Brokeback Mountain interpretation question?
March 10, 2006 5:12 AM Subscribe
MovieFilter: how did you interpret events in Brokeback Mountain? (warning: spoiler inside)
i recently watched (and enjoyed) Brokeback Mountain. I'm aware that this will be old news in the US, but it only came out in Oz resonably recently. My question regards the death of Jack in the movie. We find out that Jack is dead when Ennis rings Jack's house and speaks to his wife (can't remember her name). The wife tells us he was killed when his car shifted while he was changing a tire. However, during this discussion, Ennis has a vision of Jack being beaten up by a bunch of men. In addition, Jack's wife doesn't sound very upset. However, Ennis has recently admitted to having paranoid thoughts, and witnessed the aftermath of a similar killing when he was young. So, my question is how to interpret these events. Was Jack murdered, or was Ennis just being paranoid? If he was murdered, were the wife and father-in-law in on it? And can we actually draw a conclusion, or did the director leave it open?
i recently watched (and enjoyed) Brokeback Mountain. I'm aware that this will be old news in the US, but it only came out in Oz resonably recently. My question regards the death of Jack in the movie. We find out that Jack is dead when Ennis rings Jack's house and speaks to his wife (can't remember her name). The wife tells us he was killed when his car shifted while he was changing a tire. However, during this discussion, Ennis has a vision of Jack being beaten up by a bunch of men. In addition, Jack's wife doesn't sound very upset. However, Ennis has recently admitted to having paranoid thoughts, and witnessed the aftermath of a similar killing when he was young. So, my question is how to interpret these events. Was Jack murdered, or was Ennis just being paranoid? If he was murdered, were the wife and father-in-law in on it? And can we actually draw a conclusion, or did the director leave it open?
Best answer: Read the short story by Annie Proulx. The New Yorker was hosting all 11 pages of it, but they've moved it back to their subscriber section. However, ways to read it online remain, if you know where to look.
My take? Jack didn't die from any mishap involving truck repair.
posted by grabbingsand at 5:26 AM on March 10, 2006
My take? Jack didn't die from any mishap involving truck repair.
posted by grabbingsand at 5:26 AM on March 10, 2006
I think we never really know, and I think the point isn't how Jack died, but that Ennis' father-instilled self-loathing and fear leads him to assume that Jack's refusal to completely hide his homosexuality resulted in his death, which further reinforces his belief that he needs to feel ashamed and be secretive. I think it's left open, and I really liked that Ennis instantly assumes that Jack "got what was coming to him", whether he did or not, because it's very much in keeping with what we learn about his character. If I were trying to figure it out further, I'd wonder if something happened with the husband of his wife's friend and that led to problems, but ultimately, I think it's more poignant left open.
posted by biscotti at 5:28 AM on March 10, 2006
posted by biscotti at 5:28 AM on March 10, 2006
[OT: Thank you so much for that grabbingsand, I'd been meaning to hunt down the Annie Proulx since realising that it had disappeared from the New Yorker.]
posted by ceri richard at 5:28 AM on March 10, 2006
posted by ceri richard at 5:28 AM on March 10, 2006
The reason Ennis assumes the worst is because that is the way he feels about being overtly gay. Remember the earlier scene, where he mentions the two old guys who lived near him? One was killed, and left in a ditch.
He knows Jack was more thinly veiled with his sexuality than himself, with the trips to Mexico and whatnot. So he automatically assumes the worst.
I don't really know what to make of that unemotional phonecall. Did she know he was gay?
posted by graventy at 5:41 AM on March 10, 2006
He knows Jack was more thinly veiled with his sexuality than himself, with the trips to Mexico and whatnot. So he automatically assumes the worst.
