North Carolina speeding ticket

April 17, 2019 1:28 AM

I live in North Carolina and received my first speeding ticket today (caught in a speed trap, I realized too late three state troopers were pulling people over). What should I do?

He says I was doing 51 in a 35 which I probably was, I was not paying close attentions. And I couldn’t plead ignorance of the speed limit as I was just a couple miles from home. My fine is 240 which I will pay if I have to, but it seems like internet advice is to go to the court date and try and get the charge lowered? I’d rather have Mefite advice than random google advice. I am more worried about my insurance rates than the fine? I am kind of in a dither, any advice on NC speeding tickets?

posted by anonymous to Law & Government (18 answers total)

Every ticket I have received, I have gone to court and made a deal with the DA. Mostly they will allow you to plead to a charge that carries no points but has a hefty fine. The points are the key to the insurance rates. If that is the random internet advice you found, I agree with it.

My experience is 2 in NYS and 1 in VA. YMMV. The only thing you have to lose by showing up is your time.
posted by AugustWest at 2:24 AM on April 17, 2019 [2 favorites]

I have had my share of speeding tickets in NC. Hire a lawyer out of all of the letters that are going to come your way. They’ll plead it down and you’ll be fine.
posted by sara is disenchanted at 2:33 AM on April 17, 2019 [7 favorites]

Call your insurance company, ask them what the potential increase in your insurance rate would be. If it's zero, consider yourself lucky, pay the ticket and move on.

If it's more than zero consider carefully whether the money-per-hour you'll lose taking off work to go to court plus the money you might pay to a personal attorney plus whatever other unknown expenses will pop up will still add up to less than that bump in insurance rates.
posted by bendy at 2:33 AM on April 17, 2019 [5 favorites]

You may not want to use it, I never have, but North Carolina has this funny little bit of law called Prayer for Judgement. I've only ever heard people talk about it, and I'm pretty sure you have to actually show up in court to use it, but as far as I can tell it's a twice every five years Get Out of Jail Free card. I have no idea if your insurance rates are affected.

I would definitely google more about it than that wikipedia page if you want to do it, but I just wanted you to know that's a thing.
posted by Jenny'sCricket at 3:20 AM on April 17, 2019 [2 favorites]

The last time I got a ticket, a friend of mine, who also happened to do duty as a traffic court judge, explained to me that all the authorities care about is getting the income. So, just make a deal to plead to a different charge (it's usually something like "public nuisance"), pay a fine, and leave your insurer in the dark.

Here's the thing about your insurer upping your rates after a traffic violation...It will probably never go down after that, no matter how much time passes.
posted by Thorzdad at 3:43 AM on April 17, 2019 [1 favorite]

North Carolina speeding ticket haver here. I agree with bendy. Talk to your insurance company first. If you go to court, even if the charge is lowered, you still have to pay court fees, which are around $200, IIRC. The actual "speeding" portion of your fine is probably only like $50. If you do go to court, dress up. The prosecutor actually thanked me for wearing a jacket and tie when most people there were wearing sweatshirts and jeans. Not sure if that is what inspired him to lower my charge, but it didn't hurt.
posted by Rock Steady at 3:55 AM on April 17, 2019 [3 favorites]

North Carolina traffic law is idiosyncratic. Advice based on experience in other states is harmful. Pick a lawyer that practices in the county where the ticket was issued. Plead "Equipment malfunction". Pay the lawyer.

That's all there is to it. Your problem has been effectively resolved by cash.

Prayer for Judgement also works but is less optimal (relative to "Equipment malfunction") because it can only be used once every three years*; if your entire household's driving record is not squeaky-clean in that time, the fines and points you receive will be unavoidable. Do not go to court, you will only waste time and be in the way. The lawyer will attend on your behalf. You will receive a letter later with the result of the court date. You don't have to talk to insurance, unless you were also in an accident. *(State law allows two Prayers for Judgement every five years but insurers only recognize one every three years. A brief explainer about PfJ.)

(This bit of North Carolina law is horrible civic policy for a number of reasons but since that how the system currently works, that is how you use it.)
posted by ardgedee at 4:08 AM on April 17, 2019 [6 favorites]

Both times I’ve gone to court for tickets (NJ and PA), they automatically lowered the offense for everyone except NJ drivers with cell phone use tickets.

