I need the "How to start a petition" basics from start to finish
October 19, 2019 3:33 PM Subscribe
I want to start a petition in my state regarding amending some of the landlord tenant statutes that are over 100 years old.
I dont have any political affiliations, socioeconomic education, agendas on the side of anything except fair treatment for residents of cities who rent their homes or money. How do I do this? Is there a draft template? Can it be written in layman's terms? How many signatures does it need to get a look by Congress?
I dont have any political affiliations, socioeconomic education, agendas on the side of anything except fair treatment for residents of cities who rent their homes or money. How do I do this? Is there a draft template? Can it be written in layman's terms? How many signatures does it need to get a look by Congress?
You mentioned congress, but landlord/tenant law is a mix of federal, state, and county/city law. As bq mentions, you are probably looking at state statute, not anything federal; the federal laws are primarily about preventing discrimination. I'm going to make a big leap here and answer the question I think you were asking - how to change a state law - rather than how to start a petition. A petition can be a useful tool, but it doesn't have a direct connection with changing law. Here is an ask.mefi post from 2012, asking "How might I, as a layperson, get a bill/law introduced and passed in my state?" that offers some helpful suggestions.
posted by kovacs at 4:28 PM on October 19, 2019 [3 favorites]
posted by kovacs at 4:28 PM on October 19, 2019 [3 favorites]
In your state, and likely your local area as well, there will be organizations for tenants and organizations representing landlords. Advocating for legislative changes is often a big part of what these groups do, so it may make sense to get involved in their efforts and to make suggestions through them.
Why? Because the organization is a group of people who already care about the issue, it will have existing relationships with lawmakers and legislative staffers, showing up as representatives of an organization sounds more legit than just being a person with a petition, and the organization will be more familiar with the issues and what kinds of changes are worth making.
posted by zachlipton at 4:45 PM on October 19, 2019 [4 favorites]
Why? Because the organization is a group of people who already care about the issue, it will have existing relationships with lawmakers and legislative staffers, showing up as representatives of an organization sounds more legit than just being a person with a petition, and the organization will be more familiar with the issues and what kinds of changes are worth making.
posted by zachlipton at 4:45 PM on October 19, 2019 [4 favorites]
Any petition will be looked at, but all will basically be ignored. Politicians don't give a damn about petitions. One reason is because it's so easy to get people to sign petitions to ban dihydrogen monoxcide or end woman's sufferage.
They are great for building a mailing list and engaging, educating the public.
posted by Sophont at 5:20 PM on October 19, 2019 [2 favorites]
They are great for building a mailing list and engaging, educating the public.
posted by Sophont at 5:20 PM on October 19, 2019 [2 favorites]
Is there a university law clinic, or non-profit poverty law center?
My local law university has a legislation clinic. If you put a request in to the professor, you can get into a queue that specifically assigns students a thesis project of writing novel legislation.
I think the 'Green Homes Guarantee' is likely to be a hot topic on campus lately.
You also need to find a legislator that gives a toss. you may want to talk to a local housing advocacy group or anti-discrimination group about potential leaders.
posted by eustatic at 5:53 PM on October 19, 2019 [1 favorite]
My local law university has a legislation clinic. If you put a request in to the professor, you can get into a queue that specifically assigns students a thesis project of writing novel legislation.
I think the 'Green Homes Guarantee' is likely to be a hot topic on campus lately.
You also need to find a legislator that gives a toss. you may want to talk to a local housing advocacy group or anti-discrimination group about potential leaders.
posted by eustatic at 5:53 PM on October 19, 2019 [1 favorite]
Any petition will be looked at, but all will basically be ignored.
There are petitions and there are petitions. If you live in a state with a state law initiative referendum process, a properly-worded petition can get a measure on the ballot for the people to vote into law (or not). In Oregon, for example, you must collect signatures equal to 6-8% of the total number of voters in the previous gubernatorial election.
If this is an option in your location, the process will be state-specific. You'll need legal advice to ensure that the wording of your ballot measure is constitutionally kosher, possibly its title and summary as well, and you'll definitely want the assistance and backing of like-minded organizations, because collecting a few hundred thousand signatures is an awfully big job. People do it, though!
posted by mumkin at 6:01 PM on October 19, 2019 [2 favorites]
There are petitions and there are petitions. If you live in a state with a state law initiative referendum process, a properly-worded petition can get a measure on the ballot for the people to vote into law (or not). In Oregon, for example, you must collect signatures equal to 6-8% of the total number of voters in the previous gubernatorial election.
