rhonzo at 7:34 AM on October 18, 2022 [7 favorites]
Buying two entire wardrobes seems wasteful to me
Also maybe an opportunity to educate on the enormous ethical and environmental costs of a lot of the clothing pushed at them.
These stayed on my mind.
OP, I wanted to gently add that while I agree with these goals...pushing this at the children of divorced parents is kind of pushing social responsibility down to the lowest people on the totem pole - kids whose schedules and choices are not fully yet their own, who aren't making their own money, etc. I get your goal of "wastefulness" but it seems like this might not be the exact time and way to address it.
As a child my mother made me wear "perfectly good" hand-me-downs and I was bullied and isolated. Probably not just because of the clothes but they didn't help. She set unrealistically limited budgets and wouldn't buy things. I had to go babysit to afford gloves, for example. Meanwhile she had perfectly good, even luxurious, clothes. It took me years to get over it and start to feel good about myself. As a woman particularly, this seriously impacted me, especially when I was in women's magazines. And that was not having to deal with the 'feels like a hotel' thing.
With my kids, I've always encouraged mindfulness and awareness of manufacturing and thrift shops and those things - but modelled it more than insisted on it. Shopping together, talking things through, but giving choice seems to have served us well.
As my oldest has entered his teen years I've let him go ahead and make his mistakes (or not). He's got a few things I certainly wouldn't have bought, which was the point of giving him his own money (plus he's earned some) but overall he's made really good, durable, sensible choices. If he hadn't though, good, better to learn that before you have a credit card in your name.
Anyways again that doesn't address the divorced aspects but I think it does speak to your relationship with your kids and the impact you want to have on them (which doesn't have to be in line with mine of course, just sharing.)
posted by warriorqueen at 7:50 AM on October 18, 2022 [20 favorites]
Also maybe an opportunity to educate on the enormous ethical and environmental costs of a lot of the clothing pushed at them.
These stayed on my mind.
OP, I wanted to gently add that while I agree with these goals...pushing this at the children of divorced parents is kind of pushing social responsibility down to the lowest people on the totem pole - kids whose schedules and choices are not fully yet their own, who aren't making their own money, etc. I get your goal of "wastefulness" but it seems like this might not be the exact time and way to address it.
As a child my mother made me wear "perfectly good" hand-me-downs and I was bullied and isolated. Probably not just because of the clothes but they didn't help. She set unrealistically limited budgets and wouldn't buy things. I had to go babysit to afford gloves, for example. Meanwhile she had perfectly good, even luxurious, clothes. It took me years to get over it and start to feel good about myself. As a woman particularly, this seriously impacted me, especially when I was in women's magazines. And that was not having to deal with the 'feels like a hotel' thing.
With my kids, I've always encouraged mindfulness and awareness of manufacturing and thrift shops and those things - but modelled it more than insisted on it. Shopping together, talking things through, but giving choice seems to have served us well.
As my oldest has entered his teen years I've let him go ahead and make his mistakes (or not). He's got a few things I certainly wouldn't have bought, which was the point of giving him his own money (plus he's earned some) but overall he's made really good, durable, sensible choices. If he hadn't though, good, better to learn that before you have a credit card in your name.
Anyways again that doesn't address the divorced aspects but I think it does speak to your relationship with your kids and the impact you want to have on them (which doesn't have to be in line with mine of course, just sharing.)
posted by warriorqueen at 7:50 AM on October 18, 2022 [20 favorites]
I'm sharing my perspective as an adult woman who splits her time across two households (rather than as a parent of children in the same position) by choice but also by obligation. Packing is the pits, truly. It was adding enough stress in my life that I got fed up and purchased not quite a full second wardrobe but enough that I always had a few full outfits in each place and could then choose to shuttle some additional clothes as I might like. I specifically chose to purchase things I liked secondhand from Poshmark because I wanted items that I felt good in without creating an excuse to splash out at full retail prices.
Here's what I've learned from experience. Life in 2022 is stressful enough as it is for a full-fledged adult with full autonomy and an established sense of self. Being a girl is hard. Being a pre-/early teen girl is hard. Packing up your life on a regular basis is like being punished for not having a full-time home which sounds like is very much not in your daughters' control. So many things are outside of our control, that when something is within my control (and doesn't break the bank) I will do what I can to reduce stressors and increase comfort for myself and my loved ones.
This is even more true if your daughters are marginalized (in ways beyond a girl already is relative to a boy) or otherwise are neurodivergent. Picking, planning, and packing outfits requires organization and executive function on top of managing all the other needs and responsibilities on their plate.
Packing is also not a trivial task, it carries consequences. Weather turned cold but you forgot to pack your sweater? Packed a suitable outfit but lack the appropriate footwear so the outfit is either inappropriate or otherwise highly awkward? Sure, these aren't end-of-world scenarios here, but they are stressful. A situation needn't be earth-shattering to be worth mitigating.
