Dangerous passing
February 14, 2006 10:42 AM Subscribe
Why do people speed up when I pass them?
The classic example: I am behind someone doing 55-57 mph for miles. I signal and move into the passing lane, going around them at 65 mph. I go to move back into the lane ahead of them, check my mirror, and they're right there blocking me, roaring along at 65 mph. I almost always have to sharply step on the gas to get around them. About 60 seconds after I pass them, they are back to their old 55-57 mph speed.
What I'd like to know is has someone been in the same car with a driver who's done this and inquired why they did what they did? Or has a formal study been done on this?
Some observations:
(1) People seem to "speed up" only when it's a two-lane road. I don't notice this phenomenon at all on the Interstates.
(2) I would estimate that where I live, about 40-60% of people speed up when I pass them on a two-lane road. This incidence is too high to be ascribed to aggressive driving (and if that was truly the case, at least somebody would jockey with me to not let me in, which has never happened).
Any thoughts here?
The classic example: I am behind someone doing 55-57 mph for miles. I signal and move into the passing lane, going around them at 65 mph. I go to move back into the lane ahead of them, check my mirror, and they're right there blocking me, roaring along at 65 mph. I almost always have to sharply step on the gas to get around them. About 60 seconds after I pass them, they are back to their old 55-57 mph speed.
What I'd like to know is has someone been in the same car with a driver who's done this and inquired why they did what they did? Or has a formal study been done on this?
Some observations:
(1) People seem to "speed up" only when it's a two-lane road. I don't notice this phenomenon at all on the Interstates.
(2) I would estimate that where I live, about 40-60% of people speed up when I pass them on a two-lane road. This incidence is too high to be ascribed to aggressive driving (and if that was truly the case, at least somebody would jockey with me to not let me in, which has never happened).
Any thoughts here?
They zone out, start going slow. You passing them "wakes them up," they realize they are driving slower than they would "like," and speed up.
posted by deadfather at 10:45 AM on February 14, 2006
posted by deadfather at 10:45 AM on February 14, 2006
There are plenty of drivers on the road who want to be in front. They don't necessarily want to drive faster than you, but they want to be in front. It's that simple. There's no magic answer, no rationalization that's going to explain it. They just want to be in front.
posted by cribcage at 10:47 AM on February 14, 2006
posted by cribcage at 10:47 AM on February 14, 2006
If you've been tailgating them for those miles, then I would agree it's probably pettiness. If you haven't, then I would agree with with deadfather.
You can also get into situations where you feel another car on the road is driving aggressively or annoyingly and you don't want to get stuck behind that particular car.
posted by occhiblu at 10:52 AM on February 14, 2006
You can also get into situations where you feel another car on the road is driving aggressively or annoyingly and you don't want to get stuck behind that particular car.
posted by occhiblu at 10:52 AM on February 14, 2006
Do you mean two-lane roads where the traffic in each lane goes in opposite directions?
posted by mullacc at 10:53 AM on February 14, 2006
posted by mullacc at 10:53 AM on February 14, 2006
I do it.
1. Territorialsm. No one likes to feel "hijacked."
2. Each car that passes you up is one more car to potentially slow you down at the next light.
3. Once you see a car speeding up next to you, it's a green light for yourself to speed up because you're less likely to be pulled over for "going with the flow of traffic." Also, to go slightly slower than the passing car means they'll be pulled over before you.
4. Natural competitiveness. I don't consciously process it, but any sort of infringement makes me view it as a contest. Especially with other male drivers. And especially in SUVs (I drive a van).
By the way, I should note this is from the perspective of someone who forcibly goes exactly 7 mph over the speed limit everywhere (unless otherwise provoked or given the opportunity to speed up).
Impulse, self-centeredness, and efficiency, if you want the quick and dirty.
I should also note I don't like to hold people up and give them a free pass if they really want to zoom past me at 30 mph over the speed limit.
posted by Mach3avelli at 10:55 AM on February 14, 2006
1. Territorialsm. No one likes to feel "hijacked."
2. Each car that passes you up is one more car to potentially slow you down at the next light.
3. Once you see a car speeding up next to you, it's a green light for yourself to speed up because you're less likely to be pulled over for "going with the flow of traffic." Also, to go slightly slower than the passing car means they'll be pulled over before you.
4. Natural competitiveness. I don't consciously process it, but any sort of infringement makes me view it as a contest. Especially with other male drivers. And especially in SUVs (I drive a van).
By the way, I should note this is from the perspective of someone who forcibly goes exactly 7 mph over the speed limit everywhere (unless otherwise provoked or given the opportunity to speed up).
Impulse, self-centeredness, and efficiency, if you want the quick and dirty.
I should also note I don't like to hold people up and give them a free pass if they really want to zoom past me at 30 mph over the speed limit.
posted by Mach3avelli at 10:55 AM on February 14, 2006
I've caught myself doing this more than once.
What deadfather and zeoslap said, plus it just seems automatic in a hard-to-explain kind of way.
posted by tkolstee at 10:56 AM on February 14, 2006
What deadfather and zeoslap said, plus it just seems automatic in a hard-to-explain kind of way.
posted by tkolstee at 10:56 AM on February 14, 2006
are you sure that they speed up?
you might be underestimating the speed that *you* must quickly build up to, in order to pass the car swiftly. It always takes longer than you think.
posted by seawallrunner at 11:02 AM on February 14, 2006
you might be underestimating the speed that *you* must quickly build up to, in order to pass the car swiftly. It always takes longer than you think.
posted by seawallrunner at 11:02 AM on February 14, 2006
You passing them "wakes them up," they realize they are driving slower than they would "like," and speed up.
That would be me. Nothing personal.
posted by StickyCarpet at 11:03 AM on February 14, 2006
That would be me. Nothing personal.
posted by StickyCarpet at 11:03 AM on February 14, 2006
I, too, have caught myself doing this in exactly the same way deadfather describes. If I become consciously aware of it, I'll strive to avoid it, but for every time I consciously stop myself from doing it there's probably ten times I'm not aware I'm doing it.
posted by DevilsAdvocate at 11:04 AM on February 14, 2006
posted by DevilsAdvocate at 11:04 AM on February 14, 2006
The person you are tailing may be going slow because of a curvy section of road. When they come to a long straight section they speed up. This happens to be the same time that you have an opportunity to pass.
