Decorating A Public School Classroom for Halloween: Yay or Nay?
October 27, 2017 2:51 AM Subscribe
Help settle a debate between my high school teaching team. We have 6 teachers who share 2 separate rooms and we are discussing if it's appropriate to hang Halloween decorations in one of the rooms. For the record, the administration stated they want one room with no decorations but did not specifically ban anything.
Team Halloween thinks it's totally fine for a classroom to be decorated with Halloween things. Jack o'lanterns, headstones, skeletons, witches and brooms, etc. Imagine everything in the Halloween aisle from any party store; they've got it and they want to hang it all in the classroom. If kids don't celebrate Halloween, they think the kids can go work in a classroom without decorations.
Team This is Not Inclusive thinks not everyone celebrates Halloween and especially in our current US-based climate of hostility and people feeling more fragile, let's choose to be more inclusive and not hang up anything Halloweenish. They feel giving high school students the option to leave and work in another room is not especially inclusive and feels more obnoxious than anything else. A kid would have to walk in their regularly-scheduled room, see the decorations, feel uncomfortable, then leave the room. Some think this is a pretty moronic solution and if a teacher really feels the need to celebrate, it's fine to put up fall things, but the Halloween stuff is not cool. Or do it at home.
Lastly, all of this is happening in a state where recently, some public schools have cancelled Halloween costume parades because local communities report feeling excluded.
So, help us settle this: should public high school teachers hang Halloween-specific decorations in their classes?
Team Halloween thinks it's totally fine for a classroom to be decorated with Halloween things. Jack o'lanterns, headstones, skeletons, witches and brooms, etc. Imagine everything in the Halloween aisle from any party store; they've got it and they want to hang it all in the classroom. If kids don't celebrate Halloween, they think the kids can go work in a classroom without decorations.
Team This is Not Inclusive thinks not everyone celebrates Halloween and especially in our current US-based climate of hostility and people feeling more fragile, let's choose to be more inclusive and not hang up anything Halloweenish. They feel giving high school students the option to leave and work in another room is not especially inclusive and feels more obnoxious than anything else. A kid would have to walk in their regularly-scheduled room, see the decorations, feel uncomfortable, then leave the room. Some think this is a pretty moronic solution and if a teacher really feels the need to celebrate, it's fine to put up fall things, but the Halloween stuff is not cool. Or do it at home.
Lastly, all of this is happening in a state where recently, some public schools have cancelled Halloween costume parades because local communities report feeling excluded.
So, help us settle this: should public high school teachers hang Halloween-specific decorations in their classes?
Is it worth the bother? I can't possibly see how some communities are being excluded by schools having halloween costume parades - I think that's a ridiculous claim by people who think no-one should have any fun if its not the kind of fun they want to have but if you haven't put up decorations by now, they're only going to be up for a few days, is it really worth fighting about or potentially causing controversy? If the kids don't know about it they wont miss it, unless its something you usually do and have suddenly decided it might be a problem?
posted by missmagenta at 3:25 AM on October 27, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by missmagenta at 3:25 AM on October 27, 2017 [3 favorites]
(On second thought, I guess I could see an issue if they communities were very deprived and putting together a costume for their kids would be a financial burden but that shouldn't affect decorations)
posted by missmagenta at 3:27 AM on October 27, 2017
posted by missmagenta at 3:27 AM on October 27, 2017
Do you already ban decorations for other religious and cultural festivals? It seems weird to single out Halloween if not. If you do, I think there's scope for including it in the ban. I like the idea of asking the kids, but maybe have some sort of secret vote so the kids who would vote no to the decorations don't feel pressured to say it's OK.
posted by EndsOfInvention at 3:31 AM on October 27, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by EndsOfInvention at 3:31 AM on October 27, 2017 [3 favorites]
This sounds ridiculous to me. Why not celebrate everything instead of now turning to celebrate nothing? Is this what life has become? I see nothing wrong with celebrating a festival like Halloween. Isn't this what makes the world turn round? Traditions, rituals etc. I don't see how one could be offended by it, a festival that celebrates the spooky and the spiritual and with its roots in Paganism. Accessible to all, a little escape and fantasy in the middle of autumn. I grew up in a country that celebrates Halloween and always enjoyed it; I now live in a country that doesn't especially do it so much. Neither offends me. I fit in with the customs where I live and celebrate it with friends here now or in the bars/clubs/places that do embrace it. I personally think the situation you describe is overkill.