Clothing is also important. I'm a WOC who works in a male-dominated industry. When work was particularly toxic, clothing was not just a fun hobby, it was also a comfort and the armor I wore to get through a hard day. My clothing sent a message when I was often steamrolled and silenced. I sincerely hope none of this is happening to your daughters. Rather, I say this to share perspective and increase empathy that having appropriate outfits has value and the mental work required to make sure access to appropriate outfits is meaningful, especially when you're otherwise marginalized.
My point is, having access to clothing is part of what makes home, home - which is what I expect you want for your daughters. Sure, you don't need to indulge their every fashion want and whim, but anything you do to lessen their burden in packing up their lives to see you will be appreciated Just as you wouldn't ask them to lug around their beds back and forth, making sure they have enough clothes to keep dressed and comfortable is a solid thing to do for your daughters.
In case you are feeling financially manipulated or taken advantage of by your daughters or their mom, I
I hope the above can be as an alternative perspective for you to consider.
Tl;dr: it is reasonable to always have clothes at the places you call home without having to bring them all with you each time.
posted by Goblin Barbarian at 7:51 AM on October 18, 2022 [43 favorites]
Here's what I've learned from experience. Life in 2022 is stressful enough as it is for a full-fledged adult with full autonomy and an established sense of self. Being a girl is hard. Being a pre-/early teen girl is hard. Packing up your life on a regular basis is like being punished for not having a full-time home which sounds like is very much not in your daughters' control. So many things are outside of our control, that when something is within my control (and doesn't break the bank) I will do what I can to reduce stressors and increase comfort for myself and my loved ones.
This is even more true if your daughters are marginalized (in ways beyond a girl already is relative to a boy) or otherwise are neurodivergent. Picking, planning, and packing outfits requires organization and executive function on top of managing all the other needs and responsibilities on their plate.
Packing is also not a trivial task, it carries consequences. Weather turned cold but you forgot to pack your sweater? Packed a suitable outfit but lack the appropriate footwear so the outfit is either inappropriate or otherwise highly awkward? Sure, these aren't end-of-world scenarios here, but they are stressful. A situation needn't be earth-shattering to be worth mitigating.
Clothing is also important. I'm a WOC who works in a male-dominated industry. When work was particularly toxic, clothing was not just a fun hobby, it was also a comfort and the armor I wore to get through a hard day. My clothing sent a message when I was often steamrolled and silenced. I sincerely hope none of this is happening to your daughters. Rather, I say this to share perspective and increase empathy that having appropriate outfits has value and the mental work required to make sure access to appropriate outfits is meaningful, especially when you're otherwise marginalized.
My point is, having access to clothing is part of what makes home, home - which is what I expect you want for your daughters. Sure, you don't need to indulge their every fashion want and whim, but anything you do to lessen their burden in packing up their lives to see you will be appreciated Just as you wouldn't ask them to lug around their beds back and forth, making sure they have enough clothes to keep dressed and comfortable is a solid thing to do for your daughters.
In case you are feeling financially manipulated or taken advantage of by your daughters or their mom, I
I hope the above can be as an alternative perspective for you to consider.
Tl;dr: it is reasonable to always have clothes at the places you call home without having to bring them all with you each time.
posted by Goblin Barbarian at 7:51 AM on October 18, 2022 [43 favorites]
When I was a single parent, I bought all the clothes, so thanks for pulling your weight.
It makes sense for the kids to have a wardrobe distributed across 2 homes, to wear clothes from your house back to the other house, and vice versa. They're old enough, esp. 13, but also 10, to manage outfits across 2 homes without having 2 full wardrobes. Most girls that age have a lot of clothing. Talk about the environmental waste, which is staggering, the injustice to poor countries whose textile industries have been wrecked. About the wasted money of buying 2 wardrobes. The one area for making sure there's duplication is underwear and socks.
This is a chance for you and their other parent to display teamwork in solving a manageable problem, it's a teachable moment. Kids do need to have the right clothes, to fit in, up to a point. The other parent doesn't need to be in charge of this; it's emotional labor/ default parent work. Take them shopping. Be silly and have fun with it. Tell other parent you'll take on this task for a bit. Consult with other parent about what clothes are where, and the 2 of you do some of the work of redistribution.
posted by theora55 at 8:59 AM on October 18, 2022
It makes sense for the kids to have a wardrobe distributed across 2 homes, to wear clothes from your house back to the other house, and vice versa. They're old enough, esp. 13, but also 10, to manage outfits across 2 homes without having 2 full wardrobes. Most girls that age have a lot of clothing. Talk about the environmental waste, which is staggering, the injustice to poor countries whose textile industries have been wrecked. About the wasted money of buying 2 wardrobes. The one area for making sure there's duplication is underwear and socks.
This is a chance for you and their other parent to display teamwork in solving a manageable problem, it's a teachable moment. Kids do need to have the right clothes, to fit in, up to a point. The other parent doesn't need to be in charge of this; it's emotional labor/ default parent work. Take them shopping. Be silly and have fun with it. Tell other parent you'll take on this task for a bit. Consult with other parent about what clothes are where, and the 2 of you do some of the work of redistribution.
posted by theora55 at 8:59 AM on October 18, 2022
demanding (echoing their mom)
some version of "you don't buy them/us anything,"
I suspect things would eventually migrate to mom's
I feel like this is an argument you want to have with their mother. Please don't let your irritation etc with your ex pollute your relationship with your daughters.
they're starting to not want to pack bags at all
They're children and your home is their home... especially now that you say yourself that it's more of a 50/50 split. Not wanting to pack an overnight bag every time they stay with you in their other home is perfectly reasonable and I would argue is actually their right.
