Two job offers: long-term career prospects vs. benefits
July 25, 2019 8:47 AM Subscribe
How do you choose between job offers? I am very new to my field and have happily been presented with two job offers. Both will provide me with needed experience. One is in the exact area I want to work in long-term; the other offers superior compensation and benefits. What do I do?
Job 1:
Job 1:
- Exactly where I want my ultimate career trajectory to go and much more interesting work
- Defined career progression within the company
- In an extremely exciting time for the industry that will help my career long-term (the industry goes in cycles and the next cycle will be 3-4 years from now)
- Longer (much longer) hours
- Weaker benefits in terms of health insurance coverage, 401k matching, etc, and is missing some benefits of Job #2 entirely
- Pays 15% less than Job #2
- Will give me a bit less experience than Job #1 with respect to the specific functions of my job
- Not in the industry I want to be in long-term
- Less defined career progression (this is a major complaint on GlassDoor)
- More defined and shorter hours, less high-pressure projects
- The benefits are AMAZING
- Seriously, REALLY good benefits
- I cannot believe they want to pay me as much as they're going to pay me and I feel unbelievably fortunate. I have some serious debts to pay off and I can really use the money.
Job #1, and try to negotiate a salary bump based on offer #2.
Job #2 pays better today, but not necessarily tomorrow if there's no clear way to grow and progress. If you can make it up some levels of promotion in Job #1, you can make lateral moves over to companies like Job #2 that have better pay and benefits later in your career, but if you stagnate in Job #2, you can't leap over promotion levels at Job #1 -- you'd have to try to get in an Job #1 on the lower level, and they won't perceive you as a great candidate straight out of school but as a water-treader who hasn't been progressing for the past 5 years.
posted by jacquilynne at 8:57 AM on July 25, 2019 [1 favorite]
Job #2 pays better today, but not necessarily tomorrow if there's no clear way to grow and progress. If you can make it up some levels of promotion in Job #1, you can make lateral moves over to companies like Job #2 that have better pay and benefits later in your career, but if you stagnate in Job #2, you can't leap over promotion levels at Job #1 -- you'd have to try to get in an Job #1 on the lower level, and they won't perceive you as a great candidate straight out of school but as a water-treader who hasn't been progressing for the past 5 years.
posted by jacquilynne at 8:57 AM on July 25, 2019 [1 favorite]
Job #1 and work on getting them to increase the pay. They probably cannot do much on the benefit side (get you better insurance, give more to 401k, etc because all employees get the same usually).
If they cannot come up at all, I would still take Job #1 because money isn't everything and so much can change in a few short years. So much better to be in the right industry with opportunities.
posted by maxg94 at 9:07 AM on July 25, 2019 [1 favorite]
If they cannot come up at all, I would still take Job #1 because money isn't everything and so much can change in a few short years. So much better to be in the right industry with opportunities.
posted by maxg94 at 9:07 AM on July 25, 2019 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: Pay offer is firm from Job #1. Unfortunately an increase is not possible. They know about the offer from Job #2.
posted by socks_for_all at 9:11 AM on July 25, 2019
posted by socks_for_all at 9:11 AM on July 25, 2019
Still Job #1 unless the amazing benefits at Job #2 are things you will definitely use imminently and are of very high monetary value.
posted by jacquilynne at 9:40 AM on July 25, 2019
posted by jacquilynne at 9:40 AM on July 25, 2019
I'm firmly in Job #2 camp. Pay off those debts earlier! Get a jump start on a good 401k! Compound interest is amazing.
Also, leveraging your actual salary later for a job in industry of Job #1 is easier than leveraging just a job offer.
And better hours and benefits? Definitely job #2.
posted by Grither at 9:42 AM on July 25, 2019 [18 favorites]
Also, leveraging your actual salary later for a job in industry of Job #1 is easier than leveraging just a job offer.
And better hours and benefits? Definitely job #2.
posted by Grither at 9:42 AM on July 25, 2019 [18 favorites]
You are early in your career. You need to take Job #2. This is doubly-true if you are a woman, but it applies to everyone.
