When to Give Up an Old Car

June 19, 2017 6:52 PM

I drive a 2001 Honda CR-V. When should I stop putting money into it and just buy a new car? Looking for opinions from other 2001 CR-V owners and auto-savvy people.

In the past few years, I've replaced all brakes, timing belt, spark plugs, and a bunch of other things probably totally 2k, if not more. It's about time for new tires. I'm trying to decide if it's worth it at this point. The car drives fine for my day to day commute (~2 miles to work + 15 min to gym every other day), but last time I took it on a three hour drive it was kind of terrifying. It got very wobbly and hard to control. I don't do this drive often and will be using my bf's car in the future for it.

I know this version of CR-V was built well, and mechanics in the past have said the car will last a while, which is why i put all the money into it before. It's only got 110k miles on it. I'm mainly hesitant to put anymore money into it at this point, if it will only be good for city driving. I'm uncertain how much longer it will last. I'm concerned of "driving it into the ground" if it means it'll break down in the middle of the freeway. I'm also concerned about the environmental impact of buying a new car.

Basically balancing safety and environment, should I buy a new(used) car now? Will it even make any difference if I buy a car in two years?

posted by monologish to Travel & Transportation (19 answers total)

I recently drove a 1996 Nissan Altima cross-country, so I am not at all sure that there isn't something wrong with your car. You say you need new tires--wobbly and hard-to-control could be caused by tires that are out of alignment.
posted by Automocar at 6:57 PM on June 19, 2017 [6 favorites]

When your repairs per year exceed the expense of a monthly payment of a new(er) vehicle.

Wobbly and hard to control sounds like you need new struts and/or controller arms. I had to replace mine last fall (and I was considerably overdue for it when I did). At 110K miles, you are certainly (over)due to replace those, and it will vastly improve your driving experience if you do.
posted by Autumnheart at 7:01 PM on June 19, 2017 [4 favorites]

If it's wobbly and hard to control there is something wrong with it that you should investigate. Just because it only did that on a long drive so far doesn't mean it won't happen again during city driving. If you don't want to put the money in to investigate or fix this problem, that's fine, but then that does mean you should probably buy a new car now.

My rule of thumb for an old car (I have a 1998 Suzuki at the moment) is that I don't mind putting the same amount of money in for maintenance as I would lose in depreciation on a new car. So if I replaced my Suzuki with something newish today, I'd be losing $1000-$2000 per year for the next few years on depreciation of the new car. Which means I am pretty much ahead as long as I'm spending less than that annually on maintenance and repairs. (And that's assuming the new car wouldn't need maintenance or repairs, which isn't really true unless it's under warranty).

About three years ago I had a very expensive repair on the Suzuki (about $3000) and I wondered if it was worth it, and agonized about the decision, but ultimately did it because I couldn't even sell it on without the repair, and I would probably have got about $1500 for it if I did sell, so it was only really a $1500 repair. I'm glad I did repair it, because I've had another three years of problem-free driving from it since, and there's a lot higher mileage on it than on yours.
posted by lollusc at 7:02 PM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

Out of alignment = vibrating steering wheel.

If your car feels like it's rocking side to side, that's likely to be struts.
posted by Autumnheart at 7:02 PM on June 19, 2017

Yes, a car that age will need new shocks/struts. That makes a MASSIVE amount of difference to its handling. It will feel like a new car. I bought some for a friend for a dodge caravan a few weeks ago (because she doesn't take her car maintenance too seriously) and she was blown away at the difference. Braking, handling and general 'not making you throw up-ness' is improved.

Honestly, with the money you have put into it already I'm veering towards keep it if it is reliable. Tyres costs are moot because ALL cars need tyres. They are a consumable item. On reliability and cost of ownership, then by all means keep it.

On safety? Buy a new car. Every time. No 16 year old car can hold a candle to a new car in terms of crash safety. Not even close. So that's not really a good metric to use or you'll only ever be driving a current generation, 5 year old max car.
posted by Brockles at 7:38 PM on June 19, 2017 [4 favorites]

So I am not a 2001 CR-V owner or an automotive expert, but I do own a 2005 Accord with 120k miles and I take it on three-hour-plus drives fairly often (including this past weekend) and it's completely and totally fine. I will nth the others who say that it sounds like there is something wrong with your car. Get new tires, and if it's still bad after that, have the struts checked.

I'll add that I got new tires about a year ago, and I've definitely noticed a difference. I wouldn't say my car was terrifying prior to that, but it feels noticeably more stable than it did, especially on long drives. So get the new tires, and don't cheap out on them. 110k miles is nothing for a Honda.
posted by breakin' the law at 7:39 PM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

I've just noticed that you are in Texas, OP. Be aware that tyres degrade under UV light pretty significantly, too. They will harden and so be less grippy/compliant and drive pretty terribly after about 4 years. An absolute deadline on tyre age is 5 years in anything like a sunny clime for a car stored or mostly left outside.