As an example of how else this can look: When I was growing up, my parents lived 30 minutes away from each other and they shared custody of me and siblings on a weekday/weekend split. I had clothes and possessions at either place. My parents didn't really care/keep track of where things were, or whether clothes Mom bought stayed at Mom's place or clothes that Dad bought stayed at Dad's place. It was up to me to make sure that I brought along what I wanted to wear the next day, but I always had enough to wear, wherever I was, which meant I could stay wherever I wanted without needing to plan ahead to extensively.
posted by unicorn chaser at 9:29 AM on October 18, 2022 [12 favorites]
some version of "you don't buy them/us anything,"
I suspect things would eventually migrate to mom's
I feel like this is an argument you want to have with their mother. Please don't let your irritation etc with your ex pollute your relationship with your daughters.
they're starting to not want to pack bags at all
They're children and your home is their home... especially now that you say yourself that it's more of a 50/50 split. Not wanting to pack an overnight bag every time they stay with you in their other home is perfectly reasonable and I would argue is actually their right.
As an example of how else this can look: When I was growing up, my parents lived 30 minutes away from each other and they shared custody of me and siblings on a weekday/weekend split. I had clothes and possessions at either place. My parents didn't really care/keep track of where things were, or whether clothes Mom bought stayed at Mom's place or clothes that Dad bought stayed at Dad's place. It was up to me to make sure that I brought along what I wanted to wear the next day, but I always had enough to wear, wherever I was, which meant I could stay wherever I wanted without needing to plan ahead to extensively.
posted by unicorn chaser at 9:29 AM on October 18, 2022 [12 favorites]
They shouldn’t have to pack a bag beyond school work. I am willing to bet there would be less/no migration if they weren’t having their real wardrobe at mom’s place. If there’s no overnight bag then it is also less likely for clothes to move only one direction. Get the kids clothes and stop projecting your issues with their mom onto them. You are better than that and you love your kids and want them to be happy.
posted by Bottlecap at 9:38 AM on October 18, 2022 [8 favorites]
posted by Bottlecap at 9:38 AM on October 18, 2022 [8 favorites]
And even if I did get more, I suspect things would eventually migrate to mom's, which is what happens with the almost all the clothes I do get them already.
If this starts to happen, can you just ask them to bring a big bag of clothes with them at the next switch? It doesn’t seem realistic for them to have totally separate sets of clothing for each house, but it seems very reasonable for them to have enough clothing that they can keep sufficient options at both houses. If there are a few more expensive items (like a winter coat or winter boots), it might make sense for those to go back and forth - but they shouldn’t need to pack underwear, socks, pajamas, t-shirts, leggings, etc.
posted by maleficent at 9:42 AM on October 18, 2022 [1 favorite]
If this starts to happen, can you just ask them to bring a big bag of clothes with them at the next switch? It doesn’t seem realistic for them to have totally separate sets of clothing for each house, but it seems very reasonable for them to have enough clothing that they can keep sufficient options at both houses. If there are a few more expensive items (like a winter coat or winter boots), it might make sense for those to go back and forth - but they shouldn’t need to pack underwear, socks, pajamas, t-shirts, leggings, etc.
posted by maleficent at 9:42 AM on October 18, 2022 [1 favorite]
Hi, I was your daughters (I'm AFAB nonbinary and have a sister). My parents separated when I was 8 (divorce took several years because they fought each other on everything) and clothing was a constant issue. My mom was poor and my dad was rich, but he regularly refused to buy us clothes to keep at his house. My parents could not engage in any meaningful conversation so this is just how things were. My mom had primary custody, so my clothing was all at her house. I saw my dad on Wednesday nights and weekends, so I had to pack clothes in my backpack on Wednesday to wear on Thursday and then take my dirty clothes in my backpack on Thursday to school.
What I remember most is the sheer embarrassment of going into my backpack on Thursdays and having to pull dirty underwear out to get to books and folders. If I forgot to pack clothes or was just in a hurry, I had to wear whatever was lying around my dad's house, which was usually the wrong size.
Please please please just do whatever works best for your daughters as long as you can afford it. I'm 36 now and thinking about this clothing issue still makes me frustrated and upset.
posted by anotheraccount at 9:47 AM on October 18, 2022 [42 favorites]
What I remember most is the sheer embarrassment of going into my backpack on Thursdays and having to pull dirty underwear out to get to books and folders. If I forgot to pack clothes or was just in a hurry, I had to wear whatever was lying around my dad's house, which was usually the wrong size.