To answer your question, I don't see why it should be a problem.
posted by cornflakegirl at 3:41 AM on October 27, 2017 [19 favorites]
To answer your question, I don't see why it should be a problem.
posted by cornflakegirl at 3:41 AM on October 27, 2017 [19 favorites]
Our local schools do fall-themed stuff but nothing Halloween specific. I’d say they can go wild with the maple leaves and undecorated pumpkins and such.
posted by tchemgrrl at 3:41 AM on October 27, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by tchemgrrl at 3:41 AM on October 27, 2017 [6 favorites]
Could you compromise and do Halloween-associated but not supernatural things like jack-o-lanterns, bats, black cats, ravens, etc.?
Is it usual to decorate classrooms in high school?
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 3:44 AM on October 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
Is it usual to decorate classrooms in high school?
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 3:44 AM on October 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
Team This is Not Inclusive thinks not everyone celebrates Halloween and especially in our current US-based climate of hostility and people feeling more fragile, let's choose to be more inclusive and not hang up anything Halloweenish.
Are they going to do the same thing when Christmas rolls around? If not, then I’m team Halloween.
posted by Room 641-A at 3:52 AM on October 27, 2017 [3 favorites]
Are they going to do the same thing when Christmas rolls around? If not, then I’m team Halloween.
posted by Room 641-A at 3:52 AM on October 27, 2017 [3 favorites]
I really don't want to derail but I really don't understand how Halloween can make kids feel uncomfortable? I mean, besides avoiding anything horribly gruesome (which it sounds like you are), I don't understand how a few cobwebs and plastic spiders would make high school kids uncomfortable? And they're in high school. Who really 'celebrates' Halloween beyond the age of trick or treating these days?
And inclusivity to me doesn't mean banning stuff. I wish inclusivity actually meant adding things - adding more traditions, more celebrations, more exposure to different cultures and stories.
posted by like_neon at 4:05 AM on October 27, 2017 [19 favorites]
And inclusivity to me doesn't mean banning stuff. I wish inclusivity actually meant adding things - adding more traditions, more celebrations, more exposure to different cultures and stories.
posted by like_neon at 4:05 AM on October 27, 2017 [19 favorites]
Best answer: I feel like the fact that you're having this debate at all says that you shouldn't do it. If it were really as simple as "this is uncomplicated fun for everyone", it wouldn't have to be debated. You know that this is painful to a nonzero number of communities in your area, and I don't think it's a huge stretch to say it'll be painful to a nonzero number of students.
Putting up explicitly Halloween themed decorations (as opposed to autumn decorations, which are awesome and will be topical for much longer) will effectively require some number of your students to walk into a classroom that makes it quite clear that their beliefs and feelings aren't really welcome, and that seems kind of gross to me. School is hard enough.
I love Halloween. It's basically the only holiday that I don't hate. But this seems like a situation where you know that some people will find this very unwelcome, and other people want to do that anyhow, because, well, it's fun for the people who want to do it.
Presumably most people have, at some point, walked into somewhere and just had that sinking realisation that, oh, this...really doesn't want to include people like me. Maybe you're Jewish and can't stand walking into a store between September and January, or you're the sole person of color in a sea of white people. Maybe you're the queer person who can count on one hand the number of movies where someone like you gets a happy ending. And I assume that we can all agree that those things suck. They're hurtful. They do damage. And Team Halloween is suggesting that you create a scenario like that, on purpose, for your students. Please don't.
posted by mishafletch at 4:10 AM on October 27, 2017 [11 favorites]
Putting up explicitly Halloween themed decorations (as opposed to autumn decorations, which are awesome and will be topical for much longer) will effectively require some number of your students to walk into a classroom that makes it quite clear that their beliefs and feelings aren't really welcome, and that seems kind of gross to me. School is hard enough.
I love Halloween. It's basically the only holiday that I don't hate. But this seems like a situation where you know that some people will find this very unwelcome, and other people want to do that anyhow, because, well, it's fun for the people who want to do it.