Also, there was a study done of cars in mall parking lots. They found that people were twice as slow in leaving their parking slot if another car was waiting -- something to do with unconsciously protecting their turf.
posted by JackFlash at 11:05 AM on February 14, 2006
Also, there was a study done of cars in mall parking lots. They found that people were twice as slow in leaving their parking slot if another car was waiting -- something to do with unconsciously protecting their turf.
posted by JackFlash at 11:05 AM on February 14, 2006
are you sure that they speed up?
you might be underestimating the speed that *you* must quickly build up to, in order to pass the car swiftly. It always takes longer than you think.
Probably. When you're tailing a car at 55, switch lanes over and speed up to 65, and you're both going along head-to-head, there's something amiss.
posted by Mach3avelli at 11:06 AM on February 14, 2006
you might be underestimating the speed that *you* must quickly build up to, in order to pass the car swiftly. It always takes longer than you think.
Probably. When you're tailing a car at 55, switch lanes over and speed up to 65, and you're both going along head-to-head, there's something amiss.
posted by Mach3avelli at 11:06 AM on February 14, 2006
Response by poster: are you sure that they speed up?
Yes. If I'm going 7 mph faster than their previous speed (easily measurable), and I passed their vehicle 10 seconds ago, I should be 100 ft ahead of them. Yet I find them in my blind spot 20 feet behind me. That suggests they sped up by about 4-5 mph.
posted by zek at 11:08 AM on February 14, 2006
Yes. If I'm going 7 mph faster than their previous speed (easily measurable), and I passed their vehicle 10 seconds ago, I should be 100 ft ahead of them. Yet I find them in my blind spot 20 feet behind me. That suggests they sped up by about 4-5 mph.
posted by zek at 11:08 AM on February 14, 2006
Possibly related: ever notice how many people merge onto a freeway and dive straight over to the 'fast lane' - regardless of whether or not they are passing anyone? At least in the USA, it seems to be taken as a God-given right to be in the fast lane. That suggests to me that cribcage and others are right-on about everyone liking to be in front, with the attendent feeling of being personally unimpeded.
posted by cairnish at 11:12 AM on February 14, 2006
posted by cairnish at 11:12 AM on February 14, 2006
Maybe it's subconscious.
posted by elisabeth r at 11:17 AM on February 14, 2006
posted by elisabeth r at 11:17 AM on February 14, 2006
Essentially, because people are poor, inconsistent and inconsiderate drivers. See also people who won't turn their lights on in the rain/dark because "they can see just fine." But yeah, I subscribe to the "wake them up" theory as well.
Although every once in a while it might be someone who thinks you're cute.
posted by mookieproof at 11:17 AM on February 14, 2006
Although every once in a while it might be someone who thinks you're cute.
posted by mookieproof at 11:17 AM on February 14, 2006
I vote for the "waking up theory". People are just cruising along, mind on other things but when they see you try to pass them they wake up and think, "Oh, I must be going too slow, I'll speed up." I've caught myself doing it sometimes. Of course, I live in the land of very slow polite drivers so you coastal folks might be right in your territorial theories.
posted by octothorpe at 11:18 AM on February 14, 2006
posted by octothorpe at 11:18 AM on February 14, 2006
This is illegal in Minnesota (see Subd 3, sect. 2). I'm sure it's been known to spiral out of control, where you have two drivers each going 90+ mph in an attempt NOT to be passed. On a two-lane road, that's insane.
posted by Coffeemate at 11:24 AM on February 14, 2006
posted by Coffeemate at 11:24 AM on February 14, 2006
I'm sorry to admit that I do this to be an ass, BUT with one big qualifier: I tend to drive at or a little above the speed limit. So if someone is trying to pass me, and I'm already going over the speed limit, this means that the passer wants to drive even more over the speed limit than I'm going.
I consider that to be jerkish, unsafe behavior--if I'm going 70 or (depending on the rest of the traffic) 75 on a 65mph road, and someone wants to drive faster than that, they're being an asshole. So sometimes I'll play "be an ass to the asshole" and speed up to make it harder for them to pass me. Sort of a passive-aggressive way of saying "hey, buddy, you should NOT be driving that fast here".
I just hate it when shmucks driving their sporty coupes and talking on cell phones or reading a newspaper while driving, compound their bad driving by trying to go 20 miles over the speed limit.
posted by cyrusdogstar at 11:25 AM on February 14, 2006
I consider that to be jerkish, unsafe behavior--if I'm going 70 or (depending on the rest of the traffic) 75 on a 65mph road, and someone wants to drive faster than that, they're being an asshole. So sometimes I'll play "be an ass to the asshole" and speed up to make it harder for them to pass me. Sort of a passive-aggressive way of saying "hey, buddy, you should NOT be driving that fast here".
I just hate it when shmucks driving their sporty coupes and talking on cell phones or reading a newspaper while driving, compound their bad driving by trying to go 20 miles over the speed limit.
posted by cyrusdogstar at 11:25 AM on February 14, 2006
Oh, and I no longer drive, so it's no longer really an issue for me. Plus if I did, it would be in New Jersey where the other drivers are already clinically insane, so I'd probably be extra defensive and not pull shit like that. :P
posted by cyrusdogstar at 11:26 AM on February 14, 2006
posted by cyrusdogstar at 11:26 AM on February 14, 2006
deadfather writes "You passing them 'wakes them up,' they realize they are driving slower than they would 'like,' and speed up."
This is the case the few times I've caught myself doing this.
[1] If I'm driving my big block equiped '66 anyway, my Caravan isn't quite as, um, capable yet.
posted by Mitheral at 11:27 AM on February 14, 2006
This is the case the few times I've caught myself doing this.
- I'm on automatic pilot,
- I see someone pulling up next to me,
- without really coming out of autopilot I start speeding up because obviously it's safe to do so look at that guy to the left
- my brain actually kicks in, I realise I'm being a fool, and I slow down to let the guy beside me pass
[1] If I'm driving my big block equiped '66 anyway, my Caravan isn't quite as, um, capable yet.
posted by Mitheral at 11:27 AM on February 14, 2006
...because even as adults, we all want to be at the front of the lunch line.
posted by junkbox at 11:29 AM on February 14, 2006
posted by junkbox at 11:29 AM on February 14, 2006
One possibility of why people speed up is that they don't want to look at the ass of your car for the next 15 minutes. If the road is wide open -- protect the view. I know I have done this.