Please please please just do whatever works best for your daughters as long as you can afford it. I'm 36 now and thinking about this clothing issue still makes me frustrated and upset.
posted by anotheraccount at 9:47 AM on October 18, 2022 [42 favorites]
My kid (an older teen) just asked to switched his parenting schedule from 50/50 to be with me more, and I think he was partly motivated by a desire to stop schlepping his stuff back and forth. (He hadn't asked for two sets of clothes, though.) I'm sharing this in part to emphasize that yes, it is a pain for kids to do this. My kid now keeps some clothes at his other parent's house and doesn't take much of anything back and forth, except for a few things he keeps in his backpack.
What your kids are asking for is totally reasonable.
So listen, what happens if you just knock off the grumpy, disgruntled, divorced dad shtick? What happens if you decide to love your kids positively, listen to them with an open mind, believe them when they talk about the frustrations and hassles in their lives? What happens if you stop projecting your anger and frustration with your ex onto them?
I've been around guys who talk like that about their ex-wives and it's exhausting to hear, so it must be exhausting to live it. Surely it's exhausting for the kids. Can you let go of any of that resentment?
Your kids are 10 and 13. You have 7ish years with the younger and 4ish with the older when they get to decide how much they want to be around you. I know it seems exhausting and eternal when you are in the middle of it, but our time with our kids at home is very limited, a small portion of our own lives. You have half a decade to be happy and joyful with your kids and love them to pieces before they can walk away and never look back.
Do you really want to spend that time talking about how buying a few more pieces of clothes are wasteful and how they are talking like their mother?
posted by bluedaisy at 12:00 PM on October 18, 2022 [20 favorites]
What your kids are asking for is totally reasonable.
So listen, what happens if you just knock off the grumpy, disgruntled, divorced dad shtick? What happens if you decide to love your kids positively, listen to them with an open mind, believe them when they talk about the frustrations and hassles in their lives? What happens if you stop projecting your anger and frustration with your ex onto them?
I've been around guys who talk like that about their ex-wives and it's exhausting to hear, so it must be exhausting to live it. Surely it's exhausting for the kids. Can you let go of any of that resentment?
Your kids are 10 and 13. You have 7ish years with the younger and 4ish with the older when they get to decide how much they want to be around you. I know it seems exhausting and eternal when you are in the middle of it, but our time with our kids at home is very limited, a small portion of our own lives. You have half a decade to be happy and joyful with your kids and love them to pieces before they can walk away and never look back.
Do you really want to spend that time talking about how buying a few more pieces of clothes are wasteful and how they are talking like their mother?
posted by bluedaisy at 12:00 PM on October 18, 2022 [20 favorites]
Clothes migration is definitely a thing. My ex took almost all the kids clothes (including all gifts from her side of the family, which were “hers”) and always sends them back in the scruffiest junk they have. It’s natural that if you buy them something nice they’ll want to wear it, and thus the nice things you buy are always migrating back and never return because the worst worn-out clothes always return. So the kids never have anything they want to wear at your house.
The only solution I found was to help the kids plan by having a special place they could change out of “arrival” clothes, and then change back into those immediately before leaving. At least that way there’s predictability and you can have fun helping them develop a wardrobe at your place.
posted by tillsbury at 1:28 PM on October 18, 2022 [1 favorite]
The only solution I found was to help the kids plan by having a special place they could change out of “arrival” clothes, and then change back into those immediately before leaving. At least that way there’s predictability and you can have fun helping them develop a wardrobe at your place.
posted by tillsbury at 1:28 PM on October 18, 2022 [1 favorite]
I think you should listen to your daughters and take them shopping. Old Navy and Target are great and not too expensive. Before the shopping excursion have them make a list of what they want to have on hand at your house. Then go out and fulfill the list. Make sure to stock haircare, face wash, menstrual products, contact lens solution, etc. I'm frugal by nature and dislike waste, but when my kids need something, I get it.
Do not count the clothes or insist that the new items stay only at your house, allow for a natural ebb and flow of items back and forth. I am 40 years old and I still remember my stepmother going through my packed bag when I was ten years old and yelling that if I took my cute new outfits to my mom's house they would be ruined like everything else was, I could cry thinking about it even now. Don't do that to your kids.
posted by bonheur at 1:29 PM on October 18, 2022 [14 favorites]
Do not count the clothes or insist that the new items stay only at your house, allow for a natural ebb and flow of items back and forth. I am 40 years old and I still remember my stepmother going through my packed bag when I was ten years old and yelling that if I took my cute new outfits to my mom's house they would be ruined like everything else was, I could cry thinking about it even now. Don't do that to your kids.
posted by bonheur at 1:29 PM on October 18, 2022 [14 favorites]
As someone who's in a similar situation, what's a reasonable budget for clothes for girls that age? (Per season/semester/summer/year etc)
posted by gottabefunky at 1:41 PM on October 18, 2022
posted by gottabefunky at 1:41 PM on October 18, 2022
@gottabefunky Around $200 seems reasonable. It depends if they need new winter coats, boots, that type of thing. Look at Old Navy, they have a lot of sales. I buy clothes for my daughters a size up so they fit for a while.