The PA one changed it to an equipment violation instead of a moving violation, but for the same fine. When I called to schedule my PA court date, they asked for dates I wasn’t available because they like to schedule everyone for one officer on a particular date.

The NJ one I actually wanted to plead not guilty because I was innocent. It was a mis-judge of the state trooper on traffic conditions (it wasn’t speeding). But I would have had to come back to court a second day, so I chose to just plead down. The standard deal they gave to everyone was one lower offense, which in my case was half the fee.
posted by DoubleLune at 4:09 AM on April 17, 2019

Adding belatedly: You probably expect that, if you plead "equipment malfunction" there would be a demand by the court for material proof, but in reality this is unlikely to happen unless you were cited for something more severe than 15mph over the speed limit.. The county really does only want your money, and the added time involved in investigating your case interferes with processing more traffic tickets.
posted by ardgedee at 5:05 AM on April 17, 2019 [1 favorite]

Live in NC and got a ticket two years ago on my way back from Toronto. Drove to Toronto and almost back without a problem. So close. Anyway...

Talk to your insurance agent, but I saw no difference in my insurance premium based on a single ticket. There may be variables at play, though, depending on your age, other history with your insurer, and such like that. I was late 40s, been with the same insurance company since the 80s, and haven't had an accident since I was 20.

There didn't seem to be any real benefit to getting a lawyer or trying to knock the ticket down to a different (non-point) offense - I'd probably have spent more money on the lawyer than the ticket, and it didn't hurt my insurance. So I paid it, and I believe any points should drop off my license within the next 12 months. (I think it's 3 years in NC.)

If you go to court you may be able to get the fine lowered or something if it's your first offense, but it probably depends on the judge. You say it was a state trooper, so that leads me to believe this isn't going to land you in front of a small town judge where ticket revenue is a big part of their income.
posted by jzb at 5:20 AM on April 17, 2019

Note also that according to ardgedee's link, prayer for judgement isn't an option in this case, since the OP was speeding by (barely) more than 15 mph.
posted by Johnny Assay at 6:59 AM on April 17, 2019

If you can afford it, the best thing to do it to get a lawyer. This will not save you money (it will probably cost you more), but it will probably make the ticket go away entirely — no points, no fine, no blot on your record. They will probably go for deferred adjudication (or whatever they call it in NC), which means all is forgiven as long as you don't do it again within the next year or so. The lawyer should be able to tell you what it will cost and what your results will be at your first meeting. It is unlikely that you will be required to do anything more.

If you can't afford it, follow the other advice here and show up, respectful and nicely dressed, at the time set for your court appearance. Most DA's will be happy to reduce your crime to the next one down the list just to save the time and trouble of going to court (which you don't want either, but they can't be sure of that). This will certainly reduce and may eliminate points. It probably won't save money, but it won't cost you any more.

Between us, my son and I have gotten lots of tickets. This strategy has always worked for us.
posted by ubiquity at 7:23 AM on April 17, 2019 [1 favorite]

North Carolina laws are a bit funny both in letter and practice. Please do not take advice from people who are speaking generally or from experience in other states. The options, expense, and ramifications are not comparable. Also, the situation is quite different if you are a resident of North Carolina rather than just passing through.

(As a non-resident of North Carolina, it made the most sense for me to just pay my speeding ticket, because my state does not have a reciprocal agreement to share traffic violation information of this type. No points filed, my insurance isn't notified. That would be TERRIBLE BAD advice if I lived in North Carolina that would seriously mar my driving record for no good reason, per the way their system works.)
posted by desuetude at 8:50 AM on April 17, 2019

Mod note: A few comments deleted. OP, I'm officially telling you that a bunch of people advise you should pay the ticket and drive at the speed limit for safety. Commenters, please consider that answer given now.
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 8:56 AM on April 17, 2019 [2 favorites]

I am a resident of North Carolina and my neighbor has successfully pled the Prayer for Judgment at least once.
posted by bookdragoness at 1:27 PM on April 17, 2019

I wouldn't be surprised to hear that you were driving through my town.

Do NOT call your insurance company about this. Just used one of the scores of lawyers that sent mail within the first few days after a 56-in-a-35-zone ticket. Paid the lawyer $99 and the court $100 after the charge was reduced to "Improper Equipment". Did not have to appear in person or see the lawyer in person. "The North Carolina statute for Improper Equipment states that no driver's license points, insurance points, or premium surcharge shall be assessed on or imputed to any party on account of a violation of this section".
posted by DanSachs at 4:59 PM on April 17, 2019 [1 favorite]

I am board certified as a specialist in criminal law by the North Carolina State Bar. I have been practicing in North Carolina for 21 years. If you plead guilty to this offense, your insurance rates should go up 30 percent for the next three years.