Presumably most people have, at some point, walked into somewhere and just had that sinking realisation that, oh, this...really doesn't want to include people like me. Maybe you're Jewish and can't stand walking into a store between September and January, or you're the sole person of color in a sea of white people. Maybe you're the queer person who can count on one hand the number of movies where someone like you gets a happy ending. And I assume that we can all agree that those things suck. They're hurtful. They do damage. And Team Halloween is suggesting that you create a scenario like that, on purpose, for your students. Please don't.
posted by mishafletch at 4:10 AM on October 27, 2017 [11 favorites]
A lot of the graveyard death stuff can be in poor taste to people used to the festive respect of Dia de los Muertos, especially since that particular holiday's aesthetic has been coopted by general Halloween decor without much awareness beyond "ooh, colorful!"
So I'd say avoid skeletons and gravestones, but pumpkins and candy should be fine, as well as black cats, moons, and fantastical things that allude to Halloween's underlying message of transformation/bringing your true self into public for an evening/monsters that are distinctly not dead (no zombies or vampires or ghosts, but mad scientists and silly cryptids would probably be fine along with fairies and super heroes and astronauts.)
I have to suffer through Christmas for weeks every year. I'm not even particularly actively Jewish and never have been, but the whole thing makes me angsty like no other thing seems to. I never had the choice to opt out of a classroom with too much damn tinsel or a hideous red and green color scheme for the entire month of December. The best experience I had was my excellent fifth grade teacher who did a different winter holiday for every week of November and December and we learned about all the interesting traditions and art and food for them. But that was extraordinary. Normally it's some Christmassy nonsense and I just sigh and move on, and hopefully snag some candy canes. The secular traditions of Christmas always made sense to me and even more so after I learned their solstice celebration origins. But I admit it would have been nice to be able to spend the majority of my winter school day in a room that wasn't obnoxiously decorated for a religious holiday to celebrate the birthday of a dude I don't worship. So I can see the angle here, except the catch is that Halloween is not a religious holiday, nor does it cover up and celebrate the subjugation of indigenous people (like Thanksgiving and Columbus Day).
I really do think you should be involving your students, since they're certainly old enough to have an informed opinion. It sounds like there's maybe a teacher or two who're big halloween people. I know and love many of these folks but it's one thing to have the spirit of Halloween where you love fun and spookiness and individuality and the ritual of transition, and another to press all of that onto other people who are probably just trying to remember their biology homework. Some simple decorations wouldn't be pressing anyone, I don't think. Jamming a bunch of them into one room and making anyone who doesn't like that go into another undecorated room feels... much worse.
posted by Mizu at 4:13 AM on October 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
So I'd say avoid skeletons and gravestones, but pumpkins and candy should be fine, as well as black cats, moons, and fantastical things that allude to Halloween's underlying message of transformation/bringing your true self into public for an evening/monsters that are distinctly not dead (no zombies or vampires or ghosts, but mad scientists and silly cryptids would probably be fine along with fairies and super heroes and astronauts.)
I have to suffer through Christmas for weeks every year. I'm not even particularly actively Jewish and never have been, but the whole thing makes me angsty like no other thing seems to. I never had the choice to opt out of a classroom with too much damn tinsel or a hideous red and green color scheme for the entire month of December. The best experience I had was my excellent fifth grade teacher who did a different winter holiday for every week of November and December and we learned about all the interesting traditions and art and food for them. But that was extraordinary. Normally it's some Christmassy nonsense and I just sigh and move on, and hopefully snag some candy canes. The secular traditions of Christmas always made sense to me and even more so after I learned their solstice celebration origins. But I admit it would have been nice to be able to spend the majority of my winter school day in a room that wasn't obnoxiously decorated for a religious holiday to celebrate the birthday of a dude I don't worship. So I can see the angle here, except the catch is that Halloween is not a religious holiday, nor does it cover up and celebrate the subjugation of indigenous people (like Thanksgiving and Columbus Day).