posted by bonheur at 1:52 PM on October 18, 2022
posted by bonheur at 1:52 PM on October 18, 2022
As someone who shares custody of a kiddo 50%, I agree there is a weird ebb and flow of clothing- for some reason for a while we never seemed to end up with socks at my house, and some favorite outfits I got her would go missing at the other parent's house. I agree with everyone to say not to make it a point of contention with the kids and as much as possible with the co-parent (though I know when you are on rocky terms even things like where the socks are can get heated). Still, now, we just occasionally right imbalances and I ask for specific outfits or take 5 mins to look through her drawers to find things that have not returned to me. Things like the gym uniform invariably is at the wrong house every so often and requires someone to ferry it between houses (we only live a mile apart), but otherwise, we do not duplicate items between houses.
posted by rene_billingsworth at 1:59 PM on October 18, 2022 [1 favorite]
posted by rene_billingsworth at 1:59 PM on October 18, 2022 [1 favorite]
I guess maybe I'm an outlier, but I lived 50% with each parent and packed a bag every time I went to my Dad's and it never once made me feel like his house wasn't my house. If I wasn't allowed to store things there, I definitely could see having those kinds of feelings. However, my parents kept any negative feelings about each away from me for the most part and I do think that was really important. You can only control what you do and say of course, but it would be a great example for them even if they don't recognize it in the moment.
I think giving your girls some ownership of the situation along with a budget for clothes to help them figure out what they want to do is a good idea if you can afford it, but I think there are way more important things you can do to make them feel secure.
posted by Eyelash at 3:24 PM on October 18, 2022
I think giving your girls some ownership of the situation along with a budget for clothes to help them figure out what they want to do is a good idea if you can afford it, but I think there are way more important things you can do to make them feel secure.
posted by Eyelash at 3:24 PM on October 18, 2022
I just want to answer with my experience.
When my parents split, my dad (who'd been working all along) was able to hire a much better lawyer than my mother (who'd taken some years out to stay at home raising us).
This meant my dad was able to arrange matters thus:
- My dad would pay for my childcare costs (which were nil as I was old enough to stay home alone) and my mom would pay for my brother's (which were substantial)
- My dad would pay our medical and dental expenses (which were nearly nil as he was retired military)
- My dad would pay for my brother's clothes (younger boy, less, as others are saying in here) and my mom would pay for my clothes (I was an adolescent who loved clothes growing up in an affluent community where they were a significant marker)
My freshman year of high school, I decided to conscientiously make the most of the clothes that I had. I have ADD, so managing my clothes and making sure everything that coordinated was in the right place and clean and ironed was an undertaking. One afternoon after school, I made a list of all of my clothes, so I could make as many outfits as I could for as long as I could. I was switching twice a week between houses.
I left the list on my dresser.
A couple weeks later, on a day I went back to my mom's house, she asked me about the list I'd made. I had no idea how she could have known about it.
My dad had seen it on my dresser. My parents were about to have a child support hearing.
My dad took the list, brought it to the hearing, and used my conscientious effort to make the best of what my mom could buy to argue that my mom should not get more child support.
He succeeded.
I was distraught that I had unintentionally hurt my mother's interests so deeply, and I was devastated by what I felt like was an utter betrayal by my father.
I have never forgotten and never really forgiven that hurt.
Don't do things that are going to make your daughters feel emotions like that.
posted by jocelmeow at 7:15 AM on October 19, 2022 [22 favorites]
When my parents split, my dad (who'd been working all along) was able to hire a much better lawyer than my mother (who'd taken some years out to stay at home raising us).
This meant my dad was able to arrange matters thus:
- My dad would pay for my childcare costs (which were nil as I was old enough to stay home alone) and my mom would pay for my brother's (which were substantial)
- My dad would pay our medical and dental expenses (which were nearly nil as he was retired military)
- My dad would pay for my brother's clothes (younger boy, less, as others are saying in here) and my mom would pay for my clothes (I was an adolescent who loved clothes growing up in an affluent community where they were a significant marker)
My freshman year of high school, I decided to conscientiously make the most of the clothes that I had. I have ADD, so managing my clothes and making sure everything that coordinated was in the right place and clean and ironed was an undertaking. One afternoon after school, I made a list of all of my clothes, so I could make as many outfits as I could for as long as I could. I was switching twice a week between houses.
I left the list on my dresser.
A couple weeks later, on a day I went back to my mom's house, she asked me about the list I'd made. I had no idea how she could have known about it.
My dad had seen it on my dresser. My parents were about to have a child support hearing.
My dad took the list, brought it to the hearing, and used my conscientious effort to make the best of what my mom could buy to argue that my mom should not get more child support.
He succeeded.
I was distraught that I had unintentionally hurt my mother's interests so deeply, and I was devastated by what I felt like was an utter betrayal by my father.
I have never forgotten and never really forgiven that hurt.
Don't do things that are going to make your daughters feel emotions like that.
posted by jocelmeow at 7:15 AM on October 19, 2022 [22 favorites]
The only solution I found was to help the kids plan by having a special place they could change out of “arrival” clothes, and then change back into those immediately before leaving. At least that way there’s predictability and you can have fun helping them develop a wardrobe at your place.