I don't really know what to make of that unemotional phonecall. Did she know he was gay?
posted by graventy at 5:41 AM on March 10, 2006
I assumed, based on the wife's demeanor, that a) Jack didn't die while fixing a flat tire and b) he died under some sort of unsavory circumstances. That said, I found the scene with the tire iron too colored by Ennis's own history to take it at face value; I love the idea that his wife and father-in-law might have conspired against him. Off to chase down the short story, which I meant to do weeks ago.
posted by junkbox at 5:57 AM on March 10, 2006
posted by junkbox at 5:57 AM on March 10, 2006
I didn't interpret it as Ennis having a "vision." I saw it as the movie letting you, the viewer, know what really happened. Jack's wife may or may not have suspected he was gay, or may or may not have known it, but the manner of his death made her confront it, so she's got more issues going on here than just his death, and she had to concoct this story to explain his death. It sounds fake and canned when she tells it because she's told it so many times already to everybody else. She's probably angry at Jack for getting himself killed this way and leaving her to cover it all up.
posted by JanetLand at 5:59 AM on March 10, 2006
posted by JanetLand at 5:59 AM on March 10, 2006
I'm not sure whether Jack's wife knew he was gay or not, but at that point, their relationship had turned into less of a romantic one and more of a partnership, focusing on the business. Of course, she could have been masking her pain and sorrow with the emotionless face we saw; but I think that their relationship was over long before he died. I think she would only care if Jack was gay or not because of the repercussions it would have had on their business.
As to the cause of his death, I believe it's meant to be ambiguous, to let the viewer decide. biscotti is right - Jack's death is meant to bring out the true core character traits of Ennis. Whether he died via an accident or beating is slightly irrelevant, since the focus shifts to Ennis for the remainder of the movie.
posted by Meagan at 5:59 AM on March 10, 2006
As to the cause of his death, I believe it's meant to be ambiguous, to let the viewer decide. biscotti is right - Jack's death is meant to bring out the true core character traits of Ennis. Whether he died via an accident or beating is slightly irrelevant, since the focus shifts to Ennis for the remainder of the movie.
posted by Meagan at 5:59 AM on March 10, 2006
Mod note: removed the spoiler from the RSS title
posted by jessamyn (staff) at 6:12 AM on March 10, 2006
posted by jessamyn (staff) at 6:12 AM on March 10, 2006
Now moaning about the movie being ruined for me is ruined for me!
But, ontopic, the director leaves it open, but Jack totally got tire-ironed. The short story hints as much.
posted by anthill at 6:41 AM on March 10, 2006
But, ontopic, the director leaves it open, but Jack totally got tire-ironed. The short story hints as much.
posted by anthill at 6:41 AM on March 10, 2006
The circumstances of Jack's death seem highly suspect because it doesn't seem that likely that the rim of a tire would fly into his face if the tire blew. It seems more like a convenient excuse for why a man would be next to a truck with a broken face. This is compounded by the fact that Jack's wife seems very cold -- it could just be because of her marital problems, but the facts of the accident seemed very rehearsed in the film. Ennis can't be sure of what happened, but his past fills in the blanks.
It's the use of a kind of a writer's shorthand that Jack dies how he does. He could have died in an actual car accident, or in a farm equipment accident but he ends up dying in a manner that strongly suggests he met the same fate as the man spoken of by Ennis's father. Whether or not Jack was killed, we're left with Ennis's conclusion that Jack died because of his past actions and inability to hide his sexuality.
posted by mikeh at 6:53 AM on March 10, 2006
It's the use of a kind of a writer's shorthand that Jack dies how he does. He could have died in an actual car accident, or in a farm equipment accident but he ends up dying in a manner that strongly suggests he met the same fate as the man spoken of by Ennis's father. Whether or not Jack was killed, we're left with Ennis's conclusion that Jack died because of his past actions and inability to hide his sexuality.
posted by mikeh at 6:53 AM on March 10, 2006
Best answer: Of course Lureen (the wife) knew Jack was gay, at least at the time of the phone call. You can tell by the dispassionate way she tells the (completely unbelievable) story about the tire accident. Whether or not the image of Jack being attacked was what actually happened--as in, the filmmakers giving us a glimpse of his death--or just a "vision" in Ennis's mind is almost beside the point. It was the truth of the matter, and that's what is important. Jack was clearly the victim of a Matthew Shepard-like attack, and Ennis knew this as soon as Lureen started talking. Moreover, she knew (or at least strongly suspected) that Ennis was one of Jack's lovers, which is why she rolled off such a rote, unemotional account of the story she (and everyone else who participated or consented to the attack) had concoted. This was probably not the only call from a strange man she had received after Jack's death.
