Help me figure out this grad school thing... working full time / non-STE
January 26, 2018 10:19 AM Subscribe
Most advice I'm finding here and elsewhere is for STEM, professional academic track degrees, or grad school as a way to change fields. I work full time and am looking to use grad school to progress in my current field. How does this actually work?
I work for a large city government as a project manager. We have a good tuition reimbursement program and I'd like to get better at what I do, so am considering graduate school for public administration or something similar.
It seems like most of the programs with schedules compatible with working full time are "executive", but it's not clear how "executive" your current position needs to be to get accepted. I've seen others that list part time options with no real description of what that means. I'm not interested in doing a primarily online program.
How do academic references work when you've been out of your unrelated undergraduate degree for over a decade? I'm seeing them required on some applications. I'm sure there are other things I'm not thinking of.
I work for a large city government as a project manager. We have a good tuition reimbursement program and I'd like to get better at what I do, so am considering graduate school for public administration or something similar.
It seems like most of the programs with schedules compatible with working full time are "executive", but it's not clear how "executive" your current position needs to be to get accepted. I've seen others that list part time options with no real description of what that means. I'm not interested in doing a primarily online program.
How do academic references work when you've been out of your unrelated undergraduate degree for over a decade? I'm seeing them required on some applications. I'm sure there are other things I'm not thinking of.
I would start off by at least going to some info sessions for programs that you're interested in.
I don't think "executive" is a scam (although maybe it has been in the past) - it's basically just business-school language for "night and weekend classes." People in "executive" programs are holding down real jobs and (usually) getting their tuition paid by their employers. There's a lot of variation among individual programs, just like with full-time MBAs. I know a handful of people who have done executive MBAs at well-respected business schools and getting the degree allowed them to move up in their organizations. I don't know how much they actually *learned* in the programs but a lot of an MBA is about making connections and networking, anyway.
So basically, don't be scared away by the "executive" label, but do know that it doesn't mean there's anything special about the program - there are a lot of really shitty graduate programs out there that would be a waste of your time and your tuition reimbursement dollars.
As for needing academic letters of recommendation from professors, it's possible to get letters from your undergraduate professors even if it's been a long time. You'll just have to provide them with a lot of background information (both to remind them of who you are and what your did, and to tell them what you're up to now and what you need them to say). Or if actual, current recommendations from recent professors is important (again, it's going to depend on the program, so you might as well ask), you can do what the phlegmatic king recommends above and take a few classes outside of a degree program (though this is not always possible with professional programs like an MBA, which are often cohort-based with everyone taking classes at the same rate).
(I have a professional degree, I have taught people pursuing professional degrees, I no longer use my professional degree and I am not a huge fan of professional degrees in general *but* they can be necessary or at least helpful for opening certain professional doors.)
posted by mskyle at 11:52 AM on January 26, 2018
I don't think "executive" is a scam (although maybe it has been in the past) - it's basically just business-school language for "night and weekend classes." People in "executive" programs are holding down real jobs and (usually) getting their tuition paid by their employers. There's a lot of variation among individual programs, just like with full-time MBAs. I know a handful of people who have done executive MBAs at well-respected business schools and getting the degree allowed them to move up in their organizations. I don't know how much they actually *learned* in the programs but a lot of an MBA is about making connections and networking, anyway.
So basically, don't be scared away by the "executive" label, but do know that it doesn't mean there's anything special about the program - there are a lot of really shitty graduate programs out there that would be a waste of your time and your tuition reimbursement dollars.
As for needing academic letters of recommendation from professors, it's possible to get letters from your undergraduate professors even if it's been a long time. You'll just have to provide them with a lot of background information (both to remind them of who you are and what your did, and to tell them what you're up to now and what you need them to say). Or if actual, current recommendations from recent professors is important (again, it's going to depend on the program, so you might as well ask), you can do what the phlegmatic king recommends above and take a few classes outside of a degree program (though this is not always possible with professional programs like an MBA, which are often cohort-based with everyone taking classes at the same rate).
(I have a professional degree, I have taught people pursuing professional degrees, I no longer use my professional degree and I am not a huge fan of professional degrees in general *but* they can be necessary or at least helpful for opening certain professional doors.)
posted by mskyle at 11:52 AM on January 26, 2018
It seems like most of the programs with schedules compatible with working full time are "executive", but it's not clear how "executive" your current position needs to be to get accepted.
Seconding mskyle that "executive" *mostly* means "we try to make this compatible with working full-time" with a little leavening of "...and we might be willing to give you course credit for stuff you did at work if you pay us."
How do academic references work when you've been out of your unrelated undergraduate degree for over a decade?
Look at your transcript and look for courses of 50 or fewer students where you did well; ideally with writing components. Google the profs for those classes to make sure of where they are now. Email them like this:
Dear PROF,
I was a student in your CLASS in TERM, where I received GRADE. I have currently applied to MPA programs at SCHOOLS. While this was obviously a very long time ago and I do not expect that you remember me, I was hoping you would be willing to write a letter of recommendation from your records.
Yours,
setviva
(If you went to a little LAC they probably actually do remember you a little)
posted by GCU Sweet and Full of Grace at 12:17 PM on January 26, 2018 [1 favorite]
Seconding mskyle that "executive" *mostly* means "we try to make this compatible with working full-time" with a little leavening of "...and we might be willing to give you course credit for stuff you did at work if you pay us."
How do academic references work when you've been out of your unrelated undergraduate degree for over a decade?