I really do think you should be involving your students, since they're certainly old enough to have an informed opinion. It sounds like there's maybe a teacher or two who're big halloween people. I know and love many of these folks but it's one thing to have the spirit of Halloween where you love fun and spookiness and individuality and the ritual of transition, and another to press all of that onto other people who are probably just trying to remember their biology homework. Some simple decorations wouldn't be pressing anyone, I don't think. Jamming a bunch of them into one room and making anyone who doesn't like that go into another undecorated room feels... much worse.
posted by Mizu at 4:13 AM on October 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
Best answer: Polling the students isn’t inclusive; don’t make a teenager justify their religion or nationality or whatever to the whole class. If someone’s uncomfortable with the symbols then they’re probably not going to want to be singled out (either by being made to debate or move to another room.) Bad idea and slippery slope for a public school teacher to make a big deal over holidays and expose the excluded kids like that.
I agree that more generic fall symbols are festive without causing concern, plus you can leave them up longer.
posted by kapers at 4:58 AM on October 27, 2017 [13 favorites]
I agree that more generic fall symbols are festive without causing concern, plus you can leave them up longer.
posted by kapers at 4:58 AM on October 27, 2017 [13 favorites]
Best answer: Because some people don’t seem to know this: there are kids who would be excluded, not just “offended.” Many Muslims don’t celebrate Halloween, for example.
posted by kapers at 5:04 AM on October 27, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by kapers at 5:04 AM on October 27, 2017 [6 favorites]
Was just talking about this with a preK teacher at work. She has a student who is a Jehovah's Witness and thus doesn't want Halloween stuff. They'll be giving that student alternate takes on classroom activities like construction paper pumpkin decorating. But she was talking about it not being quite right to have one kid doing something different. And perhaps addressing it in the future.
As someone who grew up with a minority religion, I know I really appreciated it when my religion was included or religion was kept out of the classroom. Being a kid and being left out isn't great.
posted by sciencegeek at 5:23 AM on October 27, 2017 [2 favorites]
As someone who grew up with a minority religion, I know I really appreciated it when my religion was included or religion was kept out of the classroom. Being a kid and being left out isn't great.
posted by sciencegeek at 5:23 AM on October 27, 2017 [2 favorites]
Best answer: Having been JW briefly in my youth, I can say that for Jehovah’s Witnesses all the holidays and indeed celebrating holidays or birthdays at all can, under strictest reason, be forbidden so they are one sect where “include them all” doesn’t work.
My view on holidays at school is pretty Grinch-like.
I would ask what the teachers think the decor will add vs. the real consequences of having a student feel that his or her learning environment is foreign to them. I also wish (knowing that teachers work really hard) that there would be equal enthusiasm in decorating our classsrooms to inspire our kids to learn about great world leaders and events or amazing scientific facts as opposed to the 80th go around on the names of the reindeer. Indira Ghandi was assassinated on Oct 31, 1984, for example.
posted by warriorqueen at 6:11 AM on October 27, 2017 [7 favorites]
My view on holidays at school is pretty Grinch-like.
I would ask what the teachers think the decor will add vs. the real consequences of having a student feel that his or her learning environment is foreign to them. I also wish (knowing that teachers work really hard) that there would be equal enthusiasm in decorating our classsrooms to inspire our kids to learn about great world leaders and events or amazing scientific facts as opposed to the 80th go around on the names of the reindeer. Indira Ghandi was assassinated on Oct 31, 1984, for example.
posted by warriorqueen at 6:11 AM on October 27, 2017 [7 favorites]
Best answer: I was at a panel discussing holidays in public libraries, and their take was that people who want to celebrate any mainstream holiday have PLENTY of places to do it and see the iconography - literally every store, most restaurants, television, stuff like that. You aren’t giving people who celebrate anything that they can’t already get, and you are forcing it on people who would rather not. Can’t their high school classroom be a place free from that for those who don’t celebrate?
posted by itsamermaid at 6:16 AM on October 27, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by itsamermaid at 6:16 AM on October 27, 2017 [8 favorites]
Team "It's Not Inclusive" are engaged in a parochialism that is the unique province of American liberals. Every modern society in the world has secularized holidays and traditions with a partial or complete basis in the society's majority religion, and happily observes them including in the public sphere. Any Muslim would regard it as the height of absurdity for anyone to suggest that Eid not to be observed in a public school in a Muslim majority country and it's not very secularized at all. Heck, Thanksgiving is more Christian in its origin than Halloween (it's the Christian God to whom thanks was intended to be given, whereas Halloween is one of the more clear graftings of Christian and European pagan/polytheist tradition, although Christmas and Easter have plenty of that too).
posted by MattD at 6:16 AM on October 27, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by MattD at 6:16 AM on October 27, 2017 [7 favorites]
You aren’t giving people who celebrate anything that they can’t already get, and you are forcing it on people who would rather not.