Taking less money compounds future job and income prospects forever. A nice title and a theoretical (not guaranteed) trajectory doesn't equal money. The more money you make now, the more you will make in the future, at another job like Job #1. Your industry moves in cycles right now but there is no promise of how it will operate in 3-4 years' time, no workplace can offer that guarantee.
Well defined shorter hours, more money, and lower-pressure projects mean that you will have the freedom to live a life outside of work that you would not be able to attain with Job #1. That could mean volunteering, paying off more debt, enjoying your evening and weekends without the constant pressure of what's waiting for you back at work, security over your health and welfare and not skipping preventative doctor's visits, etc.
There is no telling what your future holds with a job at either company. No one gives a shit about promises of career progression within a company, that is a fake benefit with no guarantee ever if they want to keep you in that progression or if you even want to stay. "Work extremely hard for below market value in exchange for us maybe giving you a career path to work towards one day" is a piss-poor comp for money, defined hours, and benefits and exploits young workers.
posted by juniperesque at 9:43 AM on July 25, 2019 [31 favorites]
Taking less money compounds future job and income prospects forever. A nice title and a theoretical (not guaranteed) trajectory doesn't equal money. The more money you make now, the more you will make in the future, at another job like Job #1. Your industry moves in cycles right now but there is no promise of how it will operate in 3-4 years' time, no workplace can offer that guarantee.
Well defined shorter hours, more money, and lower-pressure projects mean that you will have the freedom to live a life outside of work that you would not be able to attain with Job #1. That could mean volunteering, paying off more debt, enjoying your evening and weekends without the constant pressure of what's waiting for you back at work, security over your health and welfare and not skipping preventative doctor's visits, etc.
There is no telling what your future holds with a job at either company. No one gives a shit about promises of career progression within a company, that is a fake benefit with no guarantee ever if they want to keep you in that progression or if you even want to stay. "Work extremely hard for below market value in exchange for us maybe giving you a career path to work towards one day" is a piss-poor comp for money, defined hours, and benefits and exploits young workers.
posted by juniperesque at 9:43 AM on July 25, 2019 [31 favorites]
Speaking as someone with longer hours/less pay/worse benefits, I would love to have Job #2. My career trajectory isn't hobbled by lack of experience, it's hobbled by burnout. I'm so exhausted and overwhelmed with deadlines that I can't effectively job hunt, and feel so trapped and demoralized I can't envision myself anywhere better. (I suspect a lot of employers do this on purpose to keep their employees compliant.)
Plus the opportunity to pay off debt quickly and build your Oh Shit/Fuck Off Fund is absolutely priceless.
posted by Orange Dinosaur Slide at 10:02 AM on July 25, 2019 [6 favorites]
Plus the opportunity to pay off debt quickly and build your Oh Shit/Fuck Off Fund is absolutely priceless.
posted by Orange Dinosaur Slide at 10:02 AM on July 25, 2019 [6 favorites]
Yup - I'm in Job 2 camp as well.
Better pay, better benefits. In my experience, eventually, work always comes down to money or benefits/quality of life. Job 2 has both...
posted by sedimentary_deer at 10:37 AM on July 25, 2019 [2 favorites]
Better pay, better benefits. In my experience, eventually, work always comes down to money or benefits/quality of life. Job 2 has both...
posted by sedimentary_deer at 10:37 AM on July 25, 2019 [2 favorites]
I did this 10 years ago, I went for job 2. I regret it. I do have a good cushion of savings and I did pay off debt but all those salary accruals meant I'd priced myself out of my preferred industry for good.
Maybe if I'd have taken Job 1 I would regret it for different reasons but currently I wish I'd been able to pay my dues in that industry when I could afford to earn less, because if I had I would now be in line for the jobs I really want. They still pay less than my current track but not so much and there is greater parity with senior roles at the next stage. I also would have had a much more interesting and varied career.
Caveat 1: If taking Job 1 means you can't eat or clothe and house yourself then absolutely do not take it, but you are early stage career and it's affordable now there's much less risk. You can always jump to a job 2 if it doesn't work out.