posted by arco at 6:55 AM on March 10, 2006
posted by arco at 6:55 AM on March 10, 2006
What arco said, and I was very impressed with how they handled this in the movie (as I was with everything else about it -- I don't think I've ever seen a literary masterpiece transferred so accurately and effectively to the screen).
posted by languagehat at 7:01 AM on March 10, 2006
posted by languagehat at 7:01 AM on March 10, 2006
It was the tire iron. Ennis hadn't been the only one of Jack's lovers (though he was the most important), and Jack wasn't as careful about keeping it secret--between the trips to Mexico and the plans to set up a ranch with his neighbor, Lureen knew something was up. From later scenes in the movie it was very clear she no longer had any love for him. She was probably not any more accepting of his homosexuality than anyone else in the area, so if the tire-iron wasn't seen as a favorable way to resolve the situation, it was at least seen as an inevitability.
posted by Anonymous at 7:01 AM on March 10, 2006
posted by Anonymous at 7:01 AM on March 10, 2006
Best answer: I always thought that he really was murdered. Here are the relevant bits from the story:
...[S]he said in a level voice yes, Jack was pumping up a flat on the truck out on a back road when the tire blew up. The bead was damaged somehow and the force of the explosion slammed the rim into his face, broke his nose and jaw and knocked him unconscious on his back. By the time someone came along he had drowned in his own blood.
No, he thought, they got him with the tire iron.
“Jack used to mention you,” she said. “You’re the fishing buddy or the hunting buddy, I know that. Would have let you know,” she said, “but I wasn’t sure about your name and address. Jack kept most a his friends’ addresses in his head. It was a terrible thing. He was only thirty-nine years old.”
The huge sadness of the Northern plains rolled down on him. He didn’t know which way it was, the tire iron or a real accident, blood choking down Jack’s throat and nobody to turn him over. Under the wind drone he heard steel slamming off bone, the hollow chatter of a settling tire rim.
And later:
The old man spoke angrily. “I can’t get no help out here. Jack used a say, ‘Ennis del Mar,’ he used a say, ‘I’m goin a bring him up here one a these days and we’ll lick this damn ranch into shape.’ He had some half-baked idea the two a you was goin a move up here, build a log cabin, and help me run this ranch and bring it up. Then this spring he’s got another one’s goin a come up here with him and build a place and help run the ranch, some ranch neighbor a his from down in Texas. He’s goin a split up with his wife and come back here. So he says. But like most a Jack’s ideas it never come to pass.”
So now he knew it had been the tire iron.
posted by amarynth at 7:05 AM on March 10, 2006
...[S]he said in a level voice yes, Jack was pumping up a flat on the truck out on a back road when the tire blew up. The bead was damaged somehow and the force of the explosion slammed the rim into his face, broke his nose and jaw and knocked him unconscious on his back. By the time someone came along he had drowned in his own blood.
No, he thought, they got him with the tire iron.
“Jack used to mention you,” she said. “You’re the fishing buddy or the hunting buddy, I know that. Would have let you know,” she said, “but I wasn’t sure about your name and address. Jack kept most a his friends’ addresses in his head. It was a terrible thing. He was only thirty-nine years old.”
The huge sadness of the Northern plains rolled down on him. He didn’t know which way it was, the tire iron or a real accident, blood choking down Jack’s throat and nobody to turn him over. Under the wind drone he heard steel slamming off bone, the hollow chatter of a settling tire rim.
And later:
The old man spoke angrily. “I can’t get no help out here. Jack used a say, ‘Ennis del Mar,’ he used a say, ‘I’m goin a bring him up here one a these days and we’ll lick this damn ranch into shape.’ He had some half-baked idea the two a you was goin a move up here, build a log cabin, and help me run this ranch and bring it up. Then this spring he’s got another one’s goin a come up here with him and build a place and help run the ranch, some ranch neighbor a his from down in Texas. He’s goin a split up with his wife and come back here. So he says. But like most a Jack’s ideas it never come to pass.”