What I don't get is the people who I pass, who then decide to pass me, and go slow again. WTF? I drive 2 lane highways frequently and this happens.
posted by maxpower at 11:29 AM on February 14, 2006
What I don't get is the people who I pass, who then decide to pass me, and go slow again. WTF? I drive 2 lane highways frequently and this happens.
posted by maxpower at 11:29 AM on February 14, 2006
They are checking you out to see if your skirt's hiked up so they can get a look at your "bidness." Or, they're assholes - see above.
posted by Pressed Rat at 11:30 AM on February 14, 2006
posted by Pressed Rat at 11:30 AM on February 14, 2006
mookieproof writes "See also people who won't turn their lights on in the rain/dark because 'they can see just fine.'"
Required by law here, your headlights and taillights have to be on whenever your wipers are on.
posted by Mitheral at 11:30 AM on February 14, 2006
Required by law here, your headlights and taillights have to be on whenever your wipers are on.
posted by Mitheral at 11:30 AM on February 14, 2006
I have been a passenger in a car with a good friend who will often drive the speed of the car in front of him, be it 55 or 70. Very frustrating. I asked him once and he had no idea he was doing it. So, at least some people just don't think about it.
posted by sohcahtoa at 11:32 AM on February 14, 2006
posted by sohcahtoa at 11:32 AM on February 14, 2006
i've noticed the same thing when walking with a large group of people. i'd have to work like hell to pass someone, but once i did, they'd quickly drop back to their original speed.
maybe it's just something our brains do because there was an evolutionary advantage 300 million years ago? ("i don't have to outrun the velociraptor; i only have to outrun you!" or something?)
posted by clarahamster at 11:36 AM on February 14, 2006
maybe it's just something our brains do because there was an evolutionary advantage 300 million years ago? ("i don't have to outrun the velociraptor; i only have to outrun you!" or something?)
posted by clarahamster at 11:36 AM on February 14, 2006
I wonder if this is a phenomenon limited to the US. Mefites abroad, care to weigh in?
posted by Mach3avelli at 11:37 AM on February 14, 2006
posted by Mach3avelli at 11:37 AM on February 14, 2006
By the way, totally off-topic, but a peeve of mine nonetheless, people walking in front of you at a just barely slower speed. Makes for passing them up very awkward.
posted by Mach3avelli at 11:38 AM on February 14, 2006
posted by Mach3avelli at 11:38 AM on February 14, 2006
They found that people were twice as slow in leaving their parking slot if another car was waiting
Great googly moogly. That's a reason to go faster! People are waiting, hut hut!
Now sometimes if they're too close or I can't see them very well I go slowly to avoid hitting them (or if I do hit them, I won't do much damage). But if I can see? I'm outta there as quick as I can.
posted by kindall at 11:42 AM on February 14, 2006
Great googly moogly. That's a reason to go faster! People are waiting, hut hut!
Now sometimes if they're too close or I can't see them very well I go slowly to avoid hitting them (or if I do hit them, I won't do much damage). But if I can see? I'm outta there as quick as I can.
posted by kindall at 11:42 AM on February 14, 2006
They zone out, start going slow. You passing them "wakes them up," they realize they are driving slower than they would "like," and speed up.
This happens to me ALL the time. Or it did, when I used to drive.
posted by lampoil at 11:45 AM on February 14, 2006
This happens to me ALL the time. Or it did, when I used to drive.
posted by lampoil at 11:45 AM on February 14, 2006
For the same reason that road races often use rabbitts to make the real contender move at a good clip--you simply want not to be a loser and left behind...just honk your horn and make nasty signs with fingers and tongue and hands.
posted by Postroad at 11:52 AM on February 14, 2006
posted by Postroad at 11:52 AM on February 14, 2006
I'm with cyrusdogstar: I, too, occasionally speed up when somebody passes me, and it's always a conscious decision when I do. Normally if somebody's attempting to pass me, I actually slow down a little in order to allow them to get by quicker. Sometimes, though, if the passer has been tailgating me or if the passer is exceeding the speed limit by a significant amount, I'm a jerk and I accelerate. Note that I would never risk causing an accident; if road conditions were poor or if there were oncoming traffic, I would not do this. Am I wrong for doing this? Possibly, but it feels pretty natural, and there's really no other way to communicate my crankiness with the passer for tailgating and/or speeding.
So, in the case of the original question, if the person you're trying to pass is going 55-57 and the posted speed limit is 55, it's quite possible that they're trying to tell you to cool your jets. And if you've been tailgating them, this moves beyond possibility to probability.
posted by jdroth at 11:53 AM on February 14, 2006
So, in the case of the original question, if the person you're trying to pass is going 55-57 and the posted speed limit is 55, it's quite possible that they're trying to tell you to cool your jets. And if you've been tailgating them, this moves beyond possibility to probability.
posted by jdroth at 11:53 AM on February 14, 2006
I wonder if this is a phenomenon limited to the US. Mefites abroad, care to weigh in?
From Canada (Vancouver): I've never done this myself, or noticed anyone doing it. I always slow down when someone's trying to pass me. If someone's driving aggressively or unsafely, I'm even more inclined to let them pass me.
posted by russilwvong at 12:08 PM on February 14, 2006
From Canada (Vancouver): I've never done this myself, or noticed anyone doing it. I always slow down when someone's trying to pass me. If someone's driving aggressively or unsafely, I'm even more inclined to let them pass me.
posted by russilwvong at 12:08 PM on February 14, 2006
it's quite possible that they're trying to tell you to cool your jets.
That seems completely insane. Do people who do this ever see people actually get that message and slow down?
posted by sfenders at 12:14 PM on February 14, 2006
That seems completely insane. Do people who do this ever see people actually get that message and slow down?
posted by sfenders at 12:14 PM on February 14, 2006
I'm in Ontario, Canada and I was just wondering this the other day on my morning commute on a 4-lane highway. It happens so frequently that I will sometimes check my odometer before and after passing them.
posted by KathyK at 12:21 PM on February 14, 2006
posted by KathyK at 12:21 PM on February 14, 2006
Deadfather's right on for the most part. Though it does, contrary to the OP's question, happen on interstates quite a bit too.
"I consider that to be jerkish, unsafe behavior--if I'm going 70 or (depending on the rest of the traffic) 75 on a 65mph road, and someone wants to drive faster than that, they're being an asshole. So sometimes I'll play "be an ass to the asshole" and speed up to make it harder for them to pass me. Sort of a passive-aggressive way of saying "hey, buddy, you should NOT be driving that fast here"."