Caveat 2: I am in the UK so health benefits were not a consideration. This may have greater weighting for you.
posted by socksister at 10:38 AM on July 25, 2019 [1 favorite]
Maybe if I'd have taken Job 1 I would regret it for different reasons but currently I wish I'd been able to pay my dues in that industry when I could afford to earn less, because if I had I would now be in line for the jobs I really want. They still pay less than my current track but not so much and there is greater parity with senior roles at the next stage. I also would have had a much more interesting and varied career.
Caveat 1: If taking Job 1 means you can't eat or clothe and house yourself then absolutely do not take it, but you are early stage career and it's affordable now there's much less risk. You can always jump to a job 2 if it doesn't work out.
Caveat 2: I am in the UK so health benefits were not a consideration. This may have greater weighting for you.
posted by socksister at 10:38 AM on July 25, 2019 [1 favorite]
I'd take job 2 and use some of the time I'd save by having pleasant normal work hours to do something that would help me get more competitive for a better paying preferred-industry job in the future. Classes, personal projects, volunteering, whatever. But I had to go through a high pressure job early on to learn that for me, work-life balance is maybe the single most important aspect of a job. That's not true for everyone, of course, YMMV. But there's a lot to be said for knocking out your debts quickly and buying yourself freedom to make different choices later.
posted by Stacey at 10:53 AM on July 25, 2019 [2 favorites]
posted by Stacey at 10:53 AM on July 25, 2019 [2 favorites]
How is your retirement savings? This early in your career, I would take Job 2, have a life, put a huge chunk into your 401(k) to take advantage of compound interest at your (presumably) young age, and worry about the nuts and bolts of career progression as you get further along and have more experiences and contacts. Full disclosure, I speak as someone who’s been in my high-paying field for 20 years, looking at retirement in ~15 years, and having to put a quarter to a third of my salary towards retirement funding. I would also suggest building up an emergency fund equal to six months living expenses, especially if your field is cyclical or in any way volatile.
The answers you are going to get are going to break out 50-50, and to be highly influenced by the experiences of the responders. As for yourself, you should probably make a pros and cons spreadsheet, be informed by anything you see in this thread that resonates with you, but not take it as gospel . As for yourself, you should probably make a pros and cons grid, be informed by anything you see in this thread that resonates with you, but not take it as gospel.
posted by matildaben at 10:56 AM on July 25, 2019 [1 favorite]
The answers you are going to get are going to break out 50-50, and to be highly influenced by the experiences of the responders. As for yourself, you should probably make a pros and cons spreadsheet, be informed by anything you see in this thread that resonates with you, but not take it as gospel . As for yourself, you should probably make a pros and cons grid, be informed by anything you see in this thread that resonates with you, but not take it as gospel.
posted by matildaben at 10:56 AM on July 25, 2019 [1 favorite]
If you have young kids or other people you have to take care of in life, I'd say Job #2 sounds like a better option. But if you have the time to spend at work, I think Job #1 puts you on a better path because the work is interesting and it puts you on the path you want to be on. This is assuming Job #1 has basic benefits, even if they aren't as good, and that you can live on the salary. You can always leave that job after a year or two and look for something like Job #2, but you might be closing a door to your preferred industry if you take the better-paying job. Also, you mentioned volunteering in the industry. I'm not sure it's a good idea to volunteer in your preferred industry as a job path and as a professional. Also, that volunteering kicks up the amount of time you are working, so your hours would be longer anyway.
posted by bluedaisy at 11:02 AM on July 25, 2019 [2 favorites]
posted by bluedaisy at 11:02 AM on July 25, 2019 [2 favorites]
Job #2 not because of the money but for the sensible working hours. Also I would not rely on GlassDoor reviews any more than I would TripAdvisor, which is to say not very much.
posted by Lanark at 1:06 PM on July 25, 2019 [1 favorite]
posted by Lanark at 1:06 PM on July 25, 2019 [1 favorite]
I am coming here as An Old(tm) to tell you: take Job 2.
Short answer: Money can't buy happiness but lack of sufficient money sure buys misery. You have lots of debt. That debt will be a much more serious drain on your life satisfaction than "working in a nice job that isn't exactly the industry I wanted to work in." (Source: I've had debt and a cool job that didn't pay much. The cool job did not make up for the daily financial stress.) Careers are long and they meander; you will have plenty of chances to have plenty of cool jobs (though your definition of that may change.) Take the job that will let you have a life, not the one that will become your life.