I don't say this to make an argument for putting up the decorations, but speaking as a former child, there is a sense of loss or missing-out when school cultures change. High-school kids, I think, would feel this less intensely (is decoration of classrooms commonly done at that age-level? It wasn't common in my experience). But when I was in first grade, my elementary school switched from doing Mardi Gras to doing a fun-fair-type carnival and it was bitterly disappointing for a lot of kids in my year. The Mardi Gras celebration was a Big Deal: it happened after school hours, and only first-graders and above got to go, so kids in kindergarten and pre-K eagerly anticipated the year they'd be old enough to go. The carnival was more inclusive, and all ages got to go, and while that was an accommodating change to make, it was still disappointing, especially since my year got hit with the changeover.
People do latch on to traditions emotionally, and some will feel senses of loss if those traditions change or are removed. We can decide it's kinder or more important to stop or change those traditions, but they do still have meaning for some. A party in someone's home could replace a school Halloween party, and arguably should if students feel excluded, but it's still not the same as a party in a classroom. Kids who are anticipating decorating pumpkins might feel a little let-down when hearing they're gonna get a history lesson instead, even if that's more appropriate for a school environment.
posted by halation at 6:31 AM on October 27, 2017 [3 favorites]
I don't say this to make an argument for putting up the decorations, but speaking as a former child, there is a sense of loss or missing-out when school cultures change. High-school kids, I think, would feel this less intensely (is decoration of classrooms commonly done at that age-level? It wasn't common in my experience). But when I was in first grade, my elementary school switched from doing Mardi Gras to doing a fun-fair-type carnival and it was bitterly disappointing for a lot of kids in my year. The Mardi Gras celebration was a Big Deal: it happened after school hours, and only first-graders and above got to go, so kids in kindergarten and pre-K eagerly anticipated the year they'd be old enough to go. The carnival was more inclusive, and all ages got to go, and while that was an accommodating change to make, it was still disappointing, especially since my year got hit with the changeover.
People do latch on to traditions emotionally, and some will feel senses of loss if those traditions change or are removed. We can decide it's kinder or more important to stop or change those traditions, but they do still have meaning for some. A party in someone's home could replace a school Halloween party, and arguably should if students feel excluded, but it's still not the same as a party in a classroom. Kids who are anticipating decorating pumpkins might feel a little let-down when hearing they're gonna get a history lesson instead, even if that's more appropriate for a school environment.
posted by halation at 6:31 AM on October 27, 2017 [3 favorites]
Response by poster: Some clarifications seem necessary: this is a public high school and we are talking about Learning Centers, rooms that work only with kids in special education.
So I'm really hoping for more legally sound answers or how other teachers and schools solve this.
In our district, teachers cannot decorate their classes with any Christmas/Hanukkah/Eid/anything religiously-related stuff in their classes, ever.
Last year, the Halloween-decoration people were told by administration that because we have students who do not celebrate Halloween for religious reasons, forcing them to go to an alternate, non-decorated room with an unfamiliar teacher could be perceived as discriminatory.
While I love the debate idea, we can't have kids self-identify religion, etc., so it wouldn't strictly be an inclusive debate (again, this is a public school).
Lastly to of course further muddy the waters, we have teachers who do not celebrate Halloween and are claiming Title VII discrimination if they are forced to work in a room with decorations or told to move classrooms.
posted by yes I said yes I will Yes at 6:43 AM on October 27, 2017 [3 favorites]
So I'm really hoping for more legally sound answers or how other teachers and schools solve this.
In our district, teachers cannot decorate their classes with any Christmas/Hanukkah/Eid/anything religiously-related stuff in their classes, ever.