Couple things: First off, you're an idiot. Their speed has nothing to do with you. You don't do any good by trying to outgun them, and YOU'RE THE ASSHOLE. Their speeding is none of your business. You should let them get past you, as there's less chance for an accident involving you if they're off way ahead of you.
Which brings us to point #2: This is definitely a US thing, and seems to have to do with a weird puritan morality. The best part of travelling by road in Italy is that no one gives a shit if you want to pass them. They're going their speed, and if you come up on them, they move over. If someone wants to go faster than you, you move over to the right and let them. If they're going too fast, the cops'll get them, not you, so what do you care? There's none of this bullshit about trying to impose your morality on other drivers. There's nothing worse than someone doing the speed limit in the passing lane.
And to the third part, garnered from a several hour discussion with a federal traffic engineer: He said two things that have stuck with me. That slow drivers statistically cause more accidents than fast drivers, as faster drivers tend to be more predictable. While faster drivers get into more accidents, it's the people who are trying to go 65 in the left lane that end up leading to unsafe merges etc. The second thing he mentioned is that all roads have a basic safe speed that, if left totally alone (no enforcement, no posted signs) 85% of people will be within 3 MPH of. The vast majority of people will find the safe speed on their own. This has absolutely nothing to do with speed limits, which are set fairly arbitrarily, and enforced as a fundraising method, not out of any real sense of safety. He said that the 15% of people who are deviating from that theoretical "safe speed" are the ones responsible for 85% of accidents on the highway, but frequently it's speed limits that make people deviate from that speed. (He also thinks that posting state troopers in visible spots as "traffic calming" or speed traps causes a lot of accidents as peoplerapidly decelerate, especially at the tops of hills).
posted by klangklangston at 12:26 PM on February 14, 2006
"I consider that to be jerkish, unsafe behavior--if I'm going 70 or (depending on the rest of the traffic) 75 on a 65mph road, and someone wants to drive faster than that, they're being an asshole. So sometimes I'll play "be an ass to the asshole" and speed up to make it harder for them to pass me. Sort of a passive-aggressive way of saying "hey, buddy, you should NOT be driving that fast here"."
Couple things: First off, you're an idiot. Their speed has nothing to do with you. You don't do any good by trying to outgun them, and YOU'RE THE ASSHOLE. Their speeding is none of your business. You should let them get past you, as there's less chance for an accident involving you if they're off way ahead of you.
Which brings us to point #2: This is definitely a US thing, and seems to have to do with a weird puritan morality. The best part of travelling by road in Italy is that no one gives a shit if you want to pass them. They're going their speed, and if you come up on them, they move over. If someone wants to go faster than you, you move over to the right and let them. If they're going too fast, the cops'll get them, not you, so what do you care? There's none of this bullshit about trying to impose your morality on other drivers. There's nothing worse than someone doing the speed limit in the passing lane.
And to the third part, garnered from a several hour discussion with a federal traffic engineer: He said two things that have stuck with me. That slow drivers statistically cause more accidents than fast drivers, as faster drivers tend to be more predictable. While faster drivers get into more accidents, it's the people who are trying to go 65 in the left lane that end up leading to unsafe merges etc. The second thing he mentioned is that all roads have a basic safe speed that, if left totally alone (no enforcement, no posted signs) 85% of people will be within 3 MPH of. The vast majority of people will find the safe speed on their own. This has absolutely nothing to do with speed limits, which are set fairly arbitrarily, and enforced as a fundraising method, not out of any real sense of safety. He said that the 15% of people who are deviating from that theoretical "safe speed" are the ones responsible for 85% of accidents on the highway, but frequently it's speed limits that make people deviate from that speed. (He also thinks that posting state troopers in visible spots as "traffic calming" or speed traps causes a lot of accidents as peoplerapidly decelerate, especially at the tops of hills).
posted by klangklangston at 12:26 PM on February 14, 2006
That seems completely insane.
Any more insane than trying to pass somebody who's already at or above the speed limit?
In the town where I live, the speed limit on a one-mile stretch of four-lane highway was recently reduced from 55mph to 45mph because of a decades-long history of fatal accidents. At the same time, the police have increased their speed traps on this section of road. Most people honor the 45mph speed limit (or, at most, cheat to 50mph). But there are still some people who come flying up behind other cars, expecting them to pull over. These impatient jerks tailgate, and when they get a chance go flying by at 60, 70, even 80mph. I often see the cars they're trying to get around accelerate to prevent them from doing so. (I've not done this myself on this particular stretch because it seems silly to do on a four-lane highway.) Who is the more insane?
Do people who do this ever see people actually get that message and slow down?
No. But maybe it makes them think about it the next time they do it. Maybe they ask their friends (are a group of random strangers on the internet) why people accelerate when they go to pass. Maybe it doesn't slow them down (or stop them from tailgating that time), but maybe it helps in the future.
Probably not, though.
Mostly it just gives me some satisfaction to be a jerk once in a while (I'm decidedly non-jerkish most of the time), just as it gives the passer satisfaction to be a jerk by speeding (or tailgating).
posted by jdroth at 12:31 PM on February 14, 2006
Any more insane than trying to pass somebody who's already at or above the speed limit?
In the town where I live, the speed limit on a one-mile stretch of four-lane highway was recently reduced from 55mph to 45mph because of a decades-long history of fatal accidents. At the same time, the police have increased their speed traps on this section of road. Most people honor the 45mph speed limit (or, at most, cheat to 50mph). But there are still some people who come flying up behind other cars, expecting them to pull over. These impatient jerks tailgate, and when they get a chance go flying by at 60, 70, even 80mph. I often see the cars they're trying to get around accelerate to prevent them from doing so. (I've not done this myself on this particular stretch because it seems silly to do on a four-lane highway.) Who is the more insane?
Do people who do this ever see people actually get that message and slow down?
No. But maybe it makes them think about it the next time they do it. Maybe they ask their friends (are a group of random strangers on the internet) why people accelerate when they go to pass. Maybe it doesn't slow them down (or stop them from tailgating that time), but maybe it helps in the future.
Probably not, though.