The lack of precision of 'cooked' tyres that are out of age, rather than out of wear, could very much be a factor. Either way, I'd be very surprised if you didnt' need new struts/shocks.

So - fix your car, is my suggestion. And if you have such a tiny normal usage keep that car. If you have the occasional long trip planned, rent a car for that trip and have the added luxury and safety on the longer, faster and higher risk journeys.
posted by Brockles at 7:43 PM on June 19, 2017 [2 favorites]

I would start putting some money aside for its replacement, and then I would maintain the CR-V and drive it until it needs something really major and expensive. Cars last longer these days, which is a really great thing. Middle of the highway? That can happen with a tire blowout on a car of any age. You're saving a lot of money keeping it going; enough to cover dealing with being stranded if it fails someplace inconvenient. Sadly my Honda Hybrid needs a transmission, so it's being retired far sooner than seems right, but it has given me a ton of warning.
posted by theora55 at 7:47 PM on June 19, 2017 [2 favorites]

Vibrating steering wheel = out-of-balance tyres. Bad alignment tends to cause the car to wander on the road. The vibration will be worse if the shock absorbers (dampers) are worn out, because they are what damp down vertical movement of the wheels.

There may also be other suspension issues, like rubber bushes that need replacing, which are affecting highway stability.
posted by GeeEmm at 8:01 PM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

At their point it doesn't sound like you've got a lemon or anything, you've just got a car with enough mileage and years that the parts that wear out are wearing out. I'd be the last person to judge you for getting a new one if you can afford it, but aside from crash safety, I don't hear anything wrong with your car that a few totally routine repairs won't sort out. And cars are just made better in the last 15 years and change than they were 30 or 40 years ago - I'd be surprised if the CRV doesn't have a minimum of 40,000 miles in it. Not shocked, mind you, but surprised.
posted by wotsac at 9:07 PM on June 19, 2017

I'm still driving my 93 civic hatchback with 160k. I'm in the middle of a protracted divorce, so there is no new car on my immediate horizon but I'm pretty attached to it anyway. Every time I make a repair (even though the latest one was probably more than the value of the car), I remind myself that I haven't made a loan payment in over 20 years, so it balances in my favor.

A thing happened this spring that was a bit unnerving. It felt unsteady and I noticed that it was bottoming out hard on tiny potholes, I was looking into getting new shocks/springs but then the right front wheel started to "crinkle" around tight corners. The lugs and axle nut were tight, so I took it in and was told the axles were loose. Whatever they did, it made all the difference. It rides much smoother and tighter. They said the shocks should last a while yet.

The main reason I'd get a new one is for safety...I worry some times that the airbag may be past it's due date but. As long as I'm the only one in it, I'll take that chance. In a year or so, that'll hopefully change.
posted by bonobothegreat at 9:38 PM on June 19, 2017

Wobbly and hard to control definitely means something is wrong with it. Have a good mechanic check out the suspension and look for serious defects in the tires. Also check the wheel bearings and make sure you don't have a warped front brake rotor. At 110K the struts are probably at least partly to blame, but they might not be the whole story. Whatever it is, it's fixable unless there's a lot of structural rust or the car's been in a severe accident.

I weigh things like this in terms of a cost per mile as a moving average, factoring in gas mileage, repairs and depreciation. How those things shake out depends a lot on your driving habits. For someone who, like you, drives very little, gas mileage is almost meaningless while depreciation on a new car can be extremely costly.

The money you've spent in the last few years is a fraction of what a new car payment would cost you over the same period. We don't know exactly what's causing the handling problem, but you'll probably come out ahead if you fix it.
posted by jon1270 at 4:57 AM on June 20, 2017

Cost-wise, it's virtually always cheaper to keep an older car running than to buy new. I'm sure there are exceptions to that, but the level of maintenance you describe is less than you would be paying in depreciation, loan interest, and higher insurance on a new car. That said, there are going to be higher and lower cost periods in a car's life, and I've known people who would buy and sell used cars based on that -- buying them at, say, 40k miles, and selling around 100k -- but that is also going to be based on the maintenance needs and upkeep of an individual car, not some sort of universal "sell at X miles" rule.

Safety-wise, however, as Brockles notes, is a different story -- newer cars have more safety features, period. Your car was very safe for it's era, but new cars now have technology that was not available back then. How you balance that with the finances is an individual question, and I know lots of people who are driving old cars by choice and who are totally comfortable with the safety tradeoff involved.
posted by Dip Flash at 6:25 AM on June 20, 2017

It's only got 110k miles on it.