Last year, the Halloween-decoration people were told by administration that because we have students who do not celebrate Halloween for religious reasons, forcing them to go to an alternate, non-decorated room with an unfamiliar teacher could be perceived as discriminatory.
While I love the debate idea, we can't have kids self-identify religion, etc., so it wouldn't strictly be an inclusive debate (again, this is a public school).
Lastly to of course further muddy the waters, we have teachers who do not celebrate Halloween and are claiming Title VII discrimination if they are forced to work in a room with decorations or told to move classrooms.
posted by yes I said yes I will Yes at 6:43 AM on October 27, 2017 [3 favorites]
Best answer: Yeah, don’t segregate kids or teachers by religion.
posted by kapers at 6:44 AM on October 27, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by kapers at 6:44 AM on October 27, 2017 [7 favorites]
I mean, the update makes it sound like your decision is already made: Halloween decorations really can't happen, and Team Festive Decor just kinda has to suck it up and deal.
posted by halation at 6:45 AM on October 27, 2017 [12 favorites]
posted by halation at 6:45 AM on October 27, 2017 [12 favorites]
I have opinions about religious holiday decorations in public schools, but what strikes me most here is that you're a high school, not an elementary school. Is there a reason people actually feel that having Halloween decorations is important or of significant value in a high school? It seems like an odd thing to be spending time and emotional energy on. If you want classrooms to look nice, be inviting, or reflect students' lives, there are countless ways to do that.
(Caveat: I went to public school and remember both zero holiday decorations in middle and high school and zero sense that anything was lacking.)
This isn't an argument where both sides are defending something equally important or, I'd guess, equally related to the core missions of the school. I think it makes sense for the pro-skeleton decorations folks to save the legal arguments, not to mention loss of goodwill, for stakes that are actually significant.
posted by trig at 7:04 AM on October 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
(Caveat: I went to public school and remember both zero holiday decorations in middle and high school and zero sense that anything was lacking.)
This isn't an argument where both sides are defending something equally important or, I'd guess, equally related to the core missions of the school. I think it makes sense for the pro-skeleton decorations folks to save the legal arguments, not to mention loss of goodwill, for stakes that are actually significant.
posted by trig at 7:04 AM on October 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
Best answer: Team "It's Not Inclusive" are engaged in a parochialism that is the unique province of American liberals.
Not in this case, I don't think. I came from a very conservative evangelical Christian community and there was a LOT of outrage surrounding Halloween. It was seen as celebrating the devil and though I never experienced it because I was homeschooled, I heard many livid parents talk about how offended they were if public schools even offered the opportunity for their children to engage in a Halloween activity.
So, on the one hand, this definitely has the potential to exclude kids and it's extremely reasonable to think there may be backlash. On the other hand, as a child who was never allowed to go trick or treating and only participated in generic "fall tests," I felt a profound sense of loss similar to what halation spoke of.
I do think for consistency (given your other decorating rules) and the risk of backlash you should go for not decorating. But perhaps you could decorate generically with a fall theme, but any activities (e.g. coloring, crafts) could have an array of options, including some Halloween and some not? Then no child has to engage in Halloween but the option is there in a way that doesn't present celebrating Halloween as the default.
posted by brook horse at 8:01 AM on October 27, 2017 [2 favorites]
Not in this case, I don't think. I came from a very conservative evangelical Christian community and there was a LOT of outrage surrounding Halloween. It was seen as celebrating the devil and though I never experienced it because I was homeschooled, I heard many livid parents talk about how offended they were if public schools even offered the opportunity for their children to engage in a Halloween activity.
So, on the one hand, this definitely has the potential to exclude kids and it's extremely reasonable to think there may be backlash. On the other hand, as a child who was never allowed to go trick or treating and only participated in generic "fall tests," I felt a profound sense of loss similar to what halation spoke of.
I do think for consistency (given your other decorating rules) and the risk of backlash you should go for not decorating. But perhaps you could decorate generically with a fall theme, but any activities (e.g. coloring, crafts) could have an array of options, including some Halloween and some not? Then no child has to engage in Halloween but the option is there in a way that doesn't present celebrating Halloween as the default.
posted by brook horse at 8:01 AM on October 27, 2017 [2 favorites]
When I talk about the parochialism, I talk about the people who want to accommodate the stripping out of traditions out of some misplaced notion of Church vs. State, not those who demand the stripping out in service of their own religious agendas. Sadly, people demanding changes to public behavior based upon their religious beliefs and biases is quite universal and not an American parochialism.