This sounds deeply unpleasant to me, as someone who was in your children's situation--it adds an additional layer of disruption to a routine that's already difficult and complicated, and reminds you every time you switch houses that your parents are being weird about your possessions. Also, if you're just there for one night, do you wear yesterday's dirty clothes to school the next day?
When you are a child of divorce with parents who split custody evenly, you do need more clothes than other children your age, but this doesn't necessarily need to amount to two full wardrobes. At least for me, things definitely moved between houses, and this wasn't a big deal, since they belonged to me, not either parent. The key is making sure there are always several days' worth of reasonable outfits at each parent's house. I would aim to make this as seamless as possible for your children, as with all the logistics of joint custody. The easier (both logistically and interpersonally) it is for them to move between houses, the less likely they are to start wanting to stay with one parent all the time--and if they do start wanting that, I can guarantee it will be with the parent who makes it easier, not the one who is tallying up the socks.
posted by dizziest at 7:49 AM on October 19, 2022 [10 favorites]
This sounds deeply unpleasant to me, as someone who was in your children's situation--it adds an additional layer of disruption to a routine that's already difficult and complicated, and reminds you every time you switch houses that your parents are being weird about your possessions. Also, if you're just there for one night, do you wear yesterday's dirty clothes to school the next day?
When you are a child of divorce with parents who split custody evenly, you do need more clothes than other children your age, but this doesn't necessarily need to amount to two full wardrobes. At least for me, things definitely moved between houses, and this wasn't a big deal, since they belonged to me, not either parent. The key is making sure there are always several days' worth of reasonable outfits at each parent's house. I would aim to make this as seamless as possible for your children, as with all the logistics of joint custody. The easier (both logistically and interpersonally) it is for them to move between houses, the less likely they are to start wanting to stay with one parent all the time--and if they do start wanting that, I can guarantee it will be with the parent who makes it easier, not the one who is tallying up the socks.
posted by dizziest at 7:49 AM on October 19, 2022 [10 favorites]
Your kids should have at least enough clothes for all of the days they live with you and for all of the conditions and occasions they will encounter while living with you. If they live with you three days a week, and you do laundry every week, then they need at minimum three complete outfits for all weather conditions (three each of sweatshirts, short-sleeved shirts, dressier pants/skirts/tops outfits, jeans, casual shorts/skirts, cardigan sweaters, tank tops, etc) plus at least double that in undergarments like bras, socks, underwear, camisoles/slips, tights, etc. that are easily soiled/sweated through. This is the bare minimum, before even beginning to address all of the extremely good reasons for having more: style and self-expression, for one, but also covering for accidents and spills, especially as they get older. (If it hasn’t happened already, they will absolutely need to emergency replace some item of clothing while living with you because of a menstrual mishap. Not being able to replace clothes in that situation is legitimately traumatic.)
If purchasing that amount of clothing for your children seems excessive to you, I think you need to seriously examine why so you can address and dispense with those unwarranted feelings. It is wildly unreasonable to expect a child to live out of a duffel bag fully half of their life. And frankly, whether they have “enough” clothes at their other home is not at all relevant to whether they have enough clothes at this one. If their mother stocks what you consider to be a wasteful amount of food in her pantry, do you expect the girls to pack meals to bring with them when they live with you? No—because when they live with you, providing for their material needs is your responsibility.
As for the logistics of clothes “migrating” from your house, I confess I don’t fully understand them. If they wear clothes at your house, then take them off in the evening and toss them in your laundry hamper, and then you wash them and put them back in their closets so they are there for them when they return—how would migration happen? Are you not anticipating doing their laundry? Sure, whatever they are wearing when they leave you will go with them, but when they return they will be wearing some other outfit that will then go in your laundry and back to their closet with you. Some periodic seasonal reshuffling may need to happen, but given that the point is they don’t want to pack and lug their clothes around, I think your worry about clothes migrating is a manifestation of your resentment and not a legitimate concern.
posted by CtrlAltDelete at 10:26 AM on October 19, 2022 [10 favorites]
If purchasing that amount of clothing for your children seems excessive to you, I think you need to seriously examine why so you can address and dispense with those unwarranted feelings. It is wildly unreasonable to expect a child to live out of a duffel bag fully half of their life. And frankly, whether they have “enough” clothes at their other home is not at all relevant to whether they have enough clothes at this one. If their mother stocks what you consider to be a wasteful amount of food in her pantry, do you expect the girls to pack meals to bring with them when they live with you? No—because when they live with you, providing for their material needs is your responsibility.