Look at your transcript and look for courses of 50 or fewer students where you did well; ideally with writing components. Google the profs for those classes to make sure of where they are now. Email them like this:
Dear PROF,
I was a student in your CLASS in TERM, where I received GRADE. I have currently applied to MPA programs at SCHOOLS. While this was obviously a very long time ago and I do not expect that you remember me, I was hoping you would be willing to write a letter of recommendation from your records.
Yours,
setviva
(If you went to a little LAC they probably actually do remember you a little)
posted by GCU Sweet and Full of Grace at 12:17 PM on January 26, 2018 [1 favorite]
Just to note:
Getting requests for LORs is normal and an expected part of the job. This includes a slow dribble of people from several years ago and students that I otherwise to not really know from Adam's housecat. People who aren't assholes just write the best letter we can from our records.
posted by GCU Sweet and Full of Grace at 12:19 PM on January 26, 2018 [1 favorite]
Getting requests for LORs is normal and an expected part of the job. This includes a slow dribble of people from several years ago and students that I otherwise to not really know from Adam's housecat. People who aren't assholes just write the best letter we can from our records.
posted by GCU Sweet and Full of Grace at 12:19 PM on January 26, 2018 [1 favorite]
I worked full time as a library department head on a mid-sized college campus and worked on my PhD in Public History at the same time. For the most part, the courses our campus offered for grad programs were mostly evening classes. There were a few throughout my coursework that were during the day, but I arranged it with my boss before I even registered for the course to leave work in the middle of the day and come back to work late to make up the time. I would suggest, during a downtime of the semester, emailing the professor who is in charge of the grad program your interested in and seeing if they would be willing to chat with you about the program to see if it is a fit for you and can work with your schedule. You can also look at the program's website and see what the requirements are for the program and check a class schedule to see when the majority of classes are being taught.
More and more universities realize that students now are required by life to work jobs and take classes, and as a result there are more and more opportunities, especially in humanities grad work, to have later classes. That said, one important element that I missed out on was the opportunity to be a teaching assistant. My full time job just didn't allow for it, and at the time, I was fine with it because I assumed I would always be with that university and would always be a librarian. When I left the job later and saw tons of academic positions that I would have love to have had, if only I'd had teaching experience, I regretted not being able to TA.
It can be done and it's not a huge burden. Just prepare yourself for the level of work and time you'll need to be prepped for it.
posted by teleri025 at 2:50 PM on January 26, 2018
More and more universities realize that students now are required by life to work jobs and take classes, and as a result there are more and more opportunities, especially in humanities grad work, to have later classes. That said, one important element that I missed out on was the opportunity to be a teaching assistant. My full time job just didn't allow for it, and at the time, I was fine with it because I assumed I would always be with that university and would always be a librarian. When I left the job later and saw tons of academic positions that I would have love to have had, if only I'd had teaching experience, I regretted not being able to TA.
It can be done and it's not a huge burden. Just prepare yourself for the level of work and time you'll need to be prepped for it.
posted by teleri025 at 2:50 PM on January 26, 2018
At my university we have oodles of masters for professionals that are at night but are real degrees that people complete in 3ish years. Dig around!
posted by k8t at 4:28 PM on January 26, 2018
posted by k8t at 4:28 PM on January 26, 2018
I would avoid unless you're 1000% sure none of the money's coming from your pocket.
Graduate tuition reimbursement is taxable compensation. When I was working at a university getting grad classes paid for, I had to pay about 1/3 up front (but got some education tax credits when I filed). (See how your employer withholds in regards to tuition reimbursement.) Depends on the university, but for me at a private research school, this cost more than a lot of graduate tuition out of pocket.
posted by supercres at 10:42 AM on January 27, 2018
Graduate tuition reimbursement is taxable compensation. When I was working at a university getting grad classes paid for, I had to pay about 1/3 up front (but got some education tax credits when I filed). (See how your employer withholds in regards to tuition reimbursement.) Depends on the university, but for me at a private research school, this cost more than a lot of graduate tuition out of pocket.
posted by supercres at 10:42 AM on January 27, 2018
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OK.
First off- I can't say that this is universal, but in my experience, "Executive" grad programs are, well, if not a scam, at least something close to a cynical money harvest. From what I've seen, they basically exist for someone in mid-to-late career upper-management to pay a vastly inflated fee to be able to take grad-level credit for their career so far. I would avoid unless you're 1000% sure none of the money's coming from your pocket.
Non-executive programs that talk about being part time should work pretty well for you. The program I'm in is built to be doable either part- or full-time (and I know people doing it both ways). In practice, it means that classes are in the evening (or theoretically on weekends) and meet once a week. It's a hassle, but it's doable. Balancing with working full-time means a reduced class load, which makes the whole thing take longer. On the other hand, you might find yourself with better focus on the material than the 23-year-olds blasting through the same classes 3 per semester.
On the recommendation/references front: I took a couple of classes within my program as a non-degree-seeking student, established myself, and then had those professors serve as my references when I flipped towards degree-seeking. So that's one way around it. If that's not a possibility, you could consider taking a standalone course or two at a community college to cultivate references. Or, honestly, contact the admissions people in whatever department you're applying to and ask them for suggestions on ways to handle it. All things being equal and assuming you're qualified (and it sounds like you are), they want you to be accepted and will help you find a way.
posted by the phlegmatic king at 11:35 AM on January 26, 2018 [1 favorite]