That's barely broken-in for a Honda. Fix what needs fixed and keep driving it.
posted by Thorzdad at 6:31 AM on June 20, 2017 [3 favorites]

I have had a lot of older cars. Currently I have a 2004 Golf. My metric for deciding whether to keep or replace is if it is reliable enough to get me where I need to go, there are no horrible rust problems, no catastrophic mechanical failures, and I'm only putting $1-$2000 a year in repairs and maintenance, then keep it. Everything you talked about having done on your car is basic maintenance and expected wear-and-tear parts. If it was my car, I would have it fixed to get rid of the wobbles.

That said, it is nice to have a new car with a warranty and no worries.
posted by fimbulvetr at 7:53 AM on June 20, 2017

Best answer: It's only got 110k miles on it.

That's barely broken-in for a Honda. Fix what needs fixed and keep driving it.

Much of my family is in the car business so I've been steeped in all things related to buying, selling, and owning cars for all 36 of my years on the earth.

With all that in mind let me say that Thorzdad's statement is accepted truth in the car business. Saying, "100,000 on a Honda is just barely breaking it in." will get knowing nods of agreement from every car sales person or mechanic that knows an accelerator from their own asshole.

But it still needs periodic maintenance. After that many miles of normal use that maintenance will start to include things like struts, bushings, and other suspension components (especially rubber ones).

All you really need now is a mechanic you can trust to give you good advice that knows their way around that car. Finding shops that know Honda's shouldn't be hard. You just need someone who knows where to look and what to check that you can trust to tell you when to replace things. Then do what they tell you.

The thing about those major repairs is that while they're expensive, they're also replacing fairly major components of the car with brand new ones. So if you put new struts and suspension bushings in it, you can drive another 110,000 miles before you should need to replace those components again. Will other unrelated parts need to be replaced in that time? Absolutely, but it's still pretty routine stuff and it's still new.

I've read articles where it was determined that the least expensive way to own a vehicle is to buy the least expensive one you can and just keep fixing it. Stuff breaks but when it's fixed it stays fixed and most other associated costs are lower.

What I can tell you from my experience in the car business is that people almost never make rational decisions about buying cars. You should be comparing the cost of maintenance and repairs to the cost of replacing that vehicle (my vote is always for a used vehicle, either a lease return or rental return) and that new vehicles costs. If you're bringing things up to your mechanic as soon as you notice them you should be fine reliability wise. Objectively, it will make sense to keep that car for a LOT longer than you're probably willing to keep it.

In the end, it will come down to your own finances (a big raise will make replacing that CRV look really attractive, for example), how you feel about the condition of the car, how reliable you feel it is, and how well it still meets your needs (or doesn't). Note that that's all based on your opinion, not hard fact. Remind yourself that the longer you can resist replacing your current car, the nicer that replacement is likely to be and hold out as long as you can. Eventually you'll say, "Screw it." and replace the CRV. It will be long before the numbers tell you it makes sense but hopefully you'll have gotten closer to it making sense than most (including myself).
posted by VTX at 8:39 AM on June 20, 2017 [3 favorites]

Also, if you decide to keep it, take an afternoon to wash all the plastic parts of the interior, vacuum all the fabric parts and the floors, remove and wash the mats, polish all interior glass. You need an old toothbrush for some of the dash. Take it to a good carwash for a wash & wax. Buy upgraded wipers. I do this annually-ish, and it makes a big difference in my enjoyment level.
posted by theora55 at 9:47 AM on June 20, 2017 [1 favorite]

Best answer: I have a 2001 CRV with 150,000 miles. I have had to put some serious money into it( two catalytic converters). It runs great now that I addressed that nightmare. I am currently on a 1000 mile road trip with no issues. I plan on keeping this car another 10 to fifteen years through regular maintenance. It may not last as long as I want but it is a solid car. When I lose my keys it only costs me $2 to get a new one. I like that.
posted by cairnoflore at 10:34 PM on June 20, 2017

I had a beloved 2000 Honda CR-V that I drove for a decade, up until last year, summer 2016. The week after the mileage turned over 200K, two things broke that were "oddball" repairs. My mechanic husband informed me that the repairs were "fatigue" type issues, not ordinary parts that just wear out. In his estimation, the car would continue to degrade and cost ever-increasing amounts of money. The retail cost of the two repairs were almost equal to the value of the vehicle. From my experience, once you hit 200K and/or you sustain "odd" repairs that approach the current value of the car, that's when it's time to get a new vehicle.
posted by Ardea alba at 1:34 PM on June 21, 2017