Chicken soup, using raw chicken trimmings?
January 25, 2019 10:20 PM Subscribe
Soup experts: help me decide whether and how to use raw chicken scraps in the broth for homemade soup.
I make chicken soup from (mostly) scratch a few times a year. I start the broth by slowly boiling the leftover carcass of a grocery store rotisserie chicken or two with various vegetable ends & skins, then straining out the solids. For the soup meat, I dice chicken thighs after trimming off their fat & stringy connective tissues.
It occurred to me that maybe I could use those trimmings in the broth phase, but I'm not sure whether that's a good idea or how I'd make the best use of them. Could they be added to the already-cooked carcass and veg mix? Should they be cooked separately in some way first? I don't want my pursuit of flavor and frugality to make things too much more complicated, or to make anyone sick.
I make chicken soup from (mostly) scratch a few times a year. I start the broth by slowly boiling the leftover carcass of a grocery store rotisserie chicken or two with various vegetable ends & skins, then straining out the solids. For the soup meat, I dice chicken thighs after trimming off their fat & stringy connective tissues.
It occurred to me that maybe I could use those trimmings in the broth phase, but I'm not sure whether that's a good idea or how I'd make the best use of them. Could they be added to the already-cooked carcass and veg mix? Should they be cooked separately in some way first? I don't want my pursuit of flavor and frugality to make things too much more complicated, or to make anyone sick.
Yeah, add them in! Consider giving them a quick roast so the fat gets nice and brown for extra flavor.
posted by Grandysaur at 10:39 PM on January 25, 2019 [2 favorites]
posted by Grandysaur at 10:39 PM on January 25, 2019 [2 favorites]
To clarify, the roasting is purely for flavor, not necessary for safety or anything.
posted by Grandysaur at 10:40 PM on January 25, 2019 [4 favorites]
posted by Grandysaur at 10:40 PM on January 25, 2019 [4 favorites]
If you put a bunch of fat into your stock and then boil it vigorously, you will make a cloudy stock with a lot of fat on top once it cools. This is perfectly delicious and fine if that's what you're after - a cloudy stock isn't the absolute best for certain applications that call for a clear broth like say a chicken wonton soup, but it'll still taste great. You can also skim the fat off the top and reserve/freeze that for separate use, it's basically schmaltz and that has a long history of being used by frugal cooks to maximize flavor.
posted by Mizu at 10:41 PM on January 25, 2019 [7 favorites]
posted by Mizu at 10:41 PM on January 25, 2019 [7 favorites]
Clear broth is easy with an egg raft!
posted by rhizome at 12:13 AM on January 26, 2019 [7 favorites]
posted by rhizome at 12:13 AM on January 26, 2019 [7 favorites]
I've done chicken stock from both a whole raw chicken and roasted chicken. I try not to let it boil vigorously, get it up to a boil, then turn down to a simmer, trying to maintain a gentle, plop, plop, plop, but not boiling. Then I let it go for a long time, 3 hours minimum, and sometimes on the lowest setting overnight (you could also do this in a crockpot if you are worried about leaving your stove on at night, I have a glass top electric cooktop so it doesn't bother me).
After it's done, I let it cool, then strain. Then I put it in the fridge, either in one big container or several smaller ones. The fat will rise to to top and solidify, then you can either keep it when you reheat (for extra flavor), or peel the fat off and save it in the freezer, in a baggie or something, for schmaltz.
Mine is often cloudy and fatty, yes, but that is what I am going for because I like the taste. If I want clear broth, I will buy boxed chicken broth (tho' I know about the raft method). I usually freeze in 2-cup or 3-cup plastic containers, and microwave at 30-second increments until thawed, or thawed enough to dump into a pot.
I try not to add too much water, just enough to cover the meaty bits and veg. If you feel it's too watery, you can always reduce it afterward, just don't add salt, or it will be too salty. I might add a small pinch at the beginning, as well as 8-10 peppercorns, a bay leaf or two, and a pinch of dried thyme. I like lots of onion in mine, one large one, 2-3 carrots, and 2 celery stalks, and some parsley is good too, stems and all, if I have it on hand.