Mostly it just gives me some satisfaction to be a jerk once in a while (I'm decidedly non-jerkish most of the time), just as it gives the passer satisfaction to be a jerk by speeding (or tailgating).
posted by jdroth at 12:31 PM on February 14, 2006
They speed up because they are an idiot, and sometimes because they are also an asshole.
posted by five fresh fish at 12:49 PM on February 14, 2006
posted by five fresh fish at 12:49 PM on February 14, 2006
So, jdroth, you're the one driver in charge of setting the safe speed? That is, you're saying that you, jdroth, drive the perfect amount over the speed limit, such that anyone going any faster needs to slow down? I mean, you say 57 is ok, but 58 is not? Sheesh.
I've also seen the (more-or-less) opposite effect. I'll be going along at a consistent speed, and someone will pull up right next to me, then stay there. Worse is when they pull into my blind spot, then don't pass. What the hell? Just 5 seconds earlier, they wanted to go faster than me. Now they're having second thoughts?
In that situation, usually I'll speed up just a tad, to see if they'll match me. Just a tad more, wait, then a tad more. Then I slow back down to the speed I wanted to go in the first place, and let them sail on by.
posted by MrMoonPie at 1:05 PM on February 14, 2006
I've also seen the (more-or-less) opposite effect. I'll be going along at a consistent speed, and someone will pull up right next to me, then stay there. Worse is when they pull into my blind spot, then don't pass. What the hell? Just 5 seconds earlier, they wanted to go faster than me. Now they're having second thoughts?
In that situation, usually I'll speed up just a tad, to see if they'll match me. Just a tad more, wait, then a tad more. Then I slow back down to the speed I wanted to go in the first place, and let them sail on by.
posted by MrMoonPie at 1:05 PM on February 14, 2006
Couple things: First off, you're an idiot. Their speed has nothing to do with you. You don't do any good by trying to outgun them, and YOU'RE THE ASSHOLE. Their speeding is none of your business. You should let them get past you, as there's less chance for an accident involving you if they're off way ahead of you.
Well said, klangklangston.
As an average Joe Citizen, it is not your duty to dictate a speed limit to anyone else. If someone wants to pass, let them pass. It's not your call to determine if they're driving too fast for a certain area.
This reminds me of a drive I made with the missus a couple of years ago from LA to San Francisco. We must have been doing about 80 in the left lane, passing some slower traffic out in the open area of the I-5, and someone in a flashy Subaru came flying up behind me. He must have been doing at least 100. As soon as I could, I moved over to the right to let him pass. He sped back up to 100 and was gone like a rocket.
About 10 minutes later, we passed him on the side of the road with a grumpy looking CHiPpie. I wonder how much the ticket was....
Now, on the other hand, if the person is driving erratically, and you think they might be impared, then feel free to call you local law enforcement office via cell, and report the fucker. I have zero compassion for someone driving drunk, drink, or altered.
Bottom line, if people want to speed, let them.
posted by Jim T at 1:09 PM on February 14, 2006
Well said, klangklangston.
As an average Joe Citizen, it is not your duty to dictate a speed limit to anyone else. If someone wants to pass, let them pass. It's not your call to determine if they're driving too fast for a certain area.
This reminds me of a drive I made with the missus a couple of years ago from LA to San Francisco. We must have been doing about 80 in the left lane, passing some slower traffic out in the open area of the I-5, and someone in a flashy Subaru came flying up behind me. He must have been doing at least 100. As soon as I could, I moved over to the right to let him pass. He sped back up to 100 and was gone like a rocket.
About 10 minutes later, we passed him on the side of the road with a grumpy looking CHiPpie. I wonder how much the ticket was....
Now, on the other hand, if the person is driving erratically, and you think they might be impared, then feel free to call you local law enforcement office via cell, and report the fucker. I have zero compassion for someone driving drunk, drink, or altered.
Bottom line, if people want to speed, let them.
posted by Jim T at 1:09 PM on February 14, 2006
As an average Joe Citizen, it is not your duty to dictate a speed limit to anyone else. If someone wants to pass, let them pass. It's not your call to determine if they're driving too fast for a certain area.
Well, by the same logic, you and klangklangston shouldn't give two hoots if myself and jdroth do what we do sometimes...right? :) Bottom line, if people want to speed to piss off speeders, let them.
Perhaps we can all agree on the one rule of the road: everyone becomes an asshole when they're driving...except us.
posted by cyrusdogstar at 1:23 PM on February 14, 2006
Well, by the same logic, you and klangklangston shouldn't give two hoots if myself and jdroth do what we do sometimes...right? :) Bottom line, if people want to speed to piss off speeders, let them.
Perhaps we can all agree on the one rule of the road: everyone becomes an asshole when they're driving...except us.
posted by cyrusdogstar at 1:23 PM on February 14, 2006
The fact that it happens 40-60% of the time suggests that it's something you're doing. I'd second the thought that you're tailgating and the person you pass is pissed at you.
posted by MarkAnd at 1:34 PM on February 14, 2006 [1 favorite]
posted by MarkAnd at 1:34 PM on February 14, 2006 [1 favorite]
So, jdroth, you're the one driver in charge of setting the safe speed? That is, you're saying that you, jdroth, drive the perfect amount over the speed limit, such that anyone going any faster needs to slow down?
Nope. I'm not saying that at all. I generally drive no more than the posted limit, but that's my choice. I usually don't give a rat's ass how fast other people drive, so long as they're not wantonly reckless. I'm just saying that sometimes, if a driver has been tailgating me or is trying to pass when I'm already speeding, I do the "speed up" thing. I've seen others do it, too. I make no claims to higher morality. I make no claims that my speed is the right speed. (But, by the same token, your speed is not the right speed, either.)
I'm not trying to say that what I'm doing is right when I accelerate. I'm just trying to answer the question, to explain to the original poster what might be happening he observes this behavior. (I think most of the time, though, it's the whole zoning out thing.)
posted by jdroth at 1:35 PM on February 14, 2006
Nope. I'm not saying that at all. I generally drive no more than the posted limit, but that's my choice. I usually don't give a rat's ass how fast other people drive, so long as they're not wantonly reckless. I'm just saying that sometimes, if a driver has been tailgating me or is trying to pass when I'm already speeding, I do the "speed up" thing. I've seen others do it, too. I make no claims to higher morality. I make no claims that my speed is the right speed. (But, by the same token, your speed is not the right speed, either.)