Long answer:
Day by day, the biggest things that have made a difference to my life satisfaction have been the things that happen a lot. (This is a scientifically validated phenomenon btw). Excitement about a promotion gives you less increase to your happiness over a year than being happy every day that you get to stop work at a reasonable hour, go home, and not check your email until the next morning. A job with long, intense hours, low pay, and meh benefits that's in an intense/interesting field says to me: "we hire new employees for as little as we can and suck them dry, and when they finally leave it doesn't matter because people are lining up to work here because we're cool." In fact, many of these places deliberately recruit passionate, high-achieving people that they can get to work themselves to the bone for below their real value because the job is seen as desirable, regardless of whether it actually is in the cold light of day. (Google "insecure overachiever" to find an article from HBR about a related phenomenon.)
(This might not be what Job 1 is like. But a LOT of places that fit those parameters ARE like that and will use our modern "follow your passion!!11" memes against you.)
I used to be a management consultant, and in that field we were promised a clear career path with frequent promotions possible. But in fact that was far from assured, to the point where there was a joke among the people at the consultant/senior consultant level was "What's the best way to make manager? Go work at [competing firm] for a year." People regularly jumped between firms every 2-4 years for promotions, and when they did so they would usually come in at a higher salary than they would have if they'd promoted from within.
Also statistically most people don't spend their whole careers in one company, they bounce back and forth like this quite frequently.
Also, in my experience, most people don't end up doing exactly what they envisioned when they were first starting out, and the first job you have in a field is rarely a golden ticket to the future in that field. When I am assessing job candidates for mid-level roles, probably 80% of the key points I use to score that resume is the most recent position, probably another 10% the one right before that, and everything else in the job history is just the last 10%. Seeing that someone went to an impressive school or worked at a big-name place or had a really cool job will make me go, "huh, cool" but what's going to sell me on you as a candidate is a trajectory of growth and a demonstration of results that tell me you have the skills I need, coupled with good references from people who know your work.
Here's what I would do in your place:
Accept Job 2. Commit (to yourself, not to them) that you'll stay there for the next "cycle" of your preferred industry. You are giving yourself permission to leave after that if you want to.
Be awesome at Job 2. Exceed expectations. Make sure that Job 2 loves you and wants to keep you but would give you a great reference if you left. (Read the Ask a Manager archives for tips on being awesome at work.)
During the next 3-4 years, use the shorter, regular working hours and extra money (and the resulting mental space and lack of stress) as a launchpad to doing things that will help you progress toward your goals:
-If possible, live off the amount you'd have made at Job 1 and put the rest to debt/savings. (Note: it's a lot better to know you can't live of $Job1Salary when you don't HAVE to.)
-Pay off your debt
-Establish and max out (if possible) retirement contributions
-Build up a generous emergency fund, keep in a high interest savings account (online banks usually have the best ones)
-Use the super awesome benefits to get your health in order. Do you have chronic conditions that need a regimen tweak? A weird knee that you really probably should get looked at? Cavities to fill? Expensive dental work? Is that old crown on its last legs?
-Do you need/have a car? Get your car repaired/buy a car and pay it off. Save up a "car repairs" fund.
-Where do you live? Is that where you want to keep living? Save up home repair/furnishings/maintenance/deposit/moving money.
-If you need to purchase durable goods, get high quality ones that will last a long time and learn how they need to be maintained so they will last. Buy your furniture/kitchen appliances/clothing/hobby equipment for longevity and value so it can last if you later move to a job where you make less money.
-Are there trainings/volunteer work/enrichment opportunities that are relevant to the work in $DesiredIndustry that would help you keep your hand in/learn useful stuff/support a cause you value? Good news, you have a regular, reasonable schedule and extra cash, which means you will have the time and money to participate in these things!
-Do you have hobbies, pets, friends, family members, a religion, or other non-work things that are important to you? Good news! You will have time to spend with them, money to do things with or for them, and you won't be too stressed and burned out to socialize/create art/play with your dog/volunteer/ETC.
