Will a plastic organizer destroy electronic parts through ESD?
June 7, 2022 4:36 PM Subscribe
I have a lot of electronic components like transistors, voltage regulators, 555 timers, op amps, etc. Currently, I keep them in millions of carefully-labelled ESD-safe bags. This method is driving me insane. I'd like to move them to a plastic organizer like one of those drawer things or a flat box with dividers. However, I'm concerned they'll be destroyed by ESD.
On the electronics forums there are thousands of posts saying "ESD IS REAL" with accompanying horror stories.
Trust me, I'm NOT an ESD denier.
However, it's also pretty clear the forum guys are super into scolding.
So, idk can I just put this stuff in a regular small parts organizer and move on?
On the electronics forums there are thousands of posts saying "ESD IS REAL" with accompanying horror stories.
Trust me, I'm NOT an ESD denier.
However, it's also pretty clear the forum guys are super into scolding.
So, idk can I just put this stuff in a regular small parts organizer and move on?
This is a really good question.
I use plastic bead boxes, because the kind with the moving dividers lets stuff slide underneath them and mixes my n channels with my p channels and my red diodes with my blue diodes.
I have done this always, so I don't have any hard data to compare. But I haven't noticed an inordinate number of dud components. There are always a few, especially with mosfets which are extra sensitive, but I personally suspect it has more to do with the fabric blends I might be wearing and an inconsistent habit of grounding myself.
It is possible that I'd see some improvement if I were stricter about things like this, but in my little world dud components haven't been a noticeable problem.
I have permanently banned plastic lawn chairs from the shop though, because you can just FEEL the electric field radiating off them.
Now, having said that: If I've got something expensive, like 16 dollar MEMS real time clocks, I'm likely to treat them with special care, because I can't even order those right now.
On preview: RustyBrooks helpfully indicated what sizes he was talking about so I'll do the same: some DIP stuff but mostly SOT-23 & 0805.
posted by Horkus at 5:02 PM on June 7, 2022 [2 favorites]
I use plastic bead boxes, because the kind with the moving dividers lets stuff slide underneath them and mixes my n channels with my p channels and my red diodes with my blue diodes.
I have done this always, so I don't have any hard data to compare. But I haven't noticed an inordinate number of dud components. There are always a few, especially with mosfets which are extra sensitive, but I personally suspect it has more to do with the fabric blends I might be wearing and an inconsistent habit of grounding myself.
It is possible that I'd see some improvement if I were stricter about things like this, but in my little world dud components haven't been a noticeable problem.
I have permanently banned plastic lawn chairs from the shop though, because you can just FEEL the electric field radiating off them.
Now, having said that: If I've got something expensive, like 16 dollar MEMS real time clocks, I'm likely to treat them with special care, because I can't even order those right now.
On preview: RustyBrooks helpfully indicated what sizes he was talking about so I'll do the same: some DIP stuff but mostly SOT-23 & 0805.
posted by Horkus at 5:02 PM on June 7, 2022 [2 favorites]
Different parts have different levels of ESD sensitivity. I'd say (ESD sensitivity) * cost / (timely availability) = give-a-shit level.
But what's the ambient humidity in your lab? In Northern New Mexico (small single digit RH%), I killed plenty of stuff with static despite reasonable precautions. In Houston (50-90+%) I've not murdered a single component that way even when explicitly trying to do so to prove a pedagogical point.
posted by sourcequench at 5:34 PM on June 7, 2022 [2 favorites]
But what's the ambient humidity in your lab? In Northern New Mexico (small single digit RH%), I killed plenty of stuff with static despite reasonable precautions. In Houston (50-90+%) I've not murdered a single component that way even when explicitly trying to do so to prove a pedagogical point.
posted by sourcequench at 5:34 PM on June 7, 2022 [2 favorites]
Response by poster: It's all through-hole packages — DIP, TO-92, TO-220, TO-226. No SMD components.
I'm in the northeast. It's pretty humid.
posted by trevor_case at 5:38 PM on June 7, 2022
I'm in the northeast. It's pretty humid.
posted by trevor_case at 5:38 PM on June 7, 2022
Humidity is a good point - I'm in a place with a floor of ~40% myself which is maybe why I scoff at ESD puritans and haven't suffered from it yet.
posted by RustyBrooks at 5:51 PM on June 7, 2022 [1 favorite]
posted by RustyBrooks at 5:51 PM on June 7, 2022 [1 favorite]
I mean, when I bought a bunch of DIP stuff recently from mouser they came in a plastic sleeve/tube. And they're fine.