If this is an option in your location, the process will be state-specific. You'll need legal advice to ensure that the wording of your ballot measure is constitutionally kosher, possibly its title and summary as well, and you'll definitely want the assistance and backing of like-minded organizations, because collecting a few hundred thousand signatures is an awfully big job. People do it, though!
posted by mumkin at 6:01 PM on October 19, 2019 [2 favorites]
Do you mean petition or referendum? Getting on the ballot varies by state and takes a *lot*of time & effort. Team up with tenants' rights groups, local legislators, city councilors. I admire your effort and I think you can effect change. It will take persistence.
posted by theora55 at 6:10 PM on October 19, 2019
posted by theora55 at 6:10 PM on October 19, 2019
I serve on my local borough assembly (like a city councilor or county commissioner). If it’s local laws you have issues with, you could try either contacting your local elected official (city council, mayor, alderman, etc) or giving public testimony at an open local legislative meeting.
Presumably, you have specific issues you are concerned with about the laws, not just that they’re old — so explain these issues and try to get a legislator to get in board to work to change them. (or, more radically, run for public office to try to change them.)
If it’s a state-level law, try contacting your local state representative about the issue.
posted by leahwrenn at 7:52 PM on October 19, 2019
Presumably, you have specific issues you are concerned with about the laws, not just that they’re old — so explain these issues and try to get a legislator to get in board to work to change them. (or, more radically, run for public office to try to change them.)
If it’s a state-level law, try contacting your local state representative about the issue.
posted by leahwrenn at 7:52 PM on October 19, 2019
Response by poster: I should have been more specific. I live in Missouri. I dont want to run for office I just dont have that much interest in politics. I want the specifics of landlord responsibilities outlined (for example: if the lease says that he is "responsible" for maintenance what are the areas covered by maintenance and when should it be looked at as neglect. If someone reads the actual landlord tenant act the wording is very swish-swishy and can be interpreted one way but litigated another and that leeway curves heavily with results leaving renters as the largest percentage of displaced or outright homeless population and unemployment rate by default. I do research but I talked to rental advocates, state reps, atty gen and legal experts for help and if they hold law degrees they are not allowed to assist in lobbying for any change pro or con. I just want to edify terminology and add words into the existing laws that we understand today. To specify things like what are acts needing of "emergency" maintenance for entry, retaliation, the who and where of the property managers power, etc.
posted by The_imp_inimpossible at 1:26 AM on October 20, 2019
posted by The_imp_inimpossible at 1:26 AM on October 20, 2019
Standard "I Am Not A Lawyer" disclaimer.
I live in Missouri.
Ballotpedia article on "Laws governing the initiative process in Missouri"
Note that the minimum number of signatures required is about 100,000 - which is one of the reasons people are suggesting you start by contacting already existing advocacy groups and non-profits working on tenant/landlord law reform and fair housing. That's far too many signatures for one person to collect, at least some of these groups will have the organization and infrastructure to collect signatures for referendums.
actual landlord tenant act the wording is very swish-swishy
On a state level this can be at least somewhat intentional, allowing local governments the ability to fine-tune laws to address their specific circumstances. Another reason people are suggesting you might start by looking at what you can do on a more local level.
I talked to rental advocates, state reps, atty gen and legal experts for help and if they hold law degrees they are not allowed to assist in lobbying for any change pro or con.
This . . . does not really make any sense. You're talking about creating and altering laws - not allowing people with law training and experience to participate in the process is unlikely. Heck, legislature members are often lawyers themselves. I feel pretty strongly that either the people you talked to did not understand what you were trying to ask or you did not understand the answers.
One possible source of confusion is that Missouri has rules governing lobbying. So Random J. Lawyer can't just start badgering the legislature, they have to register as a lobbyist and file monthly reports with the Missouri Ethics Commission.
can be interpreted one way but litigated another
Yes. This is common to lots (almost all?) laws and would still probably be the case even if your reforms came to pass. Laws deal with the relations between humans, humans are messy, there is no law so exact and detailed that it's going to operate like a mathematical equation or a bit of computer code and spit out the exact same predictable results every time you run it.
leeway curves heavily with results leaving renters as the largest percentage of displaced or outright homeless population and unemployment rate by default.
No doubt, but this is often the result of landlords winning court cases, and in turn often one strong way to change this leeway is to win court cases from the other direction. Changing legislation is often only one possible way to address inequity, and renter advocacy groups will be considering a variety of approaches to try.
Can it be written in layman's terms
I just want to edify terminology and add words into the existing laws that we understand today.
While not doubting that the language could use an overhaul, and while I suppose layman's terms could be used in legislation . . . If you think the current language of the housing act is vague and swishy, putting it in layman's terms is likely to leave loopholes big enough to pilot a boat through. Legislation is written the way it is at least partially as an attempt to be as specific as possible to reduce the number of ways things could possibly be interpreted in litigation. Obviously, it doesn't always work as well as we might like, but "layman's terms" in legislation would probably be even more vague and open to interpretation in court.
To specify things like what are acts needing of "emergency" maintenance for entry, retaliation, the who and where of the property managers power, etc.