So then when you come up on the end of your Cycle of Employment At Job 2, you can take a look at your life and see where you fall.
-If you actually are really happy and love working at Job 2, you don't have to leave!
-If you love working at Job 2 but are ready to advance, you can begin a job search for another job with a similar work/life/benefits balance but at a higher level and/or you can talk to your mentors at Job 2 about potential advancement paths within that company and how likely they are to happen for you/what you'd need to qualify.
-If you still really desperately want to work in $DesiredIndustry, you now have some solid job experience and a high previous salary to use to make it easier to get in there, and bonus, you have a healthy (or at least well-maintained) body, paid-off bills, a retirement nest egg started, savings for emergencies, functional, well-repaired housing and transport, and outside-of-work personal fulfillment to make it easier to deal with the hours and low pay.
posted by oblique red at 3:10 PM on July 25, 2019 [13 favorites]
Short answer: Money can't buy happiness but lack of sufficient money sure buys misery. You have lots of debt. That debt will be a much more serious drain on your life satisfaction than "working in a nice job that isn't exactly the industry I wanted to work in." (Source: I've had debt and a cool job that didn't pay much. The cool job did not make up for the daily financial stress.) Careers are long and they meander; you will have plenty of chances to have plenty of cool jobs (though your definition of that may change.) Take the job that will let you have a life, not the one that will become your life.
Long answer:
Day by day, the biggest things that have made a difference to my life satisfaction have been the things that happen a lot. (This is a scientifically validated phenomenon btw). Excitement about a promotion gives you less increase to your happiness over a year than being happy every day that you get to stop work at a reasonable hour, go home, and not check your email until the next morning. A job with long, intense hours, low pay, and meh benefits that's in an intense/interesting field says to me: "we hire new employees for as little as we can and suck them dry, and when they finally leave it doesn't matter because people are lining up to work here because we're cool." In fact, many of these places deliberately recruit passionate, high-achieving people that they can get to work themselves to the bone for below their real value because the job is seen as desirable, regardless of whether it actually is in the cold light of day. (Google "insecure overachiever" to find an article from HBR about a related phenomenon.)
(This might not be what Job 1 is like. But a LOT of places that fit those parameters ARE like that and will use our modern "follow your passion!!11" memes against you.)
I used to be a management consultant, and in that field we were promised a clear career path with frequent promotions possible. But in fact that was far from assured, to the point where there was a joke among the people at the consultant/senior consultant level was "What's the best way to make manager? Go work at [competing firm] for a year." People regularly jumped between firms every 2-4 years for promotions, and when they did so they would usually come in at a higher salary than they would have if they'd promoted from within.
Also statistically most people don't spend their whole careers in one company, they bounce back and forth like this quite frequently.
Also, in my experience, most people don't end up doing exactly what they envisioned when they were first starting out, and the first job you have in a field is rarely a golden ticket to the future in that field. When I am assessing job candidates for mid-level roles, probably 80% of the key points I use to score that resume is the most recent position, probably another 10% the one right before that, and everything else in the job history is just the last 10%. Seeing that someone went to an impressive school or worked at a big-name place or had a really cool job will make me go, "huh, cool" but what's going to sell me on you as a candidate is a trajectory of growth and a demonstration of results that tell me you have the skills I need, coupled with good references from people who know your work.
Here's what I would do in your place:
Accept Job 2. Commit (to yourself, not to them) that you'll stay there for the next "cycle" of your preferred industry. You are giving yourself permission to leave after that if you want to.
Be awesome at Job 2. Exceed expectations. Make sure that Job 2 loves you and wants to keep you but would give you a great reference if you left. (Read the Ask a Manager archives for tips on being awesome at work.)
During the next 3-4 years, use the shorter, regular working hours and extra money (and the resulting mental space and lack of stress) as a launchpad to doing things that will help you progress toward your goals:
-If possible, live off the amount you'd have made at Job 1 and put the rest to debt/savings. (Note: it's a lot better to know you can't live of $Job1Salary when you don't HAVE to.)