So now he knew it had been the tire iron.
posted by amarynth at 7:05 AM on March 10, 2006
I assumed that the flashes of Jack being beaten to death were just Ang Lee's way of showing us what really happened, since Jack's wife can't tell us. However, during that phone conversation, you can hear her making odd little involuntary vocalisations during the pauses. I assumed that this was her sublimated grief (at her husband's death), shame (at the knowledge that he'd been murdered for being gay) or anger (at Ennis for being part of her husband's betrayal) leaking out. It's never clear, though, how much, if anything, she knows.
posted by hot soup girl at 7:29 AM on March 10, 2006
posted by hot soup girl at 7:29 AM on March 10, 2006
Remember after the first night they spent together, Ennis goes up to look at the sheep and one of the sheep has its insides torn out by a wolf? And the look on Ennis face upon viewing that? I feel like this provides further insight into what we're talking about. Ennis' understanding is that when homosexuality surfaces, slaughter results.
("Jack, I swear" are the closing lines right? "I swear" what?)
posted by eighth_excerpt at 11:11 AM on March 10, 2006
("Jack, I swear" are the closing lines right? "I swear" what?)
posted by eighth_excerpt at 11:11 AM on March 10, 2006
And the shirt. Didn't the pattern of blood on the shirt indicate a beating?
Derail: I was really struck by how much the kids were ignored by their dad.
That hit me more than the love story.
posted by weapons-grade pandemonium at 11:25 AM on March 10, 2006
Derail: I was really struck by how much the kids were ignored by their dad.
That hit me more than the love story.
posted by weapons-grade pandemonium at 11:25 AM on March 10, 2006
My take was that Ennis ASSUMED that Jack was beaten to death (this is what happens to fags, his father showed him), but he would never really know, nor will we.
Another way he was alienated from the love of his life, not having access to the most basic information.
I feel like the ambiguity of this was what Lee was shooting for. And I like the movie that way, that we are not sure.
posted by Danf at 11:29 AM on March 10, 2006
Another way he was alienated from the love of his life, not having access to the most basic information.
I feel like the ambiguity of this was what Lee was shooting for. And I like the movie that way, that we are not sure.
posted by Danf at 11:29 AM on March 10, 2006
And the shirt. Didn't the pattern of blood on the shirt indicate a beating?
That was Ennis's shirt that Jack kept from thier first fight.
posted by tkchrist at 11:30 AM on March 10, 2006
That was Ennis's shirt that Jack kept from thier first fight.
posted by tkchrist at 11:30 AM on March 10, 2006
And the shirt. Didn't the pattern of blood on the shirt indicate a beating?
Are you talking about the shirt Ennis found in Jack's closet? That's the shirt Ennis was wearing when he and Jack had their "fight" near the end of their time on the mountain, the one where Ennis bloodied his nose. As they were parting after coming down from Brokeback, Ennis commented that he had forgotten his shirt up on the mountain. In reality, Jack had stolen it so he would have something to remember Ennis by.
On preview: What tkchrist said.
posted by arco at 11:31 AM on March 10, 2006
Are you talking about the shirt Ennis found in Jack's closet? That's the shirt Ennis was wearing when he and Jack had their "fight" near the end of their time on the mountain, the one where Ennis bloodied his nose. As they were parting after coming down from Brokeback, Ennis commented that he had forgotten his shirt up on the mountain. In reality, Jack had stolen it so he would have something to remember Ennis by.
On preview: What tkchrist said.
posted by arco at 11:31 AM on March 10, 2006
On the tire rim issue. I saw this movie with my dad and he said those tires were quite dangerous when filling with air. The rim was a separate piece that could fly off if not installed correctly. He actually knew a guy in high school that ended up with a metal plate in is forhead from that happening. The kid was working in an auto/truck shop.