As for the logistics of clothes “migrating” from your house, I confess I don’t fully understand them. If they wear clothes at your house, then take them off in the evening and toss them in your laundry hamper, and then you wash them and put them back in their closets so they are there for them when they return—how would migration happen? Are you not anticipating doing their laundry? Sure, whatever they are wearing when they leave you will go with them, but when they return they will be wearing some other outfit that will then go in your laundry and back to their closet with you. Some periodic seasonal reshuffling may need to happen, but given that the point is they don’t want to pack and lug their clothes around, I think your worry about clothes migrating is a manifestation of your resentment and not a legitimate concern.
posted by CtrlAltDelete at 10:26 AM on October 19, 2022 [10 favorites]
As a divorced person with kids and split custody I feel your pain. It's complicated, and expensive, and if not exactly wasteful it's at least KIND of wasteful to have full sets of clothes sitting unused for half of the time that they would fit. Items of clothing go over and never come back, and you will often feel like you are on the losing end of that deal (your co-parent likely feels the same way.) Also, if you have "school" clothes or uniforms it's can be that much worse, depending on the schedule. If the kids always arrive in street clothes and return in school clothes everything gets out of whack. It blows.
But as a child of divorce I can also say: any place you (and your co-parent) can find ways to be graceful, flexible, and low-heat in your dealings with the complicated practicalities of having split households will be a favor to your children, and, conversely, the times that that burden spills out into your life will/could negatively affect how they feel about it all. It's not worth it to give your children opportunity to feel like time with you is a burden on you. Even if there ARE practical burdens unrelated to how much you want them there. Get past it. It's just not worth it.
Also, I totally acknowledge that maybe the financial strain is great, and I don't have an answer for that (other than thrift and Old Navy, etc.) But if that isn't the issue, really, don't let there be an issue.
posted by dirtdirt at 8:27 AM on October 20, 2022 [1 favorite]
But as a child of divorce I can also say: any place you (and your co-parent) can find ways to be graceful, flexible, and low-heat in your dealings with the complicated practicalities of having split households will be a favor to your children, and, conversely, the times that that burden spills out into your life will/could negatively affect how they feel about it all. It's not worth it to give your children opportunity to feel like time with you is a burden on you. Even if there ARE practical burdens unrelated to how much you want them there. Get past it. It's just not worth it.
Also, I totally acknowledge that maybe the financial strain is great, and I don't have an answer for that (other than thrift and Old Navy, etc.) But if that isn't the issue, really, don't let there be an issue.
posted by dirtdirt at 8:27 AM on October 20, 2022 [1 favorite]
I resent the "wasteful" label being thrown at the daughters, on their behalf. They didn't ask for this situation. I presume you and your ex have two entire houses and two sets of household goods and two cars and so on; if you need a stockpot do you borrow it from your ex, or did you buy a replacement when you moved out? Yet the girls are the ones who are expected to have just one set of household items despite living in two houses.
Let them have their clothes.
posted by The corpse in the library at 9:56 AM on October 20, 2022 [13 favorites]
Let them have their clothes.
posted by The corpse in the library at 9:56 AM on October 20, 2022 [13 favorites]
Allow me to propose a thought experiment for you.
Imagine if you were gifted a free house, but on the condition that this is the house *your children* live in 100% the time, and their parents will take turns living at this house week by week. When the children are in your custody, you go to the kids' house and spend the week, doing everything you would normally do as a parent and as a caretaker of your children's home. Then you go back to your own house for a week when the co-parent takes over.
Just think for one moment about how exhausted you'd be. How rootless you'd feel. How chaotic your entire life would become.
In this situation, tell me, would you be forcing yourself to pack up your entire existence every week and moving from their home to yours and back again, over and over and over? Would you expect yourself to treat your children's house like a hotel that you must clear out of every single week?
Or would you perhaps find it more convenient to treat the children's house as "your home" also and thus keep a duplicate set of clothes, winter gear, household tools, and basic supplies at both your homes?
I am a parent with shared custody. The divorce was MY decision, therefore it's MY job to bend over backwards if necessary to make its consequences as painless as possible for my children. Every logistical issue is MY burden, and I need to suck it up - I am not allowed to shove any extra work onto the kids if I can help it.
The only things your kids should be hauling back and forth are things that are literally impossible to purchase duplicates of: school items, laptop/tablet/phone, security blanket, expensive personal items like musical instruments or custom-made retainers, and items with legal restrictions on duplicate purchase such as certain types of prescription meds.
Buy the duplicate set of clothes. Buy them a second set of device chargers that live at your place permanently to spare them the pain of "oops I forgot to pack my laptop charger". Buy them second bikes so you don't have to haul bikes back and forth every week in summer, buy extra pairs of snow boots and thick gloves to lighten their winter load, and obviously stock up on sneakers, sandals, flipflops, swimwear, goggles, water bottles, hats, lunch totes, socks, underwear, makeup etc. This is what you must do when you share custody.
posted by MiraK at 8:45 AM on October 21, 2022 [9 favorites]
Imagine if you were gifted a free house, but on the condition that this is the house *your children* live in 100% the time, and their parents will take turns living at this house week by week. When the children are in your custody, you go to the kids' house and spend the week, doing everything you would normally do as a parent and as a caretaker of your children's home. Then you go back to your own house for a week when the co-parent takes over.
Just think for one moment about how exhausted you'd be. How rootless you'd feel. How chaotic your entire life would become.
In this situation, tell me, would you be forcing yourself to pack up your entire existence every week and moving from their home to yours and back again, over and over and over? Would you expect yourself to treat your children's house like a hotel that you must clear out of every single week?