I'm not trying to say that what I'm doing is right when I accelerate. I'm just trying to answer the question, to explain to the original poster what might be happening he observes this behavior. (I think most of the time, though, it's the whole zoning out thing.)
posted by jdroth at 1:35 PM on February 14, 2006
"Well, by the same logic, you and klangklangston shouldn't give two hoots if myself and jdroth do what we do sometimes...right? :) Bottom line, if people want to speed to piss off speeders, let them."
On some level, sure, since I'm unlikely to ever pass you guys on the road. On another level, you're being dangerous dicks by trying to impose your morality in a way that the passers aren't, not least because you're turning the road into a petty, spiteful arena instead of just letting people do what they want.
(But good try at the "tolerate intolerance" dodge. It doesn't work for televanlists, it doesn't work for you.)
posted by klangklangston at 1:39 PM on February 14, 2006
On some level, sure, since I'm unlikely to ever pass you guys on the road. On another level, you're being dangerous dicks by trying to impose your morality in a way that the passers aren't, not least because you're turning the road into a petty, spiteful arena instead of just letting people do what they want.
(But good try at the "tolerate intolerance" dodge. It doesn't work for televanlists, it doesn't work for you.)
posted by klangklangston at 1:39 PM on February 14, 2006
I do this for the two reasons everyone is describing:
1. Sometimes I've been going abnormally slow without realizing it and their going faster next to me makes me realize it.
2. If they've been tailgating me for a long time, I will do it to spite them.
posted by TunnelArmr at 1:44 PM on February 14, 2006
1. Sometimes I've been going abnormally slow without realizing it and their going faster next to me makes me realize it.
2. If they've been tailgating me for a long time, I will do it to spite them.
posted by TunnelArmr at 1:44 PM on February 14, 2006
Maybe they speed up because they know that once you pass them you're going to get back in their lane and slowly, imperceptively slow down until they eventually have to pass you in a fit of frustration.
Solution: As you're passing them, force them off the road.
posted by blue_beetle at 1:44 PM on February 14, 2006
Solution: As you're passing them, force them off the road.
posted by blue_beetle at 1:44 PM on February 14, 2006
The problem with pissing off speeders is that you're simply antagonizing them and exacerbating the situation.
jdroth - I'm proud of you for driving the speed limit. That's certainly your choice, and a safe one at that.
I however, drive faster than the speed limit. For a couple of reasons:
1. After 15 years of living and driving in Los Angeles, I like to get where I am going quickly, so I can stay off the road as much as possible. And I do it safely.
2. I drove a small car for the majority of time in LA, and I was concerned about my safety if I was involved in an accident with anything larger than a 1988 Yugo hatchback. If I drove slowly, I would get hemmed in between an SUV the size of Rhode Island, and an 18-wheeler. I felt better about being next to the 18-wheeler than I did with the SUV... the vast majority of professional truck drivers are safe, reliable drivers. The vast majority of SUV drivers were scatter-brained assholes chatting away on their cell phones while applying make-up and reading the newspaper.
That being said, I'm happy that you've found a speed at which you're comfortable driving. Just don't be an asswipe and dictate your speed on other people.
Let's just agree to disagree... you drive your speed, and I will drive mine. I'll stay out of your way, and you stay out of mine.
posted by Jim T at 1:55 PM on February 14, 2006
jdroth - I'm proud of you for driving the speed limit. That's certainly your choice, and a safe one at that.
I however, drive faster than the speed limit. For a couple of reasons:
1. After 15 years of living and driving in Los Angeles, I like to get where I am going quickly, so I can stay off the road as much as possible. And I do it safely.
2. I drove a small car for the majority of time in LA, and I was concerned about my safety if I was involved in an accident with anything larger than a 1988 Yugo hatchback. If I drove slowly, I would get hemmed in between an SUV the size of Rhode Island, and an 18-wheeler. I felt better about being next to the 18-wheeler than I did with the SUV... the vast majority of professional truck drivers are safe, reliable drivers. The vast majority of SUV drivers were scatter-brained assholes chatting away on their cell phones while applying make-up and reading the newspaper.
That being said, I'm happy that you've found a speed at which you're comfortable driving. Just don't be an asswipe and dictate your speed on other people.
Let's just agree to disagree... you drive your speed, and I will drive mine. I'll stay out of your way, and you stay out of mine.
posted by Jim T at 1:55 PM on February 14, 2006
I think people have basically the same instincts as geese in a flock.
If you watch geese fly overhead, you'll notice if one breaks out of the flock, all the others will start flying a little faster in order to get to the right proximity. It's an instinctual action.
If you hang out on a pedestrian overpass by an 8-lane freeway, you notice the same behaviour, and if you look close, you'll see a V formation travelling down the road, albeit slightly out of shape.
So basically, our subconcious wants a 20 lane freeway so we can all spread out into a true V and migrate to Florida.
posted by madajb at 3:20 PM on February 14, 2006
If you watch geese fly overhead, you'll notice if one breaks out of the flock, all the others will start flying a little faster in order to get to the right proximity. It's an instinctual action.
If you hang out on a pedestrian overpass by an 8-lane freeway, you notice the same behaviour, and if you look close, you'll see a V formation travelling down the road, albeit slightly out of shape.
So basically, our subconcious wants a 20 lane freeway so we can all spread out into a true V and migrate to Florida.
posted by madajb at 3:20 PM on February 14, 2006
zek: do you drive something sporty and/or expensive?
I've found that this happens to me far more often when driving a sports car than when I'm driving something unremarkable.
The worst offenses (where the other car not only accelerates to prevent safe overtaking, but also decelerates to prevent re-entering the original lane), have all occurred when I was piloting something a bit sporty.
It seems like some fraction of people view the presence of a sports car as an invitation for an extraordinarily dimwitted race.
posted by I Love Tacos at 3:34 PM on February 14, 2006
I've found that this happens to me far more often when driving a sports car than when I'm driving something unremarkable.
The worst offenses (where the other car not only accelerates to prevent safe overtaking, but also decelerates to prevent re-entering the original lane), have all occurred when I was piloting something a bit sporty.