For what it's worth, the "Halloween = Satanism" things is a great example of something that public institutions also shouldn't be forced to accommodate at the cost of great American traditions.
posted by MattD at 8:50 AM on October 27, 2017 [4 favorites]
For what it's worth, the "Halloween = Satanism" things is a great example of something that public institutions also shouldn't be forced to accommodate at the cost of great American traditions.
posted by MattD at 8:50 AM on October 27, 2017 [4 favorites]
Best answer: I won't post a bunch of links here for brevity's sake but this question interested me enough to google and discover there are also Muslim and Jewish communities that are uncomfortable with Halloween's ties to paganism. So while I grew up sincerely believing that Halloween is completely secular, and would still say so myself, I am surprised to be agreeing that this is a grey area. IOW, if you would agree that a public school shouldn't put up Christmas decor, this question may be more complex than it seems.
posted by nakedmolerats at 9:14 AM on October 27, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by nakedmolerats at 9:14 AM on October 27, 2017 [3 favorites]
Best answer: Absolutely with Team It's Not Inclusive here.
-You don't decorate for any other holidays.
-Some people consider Halloween "secular," but others emphatically do not. -Those who want to/have been instructed to avoid celebration are then being asked to segregate themselves religiously, and the imposition of the choice is imposing de facto celebration.
These kids are older and I doubt they will feel sad not to have decorations. I suspect this is about the teachers and their own love of Halloween/nostalgia for the old days when inclusive pluralism was much less practiced
I poked around a little and the ACLU has addressed it sideways here and there. With respect to teaching values, my questions to the teams would be why would it be reasonable for there be an exception to the holiday policy for Halloween? And, in what way could students or the school's climate of tolerance be impacted by segregating classrooms according to religious response to Halloween?
posted by Miko at 10:14 AM on October 27, 2017 [2 favorites]
-You don't decorate for any other holidays.
-Some people consider Halloween "secular," but others emphatically do not. -Those who want to/have been instructed to avoid celebration are then being asked to segregate themselves religiously, and the imposition of the choice is imposing de facto celebration.
These kids are older and I doubt they will feel sad not to have decorations. I suspect this is about the teachers and their own love of Halloween/nostalgia for the old days when inclusive pluralism was much less practiced
I poked around a little and the ACLU has addressed it sideways here and there. With respect to teaching values, my questions to the teams would be why would it be reasonable for there be an exception to the holiday policy for Halloween? And, in what way could students or the school's climate of tolerance be impacted by segregating classrooms according to religious response to Halloween?
posted by Miko at 10:14 AM on October 27, 2017 [2 favorites]
First Amendment Center's recommendations on teaching and religious holidays
Religious Holidays in the Public Schools - guidance from a coalition of organizations of educators and many faith groups
posted by Miko at 10:17 AM on October 27, 2017
Religious Holidays in the Public Schools - guidance from a coalition of organizations of educators and many faith groups
posted by Miko at 10:17 AM on October 27, 2017
Best answer: My knee-jerk reaction was "it's Halloween! Halloween isn't problematic!" - but then I realized my reaction was fueled by the fact that I, personally, have never perceived any issues with Halloween. I've always seen it as a secular, potentially fun but ultimately meaningless holiday that "everyone" could enjoy, so I was a little resistant to the idea that people could feel excluded by it. Obviously my experience is not the case for everyone, however, and I'm glad you posted this question because it's been a helpful reminder that my experience is not universal. Of course there are people who would feel excluded by Halloween. Recognizing and respecting those people is important.