These are anti-static plastic tubes
I tinker with a bunch of microcontrollers (mostly ESP32), and a few support chips (ADCs, port expanders, solid state relays, battery charging circuits, and voltage isolators) and have gotten fully lax about ESD. I do keep my ICs in tubes, because that's convenient, but I have a ton of modules rattling around in plastic tackleboxes or cheap plastic Daiso containers. I haven't had any issues at all.
But I'm in the Bay Area where it's usually at least moderately humid. I'm sure it also depends a lot on what components we're talking about; obviously some are more robust than others. I am sure Mouser ships basically everything in antistatic packaging just because they standardize on that, and so nobody can blame them if something doesn't work, not because you're going to fry a 1/2W resistor with a static shock. I've received potentiometer knobs that came in antistatic bags.
posted by aubilenon at 6:02 PM on June 7, 2022 [1 favorite]
These are anti-static plastic tubes
I tinker with a bunch of microcontrollers (mostly ESP32), and a few support chips (ADCs, port expanders, solid state relays, battery charging circuits, and voltage isolators) and have gotten fully lax about ESD. I do keep my ICs in tubes, because that's convenient, but I have a ton of modules rattling around in plastic tackleboxes or cheap plastic Daiso containers. I haven't had any issues at all.
But I'm in the Bay Area where it's usually at least moderately humid. I'm sure it also depends a lot on what components we're talking about; obviously some are more robust than others. I am sure Mouser ships basically everything in antistatic packaging just because they standardize on that, and so nobody can blame them if something doesn't work, not because you're going to fry a 1/2W resistor with a static shock. I've received potentiometer knobs that came in antistatic bags.
posted by aubilenon at 6:02 PM on June 7, 2022 [1 favorite]
I grew up in dry and high parts of Colorado and must have gotten static shocks ~100 times a year. It became almost a form of recreation.
I have now spent about twice as long in Seattle, and cannot recall a single instance of getting a static shock.
posted by jamjam at 6:55 PM on June 7, 2022
I have now spent about twice as long in Seattle, and cannot recall a single instance of getting a static shock.
posted by jamjam at 6:55 PM on June 7, 2022
Antistatic parts organizers aren't that expensive.
Black plastic is often colored with carbon black, which is slightly conductive, if you're trying to pick up any old thing.
You could also get conductive spray paint and coat a cheap parts organizer.
posted by flimflam at 7:03 PM on June 7, 2022 [2 favorites]
Black plastic is often colored with carbon black, which is slightly conductive, if you're trying to pick up any old thing.
You could also get conductive spray paint and coat a cheap parts organizer.
posted by flimflam at 7:03 PM on June 7, 2022 [2 favorites]
I have a sheet of conductive foam. I stick the pins of the parts into the foam.
posted by H21 at 8:37 PM on June 7, 2022
posted by H21 at 8:37 PM on June 7, 2022
My ESD precautions depend very much on the class of semiconductors I handle.
- bipolar transistors, diodes/LEDs, 'simple' ICs with bipolar I/O (555/741-class analog, TTL and LSTTL logic), 'robust' ICs (voltage regulators and power drivers) ? No care at all.
- MOSFETs, CMOS logic, microcontrollers etc. ? Usually grounded mat, wristband, bit of conductive foam on the bottom when stored in a non-ESD drawer.
- stuff that's already on a module? Straight into a drawer, although larger modules tend to end up in wooden boxes.
- SMD parts get stored in ESD assortment boxes anyway.
Antistatic parts organizers aren't that expensive.
The go-to brand over here is Raaco, and they offer their assortment boxes in standard plastic and ESD-safe versions. For their wall racks you can opt to replace a few of the drawers with ESD-safe ones if you have maybe one or two rows worth out of twelve that would be holding sensitive parts; they list all sizes of drawers and dividers as replacement parts in both versions.
ESD spray coating (from CRC and others) is also an option.
posted by Stoneshop at 10:10 PM on June 7, 2022 [1 favorite]
- bipolar transistors, diodes/LEDs, 'simple' ICs with bipolar I/O (555/741-class analog, TTL and LSTTL logic), 'robust' ICs (voltage regulators and power drivers) ? No care at all.
- MOSFETs, CMOS logic, microcontrollers etc. ? Usually grounded mat, wristband, bit of conductive foam on the bottom when stored in a non-ESD drawer.
- stuff that's already on a module? Straight into a drawer, although larger modules tend to end up in wooden boxes.
- SMD parts get stored in ESD assortment boxes anyway.
Antistatic parts organizers aren't that expensive.
The go-to brand over here is Raaco, and they offer their assortment boxes in standard plastic and ESD-safe versions. For their wall racks you can opt to replace a few of the drawers with ESD-safe ones if you have maybe one or two rows worth out of twelve that would be holding sensitive parts; they list all sizes of drawers and dividers as replacement parts in both versions.
