Prone to pontificate about gaming gear? This is a chance to shine.
January 30, 2021 10:06 AM Subscribe
Our 12 y/o has saved about $1600 and wants to buy a gaming laptop. He primarily plays Minecraft, Among Us, and Portal. There are a million gaming laptops. What are some good ones in this price range?
The main things that seem important are performance, being vaguely fun looking, and bang for the buck.
His BFF's new gaming laptop has these specs. There is zero need to one up, but I also don't want him to get anything worse than that, as constantly apologizing that his sad, aging desktop PC can't keep up has gotten old. So it could be better, if his budget allows but it really shouldn't be worse.
He'd rather put his money into better specs than flashy design, but he wants something that doesn't look like--and I am going to quote him here--"some sad businessman thing like you'd get from corporate."
I've seen the Wirecutter recs, but there seem to be many more choices to account for, down to subtle differences in chipset and graphics card, available RAM upgrades, etc.
This will 100% be a Windows PC. His choice.
Anyone have any recs? I'm out of my element here and could use the help.
Two other notes: we'd get 5% back cash if we bought from Amazon, due to a credit card thing. And my sister-in-law works for Best Buy and may or may not get a discount, depending on the particular computer, margins, etc.
The main things that seem important are performance, being vaguely fun looking, and bang for the buck.
His BFF's new gaming laptop has these specs. There is zero need to one up, but I also don't want him to get anything worse than that, as constantly apologizing that his sad, aging desktop PC can't keep up has gotten old. So it could be better, if his budget allows but it really shouldn't be worse.
He'd rather put his money into better specs than flashy design, but he wants something that doesn't look like--and I am going to quote him here--"some sad businessman thing like you'd get from corporate."
I've seen the Wirecutter recs, but there seem to be many more choices to account for, down to subtle differences in chipset and graphics card, available RAM upgrades, etc.
This will 100% be a Windows PC. His choice.
Anyone have any recs? I'm out of my element here and could use the help.
Two other notes: we'd get 5% back cash if we bought from Amazon, due to a credit card thing. And my sister-in-law works for Best Buy and may or may not get a discount, depending on the particular computer, margins, etc.
To supplement the above, I’d argue the SSD needs to be at least 1TB. Games are really large these days (e.g., Doom is 65gb, RDR2 is over 100gb).
posted by sevensnowflakes at 10:55 AM on January 30, 2021 [1 favorite]
posted by sevensnowflakes at 10:55 AM on January 30, 2021 [1 favorite]
If keeping parity with his friend is important, you'll also need to find out what type of GPU the friend has. For many modern games, GPU is more important than CPU, though the three you list are not terribly GPU intensive.
As far as general specs, either a 10th or 11th generation i7 (the friend has a 10th gen) or a Ryzen 7 or 9. 16-32GB of RAM (16 is fine for what he does but more is almost always a good thing - but it's also not worth paying an extra $300 of RAM that won't have a lot of effect). 1TB SSD is definitely a good idea - again, for his current use, it might not make a big difference at the moment but there's a lot smaller of a price premium starting with 1TB than 32GB of RAM.
I recently got an Asus Zephyrus G14 which both Amazon and Best Buy has run good specials on and has been frequently cited as a really good bang for the buck mobile gaming laptop series. I don't know that it's fun looking, but it fits the genre well enough, and is relatively small and light with a long lasting battery. The highest end versions have fancy programable blinking lights on the lid that you can see examples of here.
I know some people that love their gaming Lenovos. I am pretty much forever biased against HP.
I would suggest that he make the ability to charge over USB C Power Delivery a required feature, so that if he runs off to a friend's house for the weekend and forgets the charger, he'll have an excellent chance of being able to borrow something that can charge it. My Asus, for example, won't charge at full speed over PD, but it's better than nothing. Also, most USB C PD ports will also support hooking up to USB C docking stations or monitors with DisplayPort, which may be useful to have.
One other thing to consider is that many modern gaming laptops don't have a webcam because of the assumption that people will be using better quality (and mountable) external webcams, so if the model he selects doesn't have one, he'll need to budget for one as well. Similarly, if any of his use is made significantly better by having a number pad, he'll either want a larger laptop that has one or an external keyboard for day to day use at home.