It seems like some fraction of people view the presence of a sports car as an invitation for an extraordinarily dimwitted race.
posted by I Love Tacos at 3:34 PM on February 14, 2006
So sometimes I'll play "be an ass to the asshole" and speed up to make it harder for them to pass me. Sort of a passive-aggressive way of saying "hey, buddy, you should NOT be driving that fast here"
One Audi driver playing that "game" with me (actually, a more aggressive variant, where they also matched my braking, so I couldn't just pull behind them again) came within about 100 yards of causing a fatal accident. If oncoming traffic had showed up a fraction of a second earlier, my only choices would've been:
a) kill myself
b) kill myself and the oncoming traffic
c) kill the Audi driver, and possibly myself (depending on whether or not I was able to run them off the road without losing control of my own vehicle)
Needless to say, I would've gone for choice C, since running the ass off the road is the only option with any realistic possibility of survival.
As it stood, I'm quite sure I was within 100 yards of a head-on collision at 100+mph, and within inches of taking myself and/or the Audi out.
Cars aren't toys. If somebody has setup a safe pass, let them make it. Increasing the time they spend in the other lane creates enormous dangerous to them, to yourself, and to other innocent motorists.
posted by I Love Tacos at 3:49 PM on February 14, 2006
One Audi driver playing that "game" with me (actually, a more aggressive variant, where they also matched my braking, so I couldn't just pull behind them again) came within about 100 yards of causing a fatal accident. If oncoming traffic had showed up a fraction of a second earlier, my only choices would've been:
a) kill myself
b) kill myself and the oncoming traffic
c) kill the Audi driver, and possibly myself (depending on whether or not I was able to run them off the road without losing control of my own vehicle)
Needless to say, I would've gone for choice C, since running the ass off the road is the only option with any realistic possibility of survival.
As it stood, I'm quite sure I was within 100 yards of a head-on collision at 100+mph, and within inches of taking myself and/or the Audi out.
Cars aren't toys. If somebody has setup a safe pass, let them make it. Increasing the time they spend in the other lane creates enormous dangerous to them, to yourself, and to other innocent motorists.
posted by I Love Tacos at 3:49 PM on February 14, 2006
One of my peeves is people who echo the speed of the the car in the lane next to them. I've always thought that these people are idiots but after reading this thread I have to consider the possiblility that they may be assholes.
posted by rdr at 4:16 PM on February 14, 2006
posted by rdr at 4:16 PM on February 14, 2006
Mod note: a few comments removed, please take the "who is the bigger asshole" discussion to metatalk or the chatroom
posted by jessamyn (staff) at 4:24 PM on February 14, 2006
posted by jessamyn (staff) at 4:24 PM on February 14, 2006
It certainly happens here in australia, easy to tell when you've got cruise control on and overtake someone. I don't put it down to malice, I think it's largely subconscious. Dunno about 40% of people doing it, less I would say, but still a significant proportion.
A word of warning for those who say they always speed - don't drive like that here, you will get a ticket. No one really goes more than 5 km ove the limit these days.
posted by wilful at 5:57 PM on February 14, 2006
A word of warning for those who say they always speed - don't drive like that here, you will get a ticket. No one really goes more than 5 km ove the limit these days.
posted by wilful at 5:57 PM on February 14, 2006
intermod's rules for driving in the United States:
1. Everybody complains about turn signal use, and everybody fails to use them.
2. Passing on the right is just fine, because you'll wait forever for the idiot to get out of the left lane.
3. Go 9 MPH over the speed limit (when it's safe to) and you'll never get a speeding ticket.
4. Stay well away from everyone else's two blind spots.
5. Stay well away from people on cell phones, including handsfree.
6. If you ever go to Germany, then please stay off the damn road, because you haven't ever been properly taught how to drive. Use the excellent public transit system. Or walk. THANKSOKBYE!!!!!!
posted by intermod at 8:50 PM on February 14, 2006
1. Everybody complains about turn signal use, and everybody fails to use them.
2. Passing on the right is just fine, because you'll wait forever for the idiot to get out of the left lane.
3. Go 9 MPH over the speed limit (when it's safe to) and you'll never get a speeding ticket.
4. Stay well away from everyone else's two blind spots.
5. Stay well away from people on cell phones, including handsfree.
6. If you ever go to Germany, then please stay off the damn road, because you haven't ever been properly taught how to drive. Use the excellent public transit system. Or walk. THANKSOKBYE!!!!!!
posted by intermod at 8:50 PM on February 14, 2006
Passing on the right is just fine, because you'll wait forever for the idiot to get out of the left lane.
I hope you're joking here, because this is extremely dangerous. It is never okay to pass on the right: it endangers cyclists, pedestrians, and other drivers. I've seen three nasty collisions caused by people passing on the right, and I hope I never have to see another.
posted by jdroth at 10:30 PM on February 14, 2006
I hope you're joking here, because this is extremely dangerous. It is never okay to pass on the right: it endangers cyclists, pedestrians, and other drivers. I've seen three nasty collisions caused by people passing on the right, and I hope I never have to see another.
posted by jdroth at 10:30 PM on February 14, 2006
they're wankers. I don't care what the given excuse is, there are plenty of examples above.
And those (that means you, cyrusdogstar) who go out of your way to prevent me passing: you don't deserve to be on the road. There's nothing special about the amount by which you're speeding, if I want to go 5km/h faster then that's my problem and it's not your job to try and stop me by being dangerous.
Remember people, roads are a publicly funded, shared resource. You morons doing 20km/h less than the posted limit are denying the proper usage of that resource to the rest of the populace. It doesn't make you safer, it makes you selfish and dangerous. Staying in front is selfish. Trying to block me in the outside lane will result in me calling the cops on your arse for malicious and dangerous driving; I've had someone arrested for this before.
posted by polyglot at 10:47 PM on February 14, 2006
And those (that means you, cyrusdogstar) who go out of your way to prevent me passing: you don't deserve to be on the road. There's nothing special about the amount by which you're speeding, if I want to go 5km/h faster then that's my problem and it's not your job to try and stop me by being dangerous.
Remember people, roads are a publicly funded, shared resource. You morons doing 20km/h less than the posted limit are denying the proper usage of that resource to the rest of the populace. It doesn't make you safer, it makes you selfish and dangerous. Staying in front is selfish. Trying to block me in the outside lane will result in me calling the cops on your arse for malicious and dangerous driving; I've had someone arrested for this before.
posted by polyglot at 10:47 PM on February 14, 2006
I wonder if this is a phenomenon limited to the US. Mefites abroad, care to weigh in?