Count me on Team This is Not Inclusive.
posted by DingoMutt at 10:28 AM on October 27, 2017 [2 favorites]
Count me on Team This is Not Inclusive.
posted by DingoMutt at 10:28 AM on October 27, 2017 [2 favorites]
Best answer: Students receiving special education services are already a marginalized group. Don’t put one more barrier in the way of their learning. Decorate for fall, but skip Halloween, in the name of inclusion and providing the least restrictive environment for all learners.
posted by epj at 1:08 PM on October 27, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by epj at 1:08 PM on October 27, 2017 [4 favorites]
The school where I teach has a zero Halloween policy. We have a high Eastern European population and parents tend to keep their children home from school on Halloween unless we assure them that there will be NO costumes, decorations, parties, books read, etc. Just one data point from my specific community. Pumpkin life-cycle, yes. Spiders, Jack-o-lanterns, etc, no.
posted by Cloudberry Sky at 6:40 PM on October 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Cloudberry Sky at 6:40 PM on October 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
Best answer: I teach elementary school and my current school has a no halloween policy for this reason. It is not inclusive to everyone in our community and the mission of our school is to create community and promote inclusiveness with everyone, not just the majority. I personally believe that in regards to decorating classrooms, the cutesy decorations are far far inferior to hanging up student work. If you want the students to feel welcomed and valued, you should showcase their work instead of lament the fact that you cannot decorate your room for halloween. You are free to decorate your house as much as you wish, but the classroom belongs to all the students, not just the teachers.
posted by ruhroh at 10:45 PM on October 27, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by ruhroh at 10:45 PM on October 27, 2017 [4 favorites]
Mod note: A couple deleted. Sorry, but Ask Metafilter is the part of the site for directly concentrating on answering the question / solving the problem rather than general discussion or chat about the topic. Thanks.
posted by taz (staff) at 5:44 AM on October 28, 2017
posted by taz (staff) at 5:44 AM on October 28, 2017
is this actually about religion or about hating on Halloween specifically? because compare the proportion of Thanksgiving celebrants who believe in thankfulness to the Almighty for their blessings, for real, with the proportion of Halloween celebrants who believe in spooks and goblins, for real. Halloween is explicitly about pretending. and there are certainly religious principles that condemn pretending but they are not well in line with the values of public education. if your school is actually serious about protecting children from religious observances they may not appreciate or adhere to, such as specifically Thanksgiving, go ahead and exclude Halloween too even though it doesn't deserve it. but I will be amazed. though heartened.
banning Halloween decor is like banning display calendars because some people hate February. which I do, and it might as well be my religion. but nobody cares about that. however, decorating for Halloween is a pain in the ass if you're not into it and fun if you are, so why make the teachers be involved when you could just designate an area for the kids to do it if they feel like it? after school, maybe, so nobody feels pushed to participate.
Or just fill the room with pumpkin spice candles. nothing supernatural about it, but everybody's scared of those.
you could also make the case that for those who love Halloween as a subversive children's holiday for mayhem and fear, an Authority-approved bunch of generic decorations put up by teachers in school of all places is an insult to the spirit of the holiday. though I wouldn't.
posted by queenofbithynia at 8:18 AM on October 28, 2017
banning Halloween decor is like banning display calendars because some people hate February. which I do, and it might as well be my religion. but nobody cares about that. however, decorating for Halloween is a pain in the ass if you're not into it and fun if you are, so why make the teachers be involved when you could just designate an area for the kids to do it if they feel like it? after school, maybe, so nobody feels pushed to participate.
Or just fill the room with pumpkin spice candles. nothing supernatural about it, but everybody's scared of those.
you could also make the case that for those who love Halloween as a subversive children's holiday for mayhem and fear, an Authority-approved bunch of generic decorations put up by teachers in school of all places is an insult to the spirit of the holiday. though I wouldn't.
posted by queenofbithynia at 8:18 AM on October 28, 2017
Our local schools do fall-themed stuff but nothing Halloween specific. I’d say they can go wild with the maple leaves and undecorated pumpkins and such.
This is the correct answer. Get a plain pumpkin and put it on your desk before the 31st. Don't comment about it. Take it home & carve it on that night, (uh... next year;)
posted by ovvl at 5:27 PM on October 31, 2017
This is the correct answer. Get a plain pumpkin and put it on your desk before the 31st. Don't comment about it. Take it home & carve it on that night, (uh... next year;)
posted by ovvl at 5:27 PM on October 31, 2017
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posted by I_Love_Bananas at 3:11 AM on October 27, 2017 [19 favorites]