Lastly, at 12, unless he's (and his friends) are strongly responsible/careful, I'd strongly suggest a company that offers 3-4 year no-fault warranties, preferably from the vendor themselves rather than a 3rd party. If you happen to have a Costco membership and their credit card, between the two of them, warranties on laptops get boosted to four years for free, which is worth considering, but I don't think it's explicitly no-fault so probably wouldn't cover the screen cracking from a drop or a soda getting poured into the keyboard.
posted by Candleman at 11:17 AM on January 30, 2021 [5 favorites]
As far as general specs, either a 10th or 11th generation i7 (the friend has a 10th gen) or a Ryzen 7 or 9. 16-32GB of RAM (16 is fine for what he does but more is almost always a good thing - but it's also not worth paying an extra $300 of RAM that won't have a lot of effect). 1TB SSD is definitely a good idea - again, for his current use, it might not make a big difference at the moment but there's a lot smaller of a price premium starting with 1TB than 32GB of RAM.
I recently got an Asus Zephyrus G14 which both Amazon and Best Buy has run good specials on and has been frequently cited as a really good bang for the buck mobile gaming laptop series. I don't know that it's fun looking, but it fits the genre well enough, and is relatively small and light with a long lasting battery. The highest end versions have fancy programable blinking lights on the lid that you can see examples of here.
I know some people that love their gaming Lenovos. I am pretty much forever biased against HP.
I would suggest that he make the ability to charge over USB C Power Delivery a required feature, so that if he runs off to a friend's house for the weekend and forgets the charger, he'll have an excellent chance of being able to borrow something that can charge it. My Asus, for example, won't charge at full speed over PD, but it's better than nothing. Also, most USB C PD ports will also support hooking up to USB C docking stations or monitors with DisplayPort, which may be useful to have.
One other thing to consider is that many modern gaming laptops don't have a webcam because of the assumption that people will be using better quality (and mountable) external webcams, so if the model he selects doesn't have one, he'll need to budget for one as well. Similarly, if any of his use is made significantly better by having a number pad, he'll either want a larger laptop that has one or an external keyboard for day to day use at home.
Lastly, at 12, unless he's (and his friends) are strongly responsible/careful, I'd strongly suggest a company that offers 3-4 year no-fault warranties, preferably from the vendor themselves rather than a 3rd party. If you happen to have a Costco membership and their credit card, between the two of them, warranties on laptops get boosted to four years for free, which is worth considering, but I don't think it's explicitly no-fault so probably wouldn't cover the screen cracking from a drop or a soda getting poured into the keyboard.
posted by Candleman at 11:17 AM on January 30, 2021 [5 favorites]
When I did this research about a year ago, I went for a Lenovo Legion because it had good specs and decent battery life for the price. It's working well for its recipient so far. They're not super flashy though, ASUS is another good brand that has several models at that price range that might be more exciting looking.
posted by JZig at 11:17 AM on January 30, 2021 [1 favorite]
posted by JZig at 11:17 AM on January 30, 2021 [1 favorite]
Yes, definitely find out what GPU (graphics) his friends' laptop has.
This is the most important part of a gaming laptop - but Candleman is right, the listed games don't require a current-gen/ last-gen GPU especially at 1080p. But even then you'll want something better than "integrated graphics."
A fancy GPU will drive up the price of the laptop substantially. Without knowing whether your kid is/ will-be into more graphically intensive games, a RTX 2xxx-Q GPU should be something to aim for.
Minecraft now supports raytracing (ie., RTX; AMD GPUs are brute forcing it instead of having dedicated hardware but tend to have substantially more+better VRAM, but Nvidia has dedicated DLSS hardware that compensates for less/ slower VRAM).
posted by porpoise at 11:32 AM on January 30, 2021 [1 favorite]
This is the most important part of a gaming laptop - but Candleman is right, the listed games don't require a current-gen/ last-gen GPU especially at 1080p. But even then you'll want something better than "integrated graphics."
A fancy GPU will drive up the price of the laptop substantially. Without knowing whether your kid is/ will-be into more graphically intensive games, a RTX 2xxx-Q GPU should be something to aim for.
Minecraft now supports raytracing (ie., RTX; AMD GPUs are brute forcing it instead of having dedicated hardware but tend to have substantially more+better VRAM, but Nvidia has dedicated DLSS hardware that compensates for less/ slower VRAM).
posted by porpoise at 11:32 AM on January 30, 2021 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: What do we think of this one at Costco?