But, my dad also said that it would unlikely that someone would attempt that job on the side of the road.
posted by 6550 at 1:25 PM on March 10, 2006
But, my dad also said that it would unlikely that someone would attempt that job on the side of the road.
posted by 6550 at 1:25 PM on March 10, 2006
Response by poster: thanks for the great answers everyone. I apologise for the spoiler in the title, i had assumed that everyone viewing the title would have seen my warning in the initial blurb (forgetting the RSS feed). Thanks for cleaning up after me, jessamyn.
posted by nml at 2:34 PM on March 10, 2006
posted by nml at 2:34 PM on March 10, 2006
Now that I've read the story (thanks, grabbingsand), I'm still not convinced that Ennis thinking that he knew it had been the tire iron actually means that Jack was murdered. It's still ambiguous to me, especially since the part where he "knew it had been the tire iron" is right after Jack's father has been being all angry and disappointed (and, at least to Ennis, homophobic) at him (presumably reminding Ennis of his own father, and his own consequent self loathing). I don't think this necessarily means Jack was murdered, it's just more insight into Ennis's character. Of course he's going to think Jack was murdered, that's what happens to homosexuals in the world Ennis lives in, whether he was or not.
posted by biscotti at 5:10 PM on March 10, 2006
posted by biscotti at 5:10 PM on March 10, 2006
Best answer: I'm paraphrasing from an interpretation I read on another message board:
The image of Jack getting beaten to death was Ennis's mental image of what happened, because in it, Jack was as he was when they were up on Brokeback Mountain as teenagers - he didn't have his mustache, and wearing the same clothes he wore at that time. Presumably, that's how Ennis always saw him in his mind. Of course, that doesn't mean that Jack didn't get bashed. We're just seeing Ennis's conversation with Lureen from Ennis's point of view, and death by tire iron is of course the conclusion that Ennis would draw. Whether or not you think he was right, in motive if not in details, is up to you. I personally think he was correct.
posted by granted at 6:31 PM on March 10, 2006
The image of Jack getting beaten to death was Ennis's mental image of what happened, because in it, Jack was as he was when they were up on Brokeback Mountain as teenagers - he didn't have his mustache, and wearing the same clothes he wore at that time. Presumably, that's how Ennis always saw him in his mind. Of course, that doesn't mean that Jack didn't get bashed. We're just seeing Ennis's conversation with Lureen from Ennis's point of view, and death by tire iron is of course the conclusion that Ennis would draw. Whether or not you think he was right, in motive if not in details, is up to you. I personally think he was correct.
posted by granted at 6:31 PM on March 10, 2006
If grabbingsand's link doesn't work for you (it didn't work for me), try this direct link to a pdf of the short story.
posted by needs more cowbell at 7:57 PM on March 10, 2006
posted by needs more cowbell at 7:57 PM on March 10, 2006
Larry McMurtry, one of the screen-writers, when asked this same question in a recent interview in the Advocate, said: "It’s what Ennis is feeling at the moment. But Lureen’s explanation is just as good. A lot of tires blow up and kill people."
(The interview continues:
"Do people hope Jack wasn’t murdered? What do they believe?"
Ossana: We’ve been asked that [in every interview]. You can’t believe the things we’ve heard—for example, did Lureen’s father have him killed? A reporter walked up to me and said, “What really happened? I need to know.” I said, “What do you think?” He told me, and I said, “Well, if that works for you, then good.”)
(I'd link directly to the interview, but it's weird pop-up thing)
posted by malpractice at 3:31 AM on March 11, 2006
(The interview continues:
"Do people hope Jack wasn’t murdered? What do they believe?"
Ossana: We’ve been asked that [in every interview]. You can’t believe the things we’ve heard—for example, did Lureen’s father have him killed? A reporter walked up to me and said, “What really happened? I need to know.” I said, “What do you think?” He told me, and I said, “Well, if that works for you, then good.”)
(I'd link directly to the interview, but it's weird pop-up thing)
posted by malpractice at 3:31 AM on March 11, 2006
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by TheDonF at 5:24 AM on March 10, 2006