Cooking it longer makes it taste better to me, than say, a 1-hour boil, or even 2-3 hours, it's the 6th and beyond hour that makes it yummier to my taste. But yes, as long as you have it on for at least an hour or two, the raw bits will cook up nicely and add more flavor.
posted by Marie Mon Dieu at 3:14 AM on January 26, 2019 [3 favorites]
After it's done, I let it cool, then strain. Then I put it in the fridge, either in one big container or several smaller ones. The fat will rise to to top and solidify, then you can either keep it when you reheat (for extra flavor), or peel the fat off and save it in the freezer, in a baggie or something, for schmaltz.
Mine is often cloudy and fatty, yes, but that is what I am going for because I like the taste. If I want clear broth, I will buy boxed chicken broth (tho' I know about the raft method). I usually freeze in 2-cup or 3-cup plastic containers, and microwave at 30-second increments until thawed, or thawed enough to dump into a pot.
I try not to add too much water, just enough to cover the meaty bits and veg. If you feel it's too watery, you can always reduce it afterward, just don't add salt, or it will be too salty. I might add a small pinch at the beginning, as well as 8-10 peppercorns, a bay leaf or two, and a pinch of dried thyme. I like lots of onion in mine, one large one, 2-3 carrots, and 2 celery stalks, and some parsley is good too, stems and all, if I have it on hand.
Cooking it longer makes it taste better to me, than say, a 1-hour boil, or even 2-3 hours, it's the 6th and beyond hour that makes it yummier to my taste. But yes, as long as you have it on for at least an hour or two, the raw bits will cook up nicely and add more flavor.
posted by Marie Mon Dieu at 3:14 AM on January 26, 2019 [3 favorites]
Cooking it longer makes it taste better to me, than say, a 1-hour boil, or even 2-3 hours, it's the 6th and beyond hour that makes it yummier to my taste.
Yep. That's because after that long you're causing some serious breakdown of the proteins that hold the bones together and starting to get bone minerals dissolving into the broth, giving it some salty notes it wouldn't otherwise have.
posted by flabdablet at 3:51 AM on January 26, 2019 [3 favorites]
Yep. That's because after that long you're causing some serious breakdown of the proteins that hold the bones together and starting to get bone minerals dissolving into the broth, giving it some salty notes it wouldn't otherwise have.
posted by flabdablet at 3:51 AM on January 26, 2019 [3 favorites]
It'll work just fine, and add complexity to the broth, but if you can think of an excuse to brown something before putting it in stock, do it. As Grandysaur suggests, this isn't for food safety but for deliciousness. And it applies to damn near anything from carrot ends to bones - toss it in a ramekin and roast it!
posted by aspersioncast at 7:43 AM on January 26, 2019
posted by aspersioncast at 7:43 AM on January 26, 2019
A quick trick I use to strain homemade broth is to line a colander with several layers of wet-but-not-dripping cheesecloth and then FREEZE it. I pour chilled stock through the colander, and the fat is caught beautifully by the cold cheesecloth, along with assorted other detritus like parsley stems or peppercorns. This also helps reduce cloudiness, but usually doesn't eliminate it entirely. My goal is rarely to achieve a gorgeous, clear consomme, but more likely a chicken noodle soup with veg, so I don't think pristine clarity is that important.
It is helpful, as others have said NOT to boil vigorously, but rather simmer for long periods. If you are also cooking chicken pieces to chop and add to your soup (or for chicken salad, etc.) boiling is guaranteed to toughen the meat. I usually bring bones and scraps to a boil, add chicken pieces and turn down the heat.