TRULY appreciative for everyone's thoughts here. I have learned something from literally every comment so far.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 12:15 PM on January 30, 2021
TRULY appreciative for everyone's thoughts here. I have learned something from literally every comment so far.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 12:15 PM on January 30, 2021
The hardware specs look super. Quick google suggests that it can get pretty loud under load. The RTX 2070Super is last gen, but still "upper middle class/ lower upper class" (in contrast to upper class/ ultra wealthy) and the 144hz monitor will give buttery smooth visuals which that card can fully pump frames into.
Would never have guessed recommendng a 144hz mon on a laptop, but after getting a 2k 27" 144hz for my desktop, can confirm that 2D (and older 3D) games running locked at 144hz is absolutely amazeballs. You do need a GPU to pump out frames to keep up with the refresh, but the 2070S will be up for it.
If you can afford the price, and kiddo likes the looks...
Does Costco have floor models (or local big box stores with the same model)? I'm super wary of the chiclet keyboard, but Asus ROG has a decent reputation.
posted by porpoise at 12:28 PM on January 30, 2021 [1 favorite]
Would never have guessed recommendng a 144hz mon on a laptop, but after getting a 2k 27" 144hz for my desktop, can confirm that 2D (and older 3D) games running locked at 144hz is absolutely amazeballs. You do need a GPU to pump out frames to keep up with the refresh, but the 2070S will be up for it.
If you can afford the price, and kiddo likes the looks...
Does Costco have floor models (or local big box stores with the same model)? I'm super wary of the chiclet keyboard, but Asus ROG has a decent reputation.
posted by porpoise at 12:28 PM on January 30, 2021 [1 favorite]
I’m worrying about his ergonomics because especially with young people it’s no problem no problem no problem hello! Permanent injury! Keep the desktop keyboard, at least, for a while?
posted by clew at 12:53 PM on January 30, 2021 [4 favorites]
posted by clew at 12:53 PM on January 30, 2021 [4 favorites]
I would be wary of spending all $1600 on the machine, especially more machine than he really needs for the games he loves right now. For a preteen/young teen with an expensive laptop, you NEED to budget for an extended warranty/protection plan that covers spills, drops, and irresponsible behavior. I'd want it covered for 3 years personally, but a lot depends on when you predict he'll want/need a new laptop. He's old enough to be involved in the decision making, learning about the different options and trade-offs. If he's bored by the research that goes into it, he's probably not ready for something very fancy.
posted by rikschell at 1:05 PM on January 30, 2021 [5 favorites]
posted by rikschell at 1:05 PM on January 30, 2021 [5 favorites]
A little more explanation of the Costco warranty, if that's part of your consideration, here's more details. But basically my understanding is that year 1 you have a warranty with the maker (assuming that it's a 1 year manufacturer's warranty), year 2 you have it with Costco, and year 3 and 4 you have it with Citi.
The model you linked to looks OK - it doesn't have the ability to charge over USB C but that doesn't have to be a dealbreaker. But investing in a second PSU might be in order so there can be one that always lives at home and one that lives in a bag or whatever. And it does seem like it'll be noisy so there might be some conflict over whether it's appropriate to use in family areas when other people are around.
I'm super wary of the chiclet keyboard
I think it's a very similar keyboard as my smaller model and is fine for touch typing. Not as nice as the XPS 13 keyboard but it doesn't feel like a cheap chiclet keyboard - there's plenty of travel and a solid feel. Both what I have and the Costco one have half sized arrow keys, which may or may not be a deal breaker depending on how the son likes to play. Most people I know use WASD anyway but there's some that prefer to use the arrow keys or play games without the ability to map to WASD.
Lastly, if you've never dropped this type of money on a laptop, your insurance probably has a relatively low amount of coverage for personal electronics without getting additional coverage, so you might play with variables with the deductible and amount of coverage to see if it makes sense to expand coverage in case he leaves it on the bus and it vanishes. Possibly even a secondary policy (if such a thing makes sense) so your primary insurance doesn't get cancelled or go through the roof if there's a claim.
posted by Candleman at 1:11 PM on January 30, 2021 [1 favorite]
The model you linked to looks OK - it doesn't have the ability to charge over USB C but that doesn't have to be a dealbreaker. But investing in a second PSU might be in order so there can be one that always lives at home and one that lives in a bag or whatever. And it does seem like it'll be noisy so there might be some conflict over whether it's appropriate to use in family areas when other people are around.