What I've noticed is that Europeans seem far more willing to speed up in order to pass a car. For example, in the US I might be doing 65mph and someone takes a long time to pass me at 70mph; whereas I might (temporarily) go up to 80mph to get past. (My reasoning being, I'd rather be in the wrong lane for 10 seconds than 20; and I think the excess speed is actually less dangerous than the alternative. Of course I'm liable to get a speeding ticket that way, if I'm unlucky, but I'd rather have that than risk crashing into oncoming traffic just because I took too much time getting past someone.)
Maybe it's because we have fewer long stretches of straight roads in Luxembourg, so we need to get by fast before the next turn. So for us, it isn't as much of a concern, since the speed difference might be higher. Then again, I have noticed the effect sometimes; although sometimes it can be attributed to people speeding up because they're on a straight stretch, not because I'm next to them. Still, if I see someone on my left side I'll stay at my current speed and only accelerate once they're past.
Disclaimer: I live in Luxembourg, my US driving has mostly been in the Southwest. In the US, I drive the speed limit or 5 over, except if I'm passing a truck or van that I'd otherwise be stuck behind for a long time. In Luxembourg, I typically drive 10-20km/h over, if the road and outside conditions allow it.
posted by ckemp at 12:47 AM on February 15, 2006
What I've noticed is that Europeans seem far more willing to speed up in order to pass a car. For example, in the US I might be doing 65mph and someone takes a long time to pass me at 70mph; whereas I might (temporarily) go up to 80mph to get past. (My reasoning being, I'd rather be in the wrong lane for 10 seconds than 20; and I think the excess speed is actually less dangerous than the alternative. Of course I'm liable to get a speeding ticket that way, if I'm unlucky, but I'd rather have that than risk crashing into oncoming traffic just because I took too much time getting past someone.)
Maybe it's because we have fewer long stretches of straight roads in Luxembourg, so we need to get by fast before the next turn. So for us, it isn't as much of a concern, since the speed difference might be higher. Then again, I have noticed the effect sometimes; although sometimes it can be attributed to people speeding up because they're on a straight stretch, not because I'm next to them. Still, if I see someone on my left side I'll stay at my current speed and only accelerate once they're past.
Disclaimer: I live in Luxembourg, my US driving has mostly been in the Southwest. In the US, I drive the speed limit or 5 over, except if I'm passing a truck or van that I'd otherwise be stuck behind for a long time. In Luxembourg, I typically drive 10-20km/h over, if the road and outside conditions allow it.
posted by ckemp at 12:47 AM on February 15, 2006
I call this "reactive driving" (or "-ers"). There are a number of other examples I could cite. There's the person who seems to be passing you -- but then pulls alongside and matches your speed. They're not thinking, and your car being there next to them is psychologically comforting at a subconscious level. It's easier to be next to somebody else and only pay attention to what they're doing.
I have a friend who always pulls up behind other cars, even if there's open road on all sides, and even if she has to slow down 10-15mph to do so. It's only after she does this and gets "stuck" that she wakes up and goes through a process of deciding to pass. Me, I always try to anticipate and avoid these situations.
posted by dhartung at 1:19 AM on February 15, 2006
I have a friend who always pulls up behind other cars, even if there's open road on all sides, and even if she has to slow down 10-15mph to do so. It's only after she does this and gets "stuck" that she wakes up and goes through a process of deciding to pass. Me, I always try to anticipate and avoid these situations.
posted by dhartung at 1:19 AM on February 15, 2006
jdroth: My guess is that the passing on the right thing is in a passing lane / interstate kind of thing, and not meaning passing on the right, using the shoulder as a passing lane, which is indeed very dangerous.
I love driving, and I have done a lot of it for not being a trucker, delivery driver, etc. I do notice that quite a lot of people speed up when you try to pass them. It annoys me, but not so much as when you pass them and hold a steady speed faster then them, and then a minute later they pass you going 20mph over posted limits.
Either way, I've always figured it was a natural tendency to either flock/group together like herd animals, or a subconscious competition of some sort where they feel like you are passing because you are better then them and they naturally want to make up for this somehow. I just ignore it most of the time, and go about my driving. If you are talking about when you are using a passing zone and they speed up when you are in the oncoming traffic's lane, then they are just total asses. I don't pass in passing zone's unless someone is going 15mph under the limit, so that part doesn't effect me.
I do find the whole, speed up when it gets to two lane, and slow down when it goes back to one lane thing...that is so very annoying. I often drive very curvy roads that have short passing lanes, and not many of them. I'm not willing to go much more then 10mph over the limit even when passing. If I can't make it past, that generally means I have to slow back down to 5-10mph under until the next passing zone in 30 minutes. Anyway, they mostly do this for one simple reason....it's relatively straight during the passing lane, and you have good visibility, so people are more comfortable going faster. Once it gets curvy again, it's back to 45mph.
I find tailgaters to be more annoying then anyone else. When I'm going 5-10mph over the limit, they have no real need to tailgate me.
posted by Phynix at 1:52 AM on February 15, 2006
I love driving, and I have done a lot of it for not being a trucker, delivery driver, etc. I do notice that quite a lot of people speed up when you try to pass them. It annoys me, but not so much as when you pass them and hold a steady speed faster then them, and then a minute later they pass you going 20mph over posted limits.
Either way, I've always figured it was a natural tendency to either flock/group together like herd animals, or a subconscious competition of some sort where they feel like you are passing because you are better then them and they naturally want to make up for this somehow. I just ignore it most of the time, and go about my driving. If you are talking about when you are using a passing zone and they speed up when you are in the oncoming traffic's lane, then they are just total asses. I don't pass in passing zone's unless someone is going 15mph under the limit, so that part doesn't effect me.
I do find the whole, speed up when it gets to two lane, and slow down when it goes back to one lane thing...that is so very annoying. I often drive very curvy roads that have short passing lanes, and not many of them. I'm not willing to go much more then 10mph over the limit even when passing. If I can't make it past, that generally means I have to slow back down to 5-10mph under until the next passing zone in 30 minutes. Anyway, they mostly do this for one simple reason....it's relatively straight during the passing lane, and you have good visibility, so people are more comfortable going faster. Once it gets curvy again, it's back to 45mph.
I find tailgaters to be more annoying then anyone else. When I'm going 5-10mph over the limit, they have no real need to tailgate me.
posted by Phynix at 1:52 AM on February 15, 2006
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by zeoslap at 10:45 AM on February 14, 2006