And yes, add whatever chicken bits you have around. Fat is a huge flavor vector, and this straining method has enabled me to add all sorts of skin scraps to add flavor, but then strain off the fat easily.
posted by citygirl at 7:48 AM on January 26, 2019 [1 favorite]
It is helpful, as others have said NOT to boil vigorously, but rather simmer for long periods. If you are also cooking chicken pieces to chop and add to your soup (or for chicken salad, etc.) boiling is guaranteed to toughen the meat. I usually bring bones and scraps to a boil, add chicken pieces and turn down the heat.
And yes, add whatever chicken bits you have around. Fat is a huge flavor vector, and this straining method has enabled me to add all sorts of skin scraps to add flavor, but then strain off the fat easily.
posted by citygirl at 7:48 AM on January 26, 2019 [1 favorite]
It will work great. I routinely use a combo of roasted bones and raw scraps in stocks. I tend to prefer the bits that is roasted, but both will work in a pinch. Roasted parts will give you a deeper, richer stock (more of that golden brown color). While I am firmly in the 'your stock pot is not a garbage can' camp, saving things like mushroom stems and trimmings can also amp up the flavor of a broth and unless you're dumping a couple handfuls in there, won't make it taste mushroomy.
We buy whole chickens, typically, and section them off for meals throughout the week. The carcass gets the breastplate removed, back chopped into thirds, and a brief, 10m bath in a 5% brine solution with a sprinkling (I'd say, maybe a teaspoon or two? I eyeball it) of baking soda or a couple of dashes of kansui. This flavors any meat left on the bones a bit, and has the added byproduct of changing the PH of the meat, and allows maillard reactions to occur at lower temperatures (allowing nice brown bits to form more easily). I typically broil the bones at this point, and it might only take 15-20m to have them fully browned.
And, I will say that a pressure cooker reduces the idea simmer time from 6+ hours down to like 2. It's far more energy efficient. But if you're only doing this a few times a year, it may not be worth it just for that.
posted by furnace.heart at 8:05 AM on January 26, 2019
We buy whole chickens, typically, and section them off for meals throughout the week. The carcass gets the breastplate removed, back chopped into thirds, and a brief, 10m bath in a 5% brine solution with a sprinkling (I'd say, maybe a teaspoon or two? I eyeball it) of baking soda or a couple of dashes of kansui. This flavors any meat left on the bones a bit, and has the added byproduct of changing the PH of the meat, and allows maillard reactions to occur at lower temperatures (allowing nice brown bits to form more easily). I typically broil the bones at this point, and it might only take 15-20m to have them fully browned.
And, I will say that a pressure cooker reduces the idea simmer time from 6+ hours down to like 2. It's far more energy efficient. But if you're only doing this a few times a year, it may not be worth it just for that.
posted by furnace.heart at 8:05 AM on January 26, 2019
Response by poster: Great ideas, all! I do boil-then-simmer the carcass slowly for several hours, so I'll aim to do even more of that.
posted by NumberSix at 8:52 AM on January 26, 2019
posted by NumberSix at 8:52 AM on January 26, 2019
I use a combination of raw and cooked meat/bone in my stocks all the time, and simmer them for about 8 hours. (I wrap and bag small amounts of raw trimmings and store them in the freezer until I'm ready to make the stock.)
posted by desuetude at 5:59 PM on January 26, 2019
posted by desuetude at 5:59 PM on January 26, 2019
I have yet to find a kind of chicken that doesn't work in stock. I even save the picked-over Costco roasted chickens, and the stock made with them seems to be the best of all. Go figure.
As for schmaltz, in a moment of frugality I tried adding it to my usual dumpling recipe and it was really good. Probably super healthy, too...
posted by Gilgamesh's Chauffeur at 7:46 PM on January 26, 2019
As for schmaltz, in a moment of frugality I tried adding it to my usual dumpling recipe and it was really good. Probably super healthy, too...
posted by Gilgamesh's Chauffeur at 7:46 PM on January 26, 2019
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posted by Jon_Evil at 10:32 PM on January 25, 2019 [14 favorites]