Or would you perhaps find it more convenient to treat the children's house as "your home" also and thus keep a duplicate set of clothes, winter gear, household tools, and basic supplies at both your homes?
I am a parent with shared custody. The divorce was MY decision, therefore it's MY job to bend over backwards if necessary to make its consequences as painless as possible for my children. Every logistical issue is MY burden, and I need to suck it up - I am not allowed to shove any extra work onto the kids if I can help it.
The only things your kids should be hauling back and forth are things that are literally impossible to purchase duplicates of: school items, laptop/tablet/phone, security blanket, expensive personal items like musical instruments or custom-made retainers, and items with legal restrictions on duplicate purchase such as certain types of prescription meds.
Buy the duplicate set of clothes. Buy them a second set of device chargers that live at your place permanently to spare them the pain of "oops I forgot to pack my laptop charger". Buy them second bikes so you don't have to haul bikes back and forth every week in summer, buy extra pairs of snow boots and thick gloves to lighten their winter load, and obviously stock up on sneakers, sandals, flipflops, swimwear, goggles, water bottles, hats, lunch totes, socks, underwear, makeup etc. This is what you must do when you share custody.
posted by MiraK at 8:45 AM on October 21, 2022 [9 favorites]
I suggest that you as the adult keep track of all their clothing and belongings when they leave your home. If their winter stuff ends up travelling back to their mom's, then the next week, when you're about to pick them up, send a text as you drive over, saying "hey don't forget to bring your red coat, your boots, gym shorts, a week's worth of underwear, that new face wash you like, three t-shirts, and your pajamas." Do you think that would be hard or annoying to track, even for an adult? Imagine how they feel.
Preteen and teen girls can be absolutely vicious about clothing. They notice the brands of the clothing, the age of the garment and how often it's being re-worn, wear and tear, flattering fit, suitability for the occasion, and any stains, and can be searingly cruel about it. Clothing is not a helpful place for parents to impose limits on adolescents, especially girls.
Scrape together a yearly clothing budget for your kids, probably at that age $500/year each is probably enough if you shop smart, and get a decent amount of clothing to stay at your home so the children would be properly clothed if you were their only parent.
Once a month or so, you can call their mom and coordinate sending a few items back and forth if needed, if duplicates travel or something. Or, just track the items yourself, and let them know when you're picking them up what they might have forgotten. That's an adult job.
posted by nouvelle-personne at 9:54 AM on October 25, 2022
Preteen and teen girls can be absolutely vicious about clothing. They notice the brands of the clothing, the age of the garment and how often it's being re-worn, wear and tear, flattering fit, suitability for the occasion, and any stains, and can be searingly cruel about it. Clothing is not a helpful place for parents to impose limits on adolescents, especially girls.
Scrape together a yearly clothing budget for your kids, probably at that age $500/year each is probably enough if you shop smart, and get a decent amount of clothing to stay at your home so the children would be properly clothed if you were their only parent.
Once a month or so, you can call their mom and coordinate sending a few items back and forth if needed, if duplicates travel or something. Or, just track the items yourself, and let them know when you're picking them up what they might have forgotten. That's an adult job.
posted by nouvelle-personne at 9:54 AM on October 25, 2022
Maybe this point has already been made, but if they have enough clothes at your place to not have to pack a bag, they will arrive in a set of clothes and leave in a set of clothes, so there shouldn't be much if any migration of the AMOUNT of clothes at each house (and since the clothes are theirs, it shouldn't matter which house they are at). I have 50/50 custody of my son and once he had enough clothes at both places, this was completely a non-issue, he doesn't pack a bag, I do laundry when he's not around so when he arrives he has a fully stocked dresser of clean clothes, he may arrive or leave in clothes bought by either parent but who cares, no problem.
posted by rabbitrabbit at 11:27 AM on October 26, 2022 [2 favorites]
posted by rabbitrabbit at 11:27 AM on October 26, 2022 [2 favorites]
This thread is closed to new comments.
My 10 year old who is fashion obsessed has a monthly budget for new clothes that she can accumulate for more expensive items. I buy underwear, socks and school clothes including bags and shoes. She has become a fairly careful shopper and loves thrift stores and swapping with friends as a result. She also has WAY more clothes than I could imagine needing but this is her thing.
If she leaves a favourite thing at her dad's, she has to wait for the next visit to get it, tough luck. I do not buy replacements except for necessary sports things - we both have multiple swimsuits for example.
You are projecting their mom and your relationship with her on to what sound like totally normal behaviours for kids that age. Clothes matter a lot to most people. One son and I have the same "wear 3 outfits in rotation until they are rags" but everyone else in my family goes from occasional shopping to "for fun, I window shop and make pinterest fashion boards" intensity.
Be the dad who supports their interest and enthusiasm in clothes, and who also has clear boundaries - if you forgot it at your mom's, we're not getting a duplicate, and this is your monthly/quarterly budget, have fun.
posted by dorothyisunderwood at 3:57 AM on October 18, 2022 [64 favorites]