Wie lernt man Deutsch?

November 5, 2021 5:48 PM

Did you teach yourself German in the past few years but NOT using programs like Duolingo? If so, how did you do it? Do you have recommendations or caveats? I'm a little picky, so details inside.

I've decided that I want/need to tackle German. In an ideal world, this would be not just for reading ability, but also speaking ability. I actually have some already -- I was sent to Samstagschule for some years as a child. I haven't kept up with it, but I do have a basic sense of syntax and a little bit of grasp of the grammar -- if you read a sentence to me out loud, I would likely have no idea what it meant, but I could tell you which words were verbs and which were nouns, articles, adjectives, etc. I've also been told that my pronunciation is pretty good. I'm experienced with learning languages as an adult (all Romance languages, though), and I know that I much prefer to learn a language with a rather traditional approach, one that has me doing unfashionable things like studying verb morphology and memorizing charts. Programs like Duolingo make me *nuts* -- WTF, are you never going to explain why that verb root just changed or the article is totally different? I'm just supposed to memorize it and never ask *why*? And I don't want to take a class because honestly, they're all paced too dang slow. But it's been some years since I last tackled a language, and I'm sure that there are new modalities that I haven't even dreamed of. If you're a language learner of my ilk and you've recently been working on a new language, what programs have you found useful? Or if you've recently been teaching yourself German, are there particular textbooks or other resources that you like? Or any that you'd warn me away from?

posted by pleasant_confusion to Education (14 answers total)

I also find duolingo maddening. It reminds me of the compliance training videos I am forced to watch at work, and of the apps my kid uses. My kid is 4.

I did two things when I learned German and would recommend both: I did the Pimsleur audio course which is audio only (give or take a PDF you can ignore) and much more immersive and less “see the ball, the ball is red” than duolingo. After that I was around A2.

I then did an intensive two hours day in person course at the Goethe Institute to formally move up to B1 and formalize my grammar and written understanding.
posted by caek at 5:53 PM on November 5, 2021 [1 favorite]

The Slow News podcast is a five minute podcast of international news auf Deutsch that helped keep me sharp for a while. I believe that Deutsche Welle produces it.
posted by wenestvedt at 5:57 PM on November 5, 2021 [1 favorite]

I only took a semester of German, but I've also taken French (for years) and Spanish, as well as have native fluency in an Asian language.
The most direct way to learn the rules (instead of memorizing) is to get a program for students (you can google textbook + college, textbook + high school) and read the Amazon reviews/sample for something that clicks with you.

However, what I really liked as a self-learner of a lot of languages is one step away from a textbook - a program/book that has easily identifiable patterns of the grammar/rules that you can pick up immersively. I used the Berlitz Self-Teacher for German (and for French and Spanish as well): https://www.amazon.com/Berlitz-Self-Teacher-German-Home-Study-Developed/dp/0399513221


It takes a sentence structure, then adds minor variations to it so that you can get a sense of the patterns.
posted by thesockpuppet at 6:00 PM on November 5, 2021 [1 favorite]

If you have a Goethe Institut near you, you might look into courses. In-person classes are often a better way to learn.
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 6:11 PM on November 5, 2021 [2 favorites]

I have used Duolingo to complement other methods, but I want to especially shout out Anki flashcards as a supplemental tool to whatever you do. When you run into a new word, make a flashcard of it and review your cards daily (calibrate until you're spending 20-25 minutes a day early on). This won't help with grammar, but one of the issues I have with language learning is recognizing words outside the context they're taught in and this really helped me with that.
posted by LSK at 6:54 PM on November 5, 2021 [3 favorites]

I started learning German with Duolingo and yeah, it can only take you so far! I agree with caek that Pimsleur can be a good supplement. I started an in-person A1 class in 2017 and now it's fully online due to the pandemic. Four years later and we're only at B2.2, because it's just one day a week, so I hear you on the slowness! Still, having a teacher and consistent set of students has made all the difference for me. Some of the supplemental materials we've used might work well for you:

Slow German mit Annik Rubens: Audio on a variety of current topics.
Nico's Weg: Funny drama of a Spanish man who moves to Germany and meets all these people, with plenty of structured exercises to build your skills.
German.net: Excellent quizzes for most grammatical skills, for when you're ready to drill.
Top Thema from Deutsche Welle: More topical news articles with quizzes.
I haven't tried it, but two friends of mine had great things to say about Lingoda for online classes to practice your skills with people from around the world.
posted by oxisos at 8:33 PM on November 5, 2021 [3 favorites]

Personally, I'd get a grammar-heavy textbook (no recommendations unfortunately), take advantage of today's increased accessibility to watch a ton of German-language shows and movies, check out some podcasts with transcripts, and youtube videos, and read content you're already fairly familiar with like translated books you've already read, ideally written in a fairly modern, colloquial style. (If you use ebooks you can take advantage of your device or software's built-in dictionaries.) You can also try language-tutor sites like italki (or lingoda above) or network on your own to find language exchange partners (the ability to do video meetings makes this much easier than it used to be), or a private teacher if you can afford it.

And all along, do the things a good language course would require: practice words, expressions, and grammatical constructions actively by using them in your own sentences, stories, dialogs, etc., both in writing and orally.
posted by trig at 9:09 PM on November 5, 2021

I studied German in university well enough to read but not to speak. I learned to speak pretty well later on by working with a private tutor. I learned to speak and read Spanish very well by working with a tutor from scratch. I love the private tutor experience and believe it gives much more bang for your buck than a classroom experience. Tutors on skype or whatnot are great; a live in-person tutor is even better, if you can find one in your area.