I don't know what county your ticket was in. If you memail me or say what the county is on here, I might be able to tell you how that specific county likes to handle tickets like this.

Most counties will reduce a charge like that to improper equipment. Improper equipment is not a moving violation, so you will not get any points against your driver's license or your insurance. Some counties will do that outright for a person who comes in to represent herself. Some counties will do that outright for people who are represented by an attorney, but not for people who represent themselves. Some counties will make you go to driving school to get the charge reduced to improper equipment. It depends on the policy of the district attorney's office in that particular county. I will say that most counties will reduce it to improper equipment for a person who is unrepresented. The cost for improper equipment is 188 dollars for the court cost, 50 dollars for the mandatory state assessment for improper equipment, and -- in some counties -- a 25 dollar fine from the judge. In my district, there is the 25 dollar fine so improper equipment costs 263 dollars. In the neighboring district to mine, it is 238 dollars as there is no fine from the judge. In my county, the district attorney will only offer to reduce your charge to improper equipment if you have not had another ticket reduced to improper equipment in the past three years. They don't actually look up your driving history. They have you sign an affidavit stating that you have not had an improper equipment in the past three years.

Another way to resolve your case is through a prayer for judgment continued. This is not some sort of automatic card you get to play. It is something you ask the judge for. The judge will ask if you are asking for any further relief when you are pleading guilty (16 miles per hour over the speed limit is a Class 3 misdemeanor and 15 miles per hour or less over the speed limit is an infraction -- the proper way to plead to a misdemeanor is "guilty"and the proper way to plead to an infraction is "responsible"). You then ask the judge to consider continuing judgment in the matter. If the judge gives you a prayer for judgment continued (PJC), then you will owe 188 or 190 dollars, depending if it was reduced to less than 16 over before you enter your plea. 188 is the cost for an infraction, while 190 is the cost for a misdemeanor. No matter how you resolve your case, you will have to pay an additional 20 dollars (they call this an "installment fee") if you do not pay your court costs that same day.

Your insurance company will not count a PJC as a conviction. They will let you do this one time per insurance policy in a three year period. If anyone on your policy has had a PJC in the past three years, then your insurance company will treat it as a conviction regardless of whether a judge gives you a PJC or not. You can get an unlimited amount of PJCs if a judge will give them to you. However, your insurance company will only acknowledge one per policy in a three year period (I have had clients break up their insurance policy into two policies so that both the husband and the wife are able to benefit from a PJC). Likewise, the North Carolina DMV will only recognize two PJCs within a five year period. If you were to get a third, they will ignore it and treat it like a conviction.

So a PJC is typically 50-75 dollar savings, but does have the potential to restrict possible dispositions for you or other people on your insurance policy for the next three years. An improper equipment costs more but does not have the potential to affect future possible dispositions. The link above about not being able to get a PJC for speeds over 15 miles per hour over the speed limit is wrong. North Carolina General Statute 20-141(p) states: "A driver charged with speeding in excess of 25 miles per hour over the posted speed limit shall be ineligible for a disposition of prayer for judgment continued."

Again, I am glad to give you more information if you say what county your ticket was in or Memail me.
posted by flarbuse at 10:15 PM on April 19, 2019 [2 favorites]

Mod note: From the OP:

OK so, update:

I went online to pay my ticket and there was an option to request a reduction in charges. Apparently this is a fairly recent option in NC, to process things faster and have fewer people in court. I pressed the button and and a couple days later received an email that my charge was reduced to improper equipment. I have to pay a slightly higher fine but it shouldn't affect my insurance. I have never had a speeding ticket in over 20 years of driving, so that may have helped my cause. Also note I was not in a residential area, but on a four lane road of strip malls where the speed limit drops from 45 to 35. Anyway, just wanted to let people know that this was an option--much easier than trying to pick a lawyer, go to court, figure out the prayer for judgment thing, etc. And thanks for all the nice people who replied when I was really upset and anxious!

posted by restless_nomad (staff) at 11:49 AM on April 29, 2019 [1 favorite]