A rental lease agreement is a private business contract, and American legislatures and courts have been and are very reluctant to get too detailed about what is or isn't allowed in private contracts. These things are (or should be) all spelled out in your lease agreement and it is up to you to read this agreement and negotiate it before signing that contract. It's not particularly fair, but you should know that you're definitely fighting an uphill battle here trying to get specific details spelled out in law.
fair treatment for residents of cities who rent their homes or money.
Yes. This is a long-standing systemic problem across the US, and it's a big problem that intersects with racism and classism and other inequities and inequalities in our society. You should absolutely work on helping to address this, you do need to be realistic about the process - it is not going to be solved by one person writing a layman's terms referendum that sets out a bunch of very very specific details of landlord responsibilities that then somehow just gets accepted by the Missouri legislature. Volunteering with groups that address housing fairness and equality (a relatively quick search suggests The Heartland Center for Jobs and Freedom, Legal Services of Eastern Missouri, and the ACLU of Missouri) will give you a better picture of the process and possibilities of improving fair treatment for tenants.
posted by soundguy99 at 9:07 PM on October 20, 2019 [1 favorite]
I live in Missouri.
Ballotpedia article on "Laws governing the initiative process in Missouri"
Note that the minimum number of signatures required is about 100,000 - which is one of the reasons people are suggesting you start by contacting already existing advocacy groups and non-profits working on tenant/landlord law reform and fair housing. That's far too many signatures for one person to collect, at least some of these groups will have the organization and infrastructure to collect signatures for referendums.
actual landlord tenant act the wording is very swish-swishy
On a state level this can be at least somewhat intentional, allowing local governments the ability to fine-tune laws to address their specific circumstances. Another reason people are suggesting you might start by looking at what you can do on a more local level.
I talked to rental advocates, state reps, atty gen and legal experts for help and if they hold law degrees they are not allowed to assist in lobbying for any change pro or con.
This . . . does not really make any sense. You're talking about creating and altering laws - not allowing people with law training and experience to participate in the process is unlikely. Heck, legislature members are often lawyers themselves. I feel pretty strongly that either the people you talked to did not understand what you were trying to ask or you did not understand the answers.
One possible source of confusion is that Missouri has rules governing lobbying. So Random J. Lawyer can't just start badgering the legislature, they have to register as a lobbyist and file monthly reports with the Missouri Ethics Commission.
can be interpreted one way but litigated another
Yes. This is common to lots (almost all?) laws and would still probably be the case even if your reforms came to pass. Laws deal with the relations between humans, humans are messy, there is no law so exact and detailed that it's going to operate like a mathematical equation or a bit of computer code and spit out the exact same predictable results every time you run it.
leeway curves heavily with results leaving renters as the largest percentage of displaced or outright homeless population and unemployment rate by default.
No doubt, but this is often the result of landlords winning court cases, and in turn often one strong way to change this leeway is to win court cases from the other direction. Changing legislation is often only one possible way to address inequity, and renter advocacy groups will be considering a variety of approaches to try.
Can it be written in layman's terms
I just want to edify terminology and add words into the existing laws that we understand today.
While not doubting that the language could use an overhaul, and while I suppose layman's terms could be used in legislation . . . If you think the current language of the housing act is vague and swishy, putting it in layman's terms is likely to leave loopholes big enough to pilot a boat through. Legislation is written the way it is at least partially as an attempt to be as specific as possible to reduce the number of ways things could possibly be interpreted in litigation. Obviously, it doesn't always work as well as we might like, but "layman's terms" in legislation would probably be even more vague and open to interpretation in court.
To specify things like what are acts needing of "emergency" maintenance for entry, retaliation, the who and where of the property managers power, etc.
A rental lease agreement is a private business contract, and American legislatures and courts have been and are very reluctant to get too detailed about what is or isn't allowed in private contracts. These things are (or should be) all spelled out in your lease agreement and it is up to you to read this agreement and negotiate it before signing that contract. It's not particularly fair, but you should know that you're definitely fighting an uphill battle here trying to get specific details spelled out in law.
fair treatment for residents of cities who rent their homes or money.
Yes. This is a long-standing systemic problem across the US, and it's a big problem that intersects with racism and classism and other inequities and inequalities in our society. You should absolutely work on helping to address this, you do need to be realistic about the process - it is not going to be solved by one person writing a layman's terms referendum that sets out a bunch of very very specific details of landlord responsibilities that then somehow just gets accepted by the Missouri legislature. Volunteering with groups that address housing fairness and equality (a relatively quick search suggests The Heartland Center for Jobs and Freedom, Legal Services of Eastern Missouri, and the ACLU of Missouri) will give you a better picture of the process and possibilities of improving fair treatment for tenants.
posted by soundguy99 at 9:07 PM on October 20, 2019 [1 favorite]
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posted by bq at 3:47 PM on October 19, 2019 [1 favorite]