ESD spray coating (from CRC and others) is also an option.
posted by Stoneshop at 10:10 PM on June 7, 2022 [1 favorite]
Admitting that I know jack-diddley about this on a regular basis, but - I vaguely remember my boss asking me to look into this, and finding that ESD-safe organizer trays might exist. So...that might be worth an investigation.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 4:24 AM on June 8, 2022
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 4:24 AM on June 8, 2022
I have a lot of components, both through-hole and SMD, stored in those little plastic drawer things. Through-hole ICs are stuck into black conductive foam or in those anti-static plastic bags. SMD are in their tapes inside anti-static plastic bags. Has worked fine over the last couple of decades but I'm in the Bay Area and low humidity is not a thing, can't remember the last time I got a shock.
(I don't distinguish between CMOS and TTL and analog, everything goes in some sort of anti-static bag or foam.)
posted by phliar at 11:42 AM on June 8, 2022
(I don't distinguish between CMOS and TTL and analog, everything goes in some sort of anti-static bag or foam.)
posted by phliar at 11:42 AM on June 8, 2022
Response by poster: > stuff that's already on a module? Straight into a drawer
@Stoneshop I don't understand this. (I'm pretty new to electronics.) Are you saying PCB-mounted components are inherently protected?
posted by trevor_case at 7:08 PM on June 8, 2022
@Stoneshop I don't understand this. (I'm pretty new to electronics.) Are you saying PCB-mounted components are inherently protected?
posted by trevor_case at 7:08 PM on June 8, 2022
Are you saying PCB-mounted components are inherently protected?
Not by virtue of just being mounted on a PCB, but by having their pins connected to other components. Generally, if you look at a schematic, the active and therefore possibly ESD-sensitive components are connected to the power and ground buses and there are resistors and capacitors connected to the components' other pins. Those create low-(ish-)resistance paths from those pins to ground* (maybe via other active and passive components) and so prevent static buildup. Pins on active components that are meant to be free to wire up to something external to the module, like the I/O pins on an Arduino going straight into the ATMega, are usually designed so that they're not overly sensitive.
This is not an universal rule, but it holds for the modules you'll be dealing with as an average electronics hobbyist, the stuff you get from Adafruit, SparkFun and Ali. I do keep those in the ESD-baggies they come in until I need them, but if they get put aside after use, I just stick them in one of the drawers ('sensors', 'drivers', etc.).
The wooden boxes I mentioned are about the same price as plastic boxes and come in three sizes that are stackable, so that was an easy choice to make.
* on an un-powered module, the power supply bus or buses can be considered ground when viewing from an ESD-protection point
posted by Stoneshop at 10:43 PM on June 8, 2022
Not by virtue of just being mounted on a PCB, but by having their pins connected to other components. Generally, if you look at a schematic, the active and therefore possibly ESD-sensitive components are connected to the power and ground buses and there are resistors and capacitors connected to the components' other pins. Those create low-(ish-)resistance paths from those pins to ground* (maybe via other active and passive components) and so prevent static buildup. Pins on active components that are meant to be free to wire up to something external to the module, like the I/O pins on an Arduino going straight into the ATMega, are usually designed so that they're not overly sensitive.
This is not an universal rule, but it holds for the modules you'll be dealing with as an average electronics hobbyist, the stuff you get from Adafruit, SparkFun and Ali. I do keep those in the ESD-baggies they come in until I need them, but if they get put aside after use, I just stick them in one of the drawers ('sensors', 'drivers', etc.).
The wooden boxes I mentioned are about the same price as plastic boxes and come in three sizes that are stackable, so that was an easy choice to make.
* on an un-powered module, the power supply bus or buses can be considered ground when viewing from an ESD-protection point
posted by Stoneshop at 10:43 PM on June 8, 2022
Response by poster: > Not by virtue of just being mounted on a PCB, but by having their pins connected to other components
Ah, ok. Good to know. Thanks a lot for the info.
posted by trevor_case at 6:24 PM on June 10, 2022
Ah, ok. Good to know. Thanks a lot for the info.
posted by trevor_case at 6:24 PM on June 10, 2022
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I mean, when I bought a bunch of DIP stuff recently from mouser they came in a plastic sleeve/tube. And they're fine.
I think I am a bit of an ESD denier. I mean, yes, it is something that happens, but no, I don't think it's as common as people thing.
Most of my DIP stuff, if not in tubes as mentioned above, is stuck into little foam mats that fit into plastic drawers. I don't have a lot of it though, I mostly have SMD stuff, which is stored in tape (often plastic tape, fwiw)
posted by RustyBrooks at 4:53 PM on June 7, 2022 [3 favorites]