I'm super wary of the chiclet keyboard
I think it's a very similar keyboard as my smaller model and is fine for touch typing. Not as nice as the XPS 13 keyboard but it doesn't feel like a cheap chiclet keyboard - there's plenty of travel and a solid feel. Both what I have and the Costco one have half sized arrow keys, which may or may not be a deal breaker depending on how the son likes to play. Most people I know use WASD anyway but there's some that prefer to use the arrow keys or play games without the ability to map to WASD.
Lastly, if you've never dropped this type of money on a laptop, your insurance probably has a relatively low amount of coverage for personal electronics without getting additional coverage, so you might play with variables with the deductible and amount of coverage to see if it makes sense to expand coverage in case he leaves it on the bus and it vanishes. Possibly even a secondary policy (if such a thing makes sense) so your primary insurance doesn't get cancelled or go through the roof if there's a claim.
posted by Candleman at 1:11 PM on January 30, 2021 [1 favorite]
I'm not a gamer at all, but JZig above mentioned Lenovo Legion and I thought "I was at my local NJ Costco a week or so ago and they were selling Lenovo Legion". So FWIW I'm giving the Costco link.
posted by forthright at 1:15 PM on January 30, 2021 [1 favorite]
posted by forthright at 1:15 PM on January 30, 2021 [1 favorite]
Hardware revolution does a nice job of analyzing and recommending options at various needs and price points. A budget of $1600 would put you into their mid-range Gaming Laptops here.
posted by platinum at 1:45 PM on January 30, 2021 [1 favorite]
posted by platinum at 1:45 PM on January 30, 2021 [1 favorite]
My youngest has that exact laptop and she is happy with it. She mainly plays VR (Alyx half-life and VR Roblox mostly), Minecraft, and Roblox with no complaints about performance. I know we tested a bunch of Steam games on it and there was nothing that made it laggy. I agree the fan is noisier that I would have liked but it isn’t overly annoying.
posted by saucysault at 2:20 PM on January 30, 2021 [1 favorite]
posted by saucysault at 2:20 PM on January 30, 2021 [1 favorite]
Last (hopefully) thought - rikschell is correct that a $1600 gaming laptop is overkill for the 3 games you mentioned specifically. It could be that your son and his friend will want to step up to more modern and demanding games once they both have new systems, but if they're pretty much going to be playing those three (and similar games) for the foreseeable future, having a conversation with him on whether it's better to buy a ~$1000 machine (that will still play all those games fine) and banking $600 so that when he wants something newer and shinier 2 years down the line, he'll already be mostly there. Or having the money for whatever other hobbies he's interested in.
posted by Candleman at 4:24 PM on January 30, 2021 [2 favorites]
posted by Candleman at 4:24 PM on January 30, 2021 [2 favorites]
Does it *have* to be a gaming LAPTOP? You can get a lot more for the money with a desktop, and a lot more upgrade potential further down the line for even more savings.
But assuming you must have a laptop, there are basically two MAJOR players in gaming laptops: Razer's Blade series, and MSI laptops, which comes in no less than 8 different lines due to different mainboard accommodating both AMD and Intel CPUs, and/or using NVIDIA GeForce card vs. Radeon card. for video. From there, pick your screen size, CPU gen, and amount of stuff you want built-in vs. attach externally, basically.
There are other players, but the boutique companies usually just customize a third-party supplier's machine such as Clevo. Let's just say a few companies are not known for their gaming laptops, unless you want to pay for premier stuff like Alienware (Dell's own XPS line sits between their regular Inspiron line and the premium Alienware machines)
Others have already gone through the specs, so I won't rehash them
posted by kschang at 1:44 AM on January 31, 2021 [1 favorite]
But assuming you must have a laptop, there are basically two MAJOR players in gaming laptops: Razer's Blade series, and MSI laptops, which comes in no less than 8 different lines due to different mainboard accommodating both AMD and Intel CPUs, and/or using NVIDIA GeForce card vs. Radeon card. for video. From there, pick your screen size, CPU gen, and amount of stuff you want built-in vs. attach externally, basically.