Deutsche Welle, which oxisos mentions, has lots of educational material for those learning German as a second language.

A language learner's forum has a list of resources for learning German, and is also a good forum to check out in general.

Viel Glück!
posted by bertran at 9:41 PM on November 5, 2021

I mostly learned via Duolingo, but I also bought a book to help me conceptualize what I was learning: Essential German Grammar. The Essential ____ Grammar series is great. I also have the Dutch and French editions (the latter as kind of a control, since I have a strong grasp of French from high school still). I rewrote most of the material by hand, and then used Duolingo primarily for vocabulary.
posted by kevinbelt at 4:40 AM on November 6, 2021

I found the Dreyer & Schmitt Lehr- und Übungsbuch der deutschen Grammatik immensely useful when I was learning German. Get the answer key for self study. There's also a useful series from the same publisher, Deutsch üben, with workbooks on specific themes.

It can also be helpful to use a thematic basic and intermediate vocabulary book. While this one is aimed at German speakers learning English, I found it more helpful than the analogous books aimed at English speakers learning German.

Seconding the point that others have made: immersion is important, as is repetition. Modern language pedagogy starts from the basic assumptions that the spoken language is primary, and that the primary route to proficiency is through listening and repetition. As an adult learner, I think it's fine to add orthography and grammar too, but I recommend emphasizing the former.

These days it's fairly easy to stream German TV and movies, and listen to radio. You can begin with English subtitles, and then as your vocabulary and grammatical sense improves, switch to German captioning. It also helps to listen to news radio that repeats headlines frequently. When I lived in Berlin, I found Info-Radio Berlin-Brandenburg invaluable in that respect.
posted by brianogilvie at 10:40 AM on November 6, 2021

I've had a lot of success with italki for speaking, you can work with a teacher directly so you're not stuck in a slow class.
posted by Braeburn at 2:56 PM on November 6, 2021

I moved to Germany for 18 months and spoke no German before that. In preparation, I

- labeled all the nouns in my house with their "the" and name (the "the" is super important) (der Zimt is the cinnamon)
- listened to Pimsleur tapes (1/2 hour a day)
- made contact with everyone who I knew was from Germany and asked them to help me
- watched this adult detective show called Tatort but found German Sesame Street helpful in the beginning
- made verb lists
- Made peace with idea that I was going to learn more if I talked more even that would also create more mistakes

Viel Glück!
posted by mutt.cyberspace at 3:41 PM on November 6, 2021 [1 favorite]

Programs like Duolingo make me *nuts* -- WTF, are you never going to explain why that verb root just changed or the article is totally different? I'm just supposed to memorize it and never ask *why*?

If you already know this about Duolingo, apologies, but if you've only used the app and not the browser version, you might not know about the "tips," which are basically little grammar lessons. Like, here's the beginning of the "tips" section for the introduction of the accusative case in German (formatting is much more attractive on the Duolingo page but you have to be logged-in and signed up for the German course to see it):

We have a case to crack!
In English, we say He likes Sam, but Sam likes him. He changes to him because of the role it plays in the sentence. German does the same thing, but with lots of words, including ein and der!
This change in form is known as case. The first case we’ll look at is called the accusative case!

basic form: der Apfel, ein Apfel
accusative case: Ich habe den Apfel., Ich esse einen Apfel.

Ask yourself, What do you have? or What do you like? Your answer will use the accusative case.

Not everything changes!
In the accusative case only masculine words change form, like der Apfel or der Junge. Feminine and neuter nouns stay the same!
...

(Why are there so many exclamation points! I don't know! But Duolingo-in-the-browser does have these grammar lessons, even though it's not made at all obvious.)

Another thing that helps me keep my second language from atrophying completely is watching TV shows in that language with the original-language subtitles on.
posted by mskyle at 5:30 PM on November 6, 2021 [1 favorite]

Deutsche Welle has a ton of language-learning resources and courses for learners at every level, from beginning to advanced. Nicos Weg has decent grammar explanations. Podcasts like Top-Thema typically have transcripts and sometimes comprehension quizzes.

There's a complete online textbook, with audio, video, and grammar explanations and exercises: Deutsch im Blick, from the University of Texas.

If you want extensive drill, check out the FSI German courses. (They were developed by the US Government and are in the public domain.) Many people find them horribly boring, but I find it really helpful to get SO MUCH drill to reinforce the structures.

A Language Learner's Forum has an extensive list of resources for learning German. You can also get opinions there about what's worked well for other learners (for example, FSI German, Assimil German).

Libraries often have language-learning materials, which can be a great way to thoroughly preview teach-yourself type books. Check your local library for Pimsleur, Michel Thomas, Teach Yourself, and other materials to see if they have things you can borrow. (In my opinion, Pimsleur is best.) Also, library book sales often have used language learning materials. (I have literally dozens of language teach-yourself books with answers written in for the first half of the first chapter, after which the original owner gave up.) Libraries have been my biggest source of German materials (including physical flashcard sets and CD sets).

Finally, if you're up for spending some money, Assimil German with Ease can be really good.

Personally, though, I'd check the library and exhaust the Deutsche Welle stuff first.
posted by kristi at 8:58 AM on November 9, 2021