-Pay off your debt
-Establish and max out (if possible) retirement contributions
-Build up a generous emergency fund, keep in a high interest savings account (online banks usually have the best ones)
-Use the super awesome benefits to get your health in order. Do you have chronic conditions that need a regimen tweak? A weird knee that you really probably should get looked at? Cavities to fill? Expensive dental work? Is that old crown on its last legs?
-Do you need/have a car? Get your car repaired/buy a car and pay it off. Save up a "car repairs" fund.
-Where do you live? Is that where you want to keep living? Save up home repair/furnishings/maintenance/deposit/moving money.
-If you need to purchase durable goods, get high quality ones that will last a long time and learn how they need to be maintained so they will last. Buy your furniture/kitchen appliances/clothing/hobby equipment for longevity and value so it can last if you later move to a job where you make less money.
-Are there trainings/volunteer work/enrichment opportunities that are relevant to the work in $DesiredIndustry that would help you keep your hand in/learn useful stuff/support a cause you value? Good news, you have a regular, reasonable schedule and extra cash, which means you will have the time and money to participate in these things!
-Do you have hobbies, pets, friends, family members, a religion, or other non-work things that are important to you? Good news! You will have time to spend with them, money to do things with or for them, and you won't be too stressed and burned out to socialize/create art/play with your dog/volunteer/ETC.
So then when you come up on the end of your Cycle of Employment At Job 2, you can take a look at your life and see where you fall.
-If you actually are really happy and love working at Job 2, you don't have to leave!
-If you love working at Job 2 but are ready to advance, you can begin a job search for another job with a similar work/life/benefits balance but at a higher level and/or you can talk to your mentors at Job 2 about potential advancement paths within that company and how likely they are to happen for you/what you'd need to qualify.
-If you still really desperately want to work in $DesiredIndustry, you now have some solid job experience and a high previous salary to use to make it easier to get in there, and bonus, you have a healthy (or at least well-maintained) body, paid-off bills, a retirement nest egg started, savings for emergencies, functional, well-repaired housing and transport, and outside-of-work personal fulfillment to make it easier to deal with the hours and low pay.
posted by oblique red at 3:10 PM on July 25, 2019 [13 favorites]
For your first professional job, absolutely job #2, no question. It is incredibly unlikely that you actually know what will make you happy in your career at this point, and my guess is that company #2 is reputationally very solid if they pay well, have good benefits, and people like the culture. You may dislike job #2 over time, but it sets you up with a salary floor that will be useful in all future negotiations at other companies. Go there, save money, learn more about yourself and what you like and dislike at work, and set yourself up for a more lucrative future.
posted by ch1x0r at 5:15 PM on July 25, 2019 [7 favorites]
posted by ch1x0r at 5:15 PM on July 25, 2019 [7 favorites]
-If possible, live off the amount you'd have made at Job 1 and put the rest to debt/savings. (Note: it's a lot better to know you can't live of $Job1Salary when you don't HAVE to.)
This is key part of your promise to re-evaluate your dream career next cycle - you don't want to create golden handcuffs that keep you from taking the work you want because you've thoughtlessly committed to more expensive lifestyle. Figure out the budget you would need in Job 1 (including a modest amount for debt repayment and retirement and live within that budget, setting aside the extra income accelerate your financial freedom (probably more debt reduction and retirement savings)
Also, if Job 1 is cyclical, I would worry whether you would still have a job at all in the middle of the down cycle, especially if you are going into an entry level position.
posted by metahawk at 12:28 PM on July 26, 2019
This is key part of your promise to re-evaluate your dream career next cycle - you don't want to create golden handcuffs that keep you from taking the work you want because you've thoughtlessly committed to more expensive lifestyle. Figure out the budget you would need in Job 1 (including a modest amount for debt repayment and retirement and live within that budget, setting aside the extra income accelerate your financial freedom (probably more debt reduction and retirement savings)
Also, if Job 1 is cyclical, I would worry whether you would still have a job at all in the middle of the down cycle, especially if you are going into an entry level position.
posted by metahawk at 12:28 PM on July 26, 2019
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by sixswitch at 8:52 AM on July 25, 2019 [3 favorites]