There are other players, but the boutique companies usually just customize a third-party supplier's machine such as Clevo. Let's just say a few companies are not known for their gaming laptops, unless you want to pay for premier stuff like Alienware (Dell's own XPS line sits between their regular Inspiron line and the premium Alienware machines)
Others have already gone through the specs, so I won't rehash them
posted by kschang at 1:44 AM on January 31, 2021 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: It definitely needs to be a laptop. Kiddo likes to move around the house. It's part of his coping for being an only child during quarantine.
The one I was originally looking at may be off the table. It gets poor marks for its screen and, once I add in the drop/spill protection (which, despite efforts of nice people here, it took me a bit to realize is different than a warranty) it took me way out of my price range.
My brother is trying to convince me to go up to $2000 to get one with an RTX3070 and a Ryzen 9 but it seems like total overkill.
The new leading candidate is this< one which, using SiL's discount would come in right on budget. It's the same CPU as his buddy with a slightly higher end GPU and a high refresh rate. The fans are loud and it gets hot, but those seem like common and workable flaws.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 6:12 AM on February 2, 2021
The one I was originally looking at may be off the table. It gets poor marks for its screen and, once I add in the drop/spill protection (which, despite efforts of nice people here, it took me a bit to realize is different than a warranty) it took me way out of my price range.
My brother is trying to convince me to go up to $2000 to get one with an RTX3070 and a Ryzen 9 but it seems like total overkill.
The new leading candidate is this< one which, using SiL's discount would come in right on budget. It's the same CPU as his buddy with a slightly higher end GPU and a high refresh rate. The fans are loud and it gets hot, but those seem like common and workable flaws.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 6:12 AM on February 2, 2021
Response by poster: Or maybe we just buy him the exact $999 Legion 5 his buddy has. And an Oculus.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 6:22 AM on February 2, 2021 [1 favorite]
posted by DirtyOldTown at 6:22 AM on February 2, 2021 [1 favorite]
I am just worried about him dropping it. Laptop won't survive a drop to the floor, even onto carpeted floor, esp. not a gaming laptop which tend to be heavier than regular laptops.
With desktops, with attached peripherals, if there's spills or such, you replace the peripheral (usually keyboard) and that's it. With a laptop, if you spill, you replace the whole thing.
posted by kschang at 2:32 PM on February 2, 2021
With desktops, with attached peripherals, if there's spills or such, you replace the peripheral (usually keyboard) and that's it. With a laptop, if you spill, you replace the whole thing.
posted by kschang at 2:32 PM on February 2, 2021
This thread is closed to new comments.
I usually go to reddit's suggestaloptop stuff but some general info:
Storage: 500G or more, SSD is a must. A small SSD + larger spinning disk is okay, but SSD for booting and some apps is essential in 2021.
Memory: 16G minimum. 16G is a good number (8G is not enough in 2021, IMO). >16G is more debatable. If they are super in to minecraft and wants to run servers, 16G is okay, but 32G is better. This might be a niche case but it's why I have 64G on my desktop.
Display is more personal. I'm old with crappy eyes. 1080p is enough for me on a laptop (and even bigger for me). Refresh rate minimum 60Hz. I personally think 60Hz is good enough, others will have differing opinions. Look at reviews to filter out really bad displays, but most should be okay at this price/performance range. An external monitor can always be added later to make up for any shortfall here.
CPU: I'm more familiar with AMD at this time. I think 6 core is probably a good minimum for gaming to give some headroom. Not sure what's great in notebook processors, but modern generation processors are generally fantastic (Intel -- 10xxxx 11xxxx, Amd 3xxx 5xxx) if one avoids the lowest end/lowest core counts. The linked one is 6 core/12 thread which seems good.
GPU: Both Nvidia and AMD have a new generation out. I'm more familiar with NV desktop models. But anything is the NV 3000 series should be decent to great at this time. This is a bit tricky as NV really has a huge number of SKUs and options in this space. It looks like a lot of laptops might still be on the 2000 generation. I wouldn't go lower than a 2060 at this time.
posted by jclarkin at 10:49 AM on January 30, 2021 [1 favorite]